Sebastian Crushes...

[Masha]

So basically a lot of people hate him, but I still pity Sebastian loads. (p.s. Thalia your posts are amazing.)

I understand when people say Sebastian hasn't done any good. But that doesn't necassarily make him evil, or at least not as evil as you all see him. Sebastian doesn't do the right thing. But he doesn't /always/ do the worst thing, either.

Sebastian, considering the demon blood and his upbringing could be SO much worse than he is, and the fact that he isn't, it probably the best proof we have that there is goodness inside him. A very, very, watered down sort of goodness, that mostly manifests itself as "inaction" or nutrality.

Sebastian could have killed Clary whenever he wanted. Frankly, everything would probably have worked out better for him if he had. Same goes with Jace. He didn't need either of them, not really. He could have accomplished his plan with other allies or just on his own. In honesty, had he not taken Jace or Clary and just killed them or left them alone, he may have suceeded.

But he /wanted/ them. Them specifically. Jace as a brother or as a friend or comrade, and he just wanted Clary as his, in any way. (I'm not arguing that this is okay, I'm just stating a fact.) It's proof that Sebastian doesn't want to be alone. He's lonely, I'm sure he knows it. He's aware that there is nobody else like him in the world. And he puts hope in Jace and Clary, the boy raised by his own father, and his sister, that they might be like him. And if they are, maybe they could like him. Maybe they could love him. But they don't, obviously, and that's completely understandable.

But it's /not/ understandable to Sebastian. He realizes that Jace is not like him, that it's only because they're binded together that Jace will ever co-operate with him. It's sick and twisted but also depressing that Sebastian is willing to settle for this fake loyalty. He gives up on Jace and moves onto Clary, he tries being nice to her, tries to get her onto his side, but he does it by lying, and frankly he should know she would never have joined him had be not literally been holding Jace hostage. He's frusterated that nobody seems to be like him, that he can't get anybody to like him. Not his father. Not his mother. Not Jace. Not Clary. And then he snaps at the end of the book in a terrible, horrible way, as I'm sure you all know.
(Despite everything, it's worth noting that he still doesn't kill Clary during their fight, although he obviously could have. It's ironic that he laughs at her being unable to kill him because of the bond, while he himself cannot kill her with no such barrier.)

Sebastian wants company. He wants it so bad he's willing to burn down the world to get it. That's not something a demon would want. Demons don't care about companionship. Only humans do.
If nothing else, if there's literally nothing else at all, that is Sebastian's humanity.


This is rather unrelated, but I know a lot of people say that everything Sebastian said while was being nice to Clary was a lie, which may be true, I'm not denying it. Heck, most of it probably was. But there was one thing, one that I think cannot be disputed as something Sebastiand truly meant, it also ties back into what I said above. You remember the scene at the club, where Sebastian's talking to Clary by the fountain and she's high on fairy blood, and he says Jace belongs to him? And she replies:

"Then, who do you belong to?"

And Sebastian is literally speechless. And later, he tells her: "I belong to you." This is after Sebastian has stopped playing nice. He has no reason to lie or say what he thinks Clary wants to hear. He means it. It might be twisted, but he does. He truly thinks they belong together, in every way possible. He wants them to.

I'm not really trying to change anybody's mind here. It makes total sense that you hate Sebastian. I totally get it. I really, really do. But not everyone has to hate him. I can realize all the terrible things he's done and still not hate him.

More than I pity Sebastian, I think I pity what he never got to be. He was never given the chance at a normal life, not through upbringing nor birth. Nobody's ever loved him. Nobody probably ever will. And it all could have been prevented, had Valentine not destroyed him before he was born. If nothing else, I hope people can at least see the tragedy in that.

[Nurlely]

Mim wrote: "I understand when people say Sebastian hasn't done any good. But that doesn't necassarily make him evil, or at least not as evil as you all see him. Sebastian doesn't do the right thing. But he doesn't /always/ do the worst thing, either. "

I think you contradicted your own comment. So sorry to say, but you don't actually understand why Sebastian hasn't done any good. That is because he is the evil in the story. It used to be Valentine, but surely Sebastian is worse than him. He killed people and felt no remorse. If that is not an evil deed, then I wonder what I should call it.

