You'll love this one...!! A book club & more discussion

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Off Topic Chat > Watcha Doin' - 2017.1 edition

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message 601: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments Nope, just scrub them.


message 602: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments No on the carrots. Nice stats Joan. Are not the same as I saw but the ones I saw were more than just exec. Orders. I just can't recall what everything is called. Total tally was like Trump 20 Obama 30. It was on the news of some sort locally


message 603: by Lisa (new)

Lisa (lisathebooklover) | 9244 comments Joan wrote: "Off topic question!
Do you peel carrots before eating them?"


No, just clean them, cook them and eat them :)


message 604: by Joan (last edited Feb 01, 2017 04:29PM) (new)

Joan Travis of NNY wrote: "No on the carrots. Nice stats Joan. Are not the same as I saw but the ones I saw were more than just exec. Orders. I just can't recall what everything is called. Total tally was like Trump 20 Obama..."

Those came from U.C. Santa Barbara, they have had a project on the history of the US Presidency since the 1990's. No spin just data. I pulled the numbers from their tables.


message 605: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments I think if you include the presidential orders it's more?? I know they're not the same as executive orders.


message 606: by Joan (last edited Feb 01, 2017 06:35PM) (new)

Joan Dawn wrote: "I think if you include the presidential orders it's more?? I know they're not the same as executive orders."

Apparently the other types of communications are not officially registered by the national archives so analysts can pick and choose to get the numbers they want.
That is why UC Santa Barbara reports just the official record.
It's not my area of research; that's just how I understand the political science explanation.


message 607: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments I read something about how the presidential office will use whichever stat works for them, and Trump is calling his something else, Memorandums or something like that.
It's way outside my realm of knowledge and not at all like the political system I know so I'm not sure about any of it.


message 608: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/po...

This is the article I read. It's interesting because it tells how some of them are how Obama got around Republican stalemates and Bill Clinton looked busy during impeachment investigation. It's a short article.


In other news Hillary is to release a book of essays followed by a children's book this fall.


message 609: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments That sounds something like the one I read from The Washington Post, kinda explaining what all this stuff is and that it's usually not public.


message 610: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments Just hearing on a phone call between trump and prime minister of Australia. What I like is how Australia PM isn't commenting on it to the media. Hopefully the two can have another talk and have it go better. Diplomacy was my greatest fear. Still is


message 611: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments My sister was just filling me on that one, apparently the talk with Mexico didn't go well either. He threatened to send troops in???


message 612: by Rusalka, Moderator (last edited Feb 02, 2017 02:30AM) (new)

Rusalka (rusalkii) | 19221 comments Travis of NNY wrote: "Just hearing on a phone call between trump and prime minister of Australia. What I like is how Australia PM isn't commenting on it to the media. Hopefully the two can have another talk and have it ..."

Goddammit, I was trying to not get involved.

The talk with the Aussie PM was an embarrassment, with Trump apparently hanging up on him, after informing him it was the worst conversation of his day. The PM is too busy trying to be polite and diplomatic, he's lying to Australians, which is a no no in most of our books.

A lot of Australians are calling for the government to reevaluate the Australian American alliance. We are too dependant on you lot, and we have no guarantees. We throw the baby out with the bath water for the States but there is nothing to make sure you guys do the same for us. We are expendable, and small. But it screws us over. I frequently say we went from dependence on the British to dependence on the Americans. Trump is at least proving this is even more tenuous than I thought, and people are realising we need to start looking after ourselves. Sure, sounds good to Americans "supporting us free loaders", but remember you guys positioned yourselves as such and made yourselves the ally to support the world. The world is now freaking out and trying to work out how we now look after us, as we may have to go up against our allies.

All over the fact that Australia locks up illegally, people who come to Australia LEGALLY, no matter what the orange man in a toupe tweets, seeking asylum. We have camps in foreign countries where we lock up women, children and men escaping war and persecution. The Australian government for political reasons thinks this is a better option than establishing a well funded, humanitarian pathway to asylum in Australia or elsewhere. We spend BILLIONS of dollars each year putting people in detention centres where they are sexually abused, and replicates mental illness, as they are locked up for years. Many are genuine refugees and have been proven so, but because of one election slogan, the government won't let them come to Australia as they came on a boat instead of sitting in a refugee camp or their country were they could be killed for 10 years as the UNHCR doesn't have billions of dollars.

