Controversial Statements - Bring em - No weak sauce allowed! Homelessness: A Mercy Sex Ploy?

[Phil]

I frequently do.

[Félix]

St. George airport teevee.

[Cheri]

Kyle wrote: "Excuse me, Cheri?"

Am I the only one that read the title of this thread?

New rant: Why does everyone take themselves so seriously? Take a pill or two.

[Cynthia]

Reaganomics sucked. Trickle down sucked. Reagan's deficit sucked. We have covered this before. Extensively. Ask Armenius.

[Sally, la reina]

This thread is not my favorite.

[[deleted user]]

I've got nothing.

[Sally, la reina]

thanks for sharing, Phil.

[Scout]

I don't like this thread. It brings out the worst in people. Do we need more of that?

[[deleted user]]

Cynthia wrote: "Reaganomics sucked. Trickle down sucked. Reagan's deficit sucked. We have covered this before. Extensively. Ask Armenius."


Reagan sucked. As do all politicians.

[Cynthia]

I would say some politicians have done great things for the world. Civil rights, health care, women's rights, all have been improved by the combination of individual action and the support of elected officials. It's not always perfect, but it is a system that has benfited many Americans.

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

::writhes::

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

Interest rates were raised in order to bring inflation under control. Generally when inflation is not a problem, the money supply is loosened (it becomes easier to get credit, and interest rates are lower).

It's worth remembering that high interest rates on savings back in the early 80s were accompanied by very high interest rates on loans. If you took out a loan to buy a house, you might be paying 12%-18% under Reagan.

[evie]

It was the same here in the eighties .

[Cheri]

The eighth wonder of the world: Compound interest.

[Scout]

People who change their names on TC are up to no good.

[Kevin]

ok, back to the controversial statements (because i was called out). let's try this one:

downloading and sharing digital files that are commercial (songs/movies/software) that you didn't pay for is stealing.

[Félix]

It really is stealing.

[Courtney]

Taking food stamps, wic and other government aid while you take money to build a porch, landscape your yard, paint your house and build a shed is stealing from me and all the other hard working americans.

[Kevin]

ok, off topic a bit court but i getcha. as to digital theft controversy:

http://www.todayonline.com/World/EDC1...

[Phil]

(digital theft) = (shebang)

[Sally, la reina]

Controversial statement: I liked posting bird pictures.

[~Geektastic~]

Phil wrote: "(digital theft) = (shebang)"

Now there is a controversial statement!

[Sally, la reina]

I don't agree. By that logic a mix tape is also stealing. It is not. The idea of intellectual property (music) is a 21st century fallacy.

[Phil]

So an artist should not be fairly compensated for distribution of their work?

[Sally, la reina]

What about all the people who help to produce the work? Do they all continue to get paid every single time a song is played or a dance is held? What about when a radio station plays their song?

[Kevin]

i have mixed feelings about this. in the late 80's my wife was singing professionally in various capacities and we paid to have an album recorded and cassettes made (pre-CD's LOL). anyway we were originally just trying to recoup our costs for production and such and we sold them for like $8 ea. we ran out of them at one point (before we actually were making money) and we had several people tell us "we loved the album and made copies for lots of friends who love it too". we were like [gulp] "uh...yeah thanks". not sure how much we didn't make (we didn't really lose i guess) by having bootleg cassettes being made. when you look at the big picture people are like "big time millionaire stars don't need the money" but i guess the idea is the same whether you make a hundred or a million. btw - i have used limewire at one point and then i stopped after thinking about it. here is an article about digital theft:

http://www.todayonline.com/World/EDC1...

(this is a good topic)

[Courtney]

Ok so a friend of mine downloaded a bunch of books onto my laptop that can eventually be downloaded to my ereader. I don't know where he got them from and I have not downloaded them yet. Would this be considered digital theft?

[Courtney]

Kevin "El Liso Grande" wrote: "ok, off topic a bit court but i getcha. as to digital theft controversy:

http://www.todayonline.com/World/EDC1..."

Ok I will stay on topic, just had to get that off my chest.

[Cheri]

Cortney wrote: "Ok so a friend of mine downloaded a bunch of books onto my laptop that can eventually be downloaded to my ereader. I don't know where he got them from and I have not downloaded them yet. Would th..."

Yes

[Phil]

Cortney wrote: "Ok so a friend of mine downloaded a bunch of books onto my laptop that can eventually be downloaded to my ereader. I don't know where he got them from and I have not downloaded them yet. Would th..."

Unless they are public domain books, the answer is yes: Definitely morally so, probably legally so. But if he loaned you his e-reader with the books already on it, then no.

[Kevin]

no problem courtney. i was just jacking with you. you are allowed to wander off topic on TC. (ie: see all threads)

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

Cortney wrote: "Taking food stamps, wic and other government aid while you take money to build a porch, landscape your yard, paint your house and build a shed is stealing from me and all the other hard working ame..."

Take money from where to build a porch?

[Sally, la reina]

The government, according to conventional thought.

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

The government gives people money to build porches and landscape their yards? A loan? A grant? A government program? Where, how, who?

[Courtney]

Lobstergirl wrote: "Cortney wrote: "Taking food stamps, wic and other government aid while you take money to build a porch, landscape your yard, paint your house and build a shed is stealing from me and all the other ..."