Mim wrote: "Sebastian could have killed Clary whenever he wanted. "

No, Sebastian could have not killed Clary. First, he could not do it, for it might have jeopardized his disguise. Jace would go hell and heaven to find who 'killed' Clary. As much as Sebastian considered Jace as not his equal, he would not have wanted Jace to mess up his plan. And second, Clary is his blood, which makes Clary at least close to his equal, for he considers no one else is.

Sebastian might have been lonely, but he also thinks that he is above everyone else. That is why killing humans does not make him feel any guilt. He wants to create dark shadowhunters, ones who obey evil, not angels, and to become his servants, never his equal.
Valentine was evil enough, but he regretted having created Sebastian, for he might be a very powerful shadowhunter but with no emotion but evil.

Hate Sebastian?? I think it is funny that sometimes people read beyond the texts. Sebastian is Sebastian, a freaking handsome evil person. His sexual reference is loathsome (Clary is his sister!). He made monsters out of good shadowhunters. He cut the angel's wing. He almost burnt the shiny angelic person out of Jace, for making a bond with him. He killed people!

Sebastian must die. Why? Because of what he is written in the story. The antagonist must die, to bring the peace back. Disliking Sebastian has nothing to do with imagining his character beyond the story, but because his character requires nothing but that feeling.

If Sebastian is to find his 'white soul' by the end of the day, before he dies, after being stabbed by a heavenly sword, that will be good for Jocelyn, for at least she will be able to meet his son, not some kind of monster which she has feared about the moment Sebastian was born.

[Shirley]

i have a feeling that cassandra clare is planning a redemption for sebastian's character. there was a lot of foreshadowing in CoLS, the big one being (view spoiler)[ the sword raziel gave simon (hide spoiler)]. he may born evil, but he must have some humanity in him (i mean, he's only half demon). maybe it's because i love his character, but i hope he doesn't get killed off. what can i say? i love me some flawed boys. sebastian is a complex character and maybe he is mostly villainous, but he's shown some vulnerability and interest in love. that should count for something.

[Masha]

Nurlely wrote: I think you contradicted your own comment. So sorry to say, but you don't actually understand why Sebastian hasn't done any good. That is because he is the evil in the story. It used to be Valentine, but surely Sebastian is worse than him. He killed people and felt no remorse. If that is not an evil deed, then I wonder what I should call it.

I don't think I contradicted myself, although maybe I wasn't being clear. I never argued that Sebastian has done any good. He hasn't. I was simply saying that yes, while Sebastian is bad, but he is not pure evil. Pure evil, to me anyway, is doing the worst thing whenever possible. And he doesn't. I mean, he spent basically all of CoLS trying to get Clary to like him, when he didn't need to bother. He didn't need her for his plan, he didn't need her to understand and agree with what he was doing. He wanted her to. If you're pure evil you don't care about anybody but yourself. Sebastian cared about Valentine. He cares about Clary, at least somewhat. Heck, he even seemed to get somewhat upset, or surprised at least, when Jace said that he would always hate Sebastian no matter what.

Nurlely wrote: No, Sebastian could have not killed Clary. First, he could not do it, for it might have jeopardized his disguise. Jace would go hell and heaven to find who 'killed' Clary. As much as Sebastian considered Jace as not his equal, he would not have wanted Jace to mess up his plan. And second, Clary is his blood, which makes Clary at least close to his equal, for he considers no one else is.

While I can't prove this point really, it's just what I think, but I disagree, sort of. Jace, as he is normally, would of course go through heaven and hell to find who killed Clary. But, for most of CoLS Jace is bonded to Sebastian, and Sebastian is the "dominant" one in that bond, meaning he influences Jace more than the other way around. So, of course Jace as he normally is wouldn't rest until he found who killed Clary, but I don't know if the Jace under Sebastian's influence would. I mean, did Jace ever get mad, really truly angry, with Sebastian while under the bond? (Actual question, I don't remember.) Could he even if he wanted to? If Sebastian killed Clary, of course Jace would be infuriated, heart-broken etc., but for how long? Wouldn't he sort of be forced to "get over it" because of the bond? I mean, you could argue that the "power of love" would break the bond, and Clary seemed to hope for that too throughout CoLS, but it never happened in the books. In the books, Clary even said that the Jace under Sebastian's control is not her Jace. That he's just an empty shell. Anyway, I have no idea if it would go like this or not, it was just a bit of speculation. It doesn't really matter I guess, since it didn't happen anyway.

