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A Clash of Kings
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Martin, George R.R - A Clash of Kings (A Song of Ice and Fire, #2) buddy read start date July 5th 2011 - REVISIT JUNE 2017
Lisarenee wrote: "Lisa Kay said of Jaqen, "My other thoughts on him are mainly about who the hell else he could be in this story!!"I wondered at one point if He could be Varys, but I can't see him being the one on..."
I've begun to wonder if Jaqen is Syrio Forel (Arya's teacher). We never saw Syrio die (and no one mentions later if he was killed with the rest), they're both from Braavos and my husband said that the way Jaqen speaks reminds him of Syrio.
Plus, Syrio was a great fighter who helped Ned Stark's daughter get away, so if they took him alive they probably would have thrown him in the black cells (where Biter, Rorge and Jaqen were held). And I always thought it odd how someone who was supposed to be so dangerous was sort of nice to Arya.
Laura wrote: "I've begun to wonder if Jaqen is Syrio Forel (Arya's teacher). We never saw Syrio die (and no one mentions later if he was killed with the rest), they're both from Braavos and my husband said that the way Jaqen speaks reminds him of Syrio."Wow! Good catch on your husband's part. Are you two listening to it on audio?
Nope, we're reading the books, so I have no idea how it sounds on audio. Just the way the speech is written made him think of Syrio's accent, I guess.
Questions for Chapter 44 (Tyrion) - Chapter 47(Ayra)102. Cersei didn't like Tyrion attacking her son. Now she's set on getting Tommen to safety. Kind of interesting don't you think?
I think it is wise for her to send Tommen away. King's Landing is becoming way too volatile.
103. Interesting that at one time Tyrion thought of killing his sister, but now sees killing kin a terrible thing.
I don't recall him thinking of killing her.
104. Do you think there is a connection between the mysterious Jaqen and the guy who took Varys' manhood?
Could be. I didn't think about it until you mentioned it.
105. What a horrible story Vary had to tell. To have that happen at such an early age. Now we know why he's good at changing his appearance.
Very sad and tragic for him. Kind of helps explain why he does what he has to in order to survive.
106. Do you think Varys and Tyrion have bonded? Can they trust each other?
No and NO.
107. Do you think Tyrion telling Shae about his wife will come back to bite him in the butt?
Not really.
108. Does anyone else feel Shae is going to betray him in a major way?
I never thought this, but now that you mention it, anything is certainly possible.
109. Now Catelyn must wonder what happened to Ayra. She definitely has much to fear.
OH, yes indeed.
110. Looks like the green dream is going to come true. Now we know what Theon was up to. Anyone surprised? Do you think his father will be happy?
Not surprising given all the hints we were given. I don't think this is what his father wanted him to do, so no, I don't think he'll be happy about it.
111. Okay, I have to say I like Jaqen, but now Ayra owes him a death? That is what he meant right? He would have taken her with him? Any thought on Jaqen?
I thought this was one of the most exciting chapters in the book! I think when he says, "A man must die," he means that persona (Jaqen) must die and he must take on a new identity. Someone commented that this could be Syrio, and I agree, yes it could be!
112. Do you think it was wise of Arya to not reveal her identity?
It is, I suppose, however with the Stark banner flying, I wonder why she can't reveal herself?
113. What happened to Littlefinger? Do you think it was wrong of Tyrion to give him the documents he did with the seal? Could he misuse them?
Not sure, but I think that since Tyrion doesn't trust Littlefinger, the documents don't mean anything.
Lisa Kay’s Questions for Chapter 48 (Daenerys) – Chapter 51 (Jon)114. What is significant in the name “House of the Undying Ones”? Why does Xaro Xhoam Daxos refer to it as the “Palace of Dust”? What do we know really about Pyat Pree, other than he’s a warlock? And why in H-E-Double-Hockey-Sticks did Dany go in there? Good gravy beans! At least she had Drogon with her. Whew!
This was a bizarre scene to say the least. I kept thinking that she was hallucinating after drinking the potion she was given.
115. Was Dany seeing the past, the future, or both? Did anyone else feel inclined to bookmark pages 705-706 to see if they will come true?
• three fires must you light... (life, death, love)
• Three mounts must you ride... (to bed, to dread, to love)
• Three treasons will you know... (blood, gold, love)
Ahhh… There are three of them; has any part of them already come true?
Well, she lit a fire for death and life when she burned Drogo and the dragons were born. If Drogo was a "mount" she rode him to bed, and she also rode a horse toward the comet to an unknown place of "dread" (maybe??). The wine merchant tried to kill her for gold, Mirri Maz Dur betrayed her with blood.
So now she will find love??
116. Okay, I’m lost. Where is Tyrion sending Shagga and his clansmen off to? The kingswood? Why?
They are not disciplined enough for battle (I read this later on).
117. Is it just me, or is Tyrion having a bit of personality change? Where are all his funny quips? Now they seem bitter.
I think a lot has to do with Shae. He really cares for her, and now she is in danger. Also, his family is in danger of losing the war. The reality is making him lose his sense of humor, perhaps?
118. Though he tries to shrug it off, it seems as if Tyrion respected Winterfell and a part of him is sad to see its fall out of Stark hands. Does this bode well for any Starks in the future?
I think Tyrion has an affection for Jon Snow and for Bran. If he has the power to spare them in the future, he will.
119. “Ser Osmund is as loyal as he is brave…” Queen Regent Cersei told King Joffrey, and internally, Tyrion agreed. But doesn’t Osmund’s disloyalty work both ways? Could this come back to bite Tyrion in the butt?
It always seems that Tyrion has the upper hand in buying the loyalty of the guards.
120. Hallyne the Pyromancer – does anyone else think he could be someone else in disguise? He did ask about the proximity of any dragons to explain the increase in wildfire…
Is this where someone said that the fire increases when there are dragons? Should have bookmarked this. At what point will the mainland hear about the dragons??
121. Speaking of dragons, how come no one (seemly) in the Seven Kingdoms knows Dany has three dragons now? I would have expected this news to spread far and wide. (Her pregnancy sure did!)
Ah! What I just said. LOL
122. Do you think any (or all) of the castle folk of Winterfell helped Bran, Rickon, and the rest escape or were they just as astonished as Theon? Will Theon ever have the loyalty of the people of Winterfell or is he doomed in this regard?
I don't think Bran would have wanted to endanger his staff, so I think he worked only with Osha, Jojen and his sister. Theon will NEVER have their loyalty.
123. Were you pretty sure Osha would help Bran and Rickon, even after pledging to Theon, or did it come as a complete surprise?
I figured she was faking in regard to Theon.
124. How did Bran, Rickon and the others elude Theon? Where are they anyway?
Seems they put out clues to put them on a wild goose chase.
125. Was there any truth to Ygritte’s tale of Bael/Sygerrik and Brandon the Daughterless? Or did she just know the right button to push?
There is always some element of truth in a legend. I don't think she was afraid of dying, but maybe she wanted to establish that they were related in order to prevent Jon from killing her.
126. Were you pleased that Jon Snow showed compassion with Ygritte? Will this be detrimental or fortuitous in the future?
Quite honestly, I think he should have killed her.
I am afraid this will be detrimental to him.
