Rob Smyth's Blog, page 198

Premier League: 10 talking points from this weekend's action

United were due a decision at Chelsea, Mancini should make fewer changes and Berbatov may need to change his attitude
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Chelsea were not particularly hard done by

In recent times, a lot of hot air has been emitted regarding Manchester United's supposed preferential treatment from referees. Some lunatics genuinely believe there is an official conspiracy involving Sir Alex Ferguson, the FA, the CIA and Nasa. Their attitude will not have been changed by events at Stamford Bridge, yet the fuss over Sunday's game is misplaced, a convenient narrative that doesn't stand up to the most basic scrutiny. Fernando Torres should have been sent off long before his dubious second yellow card. Chelsea were not unlucky to be down to nine men; they were lucky not to be down to eight, because Mikel John Obi should have received a second yellow card for fouling Antonio Valencia. Chelsea were the better team at 2-2, but they were about to go 3-2 down when Branislav Ivanovic committed the foul for which he was correctly sent off.

And while Javier Hernández's winner was offside, United would probably have won the game anyway. Hernández's goal does not significantly impact on the balance sheet of refereeing mistakes in matches between United and Chelsea at Stamford Bridge. Since their previous league win at Stamford Bridge in April 2002 United have suffered a series of shocking decisions, most notably in 2002-03, 2007-08, 2009-10 and 2010-11. Two of those almost cost them the league; a couple of mistakes from Martin Atkinson in 2009-10 probably did cost them the title. They were due a decision at Stamford Bridge. They are due a few more before things can be said to have evened themselves out. Rob Smyth

Me, me, me

At half-time of their game at home to Swansea, with the score goalless – goalless! – Manchester City were booed off the pitch. That's Manchester City, reigning Premier League champions. We often talk about the entitlement of the professional element of the ftbllr generation, but fans can be just as bad – the same thing happened at Old Trafford a month ago, when a very good Spurs side were thoughtless enough to take a half-time lead: "How dare you, a team in whose reflected glory I demand to bathe, not sweep aside all opposition, when I, Angry from probably not Manchester, have paid for my ticket". You can bet that the ingrates responsible were not in attendance when City were travelling to Gillingham and Bristol Rovers and United were losing to Wimbledon and Crystal Palace. Daniel Harris

Characters not chalkboards

Roberto Mancini has taken plenty of stick for changing his formation this season, but the reality is that players start a match standing on a particular sod, and then spend the rest of it tramping across various others, depending on what happens. And if this sounds simplistic, well, so it should; football is simple not systematic, the best teams defined by personnel and personality, not procedure. Of course formation impacts upon a game, but it's rarely the crucial factor in determining its outcome. In Manchester City's first nine league games last season, Roberto Mancini made 24 changes to his starting line-up compared with 32 at the same stage this, and though there are, perhaps, mitigating factors – more injuries and trickier fixtures – consistency of selection is far more significant than consistency of formation when it comes to crafting rhythmic, coherent teams. Daniel Harris

Mirallas undermined Rodgers' assessment of Everton

Both managers employed diversion tactics after the Merseyside derby. David Moyes focused on Luis Suárez and not Everton's inexplicably nervous opening and ending to the game, or failure to hurt Liverpool at 2-2. Brendan Rodgers repeatedly portrayed Everton as a direct, long-ball team after his side squandered a two-goal lead and several of his decisions – Raheem Sterling starting on the right and Suso starting instead of Jonjo Shelvey – didn't come off. Rodgers' point missed the target for one good reason - Kevin Mirallas. The Belgium international was the one player who hurt Liverpool time and again at Goodison, never from a long ball, and it was the source of Moyes' frustration – and surely relief to Rodgers – that a twisted ankle meant he did not reappear for the second half. Everton's momentum and penetration went with him. Andy Hunter

Ireland should pick Hoolahan (part two)

In a match of confused endeavour at Villa Park, Wes Hoolahan stood out a mile. Every touch was considered, urgent and purposeful. He is the kind of quietly classy playmaker no team should leave home without, and his awareness and touch are such that he probably wouldn't look out of place playing five-a-sides at La Masia. It's a surprise that he is not playing for a bigger club, and a minor scandal that he is not playing for his country: his only cap for the Republic of Ireland came four years ago, and he could not even get into the squad for Euro 2012. In an Irish team that tends to deal in confused endeavour, Hoolahan would stand out a mile. Rob Smyth

Market value

Selling RVP for below RRP was not Arsène Wenger's fault, rather that of the contract man also responsible for Samir Nasri's exit and the current impasse with Theo Walcott. On the other hand, attempting to replace him with a bargain 2-4-1 deal cannot be blamed on anybody but the manager. The argument offered is that Arsenal are changing style, their attacking options now more varied and aimed at achieving a more even spread of goals across the squad. The most obvious comparator is the Manchester United side which won the title in 2006-07, after selling Ruud van Nistelrooy, but the context was different. United had Cristiano Ronaldo to take over the principal goalscoring responsibility, Wayne Rooney, before his mid-career crisis took hold, and a proven Premier League striker in Louis Saha – as well as Paul Scholes, Ryan Giggs and perhaps the finest back five in the club's history. Arsenal, on the other hand, do not, and though Olivier Giroud and Lukas Podolski are decent players, had the money spent on them gone towards a single outstanding one, Arsenal's prospects would look far better than they do. Daniel Harris

Modesty would make Berbatov a truly world-class player

We have all played with someone like Dimitar Berbatov, the guy who knows he is gifted, far more talented than those around him, and, as such, almost sees it as an insult that he should be expected to do basic things like run around and close down the opposition. Leave that, he believes, to the carthorses. The Bulgarian was at it again on Saturday, quite literally walking around the pitch while his team-mates looked to assert themselves against Reading. But ultimately it was he who shone brightest, delivering a performance of sublime control, movement and finishing to leave those watching wondering what he could achieve if he bothered a little bit more.

With respect to Fulham, Berbatov should be at a top-level team, indeed he was until Sir Alex Ferguson ran out of patience and decided that despite his impressive scoring record, he did not fit in at Manchester United. Fulham swooped at the end of the last transfer window and signed Berbatov for a bargain £4m. It is telling that no bigger clubs targeted Berbatov, and that can only be down to his lack of energy and effort on the pitch. If he could add that to his obvious talents there is no doubt that he could still become a key player at a team with ambitions of winning the Champions League. It is as if Berbatov needs to convince himself that he is not as good as he actually is. Sachin Nakrani

Player plays, player improves

After five seasons of hosannahs and hiccups, Rafael da Silva has finally cemented his place in Manchester United's starting line-up. As all young players do and as all players do, he has made mistakes, but much of the criticism of him is besides the point. Full-backs in the better sides tend to get plenty of the ball, particularly against opponents seeking to frustrate – making them a crucial attacking option, entitled to rely on their team-mates' ability to cover when they go forward. Similarly, though Rafael can be impetuous in the tackle, his desire to get stuck-in – often after more muscular team-mates have shrunk away – is testament to his character not criticism of it; you can't sculpt heart and testicles on the bench-press. Like Anderson and Nani before him, Rafael's good form has coincidentally coincided with his consistent selection, and the manager must resist the temptation to select Phil Jones and Chris Smalling ahead of him when they return simply because they happen to be taller – a specialist is almost always better than a stop-gap. Daniel Harris

No need for Sunderland to be coy about their shyness

Sunderland can make legitimate claim to be the least watchable side in history; in nine games this season, they have mustered a grand total of 12 shots on goal, eight of them from Steven Fletcher. For context, Stoke, Reading and Villa are next lowest with 30. And yet they're not actually a bad side, nor a side playing to avoid defeat; it is just that Stéphane Sessègnon, their chief creator and outstanding player last season is horrifically out of form, which is exacerbating the weaknesses of his team-mates; Fletcher is a finisher but unlikely to fashion his own chances, James McClean too one-footed and Adam Johnson taking time to settle in. In that context, Martin O'Neill deserves credit for ensuring that his players defend properly more than criticism for their attacking shortcomings. Once Sessègnon rediscovers his touch, Sunderland will improve not only in output but in style. Daniel Harris

Lukaku looks the part

Should Roberto Di Matteo recall Romelu Lukaku in January? Seemingly Chelsea's manager is pondering such a move and, watching West Brom's lone striker, it was easy to see why. The Belgian youngster bullied Newcastle's defence and forced Tim Krul into a couple of saves before he scored West Brom's equaliser in their ultimately unlucky 2-1 defeat. Many visiting fans thought Steve Clarke erred in replacing Lukaku with Shane Long midway through the second half. "We were pleased to see the back of him," said Newcastle's Alan Pardew. "Lukaku's a big talent." Louise Taylor

Premier LeagueEvertonLiverpoolManchester UnitedManchester CityWest Bromwich AlbionArsène WengerArsenalRoberto ManciniSunderlandDaniel HarrisRob SmythLouise TaylorSachin NakraniAndy Hunter
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Manchester City v Swansea City – as it happened | Rob Smyth

Carlos Tevez's excellent goal settled a weird game that included freak injuries to Michel Vorm and Micah Richards

Preamble When you've had a chastening experience, there's nothing as comforting as comfort. It could be the zesty ingestion of 47 Big Macs, spunking money you don't have on clothes you don't want or even a home Premier League fixture. Nothing is as likely to make Manchester City feel good about themselves. Since the start of 2011, their Premier League record at the Etihad puts the 'form' in 'formidable': P32 W29 D3 L0.

City are still the best team in the Premier League. This is worth reiterating given their status as the crisis club of English football, on a notorious losing streak of one game. They have made a slightly absent-minded start to their title defence, in part because of Roberto Mancini's think problem, but their imminent departure from the Champions League will focus those minds. All should be well with their world by 7.30pm.

It's an important game for Swansea too, the start of a very tricky run of fixtures. In the next 10 games they play City, Chelsea, Manchester United, Newcastle, Liverpool, Arsenal and Spurs. There have been some scandalously premature judgements of Michael Laudrup's tenure. By Christmas we should have a much better idea how successful he is likely to be.

Swansea's last win at Manchester City came in 1951. That's a deceptive statistic, though; they've only played six games in the 61 years since. No, I'm not really sure what the point of this entry is.

Shameless plug department I wrote a chapter on Roy Keane (there's an extract here) for this book. If everyone in the entire known universe buys a copy, I'll be so rich that I never have to MBM another game, so we all win. What are you waiting for?

Michael Laudrup: the definitive player's player Just look at these tributes, and then spend 10 minutes savouring what all the fuss was about.

Team news Manchester City have recalled Carlos Tevez, Alexsandar Kolarov and Matija Nastasic. They could play a couple of formations with that XI: it might an up-yours 3-5-2 from Roberto Mancini, with Gael Clichy as the left centre-back, but it's more likely to be a 4-2-3-1 with Samir Nasri on the right of midfield. Swansea are unchanged.

Manchester City (4-2-3-1) Hart; Richards, Kompany, Nastasic, Clichy; Y Toure, Barry; Nasri, Tevez, Kolarov; Aguero.
Subs: Pantilimon, Lescott, Toure, Evans, Sinclair, Dzeko, Balotelli.

Swansea City (4-2-3-1-0) Vorm; Rangel, Williams, Chico, Davies; Britton, Ki; Hernandez, De Guzman, Routledge; Michu.
Subs: Tremmel, Dyer, Graham, Monk, Shechter, Tiendalli, Agustien.

Referee: Martin Atkinson (W Yorkshire)

5.20pm "Right, I've been disappointed by Villa and Norwich, I've been disappointed by my Quorn burgers for lunch, and I've been very disappointed by my 10-month-old son going for a nap rather than watching Star Wars Episode IV with me," says Matt Dony. "This better be a helluva good MBM, Smyth!"

I'll bring my banter A-game.

Here's a question If you have big headphones, proper headphones, and a woolly hat, how can you wear the two at the same time? You can't wear the hat on top and if you wear the headphones on top it looks like you're auditioning for the winter season of Nathan Barley. You could just go without the music, of course, but a gentleman needs his Roxette fix on a cold winter's day.

1 min City (Manchester) kick off from right to left. They are in blue; Swansea are in white.

2 min City (Manchester) are indeed playing a 4-2-3-1 formation.

3 min "Back when I used to spend my money on things like nice headphones, I would have two pairs, proper headphones, and then smaller headphones that would hook behind the ear which I could wear under a winter hat or on an oppressively warm day," says Kari Tulinius. "Big headphones and woolly hats don't play well together." This head ain't big enough for the both of 'em, and all that.

4 min It's been a pretty quiet start to the game, with more than a whiff of prawn sandwiches about the atmosphere.

5 min Britton plays a crisp 10-yard pass straight into touch. Swansea have been good without the ball but poor with it in the first few minutes.

8 min Aguero feels Williams at his back and swerves majestically around him. When he's tackled the ball breaks to Tevez in the area, and Chico makes a superb sliding tackle before Tevez can get a shot in.

10 min This is all very sluggish thus far. Whatever happened to the fast start? In 2002 Arsenal seemed to be 2-0 up after 10 minutes every second week. Now teams would rather feel their way into the game.

11 min "It is for such occasions that the humble boombox was invented," says Ben Stanley. "This has the additional advantage of allowing you to drown out the tinny grime emanating from some spotty teenager's iPhone speaker with a blast of Physical Graffiti."

13 min Kompany fouls De Guzman down the left, which gives Swansea their first attacking set piece. It's swung deep by De Guzman and, although Williams was flagged offside, Hart didn't know that when he came for the ball and made a total hash of his attempted punch.

15 min "I know I'm pushing on an open door here Rob, but watching that selection of Laudrupisms just underlines how blessed are those blessed with outrageous balance," says Gary Naylor. "Yet his contemporary, Preben Elkjaer, was a magnificently balanced footballer too – though in a completely different way. Elkjaer seemed always to be on the edge of falling over, always flat out to try to keep up with the ball and his footballing brain, always baffling us with how he actually did the things he did. Though Laudrup is at the extreme end of 'his' balance spectrum with the likes of Zidane, Beckenbauer and Muller, is Elkjaer on a spectrum all of his own? I can't think of many who played like him with quite that level of ability, like an ultra deluxe Ade Akinbiyi. Someone should write a book about those mid-80s Danes."

Quite. This is a great example of his balance. Elkjaer was one of those players, like Jan Ceulemans, who never gave defenders even a second's peace. One Spanish paper described him as "the human locomotive", which is lovely.

16 min This game is a mess. Both sides have been unusually loose in possession.

17 min Gareth Barry, the Englishman, palpably obstructs Angel Rangel, the foreign man, sending him flying as a result. The foreign man is booked for diving.

20 min Aside from that Chico tackle on Tevez, Manchester have not even had a sniff of a chance. They aren't being helped by a seriously subdued atmosphere.

21 min "We are still in the bar, Rob," hics my colleague Ian McCourt, who was in the bar during the first MBM five hours ago.

22 min Hernandez, on the right, swings a superb cross towards Michu, who is about to head for goal when Micah Richards comes round from the side to head away. In doing so he clashes heads with Michu, who drops straight to the ground and may well have been knocked out for a few seconds. He receives treatment before being helped to his feet by Joe Hart, and I think he'll be okay to continue. That was a great piece of defending from Richards, because Michu was only ten yards out and would surely have scored.

25 min "I can't have been the only one to see that Elkjaer clip and thought, 'What would Benjamin Massing do?'" says Richard Dorman.

You know you've left a decent football legacy when your surname becomes a verb.

26 min City, as Chris Waddle says on ESPN, have been far too slow in possession. I'm not quite sure why. They look like a team who are so used to going behind (and then coming back to win) that they need it to happen again before they wake up. In a daft way the worst thing Swansea could do here is score a goal.

28 min This is even worse than Aston Villa v Norwich City.

29 min Apart from this game, and the one earlier, what would be your nominations for The Joy of Six: Stinkers.

30 min Kolarov and Nasri have switched wings. This is the extent of the excitement just now.

31 min Does anyone else remember Leeds 0-0 Blackburn in 1996-97, live on a Monday night? That was the stinker's stinker, and more exciting than this.

32 min If this game was a song ...

33 min Gareth Barry overhits a 10-yard through pass to Carlos Tevez by at least five yards. A 50 per cent ineptitude ratio, which is pretty special.

34 min "How many Stoke games are you willing to list in the JOS: Stinkers?" says Mike. "Switzerland v Ukraine World Cup 2006 haunts me still."

I think there's a support group for people who watched the entirety of that game.

35 min Clichy bombs into space down the left – and sidefoots a cross straight out of play. Is this a deliberate parody of an awful football match? If so it's note perfect.

