Last Sacrifice
discussion
Really?! How stupid is he!!!???
Julie *-* wrote: "Alright, without FULLY reading all comments on this feed, I would like to state what I think..."I think that's your main problem Julie. You haven't fully read the comments on this thread. It's considered rude to interrupt a discussion without reading the entire thread, otherwise, you're more likely to repeat a topic that's already been resolved.
/basic forum etiquette 101
Actually, Julie, Adrian didn't expect Rose to forget about Dimitri- he actually saw that as being a natural reaction and understood where she was coming from but trusted her, as any person in a healthy relationship would do. Saying that his mistake was trusting her is absurd, she should have known better than leading him on when Dimitri came back and she wanted to re-unite with him even though she was conscious of the fact that Adrian was her boyfriend at the time. It's not his fault for trusting her. It's Rose's for using him as a pawn and not breaking up with him before going riding on the Dimitri's Dick express.
Julie *-* wrote: "I do agree that blaming the victim is wrong, I also agree that if the victim made a stupid mistake he/she needs to be told! You get hit by a car crossing the road. Your the victim because the car should have seen you and stopped. "stupid mistake": look both sides before you cross the road!."That's not an accurate analogy. Try again.
If you're minding your own business while you're crossing the street and a car runs you off the road, that's an accurate analogy. When someone harms you in any sort of way, emotionally/physically/sexually, it is never your fault.
I see that you're married with two children. If you knew that your husband worked with an old girlfriend, and you found out that he fucked her in the office, and then had the nerve to blame you, how would you feel? Try that on for size.
Life is filled with idiotic people. High school is part of life. This thread is the perfect example, ie, it's filled with idiots who think it's okay to blame someone for their girlfriend's mistakes. Never have I ever run into a bigger group of fucking idiots on the internet. It's astounding. You're a grown woman for pete's sake. I'm seventeen. You should know better.
Next, we'll be discussing rape victims and how they should've known better than to wear that dress at that time of night. Sheesh.
Trusting your girlfriend is NOT a mistake. It is NEVER a mistake unless they're a rapist or a pedophile or a liar. Adrian had no way to know that Rose would cheat on him because he respected her, knew people that respected her, and thought she was an upstanding guardian. If he shouldn't have trusted her, that means you thought Rose was a scummy bitch prior to Last Sacrifice. Which is it?
There's no way you can try to stop someone from riding a dick if they aren't telepathic. He didn't make a mistake. She made the mistake. If Rose had a history of lying and cheating, he might've been slow for dating her, but it still wouldn't have been his mistake. That's what you're missing. And I don't think you're a victim blamer. I know you're a victim blamer. And honestly, I don't know why you're so excited to display your ignorance across this thread.
I'm still lost at why it's a bad thing to trust your girlfriend. If Dimitri went off with Tasha for a weekend on BUSINESS, what's the appropriate response if you guys are in love? a) Freak out and drag him back.
b) Trust him and know that if he makes a mistake, the relationship wasn't worth it anyway.
I'm going with b). If they're scummy enough to cheat on you even after you trusted them, they're not worth your time. Freaking out solves nothing. Forbidding someone from doing something is absurd. They're all adults by Last Sacrifice. Rose is mature enough to date a twenty-four-year old man, therefor, she should take the responsibility that comes with having an adult relationship. Or you're admitting that Dimitri is a sick bastard who's manipulating a teenager. Either or. I don't care.
I don't get it either, relationships fail because of lack of trust with the significant other and it's widely well known that trust should the foundation of any relationship. Yet, trusting someone is a bad thing now? An excuse as to why he got cheated on? I don't get it at all. She broke that bond of trust and couldn't even take responsibility without blaming it on somebody at least. She had no character development but rather constant character digression.
Julie *-* wrote: "P.s. Cory, I have better things to do with my time then reading the other 250 posts of this thread. All I really have to read is about 10 of them because you guys keep saying the same things like a..."Julie! You're so great! Well said. =)
If a young girl is walking down a dark alley with a SHORT skirt and a TINY top and gets raped, SHE WAS STUPID! Did she deserve to get raped, no. Could she have avoided it... HELL YES!This is revolting and disgusting. What the fuck is wrong with you people? And of course, you, Kimi, would certainly approve amirite?
WOMEN DON'T PUT THEMSELVES INTO SITUATIONS TO BE RAPED. RAPISTS RAPE THEM. It doesn't fucking matter if a girl is wearing a short skirt and a tank top or a goddamn chastity belt under a fucking hijab, that rapist in the dark alley would have jumped BOTH OF THEM.
