Jonathan’s Comments (group member since Oct 24, 2013)

Jonathan’s comments from the Reading Proust's In Search of Lost Time in 2014 group.

Dave wrote: "Yes, there is a lot to observe in these big social scenes. This dinner doesn't end until next week's reading where I made some brief remarks about it. I don't think I am giving anything away to say..."

I'm having a bit of an on/off vibe with the Guermantes shindig. I really enjoyed all the chatter and bitchiness of the Villeparisis party but struggled with last week's intro to this party. This week's reading is a lot better - mainly because Proust just lets the characters talk rather than analyse it all too much.

First of all it seemed that the only guests present were the Guermantes, the narrator and the Princess de Parma, but slowly the other guests start to engage more in the conversations. Though it's all about Mme Guermantes - she just has to be the centre of attention...and people like that always have an inferior (Princess de Parma - intellectually inferior) around to bounce their chatter off and to make themselves feel good.

There's a lot of info being thrown around in these soirees and some of it may even be reliable! I think they'll have to be re-read again at a later date as what is said will probably make more sense.

Although I found all the distinctions between the Courvoisiers and the Guermantes in last week's reading a bit of a drag, I thought that it was summed up really well with this quote:

The Princess of Parma was a Courvoisier in that she was incapable of innovation in social matters, but unlike the Courvoisiers in that the surprises the Duchesse de Guermantes perpetually held in store for her engendered in her not, as in them, antipathy but a sense of wonder.

To use more modern terminology, the Courvoisiers are like introverts and the Guermantes are like extroverts; the Courvoisiers need strict social rules while the Guermantes break them and make new ones. I can empathise a bit with the Princess, as I am also fascinated with how these socialites (in real life and in this novel) operate and I'm usually happier when I know the rules & regulations that apply.

Renato wrote: " I'll add it to Goodreads (apparently it's not in the database) and shelve it to read once I finished ISOLT as I don't want to spoil anything at this time..."

And add it to the group's bookshelf as well when it's on GR.

Renato wrote: "- Is Prince Von also interested on our narrator...? "Come home with me"? Mmhmm..."

I think he is. And he also suggests that Prince de Foix has similar inclinations.

Renato wrote: "Also funny was how Oriane talked about the portrait that Elstir was painting of her:
"Didn't he once start a portrait of you, Oriane?" asked the Princesse de Parme. "Yes, in shrimp pink," replied ..."

Did you also wonder where this portrait was? Mme Guermantes says that M. Guermantes wanted to destroy it. I'm sure that the narrator would have noticed it if it was on display with the other Elstirs. Maybe it was still with Elstir? Or did I miss something?

Renato wrote: "I wish people would stop pretending when they don't know about something that is mentioned in a conversation - it's very evident when that light simply is not there, LOL."

Ha! Ha! I liked this bit as well. We can easily tell when someone does this but we all do it ourselves and think we're getting away with it (we don't). I admit it's a bad habit and it's best to declare one's ignorance...easier said than done though.

Thanks for all the photos and links Renato.

Hi MMR. There weren't many members that up for reading it at this moment in time but I'm eager to read it and Renato is as well. I'm looking forward to delving into the Dreyfus Affair and it would be great if you can join us.

MMR. wrote: "Thought I would mention a book I'm reading right now that I think has been a great enrichment to my reading this time around. "FOR THE SOUL OF FRANCE: Culture wars in the Age of Dreyfus." By Frederick Brown..."

The Frederick Brown book looks interesting, I'll add it to my TBR list. The author is a biographer of Zola of course...another book I intend to read somewhen.

Oh wow! Thanks for all the pics Marcelita! And I guess Robert was named after Saint-Loup-de-Nard as well?

Dave wrote: "To me the most significant thing about the restaurant was the disclosure about St Loup and his friends. I don't have page numbers, but the passage begins "The Prince de Foix, who was rich already, ..."

I think I'll re-read the restaurant scene again this week as I think there's more in it than I originally thought. One thing, is that the narrator wanted to talk to St-Loup about Charlus but they didn't get round to it. Also, what does St-Loup know about his uncle?