36 min Vorm, obviously bored of having bugger all to do, passes the ball straight to Aguero, 25 yards from goal. He moves it forward to Tevez in the area, where Rangel comes round to make an excellent interception.

37 min Michu has a goal rightly disallowed for offside. It was a classy finish, though, clipped high beyond the advancing Hart.

38 min "Birmingham v Wolves in the Carling Cup last season," says Phil Booth. "Has to be."

39 min An actual shot on goal. No word of a lie. Tevez had a little space on the right side of the box and drilled a sharp but straight shot that was comfortably saved by Vorm. Moments later, Swansea had their first half-chance. Richards cleaned out De Guzman on the edge of the area, but Martin Atkinson played a good advantage, allowing Hernandez to swerve into the box and hit a low cross that was hoofed clear from under the bar by Kompany. When the ball went dead, Atkinson booked Richards for his earlier attempt at a tackle.

41 min Hart makes a fine save to deny Michu. The chance came when he broke beyond a static defence onto a superb angled through pass from Ki. Michu's first touch was a fraction too heavy, and it allowed Hart to charge from his line. Michu tried to dink it over the top with his second touch but Hart had got to within a couple of yards of him and was able to block the shot. Great goalkeeping.

43 min "The 1994 World Cup final nearly killed off my nascent interest in football when I was 8," says Matt Roberts. "Abysmal match."

But it had Viola's 14 minutes of fame. And it was Barry Davies's only World Cup final, so it gets a pass.

45 min City get a corner, their first I think, on the left wing. It's taken by Aguero, and it doesn't clear the front man's feet, never mind his head. There will be two minutes of added ambience.

45+1 min "The girls behind the bar are giving us free shots," says Ian McCourt. How did you swing that? Did you tell them you know Tom Lutz?

45+2 min The half in miniature. City win a free kick on the right, maybe 35 yards from goal. All the big men come forward. Tevez hoofs it miles over everyone, and the crossbar.

Half time: Manchester City 0-0 Swansea City We must never talk of that half of football again. Ever.

Obvious half-time thought David Silva is having a good game.

Half-time emails

"The worst match I can remember is definitely Ireland v Norway in the 1994 World Cup group stage. It's hard to forget the sight of John Sheridan hoofing it 40 yards upfield every time the ball came to him, followed by John Aldridge thinking about running after it but deciding instead to trot back infield with a shake of his head" – James Roscow.

"Virtually all of Alex McLeish's games in the Premier League are tripping over each other in the boredom stakes" – Conor Seery.

"Micah Richards was the last man on the tackle he was booked for and should have been sent off. No one has seemed to notice though" – Rasmus. (He was last man but I don't think it was a clear goalscoring opportunity.)

"Evening Rob. Pop Quiz. Who is the only man to have scored in a World Cup semi-final and the Dundee derby? That's right, Claudio Caniggia. I once met him in the Overgate shopping centre in Dundee, one of the more surreal experiences of my life" – Simon McMahon.

"How tall need a player be to receive praise for his balance? With the likes of Romario, Messi, Aguero etc, I've always taken it for granted. Yet Seedorf's ability to drop his center of gravity from one leg to the other has always amazed me. Surely some kind of mometer is due..." – Phil Podolsky.

46 min Swansea kick off from right to left. City have replaced Aleksandar Kolarov with Mario Balotelli.

47 min City have had a half-time hairdryer – possibly literally – and have already shown more urgency in the first two minutes of the half than they did in the 47 minutes of the first.

48 min "I'm in California visiting some college buddies," says Eric Calhoun. "I convinced everyone to get up for the 9:30am kick-off and watch the game over breakfast, and now I'm not allowed to make suggestions the rest of the trip."

49 min I wonder if a team who are unbeaten in the league at the end of October have ever been under such scrutiny as City right now.

51 min Balotelli has just missed a very good chance. He was put through on goal by a lovely pass by Nasri and decided to go round Vorm instead of shooting. His touch was too heavy, however, and took him almost to the touchline on the left side of the box. By the time he passed the ball back into the middle, a group of Swansea defenders had got back and one of them was able to clear. In Balotelli's defence, Vorm was out extremely quickly to him.

53 min It's all City now. Tevez splits the defence with a stunning pass to find Richards in the box on the right. He eschews the shot and instead drags it across the face of goal towards Balotelli, who just can't reach the ball to put it into the open net. Balotelli claimed he was dragged down by Chico and went head to head with Williams; replays suggest he made the most of very little contact. No way was that a penalty. It was a wonderful pass from Tevez, Laudrupesque in fact. It was pretty much in a straight line, over a distance of about 30 yards, and took four players out of the game.

56 min "In 2006 I was living in the US and didn't have TV," says Kari Tulinius. "However, my landlady let me go to her apartment to watch World Cup games on a Spanish-language channel. I was the only tenant who was allowed that, but then I was the only tenant who had any desire to go into her apartment, on account of her cat. That kitty was just about the most malignant, crazed feline I have ever heard of. It would jump on whomever entered the apartment and just straight-up maul them with claws extended. It would even attack its owner, but she, being ex-military police, was a tough lady and didn't mind. However, for some reason, that cat took a shine to me, which garnered me some privileges in return for taking care of the cat whenever the landlady was away. When I'd go downstairs to watch games, the cat would inevitably curl up next to me on the sofa and purr. Usually it would sleep, no matter how excited I'd get, and wouldn't pay any attention to the screen. However, during the Switzerland – Ukraine game, as it was becoming increasingly clear that extra time was upon us, the cat woke up, looked at the TV for a minute or so, and then stepped up on me and put its front paws on my chest and started kneading me. As I looked down at it, the cat put one paw on my throat. I could feel its claws on my skin. It looked up at me, as if saying: 'I can end it for you now, if that makes your pain go away.' After a second's consideration of its offer, I shook my head, and the cat took its paw away from my throat and curled up in my lap, where it stayed all the way to the end of the match. That is almost entirely a true story."

57 min Swansea can't put three passes together. The atmosphere is still pretty subdued but you do feel a City goal is on the way.

59 min Michu produces another important save from Hart. Swansea's first decent attack of the second half almost led to a goal. After a long series of short passes, Hernandez broke away on the right and clipped over a cross towards Michu near the penalty spot. He sent a diving header towards goal but it was a bit too close to Hart, who dived smartly to his right to save. Michu will probably feel he should have scored; had it been in the corner, Hart would have had no chance. He didn't get enough of a flick on the header.

GOAL! Manchester City 1-0 Swansea City (Tevez 61) This is an excellent goal from Carlos Tevez. Nasri played a square ball to him, 25 yards from goal, slightly to the right of centre. He didn't have much space but had enough time to take a touch and then crunch a fine shot that dipped nastily and arrowed into the far corner. The way Tevez stunned the ball meant it wobbled a bit like a plastic ball, but ultimately it was the accuracy of the shot that was decisive. Vorm had no chance really, although he injured his groin in his attempt to save and is going to be stretchered off.

65 min Play still hasn't restarted. Vorm is being helped very carefully onto a stretcher by five or six physios.

66 min Vorm is finally replaced by Gerhard Tremmel, and Swansea kick off five minutes after conceding.

68 min "Like in most things, Premier League era ennui is nothing to real football era ennui," says Jon Millard. "Arsenal and Coventry seemed to be both perpetually televised in the 80s, and also, like Spinal Tap's Fire and Ice, perpetually produce lukewarm water. In 86/87 they gave us a shocking 0-0, and that so impressed ITV that they let them reproduce the exact scoreline and level of tedium next year. Being the 80s, you couldn't even watch it in the pub. Great.

71 min Michu's header from De Guzman's cross hits the outstretched hand of Kompany. There was a slight penalty appeal from Michu but nothing really. Kompany was only a couple of yards away from Michu, although he did have his arms raised. It would have been a pretty harsh penalty.

72 min Swansea replace a midfielder, Leon Britton, with a striker, Danny Graham. Michu will drop back into the hole.

74 min City still look unconvincing in defence. Nasri's pathetic clearance goes straight to De Guzman, 25 yards out. He shapes to go to the left of Hart and then sweeps a curler the other way, just past the far post. That was a fine effort.

75 min Apparently the Swansea chef, who is not a svelte gentleman, has broken his seat in the dugout. Yes, this is the bit where we link to Vito Spatafore (warning: clip has adult language).

77 min City have started sleepwalking through the game again, which has allowed Swansea to get back into the game. Pablo Hernandez clearly has his shirt pulled in the area by Nastasic, but it's not seen by the referee Martin Atkinson. That should have been a penalty, although only Mike Dean tends to give them.

78 min Swansea make their final change, with Nathan Dyer replacing Pablo Hernandez.

80 min Micah Richards is running towards his own goal when suddenly he collapses to the floor. He's beating the turf in pain, and it seems to be a knee problem. That looks pretty nasty. He had treatment for cramp a few minutes earlier but I don't think it's that. He looked in agony when it happened and now, as a stretcher is prepared, he is receiving oxygen. He may have ruptured something.

84 min Richards, still receiving oxygen, is helped slowly onto a stretcher and off the field. What a strange game of football this has been; two players have been stretchered off with apparently serious injuries, both after no contact with any other players.

85 min Richards is replaced by Kolo Toure. There will probably be at least 10 minutes of added time in this match.

86 min Nathan Dyer is booked for a sliding foul on Gael Clichy. That seemed a little harsh.

87 min He broke his seat!

88 min "Did you see Michael Vaughan's jive on Strictly the other week, Rob?" says Simon McMahon. "Didn't see that coming back in 2005." You wanna talk some jive? I'll talk some jive. I'll talk some jive like you never heard!

89 min An excellent inswinging cross from the right by, er, a Swansea player just evades the leaping Graham before drifting wide of the far post. Manchester City have been really poor in the last 15 minutes and a Swansea goal wouldn't be at all surprising.

90 min There will be 12 minutes of Fergie Time. That's about right in view of the injuries and substitutions.

90+2 min He broke his seat!

90+3 min This has been such a strange game, with an atmosphere so muted as to be almost unsettling. Dyer plays a smart one-two with Rangel and then blitzes a stunningly inept cross well wide of the near post.

90+4 min When the ball goes out for a Swansea throw-in, Michael Laudrup scoops the ball up to Ben Davies. Which is as good an excuse as any to post this link.

90+6 min City make their final substitution, with Joleon Lescott replacing Sergio Aguero. It's not a switch to three in defence; Lescott has gone to centre back, Nastasic left back and Clichy left midfield.

90+7 min A loose ball breaks to Ki, 25 yards out, and he blooters a half-volley miles wide.

90+9 min Balotelli wins a corner with an excellent run down the right. Nothing comes from it.

90+10 min Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

90+11 min After a dodgy spell either side of the Richards injury, Manchester City have been comfortable enough in added time. Not remotely convincing, but not in any real danger of conceding.

90+13 min This is now the longest Premier League game in history.

Full time: Manchester City 1-0 Swansea Balotelli almost scores with the last kick of the game, thrashing a shot that is either tipped over or hits the bar. Who cares? Thank goodness that game is over. At first it was terrible; then it was unnerving with freak injuries to Michel Vorm and Micah Richards; and by the end of 13 minutes of added time it was just plain weird. Thanks for your emails; night.

Premier LeagueManchester CitySwansea CityRob Smyth
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29 min Apart from this game, and the one earlier, what would be your nominations for The Joy of Six: Stinkers.

28 min This is even worse than Aston Villa v Norwich City.

26 min City, as Chris Waddle says on ESPN, have been far too slow in possession. I'm not quite sure why. They look like a team who are so used to going behind (and then coming back to win) that they need it to happen again before they wake up. In a daft way the worst thing Swansea could do here is score a goal.

25 min "I can't have been the only one to see that Elkjaer clip and thought, 'What would Benjamin Massing do?'" says Richard Dorman.

You know you've left a decent football legacy when your surname becomes a verb.

22 min Hernandez, on the right, swings a superb cross towards Michu, who is about to head for goal when Micah Richards comes round from the side to head away. In doing so he clashes heads with Michu, who drops straight to the ground and may well have been knocked out for a few seconds. He receives treatment before being helped to his feet by Joe Hart, and I think he'll be okay to continue. That was a great piece of defending from Richards, because Michu was only ten yards out and would surely have scored.

21 min "We are still in the bar, Rob," hics my colleague Ian McCourt, who was in the bar during the first MBM five hours ago.

20 min Aside from that Chico tackle on Tevez, Manchester have not even had a sniff of a chance. They aren't being helped by a seriously subdued atmosphere.

17 min Gareth Barry, the Englishman, palpably obstructs Angel Rangel, the foreign man, sending him flying as a result. The foreign man is booked for diving.

16 min This game is a mess. Both sides have been unusually loose in possession.

15 min "I know I'm pushing on an open door here Rob, but watching that selection of Laudrupisms just underlines how blessed are those blessed with outrageous balance," says Gary Naylor. "Yet his contemporary, Preben Elkjaer, was a magnificently balanced footballer too – though in a completely different way. Elkjaer seemed always to be on the edge of falling over, always flat out to try to keep up with the ball and his footballing brain, always baffling us with how he actually did the things he did. Though Laudrup is at the extreme end of 'his' balance spectrum with the likes of Zidane, Beckenbauer and Muller, is Elkjaer on a spectrum all of his own? I can't think of many who played like him with quite that level of ability, like an ultra deluxe Ade Akinbiyi. Someone should write a book about those mid-80s Danes."

Quite. This is a great example of his balance. Elkjaer was one of those players, like Jan Ceulemans, who never gave defenders even a second's peace. One Spanish paper described him as "the human locomotive", which is lovely.

13 min Kompany fouls De Guzman down the left, which gives Swansea their first attacking set piece. It's swung deep by De Guzman and, although Williams was flagged offside, Hart didn't know that when he came for the ball and made a total hash of his attempted punch.

11 min "It is for such occasions that the humble boombox was invented," says Ben Stanley. "This has the additional advantage of allowing you to drown out the tinny grime emanating from some spotty teenager's iPhone speaker with a blast of Physical Graffiti."

10 min This is all very sluggish thus far. Whatever happened to the fast start? In 2002 Arsenal seemed to be 2-0 up after 10 minutes every second week. Now teams would rather feel their way into the game.

8 min Aguero feels Williams at his back and swerves majestically around him. When he's tackled the ball breaks to Tevez in the area, and Chico makes a superb sliding tackle before Tevez can get a shot in.

5 min Britton plays a crisp 10-yard pass straight into touch. Swansea have been good without the ball but poor with it in the first few minutes.

4 min It's been a pretty quiet start to the game, with more than a whiff of prawn sandwiches about the atmosphere.

3 min "Back when I used to spend my money on things like nice headphones, I would have two pairs, proper headphones, and then smaller headphones that would hook behind the ear which I could wear under a winter hat or on an oppressively warm day," says Kari Tulinius. "Big headphones and woolly hats don't play well together." This head ain't big enough for the both of 'em, and all that.

2 min City (Manchester) are indeed playing a 4-2-3-1 formation.

1 min City (Manchester) kick off from right to left. They are in blue; Swansea are in white.

Here's a question If you have big headphones, proper headphones, and a woolly hat, how can you wear the two at the same time? You can't wear the hat on top and if you wear the headphones on top it looks like you're auditioning for the winter season of Nathan Barley. You could just go without the music, of course, but a gentleman needs his Roxette fix on a cold winter's day.

5.20pm "Right, I've been disappointed by Villa and Norwich, I've been disappointed by my Quorn burgers for lunch, and I've been very disappointed by my 10-month-old son going for a nap rather than watching Star Wars Episode IV with me," says Matt Dony. "This better be a helluva good MBM, Smyth!"

I'll bring my banter A-game.

Team news Manchester City have recalled Carlos Tevez, Alexsandar Kolarov and Matija Nastasic. They could play a couple of formations with that XI: it might an up-yours 3-5-2 from Roberto Mancini, with Gael Clichy as the left centre-back, but it's more likely to be a 4-2-3-1 with Samir Nasri on the right of midfield. Swansea are unchanged.

Manchester City (4-2-3-1) Hart; Richards, Kompany, Nastasic, Clichy; Y Toure, Barry; Nasri, Tevez, Kolarov; Aguero.
Subs: Pantilimon, Lescott, Toure, Evans, Sinclair, Dzeko, Balotelli.

Swansea City (4-2-3-1-0) Vorm; Rangel, Williams, Chico, Davies; Britton, Ki; Hernandez, De Guzman, Routledge; Michu.
Subs: Tremmel, Dyer, Graham, Monk, Shechter, Tiendalli, Agustien.