I don't understand. I really don't. You two and your fucktardish ways have really astounded me this time. I didn't think it was possible. You both are fucking sick.
And how the fuck did you just compare getting cheated on to being jumped and raped in a dark alley? You crossed the fucking line. You crossed it hard.
And no, it was not a "greaaat, enjoyable discussion" or whatever the bullshit that you're spewing now. Why don't you take all that you just crapped out right now and shove it right back up your ass, because it was insulting and disgusting.
Seriously? What the fuck is wrong with you?
Julie *-* wrote: "P.s. Cory, I have better things to do with my time then reading the other 250 posts of this thread. All I really have to read is about 10 of them because you guys keep saying the same things like a..."Obviously you don't since you had time to come and argue with a bunch of teens. I'd ask you to go take care of your children, but honestly, I think you should stay away from them. Have you heard of the Slut Walk? I think you should check it out. But thanks for informing me of your general stupidity. Now I can write you off permanently.
But I bet you don't understand, or are unable to comprehend my logic. Instead of berating you for being an idiot in regard to rape, I bid you goodbye. Have fun blaming victims and I'll pray (well, actually, I'm an atheist) for your children.
If a young girl is walking down a dark alley with a SHORT skirt and a TINY top and gets raped, SHE WAS STUPID! Did she deserve to get raped, no. Could she have avoided it... HELL YES!
Are you fucking kidding me? It is never ANYONE'S fault that they were raped except for the RAPIST'S! How dare you insinuate that it's someone fault for walking at night and dressing a certain way and being raped? This is exactly the bullshit that perpetuates rape culture and I am fucking disgusted.
Are you fucking kidding me? It is never ANYONE'S fault that they were raped except for the RAPIST'S! How dare you insinuate that it's someone fault for walking at night and dressing a certain way and being raped? This is exactly the bullshit that perpetuates rape culture and I am fucking disgusted.
I'm sorry, but old women get raped, men get raped, some person wearing a burka could be raped and it's all the fault of the rapist.
How the hell this thread (sp?) or discussion got so out of hands???
Mariela wrote: "How the hell this thread (sp?) or discussion got so out of hands???"Victim blaming and rape culture.
They stir things up.
First of all, you can say that I am sick until you are blue in the face, but I know I'm not. It is never right for someone to get raped! That happened to someone close to me. But personally, there's certain situations that I wouldn't anyone that I cared about to put themselves in if it could potentially causes them harm. It was in no way justified for that person to rape her and it may not have happened if she hadn't put herself in that situation. That doesn't mean that it was justified. Now that individual wouldn't make that choice if she could do it all over again.I felt that Julie made her point clear! Julie was talking about a specific situation. Goodness you all are seriously delusional and sick to think that I would think that rape is right. All you people do is twist peoples words around all day. It's really sad.
★ Kimi ★ wrote: "I felt that Julie made her point clear! "I don't think anyone cares. If they do, I think they're a fucking idiot. It's really sad that you think people should listen to you and nod along with your "opinion". Opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. Figure out who said that quote and I'll give you a gold star.
★ Kimi ★ wrote: "First of all, you can say that I am sick until you are blue in the face, but I know I'm not. It is never right for someone to get raped! That happened to someone close to me. But personally, there'..."
Um, you do the same shit. You twisted everyone's words and passive agressively insulted them instead of having the balls to call them out. I know you think we're bitches because we're open about what we think and don't back down, and I honestly could give a fuck less. The fact that you are saying "now she wouldn't make that choice" is exactly what victim blaming is. Rape should not happen, period. It doesn't fucking matter if they were drunk, high, naked, passed out, or walking at midnight. There is NO excuse for it, and no lesson to be learned. That implies the person being raped had fault in it, and they do not.
Um, you do the same shit. You twisted everyone's words and passive agressively insulted them instead of having the balls to call them out. I know you think we're bitches because we're open about what we think and don't back down, and I honestly could give a fuck less. The fact that you are saying "now she wouldn't make that choice" is exactly what victim blaming is. Rape should not happen, period. It doesn't fucking matter if they were drunk, high, naked, passed out, or walking at midnight. There is NO excuse for it, and no lesson to be learned. That implies the person being raped had fault in it, and they do not.
★ Kimi ★ wrote: "First of all, you can say that I am sick until you are blue in the face, but I know I'm not. Those who are sick don't like to admit they have problems. That's called denial. Want me to look it up in the dictionary for you?
It is never right for someone to get raped!
Good. I'm glad we agree. Basic knowledge 101: C+ for Kimi.