I can write questions for Ch. 52 - 55 if you'd like.
Response's to Sandy's answers:#115 - I'm horrible at thinking these sorts of things through, but what you mention makes sense. Usually if there are "prophecies" or whatever, it isn't until they've completely passed and someone reflects in the novel that I get it!
#117 - Also, his family is in danger of losing the war.
It's funny, I viewed it as him getting fed up with his family. Except for Jaime, he doesn't have much affection for any Lannister, and Jaime isn't even there.
In fact, there was this really interesting scene between himself and Bronn after explaining the Tysha story. I think Bronn had said he would've killed the man who did that to him (meaning Tywin) and Tyrion said "A Lannister always pays his debts." It showed to me that there's a separation between himself and the rest of the family and maybe he's not completely loyal to them. He might just be biding his time.
And that all ties into #118 - I agree that he has affection for Jon Snow (especially) and Bran. I think it would be cool for him to switch sides, but it makes me nervous for him.
#119 - It always seems that Tyrion has the upper hand in buying the loyalty of the guards.
"Seems" is incredibly important. Having characters that work for both side, but "Oh, no, I'm totally loyal to YOU" make me nervous. I mean, look at what Littlefinger did. Ned thought he had Littlefinger pay the gold cloaks to back him, but instead Littlefinger had them all turn on Ned.
That would be great Sandy. I'm running a bit behind. Was up until 4 AM this morning.
Questions for Chapter 52 (Sansa) through Chapter 55 (Catelyn)127. Do you see a way out for Sansa? I get the impression Dontos doesn’t really have a plan, even though he keeps reassuring her.
128. What do you think about Sansa’s interaction with the Hound? For all his ferocity, I don’t think he would seriously hurt her. Then again, do you think he would if Joffrey commanded it?
129. Do you think that Cersei no longer expects Sansa to marry Joffrey? It sounds to me like she is almost resigned to Stannis winning the war. Does anyone else find it weird that Jaime was determined to be with Cersei in her birthing room? It felt like she was practically admitting an unnatural relationship with her twin.
130. Did you think Jon would be “in trouble” for letting the Wildling go free? I was relieved at Qhorin’s response.
131. Another mind-meld here, Jon and Ghost? The weirwood he sees has his brother’s face with three eyes. When he senses death, did you think at this point that Bran might be dead? I did! Do you think Ghost will heal?
132. Many times in this novel we learn of events after they’ve already happened. As the mother of a 4-year-old boy and a 7-year-old girl, I had to put down my Nook in disgust when I learned that Bran and Rickon had been murdered by Theon. Did you feel rage toward Theon and the author? I sure did! Tyrion seems more upset than Cersei, who I felt was pretty blasé about it.
I also had to keep the hope that the news was false to continue reading without complete outrange. The last chapter is Bran’s, so is this ghost Bran? Perhaps “Direwolf Bran”? Is Bran really dead??
133. Did you know the “little whore” that Cersei had taken was not really Shae? Do you believe Tyrion will make good on his promise to hurt Cersei?
134. How in the world is Catelyn able to keep the news about Bran and Rickon to herself? (Here is another theory of mine: Bran/Rickon changed clothes with Jojen and Meera, and that is who was actually murdered! Ages don’t match, but still…. I am in complete denial here.)
135. Were you surprised Jaime admitted to throwing Bran off the tower? I was, especially considering he’s chained and helpless.
136. So….who sent the assassin after Bran with the knife?? Will we ever find out?
137. Ooooooh, what will Catelyn do with Brienne’s sword?
132. ...The last chapter is Bran’s, so is this ghost Bran? Perhaps “Direwolf Bran”? Is Bran really dead??Maybe a spoiler, but mostly just an observation (view spoiler).
Laura, so the actual books don't have a Table of Contents? Interesting, and I agree with you that Martin must have done it for a reason. Does anyone know if he numbers chapters in later books, or continues the same convention?
There are never chapter numbers. They only go by the character name.Not having a table of contents sometimes frustrates me, because if I wanted to know when the next Arya chapter was (and I always wanted to know when the next Arya chapter was) then I couldn't just go to the front and peek, I had to actually flip through the pages and see what each chapter is titled.
But I totally get why he did it.
@Sandy#102 – Yes, but I think she was sending Tommen away to keep him out Tyrion’s hands as much as to get him out of King’s Landing.
#103 – I believe Tyrion had a fleeting thought having once wanted to kill Cersei, but I can’t remember where it is (and I looked! – goodness, we’ve read a lot).
#111 – You ladies are convincing me. I think Jaqen might be Syrio. I hope so. :)
#112 – I don’t think Arya should reveal herself to anyone but her brother, King Robb; she doesn’t know who to trust.
#114 – A hallucinogenic? Now, Sandy, why didn’t I think of that? **smacks forehead**
#115 – I was just happy they all ended in “love”. I have my doubts with Martin writing her story. Especially since that last is treason/love together. **sigh**
#116 – Yeah, me too. At least one mystery was answered later.
#118 – I hope so! Tyrion seens a decent enough guy.
#120- 121 – Mind meld!
#122 – I think you are right; Bran wouldn’t want to endanger his staff.
#123 – I figured Osha was faking it too.
#126 – Hmmm… I wonder. I’m hoping giving Ygritte a reprieve will help Jon in the long run.
My Answers to Sandy’s Questions for Chapter 52 (Sansa) through Chapter 55 (Catelyn) 127. Do you see a way out for Sansa? I get the impression Dontos doesn’t really have a plan, even though he keeps reassuring her.
My faith in Dontos has plummeted! Poor Sansa! Plus, I figure, just from a POV logistics, she is doomed to stay with the Lannisters for a while, so we can see things through her eyes and ears.
128. What do you think about Sansa’s interaction with the Hound? For all his ferocity, I don’t think he would seriously hurt her. Then again, do you think he would if Joffrey commanded it?
This relationship has me the most puzzled. I keep wondering if he is falling for her, and if so, what will be the upshot of that ; I don’t think Martin has the “beauty and the beast” theme in mind at all, as he wants to be “original”. Instead, he is giving very little happiness to his characters (and to me!). I am wondering why I’m still reading this series as I don’t think there is going to be many (if any) HEAs.
129. ❶Do you think that Cersei no longer expects Sansa to marry Joffrey? ❷It sounds to me like she is almost resigned to Stannis winning the war. ❸Does anyone else find it weird that Jaime was determined to be with Cersei in her birthing room? ❹It felt like she was practically admitting an unnatural relationship with her twin.
❶ I don’t think Cersei expects Sansa to be her daughter-in-law. ❷ I agree. ❸ No; as twisted as it is, I think he loves her. ❹ I think she has already given up that illusion to Tyrion, and knows it.
130. Did you think Jon would be “in trouble” for letting the Wildling go free? I was relieved at Qhorin’s response.
I didn’t think he would reveal it, so I didn’t think there’d be trouble. Q’s response? I was relieved too.
131. Another mind-meld here, Jon and Ghost? The weirwood he sees has his brother’s face with three eyes. When he senses death, did you think at this point that Bran might be dead? I did! Do you think Ghost will heal?
