Jonathan’s Comments (group member since Mar 05, 2009)

Jonathan’s comments from the fiction files redux group.

Ry wrote: "Lauren wrote: "PS: I thought literature was just anything written and published? I mean, I would say leave out things like Scientific journals and stuff like that, but we just read Darwin in my bri..."

. . .oops i failed to mention gatsby in my first mention of fitz . . .

Ry wrote: "Jonathan wrote: " . . . lovely passage, but how exactly does one smell the curves of a river? . . . does a river smell different at a bend? and if so, can one smell multiple curves at a great dista..."

. . .ha! i knew it wouldn't take you long, pops! faulkner remains my nemesis!

Jonathan wrote: "Martha wrote: "I really like what I'm reading here...the resonance, attention to language, and character development as hallmarks of literary fiction. Swanny's point about form particularly intrigu..."

. . . ha! . . . sinclair lewis sold 180,000 copies of main street in 1920 (the year of its release) . . . lulu has a ways to go . . . fitzgerald, on the other hand, sold fewer than 2000 the year of its release (1925) . . . both books were 'literary' and both dealt with major american foibles, so why did lewis's book capture a large audience in the immediate sense, while fitzgerald's novel took decades to rise to prominence? . . . and it is not because lewis was more commercial in his approach, as main street was a much slower and more challenging read than gatsby . . . could the answer be good merchandising?

Martha wrote: "I really like what I'm reading here...the resonance, attention to language, and character development as hallmarks of literary fiction. Swanny's point about form particularly intrigues me, probably..."

. . . i think your point about genre-bashing was a motivating factor for writers like chabon, lethem, etc, who have been experimenting heavily with genre in a 'literary' context . . . ironically, this only made for a new level of snobbishness . . .

. . . lovely passage, but how exactly does one smell the curves of a river? . . . does a river smell different at a bend? and if so, can one smell multiple curves at a great distance? . . . and where is beyond the dusk? sounds like it should be further away than the curves of any river? . . . the tideflat part hits the mark for me, though . . .

Michael wrote: "
Dewey is actually the index to the v2 Fiction Files (after MySpace dropped the group's home page somehow). I know as well as anyone, that the original v1 Fiction Files is where the magic happene..."

. . . isn't it strange? . . . going back there is sorta like being at an archeological dig . . . how are all those posts still there? . . .

. . . if a novel forces you to pause even as it hurries you along, if it demonstrates or suggests that the author is operating outside the confines of 'the story' itself, if it resonates on numerous levels two months after you've set it down, chances are you're dealing with a 'literary' animal . . .

Patrick wrote: "Have you read American Tabloid by James Ellroy? It is a huge masterpience of an epic crime novel set against the backdrop of the Kennedy's Assassination. Will check hesh kestin's novel in November..."


. . . have not, but my brother probably has . . .you'll probably dig kestin's novel-- the kennedy assassination looms large in this one as well . . . i'll remind you when the book goes live this fall . . . and btw, thanks for the nice lulu review!

Maureen wrote: "Neil wrote: "All right . . . I'm here

I'm oddly resentful of having to join yet another networking site to keep up with folk. I know it's irrational, but what the hell in the last 6 mths I've bee..."

. . . just stay away from my beers in the refrigerator!

. . .so, today i'm inhaling hesh kestin's novel, "the iron will of shoeshine cats" which dzanc is releasing in november . . . it's the story of russell newhouse a jewish boy genius who unwittingly becomes a crime boss in 1963 NYC following the death of gangster shusan cats, who has chosen russy as his heir for reasons that russy only comes to understand as the story unfolds (i hope that's enough, ben!) . . . i generally can't stand gangster movies or gangster books (and that includes the godfather saga), but kestin is such a good writer that i'm totally immersed. . .this book reminds me of one of my very favorite novels-- budd schulberg's "what makes sammy run"--same quick, sharp, hard-nosed style . . .the cultural references, from civil rights to fashion to commerce to literature are spot-on and don't feel like window dressing . . . unlike the aforementioned border songs, this writing feels totally authentic, if not a little anachronistic . . . neil and matt (e-monk) are two people in the files who would totally dig this book . . .

