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Hunt the Moon
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Hunt the Moon (Cassandra Palmer #5)
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Claire
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Dec 01, 2012 01:17PM
This is lending weight to my hypothesis that Cassie can't just up and leave Mircea
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Well done Claire!!Based on what KC said in that Q & A I posted about the other day, I'm thinking the bond is much the same whether a vamp marries another vamp or if a vamp claims a human. And Mircea, unsurprisingly, was trying to have his cake and eat it.
I'm thinking that Cassie will always be bonded to Mircea, but she may not always be married to him. He has 'claimed' her (as a human) and she can't ever get rid of that, but it seems like there's some leeway as to whether it's a marriage or not, since Cassie isn't vamp. But yeah, it seems like the marks are always going to be there. Man, I would be effing raging if someone did that to me without my permission!!
(For reference again, the Q & A is here (Q2):
http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note...
Do you think, if you were vamp and you wanted a divorce, you could just carve the bit of skin out of your neck (or wherever it was)? Sure, it would hurt like a bitch, but you're vamp and you'll heal in a day or so and hopefully when the skin comes back all shiny and new, the bite marks would be gone. (Yeah, yeah, I doubt divorce is that simple, but surely that would get rid of the physical marks?) Too bad this isn't an option for Cassie.
@Lannister A powerful master vampire probably could just carve that chunk of skin out and be done with it. However, I doubt that happens very often because vampires are too politically aware to end a potentially useful alliance.
Mmm I know this is different but Mircea changed Rafe's allegiance/house/ blood bond so I wonder if there is a way to shift this as well. We don't actually hear about many paired vamps much unlike say Ilona Andrews where that's central to most plot lines. Is Just something masters do?
That's a good point, Anna. In Rafe's case, technically, he belonged to Tony who in turn belonged to Mircea, so they were of the same family, but the point is valid.I don't get the sense that only powerful vampires wed, though since we haven't really heard much about vampire marriages, beyond Cassie's thoughts, and she may not be completely in the know, it's hard to speculate. I tend to view vampire marriages kinda like the way it was in ye olden times when powerful families arranged marriages between their children to cement alliances. I don't think vamps have 'arranged' marriages as such, but I think they will consider other aspects beyond mere love before they commit themselves.
I get the impression that marriage, for baby vamps at least, isn't all that common. I think that the vampire's "family" are all they really need. We know vamps date, since Marco went out with that witch, but I don't think they bond too often. After all, eternity is a damn long time to spend with someone. They probably do have relationships, they just don't make them permanent. I think even I'd get sick of someone after 200 years.
Yeah, that's pretty much what I think Claire. Especially when KC has said that vamps view sex as just another tool to be taken advantage of. Somehow love seems very low down on their list of what's important. However, I'm wondering if vamps view marriage very differently from regular ole humans. They possibly have very open marriages, where sex with others isn't viewed as that big of a deal. After all, in Hunt the Moon Cassie - Mircea's wife - was supposed to be dating other people. (OK it turned out to be a bit of a disaster, but the point remains - she was being encouraged to date.) How many married people in this group could go home and say to their spouses "Well, there's this guy I work with and he says it would be better for world peace if I dated other people ...." (Is that a lead balloon I hear falling?) But Mircea didn't have a freak-out at the idea. So marriage may not equal monogamy.
I think the only reason Mircea didn't freak out was because he didn't know and Cassie didn't actually go out on a date. Remember, Cassie said that Jonas didn't know that the marks meant marriage and she had no intention of enlightening him. So Marsden was encouraging Cassie to date, but he didn't know she was essentially married. I think if Cassie told Mircea that she intended to date other people he'd have a view choice words on the subject, none of them pleasant. Especially so, given that he was sticking to monogamy.
Hmmmm I kinda want Cassie to tell Mircea she's dating other people now (and that's not impossible after the events of Fury's Kiss!!) just to see his reaction.The reason I'm thinking Mircea isn't quite as down with this whole marriage thing is, well, 1. that Q & A that I keep banging on about, where Mircea swings between wife and servant. And 2, right at the end of Curse the Dawn, where Cassie tells Mircea she wants to be courted, he actually asks her straight out "Do you want to break up with me". I don't think for a minute that he wanted Cassie's answer to be yes, but it does imply that there's some wiggle room.
Mircea was under the effect of the geis when he bit Cassie. He was basically a little out of his mind. If he'd had all his reasoning intact, he may not have bit her in the first place, but since he did, he decided to make the best of the situation. The very fact that he seems to sway between treating her as servant and wife does make you wonder if he is 100% committed. After all, when he bit Cassie, he thought he was dreaming and that she was an illusion.
I think Mircea understands the reality of the situation--no matter what vamp rules/laws state. He gets cassie is from this generation and that those bites happened because of the geis. I have no doubt he would use his bites to his advantage. Either to keep Cassie around as his gf, and/or, as his advantage with the pythia and politics.
