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Why don't more people read Self-published authors?
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Feb 01, 2012 01:47PM
I totally agree. I said it before and I'll say it again. If you're looking for a literary work of art, pleas do not buy my books. If you're looking for good stories that keep you guessing, give them a try. My books ar totally escapism. In one of the only two bad reviews the person said my book was written by a 12 yeal old. Since most TV show a are geared for the sixth grader, I should soon be a best seller. This person only paid $0.99 for the book, what did she expect, egg in her beer? (It's southern).
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Ha ha, I have to say I'm glad that's one Southern treat I haven't been exposed to yet. Really? Egg in beer? Or am I being a naive, recently relocated Northerner and it's just a saying?
No one really wants egg in their beer. It's just a saying. Most yankees don't know it.
I dunno... I'm Canadian, and we'll take anything that has beer in it. Must be someone up here who likes egg in their beer.I agree on negative reviews. I used to review professionally as part of my newspaper job but hated "grading" material, as art is subjective.
Hahaha, that's hilarious. You folks really like your beer. In order to enjoy a beer, for me, it has to be iced cold and I like either lime or tomatoe juice in it.
I gues what I need to know when someone reviews my books is this: Is this review meant as a way to help me improve or is it Just someone being mean or jealous.
When I finished my first novel, a neighbor wanted to read it. It was obvious she didn't really read it and was just jealous or maybe being mean, but she went around the neighborhood telling everyone it was about a young girl who gets raped over and over again.
What I'm trying to say
I gues what I need to know when someone reviews my books is this: Is this review meant as a way to help me improve or is it Just someone being mean or jealous.
When I finished my first novel, a neighbor wanted to read it. It was obvious she didn't really read it and was just jealous or maybe being mean, but she went around the neighborhood telling everyone it was about a young girl who gets raped over and over again.
What I'm trying to say
Peggy wrote: "When I finished my first novel, a neighbor wanted to read it. It was obvious she didn't really read it and was just jealous or maybe being mean, but she went around the neighborhood telling everyone it was about a young girl who gets raped over and over again..."Bloody hell Peggy! What a thoroughly unpleasant person!
Where reviews are concerned, I tend to avoid the negative ones on Amazon (not had any yet, but as I've not sold many copies as yet, it's only a matter of time), and pay heed to those reviews put up by reviewers who I've contacted, such as blog-based reviewers (eg Indieblogspot, darkiss reads, etc.), as giving an unprofessional review would only hurt them in the long run.
It was some of those early reviews that identified that my book still had issues, much to my chagrin.
One of my books had two unfavourable reviews. One reader said she was appauled at the way I portrayed women...e.i...four brutal rapes in the story; but this book is a Gothic Novel. What Gothic novel does not have violence in any form? I did overlook the fact that in one scene one of the character's father underwent a heart by-pass in 1926. The reader pointed this out and disenheartened me. I wrote this Novel as part of the NanoWrimo. It's 70,000 words...my first triumpth. Yet this one reader shread it to bits with her negative review. I know as a writer I must learn to take such negative reviews in stride but these two reviews will tarnish my Novel and hurt its sale.
My urban thrillers are about outlaw motorcycle clubs so as you can imagine they contain sexual violence. Thankfully, my readers no what to expect and I've had no bad reviews or any one shread it.Yes,we authors have to grow thick skin in this business. Unfortunately, it's all part of the system.
Mary, you just need to promote promote promote, get your novel out there to the right people and those two reviews will soon be buried.
All the best.
Karina - LadyHawk wrote: "My urban thrillers are about outlaw motorcycle clubs so as you can imagine they contain sexual violence. Thankfully, my readers no what to expect and I've had no bad reviews or any one shread it...."
Thanks. I have been promoting my Books via Facebook, Twitter, blogs, etc. Every chance I get I put a link of my books on every social site I can think of. Good Luck with your books!