. . .so, today i'm inhaling hesh kestin's novel, "the iron will of shoeshine cats" which dzanc is releasing in november . . . it's the story of russell newhouse an unwitting jewish boy genius who unwittingly becomes a crime boss in 1963 NYC following the death of gangster shusan cats, who has chosen russy as his heir for reasons that russy comes to understand only as the story unfolds (i hope that's enough, ben!) . . . i generally can't stand gangster movies or gangster books (and that includes the godfather saga), but kestin is such a good writer that i'm totally immersed. . .this book reminds me of one of my very favorite novels-- budd schulberg's "what makes sammy run" . . . same quick, sharp, hard-nosed style . . .the cultural references, from civil rights to fashion to commerce to literature are spot-on and don't feel like window dressing . . . unlike the aforementioned border songs, this writing feels totally authentic, if not a little anachronistic . . . neil and matt (e-monk) are two people in the files who would totally dig this book . . .

. . . well, i want to like border songs, but i just feel like it's trying too hard . . . it just doesn't feel lived in . . . the details feel researchy to me, which is a big pet peeve . . . his first book, the highest tide felt this way to me, as well . . . there's a lot of upsides too, though . . . the subject matter (u.s. / canadian border patrol, drug running, etc) is pretty interesting . . . the main characters bird-watching feels suspect to me, one of those researchy things . . .it's readable, for sure, but it's just missing that little umph that makes it feel authentic . . .

Audi Audi Oxen Freeeee! wrote: "Can we play kick the can?"

. . .hell yes!

. . . i'm rackin' my brain trying to figure out what BSG stands for . . .

. . . great posts . . . swanny, i think it might've been tennessee williams who said "kill your darlings" . . .not positive, though . . .

. . . the trick is getting good editorial feedback and knowing good editorial feedback . . .when i hear good feedback from the likes of hugh or michael or my agent or my editor, i get excited . . . i love fixing stuff . . . i have no patience for writers who are defensive about editorial feeback . . . they'll never be any good with that attitude . . . to my way of thinking, a writer should attach him/herself to serving the narrative and be willing to do whatever possible to serve that end . . . i think it's tougher for young writers to take because they have thin skin . . . the good ones thicken up quick . . . after a while, one should be able to recognize and distinguish between good editorial feedback and bad editorial feedback . . . there are some editors out there who will bully a writer into their own vision of a story, so before i consent to working with an editor i try to get a feel for their vision of the story . . . i've had a couple friends at big houses who felt like their editors changed the book they wanted to write, and ended up very frustrated by the experience . . . this where readers like pops and hugh and marge and others in this group have been invaluable to me personally, in helping me really define a work and solve problems and find missed opportunities before i get to an editor proper . . . my agent gives amazing feedback, as well . . . she helped me bring lulu and west of here to new levels with pretty short conversations . . . this is my favorite part of writing, the problem solving . . . i do my best work when my objectives are clearly outlined . . .

. . . i fell asleep with a beer in my hand last night and spilled it all over my cozies . . .but at least i wasn't on fire . . . thanks for another great link, linkmaster . . .

Matt wrote: "Ben wrote: "i always wondered why that band had such a shitty name..."

me too"

. . . i think it's out of print, but there's lots of copies floating around on amazon, etc . . . that's kinda' why i'm interested in it . . . since literary fiction is all about backlisting, i'm always curious which titles go out of print . . . for instance, all of portis's titles went out of print, and many of stanley elkin's . . .but in both of those cases, somebody reprinted them eventually . . .

. . . i think mott the hoople is kind of a cool name . . . apparently the singer read the book in prison . . .

. . . so has anyone (adrian?) read this willard manus novel from whom the band took its name . . .? . . .sounds like it falls into the confederacy of dunces / ginger man neighborhood:

MOTT THE HOOPLE is an underground classic 60's comic novel. It is written in a freewheeling bawdy style. It's hero, Norman Mott, is a Rabelaisian figure who refuses to wear anybody's label, insists on being his own man, and, through a series of comic misadventures, discovers just who that man is. Some people will know Mott the Hoople from the British rock band that took its name from the book.

. . . intersting patty, i've always wondered whether people on wiki got territorial, since anyone is allowed to edit entries . . .