Gail Simone's Blog, page 975
July 16, 2012
Do comic book company execs care about enraging their fanbase? There's been a nasty rumor ever since OMD that Marvel intentionally tries to make their fans angry because "angry fans are more likely to buy issues than happy ones." I know that's nonsense. Bu
Hmm.
This answer is a little complicated.
Okay, no, they don’t want to enrage the fanbase, I have never heard that. However, there is definitely a line of thinking that some people have, and it’s not just publishers, that the more people are talking about a book, good and bad, the better it sells.
It’s hard to argue with, in some ways. I don’t agree with it, but everything that has INFURIATED the internet fanbase lately has sold really well…the New52, like it or not, reinvigorated the entire industry…even other publishers came up and said that it gave retailers the resources to support other publishers. The AvX thing that everyone was pissed about is Marvel’s biggest hit in years. The Harley stuff that made people so mad is actually making Suicide Squad one of the only books trending UP in sales.
It’s the flip side of things like the One Million Moms’ failed boycotts, that only made sales of the targeted books stronger.
I don’t agree with this thinking, and even if I did, I think it’s a mistake to deliberately upset loyal readers, it’s uncalled for. But some people do believe it.
The thing that I do believe, and this upsets people every time I say it, but the vocal contingent on message boards and social networks sadly do not seem to reflect the readership at all. I’m not sure if they ever did. I know this is sometimes sad to hear, but it’s true, it’s absolutely true.
If it were true, the best-selling books at DC would be Batgirl and Secret Six and at Marvel, they would be X-23 and Young Avengers, and so on.
If it were true, the top ten books, with a few exceptions, would sell almost nothing.
I know it stings a bit. But the vocal internet community is an elite part of the readership. They are like gourmet readers, in my view. They have very good taste as a rule…but the books they love the most sell nothing and the books they hate are huge hits.
We have to address it, we have to quit kidding ourselves. Critical acclaim is lovely, but Tumblr buzz bears no relation to a book’s actual success, in general (I’m sure there are exceptions).
So, I think we have trained publishers not to take internet upset too seriously at this point. If we are outraged and disgusted by crossovers, and they continue to sell like hotcakes, eventually, publishers listen to numbers and not to bloggers.
I wish this weren’t the case…I don’t know if it’s the same for prose and film and music, but in comics, people will rave and rave about a book, it sells nothing, and then because they have raved about it so much, the poster or blogger feels that the company hates them personally because that book was so loved.
But no one bought it.
I don’t like talking about sales, I have never taken an assignment for sales. I don’t keep track of sales issue by issue like some writers do. I don’t find out what an issue actually sold til months after it has been out. To be honest, I am sad even to bring up this topic at all.
But realistically, if a book didn’t sell with a great creative team, the odds are not great of it EVER selling with the same or similar team. And there are people at each company who have to watch over that stuff. They have my sympathy, sometimes it means they cancel their own favorite books, or books by their good friends.
But eventually, books have to make enough money to continue publishing them.
I’m not sure if you are asking about the Steph thing. But if you are, I’m disappointed, too. When BQM told me he got Steph in Smallville, i was delighted, and I did my best to promote the book without giving away the secret. It makes me sad they took her out…best case scenario is they want her to make a debut somewhere else, worst case scenario is some arcane thing I don’t understand yet, I guess.
Anyway, hope that makes sense. If the only place you get comics intel is Tumblr and message boards, you are almost guaranteed to get a skewed version of what’s actually popular. That’s why I also talk to retailers as often as possible, to find out what people are actually buying, you know?
It sucks, but we (tumblrs and message boarders) are kind of the elite, and as such, our tastes are always going to differ some from the mainstream taste. It’s a good thing, and sometimes a sad thing.
Fear of a Black [Panther] Film
“[Black Panther] has a lot of the same characteristics of a Captain America: great character, good values, but it’s a little more difficult, maybe, creating [a world like Wakanda]. It’s always easier basing it here. For instance, ‘Iron Man 3’ is rooted right here in Los Angeles and New York. When you bring in other worlds, you’re always faced with those difficulties.”