The money they are earning that should go to buy groceries for the family instead of getting food stamps and wic. I think they sold something they owned before and got a bunch of money.

[Courtney]

Zardoz is in the Tardis wrote: "Cortney wrote: "Taking food stamps, wic and other government aid while you take money to build a porch, landscape your yard, paint your house and build a shed is stealing from me and all the other ..."

Me too. I don't mind helping those in true need but the abusers make it bad for the whole lot.

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

I have a much bigger problem with the hedge fund managers who are abusing the system by only paying capital gains taxes on what really is income and should be taxed at a higher rate.

But, you know, laws are laws and rules are rules. If people fall within the income restrictions to be eligible for food stamps or whatever government program, then they are obeying the law. If they're lying about their income, that's abuse and should be stopped. For all I know, (and perhaps for all you know?) those people do fall within the income level to receive food stamps.

Do you also get angry at people who are on food stamps (or whatever program) yet also buy and smoke cigarettes? Really, they ought to be using that money to buy food instead. And if they have a computer, TV, playstation, Wii, or iphone, they shouldn't own those things. They should be using the money to buy food instead. Right?

[Courtney]

Lobstergirl wrote: "I have a much bigger problem with the hedge fund managers who are abusing the system by only paying capital gains taxes on what really is income and should be taxed at a higher rate.

But, you kno..."

I agree. I think that they should have to buy generic brands and should not smoke or drink alcohol. Back when I was a cashier and food stamps were still in paper increments, this lady would send all her kids through the line and have them buy a 25 cent package of gum and take the change she received and buy a 40 oz. of beer.

These people I complain of i know. They probably do fall into the income requirements however, it is because the wife refused to look for work. She stays at home and just lost her disability (something she should have never gotten considering she is 32 and has popped out three babies since getting disability). It all just makes me angry

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

So she's a stay at home mother? Conservatives usually encourage that. (Unless it's poor black women, true.)

My third paragraph @473, I'm really playing devil's advocate. I don't really think the government should restrict what type of cigarette brand people are buying and force them to become teetotallers.

I personally am against smoking. I think it's vile. But as long as it's legal, poor people, or people getting food stamps, can smoke whatever legal tobacco products they want.

[Phil]

Let's talk defense spending fraud. There's big money to be found there.

[Scout]

BunWat, I'd like to know how losses due to welfare fraud are calculated. How the hell can anyone know or even estimate the percentage?

[Courtney]

Spending is bleeding from every possible place. I talk on welfare and food stamps because it just happened to be in my face.

I swear some people just think that this "money" just falls from the trees. Any yet some wonder why the state of our Union is so Fudged up.

Don't even get me started on defense spending. I have several friends in the Navy that tell me the awful stories of waste and ridiculous spending.

[Félix]

Scout wrote: "BunWat, I'd like to know how losses due to welfare fraud are calculated. How the hell can anyone know or even estimate the percentage?"

Corporations want you to focus on the minuscule amounts that go to support those among us who can't take care of themselves. Meanwhile, legalized corporate welfare in the form of special tax breaks and government contracts is HUGE in comparison.

[janine]

You made me a sandwich? Thank you!

[Félix]

You wasted 2 ml of mayo? Grrrr.

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

People complain about what they see around them. If they don't know something exists and is a problem, they're unlikely to complain about it.

We also complain according to how our knowledge of the world is structured. We tend to think of government expenditures as programs which give people money or services. But in budgetary terms, loss of income is the equivalent of a government expenditure. Included under loss of national income are tax breaks, like the mortgage interest deduction. Anyone who takes advantage of this tax break is taking advantage of the system, yet tax breaks like this don't tend to acquire the same type of moral sanction/disapproval that welfare benefits do. From a budgetary perspective they're both outlays/costs/losses/handouts.

In 2012 the federal government spent $113.5 billion on welfare for families and children. In 2013, the estimated cost of the mortgage interest deduction will be $89.6 billion. In 2013, the cost of the reduced rate on dividends and capital gains will be $110 billion.

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

The baseline is no tax breaks/credits/loopholes. In that situation, how much revenue would the government collect? Then you see how much each tax break/credit/loophole costs. How much revenue is being foregone?

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

You would look at personal federal tax breaks using a baseline of personal federal tax rates. And corporate tax loopholes using a baseline of corporate tax rates. (It doesn't even necessarily matter what the rates are, but for simplicity's sake use the rates as they are right now.)

You're getting too complicated with all the talk of income from what source. Whatever income sources a person has which are taxed - that's what we're talking about. Anything you would have to report to the IRS, is what you're being taxed on.

Economists and policy makers have these discussions all the time: how much does this tax break cost? If we didn't have this tax loophole, how much revenue would be generated?

If we only talk about things like WIC and welfare benefits being government expenditures, we end up having an unbalanced, and therefore false, discussion. It may be a lot easier to understand, but it's not an accurate framework.

[Lobstergirl, el principe]

Well, it's kind of like if I weigh 400 lbs. and never move from my chair. Should we only talk about the calories I'm consuming, or also the fact that I don't get any exercise at all? It makes sense to talk about both. It provides a more balanced picture of my fatness.

[Félix]

Gazintas and gazatas.