Works of Thomas Hardy discussion
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Tess of the D’Urbervilles
Tess of the d'Urbervilles
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Tess of the D'Urbervilles - Introduction and Phase the First: Chapters 1 - 11
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Although, as usual, I’m mostly reading a Kindle version ..."
Thanks Trisha! I don't think I've ever listened to an audio version. Pankies started a thread for dramatisations (before the relaunch), so when we've got a bit further I'll put that into this folder too.
Keith - Alec d'Urberville certainly seems like a dastardly villain at this point - and even looks the part! But he hasn't actually done anything wrong, and has been quite kind to Tess so far.
Thomas Hardy is telling us that his intentions are not pure though ...
Your question ... (view spoiler)
Maybe this would be a good topic for our post-read discussion?
Bionic Jean wrote: "Real Life Locations:
Tess catches the carriage at Shaston—the very steep “pretty as a calendar” town which I posted a picture of earlier just after chapter 1. It is called Shaftesbury in real ..."
Thank you for these resources!
I always love it when a man's opening gambit is to call me a "big Beauty."
Bionic Jean wrote: "Chapter 5: SummaryThe family is now badly off financially, but John Durbeyfield is still too lazy to work much. His wife fatalistically downplays the disaster and proposes her plan to Tess. Tess ..."
Reading this again, I am now touched by the loneliness Tess faces. She does what she must academically, socially, and familially, but remains overwhelmed by all the responsibilities and the unseen boundaries which she cannot see (or she would change them with her regular determination) but must experience in numerous painful ways.
As I read this, I perceive this loneliness was all the more intense leading up to this point:
"Tess still stood hesitating like a bather about to make his plunge, hardly knowing whether to retreat or to persevere, when a figure came forth from the dark triangular door of the tent. It was that of a tall young man, smoking.
"He had an almost swarthy complexion, with full lips, badly moulded, though red and smooth, above which was a well-groomed black moustache with curled points, though his age could not be more than three- or four-and-twenty. Despite the touches of barbarism in his contours, there was a singular force in the gentleman’s face, and in his bold rolling eye.
“'Well, my Beauty, what can I do for you?' said he, coming forward."
I'm primed to be suspicious of these "shiny" and seemingly desirable folk. Alec is not what she had envisioned of elegance, and he doesn't seem charming at all.
Natalie wrote: " Mr Durbeyfield reminds me a little bit of a person (in the USA) who had ancestors on the Mayflower."
Could you expand on this? Is this a personal recollection? I am interested in connections that might be made to America.
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Real Life Locations:
... Thank you for these resources!.."
You're welcome; I'm glad you like them. Thomas Hardy is the only author I know who invented a county, pinched an Anglo-Saxon name, and took so much from real life that parts of the topography and towns are still easily identified over 4 or 5 real counties even now!
Cosmic wrote: "Natalie wrote: " Mr Durbeyfield reminds me a little bit of a person (in the USA) who had ancestors on the Mayflower."
Could you expand on this? Is this a personal recollection? I am interested ..."
I am not familiar with the specifics, but I recall all my life hearing about people who had ancestors on the Mayflower ship that landed near Plymouth, MA in 1620.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayflow...
In the UK it's probably having an ancestor who fought with Henry V or who signed the Magna Carta. I mention it as people who have pride in their ancestors of centuries past.
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Right from my first reading of Hardy’s The Return of the Native many years back, I was immediately struck by his fixation on the workings of fate. Time and again, he presents his protagonists as being virtually powerless to prevent the misfortunes that befall them. They happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time or they encounter the wrong person, one who somehow brings about their ruin, either by deceit or simply through carelessness. And despite having been granted free will, they are somehow destined to make ill-advised choices. The influence of fate has already been pointed out several times in this novel and here in Chapter 5, Hardy explicitly presents Alec Stokes-D’Urberville as an agent fated to bring misfortune to Tess.I’ve always been troubled by this fatalistic stance in Hardy’s work, since it’s not a philosophy I share. Nevertheless, I find so much to otherwise admire in Hardy that I long ago decided to treat his fatalism as the “thorn in the rose”. Thus I find myself cheering for his hero(in)es, hoping that they will somehow manage to overcome the fate-driven headwinds they face.
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Given that Thomas Hardy's religious views changed so much over his life, it's quite surprising that fate and destiny is such a persistent theme, isn't it? It's almost a fixation, as you say.