Let me see if I read this clearly.
Marvel Studios’ co-president Louis D’Esposito thinks creating a fictional African kingdom like Wakanda is more difficult than, say, a fictionalized version of Afghanistan, the alien realm of Asgard, or the alien worlds that’s going to be in the upcoming Guardians of the Galaxy film?
How exactly is creating a fictional kingdom on Earth harder than creating a fictional kingdom of deity-like beings or of alien creatures?
I’m not sure I’m buying that. I mean, it’s not that difficult.
“I want to recreate something created in comics in live-action.” Boom! It’s done. People do it all the time. It’s not rocket science. It’s movies. You can create anything your imagination allows you to. It’s not hard at all.
You can create beings who transform into giant monsters smashing up buildings. You can create robotic suits capable of traveling from Los Angeles to Afghanistan in mere minutes. You can destroy an entire metropolitan city with alien creatures with relative ease. You can create alien realms and dimensions. You can create a floating carrier base with more machines than humanly possible. But to create an African kingdom with real world physics? That’s impossible to you guys?
It’s not that hard. I mean, filmmakers have made fictionalized African worlds since the beginning of film. We have the talent and the technology to make it look and feel real. That’s not a problem, so I don’t know why Marvel Studio’s co-head would think that’s a problem.
The problem that they refuse to acknowledge is this:
Marvel Studios fears that a Black Panther movie will be classified as “a Black film.”
That’s … that’s it.
Considering Marvel likes to do origin stories to introduce a character, the fact that his entire origin story takes place in the African kingdom of Wakanda may be a hard sell in Marvel’s eyes. And to do that, you’re going to need a majority Black cast. There’s a belief in Hollywood that you can’t put more than three Black actors in a film in leading roles because the general perception is that it’d be seen as a Black film,
Todd McFarlane stated that the producers of Spawn turned Terry Fitzgerald (Wanda Blake’s new husband) into a White man and developed a White woman named Jessica Priest to be the killer of Al Simmons instead of Chapel (a Black man) largely because the studio didn’t want too many Black leads in the film. The first Blade move has Wesley Snipes, N’Bushe Wright, and Sanaa Lathan, while the other films only had Snipes in the titular role. Steel (ugh) had Shaquille O’Neal in the title role, Richard Roundtree as his uncle Joe and Irma P. Hall as his grandmother.
Remember M.A.N.T.I.S? Great television movie about a paraplegic doctor and brilliant scientist named Miles Hawkins (the last name, had the series continued, wasn’t a coincidence and he would have been in a crossover with a Milestone character who also shares that family name) who created an exoskeleton (the costume design was created by Hardware co-creator Denys Cowan) that not only restored his ability to walk, but gave him enhanced abilities.
Carl Lumbly, who later played Martian Manhunter in various DC animated productions, played Dr. Hawkins. Gina Torres, who’s known by many as Zoe Washburne from the Firefly/Serenity series and the voice of Vixen on Justice League Unlimited and Wonder Woman in the DC Universe Online MMORPG, played Dr. Amy Ellis. Bobby Hosea played reporter Yuri Barnes while Wendy Raquel Robinson (you may know her as Principal Regina “Piggy” Grier from The Steve Harvey Show sitcom and Tasha Mack on The Game) and Christopher M. Brown played a pair of African students who interred for Dr. Hawkins.
When the film became a series, only Lumbly remained. Everybody else was gone, replaced by different actors, all White. Much of the African elements removed from the series. And it was canceled with the lead character getting squashed by an invisible dinosaur. Critics noticed the changes made from the well-received pilot and the rather lackluster series, mostly savaging the lack of diversity the series had.