Referee: Martin Atkinson (W Yorkshire)

Michael Laudrup: the definitive player's player Just look at these tributes, and then spend 10 minutes savouring what all the fuss was about.

Shameless plug department I wrote a chapter on Roy Keane (there's an extract here) for this book. If everyone in the entire known universe buys a copy, I'll be so rich that I never have to MBM another game, so we all win. What are you waiting for?

Swansea's last win at Manchester City came in 1951. That's a deceptive statistic, though; they've only played six games in the 61 years since. No, I'm not really sure what the point of this entry is.

Preamble When you've had a chastening experience, there's nothing as comforting as comfort. It could be the zesty ingestion of 47 Big Macs, spunking money you don't have on clothes you don't want or even a home Premier League fixture. Nothing is as likely to make Manchester City feel good about themselves. Since the start of 2011, their Premier League record at the Etihad puts the 'form' in 'formidable': P32 W29 D3 L0.

City are still the best team in the Premier League. This is worth reiterating given their status as the crisis club of English football, on a notorious losing streak of one game. They have made a slightly absent-minded start to their title defence, in part because of Roberto Mancini's think problem, but their imminent departure from the Champions League will focus those minds. All should be well with their world by 7.30pm.

It's an important game for Swansea too, the start of a very tricky run of fixtures. In the next 10 games they play City, Chelsea, Manchester United, Newcastle, Liverpool, Arsenal and Spurs. There have been some scandalously premature judgements of Michael Laudrup's tenure. By Christmas we should have a much better idea how successful he is likely to be.

Premier LeagueManchester CitySwansea CityRob Smyth
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Aston Villa v Norwich City – as it happened | Rob Smyth

Michael Turner's late header gave Norwich a deserved point against 10-man Aston Villa

Preamble Meeting the ex for the first time is a strange experience. On the one hand, the prospect can be intimidating, uncomfortable, painful, regretful, nostalgic. On the other the actual experience can be weirdly emboldening. Whether you're the dumper, the dumpee or you split by "mutual consent", the desire to win the unspoken battle of who has gone to pot the least can bring out an arrogant side in even the meekest characters. It's like you borrow a different personality for the night: more confident, assured and, in theory, desirable. People also go to the trouble of dressing up, wearing a minimiser if they are a man and a maximiser if they are a woman. Here, my stupid little former lover, is what you could have won. There are even suggestions – although the Guardian has not been able to verify these – that some people even splash on a bit of cologne and spend much longer than usual in front of the mirror.

So long as you don't inadvertently shout "I NEVER LOVED YOU ANYWAY, THE BLOODY ZERO 7 CDs WERE MINE AND YOUR BEEF STROGANOFF PALPABLY NEEDED MORE SALT!" it should go reasonably well and you can go away feeling better about yourself. That's what Paul Lambert and Norwich hope will happen at Villa Park today. Both have looked a little lost without each other in the early part of the season: Norwich, like Lambert's Villa, have won only one out of eight league games.

There is a burgeoning sense that Lambert, who seems to have all the tools to become what Jamie Redknapp's even more excitable alter ego would call a top, top, top, top, top, top, top manager, might just have taken a wrong turn by going to Villa. This may just be London-based-media ignorance – and apologies if so – but it does seem a bit of a nothing job at a club which is stuck in no team's land: too mediocre to go down, too mediocre to make an impression. It would be interesting to know what Lambert thinks he can achieve. He'll be fine in the medium term – it would not be at all surprising if he were the next British manager to get one of the big jobs – but it might get worse before it gets better.

The first Premier League meeting between these sides came at Villa Park in November 1992, a minor classic that Norwich won 3-2. Look at the league table after that game. How much better football was when smaller teams could be seen and heard.

Prediction on which you are advised not to stake your last Rolo, never mind your mortgage: Villa 1-1 Norwich

Team news Darren Bent has been dropped again. Remember when scoring goals was a virtue?

Aston Villa (4-4-2): Guzan, Lowton, Herd, Vlaar, Bennett, Albrighton, El Ahmadi, Delph, Holman; Agbonlahor, Benteke.
Subs: Given, Ireland, Bent, Westwood, Bannan, Weimann, Lichaj.

Norwich (4-2-3-1): Ruddy; R Martin, Bassong, Turner, Garrido; Tettey, Johnson; E Bennett, Hoolahan, Pilkington; Holt.
Subs: Rudd, Snodgrass, Howson, Jackson, Morison, Barnett, R Bennett.

Referee: Phil Dowd (Staffordshire)

"I'm a Villa fan," apologises Danny Marsh. "I am also planning my first meeting with an ex next week. How about some advice for me to come out on top? I should wear a clean jumper, right? A Villa 2-1 today!"

We'll get the crack MBM team on it. First we need to knew a few things. Was it an acrimonious split? Who dumped who? Did she cook Beef Stroganoff?

1 min Norwich kick off from right to left. They are in canary yellow; Villa are in claret y blue.

2 min "Asking the MBM followers for advice on exes is an futile one," says Alex Netherton. "To have an ex you'd have to have had a relationship."

That reads suspiciously like banter, Alex.

3 min It's been an urgent start from Norwich, who are snapping the ball around confidently. Villa look a bit tentative.

4 min "It was sort of mutual but she was the one that actually ended it," says Danny Marsh. "On the phone. Haven't seen her since. She never cooked anything. Ever."

Anyone got any advice for Danny's big night?

5 min There's a nice autumn sunshine over Villa Park, although I suspect it's still bloody freezing. The game isn't really going anywhere at the moment, Norwich having regressed towards the mean after their smart start.

7 min Gabby Agbonlahor, who at 26 is Villa's senior Premier League player today, wins the first corner of the match down the left. It's drilled deep and Benteke's looping header goes gently over the bar.

8 min Holman comes infield from the left and plays a crisp angled pass into Benteke on the edge of the area. He is dispossessed but the loose ball comes to Holman, who was following up the play, and he hits a gentle 20-yard pass that is comfortably saved by Ruddy.

10 min "Advice for Danny Marsh," says Naman Vijay. "Take a super hot date with you." I think I may just have spotted one tiny flaw in your plan ...

11 min "Just sipping on a coffee in the south of France," says my colleague Ian McCourt, aka the nicest man in journalism, "and thought I'd email into the MBM and say hi." You just wanted to let us know you're in the south of France, didn't you?

13 min Hoolahan, the best player on the pitch so far, invites a long-range shot from Tettey. He scuffs it and it's blootered clear.

14 min Why the hell doesn't Wes Hoolahan get in the Ireland team? He's an actual footballer.

15 min A long spell of Norwich possession with a tame long-range shot from Elliott Bennett. Norwich have certainly been the better team thus far.

16 min "How to deal with meeting the ex?" says Craig Smaaskjaer. "Don't turn up. It is the only answer to the thief's dilemma that is meeting the ex. The questions you have posited that will remain unanswered are surpassed only by the questions this non-attendance (with no prior warning given! – this is pivotal) creates. You might say this is a fairly mean spirited thing to do. I say yes, MBM. Yes it is. Don't think it would work for Norwich today though."

17 min Norwich might have had a penalty there. It looked completely innocuous, as Vlaar and Elliott Bennett ran to meet a ball by the left edge of the box, but on reflection I think Vlaar did trip Bennett. I'm not sure Phil Dowd had the best view.

18 min Villa win a free kick on the right. Albrighton takes his time, an age in fact, considering his options. He's practiced this skill so many times in his life, surely he's mastered it now? Surely he'll do something special now.

He curves it straight onto a Norwich head. Dear oh dear.

19 min Villa fans, as always in the 19th minute of home games, break into a minute's applause for Stan Petrov.

22 min Guzan makes a vital save from Hoolahan. That was the first big chance of the game. Holt and Hoolahan reversed their usual roles, with Holt providing for Hoolahan. A long goal kick broke to him just outside the area, and he flicked an excellent short-range through pass for Hoolahan, who had run beyond the defence. He took a touch and then tried to sweep a left-footed shot into the right corner, but Guzan deflected it wide for a corner. That's an excellent save, although Hoolahan should probably have scored.

24 min "Danny...here is an idea," says Alan McDonald. "Got a smartphone? Change the names of two male contacts to females. Then add smoking hot pics to the contacts, leave your phone on the table and have them call 45 minutes or so apart. When she inevitably asks who they are, hesitate slightly and say 'friends' then move the subject quickly on. You are welcome." Have you been watching Magnolia?

25 min Norwich continue to look much the better side. Hoolahan clips an angled pass to Holt, beyond the far post, and his header back across the face of goal is claimed by the diving Guzan.

GOAL! Aston Villa 1-0 Norwich (Benteke 27) What an excellent goal from Christian Benteke. The scoreline may be almost scandalous, given Norwich's dominance, but he took the goal beautifully. Agbonlahor did well with his back to goal, holding off Bassong and playing the ball wide to Holman on the left. As he did so, Benteke pulled away from the two centre-backs to find space near the penalty spot. Bennett's low cross came straight to him, and he took a touch before placing a lovely, calm shot into the far corner as Ruddy dived the other way. Expert stuff.

30 min "Is the nicest man in journalism in Marseille for tomorrow night's 'Olympico'?" says Phil Booth. "And re: meeting the ex – if there's any chance either of you might cry, arrange to meet in a quiet place, preferably with potplants etc to hide behind, and a quick route to the toilets."

32 min Villa have been awful in possession.

35 min A summary of the memorable action of the last five minutes:

38 min An excellent angled pass from El Ahmadi leaves Benteke one on one with Garrido (I think) to the right of the box. He cuts back infield and hits a left-footed shot that is deflected wide for a corner. The corner is claimed easily by Ruddy.

40 min A nice move from Norwich. Hoolahan wins a 50-50 with Delph 25 yards from goal and then plays a good ball down the outside for the onrushing Martin. He smashes a low cross along the face of the six-yard box which Herd, facing his own goal, does very well to hoof away for a corner.

42 min "If she's never cooked and dumped you on the phone, you're better off alone," says Martin Wills. "Sort of like being an admitted Villa fan this season."

45 min There will be one additional minute of this confused nonsense. Even Alan Parry, one of the most optimistic commentators of modern times, sounds bored and vaguely disgusted as another aimless pass disappears into touch.

Half time: Aston Villa 1-0 Norwich City A low-heartrate finish from Christian Benteke separates the sides. See you in 10 minutes.

"Best league in the world," says Silver Fox. "What. Oh."

46 min Villa kick off from right to left. Having seen a replay of Hoolahan's chance, it seems I was more than a little generous to Holt. It wasn't a through pass, just a mishit shot. Anyway, Norwich have made a half-time substitution, with Ryan Bennett replacing the injured Russell Martin.

46 min Villa almost score inside 40 seconds. A rubbish square pass from Hoolahan allows Albrighton to break down the right. He runs 45 yards and then dumps over a deep cross beyond the far post, where Benteke gets above his man to thump a downward header that is smothered by the sprawling Ruddy. It was a pretty comfortable save.

48 min "If you've been together long enough she'll see through the pretense, Danny," says Dr Phil Podolsky. "And besides you probably have enough mutual friends to keep her informed that you're holed up in that grimy one-room apartment, screaming abuse at your neighbours in four languages whenever they complain about your habit of blaring Captain Beefheart records at night. So drop that passing yourself off as a functioning member of society lark out of the windae, son, you're not fooling anyone."

49 min Alan Parry is so bored that he has just observed that we have three Bennetts on the field. He didn't add that none of them are called Gordon, but there's plenty of time yet.

50 min A shout of "Oh for f-" is audible on the commentary, presumably from someone at pitchside. I don't know how those pitchside microphones work but that was some quick editing, and with lovely comic timing as well.

52 min: JOE BENNETT IS SENT OFF FOR ASTON VILLA Joe Bennett gets his second yellow card for a cynical block on Elliott Bennett, who tried to play a one-two down the right. I missed his first yellow card – oh, me – but there's no doubt the second was a fair decision. Elliott Bennett was getting away from him and Joe Bennett pulled him back.

54 min Elliott Bennett's overhit cross almost sneaks in at the far post, with Guzan shovelling it away. Villa have made a substitution, bringing on the left-back Eric Lichaj for Gabby Agbonlahor.

56 min "If a certain Mr. Suarez committed an outrageous dive like that just perpetrated by good old Grant Holt a few minutes ago," says Roy Allen, "he'd be run out of the country." Yeah but Grant Holt isn't a foreigner, so what's your point?

59 min It seems Joe Bennett was booked shortly after the Villa goal for taking a shortcut through Elliott Bennett.

60 min This is utter rubbish I'm afraid.

61 min If this match was a cat it would be set to make the acquaintance of a bag of bricks.

62 min Johnson plays a good angled pass to Elliott Bennett, who has run off the left-back Lichaj. A good first touch will take him in on goal. He chests it out for a goal-kick.

63 min Chris Herd is booked for putting his person about Grant Holt.

64 min Guzan makes another vital save from Hoolahan. A diabolical pass from Vlaar went straight to Hoolahan, 30 yards from goal. He played the ball wide to Pilkington, ran into the area for the return and then, from a tight angle to the left of the six-yard box, smashed a shot that hit Guzan and went away for a corner. Before it is taken, Norwich replace Elliott Bennett with Robert Snodgrass.

66 min Norwich have had almost Barcelona levels of possession since the dismissal of Bennett (J), but they still aren't really getting behind Villa. They've had only two shots on target all game.

68 min Great defending by Vlaar! Snodgrass's deep cross from the right was headed back across the face by Holt. Hoolahan was about to head it in from a few yards when Vlaar jumped in to head the ball away. Moments later he does just enough to put off Holt, who heads Garrido's cross wide.

70 min A substitution per side: Steve Morison replaces Bradley Johnson, and Darren Bent comes on for Christian Benteke.

71 min Villa's defending is getting more desperate by the minute, with Herd diving towards his own goal to head a cross away for a corner. When that's half cleared, Snodgrass's 20-yard shot is blocked by the backside of Lowton. A Norwich goal isn't just in the post; it's been sent by recorded delivery.

73 min "I've genuinely seen better quality football over the park on a Sunday morning," says Silver Fox. "You understand now why I'm concerned about us going down this season?"

Villa won't go down. Have you seen some of the other sides? Since money ruined the Premier League, there are usually enough poor teams that you are never too bad to stay up.

74 min The Anglia tiki-taka continues, although Villa have limited Norwich to very few actual real-life chances. The two centre-halves, Vlaar and Herd, are putting a serious shift in now.

75 min "I've always wondered exactly how tedious it must be to be a Villa fan," says Johny Bennett. "All those years of mediocrity stretching back decades, the football equivalent of the loveless, sexless, duty-bound marriage. Many of them must secretly pray for relegation for a change of scenery."

76 min Andreas Weimann replaces Brett Holman.

77 min Guzan makes a crucial save from Holt to keep Villa ahead. Holt played a one-two near the halfway line with the excellent Hoolahan and ran through on goal, muscling Delph aside almost disdainfully. He ran into the area and tried to sidefoot the ball under Guzan, who flew from his line to make a vital saved with his legs.

GOAL! Aston Villa 1-1 Norwich (Turner 79) That, it's fair to say, was coming. Snodgrass's shot was blocked desperately by Vlaar at the expense of yet another corner on the right. With Villa sleeping and/or catching breath, Snodgrass took the corner short to Hoolahan, who clipped over a lovely, inviting cross towards the near post. Michael Turner got a run on Herd and flicked an accomplished header that clattered off the inside of the far post before bouncing into the net.

80 min If Norwich relax now, and are content with a draw, they should be shot.

81 min "Will Danny be providing a MBM report of his forthcoming date?" says Lynne Hyland. "I for one will be glued."

82 min Norwich are bombing Villa now. A long angled free-kick is nodded down by Morison towards Holt, who spins and is about to shoot when Vlaar smashes the ball away.

84 min Herd is struggling with injury, and Villa have used all their subs. They are almost out on their feet after being pummeled incessantly for 25 minutes solid.

85 min Alan Smith has just pointed out on Sky that Herd should have been sent off. When Hoolahan played that return pass for Holt's chance in the 77th minute, he was clattered by Herd, who has already been booked. That was a stunningly inadequate piece of refereeing from Phil Dowd. There was no reason at all not to give Herd a second yellow card once the ball went dead.

86 min "We've defended directly in front of the keeper, given the ball away with virtually every pass of the game and since going down to 10 men we've subbed off any forwards we've got who can defend," says Anthony Hull. "I just don't know where we've gone wrong?"