One such Centre has been declared illegal by Papua New Guinea (which is amazing in itself), and needs to be closed. The Gov can't back down as they are spineless and can't say they were wrong like real leadership could, and so negotiated a deal with the US. Now, these people who finally have hope, don't. My government is shit, and these people now probably just got screwed by Trump. It's our fault. These refugees should have been here anyway. But this is what the political bluster is about. Trump not wanting proven refugees. If he had overturned the deal because he thought we were dicks and we should take these refugees (1 250 by the way), then all power to him. Not honouring it for more xenophobic, racist reasons tied to his ill thought out, reactionary, discriminatory travel ban is despicable.


message 613: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments Not our finest hour for sure.

Yesterday was one of those days when I realized how much more daylight we have. In fall you lose some then winter start gaining and a couple minutes here and there you don't notice then one day it just hits you how much you've gained or lost. Yesterday was one of those days. For me


message 614: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments We don't have a complete shut out. This week we are letting in 676 refugees. Which percentage wise probably isn't much


message 615: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments And in complete randomness, I asked my kids this morning if they will prop me up beside the jukebox when I die. And they said no. I'm not sure my feelings on that yet. I thought they'd say yes. Lol


message 616: by Peggy (new)

Peggy (pebbles84) | 15868 comments Travis of NNY wrote: "Not our finest hour for sure.

Yesterday was one of those days when I realized how much more daylight we have. In fall you lose some then winter start gaining and a couple minutes here and there yo..."


I had that today! (for the morning, I noticed that when I'm on by bike at 7.45 I almost don't need my lights anymore) Love those moments :)


message 617: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments So I don't know if it's nation wide or just locally but directv just lost the contract to carry locals. Sure we can get most with an antenna but without DirecTV we can't DVR them. I about blew my top. Sunday is the Superbowl. Now I will miss part of it. Grrr. My wife was furious because her masterpiece classics on PBS aren't DVR currently.

So my wife got into a bottle of wine and decided she should complain to DirecTV. It was hilarious. They are confident the locals will be back eventually. He offered her $5 a month discount for the year. She ran him up almost to $20 but we got $15 off a month.


message 618: by Rusalka, Moderator (last edited Feb 02, 2017 04:41AM) (new)

Rusalka (rusalkii) | 19221 comments Travis of NNY wrote: "We don't have a complete shut out. This week we are letting in 676 refugees. Which percentage wise probably isn't much"

Just because of the Syrian war, there are 6.5 million people who are displaced. Not looking at any other conflict or famine. So just looking at those displaced by the Syrian conflict, nothing else, that is 0.0001% of those people.

In 2015, 65.3 million people were displaced. The richest country in the world is taking 676 people.

I actually need to say this again

In 2015, 65.3 million people were displaced. The richest country in the world is taking 676 people.

Some facts http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-09-21...
"Here are the countries that resettled the most refugees through the UNHCR in 2015:

United States (66,500)
Canada (20,000)
Australia (9,400)
Norway (2,400)"

And Aus are being dicks and not letting in anyone who comes here desperately by boat. And from that US number down to that 676 people, that's 0.01% of what you took in in 2015. But Aus is doing bugger all compared to the States from those facts too. We have less habitable space, but we must be comparable to Canada.


message 619: by Rusalka, Moderator (new)

Rusalka (rusalkii) | 19221 comments Travis of NNY wrote: "And in complete randomness, I asked my kids this morning if they will prop me up beside the jukebox when I die. And they said no. I'm not sure my feelings on that yet. I thought they'd say yes. Lol"

Lol


message 620: by Rusalka, Moderator (new)

Rusalka (rusalkii) | 19221 comments Peggy wrote: "I had that today! (for the morning, I noticed that when I'm on by bike at 7.45 I almost don't need my lights anymore)"


What? This is when I remember how north you all are.


message 621: by Sandra, Moderator (new)

Sandra (sanlema) | 11296 comments I notices it too yesterday morning. When my kids leave at 7:10 is clear now.


message 622: by Kristie, Moderator (new)

Kristie | 19323 comments Rusalka - I was also trying not to get involved, but I constantly feel the need to apologize for Trump. He has no tact. I've said from the beginning that his interactions with other world leaders scare me. He has no idea how to be diplomatic and treat other people properly. So, sorry about that. He is a "insert cuss word here." Unfortunately, there is nothing we can do about it.