That said, it’s kind of telling that nearly 20 years after M.A.N.T.I.S. premiered, Hollywood still fears creating a serious action-adventure property with a predominately minority cast and the perceptions of it being a “Black film.” There’s no such thing as a “Black film.” There are comedies, dramas, thrillers, and adventure stories with a mostly minority cast, but they’re just comedies, dramas, thrillers, and adventure stories.
The whole thing about Marvel not wanting to make a Black Panther film because they can’t recreate the kingdom of Wakanda seems farfetched and weird to be believed. Guess that’s just Hollywood being strange and woefully ignorant again.
If Marvel does a Black Panther movie without Wakanda, that will be the dumbest idea in history. It is what makes T’Challa awesome, and unique, apart from the million other superheroes out there.
I can understand having it be set partially in a fish-out-of-water story. But WAKANDA must be in it!
scuttlebuttink:
APE IN A CAPE: Books You Should Buy At the PRISM COMICS BOOTH
gailsimone:
Prism...
APE IN A CAPE: Books You Should Buy At the PRISM COMICS BOOTH
Prism Comics is THE resource for lgbtq comics of all kinds, they have been doing great work for years, and they publish fantastic books to appeal to all types of readers.
They publish comedies, dramas, love stories, erotic stories, fantasies, they do it all, and by some of the most talented…
Oh my gosh, Gail, you are the sweetest, seriously. It was absolutely one of the highlights of our SDCC experience to chat with you at the Prism booth (as well as hearing you speak at the Rewriting the Rules of Queers in Comics panel). You are such a genuine, down-to-earth person, we both instantly adored you. :) Thank you SO much for taking the time to recommend Mahou Shounen Fight!— we know you’re a busy person, so it means a lot. :)
ps. Reading Batgirl now and loving it!!
It’s absolutely my pleasure, I ADORE the book. Every time I go to the Prism booth, I go home with a ton of new books I love, and it pisses me off to no end that the mainstream comics press doesn’t cover these books as they deserve.
If you ever need a blurb or something, let me know, and keep doing great work!
“
Hi Gail, big fan. I was wondering whether you will be at the MCM expo in London this...
“
Hi Gail, big fan. I was wondering whether you will be at the MCM expo in London this October? I was there cosplaying as Professor Pyg last year and only found out you were there the day after I left :(
— tomontherun99
Oh, man, that’s sad, I definitely saw YOU, however, outstanding cosplay!
I am probably not going back to London this year, at least not that I am aware of. These cons need to mix up the guest list to keep it interesting for return attendees, so they don’t want to invite people from far away more than once in a row. It’s completely understandable.
But the next time I am asked, I am definitely going. The people at MCM were some of the kindest, smartest readers I have ever met, it was astounding.
I was the world’s worst pictionary player, however, I’m amazed my team didn’t just shoot me.
QUIPQUIPQUIP: Why can't Babs grow up?
You know, I’m not a fan of Batgirl right now. It has less to do with Gail Simone specifically and more to do with Babs’ demotion. She isn’t a leader. She isn’t a woman. She’s a girl stuck in a sidekick role forever, never…
And you didn’t know this poster beforehand, right? I will stand by what I said here. I guarantee I didn’t say that about Barbara’s interest in Criminology. I know for a fact I never said she wasn’t allowed to grow up. People say negative things about my work in lines all the time. Sometimes they are very aggressive. Sometimes they can be condescending. Sometimes they are perfectly nice. I am not going to try to talk them out of their opinions. I think that is obnoxious. It takes a great deal for me to be even marginally rude to a reader. If this occurred, I strongly, strongly suspect there were other factors. Everyone makes themselves a hero in the retelling of stories. But since I know for a fact I didn’t say two of the things I am accused of, I remain suspicious. If the op wants to dm me and remind me of the circumstances so I can try to remember them specifically, I am all up for that. A privately sent photo might be helpful. But I did not say those two things, so that makesme question the post.
If everyone tries to make themselves look like a hero, doesn’t that apply to you as well? For all we know you’re just saying you never said something to protect your own reputation. I’m not trying to be rude, I was just pointing this out.