Mary wrote: "One of my books had two unfavourable reviews. One reader said she was appauled at the way I portrayed women...e.i...four brutal rapes in the story; but this book is a Gothic Novel. What Gothic no..."I'm sorry to hear that, Mary. Just keep plugging away at promoting and hopefully you'll get some good reviews to balance out the bad one. If not, there are some wonderful services out there for helping people polish up their novels. :)
I give honest reviews always. If a book is flawed, I'll say it. But I don't give snarky or mean reviews. This is something that, as a consumer and a writer puts me off. If I run into a review that is deliberately meanspirited, I'll sometimes buy the book just to be contrary to the person who wrote the review! LOL! I like a review that tells me what's wrong with a book, but not one that appears to revel in telling how bad the reviewer thought the book was.
I found this quote today and thought of this conversation we've been having. Thought it would be worth sharing. “Every artist was first an amateur.”
― Ralph Waldo Emerson
Jennifer wrote: "Mary wrote: "One of my books had two unfavourable reviews. One reader said she was appauled at the way I portrayed women...e.i...four brutal rapes in the story; but this book is a Gothic Novel. W..."I have huge admiration for people who offer honest, balanced, professional reviews even when they don't care for a book. Those are the reviews it's possible to really learn something from. As a writer, I know not everyone's going to like what I write. But a reviewer who can articulate why in a clear way--whether I agree or not, that's indispensable.
Even Pulitzer Prize winning novelists receive bad reviews. Take a look at the over 300 Amazon reviews of "Cleopatra" by Stacy Schiff. http://www.amazon.com/Cleopatra-Life-...
When deciding whether or not to buy it, I read several of the positive reviews, then jumped to the extremely negative ones, and was utterly baffled by the inconsistencies. Someone whose opinion I respect told me that Schiff's writing is superb. Ultimately, a review offers but one reader's subjective opinion.
Comments made in Goodreads discussions that critique classic novels that have been considered among the best examples of writing, by Eng. Lit professors for decades or even centuries, often tear these novelists apart at the seams. So it goes; no author's work will please everyone.
I admire and respect writers who can handle negative criticism and remain open to what they might learn from it. But we're only human, and it hurts when our hard-earned labors of love are used as dart-boards.
This has become a great conversation, thanks everyone.
Everybody knows who Stephen King is, right? Did you know that he wrote 15 books before he could get an, agent, publisher, or anyone to read any?. When his wife found the 16th one in the garbage, she took it out and sent it to Hollywood. The Title was Carrie. I think if Stephen King had started out today, he would have self-published e-books. Think of all the money his publishers, agents, editors etc. would have lost?
Jenn wrote: "Jennifer wrote: "Mary wrote: "One of my books had two unfavourable reviews. One reader said she was appauled at the way I portrayed women...e.i...four brutal rapes in the story; but this book is a..."Precisely! I value well-written and balanced reviews both as a reader and writer, and I, too, am not expecting everyone to like what I write. Everyone is different, but I'm very appreciative when I get a "bad" review that is level-headed and written well. These reviews are just another way to help us identify our weak spots and improve as writers.
I just hate reviews that mock a work, no matter how bad the reviewer thought it was. It's just not classy!
Peggy wrote: "Everybody knows who Stephen King is, right? Did you know that he wrote 15 books before he could get an, agent, publisher, or anyone to read any?. When his wife found the 16th one in the garbage, ..."I think he probably would have self-published, too. Largely, because even as a known author he's had ebook-specific novels, hasn't he? And in print he's tried almost Dickensian tactics like publishing The Green Mile in small installment books.
At the beginning of King's book on writing, I felt as though he was talking about me. lol And if we've both gone through the same stages and disappointments, then surely there was hope for me too.
Kristi wrote: "I found this quote today and thought of this conversation we've been having. Thought it would be worth sharing. “Every artist was first an amateur.”
― Ralph Waldo Emerson"
Apt.
There is lots of hope for all of us. John Grishm's first book, A Time To Kill is one of my favorites of his, but when he first wrote it he could not get an agent interested. Today he would have probably self-published it as an e-book. But bact then there were no e-books. He edned up self- publishing and trying to sell them at shows, flea markets etc. Somee of them rotted and mildewed in his basement and he took them to the dump.
The second novel, The Firm, was taken to Hollywood and we know what happened from then on out. Looking back to when I wrote my first novel and spent over a year trying to find an agent, I've come to the conclusion that agents are poor salesmen. They won't try to sell anything unless they already know it will sell.
