Atlas Shrugged *chunky read*

[Laura]

That didn't make sense. It's BECAUSE her life is so shallow that she DOES care more about her social standing than her happiness. It's almost like she's so shallow that she can't appreciate true happiness (or really, anything that is real & true).

[Rachelle]

Exactly! Although I think that happens just as much now as it did back then. Smoke and mirrors are more important than true inner beauty or personal happiness.
Lillian is willing to overlook obsessive work hours and an affair to remain a happily married persona. Although it sounds as though theirs was not ever a happy marriage, maybe both married because it was the right thing to do?

[Laura]

The only thing is I'm not so sure she knows there's an affair going on. I just think she knows that he's absent more often. I don't think she's completely put it all together at this point.

Or maybe she has and she doesn't want to fully admit it to herself yet?

Yeah, I can't really come to terms with why these two married. He took her on a tour of the mill and she seemed interested and then he asked her to marry him the next day, but ... I don't get it. Unless socially it was the perfect match for her?

[Laura]

What was he really getting out of it?

[Rachelle]

Maybe the stability factor. He could be perceived as a fine upstanding businessman with a wife at home doing the proper entertaining instead of a shiftless bachelor with no ties?

[Nancy]

Good morning all! Up and at 'em early! I think she knows about the affair. I think she married him for his brilliance and what it would bring to her financial well-being not just social status. She and his family are parasites. I don't know why he stays in the marriage except as you say divorce wasn't socially as acceptable. And I think he is somewhat emotionally immature.

[Laura]

Rachelle wrote: "Maybe the stability factor. He could be perceived as a fine upstanding businessman with a wife at home doing the proper entertaining instead of a shiftless bachelor with no ties?"

True.

[Laura]

Nancy wrote: "Good morning all! Up and at 'em early! I think she knows about the affair. I think she married him for his brilliance and what it would bring to her financial well-being. She and his family are pa..."

Nancy, where are you in the book?

[Nancy]

Finishing up chapter 10 - but I don't care if you are discussing ahead - I am not going to be able to keep up. School starts workshops Aug. 9 and I have after school musical rehearsals starting right away - plus two church jobs... I'm going to slow down and lurk!

[Laura]

OK, talk to me when you get to part 2, chapter 2. I'm blown away......

[Marialyce]

I also think the $$$ thing might play a factor in it although Hank could probably buy her off. She seems very concerned with having a position and lots of things money can buy. She seems to covet things for example the diamond bracelet that Dagney wears to the party.

Some women don't mind what their husbands do as long as he continues to bring home lots of money.

[Nancy]

You guys need to stay on schedule and discuss what's current - If I'm not keeping up I can choose not to read the posts that far. Dont' worry, I'm a big girl!!

[Laura]

Marialyce wrote: "I also think the $$$ thing might play a factor in it although Hank could probably buy her off. She seems very concerned with having a position and lots of things money can buy. She seems to covet t..."

True, but I think she had all the money she needed to begin with. Of course, greed can be bottomless, so maybe she wanted more. But it was probably more of a social "perfect match" for her more than anything else. Maybe she's too shallow to feel real love for anyone, so in absence of that, marry a good-lucking guy w/money.

[Laura]

Nancy wrote: "You guys need to stay on schedule and discuss what's current - If I'm not keeping up I can choose not to read the posts that far. Dont' worry, I'm a big girl!!"

I may wind up reading ahead Nancy, I can't seem to put this book down. So at some point I'm going to have to stop discussing here and wait. *biting nails*

[Nancy]

LOL Laura - I hear you - I can't put it down, just not enough free hours in the day. Speaking of which... getting the butt in gear.

[Marialyce]

Nancy, I think we were talking about what happened in Chapter 10. I am only up to Part 2 Chapter 1. Aren't we suppose to be up to that point?

[Meg]

OK about Lillian. If you remember there is a part where everyone is talking about how they think he is having an affair with Dagny. she laughs it off and says it doesn't match his personality at all. I think Lillian just wants a meal ticket, and that is what he is to her. I think also she wants to protect herself and is snooping around just in case there might be some truth to the rumor she laughed at.

I am a little slow on the reading because I had to go to my mother's fix her computer and then teach her how to use it. I am leaving in a few hours and then I will be able to devote time to my reading. Frustrating that I cannot do it but I will be there very shortly. Just caught up to our schedule but not into this week's reading yet.

[Nancy]

Ditto Meg. i thought that was an interesting comment back a few chapters. That is didn't match his personality. His focus is business and perhaps that's why his desire is connected to that. Maybe she's not so far off after all. I agree, think she's checking in because she's sensed changes and is suspicious.

[Laura]

I wish I could remember which chapter they talked about him musing about why she married him. She had money, family money, so I don't think that was purely it.

[Rachelle]

Early, chapter two I think when we first met Lillian I think he sat and mused about what he felt for her and why they got married in the first place.

[Laura]

I think the only reason she's worried about their marriage is for the the social status being attached to him brings. I think he needs a woman like Dagny or someone who appreciates business at the level he does to really understand what makes him tick.

[Laura]

Lillian annoys me, but the parts with she and Rearden together intrigue me the most at this point.

[Marialyce]

They seem to be laying a cat and mouse type game.