If we argue that Sebastian couldn't have killed Clary because it would upset Jace, there was still no logical reason for him to even get her invovled. Jace seemed okay enough without her around, for the time being. There wasn't any need for Sebastian to try and win Clary over onto his side. Like I said, she didn't really provide him with anything. He could have just waited until he got the Infernal Cup, then went and got her and made her drink it immediately, and then Jace would still be under his control, but Jace would be happy because he had Clary, who would also be under Sebastian's control, and everything would have been peachy for Sebastian.

But regardless, I mostly just wanted to clear up what I meant.
I don't disagree with with the other things you said. I never tried to say that Sebastian shouldn't die, or that he hasn't killed people, or all those other things. But I don't think everybody has to hate him. I don't. I know he's bad, and I know you think he's all bad, and that's fine. But I don't believe in humans that are pure evil, and Sebastian, despite the demon blood, isn't a demon. Therefore, I believe there is some sort of good in him. I don't know if we'll ever see it or not, but I think there is some.

[Nurlely]

Mim wrote: "Pure evil, to me anyway, is doing the worst thing whenever possible. And he doesn't."

Pure evil is Lilith (too bad she evaporated too soon), but even Lilith loves Sebastian. Evil loves things according to what they want or feel. What Sebastian feels for Clary is that Clary is his (at least Clary is his almost equal to him)

Mim wrote: "Pure evil, to me anyway, is doing the worst thing whenever possible. And he doesn't."

Sebastian knows Clary's importance to Jace. Although he is the 'dominant' he would not push Jace as far as hurting Clary. Clary is Jace's centre. Without Clary's existence, Jace would have been an empty shell, and Sebastian is smart (evil smart) enough to know that.

Mim wrote: "If we argue that Sebastian couldn't have killed Clary because it would upset Jace, there was still no logical reason for him to even get her invovled. Jace seemed okay enough without her around, for the time being. "

We do not need to argue. We just need support our reasons with what we get from the story. Each person can interpret differently from the same source, as we also can.

Why I find the fact that killing Clary will not benefit Sebastian:
For him, Clary is his blood, which makes Clary the only girl who is good enough for him (being his equal, for sharing the same parents), and will definitely upset Jace.
And Nope. Jace is not okay enough for not having her around. Jace's mind might be cloudy enough to mostly think what Sebastian thinks, but Clary is his life.

Quoted from CoLS: Bro Zac to Clary about Jace "He still loves you, said Brother Zachariah, and his voice was surprisingly gentle. You are the central point about which his world spins. That has not changed."

Not even a powerful evil bond can sway Jace from Clary

Mim wrote: "Therefore, I believe there is some sort of good in him. I don't know if we'll ever see it or not, but I think there is some. "

Maybe, for no matter how evil Sebastian can possibly be, he is Jocelyn's son. Unfortunately, nothing good is visible until now. Hopefully, he will be, by the end of the story. I would like it to also be his last breath. I am not fond of the idea of having such an evil young man to live a happy life after some repentance by the end of the day. I rather read some Disney stories then... LOL

[Masha]

Nurlely wrote: Pure evil is Lilith (too bad she evaporated too soon), but even Lilith loves Sebastian. Evil loves things according to what they want or feel. What Sebastian feels for Clary is that Clary is his (at least Clary is his almost equal to him)

Not much to say on this besides I don't know if I really believe that Lilith loved Sebastian. It seems she was more keen on Sebastian starting a new race, if anything. I think she just loved the demon in him. Who knows, though, really.

Anyway, I don't want this thread to turn into a "how much does Jace love Clary" debate, haha. Neither of us can really say what would have happened if Sebastian killed Clary, since he didn't.

And by "agrue" I didn't literally mean we were arguing, I just saying that if we're saying that Sebastian couldn't have killed Clary because of Jace then "this, this, this..." not that we were fighting. :)

Nurlely wrote: Maybe, for no matter how evil Sebastian can possibly be, he is Jocelyn's son. Unfortunately, nothing good is visible until now. Hopefully, he will be, by the end of the story. I would like it to also be his last breath. I am not fond of the idea of having such an evil young man to live a happy life after some repentance by the end of the day. I rather read some Disney stories then... LOL.

