Why don't more people read Self-published authors? Showing 2,401-2,450 of 2,452

[Christopher]

Its worth noting that professionally published books from big publishing houses have errors and typos on them as well.

[Abby]

I think some of the stigma with self-publishing comes from all the people out there who didn't take the time to go over their manuscript, who didn't get a cover, who possibly didn't even write a good story!
Once someone said to me that a 'free page on Amazon' referring to KDP, only took ten minutes to set up, so they didn't think much of the book if it was only one Amazon. That burned my biscuits a little because it took me months to get my book to the point to where I felt it could be published.

[Abby]

Christopher wrote: "Its worth noting that professionally published books from big publishing houses have errors and typos on them as well."

Yes!

[Jim]

Any avid reader can attest to the fact that no book, regardless of publishing method, is 100% error free.

The following exercise is by no means intended to be based upon scientific methodology or even an accurate portrayal of the industry standard. It was merely performed due to personal curiosity of what the outcome might be.

During a 12-month period during the year 2020, I randomly chose 7 traditionally published books and 7 self-published books of approximately equal length. While reading, I made a concerted effort to note any spelling, punctuation, grammatical, typo, or print errors. As each was discovered, I merly made a slash on a piece of paper.

The average number of errors (total divided by 7)) discovered in the traditionally published books was 29. The average discovered in the self-published works was 112. The least amount of errors discovered among the traditionally published books was one that contained only 19 errors. The least amount of errors discovered among the self-published books was one that contained only 23 errors.

If anyone has the time and inclination to perform a similar experiment, it would be interesting to compare the findings.

I still stand by my personal observation expressed in message 2463.

[Rod]

I guess self published authors do not have the machinery behind them to advertise and promote via the professional routes. We advertise on social media etc, but it's the big publishing houses that get their books into the newspapers and on TV, resulting on wider readership.
Personally I read any book that is interesting and well written, whether it is self published or media promoted, but I have found that the books with massive advertising campaigns behind them are often a big let down, in the same way that heavy promotion of a film often leads to disappointing viewing. Word of mouth is by far the best promotion.

[[deleted user]]

Jim wrote: "Any avid reader can attest to the fact that no book, regardless of publishing method, is 100% error free.

The following exercise is by no means intended to be based upon scientific methodology or ..."

Sorry Jim,

But it sounds incredibly anal to count errors in a book. I read a book to enjoy it, not to run scientific experiments.

Beyond that, I accept myself and many others have a lot of errors in our books but since I don't make it a habit to chase them down and instead merely enjoy the reading experience. As long as it is not every second word I am fine with that.

The reason being is simply this...
High-end authors/very successful authors tend to be rigid in their writing. They have a manager, agent, sandwich maker, etc to help them out and an agenda pushed from above. IE sell, sell, sell!

People like myself tend to write what we want, when we want. The aim is not nec success but maybe a form of catharsis or merely the fun of writing whatever we want?

Finally, if I was a successful author the idea that I started writing Lovecraftian horror, moved to Noir, and then followed with a book on the nature of Angels would be considered writing suicide surely?

The general public, not the GR public will always want Lovecraftian and horror from me forever more. Where next year I might decided I want to write Mills and Boons meets Splatterpunk?

Anyways, long answers, short version.
Stephen King etc is mass audience appeal.
Where as a lot of small time authors tend to just do what the hell they feel like?

[[deleted user]]

A few more points just struck me.

Basically what is it you actually want?

I have a job and a reasonably secure life, I write for fun and if you read it I am happy, if you don't, so what?

And I get the impression that a lot of the GR authors are like that. Do people actually desire to be a successful author or do they desire to be a good author. They are two different things entirely.

[Carmen]

Douglas wrote: "A few more points just struck me.

Basically what is it you actually want?

I have a job and a reasonably secure life, I write for fun and if you read it I am happy, if you don't, so what?

And I g..."

Thought I'd jump in here and add my own thoughts to this one: There are definitely authors who are more than happy to just write for fun - that have a job but don't plan on quitting to pursue writing.
On the other hand, there are those who enjoy writing, but would also like to pursue writing full time at some stage and would like to have some degree of success - on whatever scale that might be.
I don't think that being a successful author and being a good writing author are mutually exclusive. I feel that a person can have both. : )

[[deleted user]]

Carmen wrote: "Douglas wrote: "A few more points just struck me.