I think what happens with the bites depends a lot on how much Mircea is willing to change. If he's willing to move away from treating Cassie as a servant, then I see everything working out.
yeah, I was looking up something in HtM and reread that sex scene of theirs, and they really do love each other.
That's how I feel. Cassie loves Mircea, really considers him one of the best things in her life. And Mircea is willing to be more open with Cassie than nearly anyone else. So I don't see them giving up on that relationship easily
Mod
I thought that the bite wasn't just about claiming Cassie or being woozy. I thought it was partly a tactical move to let himself know that he had claimed her because he was going to go through a time shift thing and needed to understand that he had given her a bite ...I could probably be a bit more vague if I tried hard enough :p sorry! too tired to look it up!
No it was the other way around, he bit her in frenzy, but then he realized that this was not how it happened, or something like that. So he backed off--but the bites were already there. Let me go look it up . . .“I did not want to change this future,” he agreed. “When he went to you despite my orders, and you came to me…For a brief moment, I thought it was over. But then I remembered: I had not yet been imprisoned, your clothes were wrong, and there was no snare on the bedside table. It was too soon. It was the closest I came to breaking.”
So I don't think the bites were intentional.
I have no idea if Mircea did it on purpose or not. I'm torn between thinking he was totally out of his head, but I also have a hard time believing he'd take such a big step unintentionally.
I just reread that scene (which btw, I forgot was REALLLLLY hot) and it seems like neither of them had really much thought, the geis was pretty much in charge. Plus, he didn't want Cassie to come, she was supposed to not be allowed in.So I don't know . . . I guess Mircea is smart enough for the manipulations, buttttt . . . it seems like a big stretch in this situation
I haven't reread the scene recently, but doesn't Mircea say after biting her "You're real" or "You're really here" or something along those lines? I believed he thought he was hallucinating or dreaming, and he bit her cos that's what vamps do. It wasn't really a conscious decision to mark her.
yup--“Cassie…” He looked dazed, and his voice was rough and cracked a bit at the edges. “I thought you were a dream.”
I can't believe Mircea was up to his usual manipulations here. I don't think he knew what he was doing and fell back on instinctive vamp behaviour. Probably once he was back to himself and had time to analyse what had happened with biting Cassie, that's when he would have started to work out how best to profit from the situation!
Mod
That does make sense
Its so nice to come back to the thread and find you have done all the hard work for me! You guys are awesome! :D Chocolate cake anyone?My only worry with that scenario (that vampires just revert to type/biting under stress) is that I would expect more a lot more marriages than there seem to be...
Well, I have a feeling that vampires probably don't encounter the type of stress Mircea was under all that often. In addition, it's probably not instinctive to bite other vamps, since their blood doesn't nourish.
I could imagine an injured vamp who was dazed and low on blood sensing a human near and grabbing them and biting simply out of a survival instinct. The bite to 'claim' would be a territorial kind of behaviour, to keep other vamps away from their food source. Vamps can feed from other vamps, but their blood doesn't taste good. Tomas feeds from two vamps in A Day of the Dead ...
The reused blood nourished him, the lightheaded rush of feeding giving the same almost narcotic high as always, but the taste was like metal in his mouth.
I think a vamp, even an injured one, would hesitate to feed from another unwilling vamp simply because they are equal predators and there is no guarantee of success. Indeed the consequences could be fatal, if it doesn't go your way. It would be like a lion attacking another lion when there's a herd of sleepy wildebeest standing right beside you. Why bother, when there's much easier prey elsewhere?
Exactly. So I don't think vamps just munch on each other willy nilly every time they're injured.
and it wasn't just any stress--it was a double circular geias. I bet anyone else under that same constraints would do the same--but no one else but Cassie can cause that much trouble . . .LOL!
Cassie is certainly talented that way
I enjoyed this book so much and really want to see what happens with Cassie and Pritkin Cassie and Mircea , Pritkin seem to only coming and going I am a little bias as I like Pritkin :-), not sure about Mircea tho he hard to read
I'm pro Pritkin too Karen, though I came to like Mircea a lot more (and somewhat against my will!!) after reading Fury's Kiss. Mircea is KC's most complex character and I like him for that, but I can never quite figure out his motivations, though that's not a bad thing cos it makes him so fun to read.I'm desperate for Cassie#6 to find out what happening with Pritkin!
Pritkin: Me too I want to know if he going to be ok real like him as he smart and fun with a lit bite to him :-)
He's known as the DSWM around here. That stands for Dirty Sexy War Mage. I think that name suits him! :)
Hmm yes it does I like must keep it to use when speaking about him :-)
I nearly finished my re-read of HtM. My opinion of Pritkin continues to improve ( and by that I mean I squee internally whenever the DSWM puts in an appearance). My opinion of Cassie and Mircea keeps evolving. Sometimes I want to throttle Mircea, then I want to keep him for myself. I wish Cassie would explain things to Mircea the way she explained them carefully to Marco or Pritkin.