As for sun light, I am SO thankful that the sun is starting to stay out longer. I have noticed it recently too and love it.


message 623: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments I believe in giving every single president a fair chance. I've been trying to find the positive in trump. As you all have seen. After yesterday's phone calls. I'm out. It's every man for himself. We have too many nations mad at us right now. He can dig his own holes I'm just gonna be a spectator for a while and be glad every morning i wake up and no one has nuked us. Yet. I didn't even vote for him and have been giving him enormous support. Screw it. I'll be over here sipping a beer and watching the chaos for a while.


message 624: by Janice, Moderator (new)

Janice (jamasc) | 60073 comments I think the rest of the world is more concerned about who Trump is going to nuke, Travis.


message 625: by KimeyDiann (last edited Feb 02, 2017 06:51AM) (new)

KimeyDiann | 2174 comments Dawn wrote: "It would be a really good job and I am often surprised that more women don't take up plumbing or electrical, they seem like the type of jobs that would benefit from a woman's finesse and I know they pay good, really good if you get on with the right company"

You are spot on. A lot of the things electricians and plumbers have to do require being in tight spaces where smaller hands would be a big benefit.


message 626: by KimeyDiann (new)

KimeyDiann | 2174 comments Travis of NNY wrote: "So I don't know if it's nation wide or just locally but directv just lost the contract to carry locals. Sure we can get most with an antenna but without DirecTV we can't DVR them. I about blew my t..."

We had that here recently too. The locals were off for a couple of months. My mother was furious that she was missing her shows. LOL.


message 627: by KimeyDiann (new)

KimeyDiann | 2174 comments I have been noticing the slightly longer days for a couple of weeks now. It isn't pitch dark when I leave work in the evenings at 5:00. There is actually still daylight for a good portion of my drive home! I'm loving it!


message 628: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments Rusalka wrote: "I frequently say we went from dependence on the British to dependence on the Americans. Trump is at least proving this is even more tenuous than I thought,..."

From one super power to another, I agree, I think we all did that.

I've been happy to see countries picking up some of the pieces for this though, The Netherlands is spearheading more funding for Woman's Health, after the US pulled theirs.
I'm also happy to see Canada stepping up on the refugee front and I hope we make up some of that shortfall, the Syrian refugee crisis is what prompted our change in government after all.
Again, I'm also curious about how the new bi-lateral trade negotiations will go and what countries are going to start talking because of this disruption.


message 629: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments Janice wrote: "I think the rest of the world is more concerned about who Trump is going to nuke, Travis."

Not sure Captain Ahab can get to those controls too easily. I'd hope not. But when you're sitting where I am near one of the US more major army bases and not far from NYC. We tend to be more worried for missiles aimed at us. Our base is in the running for the antimissile something or other so we can shoot down missiles aimed at us. But we haven't been approved or have it installed yet . But certainly I understand the feeling of the rest of the world.


message 630: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments I will continue to have blind faith that all our respective leaders will be able to avert something stupid like that.


message 631: by Joan (new)

Joan My heart is breaking over the way many of my compatriots are dehumanizing people who are different or from other countries. As if the travelers, the immigrants and the refuges are not people, individuals.
My congressman is feeding the xenophobia to strengthen his power base.


message 632: by Sandra, Moderator (last edited Feb 02, 2017 10:28AM) (new)

Sandra (sanlema) | 11296 comments Joan, I think you might find this article interesting:

‘You don’t belong in this country,’ actor Kal Penn was told. Here’s what he did about it.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/m...


message 633: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments The argument I hear the most is there are American Vietnam vets living on the streets . In general there are a lot of homeless starving people already in America and people want to see them put first. The issue seems to be take care of all Americans then take care of these refugees or other country people. That is what I see the most of

Yes there are the xenophobia out there I won't argue. I've seen that first hand to but in general I see a larger percentage of people under my above paragraph .