Absolutely, which is why I am not disagreeing with things the op said about tone…for all I know, I could have just accidentally stabbed my foot with a pen or something. However, since I have never said or felt anything remotely like two of the comments attributed to me, that set off my alarm bells.
I figure it’s a misunderstanding, I don’t have a bit of ill will to the op. if they post to me or dm me, I will try to answer their questions and straighten it out.
QUIPQUIPQUIP: gailsimone: QUIPQUIPQUIP: Why can’t Babs grow up?gailsimone:...
QUIPQUIPQUIP: Why can’t Babs grow up?
You know, I’m not a fan of Batgirl right now. It has less to do with Gail Simone specifically and more to do with Babs’ demotion. She isn’t a leader. She isn’t a…
Fair enough.
But I have to say, I spoke with everyone who helped man my booth the entire time (I needed help at Eccc only because I was actually selling books, something I almost never do), and none of them remember this incident or me saying anything like this, either. It makes zero sense, it is the complete opposite of my core beliefs on Barbara. Which is why I said, “what the hell?” your friend is entitled to her opinion, I have no desire to argue them out of it. But I defy anyone to find a comment from me anywhere among the THOUSANDS of posts I have made on the topic that resembles either remark even remotely. They do not exist. That is why I am so baffled.
The closest thing anyone in my booth can remember to anything like this is two people who, and I quote, “wouldn’t leave, they just wanted to stay and bitch at you.”. There are always a couple people like that, we all get them, eventually you DO have to move them along or they never stop. I’m not saying that was you guys, I really hope it wadn’t, if you say it wasn’t, then I believe you. Who was at my booth with me when you came through and I will ask them specifically, do you remember? I always try to answer people but I want to be fair to the people waiting patiently. It’s not perfect under the best of circumstances.
As for the rest, I say, what the hell, let’s call it a misunderstanding. Even if the specifics don’t seem right to me, I have no doubt that the experience wasn’t good for your friend and hey we’re disappointed. So, I say, fresh start, let’s try again.
I hate hate hate trying to talk people out of disliking something I have written, I just think it is obnoxious, but if the op has specific questions, let them please ask, I will answer to the best of my ability, since we are not at a con with people waiting that I am worried about getting to in a reasonable amount of time.
Regardless of the circumstances, your friend was disappointed, and I hate that. Tumblr is neutral ground, let’s have a do-over. To the op, please feel free to ask your questions in public or private here, I will do my best to answer them. Fair?
Sorry for the typos, typing quickly on an iPad.
Hey--I am so sorry I didn't get to meet you at SDCC. A guy at the DC booth misspoke about when you were signing, so I missed you by an hour. Did see you at the Gays in Comics panel at least--that was great! I hope to meet you in person next time we are at
Argh!
See, this stuff kills me. I hate to disappoint people like that…people travel and spend all that money to say hello and get books signed and then a schedule goes up incorrectly or a person makes a mistake…bleah!
I tried to hang out at the DC booth a few times when I wasn’t schedule to sign so that if people missed the signings I could still say hello but man, the booth was so crowded I’m sure it was difficult to see everyone.
I’m bummed I didn’t get to meet you, next year for SURE!
And the Gays in Comics panel was AMAZING. I was so honored to be included, it was just so many people I respect beyond words. Wow. Also, Chip Kidd is my new hero!
sadieblodgett:
#kate beaton should have the rights to lois...
Why can't Babs grow up?
You know, I’m not a fan of Batgirl right now. It has less to do with Gail Simone specifically and more to do with Babs’ demotion. She isn’t a leader. She isn’t a woman. She’s a girl stuck in a sidekick role forever, never allowed to grow up. Batgirl. The Batgirl role should be like Robin, something to eventually grow out of and pass on (hello, Cass and Steph), but DC isn’t letting her. A twenty something year old character should have a future as something beyond Batgirl. It isn’t Batwoman, Kate has that role. It isn’t Oracle, not any more. Babs is stuck.