88 min A moronic foul by Delph on the outstanding Hoolahan gives Norwich a free-kick 25 yards from goal. It's a fair way right of centre, so Snodgrass will swing it in. He swings it in and miles over the head of everybody for a goal-kick.

89 min Norwich's intensity has dropped a bit since the goal. On the one hand that's human nature; on the other it's just not good enough. A win is so obviously there for the taking.

90 min Morison's header hits the arm of Vlaar in the penalty area, but there were only around 2.1 millimetres between the two players and it would have been a desperately harsh penalty decision.

90+1 min There will be four additional minutes of oxygen-gulping for Aston Villa. On Sky, Alan Smith gives Wes Hoolahan the Man of the Match award; he is such a classy footballer.

90+2 min Ryan Bennett misses a great chance! Pilkington's cleared was deflected across the box to Bennett, 15 yards out, but he was leaning back and slashed a half-volley high over the bar.

90+5 min Another chance for Norwich. A driven, left-to-right pass is headed down by Ryan Bennett towards Snodgrass, only a few yards from goal, and his attempted volleyed lob drifts onto the top of the net. It wasn't an easy chance, because he was under pressure and also running away from goal.

Full time: Aston Villa 1-1 Norwich City It's hard to know what to make of that game. Norwich will be happy that they were the better side but will know they should have won it; Villa will be happy they got a point after being outplayed but know they have some very tough fixtures to come. On this evidence they are a poor side. Thanks for your emails; bye.

Premier LeagueAston VillaNorwich CityRob Smyth
guardian.co.uk © 2012 Guardian News and Media Limited or its affiliated companies. All rights reserved. | Use of this content is subject to our Terms & Conditions | More Feeds

Football Weekly Extra: City taken to the cleaners by Ajax and other tales of European woe

James Richardson has Barry Glendenning, Rob Smyth and Michael Cox on board for today's jam-packed Football Weekly Extra, and rest assured, it's a good'un.

We start with the miserable performances of the English sides in the Champions League. Manchester City got smoked in Amsterdam, Shakhtar shook Chelsea and Arsenal were awful against Schalke, meaning it was Manchester United left to fly the flag, which they did – just – by beating Braga 3-2.

Also in the podcast, Sid Lowe tells us about Barcelona overcoming Brave Celtic, Real Madrid's ongoing misadventures in Germany, and Malaga extending their winning streak against Milan.

Finally, we look forward to the Merseyside derby and the rest of the Premier League fixtures this weekend, and, in light of a Greek club signing a sponsorship deal with a local brothel, discuss the funniest shirt sponsors of all time.

Jimbo's paper review will be with you on Friday, and Amy Lawrence, Gregg Bakowski and Barney Ronay will be joining us on the pod on Monday.

James RichardsonBen GreenBarry GlendenningRob SmythMichael CoxSid Lowe

Roy Keane: the Tony Soprano of Old Trafford | Rob Smyth

Life's most interesting people are invariably flawed; Keane has been the most interesting person in British football for decades

On 8 December 1999, at 8.23pm, I fell in love with another man. Roy Keane probably wouldn't care much for this revelation, but then I'm pretty sure I wasn't alone. The context was a long-forgotten match between Manchester United and Valencia in the long-forgotten second group stage of the Champions League. Long forgotten, that is, by everybody except those besotted with Roy Keane.

For the preceding five months, there was a serious danger that Keane, aged 28 and at the peak of his not inconsiderable powers, would leave United. His contract was due to expire in the summer of 2000, and United were unwilling to break their rigid wage structure to give Keane the £50,000 a week he wanted. Moves to Juventus and Bayern Munich were frequently discussed in the press; the Bosman rule meant that, as of 1 January 2000, Keane could discuss terms with foreign clubs. All that scaremongering about the Millennium Bug had nothing on the millennial angst felt around Old Trafford. The word 'unthinkable' does not begin to do justice to the thought of that United side without Keane. Impasses are usually tedious; this was terrifying.

Then, on the afternoon of United's match against Valencia, the club announced that Keane had signed a new contract. It was a match United had to win; they had lost the first group game away to Fiorentina, largely because of a rare and hideous error from Keane. A fortnight later he righted that wrong, slamming in a joyously emphatic opening goal from the edge of the area. Keane had already made far greater contributions for United, most famously away to Juventus in the previous season's semi-final, but the combination of the goal and the earlier defenestration of the desperate thought of a world without him made it a nigh-on perfect moment. The sort that makes you realise that, even when you grow old and doddery, and when you wouldn't recognise your other teenage heroes if they were stood in front of you holding a walking stick, you will still love Roy Keane.

There is something about Keane that inspires such extreme devotion – and also wonder. At the 2012 Soccer Aid event, superstars like Robbie Williams and Will Ferrell were clearly in awe of Keane. Most fans of big English clubs other than United hate him, of course, and in that respect Keane is an uber-Marmite figure: those who love him would generally be willing to go to the ends of the earth for any unspecified Keane-related purpose. As a player, he was of his time by not being of his time: he captured the pre-millennium angst of the outsider who cannot understand the world of which he is part. In doing so he brought to mind a number of pop-culture characters of a similar disposition. Two in particular: Tyler Durden in Fight Club and Tony Soprano in The Sopranos. Like Keane, both raged, raged against the dying of society's light. There are other similarities. The intense adoration Keane receives evokes that of Tyler Durden, while his obtuse charisma, anti-heroism and scattergun frustration is shared by Tony Soprano. Keane, like Soprano, was raging for a better world and a better him. He has always been an incredibly complex man, a compelling fusion of instinctive intelligence and pathological desire.

Keane, like Tony Soprano, is a mass of often uncomfortable contradictions. Thank goodness for that. The most interesting people in life are invariably flawed, and Keane has been the most interesting person in British football for the last few decades – an outsider even down to his Diadora boots, never mind the candour that is so rare in modern football. What kind of hero would you prefer? Prom kings are for dreamers and liars. Having Roy Keane as a hero allows a vicarious ride through life in all its miserable glory.

For all his success – Keane won seven Premier League, four FA Cups and, although he'd tell you otherwise, one European Cup at Manchester United – football has often been brutally unkind to him. He was booted out mercilessly by a club and manager to whom he had given his soul and body. He missed out on his only European Cup final because of suspension. A year later, when he seemed to be on a personal mission to win the trophy – he scored six Champions League goals that season, almost half his career total of 14, and played with almost demented purpose – he then scored an own goal and missed an open goal in the quarter-final defeat to Real Madrid. Having got Ireland to the World Cup in 2002 with arguably the greatest football of his career, he missed out on the tournament because of his infamous row with Mick McCarthy. Keane always defined himself and his teams by global competition; you only have to see his boyish excitement as he stood pitchside for ITV ahead of Milan v Barcelona to realise that. Despite playing some awe-inspiring football for Ireland and for United in Europe, he played just in just one major tournament and no European finals.

If this tells us of the essentially cruel nature of football, they will not necessarily be our abiding memories of Keane. We will remember him as somebody who personified leadership, who controlled games with forensic intelligence, who was a grossly underrated passer and who, on occasion, put the fear of God into both opponents and teammates. That was a consequence of an intractable obsession with excellence. Keane combined a higher state of concentration and an inhuman perfectionism to consistently reach a level of performance beyond almost anyone else – even if that level of performance regularly did not satisfy the critic within. He was not interested in glory. Glory was something that came if you did your job properly. That, nor heroism, interested him. "You can be a hero – whatever that is," he sniffed in his autobiography.

Players of Keane's type are regularly described as 'winners', and with good reason. Keane did not so much have a will to win as a need to win. "If I was putting Roy Keane out there to represent Manchester United on a one against one, we'd win the Derby, the National, the Boat Race and anything else," Sir Alex Ferguson once said. "It's an incredible thing he's got."

It was not just winning that interested Keane, however. He was equally concerned with excellence and personal pride; winning was usually the result of the exhibition of those qualities. It was not necessarily a deal-breaker. In his autobiography he talks about the performance that first caught the attention of Nottingham Forest scouts. His team were 5-0 down with a few minutes to go. Everybody else had waved the white flag, but Keane kept doing the right things: demanding possession, moving the ball on crisply, putting out fires when the opposition had the ball. The qualities were in evidence at Forest, too: in 1992-93, the first season of the Premier League, Keane fought a lone, heroic and ultimately doomed battle to keep Forest in the Premier League.

Keane detested mediocrity, and sometimes that need for excellence proved overwhelming. It is no coincidence that his infamous foul on Alf-Inge Haaland in 2001 came immediately after Manchester City had equalised at Old Trafford. United were already champions, but they had surrendered feebly in Europe to Bayern Munich earlier in the week and Keane was convinced they were in the comfort zone. When City – a poor side who would be relegated – equalised, it all bubbled over. Prawn sandwiches, mediocrity, couldn't even beat City at home, comfort zone, Haaland in possession. "Alfie was taking the piss". Bang. Haaland was toppled like a folding deckchair and Keane was the villain again.

Keane's detractors say he was little more than a thug who went round booting people at a time when the game's laws had not evolved sufficiently. This is such offensive poppycock that it barely merits mention. The primary weapons in Keane's arsenal, by a distance, were his energy, positional sense and game intelligence. Never was this more evident than during a magnificent performance in the 1996 FA Cup final against Liverpool. The game is remembered for Eric Cantona's masterful late winner, which clinched the Double for United and completed his fairytale; justly so, yet that goal was infinitesimal in the grand scheme. In this game, as much as any others, Keane's footballing philosophy emphatically came to pass.

This particular devil has always been obsessed with detail, and the minutiae of football matches. "They say God is in the detail; in football that's true," he said in his autobiography. "Sometimes games are won by a magical goal – that's what people remember. But the essence of the game is more mundane. Detail. Wearing down the opposition. Winning the psychological battles – man on man – from the moment the ref blows the whistle for the first time." Keane called it the Law of Cumulation. "First tackle, first pass, first touch, everything counts. A lot of little things add up to the thing that matters: breaking the opposition's hearts – but first their minds, their collective mind."

Liverpool were a dangerous, free-flowing side who created umpteen chances in the two league games against United that season: a 2-2 draw at Old Trafford and a 2-0 win at Anfield that could have been 8-0 but for Peter Schmeichel. Keane did not play at Anfield, but he grudgingly respected Liverpool's abundant attacking talent: Robbie Fowler, Jamie Redknapp and Steve McManaman all played the most progressive football of their career under Roy Evans. The unpredictable brilliance of Stan Collymore was also worthy of respect. Keane's fear of Liverpool's capabilities was accompanied by loathing. In short, he couldn't stand them. The notion of the Spice Boys was anathema. Lee Sharpe tells a story of him and an "absolutely smashed" Keane bumping into the Liverpool players in a bar one Saturday night. Keane went through them one by one, dismissing their England B caps, England under-21 caps and League Cup winners' medals. The gist, frequently expressed, was simple: "What the hell have you done in the game?"

Then they turned at Wembley in cream Armani suits. The FA Cup final had been turned into fancy dress day, a jolly boys' outing. You can only imagine the unremitting contempt on Keane's face as he looked those sartorial monstrosities up and down. With help from his trusted lieutenant Nicky Butt, Keane shut Liverpool down with remorselessness, concentration and intelligence. They had barely a chance all game. It was one of the great defensive-midfield performances. It meant the game, as hyped as any FA Cup final in the modern era, was a stinker, but are you going to tell Roy Keane that was a bad thing?

This is an extract from a chapter in Life's a Pitch: The Passions of the Press Box , which includes essays from 18 writers, including Dominic Fifield, Jonathan Wilson and Rory Smith, and a cover quote from Rafa Benitez: "These are the writers as you don't normally see them: when they are fans with pens."

Roy KeaneManchester UnitedRob Smyth
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Saturday football clockwatch - as it happened | Rob Smyth

Edin Dzeko scored two late goals to give ten-man City a vital win at West Brom, while West Ham thrashed Southampton

Preamble Good afternoon. Between us, the clockwatch is usually a bit of a duff gig: you can't see the matches, it's all a bit too frenetic and you only get one 47-second toilet break in a two-hour period. Today, however, I feel blessed that Tom Lutz decided he couldn't be bothered to do it has allowed me to do it. There are six games, and all of them look pretty interesting.

Fulham v Aston Villa
Liverpool v Reading
Manchester United v Stoke
Swansea v Wigan
West Brom v Man City
West Ham v Southampton

We have Dimitar Berbatov and ten toilers against 11 toilers; the Brendan disciples against the Brendan naysayers; Michael Owen returning to a hero's welcome at his old club; a La Liga match played in Wales; the champions going to Fortress Hawthorns; and an ostensible clash of football philosophies at Upton Park.

West Brom v Man City team news

West Brom (4-2-3-1): Foster; Tamas, McAuley, Olsson, Ridgewell; Mulumbu, Yacob; Dorrans, Morrison, Fortune; Long.
Subs: Luke Daniels, Popov, Rosenberg, Jara Reyes, Lukaku, Gera, Odemwingie.

Man City (4-4-2) Hart; Richards, Kompany, Lescott, Clichy; Milner, Y Toure, Barry, Nasri; Balotelli, Tevez.
Subs: Pantilimon, Zabaleta, Dzeko, Sinclair, Kolarov, Aguero, K Toure.

Referee: Mark Clattenburg (Tyne & Wear)

2.25pm As predicted, Rio Ferdinand isn't wearing a Kick It Out T-shirt. I just don't know what point he is trying to make.

2.29pm There are five minutes to go at White Hart Lane, where Chelsea lead 3-2 in an excellent if not great game. Follow the denouement with Scott Murray. I could have just said 'follow the rest of the game', couldn't I? Always with the big words, this one.

West Ham v Southampton team news

West Ham (4-3-3): Jaaskelainen; Tomkins, Collins, Reid, McCartney; Noble, Nolan, Diame; Benayoun, Carroll, Jarvis.
Subs: Spiegel, Cole, Maiga, Spence, O'Neil, Chambers, Hall.

Southampton (4-2-3-1): Boruc; Clyne, Hooiveld, Fonte, Yoshida; Schneiderlin, Steven Davis; Puncheon, Do Prado, Lallana; Rodriguez.
Subs: Kelvin Davis, Lambert, Ward-Prowse, Mayuka, Seaborne, Chaplow,
Reeves.

Referee: Neil Swarbrick (Lancashire)

Man Utd v Stoke team news

Man Utd (4-2-3-1): De Gea; Rafael, Ferdinand, Evans, Evra; Scholes, Carrick; Valencia, Rooney, Welbeck; Van Persie.
Subs: Lindegaard, Anderson, Giggs, Hernandez, Nani, Powell, Wootton.

Stoke (4-5-1): Begovic; Cameron, Huth, Shawcross, Wilson; Walters, Whitehead, Nzonzi, Adam, Kightly; Crouch.
Subs: Sorensen, Palacios, Jones, Owen, Upson, Etherington, Wilkinson.

Referee: Anthony Taylor (Cheshire)

Liverpool v Reading team news

Liverpool (4-2-3-1): Jones; Wisdom, Skrtel, Agger, Johnson; Gerrard, Allen; Sterling, Sahin, Suso; Suarez.
Subs: Gulacsi, Jose Enrique, Assaidi, Henderson, Downing, Carragher, Shelvey.

Reading (4-5-1): McCarthy; Cummings, Gorkss, Mariappa, Shorey; Kebe, Guthrie, Leigertwood, Karacan, McAnuff; Pogrebnyak.
Subs: Stuart Taylor, Gunter, Pearce, Le Fondre, McCleary, Robson-Kanu,
Roberts.

Referee: Roger East (Wiltshire)

Swansea v Wigan team news

Swansea (4-3-3): Vorm; Rangel, Chico, Williams, Davies; De Guzman, Ki, Britton; Routledge, Michu, Hernandez.
Subs: Tremmel, Graham, Dyer, Monk, Shechter, Moore, Tiendalli.

Wigan (3-4-3, maybe): Al Habsi; Ramis, Caldwell, Figueroa; Boyce, McCarthy, McArthur, Beausejour; Kone, Di Santo, Maloney. Subs: Pollitt, Jones, Watson, Gomez, McManaman, Boselli, Miyaichi.

Referee: Mike Jones (Cheshire)

2.54pm This email, from my colleague Grant Klopper means nothing to me as I still have a phone from 2002, but it might mean something to you under-90s. "You might want to give a shout out to mobile users to try the Clockwatch blog on the beta site, just remind them it is in beta ..."