Still I have seen nothing done or talked about to help our homeless . So I don't know which one of the above situations fits our administration. To be perfectly honest

Why can't they both be helped would be the correct question?


message 634: by Peggy (new)

Peggy (pebbles84) | 15868 comments That's what the right wing people here say all the time here too: own people first. Not necessarily homeless, but around here it's mostly about care for the elderly or people who live in poverty.

I hate it, I don't understand why there always needs to be an us and them. Like you say Travis, why choose, why not help both?


message 635: by Sandra, Moderator (new)

Sandra (sanlema) | 11296 comments The reason I posted the link was I liked the way he turned a hate comment into something positive.

I agree with your comments about vets, Travis. We receive phone calls all the time asking for donations (that we usually do, btw), but they are always from ONG, nothing from the government.

I totally understand people wants to see Americans receiving help, and find it fair America helping Americans first. I can understand that way of thinking, of course. But I don't think this is what most those trolls/haters/whatever are thinking when they post these comments, or any other hate demonstration. I think people (in general, not only Americans) are racist, classicists, xenophobes, etc. just because they are. Period. Lots of fear, insecurities, and ignorance. Not to much thoughts about it.


message 636: by Joan (new)

Joan Travis of NNY wrote: "The argument I hear the most is there are American Vietnam vets living on the streets . In general there are a lot of homeless starving people already in America and people want to see them put fir..."

Thanks that was interesting - it is so disturbing seeing people lumped into one amorphous group based on nationality, religion - as if all people from New York State were alike! (like saying all upstate and downstate New Yorkers are alike). And then when people say "but Islam is different" I just hear Nazi's buzzing in my head.
I had heard about some actor named Penn responding to the current xenophobia, but I assumed it was the other Penn guy - what's his name. Ah well all Penns are alike.


message 637: by Sandra, Moderator (last edited Feb 02, 2017 11:43AM) (new)

Sandra (sanlema) | 11296 comments This conversation reminds me a talk I had with my kids a few days ago during dinner. The trigger wasn't anything that it is right now in the news, but I think is related. The thing is that I asked them "What is the personal merit of have been born white instead of black, or with blue eyes instead of brown, or in America instead of Uruguay, or even in Uruguay instead of Rwanda?". My 14 years old answered "None. Those are things that just were given to you". I was SO proud of him! I said then "Not even have been born smart has any personal merit. In any case what you do with it is what counts".

No one who gives some thought to race, citizenship, etc. can feel superior in any way.


message 638: by Cherie (new)

Cherie (crobins0) | 21536 comments KimeyDiann wrote: "Dawn wrote: "It would be a really good job and I am often surprised that more women don't take up plumbing or electrical, they seem like the type of jobs that would benefit from a woman's finesse a..."

I suspect that women don't go into these trades, is that it requires going down into crawl spaces and into attics. Yes, their small hands and small size would be an advantage, but it is still close, dirty, nasty work. I can do my own plumbing inside the house, but you cannot pay me enough to go under the house.
I have a friend who is still going after her electricians license at 54 yo, and constantly tells me how dirty and muddy she gets, and how she hates climbing up on the poles. She has to put the time in, no matter where they send her. The class room time is called BiS (buts in seats) and has to be endured, even if the students can read the books and pass the tests. It is all part of the plan, mapped out in the dark ages by the trade unions.


message 639: by Joan (new)

Joan Sandra what a wonderful story, sounds like you have built a wonderful family.


message 640: by Kristie, Moderator (new)

Kristie | 19323 comments The problem with people saying help the vets, homeless, elderly, etc first is that they don't actually do anything to help them. They just use it as an excuse to not help other groups. I agree that those groups of people need help too, but you need to do more than just bring it up.