Also, why are the Guermantes both interested in the narrator now? Are they trying to warn him of Charlus? Why doesn't Charlus want the narrator to go to the Guermantes? Is it because he thinks they'll convince the narrator not to see him?

Dave wrote: "I also liked how the proprietor was insolent to the narrator until he learned of Saint Loup's affection - then he became fawning. ..."

Yes,the sudden change in the waiter's attitude once he realises that the narrator is with St-Loup is brilliant. It reminds me a bit of Monty Python's dirty fork sketch.

Dave wrote: "Jonathan, I "passed over lightly" the whole Courvoisiers vs Guermantes distinction. I gather, like you, it had to do with one-upmanship in aesthetic taste. The main thing I got out of the Duchesses dinner party was more development of the characters of the Duc and Duchess,...."

I hope that the dinner party will start in earnest in next week's reading. I guess Proust is just giving us the background info with all this detail of the nobility. Is Proust deliberately highlighting how antiquated the nobility were?

Proust keeps on mentioning Saint-André-des-Champs. Is it a real place or based on a real place?

I thought the first half of this week's reading was as good as anything else in this volume, i.e. St-Loup's arrival and their visit to the restaurant.

When St-Loup arrives at the point of the narrator's crying fit, he says that friendship falls 'half-way between fatigue and boredom' though he admits it can be useful - I guess he'd rather be romping with the Balbec gang. However, he seems more positive about the benefits of friendship after St-Loup's stunt of clambering over the furniture at the restaurant with a cape for the sickly narrator.

I liked the bit about entering the restaurant on his own: '...it was my misfortune to have to enter the place on my own.' He gets trapped in the revolving door, to the disdain of the staff, he then sits in the wrong place, gets moved around by the waiters. I find this amusing as I never know what to do when I enter an unknown café or restaurant - the etiquette is always different and yet one is expected to know what it is. A similar thing happens with me over keys/locks when staying at a hotel or as a guest somewhere. I'm always amazed at how door locks & keys can be made in so many different ways - sometimes they totally flummox me. And others wonder what sort of idiot doesn't know how to use a key!...maybe it's just me!

Sunny in Wonderland wrote: "Didn't someone say somewhere that a lot of people never read further than The Guermantes Way? For me, this week's reading is supporting that statement. I'm so BORED with all of this high society,..."

I've just finished this week's reading and I kinda agree with you Sunny, although for me it's only been the last 50 pages or so, since the narrator returned from viewing the Elstir paintings, that it's been turgid...I just don't care that much about the differences in the social etiquette between the Courvoisiers and the Guermantes. I hope that the narrative will return to the dinner party itself and we can get on with some dialogue, à la Mme Villeparisis' do.

Given that the narrator has finally got his nose into the Guermantes' salon I wonder how long it will be before he's disillusioned by it all? - I think Dave's post above hints towards it being soon...

I've inadvertently mentioned at work that I'm reading this thing called ISOLT. Well, if reading in itself is not strange enough (who reads these days?) then reading a 4,000 page novel is just perverse! And what actually happens in it? They despair of me, I think.

On Albertine:

...she seemed to me often to be a very poor sort of rose, and I would have preferred to shut my eyes to avoid seeing the various blemishes on its petals...

It is true that I was not in the least in love with Albertine...

I'm glad you're still with us Dwayne. I agree, this week's reading was a bit special.

Welcome aboard MMR. Did you finish ISOLT last year?

Wow! You're storming through S&G. I'll try not to read your comments beforehand. Keep up the good work though. I'll see you here in a month.

Marcelita wrote: "A member if the Boston Proust Society of America has written a play about that evening.
"Proust and Joyce at the Majestic" by Debbie Wiess. ..."

It sounds interesting Marcelita. Have you seen it? Or are you going to attend the Boston showing?

I was going to read the 'Night at the Majestic' book before I started reading ISOLT but wondered if that was such a good idea, re spoilers etc. I'll probably leave it now until I've finished ISOLT.

Please use the thread below to comment on The Dreyfus Affair by Piers Paul Read.

Although the intention is to read the book between 14th June and 18th July please feel free to add comments at any time.