The second novel, The Firm, was taken to Hollywood and we know what happened from then on out. Looking back to when I wrote my first novel and spent over a year trying to find an agent, I've come to the conclusion that agents are poor salesmen. They won't try to sell anything unless they already know it will sell.
Kristi wrote: "I think for the most part, people don't purposely discriminate against self-published authors. I think they just don't know about them. I know for myself, I didn't realize just how many more auth..."
I agree completely, Kristi. It used to be that if a book didn't show up on the book store shelves, how would we learn about it?
Today, thankfully, we have a lot of options to find all those hidden gems in the writing world. Even still, self-published authors aren't as easy to find as those with traditional publishers. It is great to have places like Goodreads that help highlight those new authors and give readers a chance to discover something special.
Jenn wrote: "Peggy wrote: "Everybody knows who Stephen King is, right? Did you know that he wrote 15 books before he could get an, agent, publisher, or anyone to read any?. When his wife found the 16th one in..."It's quite heartening to hear that. I'm working on my 3rd novel currently, so I don't need to get depressed until I've written quite a few more!
Honey, I'm working on my ninth and am only now starting to see a few sales and some good reviews. The thing that was a big breakthrough for me was when I participated in the free Friday book give-a-way through WLC on Melissa Foster's website.
Women's Literary Cafe. It's a website designed to bring readers and writers together. Some men authors are on there too. Melissa Foster set this us and she has all kinds of things going on to help you. Check it out. Most of it's free. She has good karma.
I'm so glad I came upon this thread. It's wonderful to see so many people willing to read self-published works.I've been hoarding up on a lot of free books recently, no doubt thanks to Amazon's KDP Select. I'm very happy to have such access to self-published works and be able to find so many authors interleaving intricate plotlines and characters into imaginative settings. It's good for the brain!
Isn't it wonderful you don't have to spend a fortune to find such wonderul fres new authors to read? I'm having a blast.
Hi guys, i almost read only reviews with 3stars. this way i can see the good and bad parts of a book, because in my opinion 1/5 star reviews are either to enthusiastic or foulmouthed. this is equal for wellknown authors or selfpublished, but the later mostly doesn't have many reviews or overhelming 5 stars reviews by internet friends, friends or other authors who help each other without publishing reviews with fewer than 4 stars as if they were bad ones. 1-3 could be great if they fair written and put things in that other reader may like or also dislike. for example: some don't like hard violance, but other like it ruge.
Mary wrote: "One of my books had two unfavourable reviews. One reader said she was appauled at the way I portrayed women...e.i...four brutal rapes in the story; but this book is a Gothic Novel. What Gothic no..."Sorry about that review, Mary. Just remember that your book will not appeal to everyone. The surest way to fail is to try to please everybody. I do not remember who said that, but it rings true for me. Just stick to the stories that you have in your heart and mind and you'll do fine. It will not matter if people have a problem with the content.
Peggy, I think the "unknown actors" is a good simile. However, in defense of the people who avoid the unknown actors, *followers* might be an unfair appellation.They may prefer to avoid the risk of possibly having to walk out of a godawful movie and lose their ten dollars plus popcorn on top of their evening's entertainment. That might be too much stress to contemplate for someone who just wants to relax with a good movie.
Come to think of it, lol, for some people, that very peril might add to their enjoyment of trying new authors. Like bungee-jumping or drag racing. :D
Even free sample chapters (the equivalent of a movie trailer?) are sometimes (not always by any means, just sometimes) more work than I want to do. I just want to wind down with a good book. Do I really have to read a sample chapter first just to find out whether the author can put one word in front of the other? And it doesn't guarantee that the story won't fall apart before the end. Talk about ruining an evening.
When I do find an indie author who gives me a good experience, I cling like a limpet to everything they write, but it's a lot more work to vet an indie author than one who's been screened by a publisher to winnow out the blatantly unreadable.
P.J. wrote: "Peggy wrote: "When I finished my first novel, a neighbor wanted to read it. It was obvious she didn't really read it and was just jealous or maybe being mean, but she went around the neighborhood t..."Do you ever get the feeling that some people don't really...you know...*take in* what they read? Maybe the rapes were the only thing that got through the fog.