Yes, I also think it would be strange if Sebastian got to have a happily ever after. I don't expect him to survive, honestly. I'm hoping that we, and maybe some of the characters, will somehow get a glimpse into what he could have been like had he not been injected with demon blood and rasied as he was. I'm not sure how that would happen, but yeah.

I know we'll probably never totally agree, but thanks for being rational about everything and keeping everything friendly even with our differing opinions. :)

[Nurlely]

Mim wrote: " Not much to say on this besides I don't know if I really believe that Lilith loved Sebastian. It seems she was more keen on Sebastian starting a new race, if anything. I think she just loved the demon in him. Who knows, though, really."

Surely Lilith loved Sebastian. She considered him as his child. And if she loved the demon in Sebastian, that is what we are served so far, the evil Sebastian, with demon's blood running in him.

Mim wrote: " Yes, I also think it would be strange if Sebastian got to have a happily ever after. I don't expect him to survive, honestly. I'm hoping that we, and maybe some of the characters, will somehow get a glimpse into what he could have been like had he not been injected with demon blood and rasied as he was. I'm not sure how that would happen, but yeah."

If he had not been injected with demon blood, than we would never have the freaking handsome loathsome evil Sebastian! Who will Cassie leave us with? Lilith? She might do well (after all...she is the mother of all demons), but she might not good enough for female fans.... And to have another super shadowhunter to compete with Jace? That is so messed up....hahahaha

I read something about Cassie will 'kill' some of the main characters. More than one. That should start with Sebastian. I don't even want to think about others whom she may also eliminate... (or she can kill them but Jace and Clary... LOL)

Thanks back at you. Having different opinions doesn't mean that we have to dislike each other. We have all those bad characters in the books for that... ;)

[Masha]

Nurlely wrote: If he had not been injected with demon blood, than we would never have the freaking handsome loathsome evil Sebastian! Who will Cassie leave us with? Lilith? She might do well (after all...she is the mother of all demons), but she might not good enough for female fans.... And to have another super shadowhunter to compete with Jace? That is so messed up....hahahaha

Oh no I didn't mean for him to like, turn good halfway through, or for us to literally see what the story would have been like without him being evil, because then it would be totally different, of course haha. I meant more like, in his dying moments, he'd be good, something like that, maybe.

[Nurlely]

Mim wrote: "Oh no I didn't mean for him to like, turn good halfway through, or for us to literally see what the story would have been like without him being evil, because then it would be totally different, of course haha. I meant more like, in his dying moments, he'd be good, something like that, maybe. "

I tried to imagine that too, and failed. What would Sebastian be? He was born a baby 'monster' and freaked his mother out. And thanks to Valentine's 'fatherly' education, he has become worse and worse ever since. Special thanks to Lilith (this will go with a Demon Award)
And Sebastian might have a loving mother but he also had Valentine as a father-who-will-never-be-elected-as-father-of-the-year. Will he be like either his parents, or as annoying as Clary?

Sebastian might be as pure as a newborn baby with absolutely handsome face. Who knows that I will even cry when he exhales his last breath (Doubt it)

[Ariane]

Nurlely wrote: "Thalia wrote: "Yes, that's very true. (: Thank goodness!"

We can all be your friend. Ariane is my friend and I remember she does like Sebastian.

I can knock Sebastian' skull and Ariane can hug h..."

OMG that is definitely true. Hahahaha Maybe that's the reason why we are not included in the book. It will be too confusing to the readers. Haha! I bet they'll want to kill me to for loving Sebastian. LOL

[Nurlely]

Ariane wrote: "OMG that is definitely true. Hahahaha Maybe that's the reason why we are not included in the book. It will be too confusing to the readers. Haha! I bet they'll want to kill me to for loving Sebastian. LOL "

I will not let them kill you for loving Sebastian. Although you will probably die of misery when I kill Sebastian.... LOL

[Ariane]

Nurlely wrote: "Ariane wrote: "OMG that is definitely true. Hahahaha Maybe that's the reason why we are not included in the book. It will be too confusing to the readers. Haha! I bet they'll want to kill me to for..."