Fulham v Aston Villa

Fulham: Schwarzer, Riether, Hughes, Hangeland, Riise, Sidwell, Baird, Richardson, Rodallega, Berbatov, Petric.
Subs: Stockdale, Senderos, Kasami, Karagounis, Diarra, Dejagah, Kacaniklic.

Aston Villa: Guzan, Lowton, Vlaar, Baker, Bennett, Ireland,
El Ahmadi, Delph, Holman, Bent, Agbonlahor.
Subs: Given,N'Zogbia, Albrighton, Benteke, Bannan, Weimann, Lichaj.

Referee: Chris Foy (Merseyside)

2.58pm Listen to Clive Tyldesley growling here. It almost sounds like he's having the world's first fatal goalgasm.

Who's hungry? I was until I saw what MOTDs Conor McNamara will be eating at Anfield today.

3pm Six men who may or may not have been bullied at school; six whistles; six nascent Premier League matches.

3.01pm "Is Rio seriously not wearing a Kick it Out shirt?" says Kevin Smith. "After all the shit his manager said about Jason Roberts' decision?"

Eh? What would that have to do with anything?

3.02pm "What's Ferguson's method of picking a keeper?" says Zach Neeley. "The possibilities seem endless." Weird, isn't it? Especially as one of those keepers is the best shot-stopper. There aren't too many precedents for this at the highest level. Ron Greenwood/Petr Shilton/Ray Clemence is the obvious one, but it can't be a good thing.

3.04pm "Conor McNamara's food," says Sam Bates. "Is that also the smallest coke bottle in recorded history? LFC must be spending all their budget on stalking 'journalists'."

3.05pm Dimitar Berbatov has already made two chances for Fulham, according to Chris Kamara on Sky. Berbarotica is going to be a recurring theme of this season now he has a manager who trusts him and – maybe – a stage with which he is more comfortable.

3.10pm "I can't believe I'm emailing your football clockwatch to discuss cricket," says Phil Podolsky, "but this lady I know got to hang out with John Emburey and was the recipient of some serious b***er. She learned that cricket can bridge cross-cultural barriers, and that b***er can be as important as batting. Worth a shout!"

B***er? Do you mean banter. My use of the word in full has nothing to do with the fact that, according to this, I have used the word 'banter' more than anyone else in the history of the Guardian website. I won't give up my crown easily. Banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter banter.

3.11pm: Manchester United 0-1 Stoke (Rooney own goal 10) Wayne Rooney scores the opening goal at Old Trafford. So far, so normal, but this time he has diverted a Charlie Adam free-kick into his own net. "It's a hown goal!" says Paul Merson on Sky. God bless him.

3.13pm Stoke almost made it 2-0 just then, with Charlie Adam trying to catch David de Gea out at the near post and almost succeeding.

3.14pm These are the latest Premier League scores. It's all happening.

Fulham 0-0 Aston Villa
Liverpool 0-0 Reading
Manchester United 0-1 Stoke
Swansea 0-0 Wigan
West Brom 0-0 Man City
West Ham 0-0 Southampton

3.17pm A note for those whose principal vice is nostalgia: you have seen this wonderful Match of the 90s archive, yes?

3.20pm Stoke usually roll over pathetically away to the big clubs, but not today. Jonathan Walters just had a half-chance to make it 2-0, and it sounds like Stoke have been much the better side thus far.

3.21pm "So how do you do MBMs?" says Chris B. "I'd always imagined some sort of Minority Report hi-tec thingy involving a massive screen and lots of waving your hands around to get the info on different matches at the same time. Possibly also involving poor, young interns sitting in some blue watery gunk feeding you the data."

That's remarkably close to the reality of the MBMs. Remarkably close. I don't need to describe how it actually works, because we have live footage from the webcam on my monitor.

3.22pm: James Milner sent off I'd like to see the look of Roberto Mancini's coupon right now. James Milner has been given a straight red card – the first of his career – by Mark Clattenburg. It was for a tackle on, er, a West Brom player, and Phil Thompson on Sky reckons a yellow card would have been more appropriate. If there's one place you don't want to go down to 10 men, it's Fortress Hawthorns.

3.24pm David de Gea has just made a fine save from Jon Walters at the end of an orgiastic burst of tiki-taka from Stoke. Yep. They are playing tiki-taka today, not kicki-hacka. "It's all Stoke," says Paul Merson. "Man United don't know how to cope. The keeper's keeping them in the game."

3.25pm A great point from my colleague Sean Ingle: United have conceded the first goal in six of their eight league games this season. They regularly conceded the first goal in the 1998-99 Treble season as well. This is where the comparisons between the two sides start and stop. Schmeichel-Neville-Stam-Johnsen-Irwin-Beckham-Keane-Scholes-Giggs-Yorke-Cole. And weep.

3.26pm "Monsieur Parkington-Smythe, when did football get so confusing? Is it now racist or not to wear an anti-racism T-shirt?" says Nathan Fisher. "I think we should be told."

GOAL! Manchester United 1-1 Stoke (Rooney 27) Wayne Rooney Tommyhutchisons United level with a fine goal, heading in a wonderful cross from Robin van Persie.

GOAL! Liverpool 1-0 Reading (Sterling 29) Raheem Sterling puts Liverpool ahead with his first senior goal, a fine finish according to Charlie Nicholas on Sky. He is the second youngest goalscorer in Liverpool's history after former footballer Michael Owen. Liverpool have been battering Reading, and Sterling alone could already have a hat-trick.

3.31pm "Afternoon Rob!" says Ryan Dunne. "Although the clockwatch is enjoyable enough on its own merits, today's is especially good as one can combine following it with watching (the much underrated) Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith on the telly! This, surely, is the stereotypical MBMer equivalent of James Bond saving the world and getting the girl."

3.32pm The latest scores.

Fulham 0-0 Aston Villa
Liverpool 1-0 Reading
Manchester United 1-1 Stoke
Swansea 0-0 Wigan
West Brom 0-0 Man City (James Milner sent off)
West Ham 0-0 Southampton

3.33pm "Milner's was a deserved red," writes 'not the' Chris Price. "Milner lunged at the Bromwich player at the top of the penalty area with the nearest City player several yards behind. And Mancini's expression was excellent.

3.34pm "Just had a look at the benches named at Old Trafford and there's little to choose between them," says Gary Naylor. "When did that happen?"

United do have around 47 injuries, in their defence.

3.35pm There are no hard footballers any more, right? Well ...

3.36pm "Beckham-Scholes-Keane-Giggs," says George Solomon. "Oh-me-oh-my. How unappreciated was that four at the time? Unreal." The last great British and Irish midfield, and probably the best.

3.37pm Can somebody score a goal please? I'm bored. Thanks.

3.38pm Goals please!

3.39pm Emails please!

3.42pm Danny Welbeck has hit the bar at Old Trafford, according to Paul Merson. Well, according to Paul Merson he has hit the Demba.

GOAL! Manchester United 2-1 Stoke (Van Persie 44) United have savaged Stoke in the last 15 minutes and now they lead. Antonio Valencia roasts his man in the usual style, screams the ball across the box, and Robin van Persie finishes adroitly. (I'm paraphrasing Merse with that description.)

3.45pm "I'm sorry," begins Sir Ian Botham Nick Smith, "but Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith is a crime against the original episodes. A bit like building a time machine and putting Joe Kinnear in charge of Barcelona." Which one of you is Sergio Busquets?

3.47pm Look at this goal. This is how you Brendan the ball out from the back.

3.48pm Rooney, by the way, is the first United player to score at both ends since David Beckham at Blackburn 11 years ago.

3.49pm It's half time. You want some latest scores, don't you.

Fulham 0-0 Aston Villa
Liverpool 1-0 Reading
Manchester United 2-1 Stoke
Swansea 0-0 Wigan
West Brom 0-0 Man City (James Milner sent off)
West Ham 0-0 Southampton

3.50pm "NO WAY should Milner have been sent off," says James Hopkin. "Lescott was a stride behind and gaining. Clattenberg is dishing out cards all over the place in this game, and he's always had it in for us (City). PS got a story on Radio 4 tonight, in the broadcasting blackhole of 12.30am – please help!" You do realise the clockwatch has an average readership of 4, don't you? And one of those is my imaginary friend.

3.51pm BANTER.

3.59pm "Is George Solomon having a laugh?" says Nick Thorp. "We appreciated the hell out of that midfield, not least in the Camp Nou in 99 when half of it was missing and the other half out of position. They had everything. Everything."

I don't think they were underrated but I do think they were taken slightly for granted – inevitable when you are winning the title by New Year's Day. I watched the 2000-01 DVD last night (order, ladies) and the aggression, conviction, economy and class of their football made me want that DeLorean real bad. That said, were they really as good as the famed quartet of Bellion-Kleberson-Djemba-Djemba-Miller?

4.02pm "Greatest British midfields?" says Jeremy Boyce. "Do me a lemon... Sorry to mention the nasties but perleeeeease give me Lorimer-Bremner-Giles-Gray any day. fit, fast, fighting (?) spirit, and ultimately more British given their history of heroic failure." Hmm. A great midfield, no question about that, but I'd take United's over them. And Everton 1984-85 and Liverpool 1978-79, great though they also were. The greatest midfield of all time? Hard to look past Fernandez-Giresse-Platini-Tigana I suppose.

4.03pm "Banter," banters Tom Chivers.

4.04pm: West Ham 2-0 Southampton (Noble 46, Nolan 47); Man Utd 3-1 Stoke (Welbeck 46) Goalscoring midfielder Mark Noble has chipped a free-kick past Artur Boruc, while Danny Welbeck has put Manchester United 3-1 up with a diving header from Wayne Rooney's excellent cross. In fact West Ham are 2-0 up now thanks to Kevin Nolan.

4.06pm Asmir Begovic has made an amazing save to deny Jonny Evans at Old Trafford. Stoke started this game extremely well, and could have gone 2-0 up, but they are in danger of a hiding now.

4.08pm "Milner's foul wasn't in the area, but when they are, it seems harsh to give the last man a red card AND the penalty," says Jordan Pickering. "What do you think of giving a penalty goal (rather than a penalty kick) and a yellow? Seems fairer to me."

Agree completely. The red card is for the denial of a clear goalscoring opportunity, but a penalty is a clear goalscoring opportunity. (Insert your own Jaap Stam joke here.)

4.09pm "But because West Germany beat Holland," says Gary Naylor, "we know that Steven-Reid-Bracewell-Sheedy beats Beckham-Scholes-Keane-Giggs." How many European Cups did they win? Eh?

4.10pm Reading have crossed the halfway line at Anfield. Not just that, they've had a good chance, with Brad Jones making an excellent save from Garath McCleary.

4.11pm "The greatest midfield of all-time is Spain's at Euro 2012," says Gary Naylor. "Mind you, there were nine of them."

4.12pm "RE: The greatest midfield of all time?" says Admir Paljiae. "Hard to look past Fernandez-Giresse-Platini-Tigana I suppose. Maybe Spanish midfield that conquered Europe (twice) and won World Cup?" Except that wasn't the same midfield, was it? Senna played in 2008. You could still make a very strong case for Busquets, Xavi and Iniesta of course. In fact I would pick them, I just have a default setting in my brain that doesn't consider anything since 2000.

4.14pm The latest scores.

Fulham 0-0 Aston Villa
Liverpool 1-0 Reading
Manchester United 3-1 Stoke
Swansea 0-0 Wigan
West Brom 0-0 Man City (James Milner sent off)
West Ham 2-0 Southampton

4.16pm "Re: Denmark's goal v Ireland," says John Foster. "What a goal. What a team. Elkjaer and Laudrup would both be in my 'turbulent geniuses' all-time XI, alongside Hagi, Stojkovic, Prosinecki, various other east European midfielders, and Dimitar Berbatov. Anyway, isn't this an opportune moment to plug the Twitter account of a certain upcoming Denmark-related book?"

Oh, is there one coming out? #banter

4.17pm: Manchester United 3-2 Stoke (Kightly 58) Michael Kightly, who was about to be substituted, has given Stoke a chance at Old Trafford. United have conceded 11 in the last six league games at home. There's a 2001-02 whiff about United this season. They are playing like a team managed by Kevin Keegan.

4.19pm Even with ten men, City are creating the better chances at the Hawthorns. Yaya Toure has just missed the best of all, heading over from a few yards.

4.21pm: West Ham 2-1 Southampton (Lallana 63) Adam Lallana converts Jay Rodriguez's mishit shot to bring Southampton back into the match at Upton Park.

4.22pm: Swansea 1-0 Wigan (Hernandez 65) Pablo Hernandez has scored his first goal for Swansea after a fine run from Wayne Routledge.

GOAL! Manchester United 4-2 Stoke (Rooney 65) Wayne Rooney taps in a loose ball to put United two ahead again. It's his third goal of the day, two of which have come at the right end.

GOAL! Swansea 2-0 Wigan (Michu) Michu has put Swansea two ahead, heading in Jonathan de Guzman's near-post corner. Laudrup in!

4.25pm "Garrincha-Zito-Didi-Zagallo," says Mike Gibbons. "Won the World Cup in Europe in 1958 and doubled up without Pele's help in Chile in 1962. That's Blockbusters." Ah, it would be, but many people will tell you Garrincha was a forward rather than a midfielder; apparently he played much further forward than Zagallo on the other flank. The word is Brazil were playing a kind of lopsided 1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1-1.

GOAL! Swansea 2-1 Wigan (Boyce 69) Can people stop scoring goals please? Emmerson Boyce has brought Wigan back into the match at Swansea, apparently with a kind of scorpion kick over his own shoulder. Emmerson Boyce do Nascimento.

4.28pm "Rob, your description of Adam Lallana's goal didn't really do it justice," says R Johnson. "A fine touch, spin and smash." It's almost as if I'm completely winging this with only Soccer Saturday for company!

4.29pm: West Brom 1-0 Man City (Long 67) Shane Long diverts Peter Odemwingie's miserable shot past Joe Hart to give West Brom the lead at Fortress Hawthorns. They've already beaten Liverpool and Everton at home; this would be on another level entirely.

4.30pm: West Ham 3-1 Southampton (Noble pen 72) Can people stop scoring goals please? West Ham have a decent tradition of penalty takers – Stewart, Dicks, Di Canio and now Noble. He rarely misses, and he has put West Ham further ahead from the penalty spot at Upton Park.

4.32pm "They aren't the greatest midfield of all time, but one of my favourite midfields is Argentina's from the Copa America in 2007," says Christopher Faherty. "It was Cambiasso-Mascherano-Veron-Riquelme. On paper it doesn't work. Where's the width? Two central, immobile playmakers? But there was such a lovely passing balance to them, intelligent players working intelligently for each other. Back when Messi was still a freewheeler and Tevez a charming, wavy-haired grafter too. Simpler times. Happier times." Veron was a glorious disgrace in that final, when they were hammered by Brazil.

4.34pm A rare sight indeed in modern times: Michael Owen is on the field at Old Trafford.

4.35pm "Could someone please buy Welbeck a set of studs?" says Jenny Sofia. "He always seems to be playing in bowling shoes - I have never seen anyone slip/fall over as much as Welbeck."

4.36pm Luis Suarez has just missed his 471st chance of the afternoon.

4.37pm "Cerezo, Zico, Falcao and the late great Socrates," says Richie Ramsahoye. Hmm. Serginho made that overrated shower look good.

4.38pm Manchester City will be seven points behind Chelsea if they lose today. That's a big gap, even in October. I wonder what odds you'd get on Roberto Mancini being gone by the start of next season. It's certainly not beyond the realms.

4.39pm Right, the latest scores.

Fulham 0-0 Aston Villa
Liverpool 1-0 Reading
Manchester United 4-2 Stoke
Swansea 2-1 Wigan
West Brom 1-0 Man City (James Milner sent off)
West Ham 3-1 Southampton

4.40pm: West Brom 1-1 Man City (Dzeko 80) For all his limitationos, Edin Dzeko scores some bloody important goals for Manchester City. I vaguely remember one last May. He's scored another today, coming off the bench to equalise at Fortress Hawthorns. That's a pretty impressive display of character from City, who were down a man and a goal.

4.41pm: Fulham 1-0 Aston Villa (Baird 84) Chris Baird has scored his triennial goal to put Fulham ahead at Craven Cottage.

4.42pm "How about the greatest midfields that could've/should've been (feasible ones, not Maradona-Cruyff-Messi dream teams)?" says Ryan Dunne. "Obvious pick: Figo-Zidane-Makelele-Beckham. And surely a Man U guy like yourself has pondered combinations that really could have utilised Veron for a Europe-conquering side?" I wouldn't waste a millisecond on that magnificent, fraudulent bald villain. All I think about is whether United would have won a record five or six titles in a row if Ferguson had not tampered with possibly the greatest midfield in British and Irish football history.