I won't mention any names, but honestly, have you read some of the best selling authors who have been around forever and you wonder how the hell they got to be a bestseller. And yeah, I've gone to a movies that had high ratings and was glad when I had chosen not to have bought popcorn for that movie.
There are no guarantees on anything. I have found more books I liked than disliked by self-publised authors. I think it's wonderful, all the fresh new authors I'm finding. Some of my old favorites were getting stale.
Some of my oldtime favorites seem to be coasting and by that I mean, they appeared to think that just because a book was written by them, then it would be a best seller and they were usually right, but not because the book was good but because we had grown to just buy it because it was written by them.
The other thing is that it's not a question of whether a book is good or bad but it's a matter of taste.
There are no guarantees on anything. I have found more books I liked than disliked by self-publised authors. I think it's wonderful, all the fresh new authors I'm finding. Some of my old favorites were getting stale.
Some of my oldtime favorites seem to be coasting and by that I mean, they appeared to think that just because a book was written by them, then it would be a best seller and they were usually right, but not because the book was good but because we had grown to just buy it because it was written by them.
The other thing is that it's not a question of whether a book is good or bad but it's a matter of taste.
I just compared out books we have read in common and the proof is right there. We don't agree on what good and what's not. Most people like pinapple. I hate it. To me, it's the most disgusting sickening sweet thing I ever put in mouth. If pineapple was a book instead of a fruit, it would be a best seller because most people would like it.
I agree, Sherri. I had a publisher and editor for my first book, BLOOD ON WHITE WICKER. When I got my book back from the editor it was so sterilized that all the flavor, that had made it my book, was gone. I changed it back the way I had it, fired my editor and publisher and started self-publishing. It's the only way to go.
So, Patrick, you don't get to read a book until someone else has reviewes it? What if everyone waited for reviews to come out before they read any books? No books would ever get read.
I definitely give self-pubbed authors a chance. In fact, most of the books I buy on Kindle (and I get like 30+ every week) are from self-pubbed authors.The 2 things that can get me out of a read are bad spelling/grammar (not the occasional mistake but like, pages of them!), and a waffling plot.
Speaking of the latter, I've abandoned a lot, and I really mean a lot, of big name books lately because the plot just wasn't going anywhere, and some even felt like I should be 'honoured' be be reading their works (won't name names but this one is publisher-specific, one pub in particular!).
So yes, I'll take my chances on an indie. Figure they've got as much chance as a big name to hook me
*off my soapbox...*
So glad you said that, Zee. I agree with all of what you just said. I must admit that before I started writing myself and saw how hard it is to find an agent, publisher etc., I would not have even considered reading any indies. I had my list of thirty or so fvorite best selling authorsand I stuck with them even though I was getting pissed off with some of them because their books were getting boring. It was as if they knew they could sell books just because they were who they were.
When I became an indie myself and got on twitter and goodreads I decided to give some of the other indies a try. Boy was I pleasantly surprised! I am having the time of my life reading these wonderful fresh new authors who work hard trying to prove themselves.
Some of the authors I used to read are still charging big bucks for e-books, sometimes the same as for a print copy. There are no trees involoved here and besides, I can get ten or twenty fresh new indie suthors for the price of one of theirs.
As far as mistakes are concerned, personally I've never read any book without some mistakes and this includes all the best sellers our there. I read Atlas Shrugged over the summer and it had two mistakes. If they can't get it right in 45 years then who am I to criticize a few mistakes by indies.
I have about five new favorites right now. I have been buying everything they write. Their e-books are $0.99 as are all of mine. One of my very favorite fresh new authors can't seem to get the quotation marks in the right place. He is getting better with that. But what a writer!! I have to read him all in one sitting. One of my other favorites writes, "He was sat at the table," instead of, "he sat at the table." or "He was sitting at the table."
It's a catch 22 situation for us indies. We'll hire an editor when we make enought money. In the meantime, be kind, overlook the human element, and enjoy the book.