That happened to someone close to me. But personally, there's certain situations that I wouldn't anyone that I cared about to put themselves in if it could potentially causes them harm.
What kind of situations? Your English is so broken, I can barely understand what you're saying. You're saying that if someone is walking down a dark alley in a tank top, they're at a higher risk for being raped? You're WRONG. Rapist rape regardless of where the victim is and what they're wearing.
It was in no way justified for that person to rape her and it may not have happened if she hadn't put herself in that situation.
Put herself in that situation? Did she open her legs and ask to be raped? I doubt it. Please don't try and make it seem like you know what you're talking about, because you're failing. Epically.
That doesn't mean that it was justified. Now that individual wouldn't make that choice if she could do it all over again.
She had no choice. You're an idiot if you think she had a choice. The rapist was the only one who decided to rape her. Women are raped in cars, their homes, by friends, by fathers, by brothers, by sisters, by mothers... etc. They never have a choice in the matter.
I felt that Julie made her point clear!
Whopidefucking doo.
Julie was talking about a specific situation.
Julie is completely wrong.
Goodness you all are seriously delusional and sick to think that I would think that rape is right.
You indicated that the victim was partly at fault. Not I.
All you people do is twist peoples words around all day. It's really sad.
It's sad that you don't even know what's coming out of your own mouth. I suggest you learn how to read critically. You can pick up the skill from any ten-year-old kid. They'll gladly assist you.
Now, can we please get back on topic? I don't know why Julie thought it'd be smart to reference a sarcastic jibe I made in my post and veer the entire topic in another direction. Thankfully, she revealed the full extent of her stupidity. Now I know that both you and Julie are sick and need serious re-education.
Exactly which words did I twist around? Please tell me.
★ Kimi ★ wrote: "First of all, you can say that I am sick until you are blue in the face, but I know I'm not. It is never right for someone to get raped! That happened to someone close to me. But personally, there'..."I have no desire to even attempt to speak civilly to you anymore, because you continue to act like a self absorbed asshole.
it may not have happened if she hadn't put herself in that situation.
Rapist rape regardless of situation, person, clothing, or any other idiotic factor that you may come up with. Rapist don't give a fuck if a person is walking at night in a dark alley or in clear daylight on a subway. Rapists don't give a fuck is a person is wearing a chastity belt or black lace underwear. THEY. ARE. RAPISTS. Stop being a stupid bitch and learn that.
Now that individual wouldn't make that choice if she could do it all over again.
Of course she wouldn't, you stupid bitch. An individual who knew she would be raped in an alleyway WOULD STEER CLEAR OF ALLEYWAYS FOR THE REST OF HER LIFE. Would that stop the rapist from raping another girl another time? Fuck no. Why? RAPISTS. ARE. FUCKING. RAPISTS. They don't give a fuck who they rape, when and where. They're sick minded freaks.
I felt that Julie made her point clear! Julie was talking about a specific situation.
Yes, you delusional bitch, a specific situation and I will quote her: "If a young girl is walking down a dark alley with a SHORT skirt and a TINY top and gets raped, SHE WAS STUPID!"
And now to quote myself: "WOMEN DON'T PUT THEMSELVES INTO SITUATIONS TO BE RAPED. RAPISTS RAPE THEM. It doesn't fucking matter if a girl is wearing a short skirt and a tank top or a goddamn chastity belt under a fucking hijab, that rapist in the dark alley would have jumped BOTH OF THEM."
Read it over and over again until you get it through your thick fucking skull.
All you people do is twist peoples words around all day. It's really sad.
You two are the ones calling the raped girl stupid, and we're the people that are sad? What kind of sick, dark fantasy world do you live in?
Why don't you grow up and come out of it? I'm beginning to become ashamed to have you two twisted morons as part of the human race, no lie.
Cory wrote: "★ Kimi ★ wrote: "I felt that Julie made her point clear! "I don't think anyone cares. If they do, I think they're a fucking idiot. It's really sad that you think people should listen to you and n..."
Please, I respect others opinions when they are brought to my attention respectfully.
★ Kimi ★ wrote: "Exactly which words did I twist around? Please tell me."[image error]
You might need this in the future. I suggest you purchase it now.
There is no lesson to be learned from rape. You're twisting our words to indicate that we think you approve of rape. Nowhere have we stated that. I think you're an idiot because you think rape teaches women a lesson. That is wrong.
OH MY GOD. You really are one stupid bitch!VICTIM BLAMING IS NOT A GODDAMN OPINION. RAPE CULTURE IS NOT A GODDAMN OPINION. LEARN IT, BITCH.
★ Kimi ★ wrote: "Exactly which words did I twist around? Please tell me."