4.44pm: West Ham 4-1 Southampton (Maiga) The substitute Modibo Maiga has clinched victory for West Ham with a delicious curler. Southampton's defence? Bloody hell.

4.45pm "Maybe it's just because he was playing when i was getting into football but am I the only one who thinks Paul Ince was a great player when he was at United?" says David Flynn. "It's just me isn't it." Crikey, not at all. Until he got delusions of being a playmaker, he was immense.

4.46pm "Collins, McStay, Thom," says Stephen Finkel, "behind Van Hooijdonk, Cadate, DiCanio." And that's Blockbusters.

4.47pm Micah Richards has a header cleared off the line for Man City at the Hawthorns. These are the latest scores.

Fulham 1-0 Aston Villa
Liverpool 1-0 Reading
Manchester United 4-2 Stoke
Swansea 2-1 Wigan
West Brom 1-1 Man City (James Milner sent off)
West Ham 4-1 Southampton

4.48pm Southampton have conceded 24 goals in eight games. No team in Premier League history – not even Swindon, not even Man Utd when Fabien Barthez was having his phase – have let in that many at this stage of the season.

4.49pm "Mancini should be gone anyway," says Tom Barneby. "He'll never do it in Europe – see his meltdowns for Inter after the Liverpool game (when Moratti has to stop you quitting in the changing room at full time something is amiss), for City with the Tevez affair (when he was in a red hot funk after Dzeko didn't look happy when subbed off for Barry) and castigating Hart for saying the right thing after the Madrid defeat. Fergie would have had the title wrapped up by Easter with that squad and Mancini needed an extra time winner at home against QPR. They'll get rid and get Pep/Jose in." Yes, if you swapped managers like year City would have been won by at least 10 points, probably 20.

4.50pm Romelo Lukaku has missed a great chance to put the hurt of Manchester City, planting a header straight at Joe Hart from just 8.124441 yards. That would have been a goal for both his clubs, West Brom and Chelsea.

4.51pm Michel Vorm has made a save from his opposite number Ali al-Habsi at Swansea.

4.52pm: West Brom 1-2 Man City (Dzeko 90) Manchester City have won it! This is a sensational comeback with ten men. I have no idea how the goal came about; I do know that the substitute Edin Dzeko scored it, his second of the game. City have won four of their last eight league games in the final few minutes. They are few better habits for a football team to develop.

4.55pm "Can I guess that Wilson-Smyth-Murray-Lutz is a midfield that strikes hearts into teams all around the King's Cross area?" says Robin Hazlehurst. "If not it should be. And not necessarily only football teams."

4.56pm It has finished at West Brom, Liverpool, Manchester United and Swansea.

4.57pm Chelsea and Manchester City only took three points today, but the manner of their victories, on today of all days, will give them so much impetus for the next few weeks. They are both huge wins.

4.58pm It's finished at Fulham and West Ham. It finished there a few minutes ago; as the girl said in Peep Show, I'm a bit sloww.

4.59pmThese are the final scores.

Fulham 1-0 Aston Villa
Liverpool 1-0 Reading
Manchester United 4-2 Stoke
Swansea 2-1 Wigan
West Brom 1-2 Man City
West Ham 4-1 Southampton

I'm spent after a oxygenless second half. Ta for your emails. Night!

Premier LeagueRob Smyth
guardian.co.uk © 2012 Guardian News and Media Limited or its affiliated companies. All rights reserved. | Use of this content is subject to our Terms & Conditions | More Feeds

Andy Murray v Roger Federer – as it happened! | Rob Smyth

Andy Murray overpowered Roger Federer 6-4, 6-4 to move into the final of the Shanghai Masters

Preamble Yes, you're right. You've rumbled us. It's true: the semi-finals of the Shanghai Masters did not feature when we had our big imaginary editorial meeting to discuss the big live events of 2012. But it's Saturday, there's no football, there's no cricket, Bradley Wiggins isn't on his throne, and live-sport junkies need their fix. So we're going to do a game-by-game report of Andy Murray v Roger Federer. My Little Book of How To Hype Sporting Events Just So tells me that this is probably the most important game in the history of any sport, ever.

The winner will face glutenaversion's Novak Djokovic, who has just beaten Tomas Berdych in straight sets.

Does anybody have anything to talk about? If you were in any doubt as to how intrinsically cool Guardian people are, the sports desk are currently discussing whether you can taste the difference between Diet Coke and Coke Zero. Tom Lutz says yes; I say no. Hoxton weeps for us.

12.53pm "It's 10 pm here in Sydney," says Ed Jones, "and I've got to run for the Emirates' limo in a coupla hours – to be followed by 14'n'a half hours on the plane to Dubai – so I won't be able to follow the match live.

"My couple of dirhams' worth is: if Murray has got over his 'I'm tired, I'm sick and I'm playing soooooo bad', as he cried out during the match against Stepanek last night, he has a good chance of beating Saint Rog. Even though M. was mince against Stepanek, and his first-serve percentage was pathetic, there were still moments of the usual unpredictable genius. Murray now has a better idea than ever how of how to beat Roger and, subject to fitness and focus, I reckon he will do it. Whether he can continue, and beat Djokovic in the final, after his solid dismissal of Berdych, is another question. But he did it in five sets in the US, so why shouldn't he?"

12.59pm "There are some strong rumours floating around cycling websites and forums that athletes from other sports were linked to the naughty doctors uncovered in the Armstrong Usada report, including football and tennis," says John Davis. "Would you like to see these followed up (if true) if it led to the kind of soul-searching we've seen in cycling?"

You're darn tootin'. You'd have to be pretty naive to believe that any sport is completely clean, whether in terms of drugs, match-fixing or whatever.

1st set: Federer 0-1 Murray (Murray one break up) A cracking start from Murray, who breaks Federer to 15. The key shot was a vicious, beautifully directed backhand at 15-30. That gave Murray two break points, and he took the first with an authoritative whipped forehand. He ran all over Federer in that game.

"Afternoon Rob," says Simon McMahon. "Seeing as it's a tennis commentary, how about we talk about darts? It's the semi-finals of the World Grand Prix from Dublin tonight. Darts is long overdue a Guardian live commentary, don't you think?" We were talking about this in the pub last night. I'd love to do one. It depends mainly on resources but we might try to do the semis and the final of the World Championship. Darts isn't an ideal format for an MBM, though; it might work better with 10-minute updates rather than leg-by-leg descriptions.

1st set: Federer 1-1 Murray (with serve) A disdainful forehand from Federer gives him a chance at 0-30. He nets a forehand and then unsuccessfully challenges a cross-court backhand from Murray that was just in. Murray is hitting the ball as if he wants to kill it, to nick that great line from Sir Alex Ferguson, but he nets a forehand to give Federer a break point and then loses serve with an errant backhand. "Q" is the entire content of Yvonne Woodroof's email. It's more articulate than most we receive, honk honk.

1st set: Federer 2-1 Murray (with serve) Before and during points you could hear a rat piss on cotton; then there's a sudden explosion of noise, certainly when Federer wins a point. A long, classy rally at 40-30 ends when Federer, worked around the court by Murray, stretches to hit a forehand long. Murray has a break point after another long forehand, but Federer saves that and goes on to hold. This has been a fine start, really aggressive from both players.

1st set: Federer 2-2 Murray (with serve) Federer hits a couple of gorgeous shots, a staggeringly good in-to-out forehand a backhand down the line, but Murray is able to hold to 30.

"I'm sitting in a cafe in Nairobi waiting for a phone call that would confirm whether I've been hired or not," says Ken Mulumbi. "(Graduated from uni two months ago and the job in question is quite simply my dream job. Fingers crossed and all.) Who are you rooting for?" I just want tennis to be the winner. Okay, Murray, although I'm a bit of a glory hunter when it comes to tennis so it won't shatter my world if he loses. I'll cry in the toilets, sure, but I'll be okay. I'll get through it.

More importantly, what's the job?

1st set: Federer 2-3 Murray (Murray one break up) Consecutive double-faults from Federer – when did that last happen – gives Murray three break points. Make that three consecutive double faults! That is quite extraordinary. Murray has broken Federer – and he only needed to win one point to do so.

1st set: Federer 2-4 Murray (Murray one break up) Dear me, that's a diabolical forehand from Federer, blazed miles wide to the right. That, coming from someone so elegant and excellent, that was an incongruous as seeing Cate Blanchett in a neon shellsuit shouting "CAAAAAHNT" at everyone. Murray holds to 30.

"After Flushing Meadows, do you think watching Our Andy will ever be the same again?" says Ali Walker. "Less excruciating certainly, but is that a Good Thing? It's almost like a part of why-one-watches-sport died when he won the US Open. Next time he's struggling against a no-hoper in the third round of a Grand Slam it just won't have the same tension. Maybe at Wimbledon... Anyway, COME ON ANDY!!!"

You're darn tootin'. It's never the same after the first time, because the innocence has gone forever. It was kind of similar when England became really good at cricket, although in the last few months they have selflessly reverted to type in an attempt to enhance our viewing experience.

1st set: Federer 3-4 Murray (Murray one break up) An easy hold for Federer. "At Roland Garros, Murray berated himself with the magnificent 'I'm trying my tits off, here!'" says Matt Dony. "Any chances you think he'll manage to top that today? It's what court side mics were invented for."

1st set: Federer 3-5 Murray (Murray one break up) Apologies if the updates are a bit slow. I'm trying my tits off here! This is how that last game progressd: 0-15 (Murray's first double fault, after which, for a few tantalising seconds, he looked set to turn the air Scottish), 15-15, 30-15, 30-30, 40-30 (an angry 137kmh ace) and then game (another ace).

"Talking of great lines (and darts)," begins Simon McMahon. "I always smile when I think of one of the late Sid Waddell's many classics, as the camera lingered on the player at the back of the stage with pint in one hand and fag in the other, 'Jocky Wilson ... what an athlete!'." The word 'genius' was invented for Sid Waddell.

1st set: Federer 4-5 Murray (Murray one break up) Federer holds to 30, despite his fifth double fault of the match. He has been putting a bit too much juice into his second serve, presumably because of the quality of Murray's returns. Murray will serve for the set.

Murray wins the first set 6-4! Federer is hardly bothering the Murray serve at all. He wins a point after a long rally but is otherwise blown away: an ace either side of that rally gives Murray two set points. He needs only one, with Federer wafting a backhand long. Murray wasn't perfect in that set, but it was largely a superb, authoritative performance. He is seeing opponents through different eyes now. There is barely a hint of meekness or self-doubt.

2nd set: Federer 1-0, 4-6 Murray (with serve) Murray mangles the Federer second serve with a preposterously good cross-court backhand. That takes us to deuce, and Murray follows up with an even better forehand. What a shot! He had to stretch a long way to his right and blitzed the ball back whence it came. Murray is brutalising the Federer second serve. Even when Federer gets his first serve in, Murray is running him round the court. Federer just about hangs on to save four break points. A shocking unforced error gives Murray a fifth chance – and he hits the top of the net with a cross-court forehand. That could easily have dropped over.

I have no idea how Federer is still in this game. He saves a sixth break point and then asks the umpire to stop the game because of a wet court. They're going to close the roof, and Murray, with Wimbledon in mind, is obviously unhappy with that. That's a double boost for Federer: a timeout that he desperately needed, and the advantage of the roof being closed.

They're now going to carry on while the roof closes. This is mildly farcical. We had a seven-minute break between points, and this game has been going on since 1949. Federer nets a half-volley to give Murray his seventh break point of this game. In the past you could have gone through a calendar year without getting seven break points against Roger Federer. He saves the point at the end of an amazing rally that has just about everything. "One of the best points of 2012!" says the Sky commentator. That might be a turning point in the match, and Federer hurries through the next two points to finally hold. How on earth did he win that game? That was pure mental strength.

2nd set: Federer 1-1, 4-6 Murray (with serve) Murray holds to 30. I'm still reeling from that last game, which was entirely ridiculous. Apparently they are now not closing the roof, although that break has nonetheless changed the momentum of the match slightly.

"Greetings from Oz!" says Michelle. "Half past eleven, and attempting to churn out yet another English essay plan - the school-exams-to-end-all-exams start Monday. Let's just say the panic hasn't kicked in yet! I'm backing Murray, he's improved so much this year! And he's got a perfect record at Shanghai to extend!" Essay plans?! I knew I'd taken a wrong turn in life but I didn't realise it was by not doing essay plans at school. How different things could have been.

2nd set: Federer 2-1, 4-6 Murray (with serve) There are still far too many unforced errors from Federer. He clumps a backhand long to give Murray a sniff at 0-30 but then wins the next four points to hold. After the third, Murray does turn the air Scottish, shouting (I think), a trusty two-word phrase that ends with the word 'sake'.

"Gadzooks!" says Nathan Fisher. "I think I have deduced the reason you're struggling for emails! It's your middle-class surname. I sent you a message half an hour ago, and have just been told that no such user exists. I made the mistake of assuming your surname was spelt with an 'i' like every other 'Smyth' I've ever known. Anyway, if Murray wins this, does that make him a shoo-in for SPotY?" Middle class! Smythe is posh; Smyth is just Irish. Ain't no trust in my fund. I assume Murray has no chance of SPotY, although I'd give it to him.

2nd set: Federer 2-2, 4-6 Murray (with serve) Murray is chuntering incessantly, even though he looks reasonably comfortable on his serve. He holds for the sixth consecutive game, this time to 30.

"So what's been your sporting highlight of the year so far, Rob?" says Simon McMahon. "Quite a few to choose from; Wiggins in Paris, City 3-2 QPR, Spain's dismantling of Italy in the final of Euro 2012, Team GB, Pietersen at Headingley, Murray in New York, Ryder Cup Sunday. And that's not even to mention Dundee United 3-0 Dundee." Pietersen at Headingley, for sure. That, much more than any of the others, felt otherworldly. It's a decent rule of sport that the greatest things are those you remember for the manner of the achievement rather than the achievement itself, and that obviously applies to Pietersen. Simon Whitlock's nine-darter at the O2 was my second biggest highlight, since you asked.

2nd set: Federer 2-3, 4-6 Murray (Murray one break up) Murray has broken again! From 40-15 he played beautifully in that game. The second of two storming forehands gave him a break point, and he took it by stretching to his right to power Federer's first serve into the corner.

Simon McMahon's email prompts the obvious question: has there been a better British sporting year than 2012?

2nd set: Federer 2-4, 4-6 Murray (Murray one break up) It feels weird typing this, but Murray is just too good for Federer at the moment: too fast, too aggressive, too accurate, too much. He holds to 15 and is within two games of victory.

"For me, Pieterson in Colombo in the sporting moment of 2012," says Richard Lunt. "150 from 161, exploded a really tight match wide open. Great to be there and see the sixes flying to all corners!" That was an amazing innings, the sort that ensures you never forget where you were that day. In the bloody office, in my case.

2nd set: Federer 3-4, 4-6 Murray (Murray one break up) Federer keeps himself in the match, recovering from 0-30 to win four straight points for the second time in three service games. Crucially, however, he lost the other service game, so all Murray needs to do is hold his serve to win.

2nd set: Federer 3-5, 4-6 Murray (Murray one break up) Murray double faults to make it 40-30 and shouts a few sour nothings at himself. But all's well that etceteras well: he follows up with an ace that takes him to within one game of victory.

"'Murray is just good for Federer'" quotes Sarah Williams. "Agh, don't jinx the poor chap!" Trust me, I'm a tennis expert. A-hem.

2nd set: Federer 4-5, 4-6 Murray (Murray one break up) Federer holds to 30 despite another forehand howitzer from Murray, who will now serve for a place in the final.

"The short answer is, of course, no," says Simon McMahon. "For sustained excellence and achievement nothing comes close to this year. It almost seems a shame to rank one performance or individual above another such has been the consistent brilliance on display. Just like the Nobel prize given to the EU, can't we just give SPOTY this year to 'British Sport'?" Or to Rob Smyth maybe? Could this year really have happened without me? That's for others to decide.

2nd set: Federer 4-5, 4-6 Murray (Murray one break up) It's raining! Oh my. It's a bit heavier this time, and they are going to close the roof. That should take around eight minutes 21.247823421 seconds. We haven't had any points in Murray's service game yet.