When I became an indie myself and got on twitter and goodreads I decided to give some of the other indies a try. Boy was I pleasantly surprised! I am having the time of my life reading these wonderful fresh new authors who work hard trying to prove themselves.
Some of the authors I used to read are still charging big bucks for e-books, sometimes the same as for a print copy. There are no trees involoved here and besides, I can get ten or twenty fresh new indie suthors for the price of one of theirs.
As far as mistakes are concerned, personally I've never read any book without some mistakes and this includes all the best sellers our there. I read Atlas Shrugged over the summer and it had two mistakes. If they can't get it right in 45 years then who am I to criticize a few mistakes by indies.
I have about five new favorites right now. I have been buying everything they write. Their e-books are $0.99 as are all of mine. One of my very favorite fresh new authors can't seem to get the quotation marks in the right place. He is getting better with that. But what a writer!! I have to read him all in one sitting. One of my other favorites writes, "He was sat at the table," instead of, "he sat at the table." or "He was sitting at the table."
It's a catch 22 situation for us indies. We'll hire an editor when we make enought money. In the meantime, be kind, overlook the human element, and enjoy the book.
I love reading your posts Peggy, but I have to ask you. An indie paperback may cost $10, not including postage. Yes, e-books have to be cheaper but why are you and many others selling your work for $99.
I used to have e-books sales because I was selling my titles for less than half a price of a paperback. But now these silly prices have boomed, I don't have any.
I can't afford to sell my books for nothing. I'm not going to compete.
So are you selling so many copies that you can afford to sell them so cheap?
How does this work?
Karina - LadyHawk wrote: "I can't afford to sell my books for nothing. I'm not going to compete.So are you selling so many copies that you can afford to sell them so cheap?"
This is a question I would love the answer to as well, Karina.
I don't know how indie authors, particularly those just starting out with their ebooks, can sell their books for $.99 or even give them away for free. I just published my two ebooks recently and priced them at $2.99 and $4.99, which to me is not an exorbitant price. But, how can I compete against $.99 or less?
I am so glad to have found this group! ;o) I'm self published as well and would not have it any other way. If I could change just ONE thing, I would make self publishing to paperback far less expensive for the reader. I'm getting ready to put "Laiden's Daughter" to print at Create Space and even I'm balking at the 11.99 price I have to charge just to make .82 cents a book via book stores. I wish there was a less expensive way to get it to the readers via paperback. Does anyone know of a better way?
Peggy wrote: "Women's Literary Cafe. It's a website designed to bring readers and writers together. Some men authors are on there too. Melissa Foster set this us and she has all kinds of things going on to he..."Thanks for that. I have to admit I'd never heard of it before. I will check it out.
Suzan wrote: "I am so glad to have found this group! ;o) I'm self published as well and would not have it any other way. If I could change just ONE thing, I would make self publishing to paperback far less expen..."I know I some authors sell their books on their websites, and sometimes even include an autograph. For example, one author I know has trade paperbacks that buying anywhere else are $14.95, but he offers them on his website for $10 with an autograph. I don't know what kind of profit he sees, I figure that's not my business to ask. But it's an idea. Hope that helps.
Hey, did you know it's been renamed to World Literary Cafe?
Okay, here is my logic about why my e-books are $0.99. I am an unknown author right now. My goal is to have as many people read my books as possible. So, just to get exposure, I charge a ridiculously low price. I had one of my books on WLC last Friday for free. Fifty books were downloaded. I got no money but I got two really good reviews and some sales from that. When I become a best selling author, I'll probably raise the price and people will probably pay it. After all people are willing to pay the same for an e-book as they are for a print copy of some of the best selling authors out there today. But I will probably charge around $3 or $4.
My logic for buying the $0.99 books by the fresh new authors: I read at least five books a week. As long as there is new talent to explore for $0.99 or free, I will take advantage of it. If I can get four for the price of one of the others, I'll get the four.
What the fresh new $0.99 authors will gain from my reading their books: I do reviews on amazon and give as many stars as I possibly can. These reviews are seen by people browsing for books, and not just people on goodreads and twitter. So I feel like I'm giving something back. It's a win-win situation. Since publishing e-books is free, then no one is loosing any money.