Now that I realized what I just said….I SOUNDED LIKE JESSAMINE! Eeewww Hahahaha

[Thalia]

I agree with what most of what Mim said. And dude, I totally forgot about when he says, "I belong to you," to Clary. Ugh, more feels to tackle me. I won't get into another huge long post (I have a tendancy to ramble), but that's the icing on the cake to me. Mim is right--he literally had nothing to gain, nothing to live for, his disguise was completely broken, and he wasn't playing nice anymore. He wasn't trying to convince her he was right or anything like that. Sebastian was his honest self in those moments, because he had no reason to hide. So why would he admit that he, he belongs to Clary; and admitting you "belong" to someone is admitting that they basically own you. You are theirs, and they have the control and dominance over you. Sebastian actually admitted that Clary has control over him--but he's afraid of it. He doesn't like knowing there's someone out there better than he is, he doesn't like feeling like someone has control over him. He doesn't like feeling powerless. And yet, he admits it, freely and openly, to Clary that he is hers and he belongs to her.

At this point, I'm trying really hard, but I don't know why someone couldn't see any humanity or heartbreak in Sebastian or his story. To me, it's all like a slap in the face, and it hits me hard, and I cry whenever I think about him and everything he's gone through. I really can't picture myself not feeling that way; which is why I guess I've decided not to post very much here anymore. I'm too invested and I get too passionate about it.

[Nurlely]

Ariane wrote: "Now that I realized what I just said….I SOUNDED LIKE JESSAMINE! Eeewww Hahahaha "

Oh dear.... now I am imagining you with your parasol, walking the street.... hehehehe

[Olivia]

INCEST!!!! does that count as a spoiler.. nah we all know hahaha

[Jamie]

does anybody know who's the guy that does all the Sebastian photos?!?! IM SO ANXIOUS AND HE LOOKS LIKE THE PERFECT SEBASTIAN TO ME

[Ariane]

Jamie wrote: "does anybody know who's the guy that does all the Sebastian photos?!?! IM SO ANXIOUS AND HE LOOKS LIKE THE PERFECT SEBASTIAN TO ME"

image:

Ben-Barnes Is perfect

[Thalia]

BENNNNN
BEN BARNES
THEY BETTER PICK HIM WHEN THE FILM COMES OUT.
BECAUSE HE IS PERFECTION IN A HUMAN BEING.
although I can't watch Prince Caspian without seeing Sebastian anymore.

[Leslie]

Anna wrote: "THERE IS A BIG SPOILER IN THIS ONE!

I've always like him.
I was thinking; what would happen if Clary would have drunken the blood of the Lilith? she would have done EVERYTHING Sebastian said. an..."

I agree I like Sebastian especially in Lost Souls. He's just so messed up, no moral compass! And. The fact that the kissing scene wasnt JUST a kissing scene...I was glued to the page...it may be wrong to like but I do...

[Jamie]

Leslie wrote: "Anna wrote: "THERE IS A BIG SPOILER IN THIS ONE!

I've always like him.
I was thinking; what would happen if Clary would have drunken the blood of the Lilith? she would have done EVERYTHING Sebast..."

i found my twin..

[Margarita]

Ulliel Gaspard is the perfect Sabastian!He looks so wicked and badass!

[Margarita]

Thalia wrote: "I agree with what most of what Mim said. And dude, I totally forgot about when he says, "I belong to you," to Clary. Ugh, more feels to tackle me. I won't get into another huge long post (I have a ..."



HE IS THE PERFECT SABASTIAN! Ulliel Gaspard!<3

[Daisy97]

All I have to say about Sebastian and Clary's relationship is: still a better love story than Twilight.;)

[Margarita]

Ariane wrote: "Jamie wrote: "does anybody know who's the guy that does all the Sebastian photos?!?! IM SO ANXIOUS AND HE LOOKS LIKE THE PERFECT SEBASTIAN TO ME"

image:

Ben-Barnes Is perfect"
I just found out that Ulliel Gapard was rummored to have been considered to play the part of Alec, but due to his french accent, he was eliminated out of the casting. In my opinion, he could be given the part of Sabastian since he looks more like the sabastain i had pictured in my head. Also the guy he's suppose to be pretending to be french in the second book so there! BINgo! Have a winner! He is perfect for the part and Ben Barns would do a good job too if it werent for the fact that he has dark skin will Sabastian doesn't!