Every time you responded to Leah and Cory you made them look like a bad guy and made yourself look like a victim. Your "nice girl" act was complete bullshit and it was passive agressive. You did it to incite them and make them look angry, thus so you could say "oh look at these crazy bitches attacking me!" You referenced "certain individuals" instead of actually directing your comments at the person, thus making you a coward.
Every time you responded to Leah and Cory you made them look like a bad guy and made yourself look like a victim. Your "nice girl" act was complete bullshit and it was passive agressive. You did it to incite them and make them look angry, thus so you could say "oh look at these crazy bitches attacking me!" You referenced "certain individuals" instead of actually directing your comments at the person, thus making you a coward.
@Cory: You so need to buy that book. Ship it to her, too. First class so she can learn right away!
★ Kimi ★ wrote: "Please, I respect others opinions when they are brought to my attention respectfully. "That's unfortunate. I have no respect for you. I don't have an opinion on rape. I have facts. The victim is never in the wrong. Rape doesn't teach lessons. It ruins lives. There's never anything to be learned from it.
I suggest you go back to school, Kimi. Basic facts. My opinion is irrelevant. If you think I need to respect your opinion on victim blaming, here's what you can do:
Wow...this is still going on? Dang. Cory, Mello & everyone else who's against blaming the victim: clearly some people are never going to get it. Ever. It's unfortunate, really. It's sad that women seem to think that blaming the victim is okay when "they were clearly asking for it", or whatever.
I didn't want to get into this, but this whole rape conversation is troubling so I couldn't refrain from posting. First things first: Rapists are sick. They will rape anywhere they please, regardless of what their victim(s) are wearing/what they look like/how old they are. It's not the victim's fault, ever.
Moving on...
To everyone who thinks Adrian was stupid for trusting Rose: We get it, you loooooove Rose and Dimitri. It's all about Rosa & Dimka luv 4evuh. That said, doesn't that say something about you as people? You don't care how a "love" story comes together so long as it's squee-worthy. You're not in the least bit disgusted by Rose's and Dimitri's actions. You don't care about the very long list of people Rose had no problem taking advantage of (read: totally screwed over) in order to get her (read: your) happily ever after. Huh. That's more then a little disturbing.
Or maybe not. I mean, if your significant other totally cheated on you it's your fault, right? Because you were stupid enough to trust him/her, right? I mean, it was stupid to trust him/her, even though you had no reason NOT to trust him/her. And anyway, you shouldn't be bitter because at least somebody got their HEA regardless of the fact your heart was stomped to bits on in the process, because--and this is important kids, so pay attention--all that matters is true love & HEAs. Nothing else. <------This mentality? Totally makes sense.
Oh Penny, you are so right. I guess some people simply just don't get it. I do hope those people go back to elementary school to learn how to read and comprehend information and also go through extensive psychological therapy to figure out what the fuck is wrong with them, though. And the way you phrased the fact that what if it was you getting trampled over so someone else could get their happy ending is genius. You clearly have to be some sort of sociopath not to get that....nevermind. I'm sorry, any one diagnosed with sociopathy that's reading this. I shouldn't have compared you to that.
WOW ladies (and gents if any), this is a YA book so get a grip. Rose is a young girl in love with her teacher. Adrian is a sweet but spoilt brat from royalty. There is no rape in these books. The sex which like happens twice or three times in the whole series is not rape or anything close to it. There is no deeper meaning to the entire story, its just a love story.
The sweet spoilt boy lost the girl, but that was obvious from the word go. This was a long drawn out love story between Rose and Dimitri.
Ime sorry if some you have issues, but there is no need to take them out on others about a book with no real deep meaning. If you feel you are in the right, then do the mature thing and stop reacting back like a child.
Why don't you read the damn thread properly? The rape topic has nothing to do with Vampire Academy but rather with the topic of victim blaming. Please READ the entire thread before barging into this thread and playing mother hen. You look like a fool. So what's your point? That it was Adrian's fault that he got cheated on? Because he was a "spoilt, sweet" boy? Don't dismiss cheating and all the shit that Rose did just because it's a love story so that makes it okay.
You're a moron. These "issues" revolve around "victim blaming" in a young adult book. Just because it's fiction doesn't make it any less wrong or disgusting, seeing as it gives the message that cheating is play and blaming the victim is A-okay. This thread is a debate, get the fuck over it.
