Pam’s Comments (group member since Dec 29, 2016)

Pam’s comments from the Our Shared Shelf group.

Maja wrote: " I am actually a historian, specialized in English medieval queens, so in that regard I have worked a lot with women's rights (or lack thereof) in the middle ages, and I think that was what really spurred my interest in knowing more about the evolvement from then till now"

That's so fascinating! Wow!

When is your book coming out? :)

Ross wrote: "Inequality is the root cause of the injustice women and other groups face. If you stand for equality for all. Then you are Intersectional feminist.."

Ok. So that's part of it.

Remember that intersectionality specifically says that all women have a perspective in their lives that differ from others. Race, sexuality, education, country, economics play a part in how they are treated and their available answers.

On important caveat. No one way is better. We are not saying that there is a specific lens that is better or worse or one that we should all conform to be. A rural grandmother with less than a highschool education is not better nor worse than a college educated queer doctor.

We are simply saying that the most important issue to one is not necessarily going to be the same for the other. Nor would their way of answering any problem would be the same.

Now. Equality anywhere. A good example of this would be the right to vote. In the States and the UK, women were given the right to vote in 1920s or so. Liberal or white feminist could pay themselves on the back,their job done. Women could vote.

But black women, under Jim Crow rules were not able to vote.

By law... All women could vote. But in reality there were issues preventing or sabatoging a black woman's ability that wasn't affecting the white woman.

And then we should also add Asian immigrants who were banned from being citizens and therefore couldn't vote until 1952. Even though millions were living in the States since the 1800's. And

Let alone the right of Native American women who were only given the right in the 1960s.

The law states all women could vote, yet other issues targeting specific races made the task improbable.

So yes. Equality for all. But whose equality?

And of course, those who studied and made this their careers ( women's studies majors, etc.) Please correct me if there are any logical errors.

Maja wrote: " One question, is Equality also considered a sub-category of feminism? I ask this because equality seems to be something that Emma Watson emphasizes a lot, yet she calls herself a feminist. Hope you (or someone else?) can answer :)"

Thanks for a great question Maja. ( Women's Studies Majors/ Meelie?) Please correct me if I'm wrong.

But I believe Watson's HeforShe campaign is a great example of liberal feminism. HeforShe, for example, works hand in hand with people around the world into seeing how together all genders can help those who identify as women or show feminine traits through changing the rules in public and private sectors.

Check out their impact here:
https://www.heforshe.org/en/impact

As a feminist:

I'm furious that I live in a time where abortion clinics are attacked (verbally and physically). Where organizations like Planned Parenthood, that provides BASIC care for women/mother/father's are being defunded because of stupidity. I am boiling with anger over health clinics that are trained to lie to vulnerable women so that timelines are skewed so that abortion is no longer available. And yet, a clinic which provides honest medical services are forced to close down because their hallways are not wide enough. I am furious that some pos who sexually assualted a woman (appointed by another abuser pos) now gets to decide the fate of Roe v Wade ( aka the Supreme Court case that legalizes abortion in the US).

My body. My choice

I was talking to my SO the other day when he mentioned it was quite confusing for a new person to understand the various forms of feminism. It can be daunting especially if we bring it up in conversation without explaining it.

Like any large topic there exists numerous subcategories or genres or flavors underneath it which has it's own markers that can distinguish it from others.

For example: our Sept/October Book Rebecca is a Horror book with a sub-genre of Gothic Horror. Or for another example: Christianity can be broken into sub-categories of Anglican, Catholic, Presbyterian, etc

So what are the sub-categories within Feminism? Some of the bigger ones include;

- Liberal Feminism: Women are equal to men. The emphasis is to make legal and political rights proclaim that parity if it's not already present.

- Radical Feminism : Simply put: the deck is stacked in favor of men no matter how many policies we pass. So we need to radically re-order male supremacy by eliminating all social and economic contexts.

- Cultural Feminism : Lumped with the first two is more cultural understanding and appreciation of femaleness. I.e. Cultural feminists try to uphold the idea of what makes a woman a woman. (See also a sub-sect Maternal Feminism)

- Inter-sectional Feminism: Believes that there are other factors impacting marginalized people than gender alone. Race, Sexuality, Social Class, etc all may effect a person in a different way based on any given situation. And if we are to make things better, then we need to be aware of all of these issues.

- White Feminism: Feminism that tends to focus (consciously or unconsciously) on white/ western women's needs without taking into consideration minority or social issues. (This was me back in high school as my entire worldview was simply my family and our neighborhood)

- Eco Feminism: Feminist review of ecological issues. Ecofeminist thinkers draw on the concept of gender to theorize on the relationship between humans and the natural world. The concept is that as individuals who tend the home / children in some places, women are more aware of the needs of water, firewood, air than male counterparts. Another example: Industrialization is the rape and pillaging of natural resources. The use of rape specifically can have gender connotations.