I love the conversation with your kids, Sandra. More people need to do that.


message 641: by Sarah (new)

Sarah | 18550 comments Countries pull funding for overseas aid in order to help those at home first and then find something else to spend it on, not those at home in need. Homelessness here has increased and many are army vets. There are a lot on the canals with pretty crappy plastic boats with no fires on which must be so uncomfortable to live in but it's a huge step up from being homeless. Mental health facilities and homeless shelters are few and far between as they don't make any money, wages are low and the cost of living high and benefits keep being slashed. Sure help those at home, but the government doesn't and it's not the fault of the immigrants.


message 642: by Sandra, Moderator (new)

Sandra (sanlema) | 11296 comments Thank you Joan and Kristie.


message 643: by Peggy (new)

Peggy (pebbles84) | 15868 comments That's wonderful Sandra. You should be proud indeed!


message 644: by Janice, Moderator (new)

Janice (jamasc) | 60073 comments I can understand your POV of being a target considering where you live, Travis. I'm certain that there are checks and balances in place to make it difficult to fire off nuclear war heads. One just hopes that they prevail. There is a lot of fear and uncertainty in the world right now.

I wonder how the children are coping with it. They hear their parents talk and the fear trickles down. Sandra, I really like how you have open communication with your children. I have a friend who is white and is married to an East Indian. They have a couple of children. One evening, they were discussing discrimination and Joan had everyone put their hands in a circle. Not one of them had the same colour of skin. She said it was a powerful exercise for them to see differences and recognize connection.


message 645: by Joan (new)

Joan Sarah wrote: "Countries pull funding for overseas aid in order to help those at home first and then find something else to spend it on, not those at home in need. Homelessness here has increased and many are arm..."

Sarah good point - it can seem so overwhelming and individuals just don't know how to make a difference.
I have been thinking of working my way through the A Path Appears: Transforming Lives, Creating Opportunity. I'm not sure I have enough discipline to complete the Udemy companion course
"A Path Appears makes clear how typical citizens can drive the momentum of worthy solutions to our world’s most pressing social problems."


message 646: by Travis (new)

Travis (travistousant) | 6011 comments And that was stated in my original statement the government never comes through for its own people. I don't get it. Must be because homeless can't pay taxes.

We were just talking about something on the internet saying nuclear codes should be implanted in an innocent persons chest who has to accompany the president, whoever around. And if the leader wants to kill thousands of innocent people with a nuke, first he must kill the innocent code holder and cut out the codes. I like it. I think that's the kind of protection the codes need. In reasonable countries. Pretty sure the innocent person would be killed right after implants in somewhere like North Korea


message 647: by Sandra, Moderator (new)

Sandra (sanlema) | 11296 comments Thank you, Peggy.

Janice, when my 7 yo knew Trump was elected he told me that now we would have to leave the US. I explained things to him, the difference of being allowed to stay or not, and I showed him his own green card. I am not sure what are they hearing outside the house, by my husband and I are not making a big deal of all of this. They haven't seen us panicking or anything. I think that helps.

I am very insistent about the importance of being confident in who you are. I have here kids from Brasil, Uruguay and US. I don't want nobody feeling superior or inferior in any way. I usually use an example they love because involves their two grandmas. My mom thinks I am very smart. Seriously. It is more than a mom thing. She is convinced I am incredibly smart. Who knows why. Now my mother in law thinks I am pretty dumb. She probably uses more challenging words with my toddler than the ones she uses to speak to me. So I say to my kids that my IQ is the same when I am with my mom or with my mother in law. One doesn't make me smarter, and the other doesn't make me dumber. What ever they think of me doesn't change who I am.


message 648: by Kristie, Moderator (new)

Kristie | 19323 comments Sandra - I'm so sorry your son felt that way, but I'm glad he has you to explain things to him so that he is not scared. That is a great example you used to explain to your kids that you are the same person and have the same value no matter who you are with or what their opinions are.


message 649: by Joan (new)

Joan Sandra what a great way to explain; I agree with your Mom - you're brilliant.


message 650: by Dawn (new)

Dawn (caveatlector) | 1796 comments Cherie wrote: "I suspect that women don't go into these trades, is that it requires going down into crawl spaces and into attics. Yes, their small hands and small size would be an advantage, but it is still close, dirty, nasty work...."

I would say this is probably part of it but I know quite a few women who work in Parks & Landscaping, or who are mechanics, they get filthy and don't care. It can be a little tough to be the only woman though, you need the right attitude for that.

I do hate crawlspaces myself, though it has nothing to do with dirt and everything to do with height. I despise the really short ones with all the ducting.


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