At least read the thread properly before playing mother hen. You sound incredibly idiotic and condescending.
dimka always had to be with rose since book 1
Speaking if this thread. Wow. I'm appalled. Along with the victim blaming bullshit, you actually think rape teaches you a lesson? And it's the woman's fault for wearing a short top and mini-skirt that she got raped? You are disgusting, especially with the way you think. No wonder the world is so fucking screwed up. A rapist is a rapist. He will go for any woman: she can be walking around the middle of the night naked or she could be wearing a fucking burqa and he will rape her, regardless of clothing. If he doesn't give a damn about her consent, he won't give a damn about her clothing. You are a deranged, fucked in the head bitch that needs to go seek therapy if you think morals can be learnt from the experience.
Also, Kimi, you are incredibly passive aggressive. Especially when you throw shade at anyone with a differing opinion. I find it hilarious you cant even defend yourself without making indirect jabs. I was right: you are an inbecile and a coward. And I will never respect or even try to comprehend your victim blaming bullshit that you seem to pull out of your ass.
Karinloos wrote: "WOW ladies (and gents if any), this is a YA book so get a grip. Rose is a young girl in love with her teacher. Adrian is a sweet but spoilt brat from royalty.
There is no rape in these books. The..."
"A young girl in love with her teacher." It may not be rape, but it is a gross imbalance of power. He took advantage of his authority and should have waited until he was not her educator anymore before sleeping with her. The rape topic was brought up out of the victim blaming, and it was someone on the other side that had the nerve to compare it to cheating, not us. So go attack them.
There is no rape in these books. The..."
"A young girl in love with her teacher." It may not be rape, but it is a gross imbalance of power. He took advantage of his authority and should have waited until he was not her educator anymore before sleeping with her. The rape topic was brought up out of the victim blaming, and it was someone on the other side that had the nerve to compare it to cheating, not us. So go attack them.
Stormy [S♥J] wrote: "Adrian isn't the kind of guy to just boss her around and tell her what to do. Why take away someones free will?You should always think the best of the person your in a relationship with and have ..."
I definately agree with u
Karinloos wrote: "WOW ladies (and gents if any), this is a YA book so get a grip. Rose is a young girl in love with her teacher. Adrian is a sweet but spoilt brat from royalty. There is no rape in these books. The..."
My God, I can't stand assholes like you. I'm not even going to waste my time explaining to you what you were too stupid to read.
Read the whole thread, fuckwad. When you're done, come back and then maybe we can discuss something intelligently.
And like Midnight said, THE OTHER SIDE compared rape to cheating. You are so off the mark it's not even funny, idiot cakes.
(Also, read Leah's post. It seems she took the time to carefully explain to you what you missed. You should probably thank her.)
Leah wrote: "dimka always had to be with rose since book 1"
Karinloos wrote: "WOW ladies (and gents if any), this is a YA book so get a grip. Rose is a young girl in love with her teacher. Adrian is a sweet but spoilt brat from royalty.Rose is 17. Dimitri is 24. Either he took advantage of her, or she's responsible enough to make her own decisions. Make up your mind. It doesn't matter if this is YA. So what? Does that mean it's lesser? Are you that stupid? YA is a marketing term, not a genre. If Adrian were a rich gross heavily overweight sixteen-year-old boy, it would not matter. Rose still cheated on him.
There is no rape in these books. The sex which like happens twice or three times in the whole series is not rape or anything close to it. There is no deeper meaning to the entire story, its just a love story.
Learn how to read. Please. Reading is fundamental on the internet. Also, learn how to spell spoiled. It's not spoilt.
The sweet spoilt boy lost the girl, but that was obvious from the word go. This was a long drawn out love story between Rose and Dimitri.
The spoiled sweet boy was cheated on by a stupid, shitty bitch. That wasn't obvious from the get go. This was a long drawn out porno between Roza "the wild dick rider" and Dmika "I like 'em young".
Ime sorry if some you have issues, but there is no need to take them out on others about a book with no real deep meaning.
I'm glad that you admit this book is a piece of shit. I have issues with you vomiting your stupidity on the web. Thank you for apologizing. Please, clean up your vomit.
If you feel you are in the right, then do the mature thing and stop reacting back like a child.
You are the child. You are siding with the victim blamers. And no, I will not stop until they a) leave, or b) admit they're wrong. Why don't you stop acting like you're somehow in the right by playing the victim. You decided to come here of your own free will, dragging your no reading ass onto this thread, on a mission to spread your vomit across this forum. Bye Bye. And take your vomit rag with you.
undoubtedly you are not understanding what I have been saying from the start. I will dumb it down for you.No matter what way you say it, a victim is a victim. ALL I have been saying is that there are STUPID victims. EVERY single victim COULD have avoided being a victim. If you become a victim you then learn your mistake and learn to avoid being in the same situation. I have NEVER said that it's the victims FAULT for being a victim. Yes, there are rapists and cheater and ppl who are wrong in the world. If you actively prepare yourself you could avoid being in certain situations where you could be attacked. I dare any of you to ask a cop if there is a situation where a single victim could have avoided the attack on him/her. I'm not talking about bombings or mass murders or freaks of nature. I am talking about personal physical/mental attacks. I really doubt the cop will be able to tell you even one.