[Nurlely]

What about Landon Liboiron?



He is 22 while Gaspard Ulliel is 28

[Leslie]

Jamie wrote: "Leslie wrote: "Anna wrote: "THERE IS A BIG SPOILER IN THIS ONE!

I've always like him.
I was thinking; what would happen if Clary would have drunken the blood of the Lilith? she would have done EV..."

Let's be sickos together!! Ha ha ha So right and so wrong (:

[Jamie]

OMG LOLOL ;)

[monet]

I've always felt sorry for Sebastian, even in COLS when I knew he was bad but *sigh* I have faith.

I have a theory that there's going to be another weapon of sorts made out of heavenly fire which Sebastian will be stabbed with etc and he won't be evil any more and will realise that he really does love Clary but not romantically, but as a sister and he just couldn't tell what that feeling/connection was before since he's never experienced it. But i don't know, since he thinks that he 'belongs' to Clary and she 'belongs' to him...

And then he will consider becoming a Silent Brother in the end or maybe an angel kills him in the end or throws him into heavenly fire where he realises that he CAN'T be with Clary and Maureen senses weakness or something and kills him. Or maybe he lives and starts shit up in Lady Midnight...

And if the Clave locks him up in Idris, like guys come on we all know what will happen.

But honestly guys, ONE MORE YEAR TILL CITY OF HEAVENLY FIRE!
And 15 more days till we find out who the hell Tessa end up with in Clockwork Princess! *cough* Will *cough*


And guys, Sebastian's supposed to have white blond hair... But Ulliel Gaspard is so fucking sexy.

[Thalia]

As for Gaspard, I always pictured him for Alec, too. LONG before the movie was ever in consideration, the graphic-making community on tumblr and video editors making TMI fan videos needed their own cast.

Alex Pettyfer - Jace
Alexz Johnson - Clary
Kristopher Turner - Simon
Ulliel Gaspard - Alec
Odette Yustman - Isabelle

Magnus kinda floated around--I don't think anyone ever had a general consensus on who he should be, like the rest of the cast. I, personally, could never picture Gaspard as Sebastian, probably because I've envisioned him as Alec for so long. His dark hair and light blue eyes just scream Alec at me. Plus, Ben Barnes is already totally capable of playing a darker role, because of his lead as Dorian Gray in the "Picture of Dorian Gray" remake.

I have a lot of casting feels, I'll never forgive the casting of Jamie Campbell Bower.

[Daisy97]

I still can't get over Jamie being Jace too.

[Brandy]

I agree with most! I like Sebastian and his interaction with Jace and Clary. He is very witty and fun, not to mention mysterious. I'm kind of holding out on some mysterious plan to make Sebastian a good guy but I don't know if that will happen :(

Even if it doesn't, he is one of my favorite villains though. I love how Cassandra made Sebastian fun but also someone you have to pay attention to because you never know what his next move will be.

[Maria]

Sebastian is going to die. Maybe he will change at the last minute and sacrifice for the others, or he will be murdered for all the things he did, but Im pretty sure he's going to die.

As for the perfect cast, I always pictured
Alex Pettyfer - Jace
Rachel Hurd-wood - She's the perfect Clary!! If you dont believe mee look it up. Thats exactly how I picture her.
Gaspard Ulliel- the perfect Sebastian
Aaron Johnson - Alec
Robert Sheehan - Simon. He is basically the only actor in the movie that I thought was perfect

[Leslie]

She really would be a great Clary!

[Madison]

Spoiler alert? I think that Muareen (remember the phyco-pathic 13 yr. old vampire girl, killed a umpteen century old vampire) and Sebastain become one team; and I've been noticing that many people hate that Sebastian is in love with Clary, but WHAT ABOUT JACE! He said he was dying on the inside for becuase he couldn't have her, and Sebastian feels the same way. Is it gross that they're related, or Sebastian is alittle... you know, or Clary is already in a relationship? Sebastian is lonely! He is a teenager (hormones) and doesn't have anyone to even talk to (that's Muareen's que). He doesn't have anyone to comfort or to comfort him, he no longer has a father, his mother tried to kill him, twice, and yes I understand that he is cruel and twisted, but he is still a boy who took the wrong path while hiking. If he was really a heartless fiend, he would have killed Clary long ago. That proves that even though Clary is more her mother than father Sebastian loves her. He tried to make her part demon, so that when she would be loyal to him, he would have what he wanted.