Can you imagine Dick Grayson, who should be around Babs’ age, being called Batboy? No. Because he’s no longer a boy. He’s a man. He’s no longer Robin. He’s Nightwing. He’s grown up and out of his childhood vigilante identity. So why can’t Babs? Well, she did, way back when, before she became Oracle. She retired the mantle of Batgirl, not because she was sick of vigilante-ing, but because she said she had outgrown it. She wanted her own identity, separate from Bruce, and separate from girl, which she no longer was.
I had the opportunity to ask Gail Simone, writer of Batgirl, about this when I visited her booth at Emerald City Comic Con. I was excited. Gail Simone wrote Babs as the hero I loved in Birds of Prey. I loved that title and I loved Secret Six. I’m a huge fan of her Tumblr and the way she responds to fans. So I had so much hope for the conversation. Unfortunately, I received the brush off.
I started out telling Gail Simone the things I always wanted to say to her: That Birds of Prey was one of my favorite comics of all times. That Oracle gave me hope for women in leadership positions in comics. That I loved her writing and her characters. But when I started voicing curious concerns about what I’ve written above, she turned cold. I don’t think she wanted to have this conversation at all. I asked about Babs’ age and how that would relate to her current title, I was told she was barely twenty-one, she has many years of Batgirl ahead of her. As if that makes it okay for her to be only girl and not woman, stuck in this sidekick role. When I asked about her future, if she had any other plans, I got the same answer. Finally, as I was leaving, I got a joking answer about how she used to be interested in criminal psychology. But that isn’t the stuff of comics No, she was Batgirl and she would stay Batgirl.
I’m going to give Ms. Simone the benefit of the doubt. I am sure she gets a lot of flak from a lot of fans, and I’m sure many are less than respectful when they confront her. Maybe she was expecting that from me and was trying to fend it off. I don’t know. But I left the booth very unsatisfied, just as I leave Batgirl comics. Because Babs is a girl again, even as she ages. She isn’t a leader, she isn’t a genius, and she isn’t a woman. She’s a bat with a smile and a high kick. And she’s never going to grow up.
What the hell?
What the hell, what? Everything said above was true. Babara has been regressed backwards, into an identity that she grew out of and that no longer suits her. The new comic is not your best work. It’s not even very good at all. I’ve seen you write screeds of gratitude and praise whenever someone says something positive. I’ve seen you absolutely refuse to shut up when people had less valid criticisms. So now, the person above has perfectly summed up why it’s shitty that Barbara is Batgirl again and how you’ve given them the brush off, and you simply respond with “What the hell?” And prove their point. You’re just brushing them off again.
My “what the hell” had nothing to do with with the OP’s opinion on the book. They are absolutely entitled to them, as are you entitled to yours.
My ‘what the hell’ is because I guaran-fricking-tee this conversation never happened, not like this. That thing at the end, about Babs not being interested in criminology, and it ‘not being the stuff of comics,’ that’s absolutely absurd. I never, ever said that, I can’t even imagine saying anything that could be charitably misconstrued in that way. I know what Babs’ history is, I know what her interests are, and I had a zero issue plotted AT THE TIME that showed that criminology was her passion.
“Not the stuff of comics?” No way, no way in the world. The original poster either misheard or misquoted, you might as well say that I said Ragdoll wasn’t interested in monkeys. No WAY that happened. I don’t believe it for a moment. I don’t think that, I don’t think anything like that, and it makes me very suspicious of the rest of this post.
Here’s what it means to be a writer in comics at a convention, when you write characters people care about. At ECCC, I was swamped, swamped like I have almost never been before. I don’t know why, but I was busy from the moment I walked into the hall until ten minutes before closing the final day. There were lines almost the whole time and never a break of more than a few seconds. I barely had time to go to the bathroom and I hurried back whenever I had to go, so people didn’t have to wait. I didn’t have time for lunch, and every time I did a panel, when I came back, there were people waiting for signings. I am positive most anyone who was there will back me up on this.