Now, let's repeat what I have said in case your too childish to understand (I did this with my two year old so your thick head should be able to understand).
A VICTIM CAN BE STUPID!!! A VICTIM COULD HAVE AVOIDED BEING A VICTIM!!! are they a victim, sure. Do some of them need a good slap and asked why they were being stupid? YES!
I have read 99% of the posts on this thread ( some of you are just not worth reading anymore). I have NOT found a single person who has said "ADRIAN IS TO BLAME". You can all take your victim blaming and put it back where it came from. NOBODY is BLAMING the VICTIM! some ppl (who have a head on their shoulders) are saying that Adrian could have used his brain and seen where things were going and avoided being a victim. That is a valid opinion. In MY OPINION Adrian was stupid! <--- VALID!
I understand that you won't see it the same way I do. That's your right. I've said what I thought about all this, if you don't like what I have to say that's your choice. If you feel the need to bash my OPINION then go right ahead and do that, it will show your true mentality.
Every one who is on the NO VICTIM BLAMING train will probably one day be the victim. Your too naive to see that situations can be avoided. I really hope that you have someone like me around in your life to slap you across the head and say what the hell were you thinking when you put yourself in that situation? Then give you a big hug and ask if your ok. That's the kind of person I am. I am a person who knows that one can avoid being a victim. I can be prepared for situations in which I could be a victim. Will I ever be a victim? Maybe. Will I learn from my mistake that put me in that situation? OH YA!
Julie *-* wrote: "undoubtedly you are not understanding what I have been saying from the start. I will dumb it down for you.
No matter what way you say it, a victim is a victim. ALL I have been saying is that the..."
Okay, so if, God forbid, something were to happen to one of your family members or your best friends, you would be ok with someone asking THEM what they could have done to prevent it instead of placing the blame solely where it belongs, and that is on the victimizer? Blaming victims trivalizes the action and minimzes the perpetrator's guilt. It doesn't matter, again, where you are or what you were doing. I could have been in church praying and wearing a habit and I could still be raped or killed. Criminals don't care either way, and that's the point I'm trying to make. What about crimes agianst children? Should they not have played outside or wore their pajamas? What lesson could they have learned? Or what if I am carjacked? Should I not have been driving. We should not be adjusting our behavior to accomdate scumbags. And I hope no one like you is around if God forbid I am a victim of a crime because it's people like you that cause people to be afraid of reporting what has happened to them. You people are the reason victims are silenced.
No matter what way you say it, a victim is a victim. ALL I have been saying is that the..."
Okay, so if, God forbid, something were to happen to one of your family members or your best friends, you would be ok with someone asking THEM what they could have done to prevent it instead of placing the blame solely where it belongs, and that is on the victimizer? Blaming victims trivalizes the action and minimzes the perpetrator's guilt. It doesn't matter, again, where you are or what you were doing. I could have been in church praying and wearing a habit and I could still be raped or killed. Criminals don't care either way, and that's the point I'm trying to make. What about crimes agianst children? Should they not have played outside or wore their pajamas? What lesson could they have learned? Or what if I am carjacked? Should I not have been driving. We should not be adjusting our behavior to accomdate scumbags. And I hope no one like you is around if God forbid I am a victim of a crime because it's people like you that cause people to be afraid of reporting what has happened to them. You people are the reason victims are silenced.
Yes, I would see what could be done to avoid being a victim again. Does that change the fact that the victim was a victim? Does that stop someone from speaking up about it? NOPE. The blame does not change. That's the point I have been trying to make. I do everything I can to stop myself from being a victim. That's being smart. I have taken self defense, I carry a phone and something to defend myself with, I don't carry lots of cash on me, I don't walk through the forest to get to my house late at night... I stick to the main roads. All things that will stop me from being in danger. If I am a victim at one point in life, I will ask myself, what could have been done to avoid being in that situation. That's being pro-active and SMART! If you don't your only going to set yourself up to being in the same situation. I never said that a victim is to blame for what was done. They aren't at all. What I am saying is that you can be SMART and avoid dangerous situations. I disagree that you should not be adjusting your behavior to accommodate scumbags. If your prepared for scumbags, you avoid bad situations. If your prepared for someone to come attack you, your chances of not being a victim are MUCH, MUCH higher.