That was pretty cool. I think it was; it begs the question: are all the Starks “skinchangers”? If so, was that eagle one also? If that is true, then who was the eagle? (view spoiler) I hope Ghost heals… but I don’t know about scars.
132. Many times in this novel we learn of events after they’ve already happened. As the mother of a 4-year-old boy and a 7-year-old girl, I had to put down my Nook in disgust when I learned that Bran and Rickon had been murdered by Theon. Did you feel rage toward Theon and the author? I sure did! Tyrion seems more upset than Cersei, who I felt was pretty blasé about it.
I also had to keep the hope that the news was false to continue reading without complete outrange. The last chapter is Bran’s, so is this ghost Bran? Perhaps “Direwolf Bran”? Is Bran really dead??
Re: Bran, see spoiler to #131, if you want a plot reveal, otherwise refrain. Cersei is an unfeeling witch, spelled with a B.
133. Did you know the “little whore” that Cersei had taken was not really Shae? Do you believe Tyrion will make good on his promise to hurt Cersei?
That was a total surprise to me. Yes, Cersei went too far and now Tyrion is out for blood. That said, she is a step ahead of him in the hate department; I think those secret passages will come in handy for Tyrion.
134. How in the world is Catelyn able to keep the news about Bran and Rickon to herself? (Here is another theory of mine: Bran/Rickon changed clothes with Jojen and Meera, and that is who was actually murdered! Ages don’t match, but still…. I am in complete denial here.)
Okay, I gasped when I read your theory about Jojen and Meera! Oh no, I hope not; I like them.
135. Were you surprised Jaime admitted to throwing Bran off the tower? I was, especially considering he’s chained and helpless.
Actually, for some reason, I wasn’t surprised. I’m not sure why.
136. So….who sent the assassin after Bran with the knife?? Will we ever find out?
I think Littlefinger did it, to set up his own evil plans.
137. Ooooooh, what will Catelyn do with Brienne’s sword?
Hmmm… I’m thinking she might kill him as all her children are dead or lost to her and she is so grief stricken. But maybe the fact that Sansa is still alive will stay her hand and she’ll just cut something off.
GREAT Qs SANDY!
Lisarenee, I can do today's questions, if you like. ...And if my power doesn't go out again!
Lisa Kay,Good point re: Sansa's POV on Lannisters. I am loving her private thoughts on Joff...makes me laugh!
RE: plot reveal (and spoiler if you haven't read Chapter 56 Theon!) (view spoiler)
Suspect you are right about Littlefinger...was he just trying to stir up the war between Starks and Lannisters? To what end? Will be interesting to hear the real story of his past with Cat and Lysa.
Loving this series!
Sandy wrote: "I am loving her private thoughts on Joff...makes me laugh!"Yes, indeed, I am quite enjoying her internal dialogue with regards to
I'm having a love/hate relationship with this series. Just when I'm loving it, something happens that disgusts me. Just when I'm ready to put it down forever, something happens to make me desperate to find out what happens next. **sigh**
Lisa Kay: I think Littlefinger did it, to set up his own evil plans.Sandy: Suspect you are right about Littlefinger...was he just trying to stir up the war between Starks and Lannisters? To what end?
It's funny because I felt like we start seeing less and less of Littlefinger. They start sending him off places, plus Tyrion never trusted him, so they had very little interactions.
That being said, the less we see him, the more I suspected him for everything. I always feel like he's up to something, and if we don't see him, it's easier for him to get away with things.
I don't know why he would be doing any of the things we suspect him of being involved in, but I just don't trust him.
Laura, good point! He is likely up to no good when he's "off camera."Lisa Kay, that's a testament to what a good writer GRRM is...we feel all these different emotions and can't wait to see what happens next.
Laura wrote: "I don't know why he would be doing any of the things we suspect him of being involved in, but I just don't trust him."Sandy wrote: "Laura, good point! He is likely up to no good when he's "off camera.""
Yeah, Littlefinger is Definitely Up To Something! But what?
Lisa Kay wrote: "...I'm having a love/hate relationship with this series. Just when I'm loving it, something happens that disgusts me. ."The funny thing is, I'm one of those readers who loves it when something horrible happens. In regards to Bran (view spoiler).
The reason I like it is because it makes for a very accurate representation about what would happen in a war. I like that some of his characters are despicable. I like to hate Cersei, Joffrey and Theon for the things they choose to do.
It's like Mockingjay. I know a lot of people hated that last book, but I loved how bleak it was. How absolute unforgiving Suzanne Collins was as a writer. And that was a YA novel!
But then, that's just my taste. I don't go for sweet stories, lol.
Laura wrote: "But then, that's just my taste. I don't go for sweet stories, lol..."I must confess to having to read a few fluffy, light, sweet stories just to get me through A Game of Thrones. Maybe that is the problem... I need to pick another one up. I thought I had with Honor's Splendour, but it had a rape in it also (though "off camera").
I like a variety, but when I look at the books I have rated 5-stars, they are mostly sad, depressing, emotionally intense, etc. I wonder what that says about me? LOLAgree Martin is to be commended for not delivering the HEA or the results we want. Ditto for Collins.
Speaking of rape, Lisa Kay, that's my one big complaint about these books. There is A LOT of rape. And, fair warning, it only gets worse.Martin has made rape to be just another thing. In one of the later books a man mentions so nonchalantly that he had more than a few women when he was younger, some by force.
Then there was the story the Mountain's men were telling that made Arya so mad. They were all laughing about how the Mountain took that poor girl on the table right in front of her father. Then had all the others rape her and demanded change because she wasn't worth it.
I don't like that it becomes such a commonplace thing and so accepted. Even poor Lollys, who was raped by half of King's Landing, everyone afterwards just acts like, "Oh, it was her own fault." No one seems to care at all (except her mother and sister).
A few mentions of rape, ok. Understandable. It happens in war in real life. In the Congo, 48 women are raped every hour. So it would have been weird if there was no mentions of it. But it becomes so pervasive in his books, it's accepted and even encouraged. Some men act like some women should be raped to teach them a lesson and that they deserve it.
That's something I think Martin needs to cool it on.
I like that Dany enforced "no raping" with her men. I liked that that was one of the reasons Arya wanted that first guy, Chiswyc, killed, b/c of his callousness in telling the tale.However, another thing I don’t like about this series is that Martin will allow his likable (and even unlikable) characters to show mercy – but it always comes back to bite them in the butt. What does that say?
Agreed, that sort of makes you think the moral of the story is don't show mercy or you'll regret it later.I think in some of the instances where they show honor or mercy it was the sort of situation where you shouldn't. Ned Stark tried to be honorable, but the problem was that the people he was dealing with were not.
Sometimes the characters would do something nice and I'd be like "WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT? You can't trust so-and-so!"
Laura wrote: "Sometimes the characters would do something nice and I'd be like "WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT? You can't trust so-and-so!"I agree with you, Laura. I find myself, as in those old horror movies where you screen at the actors "NO! DON'T OPEN THAT DOOR!" I'm doing the same thing here, "No, don't trust them!" It makes the whole concept of honor seem so intangible.
I like that Martin shows both sides of this story, multiple POVs, and someone to cheer for on both sides. It tests the old grey matter.