Lannister wrote: "He's known as the DSWM around here. That stands for Dirty Sexy War Mage. I think that name suits him! :)"I had not heard this before I love it! ROFL XD
Claire wrote: "I nearly finished my re-read of HtM. My opinion of Pritkin continues to improve ( and by that I mean I squee internally whenever the DSWM puts in an appearance). My opinion of Cassie and Mircea kee..."I also squee internally whenever he is on the page. I think when he appears back from faery . . . I do an external squee. Every. time.
I also wish Cassie did a better job at explaining things to Mircea--but maybe it's an emotional thing.
I get so happy when he's back, and find myself wishing that Cassie had jumped up to give him a hug or something.Anyway, Cassie is clearly frustrated with Mircea. Maybe it is an emotional thing, but if Mircea is willing to share very private thoughts with Cassie, she should be willing to be equally forthcoming especially on such a big issue. What bugs me about the situation is that Cassie clearly explains to both Pritkin and Marco what it is that's bothering her (to Pritkin more in depth...but are we really surprised? =p ). I think if Cassie had clearly articulated to Mircea that he was actively harming her and keeping her from her job, he might understand it better.
Hmm good points but I wonder is it because John and Macro give respect in some way they speak their mind to hear so it frees her up to be herself where s with Micera she can't he could use it against if he need to sorry to Micera fans and my spelling just woke up lol
Claire wrote: " What bugs me about the situation is that Cassie clearly explains to both Pritkin and Marco what it is that's bothering her"Don't you think it says so much about the state of Cassie & Mircea's relationship that she's able to discuss her problems with Pritkin and Marco, but not with Mircea?
I think if Cassie had clearly articulated to Mircea that he was actively harming her and keeping her from her job, he might understand it better.
I think Mircea knows exactly what he's doing. He wants Cassie's Pythia duties to be filtered through him first. That's the whole point of having a tame Pythia. The vamp senate wants to make the decisions, not Cassie.
I hate it when you make sense, Lannister =pThe problem is that I love Mircea and Pritkin for different reasons. I can't pick one over the other so I kinda want it to work out with both of them.
I know the feel Clare but I cant get a read on Mircea sometimes in parts of the books I loved to throw his ass over a cliff but in others you just want to curl up to him lol, but Prikin is better for Cassie me thinks as they got this pull which need want or understand for different resons but that mite change in her next book
Pritkin might be better for her....but he might not. Mircea's protection definitely counts for something.
Pritkin would probably be safer without her as Rosier points out!
....Eeeeh Pritkin would get himself into trouble anyway!
Claire wrote: "I hate it when you make sense, Lannister =p"LOL, well it's an infrequent occurrence so I wouldn't worry about it! :D
The problem is that I love Mircea and Pritkin for different reasons. I can't pick one over the other so I kinda want it to work out with both of them.
And this, in a nutshell, is the issue so many fans have! Even though I constantly doubt Mircea's intentions, I still hate the thought of him being jilted and broken-hearted. That's why I think KC will kill him. Kidding, kidding!! :)
Karen wrote: "I cant get a read on Mircea sometimes in parts of the books I loved to throw his ass over a cliff but in others you just want to curl up to him lol, but Prikin is better f..."
I think, right now, Pritkin is a better person for Cassie simply because he doesn't want anything from her. His protection and his affections are given solely out of loyalty. Some mages might use Pythia guard duty as a means of promoting their standing within the Circle and elevating themselves. Pritkin doesn't give a damn about any of that. All he wants to do is take care of Cassie. There are no strings attached. Unlike Mircea. His affections come with a price. That doesn't mean he's a bad guy, but his protection definitely has strings. Mircea (or the Senate) will want favours from the Pythia at some point down the line in exchange for their protection. They aren't doing it for nothing.
Yes this is why I'm team Pritkin! When Cassie and Pritkin are together, it is just Cassie+Pritkin. But when Mircea and Cassie it is Pythia+SenateMember.
She is able to talk to Pritkin more, because while he is protective of her, he won't freak out and chain her to a couch to keep her safe!
Good points Ela!God, that couch scene, I keep forgetting about it! Try to imagine being with a guy who chained you to his couch, because he thought you would be 'safer' there. We put people in jail for that kind of behaviour and call them crazy, obsessive stalkers and abusers!! But Mircea gets away with it. WTF?
Annnnnnd this is why I flip flop. Most days I'm like, "Team Pritkin, yeah!" and then we get to scenes in HtM when Mircea's laughing joyously and spinning Cassie around in the snow just because she's there. Or sharing the story of his childhood that he never told anyone else, but wanted her to know. Sometimes I think he's changing as much as he's able, after 500 years of the same song and dance. And, some days, I think politics are all that move him.That's the issue with vampires (like LC and Mircea) that act so human! Who the hell knows what they're up to!
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