2.58pm Apparently it is going to take around 20 minutes to close the roof. Twenty minutes! The players, who were originally told it was only going to take a few minutes, were hanging around but now they have done one.

2.59pm "Since you asked, Simon, mine was the Euro final," says Phil Podolsky. "The greatest national side of them all replies to its critics in emphatic style (thus corroborating at least some of their arguments, yeah, okay). And the highlight of that was the first goal, a header that was all about speed of reaction and rapport with the ball rather than athleticism. Silva coaxed the ball into the corner with hardly as much as a nod, an underrated finish stylistically continuous with Iniesta's and Fabregas's deservedly feted buildup rather than resembling, say, Andy Carroll's gloriously emphatic goal against Sweden or most headers for that matter."

3.01pm "Just tuned in," says Jess McGongile, "have the players left because oppa gangnam style is blaring out?"

Quite possibly. It's time to start a new official Guardian campaign: STOP EVERYTHING GANGNAM.

3.03pm An interlude.

3.04pm "So ... while we're waiting for the roof ..." says Sarah Williams. "Any news whether Ken in Nairobi got the job?" None at all. Come on Ken, any news? Twos of readers are on tenterhooks!

3.06pm "Tino Best at Edgbaston," says Matt Dony. "Bonkers and never-to-be-repeated innings. Marvellous."

3.09pm "Threes!" says Julia Gilbertson. "Did he get the job? And what is it?"

Nobody knows. I need to know. Let me check if he's on Twitter. Is that stalking? It was just game-by-game text-based commentary banter your honour!

3.11pm "Watching the match from Dominican Republic in the Caribbean," says Paola Barcacel. "The +10 hours time difference is not ideal, but oh well ... Good luck to Murray!"

3.13pm "Andy's not much of a face-puller, is he?" says Andrew Benton. "I saw Laura Robson at the Beijing tennis open a couple of weeks ago, and her visage was contortion-free.... her Japanese and Italian opponents, on the other hand, seemed to be in immense pain when hitting the ball... Is it a British thing? Does Tennis GB frown on such facial contortions?" No emotion please we're British.

3.14pm We've had official confirmation that the roof should be closed within the next 72 years.

3.20pm: HE'S DONE IT! "I check back in to find out who won only to find the masses clamouring for news," says Ken Mulumbi. "Well........... I GOT THE JOB! I am going to get absolutely smashed tonight. It's a software design job, I'm a programmer. Pays well enough that I can move out of home on my first salary. Quite happy. And quite thankful. Now you know. Go Roger!"

3.21pm The players are back out. The roof is on and, in a couple of minutes' time, Andy Murray will serve for the match.

3.22pm "Rhye?! That's my friend's project..." says Peter Corway. "Completely bizarre that it has popped up in a Guardian MBM during a Shanghai Masters Semi-Final. Anyway, regarding sporting events, it's difficult to overlook the European Sunday Ryder Cup comeback. I won the Ryder Cup AND the Nobel Peace Prize in 2012. In my mid twenties I have already achieved two of my life ambitions."

MURRAY BEATS FEDERER 6-4, 6-4 AND WILL PLAY NOVAK DJOKOVIC IN TOMORROW'S FINAL Murray cruises through his final service game, losing only one point, to complete an excellent victory. At times he played with merciless purpose and he had a bit too much for a subdued Federer. He will play Novak Djokovic in the final tomorrow; Ken Mulumbi will start his dream job soon. The world is a good place. Thanks for your emails; bye.

TennisAndy MurrayRoger FedererRob Smyth
guardian.co.uk © 2012 Guardian News and Media Limited or its affiliated companies. All rights reserved. | Use of this content is subject to our Terms & Conditions | More Feeds

Football Weekly Extra: World Cup qualifiers, and where is Franny Jeffers?

James Richardson has Amy Lawrence, Paul Doyle and Rob Smyth in the pod for one of our infamous international preview shows.

We do our very best to look forward to the key fixtures in the World Cup qualifiers, including England's 1-0 victory over San Marino, a must-win game for Chris Coleman's as Wales take on Scotland, and Ireland's inevitable tonking at home to Germany.

Also in the podcast, we discuss diving, oddball managerial motivational techniques, and Newcastle's controversial sponsorship deal with Wonga, before marveling at Francis Jeffers' latest career move – to Maltese side Floriana, since you asked– and praising other English exports who have taken their skills to far flung places.

Yup, it's a classic edition of Football Weekly Extra.

Barry Glendenning, John Ashdown and James Dart will be struggling to fill pod airtime on Monday. Your suggestions for some topics are most welcome.

James RichardsonBen GreenAmy LawrenceRob SmythPaul Doyle

Australia v West Indies – as it happened | Rob Smyth

The West Indies destroyed Australia by 74 runs to reach their first World Cup final since 1983

Preamble It's 1996. Cool Britannia is in full swing, with Britain is in the process of disappearing up its own hubris alley, not to be seen again for a few years. Keith Allen is redefining ubiquity. Middle-class people who get squeamish during a flu jab are embracing the delusion of empathy with Mark Renton. Five unknowns really really really wanna zig-a-zig-ahhhhh. Damien Hirst is turning cows and formaldehyde into £100 notes. And West Indies and Australia are meeting for the right to play Sri Lanka in a World Cup final.

That classic World Cup semi-final, when Australia recovered 15 for four to win by five runs after a staggering feat of bottlejobbery from the West Indies, was so good that it even overshadowed the Bis/Super Furry Animals concert at The Stage in Hanley that Thursday night. The decline of West Indies cricket has been such that, in the 6049 days since, the two teams have not played each other in the knockout stage of a World Cup.

Today they meet, if not quite on equal terms, then at least with a West Indies win a realistic possibility. Australia beat the West Indies comfortably in the group stages – they were cruising even before Duckworth/Lewis came into play – but, as we saw against Pakistan, they are dangerously dependent on their magnificent top three. Then again, West Indies are pretty dependent on their big two: Chris Gayle and Sunil Narine. Gayle has brutalised Australia in T20s before and, on this crumbling Colombo surface, Australia will do well to shiv Narine. Shiv Narine! And the award for worst and most contrived cricket pun of 2012 goes to ...

The match starts at 2.30pm English time. The winners will be back here on Sunday; the losers need to remember where they put their passports.

Pre-match bits and bobs

• A friend is working on a fascinating documentary about the stories and memories of the inhabitants of the last post-war prefab estate in London. You can see/read more here and, should you be so inclined, you can back the project with cold, hard cash. (Well, okay, cold, hard, internet-transferred money.) Even I am going to transfer some money just as soon as I stop forgetting to do so. Go on. Ten dollars, what's that? That's just the two extra drinks you're going to have tonight which will lead you to a regrettable drinking-and-dialling incident.

(I was never much good at this peer-pressure lark.)

• A few weeks ago we had the first Guardian cricket-writing masterfarceclass. It was an enjoyable day during which Selve and I met some really nice and talented people. One of those, Tom Maston, is looking for writers for his blog. If you are interested, let me know and I'll forward your details on to Tom.

1.44pm "While it is true that the man in your picture requires no caption for those of us following this match," begins Brendan Large, "it may look a little strange to anyone accidentally finding this page and lead to some serious questions as to the meaning of OBO."

If Hollyoaks and A Question of Sport can have post-watershed versions, there's no reason why we shouldn't try it. Can someone please start an online petition for the Guardian to publish a weekly cricket erotica column: Fifty Shades of Gray-Nicolls by Andy Bull.

1.52pm "Why does a new batsman, upon reaching the crease, take off one of the bails, knock the ends into the ground with the bat, and then replace the bail?" says Ethan Forbes. "Are they superstitious? Marking their territory? Reminiscing back to their childhood playing in the sandbox? What is it?"

I have, you might not be surprised to hear, no idea. But I'm sure one of our ones of readers will know. Anyone? Anyone?

West Indies have won the toss and will bat first. George Bailey says he would have batted as well, which tells you how important a toss it is because Australia have chased brilliantly for most of this tournament. Both sides make one change. Dwayne Bravo is fit enough to replace his brother Darren, although he won't be able to bowl, while Australia bring in David Hussey for Glenn Maxwell. Both sides have at least four slow bowlers they could use on this tired pitch.

Australia Warner, Watson, M Hussey, Bailey (c), White, D Hussey, Wade (wk), Cummins, Starc, Hogg, Doherty.

West Indies Charles, Gayle, Samuels, Dwayne Bravo, Pollard, Russell, Ramdin (wk), Sammy (c), Narine, Badree, Rampaul.

2.07pm "Bails!" says Tom Wilson. "They're taking their guard! You need a bail to do that on the hard West Indian pitches which has probably led to the habit..." Ah, of course. I was being thick. And I've never played on West Indian pitches, sadly.

This is what Enery Gayle did to Australia at the 2009 World Twenty20.

2.28pm "Convincing win in the end for the Australian women earlier," says Simon McMahon. "Don't know if you caught it, but the quality of discussion and analysis after that game from Nass and Atherton was top-drawer, again showing why cricket is the king (and queen) of sports. Can you imagine Shearer and Hansen discussing women's football with the same level of insight and authority? Actually, don't answer that."

In fairness – because I'm always a fair man – you could imagine Gary Neville doing the same. I did see it and it was excellent, especially Nasser cooing over Ellyse Perry's action. The days when people were critical of Sky's coverage seem a long, long time ago. It's probably the best sports coverage I've ever seen, with the obvious exception of the homoerotic wrestling on ITV on Saturday lunchtimes.

1st over: West Indies 2-0 (Charles 1, Gayle 0) Mitchell Starc, the excellent left-arm swing bowler, will take the first over. His third and fifth balls are superb inswinging yorkers that Johnson Charles digs out. Charles does sometimes have dot-ball issues – dot-ball issues and the new rock-and-roll breakdown – and there are five of them in that over.

"Rally Round The West Indies has to be my favourite cricket song ever," says Matthew Share. "Bumboclart put the lyrics up BTL the other day." This is great, of course.

2nd over: West Indies 12-0 (Charles 9, Gayle 1) Shane Watson will share the new ball. He's the bookies' favourite to finish as the top wicket taker in the tournament. Our friends at Oddschecker tell us you could get 225-1 on him before the tournament; he's now 4-5. He dismissed Gayle in the group match between these sides and has a knack of taking important wickets. Not in that over, however. Charles, having made one from his first eight balls, drags a big drive over midwicket for four, with the ball hitting the rope on the half-volley. Two balls later he drags another drive wide of mid on for four more. As Nasser Hussain said earlier on Sky, there's a touch of Kieswetter in Charles's block-block-thwack approach. Gayle has only faced one ball so far.

WICKET! West Indies 16-1 (Charles c Wade b Starc 10) Mitchell Starc is rewarded for a superb start with the ball. He found the edge four times in five balls in that over, and the last of those brought the wicket. Johnson Charles went for an ugly, leaden-footed slap at a ball that took the edge and went straight through the keeper Wade. Outstanding stuff from Starc, who looks ominously good.

3rd over: West Indies 17-1 (Gayle 3, Samuels 1) Starc's first ball to Samuels takes the inside edge, so he found the edge with five out of six deliveries in that over. Australia have found one here all right.

"If Neville did the cricket," is the subject of Mike Murphy's email. "Perhaps we might see a 'Torresgasm' moment from the commentary box (2.28pm) in today's match – I imagine that Ambrose and Richardson conspiring for a run out in that 96 semi with the end in sight might well have tipped 'our Gary' over the edge."

4th over: West Indies 23-1 (Gayle 4, Samuels 6) Samuels drives the new bowler Pat Cummins wide of mid-off for four, a sumptuous stroke that has retinas of the world uniting in approval. At the other end Gayle hasn't really got going, although he has only faced six balls. He likes to take a bit of time to get his eye in and allow his muscles to wake up.

"Please take the picture down," says Simon McMahon. "Every time I see it I start hearing the words:

I'm Chris, Virgo.
Take my hand, come with me, baby, to Love Land
Let me show you how sweet it could be...

Make it stop."

5th over: West Indies 33-1 (Gayle 10, Samuels 8) [MarkNicholas] Christopher Henry Gayle! [/MarkNicholas] After four from his first nine balls, he more than doubles his strike rate by blasting a full delivery from Watson miles over wide mid-off for six! That's what we've all skipped Countdown for.

6th over: West Indies 46-1 (Gayle 16, Samuels 15) Xavier Doherty comes into the attack. His first ball turns sharply away from Samuels, who edges it just short of slip, and the second brings a huge LBW shout. Aleem Dar thought about that for ages before saying not out. Samuels pushed defensively outside the line of a ball that straightened and would have hit the top of middle stump, but I have a feeling, having seen a replay, that Samuels jammed the ball at the same moment it hit the pad. If Aleem Dar spotted that, he isn't human.

Samuels drives a sweet, effortless six over long-on two balls later – and then Gayle drives his first ball from Doherty over midwicket for a mighty six! "Give over!" says Bumble. That was a monstrous hit, 94 metres. Orthodox left-arm spin to Chris Gayle? Good luck with that. The way Gayle constructs a T20 innings in fascinating: four from nine balls, then 12 from two.

7th over: West Indies 53-1 (Gayle 16, Samuels 22) Brad Hogg's first ball of the match is driven thrillingly down the ground for a flat six by Samuels. That's the fourth six in eight balls and the third in four. Hogg has seen it all before, of course, and follows up with an excellent wrong'un that completely befuddles Samuels. There is a stumping referral after some smart work from Wade; Samuels was just back in time. Samuels can't pick Hogg's wrong'un.

"Look I know I shouldn't say this, but does cricket (well, international cricket)
need Chris Gayle more than Chris Gayle needs cricket?" says Gary Naylor. "If so, there's something awry, for all the wonder of the man." How do you mean?

WICKET! West Indies 57-2 (Samuels b Cummins 26) This is high-class bowling from Pat Cummins. He had been smoked through extra cover for four by Samuels but had the nerve to try a slower ball next up. Samuels heaved all over it and it made the acquaintance of his middle stump. Samuels made an excellent 26 from 20 balls, an innings that was both aesthetic and brutish.

8th over: West Indies 59-2 (Gayle 17, Dwayne Bravo 1) Gayle has faced only 12 out of 48 deliveries in this innings, which is ridiculous. "Pat Cummins – stunning slower ball," says James Pennington. "Him and James Pattinson will win us the Ashes back next year. Heard it here first..." Steve Waugh sort of said it a year ago, with his usual terrifying conviction. It'll be really interesting to see who the seamers are next year. Starc looks excellent to me but I realise the new, improved Peter Siddle is the top man in Tests at the moment.

9th over: West Indies 64-2 (Gayle 18, Dwayne Bravo 5) Bravo is a good nurdler and he needs to take a run a ball here to give Gayle the strike as much as possible. Instead he drives Hogg in the air towards long-off, where David Hussey can't decide whether to go for the catch or stop the ball. In the end he does neither, with the ball kicking up sharply off the turf and over his hands for four. Five from Hogg's over, a really good one.

10th over: West Indies 74-2 (Gayle 26, Dwayne Bravo 7) This is a seriously risky decision from George Bailey, who has fed Xavier Doherty to Chris Gayle. He bowls around the wicket, and Gayle slaughters the second ball over long-on with chilling economy. See ball, murder ball. We used to say that big-hitting batsmen don't deal in singles, instead just hitting boundaries. Today Gayle isn't even dealing in fours: all his three boundaries have been sixes.

11th over: West Indies 83-2 (Gayle 28, Dwayne Bravo 10) Australia need Gayle. Whether it's by hook, crook or a long hop that is mowed to deep midwicket, they need Gayle in the next two or three overs or this could be not entirely pretty for them. When was the last time a player had such an aura in any form of the game? You're arguably going back to Viv. Anyway, David Hussey comes into the attack, with his first over going for nine. A low full toss to Bravo from around the wicket goes through the unsighted Wade's legs for four byes, at which point Wade inadvertently uses the stump mic to share a popular four-letter word with TV viewers around the world.

"That picture of Gayle you had earlier," says Daniel Harris. "Henry shaves his pits. THERE ARE NO HEROES."

12th over: West Indies 91-2 (Gayle 29, Dwayne Bravo 12) It's a measure of Starc's performance in this tournament that Gayle is taking very few risks against him. Starc's third over is another excellent one, with the exception of a delivery speared down Gayle's leg side for five wides.

"What I mean re: Gayle, is the old saw about international cricket's calendar being squeezed by domestic tournaments that pay big (or even not so big) money (certainly compared to the resources of some boards). The argument is always that a player needs to play international cricket to have the profile required – maybe Chris Gayle just doesn't need it. He, like his hitting, is big enough!" Hmm, I've never really thought about it like it. You could certainly argue he doesn't need Test cricket (which is a significant concern) but I do think he needs international cricket. He should definitely have his own chat show, though. It would have to be conducted on a bed, like Paula Yates used to do.