[Meg]

The plot is thickening. Remember that Reardon was feeling guilty about the whole Dagny situation.

[Laura]

Please, he'd have to be a TOTAL robot not to feel guilty. I don't know why he doesn't ditch Lil the Pill. lol.

Oh it's thickening! What chapter are you on Meg? I have a feeling you'll be busting ahead this week!

[Meg]

Just Chapter 1 in book two, but tonight is definitely a reading night, as soon as I unpack and clean up a bit. Oh, and of course, sending a thank you to my secret admirer LOL!

[Marialyce]

Same spot I am at, Meg.

Laura, I do think he is robotic like. He says he doesn't love Dagney, he just wants to possess her. He is a scary dude.

[Laura]

You know but in his way I think he does love her. I think he's stunned at his ability to feel something for a person, and not his Profit & Loss statement lol.

Remember this is written by a Russian, so ... maybe the robot-ness comes from that? Because in a way he doesn't seem human.

But if you were married to Lil the Pill, and your business, you might be a bit inclined to skip the emotions too. She's always demeaning him in public, she's horrible! I wouldn't do that to my husband even if we weren't that close. It makes her look as bad or worse than she's trying to make him appear.

[Marialyce]

Do you, Laura? I feel he wants to own her just like he owns everyone else including the lovely Lil and of course Dagney is going right along with it. Dagney seems to like men who take control of her. (including Francisco)

I seem to want something sinister to happen to Lovely Lil. I also want to see what Francisco is up to.

[Laura]

I do think he loves her as much as he's capable of loving anyone. But I'm into chapter 3 and


****************spoilers Part 2, chapter 3********



there's a bit more evidence of it there. Not a ton but a bit.



@

[Laura]

I need to get reading, I sooo want to finish this book and see what happens! Loving it!

[Marialyce]

I can see that I will be up for awhile!! :)

[Laura]

Quite a lot in chapter 3......

[Meg]

I don't think that we discussed this but at the end of Book I the bum is back and again asks Who is John Galt? Any ideas?

[Nancy]

When the "Who Is John Galt?" question appeared in the beginning it was close to the time she realized the composer had disappeared. Owen Kellog refuses the job and utters the same phrase. This time Ellis Wyatt disappears. John Galt has something to do with the absurdity of life and how dysfunctional society has become. Just a guess.

[Emily]

That whole "possession" thing is the reason I don't like Reardon.

[Laura]

I think John Galt is the People. Us. Guessing.

[Sheila , Supporting Chick]

Since Dagney was on the search for the inventor of the new type of motor, and the famous Philosopher/cook told her that she would not find him "until the day he chooses to find you - as he will."...I'm wondering if John Galt might be the inventor of the motor?

[Marialyce]

Hi Laura,

Did a certain part remind you of the one scene in Titanic? I am only up to Chapter 2, however. I couldn't read as much as I wanted to. ...but today!!!

[Marialyce]

I kind of agree with you, Sheila, that John Galt is the inventor of the motor.

...could John Galt be Francisco who seems to be directing things from the periphery? I know this is a stretch...

[Laura]

Marialyce wrote: "Hi Laura,

Did a certain part remind you of the one scene in Titanic? I am only up to Chapter 2, however. I couldn't read as much as I wanted to. ...but today!!!"

Don't laugh but I've never seen Titanic.

[Marialyce]

Oh! Laura, you must rent it. (it will put you in a romantic mood!) :)

[Laura]

A neighbor loaned it to us once, and I don't know how long we had it without watching it. I think it was the length that scared us off.

[Marialyce]

Can you re borrow it? Now you have to because I got you wondering what part I mean... and I am not going to tell you!! :))

[Laura]

lol I'm sure we could!

[Lori]

I've fallen almost hopelessly behind with reading this book. But I have 2 weeks coming up where I am pretty much free as a bird, so I'll plan on catching up then. Life is too crazy sometimes.

[Nancy]

I am barely keeping up Lori, but I know I am going to be so glad to say I have read this infamous book. When does school start?? Moving back to your apartment??

[Nancy]

I guess we are supposed to be discussing Chpt 7-10. A continued element seems to be those that can't succeed blame their failures on the selfishness and unfair competition of those that are smart enough to produce. Everyone Dagny encountered as she searched for the designer of the motor had the same excuse. When Ivy Starnes described her father she said he "cared for nothing but business." This certainly is the complaint of Rearden's family. OBviously in this context these are the responses of threatened jealous people. However I'm posing a weird question. In our current society what is the balance between being obsessed with work versus family? And what is a balance between helping the impoverished versus keeping them dependent on handouts?

[Laura]

I think yours is THE question Nancy. If we had the answer, all would be well. As close to utopia as fallible humans could make it.

[Marialyce]

I think so too, Nancy. If we could solve that second question, life would be much better than it is. There are so many folks taking advantage of the programs in place that the people who really need it most are often overshadowed. I know of someone who paid a person to put her on the books so that she would get Social Security benefits. The person is a multimillionaire and I am sure she is not the only one.

I guess most people try to balance work with family. I think it was easier when I was raising my kids and working. Perhaps it was the job of teaching that afforded me with a better balance but my husband and I tried to accomplish a work/family balance. I think it is so hard on the people today. I can see the hours my girls work. Even though only one has children, I can see that it's very hard on the family and one another.