A victim is a victim none the less. ALL I have been doing is DISCRIBING the type of victim I think he is. NEVER have I said that I thought Adrian was to blame for what Rose did. All I did was explain how I thought the whole situation could have been avoided. Nothing wrong with doing that. Someone who is actively finding ways to protect themselves from being a victim has better chances then someone who doesn't.
Julie *-* wrote: "undoubtedly you are not understanding what I have been saying from the start. I will dumb it down for you.No matter what way you say it, a victim is a victim. ALL I have been saying is that the..."
Ugh. Really?
Look, I don't think you understand: We understand what you're saying. You have made your view clear. It's just that you sound crazy. So, every victim of rape or sexual assault could have avoided being attacked? In every single instance? Really? You're insane. Good luck with that.
But whatever, I'm done with this whole rape analogy. It was shoddy from the get go, and honestly you're never going to understand the fact that rape is NEVER the victim's fault so lets just move on, shall we?
Sure, Adrian--and every other person who has been cheated on, ever--could have avoided being cheated on if they hadn't been so stupid (your word, not mine) and gotten into a relationship to begin with. But they did. So it's their fault, right?
Look, you seem to think Adrian saw the writing on the wall, or that he should have. But here's the deal: he trusted his girlfriend. Why? Because he was in an adult relationship. And in adult relationships you should trust your partner. If your partner has proved him/herself a liar, then yeah, maybe they aren't trustworthy. But until Rose CHEATED ON Adrian he had no reason to not trust his girlfriend, regardless of the fact that she was with her ex-boyfriend.
The fact is, Rose should have felt some sort of (real & lasting) remorse for how she treated Adrian, because he was a good boyfriend and an even better friend to her. She didn't. And when he tells her off (rightfully so) for being such a selfish slut-faced ho bag, she throws it back in his face, as if it were his fault. It wasn't.
See, there's this saying: "fool me once, SHAME ON YOU. Fool me twice, shame on me." Adrian had no reason not to trust Rose. So, yeah, I'd say the shame lies solely on Rose's shoulders. Shame on her.
And another thing: so there's no rape in this series? Really? How about in Blood Promise when Dimitri keeps Rose prisoner, giving her what basically amounts to the date-rape drug (his venom), and has sex with her multiple times. It doesn't matter that they "love each other" or that Dimitri was "not in his right mind". Rose wasn't in her right mind either because of Dimitri's venom. Do you people think Rose, had she been in her right mind, would have willingly had sex with stragoi Dimitri? Do you think she tracked him down just so he could keep her against her will and basically (date) rape her multiple times? Did you people find that whole situation romantic? If the answer is yes, you need to get help. I don't care how they felt about each other. Dimitri still took advantage of Rose. What he did was wrong.
And don't even get me started on the whole statutory rape thing.
The fact that a five year old's accountability in being raped/molested is being debated (here's a hint, THEY FUCKING HAVE NONE) proves the lows people can sink to. As someone who has seen the effects of child rape/molestation, I am utterly offended.
Julie *-* wrote: "When it comes to small children, it's the parents job to protect them. If the parents don't then it's the job of the babysitter and/or teacher. There are signes that you can watch for. Small childr..."
It's often the babysitter, the teacher, or the parent themselves doing the violating. When we are taught all of our lives to respect authority without question, it's hard for children to speak out. They do not understand sex, so they may not even know that something wrong is happening. They may be too scared to articulate how they feel or they may have been threatened/had their family threatened. My best friend was constantly told his mother would be hurt/killed if he said anything.
It's often the babysitter, the teacher, or the parent themselves doing the violating. When we are taught all of our lives to respect authority without question, it's hard for children to speak out. They do not understand sex, so they may not even know that something wrong is happening. They may be too scared to articulate how they feel or they may have been threatened/had their family threatened. My best friend was constantly told his mother would be hurt/killed if he said anything.
You BLAME Rose for cheating on Adrian? Right? Since Rose was mentally unstable due to Lisa and her whole spirit thing, does that not mean that Rose was a victim too? Are you not a victim blamer now? Is everyone on here who has stated that ROSE IS TO BLAME not a victim blamer? well, yes, yes you are! Someone who is mentally unstable is not to blame for his/ her actions.She showed no signs of mental instability, darkness doesn't transfer through the bond when Rose is away from Lissa— she was at court and Rose was frolicking with Dimitri elsewhere. So, no, we aren't victim blamers. Nice try though.