I hate to make readers wait, so I stayed at my table, I never took any breaks, not even to go speak with friends or colleagues or to see a panel. I speak to every single person in line, and I try to be as kind and helpful as I can be. The idea that I was some hostile presence because someone doesn’t like the new Batgirl…well, I am skeptical in the extreme.
I don’t recall this conversation. I am doing a lot of cons, I speak to thousands of readers. My stock response if someone doesn’t like a book is some variation of, I’m sorry you didn’t care for the book.
That’s about it. That’s mostly what I have time for if there are people waiting for a signature. I defy most anyone to do much better in a crowded, busy con when you are swamped for three straight days.
As to the ‘brush off,’ well, I have spoken about these topics endlessly. Repeatedly. How anyone can follow my tumblr and never have seen me address this stuff, well, again, it makes me wonder how honest they are being. And posting praise…whatever. People say nice things, sometimes I repost it. It’s probably maybe 1 thing out of fifty I receive. I have also reposted criticism. If the ratio isn’t what you would prefer, I don’t know what to say to that.
Do I believe this poster came to me with concerns and criticisms and I probably didn’t answer them to their satisfaction? Very probably. But I have people every day of every con with VERY SERIOUS FEELINGS and I can rarely answer them as I would if we were having a discussion anywhere but across a noisy table at a packed con with other people waiting in line.
I have no skepticism whatsoever about the op’s sincerity in their beliefs about the new book, and one of the reasons I don’t screed about it is simply, what DO you say? Someone doesn’t like a book or a direction, who am I to argue them out of it? It’s obnoxious, I’ve seen writers do that, I’ve done it myself, it just makes them look foolish.
I disagree with a lot of the poster’s points. I agree with some. If we had talked on Tumblr or at a less busy signing, maybe it would have been more in-depth, but I doubt I would have had the answers to make them happy, because Barbara IS being shown at an earlier point in her life and career. She hasn’t achieved everything yet, she can’t topple kingdoms with a button. That is kind of the point. Agree or don’t agree, that’s fine, but I certainly didn’t make that decision. We are showing an earlier Batgirl, and just as the Batgirl in DC animation isn’t yet fully evolved, a lot of people enjoy seeing her at this earlier stage. Not everyone does. I understand that. If I didn’t sit down and address this stuff point by point in detail, it is because it’s hard as hell to hold ANY decent conversation when you are swamped, the con is noisy, you are talking across a table and there are people talking right next to you, some readers barely speak above a whisper, and some are very angry about something when they show up, often about things I have little to no control over at all.
I do my best. I don’t give people the ‘brush off.’ I spend my time at cons trying to talk to as many readers as possible for as long as possible. I just finished San Diego Comicon, which I paid for totally at my expense, and it was expensive as hell. I didn’t see a single panel for myself, I didn’t spend time in the green room sipping iced tea, I spent almost every moment I could doing things for readers, including three social justice panels and charity signings, I endlessly tweeted about small press books from people just breaking in, I answered every question as best I could until I went back to my hotel and collapsed after every night.
I do my best. This op may not have gotten the answer they wanted, but I am completely skeptical about the alleged tone of this conversation. Frankly, I don’t believe it for a moment. Maybe they didn’t like what I said, but the idea that I ignored them or dismissed them completely…
…I’m sorry, that’s extremely unlikely at best.
I’m sorry I didn’t give them the answers they wanted to hear. But that doesn’t translate into being ignored or treated badly, which seems to be what they are alleging.
Gail I can't. that post. it hurt my soul. it's so awful i cant even put it on my blog. If i went to comic-con and had the change to meet you I would tell you how you've taken my favorite and made her into the WOMAN she is. thank you soo much!! (SHE WAS NEV
That original post leaves me a complete skeptic. I guarantee I never said that stuff.
I am kind of aghast.
But thanks!
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