Questions for Chapter 56 (Theon) – Chapter 59 (Tyrion) 138. “They gave me no choice.” That seems to be Theon’s mantra. Are you in agreement? I kept remembering him kicking that severed head around like a ball at the beginning of A Game of Thrones in comparison to (finally) beheading Farlen. He’s finding the “glory” of being Prince of Winterfell is in reality more “gory” than his conscience can handle. Are you feeling any sympathy for him?
139. Who do you like better by the end of chapter 56, Theon, or his sister, Asha?
SPOILER QUESTION COMING!
140. Where you surprised Theon had not killed Bran and Rickon? What are his reasonings for letting everyone think they are dead? Is compassion any part of them?
141. When she is with King Joffrey, do you love Sansa’s internal dialogue as much as me?
142. The coming battle seems to have extinguished the “mob” mentality. When Sansa was among the singing crowd of the sept, were you at all afraid for her?
143. The Queen Regent Cersei (who dressed for the occasion) told Sansa that Ser Ilyn is there for protection. Is this really the case, or is he there to behead someone else? Sansa’s would prefer the Hound to protect her. Comments?
144. Besides the obvious “B” word, what is another I’m looking for to describe Queen Regent Cersei’s comments and attitude toward Sansa? Patronizing?
145. What were you thoughts on the battle at Blackwater Bay/Kings Landing? Interesting? Were you able to keep all the ships straight and which side they were on?
146. Finally, we know what Tyrion’s chains were for! (I thought they would keep the ships out of the harbor, not trap them in.) Was this a clever plan?
147. After the last time, I was surprised to see Davos still alive for this chapter (I’ve quit looking for chapter names for a while). Think he’ll survive this one? Will the resourceful old pirate, Salladhor Saan, and his proud Valyrian, save Davos?
148. “Mother promised I could have the Whores.” Were you remembering
149. Were you surprised at Sandor Clegane's refusal to return to battle? What about Tyrion; were you impressed? Did he have any other choice? Will he be successful?
Thanks Lisa Kay. I'm almost caught up on my reading. Sorry everyone. So much has happened in these past 15 chapters. I should be good for tomorrow.
Not a problem, Lisarenee! You do
so
much. :)
Questions for Chapter 56 (Theon) – Chapter 59 (Tyrion)138. “They gave me no choice.” That seems to be Theon’s mantra. Are you in agreement? I kept remembering him kicking that severed head around like a ball at the beginning of A Game of Thrones in comparison to (finally) beheading Farlen. He’s finding the “glory” of being Prince of Winterfell is in reality more “gory” than his conscience can handle. Are you feeling any sympathy for him?
I don't agree that he has no choice, and I feel no sympathy for him at all. I am looking forward to the day he is punished and/or slain.
139. Who do you like better by the end of chapter 56, Theon, or his sister, Asha?
Asha
SPOILER QUESTION COMING!
140. Where you surprised Theon had not killed Bran and Rickon? What are his reasonings for letting everyone think they are dead? Is compassion any part of them?
I kept hoping they were not dead and was formulating theories. Glad they really weren't killed. Perhaps Theon thinks they will take him more seriously, knowing he will kill those who defy him. I don't think he has an ounce of compassion. He has a huge ego and a sense of entitlement. I believe he doesn't know where Bran and Rickon are and he's trying to save face.
141. When she is with King Joffrey, do you love Sansa’s internal dialogue as much as me?
Yes, completely! I really love how she has grown up and the scales have dropped from her eyes in regard to Joff.
142. The coming battle seems to have extinguished the “mob” mentality. When Sansa was among the singing crowd of the sept, were you at all afraid for her?
Yes, afraid for all of them barricaded in the hall.
143. The Queen Regent Cersei (who dressed for the occasion) told Sansa that Ser Ilyn is there for protection. Is this really the case, or is he there to behead someone else? Sansa’s would prefer the Hound to protect her. Comments?
I do think he's here for protection, but it wouldn't surprise me if he has standing orders to behead certain people in the event of XXX (insert event) happening. Something like a contingency plan. Sansa trusts the Hound and knows he is capable of protecting her. I liked how she prayed for him.
144. Besides the obvious “B” word, what is another I’m looking for to describe Queen Regent Cersei’s comments and attitude toward Sansa? Patronizing?
Cersei thinks Sansa is a naive little fool, and in some ways she still is. I think Cersei may be a little envious at her naivete. Cersei knows that she is (probably) about to be captured or killed and she doesn't know how to prepare for that.
145. What were you thoughts on the battle at Blackwater Bay/Kings Landing? Interesting? Were you able to keep all the ships straight and which side they were on?
No, it was confusing! I had the feeling it was a trap, though. Interesting that both sides' ships were trapped.
146. Finally, we know what Tyrion’s chains were for! (I thought they would keep the ships out of the harbor, not trap them in.) Was this a clever plan?
Yes, it was a very clever plan. They didn't see it coming.
147. After the last time, I was surprised to see Davos still alive for this chapter (I’ve quit looking for chapter names for a while). Think he’ll survive this one? Will the resourceful old pirate, Salladhor Saan, and his proud Valyrian, save Davos?
I hope he does survive, but the odds are against it.
I wonder if this will make Stannis ensure he brings Melisandre to future battles?
148. “Mother promised I could have the Whores.” Were you remembering the little piss ant King Joffrey, the rabbits, and his new crossbow when he made this sulking statement?
No, I wasn't sure what he was talking about. Also, if he's king why does he need permission from Mother to have anything?
149. Were you surprised at Sandor Clegane's refusal to return to battle? What about Tyrion; were you impressed? Did he have any other choice? Will he be successful?
Yes, I was VERY surprised that the Hound refused. I was impressed with Tyrion and I don't think he had another choice. I am afraid he will not be successful, though, unless the mountain people come to his aid.
Sandy wrote:I do think he's here for protection, but it wouldn't surprise me if he has standing orders to behead certain people in the event of XXX (insert event) happening. Something like a contingency plan.
That's what I was thinking too. It's very much something Cersei would plan out ahead of time.
Also, if he's king why does he need permission from Mother to have anything?
Joff hasn't come of age yet, that's why Cersei is the Queen Regent. She's ruling, not Joff. But when Joff is 16 (I think is the age) that's when he doesn't have to listen to her anymore. Also, he's a mama's boy.
Answers to Questions for Chapter 56 (Theon) – Chapter 59 (Tyrion)138. “They gave me no choice.” That seems to be Theon’s mantra. Are you in agreement? I kept remembering him kicking that severed head around like a ball at the beginning of A Game of Thrones in comparison to (finally) beheading Farlen. He’s finding the “glory” of being Prince of Winterfell is in reality more “gory” than his conscience can handle. Are you feeling any sympathy for him?
I think I'm probably one of the only people who does feel sympathy for him. This is where I become really torn about Theon! On the one hand, he totally did the wrong thing. But on the other, he took Winterfell because he loved it there. I think he thought he would find a place to belong because he discovered the Iron Islands were not home for him anymore.
139. Who do you like better by the end of chapter 56, Theon, or his sister, Asha?
I like them both in this chapter. You can see Theon’s plans all falling apart and he doesn’t know how to fix it. But Asha has a point that he never should have killed the kids.
SPOILER QUESTION COMING!