This will be another excellent topic to discuss when we complete the novel, in our third month. Thanks Jim :)
Like you, when I reread a novel by Thomas Hardy, I look out for signs of hope!
Jean's copy must be a later revision. Mine has the line as:“'Well, my big Beauty, what can I do for you?' said he, coming forward."
I am using the Penguin Classics edition edited by Tim Dolin, 1998 edition. The preface mentions that the edition uses the first volume as it was published. A footnote tells me that the word "big" got deleted by Hardy in a future edition/revision.
So I am not reading the same precise text of the rest of the group.
I have an earlier edition than the one pictured.
Jan @ 130. I loved your comment and section of dialogue you chose. I couldn't agree more and have to admit that I shed a tear over the demise of Prince.
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It wasn't me Natalie, it was Jan who posted that quotation (although she did also repeat one I had posted).
I suspect we are all reading a variety of editions, but hope that first time readers are being careful if theirs is an annotated edition, as they are notorious for spoilers.
The one I am reading is always the one I put on our group shelves. Since it is an Ulverscroft Large Print edition, I doubt whether anyone else will be reading it! It is just the text, no notes.
When I include quotations I use the Gutenberg free edition from 1895 online: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/110/1...
It includes both Prefaces i.e. to the 1st, and the 5th and later editions. As I mentioned in the introductory comments, these are safe to read!
I also have a free kindle edition published by "Public Domain Books" B000JML1LQ to use when I'm out and about. This is undated.
The illustrations predate all these editions. They are from the serial in "The Graphic", in 1891.
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I find this most surprising, given that the first printing in the Graphic as a serial had been heavily edited (see my introductory comments), because it was thought to be too shocking.
Here we have plenty of indications that Tess is ... er ... well- endowed. Alec's eyes are "riveted" on her "fulness of growth", making her appear more womanly. She "had inherited this feature from her mother", who had breastfed 6 children including the current baby, "without the quality it denoted" (without being a mature woman). Tess is embarrassed by this "'fault' which time would cure", because in time she will be fully developed in all areas.
So if we assume this interpretation, Alec calling her "my big Beauty" with his very first words, his eyes rivetted to her "fulness of growth" is incredibly lustful. No wonder Thomas Hardy had second thoughts and took it out.
But do you see the problem? The first edition was the one including the word "big" - and yet the serial was the bowdlerised one. It doesn't seem to make sense.
Bionic Jean wrote: "Thomas Malthus
As Tess grew older, and began to see how matters stood, she felt quite a Malthusian towards her mother for thoughtlessly giving her so many little sisters and brothers, when it ..."
I had to look this up as I was unaware of this theory. So she thought her mother shouldn't have had as many children as she did when they didn't have the money to support them above the poverty line. In her innocence, did she not realize that there was not a way for poor women to prevent pregnancy in the fullfilling of their marital duties?
Bionic Jean wrote: New versus old, then, and yet the irony is that this “d’Urberville” wealth is from trade, and not ancient lineage at all. They are pretenders. I was so surprised to learn of this deception by the Stoke family.
Peter wrote: Hardy has a definite affinity to describe settings of the natural world. He frequently places his characters in settings where nature speaks clearly about the characters who share the natural world. I love this as I have reveled in his descriptions of the landscape and was particularly struck on her journey to the "d'Urberville" mansion. It seemed to symbolize the crossing from childhood to young adulthood as she ventured into the unknown beyond the Vale she so loved & was as familiar to her as her family.
Bionic Jean wrote: Does anyone else get an image in their mind of a blackguard in silent films, twirling his moustache lasciviously?Oh absolutely!!!
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I suppose that's it, yes. Either that, or she never thought of it at all.
Also, at this time (illogically) having a child was always considered a woman's "fault", wasn't it?
Bionic Jean wrote: Also, at this time (illogically) having a child was always considered a woman's "fault", wasn't it? Even when married? I didn't know that. Certainly with a pregnancy outside of marriage and I would say that unfortunately many still believe that today!
Bionic Jean wrote: "More Real Life Locations:
Tess catches the van at Shaston—the very steep “pretty as a calendar” town which I posted a picture of earlier just after chapter 1 (comment 25). It is called Shaftes..."
Thank you Jean for posting pictures and background information. It helps to visualize the areas where the story takes place.