Basically what is it you actually want?

I have a job and a reasonably secure life, I write for fun and if you read it I am happy, if you don't, s..."

I agree they are not mutually exclusive but due to the demands set upon the idea of success then to be successful without paying some sort of price in what you write would be unlikely I suspect?

What the mob wants the mob gets.

[Carmen]

Douglas wrote: "Carmen wrote: "Douglas wrote: "A few more points just struck me.

Basically what is it you actually want?

I have a job and a reasonably secure life, I write for fun and if you read it I am happy, ..."

I know there have been authors that have started one genre for a while, then have slowly switched to another - inevitably, there will be some readers lost along the way that might have not liked the switch that was made by the author. Though, also - there will be new readers gained with the genre switch.
I suspect an author will 'win some, lose some' along the way if they happen to switch genres. But on the other hand, there will be those core fan readers that will stick with the author despite the genre switch.
The author would have to gauge if the switch is worth it. There are the authors that would be popular in a genre that would be scared to make a genre switch, due to the price it might entail.
Then again, a person also gets those authors who write to market.
I have heard that when an author is starting out that they should stick to one genre for the first little while before switching.
I figure a person gets three types of authors: those that write what the reader wants, authors who write what the author themselves enjoy writing, and then the authors who do a mix of the two. : )

[[deleted user]]

Carmen wrote: "Douglas wrote: "Carmen wrote: "Douglas wrote: "A few more points just struck me.

Basically what is it you actually want?

I have a job and a reasonably secure life, I write for fun and if you read..."

There is wisdom in your reply, really there is no correct way to be an author or equally, a bad way? It really depends on what you intend to gain from the experience I suppose?

Maybe we need to create a flow chart of choices :)

[Carmen]

Douglas wrote: "Carmen wrote: "Douglas wrote: "Carmen wrote: "Douglas wrote: "A few more points just struck me.

Basically what is it you actually want?

I have a job and a reasonably secure life, I write for fun ..."

Very true - each author is different in the way they approach things.
A flow chart of choices would be a very good idea - though it might confuse some people (there are so many choices - and a person can go down any number of routes)! X D

[[deleted user]]

Thats the joy of a flow chart, it claims its place within logic, but really it is a creature of chaos :)

[Carmen]

Douglas wrote: "Thats the joy of a flow chart, it claims its place within logic, but really it is a creature of chaos :)"

Haha, yeah - you can definitely say that again! : D

[Hyrum]

Some thoughts.

1 the cover - I judge the author by the cover. If the cover looks like it took 5 minutes to create, I usually don't bother to look into the book, unless the description fits what I like to read, which is rare.

2 promotion - the cards are stacked against self-published authors. The big publishing houses want to sell books, yes, but they know that the average person will only read what they think is popular, so they create a facade of popularity, usually by just printing "New York Times Bestseller" or some other meaningless designation on the cover. The book content doesn't have to be good, it just needs to be polished, which is easy for them. And if the book is just okay or less than okay but is raved about, people will convince themselves that they loved it.

2A nepotism - the upper class have many relatives and some of them will want to be writers. These people will have lots of help writing, and will get the most promotion. Their real identities will sometimes probably be hidden and they will be made to look like a rags to riches type of person so the average joe will buy their stuff. This is why I'm very suspicious (suss as my 12 year old would say) of many authors that make it big and are heavily promoted.

[Andy]

Personally I write because it's fun and I usually collaborate with my son which increases the enjoyment considerably. I'd like to get better circulation of my works because I don't want to see them disappear into the digital ether of obscurity when I know many people will enjoy reading them.

I'm not going to compete with a publisher's advertising budget, and I view self-publishing as a hobby. My viewpoint is that in time I'll get more traction and followers. It's a long timeline that should get more circulation at some point, but I also don't have investors demanding significant profits. Besides, the real money is in getting a book picked up for a screenplay so the ugly truth is that as long as online retailers like Kindle and Apple books take half of the sale price all I'm doing is working for someone else as usual.

Self publishing is a hobby, and if I manage to find real success I'll be very happy. Until then I'll keep turning out sleeper hits. ;)

[Vikas]

For me, it's about the editing and also it's down to lack of promotion or awareness on my part. I love getting free books for review and I don't say no to self-published authors. So I read their work if I know about them and if I am able to get a copy.