140. Where you surprised Theon had not killed Bran and Rickon? What are his reasonings for letting everyone think they are dead? Is compassion any part of them?
I was relieved. I had such a hard time thinking about him actually killing the boys. I was so confused throughout the whole chapter too because the pieces were there, but I couldn’t put them together for some reason. Like the direwolf pin that Theon pulls out of the fire. It’s the same one Reek had in his bag and Theon felt at the end of his last chapter. And I recognized that, but for some reason I didn't realize what it meant. And Theon was thinking about dressing the boys. I was so confused about why he had to dress them.
I think there is compassion there. I think Theon is glad he didn’t actually have to kill Bran and Rickon, but he managed to make everyone think he did. And, I can’t remember if this is from this chapter or the next Theon, so I’ll put it behind a spoiler cut to be safe (view spoiler)
141. When she is with King Joffrey, do you love Sansa’s internal dialogue as much as me?
I like to see how much Sansa has changed. Internally, I feel like she’s becoming more Arya-like.
142. The coming battle seems to have extinguished the “mob” mentality. When Sansa was among the singing crowd of the sept, were you at all afraid for her?
I’m always afraid for Sansa! But I keep telling myself she’s lasted this long in the lion’s lair, surely she’ll be fine. Maybe I'm in denial.
143. The Queen Regent Cersei (who dressed for the occasion) told Sansa that Ser Ilyn is there for protection. Is this really the case, or is he there to behead someone else? Sansa’s would prefer the Hound to protect her. Comments?
I think Sansa’s preference for the Hound makes sense. He still scares the crap out of her, but he’s the monster she knows. The Hound has helped her out a little, whereas Ilyn Payne will always be the man who beheaded her father. I think Cersei likes to keep Ilyn around just in case. He’s loyal to her, he can’t tell any secrets he hears and I think she likes that.
144. Besides the obvious “B” word, what is another I’m looking for to describe Queen Regent Cersei’s comments and attitude toward Sansa? Patronizing?
Cersei always reminds me of the mean girl in school who says things in a sickly sweet voice but they’re really insults. She is patronizing and she’s also putting on a show I feel like for the others in the hall.
145. What were you thoughts on the battle at Blackwater Bay/Kings Landing? Interesting? Were you able to keep all the ships straight and which side they were on?
I don’t like to read about battles to begin with and the fact that this one was on the water made it even worse. I skimmed most of this.
146. Finally, we know what Tyrion’s chains were for! (I thought they would keep the ships out of the harbor, not trap them in.) Was this a clever plan?
Super clever. It wasn’t enough to just keep them out, because then Stannis still has those ships and men at his disposal.
147. After the last time, I was surprised to see Davos still alive for this chapter (I’ve quit looking for chapter names for a while). Think he’ll survive this one? Will the resourceful old pirate, Salladhor Saan, and his proud Valyrian, save Davos?
I didn’t think Davos would last nearly as long as he did. For some reason I thought his only purpose was to give us like two chapters from Stannis and that would be all. I think he's proving to be more important than I had initially thought.
148. “Mother promised I could have the Whores.” Were you remembering the little piss ant King Joffrey, the rabbits, and his new crossbow when he made this sulking statement?
He’s such a cruel child. It makes me think about that beautiful sword (that Arya threw in the river! Take that!). He's given anything he wants, but he was never taught how to play nice with his toys.
149. Were you surprised at Sandor Clegane's refusal to return to battle? What about Tyrion; were you impressed? Did he have any other choice? Will he be successful?
I was surprised because the Hound seems to be unflappable, but it made sense with all the fire. I don’t like the times when Tyrion steps up and is a fighter. It’s not believable to me. Especially since when Catelyn was taking him to the Vale and they were attacked, Tyrion mentions that that was his first time really fighting. And suddenly he’s the pro at it and he’s a master at maneuvering troops. I don’t buy it.
Laura wrote: "Answers to Questions for Chapter 56 (Theon) – Chapter 59 (Tyrion)138. “They gave me no choice.” That seems to be Theon’s mantra. Are you in agreement? I kept remembering him kicking that severed ..."
Laura, excellent point about not putting the bodies in the crypt...I had forgotten about that!
Oh good, that was this chapter. I finished the book a while ago and don't have it near me, so I keep having trouble remembering which chapter things happen!
@Sandy#143 "...he has standing orders to behead certain people in the event of XXX (insert event) happening..."
Interesting. I like that theory.
#145 - I kind of gave a big sigh when reading all the ships names, and thought, "Ugh!" But I was surprised at how interesting the battle was; it held my attention. Like the battle scene with Tyrion in A Game of Thrones, I couldn't believe how fast I read through it.
#146 - I thought it clever too; however, I'm wondering if others will say the price of losing all those ships was too high.
#147 - "...will make Stannis ensure he brings Melisandre to future battles?..."
I'm wondering the same thing.
#148 - I'm not sure who the "Whores" (with a captial "W") are either. I'll have to go back, b/c I think they were mentioned b/f.
#149 - I think Martin was trying to show, not only the Hound's fear of fire - which I think he faced, but how really terrible the fighting was.
@Laura#138 - You are not alone in you sympathy for Theon. Granted, I don't have as much as I did; but, I think he really is a "split" person, between a rock and a hard place, even if by his own design. I was expecting his father to take Winterfell, so I'm seeing waiting to see the upshot of him finding out about Prince Theon!
#139 - I dislike them both equally.
#140 - I do think Theon replaced B&R bodies b/c he wanted to save face; nevertheless, I also think he didn't want to hunt them down and kill them. Ditto with putting the other bodies in the crypt (it was in this chapter); I think you are right about his reasons for not doing so. However, this is going to bite him in the butt as those heads on those spikes is NOT a good thing. He is such a complex character, but he has too much ego.
#141 - :)
#143 - Well, he certainly scares the crap out of me, too! Like Sandy, I liked that Sansa prayed for him. (Which really confuses me, LOL!)
#149 - Ahh... we disagree; I'm buying it. :)
Now I'm not entirely sure, but weren't the Whores those three things they built to throw the wildefire pots out onto the ships in the bay?
Laura wrote: "Now I'm not entirely sure, but weren't the Whores those three things they built to throw the wildefire pots out onto the ships in the bay?"Ahh... maybe. Thanks, Laura. I'll check. I actually have some little arrow post-it notes, in multiple colors, I keep meaning to use. But, I have this image of every page marked with one, LOL!
I added the previous questions to the first few posts. Now I'll start writing my questions for Chapters 60 - 63. Then I'll go back and answer previous questions.
Questions for Chapter 60 (Sansa) - Chapter 63 (Daenerys)150. Well, we get a glimpse at what makes Cersei tick and it ain't pretty. Why was she giving Sansa all that advice if she knew she'd never be queen?
151. Do you think Tyrion will survive and, if so, in what shape? The story would be so boring without him.
152. Should Sansa have gone with the Hound?
153. Why do I get the feeling Sansa should stay away from Ser Dontos.
154. Do you believe Stannis is dead and do you believe that both Cersei and Joffrey survived? It sounded like she was about to kill herself. I just can't see this as the end to Cersei, Joffrey, and Sansa. What would be left to the story?