My logic for buying the $0.99 books by the fresh new authors: I read at least five books a week. As long as there is new talent to explore for $0.99 or free, I will take advantage of it. If I can get four for the price of one of the others, I'll get the four.
What the fresh new $0.99 authors will gain from my reading their books: I do reviews on amazon and give as many stars as I possibly can. These reviews are seen by people browsing for books, and not just people on goodreads and twitter. So I feel like I'm giving something back. It's a win-win situation. Since publishing e-books is free, then no one is loosing any money.
That's outrageous! That's all you get for one of your books on Create Space? They charge too, don't they? I have all my print copies on lulu.com. I just looked over there and found one that I'm charging $12.00 for. On that one I get $1.33. It's a little better. But I think as more and more people get e-readers, print copies will be a thing of the past.
I'm lucky if I make $1 on every printed copy I sell. It's a win-win situation for you Peggy but not for me. Yes, the cheaper the book, more sales. I've been at this since 2006 and I have to start making some money from this.
I've lost so much time with my children as I'm glued to the office chair. Some thing has to give.
I'm just very frustrated by these prices too high or too low. They need to be regulated to give every author a chance in this overflowing competitive field.
Yeah, in a perfect world, everyone would be given an equal chance but we know that will never happen. I guess our goals are different. I just started and am willing to make little or no money just to get my name out there.
Like I said, you can make more on the print copies on lulu.com and it's free.
The statement, the cheaper the books the more sales is totally false. My books are dirt cheap but they sell less than some of the best sellers who are charging the same for an e-book as for a print copy when there are not trees involved.
Like I said, you can make more on the print copies on lulu.com and it's free.
The statement, the cheaper the books the more sales is totally false. My books are dirt cheap but they sell less than some of the best sellers who are charging the same for an e-book as for a print copy when there are not trees involved.
Hello Elle, thanks for this thread. Indies have got a bad name, in part due to their spamming on Kindle Forums. It's an unfortunate case of some bad indies make all indies look bad.
Another problem is poorly written and produced books full of spelling and punctuation errors. This, for me, is less serious, because I always read the sample. Bad writing is evident from the beginning. I don't buy the book. Some people on the forums complain that some books start off well and then goes downhill. This is not a problem either, as readers can get a refund within 7 days of buying.
Maybe I've been luck, but I've never had to ask for the refund.
Another problem is poorly written and produced books full of spelling and punctuation errors. This, for me, is less serious, because I always read the sample. Bad writing is evident from the beginning. I don't buy the book. Some people on the forums complain that some books start off well and then goes downhill. This is not a problem either, as readers can get a refund within 7 days of buying.
Maybe I've been luck, but I've never had to ask for the refund.
Peggy, I totally agree. The 'tried and tested' big names out there are getting stale with their stories. Some even look like the books are just the same story with location and character names swapped there.What I really like about indies is that they push the limits of what's available in trad publishing. There's no one here to tell them, "this concept will never fly." So out they go with their new concepts and we the readers are the winners in the end, because we get fresh and 'different' fiction that tickles our reader bones.
And totally agree about the price. I'm from a small island where almost everything seems to be imported (read that as, Expensive!). Before the ebook revolution, I used to buy a paperback here at around 600 bucks (that's $20 or so). Now when you imagine most people make only around 25K a month here, you're hard pressed to push half a grand and even more towards 1 book, right?
But then comes Kindle, and in that same money I would've gotten 1 paperback, I can get anywhere between 10-20 ebooks (which is how I'm able to buy 20-30+ books every week).
Another thing I love about ebooks - they're virtual. Just last month we went on a weekend break to a beach-front hotel, and I took 20 books to read with me. Additional weight in my luggage? Zero gram! Reason? All those books were on my phone :)
Hi all,I read an interesting article a while back (link below) on how self-publishing is replacing the traditional 'mid list'. I was reminded of it yesterday when I saw that Tanith Lee has recently put something out on Smashwords.
I do think the $0.99 ebook novels are devaluing the market (and thus writing as a whole). Given the work that goes into creating a full-length book, does it really make sense to price an ebook novel at the same level as a download three-minute single?
http://publishingperspectives.com/201...
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