[[deleted user]]

Andy wrote: "Personally I write because it's fun and I usually collaborate with my son which increases the enjoyment considerably. I'd like to get better circulation of my works because I don't want to see them..."

Could not agree with you more and love the fact you write with your son, now that is a blessing :)

[Ashrita]

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[Julia]

I'm self-published, and when it comes to new reads I usually am not picky. However, I am limited to what I read since I don't use e-readers. My to-read shelf is usually classics that are already in the house or books I buy on a whim at thrift stores.

[Julia]

About the typos in self-published books, many readers of mine think I misspelled the titular word "Coincident" (rather than Coincidence), but I deliberately chose a different word. I hope it sparks the interest for readers to think they have caught me in error, enticing them to at least read the description of my book, and then consider purchasing it.

[Julia]

I haven't read a new traditionally published release in years because I find them biased in their themes; any self-published book recommendations out there?

[Monette]

It's harder and harder to get a decent publisher these days. All nine of my books are at Amazon, self-published, but I find myself a competent editor. A lot of self-published authors are not. That makes any self-published novel look suspect. If you contact me, I just might have a deal for you.

[Lester]

Nora wrote: "I am late to this discussion, but have found the thread interesting. I am convinced Amazon would not have created Kindle Direct if there was no customer demand. From my perspective the marketplace ..."
I am sorry to think that Amazon has cornered the market on publication. I have to admit that my third book will probably be done on KDP because the first two were so costly. However, I do think the KDP has contributed to the explosion of publications. My second book is now in the 7 millionth position on Amazon... I can't imagine what could be lower. I was not expecting to get rich, but now I have had to spend $4500.00 just to try to increase my exposure on social media. Of my 30 reviews most are 4 and 5 stars posted on my website (www.LesterFisher.com), and goodreads, and Amazon, Google Books. But I do agree that it has become an extremely competitive market.

[Arch]

Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but does self published means ebooks? I have been reading romance books for over 30 years and I prefer paperback books. If any of the authors that I have read over the years have self published their book or books, I didn’t know.

I don’t buy books at full price. I get my books from library sales, thrift stores or garage sales and my paper back spending is from 10 cents to 5/$1.00 and if I buy a hard back, it’s either 3/$1.00 or 5/$1.00 and cheaper if there. I am not really into ebooks, but if I get them I go for the free ones or ones that can be checked out from the library.

Sorry to say, but I can’t see myself paying full price for a book and if I don’t like it, I am stuck with a book that I will feel I have wasted my money on. With cheap buys, if I don’t like the book, I can give it away.

How I choose a book to read. I check out the description on the back of the book and prologue, if there is on. If they catch my attention, then I will read the book. Of course, I have themes that I like reading. A book can have a good description and prologue and still lose my interest later on.

I don’t read first person books, erotic stories, same sex stories, paranormal, fantasy. I love tension in the stories that I read and no I am not talking about sex. Speaking about sex, a lot of books nowadays are about sex. How good the man is in the bed. That’s not romance. I don’t care about a hero being rich either. The hero has to romance the heroine and show that he loves her. They have to have chemistry. A lot of hero and heroines don’t have chemistry and I am expected to believe they belong together.

I am not an author, but I am a writer. I write stories that I love to read. I am not getting anything published. Don’t care to. I write for fun.

Now down to errors in books, let me just say that errors are in books, even if they are bestsellers. A book may not have a typo, but compare it to grammar rules, you will see just how much errors are in that book. When I read a book, I am not looking for errors, I am looking for a story. I am not looking for an author or writer to tell me a story, I want them to show me a story. Bring your characters to life. Make me want more.

[Mellie]

Arch wrote: "Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong, but does self published means ebooks?"

Self published authors can produce ebooks, audio, paperback, hardbacks and large print (popular with libraries). It is entirely up to them as to which, or how many, formats they produce.

[Arch]

Mellie wrote: "Self published authors can produce ebooks, audio, paperback, hardbacks and large print (popular with libraries). It is entirely up to them as to which, or how many, formats they produce.
"

Ok, then I probably came across some self published authors and didn’t know.

[Sophie]

Hyrum wrote: "Some thoughts.

1 the cover - I judge the author by the cover. If the cover looks like it took 5 minutes to create, I usually don't bother to look into the book, unless the description fits what I ..."
---

You make very good points.