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There is a similar sentence at the beginning of the chapter: ”he [Jack Durbeyfield] had good strength to work at times; but the times could not be relied on to coincide with the hours of requirement”. But here there is no fatal destiny involved, rather it is Jack Durbeyfield’s choice to not work that makes the undesirable outcome.
The sentences sound so similar to me, and yet one involves free will and the other a fatal destiny. Is the similarity just coincidence, or is there a deeper meaning? I’m unsure…….
Chris wrote: "Bionic Jean wrote: "Thomas Malthus
As Tess grew older, and began to see how matters stood, she felt quite a Malthusian towards her mother for thoughtlessly giving her so many little sisters and..."
I don't think there was a reliable method for preventing pregnancy at this time (other than abstinence). Condoms were not common (and made from sheep's intestines or fish skins... so you can imagine what the failure rate was like!). "Natural rhythm" (avoiding the most fertile times) is highly ineffective still (because biology - both cellular and hormonal)... in theory, it would work rather well, but in practice it doesn't (I think something like 60-80%, only? By official reported statistics, anyway. The effectiveness of other birth control options are contrasted on the product monographs of birth control pills. I don't have one handy, though - just going by memory!).
Also, there's individual variation - if they were both rather fecund, then, well... :) (Nowadays, you can measure every bodily metric and probably get pretty good at avoiding pregnancy).
I got the impression that they are both highly immature, lusty and irresponsible people anyway. :) Children having children, what? So probably a moot point. ;)
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I think that's about the size of it, yes.
Plus these country people had the cycle of life and death all round them. They would rejoice at any new birth, and were grateful for God's bounty. Preventing it would probably not enter their head!
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I very much like the two quotations you have contrasted here, thank you Bridget!
"The sentences sound so similar to me, and yet one involves free will and the other a fatal destiny. Is the similarity just coincidence, or is there a deeper meaning?"
The observation about John Durbeyfield is clearly intended as humour: the quip that"the times could not be relied on to coincide with the hours of requirement" is funny! We see this as being totally within his control; he has free will, but it appears different to him. In this, he is a creature of instinct.
But on the other hand it does touch on the theme of inevitability. It is Jack's destiny, or his fate. So I'm now wondering if Thomas Hardy is almost parodying himself, deliberately using humour to illustrate another instance of his sincerely held belief about predetermination.
Could something like this be the "deeper meaning" or extra dimension you were aware of?
Bionic Jean wrote: "Capn wrote: "Children having children, what? So probably a moot point. ;)"I think that's about the size of it, yes.
Plus these country people had the cycle of life and death all round them. They..."
Right, especially because they had already lost two children between Tess and the next sibling. :(
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I'm so glad you're enjoying these posts, and will write them whenever I have time :) I found a beautiful picture of the lush countryside around Pentridge ("Trantridge") , but was not allowed to post it :( I must search through my own photos, and see if I have anything ...
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Tess feels dazed as she rides away from Trantridge. Another passenger comments on her appearance, and she remembers that she is covered in flowers. She tries to remove most of them, and the thorn of a rose pricks her chin, which she considers a bad omen. She spends the night in Shaston and goes home the next day.
Tess enters the house to find her mother triumphant. They have already received a letter asking Tess to come look after the birds at the d’Urberville estate. She will be paid well and the family is gleeful with the news. Tess feels uncomfortable, however, and doesn’t wish to return to the Slopes, but she won’t explain why.
A week later Tess returns home from job searching to find the family rejoicing again. Alec d’Urberville has ridden by and asked in person if Tess would come to manage the fowls. Mrs. Durbeyfield exclaims over how handsome he is, and the diamond ring on his finger. John Durbeyfield thinks that Alec wants to marry Tess to improve his own bloodline. Tess is again reluctant and wishes she had met with Mrs. d’Urberville instead.
After thinking again of Prince’s death and being teased by her younger siblings, Tess finally agrees to go. She warns her mother that she only wants to earn money, not get married. She writes to the d’Urbervilles and receives a response, but notices that Mrs. d’Urberville’s handwriting seems masculine. Joan is offended that they are only sending a cart for Tess instead of a carriage. Once she has made her decision Tess feels less restless, and she can accept that fate does not want her to become a schoolteacher as she had once hoped.
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We have another connection here with the natural world, as Tess is going to look after the birds. Her employment seems like a stroke of good fortune to the family, but Tess has a feeling of foreboding, although she says she can’t explain why. We can though; Thomas Hardy is adept at signalling where the story is about to go!