- I-Feminism: Individual Feminism. This plays more into body-centric discussions regarding a woman's autonomy over her own body. Plays a lot into women's pain, the abortion discussion etc.

Ok! Real Quick Very Simple FAQ

- Can I be prefer more than one sub-type of feminism?
Of course! Chances are you already are as you find yourself interested in a lot of issues. Just like your book choices: Sci-Fi/Fantasy, Horror, Biography, etc you can find you like all sorts

You can be passionate about a few of these issues. You're still a feminist at your core. These categories just help to identify facets that interest you.

- Will I always have the same feminism thoughts?
Probably not. As a child you probably had a favorite cartoon character. But as you got older your interests change. Your worldview expands. Your perspective changes as your role changes be it" child / teenager/ student / graduate / homeowner / mother etc.

I myself was very much a white feminist until I went off to college and even more so since I hung around OSS. That's not wrong. It was what it was.


Ok! Did I miss any? Are there corrections I should make? Most definitions and examples were compiled really quick off of the internet. Wikipedia being the largest source

And then: Do you, dear reader, see any that match you? Was this helpful?

Timely:

https://psmag.com/social-justice/for-...

Native Americans had the right to vote since the 1960's and yet there are still places that try to undermine their ability to vote.

Well said!

Lianne wrote: "I also have issue's with having three books for this month. Not only for reading pace and shipping time, but also regarding money. The books on this list are usually not available in libraries clos..."

Agreed

Jasmine wrote: "I usually get shouted down here as too radical or a "man hater" when I bring up the need for anger against all men and their universal guilt"

Ha. You got me there. I personally do not agree with what you are saying, but I can admire the enthusiasm and tenacity behind them if not respect that your opinions are formed on personal experiences.

I simply value order and organization. And in having this conversation (on your article, on complicity, etc) in a unique thread it may offer more people to join in the discussion than just those looking for progress updates.

This is a timely addition Jasmine, given the books for November / December all deal with the anger of women.

Perhaps you would like to start a whole thread on this topic as it may grow beyond what this thread on progress tries to expose? I.e. I think there is more to discuss than what an update thread can hold before the mods will intercede.

Ohh three books!

Does anyone recommend an order to these? I ask, as Brittany Cooper's book summary it says In the Black feminist tradition of Audre Lorde, Would it be better to read Lorde's book first and then the other two?

Just beautiful! I love everyone's verbal approval of themselves

I'll check it out later! Happy Intersex day!

Congratulations to Zewde and to Ethiopia. May her time serving help bring about a new era of prosperity

Similar to helping people who aren't like you: learn from them, add you voice to their cause, point out if the current system doesn't help them, etc.

I'm not very familiar with autism, my sister is handicapable and I worked with medical orthodics devices. The big thing that I find for them is cost of life.

-I.e. government policies dictate the disabled communities aid vs how much is out of pocket. Or even policy on what's considered a medical device or a personal device
- availability of jobs. Just because individuals don't function like you or me doesn't mean they cannot function at all
- transportation. Does your city / community have a bus for people who have wheelchair needs? Or at least a service to help these individuals get to places like the grocery store?
- infrastructure: can the disabled community use the facilities? Are there ramps instead of stairs? ATMs at their level etc etc etc

I know people who keep both. Either by hyphenating as mentioned here or that the children receive the mother's maiden name as their middle name. Similar to what Lupe mentioned above. Jane Smith marries John Doe and their kid becomes Jo Smith Doe.

My cousin did something interesting, too. His parents divorced. So in retaliation to his father my cousin had his name legally changed to his mother's maiden name.

Samantha wrote: "Hello! Does anyone know the titles of the books Reni recommend? Both the YA and the fiction one?
I tried to understand them but I really couldn’t!! Thanks so much!! ."

Gotcha covered!

Noughts & Crosses


Augustown

Taylor wrote: "That's all fine and dandy but not everyone understands the implications nor do they take time to think about what feminism really mean..."

What does feminism really mean?

Nora wrote: "Mrs. Danvers was obsessed in her love for Rebecca and the ultimate betrayal of learning that Rebecca had lied to her, to me, was the reason Mrs. Danvers lit the place on fire. I didn’t feel it was to get back at Maxim, although in part it probably was, but she wanted to destroy the sham that was her life before. ..."

Ohh interesting!

Emma wrote: "Yes. May I suggest you read Eggshell Skull by Bri Lee. Also, Boys Will Be Boys by Clementine Ford."

Point of Clarification: Is your yes saying:
- Yes, I believe the law is doing enough for women
- or Yes, I agree that the law is falling behind technological and social change