155. Where the heck is Robb? Is he dead?
156. Daenerys looks to be in prime position to take over her rightful place as Queen. What do you think?
157. Darn! I was hoping to know what the Song of Ice and Fire was. Could it mean a uniting of Robb (ice) with Daenerys (fire)?
Lisarenee's answers to Lisa Kay’s Questions for Chapter 48 (Daenerys) – Chapter 51 (Jon)114. What is significant in the name “House of the Undying Ones”? Why does Xaro Xhoam Daxos refer to it as the “Palace of Dust”? What do we know really about Pyat Pree, other than he’s a warlock? And why in H-E-Double-Hockey-Sticks did Dany go in there? Good gravy beans! At least she had Drogon with her. Whew!
I have no idea about any of those questions, but I think Dany was searching for knowledge in whatever form she could find. This time she should have been more cautious. She seems awfully gullible and too trusting.
115. Was Dany seeing the past, the future, or both? Did anyone else feel inclined to bookmark pages 705-706 to see if they will come true?
• three fires must you light... (life, death, love)
• Three mounts must you ride... (to bed, to dread, to love)
• Three treasons will you know... (blood, gold, love)
Ahhh… There are three of them; has any part of them already come true?
I think she was seeing the past present and future all in one. I'm still betting she and Robb will end up together. It was confusing to figure out what could be what.
116. Okay, I’m lost. Where is Tyrion sending Shagga and his clansmen off to? The kingswood? Why?
I thought somewhere to fight.
117. Is it just me, or is Tyrion having a bit of personality change? Where are all his funny quips? Now they seem bitter.
He's a little down it would appear and not on top of his game. Probably tired of all that goes on.
118. Though he tries to shrug it off, it seems as if Tyrion respected Winterfell and a part of him is sad to see its fall out of Stark hands. Does this bode well for any Starks in the future?
I think Cersei will not let them live if they turn out to be the winners.
119. “Ser Osmund is as loyal as he is brave…” Queen Regent Cersei told King Joffrey, and internally, Tyrion agreed. But doesn’t Osmund’s disloyalty work both ways? Could this come back to bite Tyrion in the butt?
Anything can happen in this book and it usually does. Trust no one.
120. Hallyne the Pyromancer – does anyone else think he could be someone else in disguise? He did ask about the proximity of any dragons to explain the increase in wildfire…
Hmmm.... now you've got me wondering.
121. Speaking of dragons, how come no one (seemly) in the Seven Kingdoms knows Dany has three dragons now? I would have expected this news to spread far and wide. (Her pregnancy sure did!)
Very strange.
122. Do you think any (or all) of the castle folk of Winterfell helped Bran, Rickon, and the rest escape or were they just as astonished as Theon? Will Theon ever have the loyalty of the people of Winterfell or is he doomed in this regard?
No one likes Theon. I think everyone had a hand in the escape.
123. Were you pretty sure Osha would help Bran and Rickon, even after pledging to Theon, or did it come as a complete surprise?
I was not sure. Bran was very upset when she pledged allegiance to Theon.
124. How did Bran, Rickon and the others elude Theon? Where are they anyway?
No clue.
125. Was there any truth to Ygritte’s tale of Bael/Sygerrik and Brandon the Daughterless? Or did she just know the right button to push?
No clue, but I wish I had one.
126. Were you pleased that Jon Snow showed compassion with Ygritte? Will this be detrimental or fortuitous in the future?
I was, but I think it will bite him in the butt in the future.
Lisarenee's answers to Sandy's Questions for Chapter 52 (Sansa) through Chapter 55 (Catelyn)127. Do you see a way out for Sansa? I get the impression Dontos doesn’t really have a plan, even though he keeps reassuring her.
I think he wants something more because he seems to like kissing her. I don't like him.
128. What do you think about Sansa’s interaction with the Hound? For all his ferocity, I don’t think he would seriously hurt her. Then again, do you think he would if Joffrey commanded it?
He's a questionable one. Very hard to read.
129. Do you think that Cersei no longer expects Sansa to marry Joffrey? It sounds to me like she is almost resigned to Stannis winning the war. Does anyone else find it weird that Jaime was determined to be with Cersei in her birthing room? It felt like she was practically admitting an unnatural relationship with her twin.
I agree it seems an admission.
130. Did you think Jon would be “in trouble” for letting the Wildling go free? I was relieved at Qhorin’s response.
So was I. It was unexpected.
131. Another mind-meld here, Jon and Ghost? The weirwood he sees has his brother’s face with three eyes. When he senses death, did you think at this point that Bran might be dead? I did! Do you think Ghost will heal?
I don't know but yes, I thought Bran dead. I don't know about Ghost, but I hope he lives.
132. Many times in this novel we learn of events after they’ve already happened. As the mother of a 4-year-old boy and a 7-year-old girl, I had to put down my Nook in disgust when I learned that Bran and Rickon had been murdered by Theon. Did you feel rage toward Theon and the author? I sure did! Tyrion seems more upset than Cersei, who I felt was pretty blasé about it.
I also had to keep the hope that the news was false to continue reading without complete outrange. The last chapter is Bran’s, so is this ghost Bran? Perhaps “Direwolf Bran”? Is Bran really dead??
I thought this such a strange thing. Why did he do that? I just kept thinking it was odd. Did he not wish to show violence to children, but didn't he already? This is very strange.
133. Did you know the “little whore” that Cersei had taken was not really Shae? Do you believe Tyrion will make good on his promise to hurt Cersei?
I thought she had Shae. Was totally shocke when she didn't.
134. How in the world is Catelyn able to keep the news about Bran and Rickon to herself? (Here is another theory of mine: Bran/Rickon changed clothes with Jojen and Meera, and that is who was actually murdered! Ages don’t match, but still…. I am in complete denial here.)
I know you can't help wishing. It's one of those things where you don't believe it till you see it or, in this case, read it. I'm in total denial as well.
135. Were you surprised Jaime admitted to throwing Bran off the tower? I was, especially considering he’s chained and helpless.
I think he's just that stupid.
136. So….who sent the assassin after Bran with the knife?? Will we ever find out?
I'm betting Jaime and Cersei.
137. Ooooooh, what will Catelyn do with Brienne’s sword?
Kill the Sisterf@cker. *slaps self for being bad*
Questions for Chapter 56 (Theon) – Chapter 59 (Tyrion)
138. “They gave me no choice.” That seems to be Theon’s mantra. Are you in agreement? I kept remembering him kicking that severed head around like a ball at the beginning of A Game of Thrones in comparison to (finally) beheading Farlen. He’s finding the “glory” of being Prince of Winterfell is in reality more “gory” than his conscience can handle. Are you feeling any sympathy for him?
I can't find any sympathy for him. He's a spoiled brat and he deserves what he gets. Hopefully what he deserves is yet to come.
139. Who do you like better by the end of chapter 56, Theon, or his sister, Asha?
I still like Asha.
SPOILER QUESTION COMING!
140. Where you surprised Theon had not killed Bran and Rickon? What are his reasonings for letting everyone think they are dead? Is compassion any part of them?
I think he didn't want to be humiliated. Plus, maybe he couldn't have killed them.
141. When she is with King Joffrey, do you love Sansa’s internal dialogue as much as me?
I do.