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Alec is obviously interested in Tess, and has put some effort into these arrangements; probably inventing a job, writing the letters and showing up in person with his flashy diamond ring. The family’s delight over his wealth, combined with John Durbeyfield’s vanity, show the farcical disparity between the two families. It also shows how Tess was right to think that the family relies on her to support them, whether through work or they hope, through marriage to a rich man, although this thought angers her.
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What did you think to this chapter? Did it confirm what you expected?
Also, please pop over HERE, and if you have a preference, please let me know there (just so as not to divert this thread :))
It´s hard to say if this chapter confirmed my expectations, as I not only knew the story, but already read the book before. I was shocked that Tess, though she senses her fate, goes to "the D´Urbervilles". So far she reminds me in one sense of Margaret in North and South by Elizabeth Gaskell, where she also takes the part of parent over her parents, even if she is more confident than Tess.
I have just caught up with the reading and I’m very much enjoying the discussion. I’ve not read the book before and, in fact, this is my introduction to Hardy. His descriptions of natural setting - which some of you have noted - are so lovely. Poor Tess does seem to be carried along on a wave of destiny which she believes she has no choice but to follow. Her own conscience and sense of responsibility, as well as her family’s expectation, make it impossible for her to do otherwise. The future for her is foreboding, but I am hoping that her destiny is one of happiness delayed, not permanently denied.
I agree with Donna. I would add that Tess definitely has a sense that Alec is a menace to her in some way. There is a real wariness towards him. She continually wishes that she could feel certain that his mother was part of the plan. I think she knows she is being manipulated.
When I wrote my comments about Chapter 5, applying the term “thorn in the rose” to express my willingness to tolerate Hardy’s fixation on fate, I had not yet read Chapter 6; but here I see him use the same term as an ill omen. Perhaps Hardy’s fatalism is influencing my thinking more than I thought!The most troubling aspect of this chapter is that all of Tess’s instincts tell her that getting involved with Alec is a mistake, and yet her sense of obligation to her family finally convinces her to go along with what is (based on the masculine handwriting) not an honest offer coming from an aged woman (whom she has never met). Tess does exactly the wrong thing, for a reason that is not even valid, pushed along by the foolish hopes of her mother. A plot device that is typical of Hardy.
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Could something like this be the "deeper meaning" or extra dimension you were aware of?.."
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Yes, I think that's it exactly, Jean. Thank you. I had not thought of it being a parody, but that connects the two sentences nicely.
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But Tess seems to have nobody to guide her, and doesn't know whether to trust her instincts.
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Tess prepares to leave for the Slopes and allows her mother to dress her up. Tess looks older than she actually is, and her mother is delighted with her appearance, and the effect she imagines it will have on Alec d'Urberville. Tess says goodbye to her father, who takes a break from his nap to say he will sell his title to Alec. He starts by asking for one thousand pounds, but beats himself down to twenty. Tess leaves with her mother and sisters, full of emotion.
The family goes to wait for the cart to Trantridge, all of them looking innocent and beautiful. The cart appears and Tess says goodbye and walks up the hill. Joan Durbeyfield watches the cart approach, and sees with delight that it is driven by Alec d’Urberville. Tess hesitates to go with him, but then strengthens her resolve and leaves. The children and her mother start to cry.
That night as they are lying in bed, Joan Durbeyfield voices her misgivings to her husband. She says she wishes she had found out if Alec was a good man or not, before letting Tess go with him. But then she consoles herself that if Tess plays her “trump card”, her beautiful face, then Alec is sure to marry her.
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The description of Tess’s appearance as a physically desirable woman, belies that fact that she is still an innocent girl at heart.
John Durbeyfield’s comical goodbye satirises both his delusions of grandeur, and his poor understanding of money. There is also a tragic note though, because of his many young children.
We have the traditional ways being pushed aside by the flashy new ones again. The gleaming new cart, all style and appearance, is contrasted with the reliable but shabby old one Tess had expected to see.
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We saw Joan Durbeyfield push her plan very hard, and then have doubts, but in the end she trusts that everything will work itself out. She keeps believing in fate: that “what will be will be,” and for her that is a reassuring and optimistic idea. She sees beauty as Tess’s strength, as it was for her—but we see that Tess’s beauty may work against her, attracting predatory men. Joan Durbeyfield comforts herself by thinking that whatever happens, Tess would be able to make a rich suitor marry her.
I think Thomas Hardy is pacing this very carefully, slowly cranking up the tension, don't you?