When it comes to protecting yourself, for me, there are always ways to avoid situations. That's just the way I think. You could name all sorts of situations and I would find something that could have been done to avoid it.
As a victim of being molested as a child, please tell me how I could have avoided that damn situation. How did I let myself be the victim? Hmm? How could I have avoided it when I haven't DONE anything to provoke it? Please do enlighten me because I am so fucking appalled by your comment.
Honestly Julie, I think you've proved that you're a fucking moron. Really. Take this:
And have a nice fucking day. I won't even bother rebutting you. You've proved that you aren't worth a rat's ass.
I bet you believe in a rape emergency kit too, don't you? I better go buy rape insurance because it's my responsibility to make sure I'm not raped. What the fuck is wrong with you?I have cousins who were molested. I have a cousin who is a child molester. Unless those girls were mind readers, they had no way of knowing that he was a child molester. Some situations can never, ever, ever be prevented. You are wrong for thinking that they can. Most people don't even like talking about the experience because it triggers the trauma. Duh. I'm sorry, but if you're too stupid to understand that, you don't need access to the internet, books, or contact with other people.
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Michelle, the Bookshelf Stalker
(last edited Sep 06, 2011 10:58AM)
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♔ Julie *-* wrote:"That's the point I have been trying to make. I do everything I can to stop myself from being a victim. That's being smart. I have taken self defense, I carry a phone and something to defend myself with, I don't carry lots of cash on me, I don't walk through the forest to get to my house late at night... I stick to the main roads. All things that will stop me from being in danger. If I am a victim at one point in life, I will ask myself, what could have been done to avoid being in that situation. ..."I really, really tried to avoid commenting since this entire thread is seriously out of control but as the victim of a very violent crime, I can't keep quiet.
In May of 2007, I was attacked by 4 men in a parking lot of a major department store. I had very little cash on me ($40), the parking lot was well lit, there were crowds of people coming and going from the store (in fact the men were chased by one such group). I had pepper spray on me, AND a stun gun in my purse. I was super observant. However, I was still attacked. If you want to message me in private, I will show you the youtube videos from the news story of my attack. I will also share my pictures. I had a broken jaw, 2 black and blue eyes, a broken nose, a lacerated lip (my upper lip was hanging off my face), a broken hand (don't ask), and a C1 neck injury when my head connected with the side of my car.
My reason for telling you this is to hopefully educate you that not all victims could have prevented their own attack. One of my attackers went on to kill a Sheriff 7 months later (Dec of 2007) .
I spent the next 2 years dealing with a murder trial. It's easy for people who've never been a victim to say what the victim could have done differently but until it happens to you, you really should think before you speak.
I won't comment anymore on this topic in this thread. I probably shouldn't have said anything in the first place. And finally, I know I'll regret hitting that damn post button but here I go...
^I'm sorry for your ordeal, that's absolutely horrid and I wholeheartedly agree that it's easier said than done and the ordeal is A LOT different. I'm honestly so fucking disgusted that I could warn others not to get molested in the future, why not stop the crime from happening in the first damn place instead of placing victim blame?
Don't you understand that if the crime was prevented then there would be NO victims at all? Sometimes, knowing a bit of self defence and having a mobile won't be enough. Plenty of women carry a mobile yet they get raped— not in a dark alley but in during the daytime. It doesn't happen at a certain time. It can happen ANYWHERE.
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I really don't understand you people...
The "mistake" that you said he made IS NOT A MISTAKE. Not letting Rose go and find Dimitri would have been controlling and selfish. How was he supposed to tell her where she could and could not go? Actually, that sounds like something Dimitri might do...
If you know Rose's assholish ways then why are you so persistent that Adrian is somehow at fault for her bitchery? Not liking Adrian is fine...blaming him for what Rose did is not.
I don't know how old any of you are but if you go back to high school you will see ALL that and more. You've got cheater, manipulators and bitches in high school.
What does High school have to do with Rose cheating on Adrian and victim blaming? Right, nothing. By the time Rose makes her grand finale she isn't in High school anymore, and neither is Adrian. Even if they were, what would that have to do with anything again?
I guess at the end of the day, I'm in neither of the "groups" on this thread. Sorry, I guess that's going to get everyone against me!!!
No, you're obviously in with the Victim Blamers. Maybe you should take a badge and a soda and get comfy -- denying it won't do you any good.
Of course, in the Anti-Victim blaming over here our badges are shinier we've got chocolate chip cookies (and we aren't naive assholes). But you go and have your stale Pepsi. Go on.
But no, it wouldn't get anyone against you if you actually were in neither of the groups.