13th over: West Indies 104-2 (Gayle 33, Dwayne Bravo 21) Shane Watson's third over disappears for 13. Bravo flicks him just wide of the diving Bailey at midwicket and then drives a handsome six over long-on. Gayle completes an expensive over with a tickle past short fine leg for four. Gayle has faced only 23 of the 78 deliveries so far. It's enough to remind a girl of Carl Hooper being deprived of the strike during the heartbreaking NatWest semi-final of 1994. It's not doing the West Indies much harm at the moment though; they are on course for a mighty score.

14th over: West Indies 113-2 (Gayle 34, Dwayne Bravo 29) Bravo throws his entire body – his entire being, darling – at a short ball from Hogg, launching it over midwicket for a swashbuckling flat six. Gayle faces only one delivery in that over too, and Bravo will have the strike for the next over. This is almost bizarre. Gayle has 34 from 24 balls, Bravo 29 from 27.

"Does Chris Gayle need Gary Naylor more than Gary Naylor needs Chris Gayle?" says Neill Brown.

15th over: West Indies 132-2 (Gayle 50, Dwayne Bravo 30)
Breaking news: Chris Gayle has just monstered David Hussey for an amazing six over long-on. That went 102 metres! It equals the biggest six of the tournament, hit by Marlon Samuels. Gayle drags the next ball towards deep midwicket, where Starc makes a really brave attempt to take the catch and is hit on the chin when the ball kicks up off the pitch. A couple of fours – one savaged, one steered ingeniously wide of short third man – make it 19 from the over and take Gayle to the usual half-century from 29 balls. He is the Twenty20 Bradman.

"Why would you have fine leg up in the 12th over of a T20 match!?" says SB Tang. "You risk a boundary and all you get in return is the potential benefit of a saved single. That makes no sense. Oh man, and now Bailey's got third man up when Hogg's bowling. Inexplicable."

WICKET! West Indies 140-3 (Dwayne Bravo c Bailey b Cummins 37) Dwayne Bravo throws every sink in the house at a full delivery from Pat Cummins, launching it miles in the air and eventually over long-off for the ninth six of the innings. He's out next ball, driving straight to extra cover, where Bailey takes the catch at the second attempt to end a joyous, unfettered innings of 37 from 31 balls.

16th over: West Indies 142-3 (Gayle 51, Pollard 2) Some respite for the Aussie bowlers – the new batsman is Kieron Pollard.

17th over: West Indies 150-3 (Gayle 56, Pollard 3) Up to now Gayle has shown respect to Starc, Hogg and Cummins, scoring eight from 13 balls off them, but has targeted Doherty (14 off five), Hussey (18 off seven) and Watson (15 from nine). He inside edges four more through square leg off Watson, whose last over goes for eight in total. That includes two byes after a rare fumble from Wade. Watson ends with R-rated figures of 4-0-35-0.

18th over: West Indies 163-3 (Gayle 61, Pollard 10) Gayle was treated between overs for a problem with his side. I think he's pulled a muscle. He's going to continue for now, although any big shots will probably hurt. Not as much as they'll hurt Australia. Gayle, moseying down the track, beasts a short ball from Cummins over midwicket for four. A wonderful clip through midwicket brings Pollard his first boundary and makes it 13 from the over. Pollard He has 10 from nine balls, Gayle 61 from 36.

"I note that M J McCague took his 100th List A wicket in that match (13th over) though," says Colin Orr. "Mid 90s domestic semi-finals were such sweet sorrow..." As were the finals, or at least Aravinda's Final in 1995.

19th over: West Indies 180-3 (Gayle 68, Pollard 20) West Indies made 191 against Australia in the group stage and lost, although that was a different pitch. They should reach 191 here because Starc's last over has gone for 17. Gayle flicks high over midwicket for his fifth six – his sixes are barely noteworthy anymore – and then Pollard flicks a boundary to square leg after a misfield from Mike Hussey. He was done by the spin of the ball when it bounced, but he should still have stopped it. The next ball is ramped brilliantly for four by Pollard; it almost went for six in fact.

20th over: West Indies 205-4 (Gayle 75 not out; Pollard c Warner b Doherty 38) Oh my goodness. Xavier Doherty is going to bowl the last over. To Chris Gayle and Kieron Pollard. That's a serious risk from George Bailey. Unsurprisingly, it's a disastrous decision. Doherty has gone for 25, including four sixes! The first ball is a disgusting full toss that Gayle belabours for a 97-metre six. He's holding his side, though I'm not sure if it's the injury or if he's laughing at his own brilliance. As ever, he has a big smile on his face.

Pollard then hammers three consecutive sixes, the first to midwicket and the second and third launched viciously down the ground. The last in particular was huge, and had Bumble screaming "Wallllllllllloooooooooooooooop!" It was an uber-wallop. He went for another off the final ball but was caught brilliantly at long-off. No matter, because West Indies have posted a stunning total here. Pollard made 38 from 15 balls, while Gayle made 75 not out from 41. Imagine how many they'd have got if he'd had his share of the strike! Doherty's figures are X-rated: 3-0-48-1. He went for seven sixes. There were 14 sixes overall. Australia need snookers, a miracle, and 206 from 20 overs. See you in 10 minutes.

INNINGS BREAK "Some might say that bowling Doherty in the final over was a mistake, but he got his man in the end," says Simon Huxtable. "Who's laughing now?"

WICKET! Australia 2-1 (Warner b Badree 1) What a start for the West Indies! The legspinner Samuel Badree has bowled David Warner with the last ball of the first over. It was a strange dismissal, because there was hardly any appeal and most people thought the ball had missed the stumps before deflecting back onto them via the pads of the keeper Ramdin. The umpire Kumar Dharmasena went upstairs just in case, and the replays showed that the ball has brushed the outside of the off stump.

1st over: Australia 2-1 (target 206; Watson 1, M Hussey 1) It almost kicked off just before that wicket. Watson, Warner, Samuels and Sammy had words before a ball was bowled, with the umpires stepping in to calm things down.

"Yup, I agree that Bailey shouldn't have bowled Doherty in the final over," says SB Tang. "In Bailey's defence, Doherty's consistently been the best spinner in Australian domestic limited-overs cricket for several years now and Bailey's his state captain. Doherty never let Bailey down for Tasmania ..."

2nd over: Australia 11-1 (target 206; Watson 2, M Hussey 7) Australia are getting a whisper of pad music, with the offspinner Marlon Samuels starting at the other end. Mike Hussey drives him nicely down the ground for four, is beaten on the inside by a quicker delivery that doesn't miss off stump by much and then cuts the last delivery for three. Surely Hussey will have to bat almost all of the innings if Australia are to win. Impossible targets in World Twenty20 semi-finals? Mike Hussey will tell you there is no such thing.

"A pundit has just described Gayle's 75 from 41 as "anchoring" the West Indies innings," says Neill Brown. "With figures like that, surely a more accurate word than 'anchor' is needed? I can't think of one, as that sort of batting (like Twitter, or women) is something I just don't understand."

3rd over: Australia 22-1 (target 206; Watson 2, M Hussey 18) Hussey has started exceptionally and puts Badree away for consecutive boundaries behind square on each side of the wicket. Eleven from the over. If they do that every over they'll win. Simples.

"I was at the '95 Aravinda Final," says Jonathan Lewis. "What a player. Always remember a Kent player came out in a floppy sun hat to face Wasim at his peak and played him brilliantly. Brave man." It was a young David Fulton, playing in the biggest game of his career by a distance. He kept pulling Was for four, too, until he got a grubber from someone else when he'd made 25 or so.

WICKET! Australia 22-2 (M Hussey ct and b Samuels 18) A huge wicket for the West Indies. Mike Hussey top-edges a slog sweep straight up in the air, and the bowler Samuels takes the skier comfortably before volleying the ball away in celebration. Hussey made 18 from 12 balls; with him, surely, goes Australia's chance of winning this game.

4th over: Australia 24-2 (target 206; Watson 7, White 1) Watson misses a muscular slog-sweep at a ball from Samuels that zips under the bat. The next ball is too short and he rocks back to smash a cut through the covers for four. Australia need 178 from 16 overs.

WICKET! Australia 29-3 (Watson b Badree 7) It's all over now! Not only are Australia three down, they've lost their T20 holy trinity. Watson tries to pull a ball from Badree that is a fraction too full and skids through to hit the stumps.

5th over: Australia 31-3 (target 206; White 1, Bailey 2)
"You put the commentator's curse on Huss Rob!" says SB Tang. "He was, in classic Huss fashion, looking as solid as a rock until you (unwittingly?) unleashed the evil curse from your English fingertips ... It'd be a good time for David Hussey and George Bailey — who both possess outstanding domestic limited overs records, but distinctly underwhelming international records — to finally get it done at international level." No chance. You could have a five-six-seven of Symonds, Miller and Gilchrist and you wouldn't win this.

6th over: Australia 42-3 (target 206; White 4, Bailey 10) Bailey blasts Samuels for consecutive boundaries to long off. Defiant stuff, but surely it won't make any difference.

"Forfeit," says Simon McMahon. "If the Windies don't win this, Rob, I'm going to have the picture of Chris Gayle from earlier tattooed onto my eyeball." Some people do actually tattoo their eyes, don't they. The eff's that about?

WICKET! Australia 42-4 (White c Ramdin b Rampaul 5) With the Powerplay over it's safe to bring on the quick bowlers. How about-face does that sound? Anyway, whateverrrr, because Ravi Rampaul has struck first ball! Cameron White was strangled down the leg side, flicking at a full delivery and giving a straightforward catch to Ramdin.

WICKET! Australia 42-5 (D Hussey ct and b Rampaul 0) This is turning into a humiliation for Australia. David Hussey is bounced out second ball, getting a leading edge that plops straight up in the air for Rampaul to take a simple return catch. He had serious trouble with the short ball in the Caribbean earlier this year; clearly not all Husseys like it up 'em. What a performance from the West Indies – and Sunil Narine hasn't bowled a ball yet.

7th over: Australia 43-5 (target 206; Bailey 10, Wade 1) For the second time in the tournament, Ravi Rampaul has started with two wickets in his first over. If Australia win this it will make Adelaide 2006 look like a routine crossing of Is and dotting of Ts.

"Re: Neill Brown's point in the second over," says Luke Williams. "Gayle's 75 'thrust' the WI innings?" For the sake of Simon McMahon's sanity, no.

WICKET! Australia 43-6 (Wade c Badree b Narine 1) With Matthew Wade on strike, Darren Sammy turns to Sunil Narine – and it takes him only two balls to dismiss his bunny! This is extraordinary. Wade has a shocking head-to-head record against Narine in international cricket, and it's just worse: two balls, no runs, one wicket. Wade top-edged a sweep to short fine leg, where Badree backpedalled to take a routine catch.

8th over: Australia 49-6 (target 206; Bailey 16, Cummins 0) "Badri Narain is a famous pilgrimage in India," says Narayana Rao. "In this match, Badree has wrecked the Australian batting already before Narine came into action."

9th over: Australia 53-6 (target 206; Bailey 17, Cummins 1) West Indies have been in some Champions Trophy finals – they won it in 2004 – but this will be their first World Cup final since 1983. Rampaul continues, conceding four from the over. George Bailey is a proud man and he won't want Australia to be rolled for 70 or 80 here, especially as it could be his last game as Australia captain.

10th over: Australia 64-6 (target 206; Bailey 28, Cummins 3) Bailey slog-sweeps Badree for a six,with a lovely clunk off the bat. Badree ends with excellent figures of 4-0-27-2; those wickets of the two Ws pretty much finished the match.

"Could this be the biggest defeat in T20 history, the mighty Aussies in a World Cup semi final?!?" says Matt Renshaw. "Oh how I wish I were watching, sounds delightful." The biggest margin of victory by runs in a T20 international is an absurd 172, although the biggest against a Test-playing nation is 103 runs.

11th over: Australia 89-6 (target 206; Bailey 49, Cummins 7) This is an admirably proud innings from George Bailey, who has just smashed Andre Russell's first over for 25: six down the ground, four over extra cover, four more when Rampaul at long-off ran in too far and dropped a straightforward catch, and finally a majestic driven six over midwicket. Cummins finished the job by flicking another piece of rubbish to fine leg for four.

"Here's a question for your statistician," says V Balaji. "If you counted Australia 6s as wickets, 4s as dot-balls, dot-balls as 4s and wickets as 6s, would
they be on track now to win this game?" He's on it.

12th over: Australia 96-6 (target 206; Bailey 51, Cummins 10) Darren Sammy turns to Sunil Narine to restore some order. Bailey taps a single to reach his half-century from only 23 balls, and a single from Cummins later in the over brings up the fifty partnership from 26 balls. They need 110 from 48 balls. No, it can't.

"The opposite of an anchor is a propeller, surely?" says John Starbuck. "Though in Gayle's case, it was more like a ramjet."

13th over: Australia 107-6 (target 206; Bailey 59, Cummins 13) Bailey cuffs yet another six, his fourth and the 18th of the match, over midwicket off Darren Sammy. Never mind this possibly being his last game; he'll have a job for life if he finds a way to win this.

WICKET! Australia 111-7 (Bailey c Russell b Pollard 63) George Bailey lived by the deep midwicket boundary, and now he has died by it, holing out off the new bowler Kieron Pollard. His clean-hitting 63 took just 29 balls.

WICKET! Australia 111-8 (Cummins c Charles b Pollard 13) On commentary, Mark Waugh is still talking as if Australia can win this. You might snigger, but it demonstrates the mindset of that amazing team, without which they wouldn't have pulled off a miraculous victory at Colombo in 1992. They won't be pulling off a miraculous victory at Colombo in 2012, however, and even Waugh must accept it's over now. Pollard has made it two in two balls, with Cummins clouting one high in the air to Charles on the edge of the off-side circle.

14th over: Australia 113-8 (target 206; Starc 1, Hogg 1) Starc misses the hat-trick ball for a mile. The West Indies jokily appeal for caught behind, with Darren Sammy signalling for a review.

"I was also at Aravinda's Final in 1995," says Gary Naylor, "shouting home Lancashire not so long after shouting home Everton at Wembley in Joe Parkinson's FA Cup Final. Do you know a Kent/Manchester United supporter at whom I can smirk about this?" I don't, but I know someone who can ensure you'll never be published on an OBO or and MBM ever again. Bye!

15th over: Australia 121-8 (target 206) Rampaul puts Hogg on his 41-year-old backside with a bouncer. It's not quite Michael Holding to the fortysomething Brian Close, though, and Hogg has a smile on his face.

"Colombo 1992, Sabina Park 1995, the 1996 World Cup semi, Port Elizabeth 1997 (courtesy of Junior himself), Hobart 1999, the 1999 World Cup semi etc etc," says SB Tang, nestling in the loving bosom of Australia's miraculous and/or landmark victories of the 1990s. "I could go on and on and on ... but those days are gone I'm afraid."

WICKET! Australia 121-9 (Hogg st Ramdin b Narine 7) Sunil Narine strikes with his first ball back in the attack. Hogg comes down the track, misses and is stumped smartly by Dinesh Ramdin.

16th over: Australia 127-9 (target 206) "Ostracism - that's a bit tough on Naylor, isn't it?" says John Starbuck. "There must be some kind of suitable forfeit instead, probably involving a tattoo." Ian Rush on his eyeball?

WICKET! Australia 131 all out (Starc b Rampaul 2). WEST INDIES WIN BY 74 RUNS Ravi Rampaul completes a stunning victory by cleaning up Mitchell Starc, and West Indies are in their first World Cup final since 1983. The players get in a huddle and start dancing. I think it's that Gangnam thing, although I haven't really got a clue as youth left me a few years ago. Took the bloody Mogwai CDs an' all.

Anyway, yes. What a victory for the West Indies. They battered 14 sixes to post 205 for four and then their slow bowlers took out Australia's big three before you could say 'where's the chin music?' It was a thrashing. It was more than a thrashing, and but for George Bailey Australia would have completely humiliated. West Indies will play the hosts Sri Lanka in the final on Sunday. Whichever side wins, the cricket world's heart will be warm. Please join James Riach for that match. Thanks for your emails; bye.

World Twenty20 2012World Twenty20CricketWest Indies cricket teamOver by over reportsAustralia cricket teamRob Smyth
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