142. The coming battle seems to have extinguished the “mob” mentality. When Sansa was among the singing crowd of the sept, were you at all afraid for her?
Heck yes.
143. The Queen Regent Cersei (who dressed for the occasion) told Sansa that Ser Ilyn is there for protection. Is this really the case, or is he there to behead someone else? Sansa’s would prefer the Hound to protect her. Comments?
Not a clue at this point why Ser Ilyn was there. I would want the Hound too.
144. Besides the obvious “B” word, what is another I’m looking for to describe Queen Regent Cersei’s comments and attitude toward Sansa? Patronizing?
I can't think of a word. She still thinks Sansa is stupid, but she is so young.
145. What were you thoughts on the battle at Blackwater Bay/Kings Landing? Interesting? Were you able to keep all the ships straight and which side they were on?
I was able to. The chain. I would never have thought of that.
146. Finally, we know what Tyrion’s chains were for! (I thought they would keep the ships out of the harbor, not trap them in.) Was this a clever plan?
Yep, but it also got rid of Joffrey's ships and men as well.
147. After the last time, I was surprised to see Davos still alive for this chapter (I’ve quit looking for chapter names for a while). Think he’ll survive this one? Will the resourceful old pirate, Salladhor Saan, and his proud Valyrian, save Davos?
No clue. I hope he survives. I think we didn't get enough of him.
148. “Mother promised I could have the Whores.” Were you remembering the little piss ant King Joffrey, the rabbits, and his new crossbow when he made this sulking statement?
He is repellant.
149. Were you surprised at Sandor Clegane's refusal to return to battle? What about Tyrion; were you impressed? Did he have any other choice? Will he be successful?
I was surprised by Clegane. We'll have to wait and see about Tyrion.
Lisarenee, I'm going to respond to your answers in more detail later, but I just had to say: #137 - FOFLMAO!
My Answers to Lisarenee’s Questions for Chapter 60 (Sansa) - Chapter 63 (Daenerys) 150. Well, we get a glimpse at what makes Cersei tick and it ain't pretty. Why was she giving Sansa all that advice if she knew she'd never be queen?
I was pretty sick of all her whining about not having a sword when she was little; I kept comparing her to Arya. Cersei sure learned her “lessons” well; she’s lethal even if she didn’t have a sword. Why all the advice? She is just Queen B!tch of the Universe. Actually, she turns my stomach. I find it hard to find even one redeeming quality about her.
151. Do you think Tyrion will survive and, if so, in what shape? The story would be so boring without him.
I think he will survive. However, I don’t know what shape he’ll be in. Wow! I wonder if he’ll have amnesia, LOL! Definitely – too boring w/o him! However, I don’t think any lasting harm will come to him; if Martin kills off all the best characters, I’d think he’d lose a lot of his readers.
152. Should Sansa have gone with the Hound?
There for a minute, I was thinking she should have. What was that all about anyway; think the Hound is in love with Sansa? I do. Has he finally cracked, or will he show up again stronger than b/f? I’m thinking he’ll be back.
153. Why do I get the feeling Sansa should stay away from Ser Dontos.
‘Cause he’s a creep-oid? And why was he telling Sansa that “Lord Renly” came and saved the day? Huh? WTH? Has he lost his marbles? Isn’t King Renly dead? Or do we have more black magic afoot?
154. Do you believe Stannis is dead and do you believe that both Cersei and Joffrey survived? It sounded like she was about to kill herself. I just can't see this as the end to Cersei, Joffrey, and Sansa. What would be left to the story?
Nope. I don’t think King Stannis is dead. Yes, hard to believe C&J both made it. I was pretty sure she would have killed herself; alcohol and swords don’t mix. I would love for it to be the end of them both; alas, I fear we have much more to come…
155. Where the heck is Robb? Is he dead?
I don’t know what King Robb is off doing. I don’t think he is dead. But I haven’t heard about any more battles he’s won. When is he going to show up at Winterfell?!
156. Daenerys looks to be in prime position to take over her rightful place as Queen. What do you think?
Yeah! She’s finally getting her ships. She's getting closer. :)
157. Darn! I was hoping to know what the Song of Ice and Fire was. Could it mean a uniting of Robb (ice) with Daenerys (fire)?
I know! Tell us already. I’m thinking Jon Snow (ice) and Daenerys (fire).
Lisarenee, I'll do today's questions.
Lisa Kay’s Questions for Chapter 64 (Arya) – Chapter 67 (Tyrion) 158. It sure seems as if Harrenhal is unlucky for those who rule there. I can’t really blame Arya for wanting out of that place. Think it is haunted, or jinked, or something? What does this foretell for Littlefinger? (If he ever gets to own it.)
159. Did you ache just a little for Arya when she grieved for her brothers? Do you think that was really Lord Stark, Arya’s father, talking to her in the godswood?
160. Is Arya going to be a “skinchanger” like Bran? Will all the Stark children be able to do this?
161. Gendry and Hot Pie seemed pretty unhappy with Arya; were you surprised they went with her? Clever Arya, taking those maps; think they’ll come in handy for something other than finding her way to a safe place? BTW, will she really go to Riverun?
162. Did you think Arya had it in her to kill that guard? Think the coin had anything to do with it?
163. Was King Joffrey’s whole wimpy “Mother!” court scene too, too pathetic, or what? At least Sansa’s has a sense of humor. Nevertheless, what ever will they do with her now?
164. Okay, just who is Ser Dontos? What’s with the hair net for Sansa? And there is that city again, Asshai!
165. Okay, I’m pretty sick of Theon, but I think Winterfell just fell into worse hands than his. Was that a surprise that made perfect sense in hindsight?
166. Tyrion wasn’t quite an amnesiac, but the milk of the poppy was making him have some strange dreams. Any new revelations there for you?
167. Will Shae still want to be with Tyrion once she sees the extent of his injuries?
168. BTW, who do you think found Tyrion down in the cellar?
169. Who do you think assigned Ser Mandon to kill Tyrion? If it was Cersei, and Jaime makes it back to King’s Landing alive, it will sure make for an interesting dialogue to see whose side he takes.
170. Methinks Tyrion is in deep poop, and I don’t just mean his injuries. What do you think? How about his father taking over as the Hand?
Lisarenee's answeres to Lisa Kay’s Questions for Chapter 64 (Arya) – Chapter 67 (Tyrion)158. It sure seems as if Harrenhal is unlucky for those who rule there. I can’t really blame Arya for wanting out of that place. Think it is haunted, or jinked, or something? What does this foretell for Littlefinger? (If he ever gets to own it.)
It is looking that way. Everyone keeps dying. Perhaps it is cursed. I think Littlefinger will die. I don't see the Lannisters as being the last ones standing. That means all who are working under them will fall as well.
159. Did you ache just a little for Arya when she grieved for her brothers? Do you think that was really Lord Stark, Arya’s father, talking to her in the godswood?
Yes. She can't express her grief. At least she knows not to go to Winterfall. Would have been bad if she headed there.
160. Is Arya going to be a “skinchanger” like Bran? Will all the Stark children be able to do this?
Could be. As they get closer to Winter it seems the bonds are getting stronger.