If anything Sebastian would make a whole army, just to force Clary to him. If she refused, he would risk his life and army to get her. He has already risked his life.
Point Made

[Madison]

Also there is a Hollywood made trailer on Youtube (let the frantic COB fans fly to youtube)

[[deleted user]]

Moonstar wrote: "Brenda wrote: "I found myself liking sebastian, definitely one of my favorite villains even after the whole kissing scene...."

Defiantly. If I had to choose which villan I liked the best, it would..."

Same for me!!

[Kailey]

UGH no TEAM JACE ALL THE WAY

[Thalia]

But Jace isn't a villain..?

[Chisom]

Uche wrote: "I actually bought the story he told Clary of becoming a good guy, etc until the whole reveal.

I'm actually more surprised at how much I liked Clary and sympathized with her in this book."

lol i did too. Sebby isnt my fav char, but he definetly is awesome! i think i might like him better than Jace. Maybe.

[Monica]

Sebastian reminds me of a bad boy/tough/kind of guy. That is exactly the kind of guy I like!!!

[Viah]

Hey guys take my quiz and tell me what you think!

http://www.goodreads.com/quizzes/2492...

[[deleted user]]

Ria wrote: "spoiler. he's a freak. he kisses clary and tells her see belongs to him. how is that right?!"

How is that wrong?

[[deleted user]]

Nichole wrote: "I'm really confused as to why people are liking Sebastian. Is it normal to like an evil character who wants to destroy everything and who has killed before? Before you start liking someone, think a..."

Yes it is normal , you clearly don’t see the bigger picture of the character.

You would excuse anything a hero did but the minute anyone labelled a villain does something bad , they’re evil. Grow the hell up. In real life i would feel the same about these characters as i do in the books.

[[deleted user]]

Simplyminali wrote: "i do want him to die because he got in the way of jace and clary's relationship"

It’s not like he’s a random character , he’s her brother so he kind of does have some right to do that . So definitely a stupid reason to want him to die, seriously?! Because he didn’t let your characters keep doing the only thing they are able to do , which is suck face? Lol come on

[[deleted user]]

Joana wrote: "I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!"

He was a great character, very intruiging and had more depth than any of the others she wrote really , clary had some depth but i mean overall there wasnt much to the other characters or plot to go on in a way. I would say clary should have chosen sebastian.

[[deleted user]]

Maliha wrote: "Zooie wrote: "Maliha wrote: "what's up with him saying he liked isabelle? and who the hell is his 'dear beloved' ??
i pity him for being so lonely and needing to burn down the world. and anyone els..."

He later said that he realized she is like her after hearing about what she did , and he wanted her again even more . He wanted her either way i think but he decided she was his only equal in the world.

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Valencia wrote: "I <3 Sebastian more than i love any other character. I prefer the bad boys, and he totally is cute and hot and makes more sense than the other lot who are all grooming in looovvveeee :P
*Sebastian ..."

He isn’t some typical “bad boy” going through a phase , he’s just. Sophisticated character that’s mostly a mystery to those around him and yeah it’s annoying when all the other characters are doing is making out usually.

[[deleted user]]

Valencia wrote: "I still love Sebastian, he's so hot...and amazing <3 and i love him because he is just that sexy and glamarous dark guy that i like. Jace has nothing on Sebastian, at least Seb isnt impressing anyo..."

Sebastian is never really trying to impress with his looks because unlike Jace he knows he has a personality lol

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Erin wrote: "Aneeqa wrote: "Sebastian's awesome,I simply loved him! He is very different from the good guys as well as the other bad guys, and he stands out. He is a badass evil dude. And the thing bou liking h..."

Pretty sure those rape stats have been proven to be bs

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Daisy97 wrote: "Lena wrote: "I started liking sebastian when he was walking around Paris with Clary :) Yes he kissed his sister but i dont believe that he's actually in love with her. I think it was more out of pu..."

Commit incest? Lol its not a crime , not really. Calm the hell down .