I would add to these a certain degree of snootiness - most of the general public will not read self-published books because they don't come from a reputed, well-established publishing company. But this happens with all products, not only books. For instance, When was the last time you bought a bottle of home-made wine?

In addition, many self-published books are amateurish in content. Sadly, some writers do not take the time to polish their prose, content, or edit with a publisher's perspective. I've often been very attracted to self-published books due to their premise, only to be later put off by grammar mistakes, typos, misspelled or misused words, endless paragraphs, etc. If you want your books to be read, you ought to offer quality to your readers.

That said, there's also excellent self-published stories out there, but it takes time to sort them out.

[Arch]

I have seen errors in bestseller authors books. Why would errors be in a bestseller book?

[Aaron]

Arch wrote: "I have seen errors in bestseller authors books. Why would errors be in a bestseller book?"

simple enough to say that they don't have any proofreaders or they just want to get the book done without checking on their work.

[Arch]

Aaron wrote: "simple enough to say that they don't have any proofreaders or they just want to get the book done without checking on their work."

Which author do you believe do not have any errors in his or her book?

[Aaron]

I know RL Stein doesn't have errors, also some authors on here don't have any either. just review my page to see which ones I'm talking about.

[Arch]

Aaron wrote: "I know RL Stein doesn't have errors, also some authors on here don't have any either. just review my page to see which ones I'm talking about."

Are you telling me all those books are grammar perfect? That if I was to take one and go page by page that I would not find a grammar error?

I don’t have time to do that, but if I did, I say I would find errors.

[[deleted user]]

Aaron wrote: "I know RL Stein doesn't have errors, also some authors on here don't have any either. just review my page to see which ones I'm talking about."

I read books for the story they tell, not to search for grammatical perfection. If the story is not interesting and doesn't tell something about characters, personal stories and events, then it is not worth reading, grammatically perfect or not. Are you entertained and satisfied after finishing to read a book? For me, that's the only worthy criteria in calling a book 'good' or 'excellent'.

[Arch]

Michel wrote: "I read books for the story they tell, not to search for grammatical perfection. If the story is not interesting and doesn't tell something about characters, personal stories and events, then it is not worth reading, grammatically perfect or not. Are you entertained and satisfied after finishing to read a book? For me, that's the only worthy criteria in calling a book 'good' or 'excellent'. "

I agree. I want a story, not a grammar book.

[Christopher]

It is very difficult to get editing and proofing perfect, no matter how talented or skilled someone is. Something usually slips through no matter how careful.

Its ideal to have zero, but challenging. I have seen errors in very fine, very well-published and famous books.

And I have seen reviews that take unusual takes or creative writing as erroneous as well. Imagine a modern reviewer reading Clockwork Orange and the oddities and slang in it.

[Jim]

Aside from all of the issues previously stated within this discussion, the primary reason so many self-published books do not attract a significantly-sized readership is the sheer magnitude of the competition.

Not very long ago, only a few hundred thousand living writers could claim the title of Published Author. Due to the introduction of self-publishing and vanity presses, today literally millions can legitimately say that they are a published author.

Very few achieve commercial success or even notoriety within this extremely competitive field. That said; some have. Whose to say that you might not eventually become one of them? I wish you success.

[Robin]

Looking over this discussion, I think that a broad consensus has been reached.

There are two main issues.

The first is that Indie authors are held to a different standard, as there is a general feeling that their work will be poor in comparison to a traditionally published book. This means that their books are put under the microscope in a way that trad books are not.

I don't remember anyone ever pointing out typos or perceived grammatical errors in a trad pub book in any review I have ever read. We all know that they are there though. An indie book? Well, it sometimes seems that small errors are more likely to be written about than the quality of the actual storytelling.

I say 'perceived errors' in that previous paragraph by the way, because as @Christopher R Taylor pointed out at post 2464 if an indie author attempts any creative experiments, they are just perceived as mistakes. Dylan Thomas did some extraordinary experimental things with grammar and punctuation. They work and they are wonderful. If an indie author used those techniques they would quite simply be viewed as 'wrong'.

The second issue is that of visibility. As @Jim Vuksic points out at post 2466 the sheer volume of published works is now absolutely astronomical and growing every day. Even the big boys can some times have problems pushing certain titles and they have entire departments working on every aspect of the marketing. No indie author can compete with that. In a way, when you think of how the odds are stacked against you, if you sell anything at all you have done well.