161. Gendry and Hot Pie seemed pretty unhappy with Arya; were you surprised they went with her? Clever Arya, taking those maps; think they’ll come in handy for something other than finding her way to a safe place? BTW, will she really go to Riverun?
I was surprised they went with her, but she wasn't. Ayra is clever. She knew things would get bad and she knew how to manipulate the guys. I'm guessing she'll try to find Robb. I think she wants to fight.
162. Did you think Arya had it in her to kill that guard? Think the coin had anything to do with it?
I think she knows the stakes. It's either them or her. She chose herself. She sort of worked up to it by letting Jaquen kill the other men. Plus, she did kill the one boy early on. It wasn't her first taste of blood.
163. Was King Joffrey’s whole wimpy “Mother!” court scene too, too pathetic, or what? At least Sansa’s has a sense of humor. Nevertheless, what ever will they do with her now?
I really dislike Joffrey.
164. Okay, just who is Ser Dontos? What’s with the hair net for Sansa? And there is that city again, Asshai!
I haven't a clue.
165. Okay, I’m pretty sick of Theon, but I think Winterfell just fell into worse hands than his. Was that a surprise that made perfect sense in hindsight?
I agree and in hindsight it's not surprising.
166. Tyrion wasn’t quite an amnesiac, but the milk of the poppy was making him have some strange dreams. Any new revelations there for you?
I think he's not convinced his wife was a whore. I think he still loves her.
I think Shae will end up with Tyrions father. He'll discipline him for going against his wishes where she is concerned.
168. BTW, who do you think found Tyrion down in the cellar?
He said the voice sounded like Pod. So maybe it was him.
169. Who do you think assigned Ser Mandon to kill Tyrion? If it was Cersei, and Jaime makes it back to King’s Landing alive, it will sure make for an interesting dialogue to see whose side he takes.
170. Methinks Tyrion is in deep poop, and I don’t just mean his injuries. What do you think? How about his father taking over as the Hand?
I have no idea how everyone will react to him. Was destroying all the ships going a bit too far? Why didn't he know his father was coming?
Answers to Questions for Chapter 60 (Sansa) - Chapter 63 (Daenerys)1. Well, we get a glimpse at what makes Cersei tick and it ain't pretty. Why was she giving Sansa all that advice if she knew she'd never be queen?
Maybe because she’s just cruel like that. I think she also just likes to impress people and Sansa isn’t exactly going to run off and do anything.
It’s funny; I think Cersei realizes that Sansa would have been a good queen for Joffrey (even if Cersei didn’t particularly like Sansa and thought she was weak). Sansa wouldn’t have been demanding, she wouldn’t have been scheming and she would have listened to whatever Joffrey and Cersei said and supported them. She was going to be the perfect little bride. Killing Ned Stark and making enemies of the Starks also ruined that.
2. Do you think Tyrion will survive and, if so, in what shape? The story would be so boring without him.
I suppose the story would be boring without him. I was never a huge fan of Tyrion. He’s interesting, but I thought there was entirely too much of him in this book.
3. Should Sansa have gone with the Hound?
I vote YES. I understand why she was afraid to go with him, but if I was Sansa, I would jump at any chance to get the hell away from King’s Landing. And everyone’s going to be so distracted for the next few hours. It’s the perfect chance. Plus, I think if I had the option of putting myself in the Hounds hands (who has helped me in the past and has shown he can be kind in his own way) and Dontos (who is drunk all the time), I would definitely choose the Hound.
4. Why do I get the feeling Sansa should stay away from Ser Dontos.
He’s drunk and he’s a fool. I don’t think him trustworthy. But also, Sansa can never know if someone is secretly working for Cersei. With the Hound, you know what you’re getting. He never tries to be sneaky or play games.
5. Do you believe Stannis is dead and do you believe that both Cersei and Joffrey survived? It sounded like she was about to kill herself. I just can't see this as the end to Cersei, Joffrey, and Sansa. What would be left to the story?
That many taken out in one blow? That wouldn’t happen. Cersei is going to plague everyone until the very end I think. She’s just too tricky and cruel.
6. Where the heck is Robb? Is he dead?
Off fighting. One of the reasons why I think we should get get a random chapter every once in a while from him is just so we can know what’s happening.
7. Daenerys looks to be in prime position to take over her rightful place as Queen. What do you think?
She does, but I still think she has too much ahead of her. She still needs to get there for starters.
8. Darn! I was hoping to know what the Song of Ice and Fire was. Could it mean a uniting of Robb (ice) with Daenerys (fire)?
I think Ice is referencing the seasons. It’s slowly turning to autumn and I think winter will be here soon and it will be a rough one. I think there will still be lots of fighting going on at that point.
Is Robb really ice? I would think the Wall and beyond a better representation of ice. Dany and her dragons are definitely the fire though. Perhaps ice and fire simply refer to a coming fight between the white walkers and Dany or that Westeros will have to come together to fend off the two of them.
Nothing But Reading Challenges
Books mentioned in this topic
A Dance with Dragons (other topics)A Game of Thrones (other topics)
A Game of Thrones (other topics)
A Game of Thrones (other topics)
Honor's Splendour (other topics)
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114. What is significant in the name “House of the Undying Ones”? Why does Xaro Xhoam Daxos refer to it as the “Palace of Dust”? What do we know really about Pyat Pree, other than he’s a warlock? And why in H-E-Double-Hockey-Sticks did Dany go in there? Good gravy beans! At least she had Drogon with her. Whew!
115. Was Dany seeing the past, the future, or both? Did anyone else feel inclined to bookmark pages 705-706 to see if they will come true?Ahhh… There are three of them; has any part of them already come true?
116. Okay, I’m lost. Where is Tyrion sending Shagga and his clansmen off to? The kingswood? Why?
117. Is it just me, or is Tyrion having a bit of personality change? Where are all his funny quips? Now they seem bitter.
118. Though he tries to shrug it off, it seems as if Tyrion respected Winterfell and a part of him is sad to see its fall out of Stark hands. Does this bode well for any Starks in the future?
119. “Ser Osmund is as loyal as he is brave…” Queen Regent Cersei told King Joffrey, and internally, Tyrion agreed. But doesn’t Osmund’s disloyalty work both ways? Could this come back to bite Tyrion in the butt?
120. Hallyne the Pyromancer – does anyone else think he could be someone else in disguise? He did ask about the proximity of any dragons to explain the increase in wildfire…
121. Speaking of dragons, how come no one (seemly) in the Seven Kingdoms knows Dany has three dragons now? I would have expected this news to spread far and wide. (Her pregnancy sure did!)
122. Do you think any (or all) of the castle folk of Winterfell helped Bran, Rickon, and the rest escape or were they just as astonished as Theon? Will Theon ever have the loyalty of the people of Winterfell or is he doomed in this regard?
123. Were you pretty sure Osha would help Bran and Rickon, even after pledging to Theon, or did it come as a complete surprise?
124. How did Bran, Rickon and the others elude Theon? Where are they anyway?
125. Was there any truth to Ygritte’s tale of Bael/Sygerrik and Brandon the Daughterless? Or did she just know the right button to push?
126. Were you pleased that Jon Snow showed compassion with Ygritte? Will this be detrimental or fortuitous in the future?