Yes, it´s exciting to see how Tess is prepared (for slaughter, I´d like to say) by her naive mum, then driven to the estate but overtaken by Alec´s wagon and disappearing in what seems to be her fate.
Any sympathy I had for Tess’s father or any benefit of the doubt I may have afforded him is totally gone after his crass behavior in this chapter. He couldn’t even stop his self-absorbed behavior long enough to give Tess a genuine, heartfelt sendoff. Tess continues to have a fatalistic attitude and is mostly passive in this chapter, except when she takes the decisive step of climbing into the cart with Alec.
On the surface, this short chapter seems to be quite a simple, straightforward episode: Tess allows herself to be dressed up and made to look attractive and somewhat more mature than she really is, a smart-looking carriage arrives, driven by young Alec, Tess mounts and they depart.But there’s a disturbing subtext throughout the chapter: Tess envisions a very different future than that imagined by her mother; the sudden appearance of a very different conveyance than expected raises questions; and at nightfall, even Mrs. Durbeyfield (belatedly) begins to have second thoughts about the manner in which Tess has suddenly and permanently left the family. One senses that a true turning point has been reached; from this point onward, Tess will be entirely dependent on her own internal resources for her future wellbeing. And it’s very unlikely that Mrs. Durbeyfield’s naïve faith in “her face” as her “trump card” will be sufficient.
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"from this point onward, Tess will be entirely dependent on her own internal resources for her future wellbeing."
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Tess and Alec ride away from the green Vale and into the gray unknown. Alec drives recklessly and Tess is still wary since Prince’s death, so she asks him to slow down. He responds by teasing her with stories that his horse has already killed one man. Alec goes downhill at a terrifying gallop, and Tess clings to his arm. He asks her to hold onto his waist instead, as he is using the reins. When they reach the bottom Tess lets go and is angry because she realises how he has tricked her.
They start off down another hill but this time Tess won’t hold onto Alec. Instead he asks if he can kiss her. When she refuses he makes the horse go faster, and finally she agrees, looking like a frightened animal. Alec slows the cart and tries to kiss her, but she avoids him again. He curses and Tess starts to cry, pleading that she doesn’t want to be kissed. Alec gives her “the kiss of mastery” anyway.
Unconsciously Tess wipes her cheek with her handkerchief, which makes Alec angry. He insists that she has undone the kiss, and he must have another one. At that moment Tess’s hat blows off, and she makes him stop the cart. Once she retrieves her hat she refuses to get back on, saying that she will walk the rest of the way. Alec realises she has tricked him and starts to curse at her.
"Tess stood still, and turned to look behind her" - Joseph Syddall (likely) 25 July 1891
Tess shouts an insult back at Alec and his anger suddenly dissolves. He tries to convince her to get back on the cart but she will not, even though now he feels ashamed and would not have tried any more seduction. Tess wishes she could return home, but reminds herself that she is doing this for her family. Finally the Slopes and the poultry-farm appear in the distance.
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“The kiss of mastery” is an ominous phrase, showing Tess as a victim of male dominance. Tess is portrayed as an animal being teased by a cruel human, and so again stands as an image for the purer natural world. Can a kiss be “undone”, or has a line been crossed here? By leaving the cart Tess is able to achieve a little power, and retain her dignity, even though it means walking for miles.
We can see how fickle Alec’s nature is, because of his swift emotional shifts. Tess continues her proud walk separate from Alec’s cart, asserting her independence from his wealthy male authority. She resolves to stay with her mother’s plan, and is acting as a sacrificial figure for her family’s benefit.
It’s interesting that we have not yet seen Alec’s mother, or anything of the job Tess is to undertake or, where she will live on the property. My heart is in my mouth for poor Tess!
I see Tess like a lamb being sent either to market or for sacrifice. Alec, in contrast, is definitely wolf-ish!Hardy is such a clever and keen observer of human nature, characters and their motivations. Times and details might change, but over 100 years later, this situation is still relatable and timeless.
As always, I'm enjoying the richness of Hardy's writing. It feels like every sentence is carefully considered and curated.
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Although, as usual, I’m mostly reading a Kindle version of the book I have also listened to part of an audio version. If anyone is having difficulty with the local dialect, I recommend the audio version read by Peter Firth. (Depending on your Amazon account, you may be able to borrow both the “AmazonClassics” Kindle version & the audio free of charge.)