Something that hardly anyone admits, is that hard work and perseverance are not enough. To be noticed, you also need an enormous slice of luck. Yes, sorry, I am saying that it's not enough to be good at what you do and work hard, you also have to be lucky. You can't control the luck, you can only do your best with the things that you can control.

The short version...

More people do not read indie authors because they do not know that we are there and when they do stumble across our works, they are immediately suspicious of the quality and likely to judge us unfairly.

I am not going to stop writing anytime soon though :-)

That's my contribution, for what it is worth and like @Jim Vuksic above I sincerely wish you luck and every success.

[Donnally]

Arch wrote: "Aaron wrote: "I know RL Stein doesn't have errors, also some authors on here don't have any either. just review my page to see which ones I'm talking about."

Are you telling me all those books are..."

Professionally edited books have errors. I read somewhere that 1 error in 7,000 words is considered a professional standard. Personally, I hold myself to a higher standard. My novel The Devil's Workshop contains zero errors.

[Julia]

Gloria wrote: "A steamy romance, French Kiss. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09F7T1ZWG?..."

Be careful putting links to your own books... you may get reported for self-promoting.

[Donnally]

I thought self-promotion was permitted in this group.

[Christopher]

Another aspect is that its difficult to get noticed. This has always been true about authors. Patrick O'Brian wrote for nearly 20 years before finally breaking into the US market and becoming a success. His books were amazing and loved but only by a small market. Until finally he got noticed by someone who spread the word.

Getting noticed is the key; advertising is extremely unlikely to work (when's the last time YOU bought a book because of an ad?). Publicity isn't likely to work. It takes getting noticed and word of mouth and becoming known and popular. And self publishing people just don't have that network that publishers have.

[Arch]

Donnally wrote: "Professionally edited books have errors. I read somewhere that 1 error in 7,000 words is considered a professional standard. Personally, I hold myself to a higher standard. My novel The Devil's Workshop contains zero errors. "

If you say so.

[Aaron]

I prefer any story that is not boring, if it has any errors in it, I just simply tell the author that their book has errors in it, kinda like being the editor but as a reader, there are a few books that I have read that are somewhat boring, it gives me a longer time to finish.

[Aaron]

oh and Arch, as for RL Stein, he's one of the best ya authors out there that does not make any mistakes, I was reading him for a very long time like since I was 14 and I'm still reading him now and I'm 44 years old.

[Christopher]

I think the formatting and presentation matters more than exactly perfect editing for most readers. If your ebook is a mess and your cover looks like you took 5 minutes with 3d Poser, its going to be something people tend to avoid.

[P.L.]

Reading a self published book at the moment. No errors, the structure is fine, but it's shallow and there's just not much to sink my teeth into. The dialog is just a little more inane than I want, the writing a little more padded than I want.

This author did all the things right, but still has room to grow.

Having said that, trade published books are far more likely to annoy me for being pretentious and elitist! :) Impenetrable, some say, and I don't disagree!

I'm a crabby reader, I guess. But also it's a little bit like finding a new singer to enjoy. It takes a while to get used to their voice and artistic vision.

[Arch]

Aaron wrote: "oh and Arch, as for RL Stein, he's one of the best ya authors out there that does not make any mistakes, I was reading him for a very long time like since I was 14 and I'm still reading him now and..."

If you say so.

[Theresa]

Donnally wrote: "I thought self-promotion was permitted in this group."

Self promotion is permitted in the group, but you have to start a thread in a correct area. You probably saw self-promotion in the Bulletin Board area, or in specific genre threads. So if the author was advertising their romance book, for example, that person could start a thread in "Romance" and/or "Bulletin Board" titled "Steamy Romance" and link to their book and/or give whatever information they want about it.

Randomly sticking self-promo into a thread that isn't about that book or self-promo is frowned on, and can be reported if someone decides to be a stickler.

[Jim]

The majority of Goodreads discussion groups include a topic dedicated to book/blog promotion by authors or their representative.

The occasional reprimand or deletion of a promotion occurs because too many novice authors blatently (and often unprofessionally) promote their work, solicit reviews, or offer free copies within a discussion topic that has absolutely nothing to do with writing or books.