Summer Knight - Butcher [Jan 16, 2022]

[Jenna, I'd be free if not for Temper & Edgewalker]

Summer Knight - Jim Butcher

January 16, 2022.
Requested by Katie K.

[slagathor]

\o/

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Started my re-read today… I’m hyper-aware of you guys’ pet peeves by now :D

Too busy to listen midcombat, check, page 2…

Hints of old chivalry, check, in the first 5-10%…

Male gaze, check, several times in the first 15-20%…

Still a good entry that has alot of things start coming together…

Only about 25-33% so far?

[Tonari no Emily]

At least he's consistent xD
Chapter 1
(view spoiler)[ Totally right about not listening midcombat Iain lol.
"Harry!"
"Not now!" That's gotta be the most common exchange, right?
It's raining toads and Harry's fighting magical creatures, sounds about right for all the openings so far. This time we have ghouls!
Also, I'm glad Harry can realize he's being an ass and accept help from his friends. (hide spoiler)]

[RachelG.]

Timelord Iain wrote: "Started my re-read today… I’m hyper-aware of you guys’ pet peeves by now :D"

I have been trying to turn off my feelings about all those things you mentioned because of course it was the first thing I noticed. I have only read the first chapter so far.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Just make it thru the first 25% or so and reach Toot Toot: a legend is born… this is one of my favorite developments / running gags of the series… had to hold my tongue back in book 1… but here, we see the beginnings of (view spoiler)[ General Toot Toot Maximus, and the (piz)Za Lord’s Guard… they don’t even care anymore, about the summonings, as long as it means more pizza… and all the pizza is making them bigger, especially Toot Toot… :D (hide spoiler)]

[Paula]

I'm also going to join from this book forward. I'll start in a couple of days

[Fazila]

Gonna start today!!

[Tonari no Emily]

Toot toot is great! I remember reading somewhere or maybe it was an interview that Jim Butcher put in more Toot Toot because of James Marsters's narration. I was trying to find where i saw that and came across this interview: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MPu4pfW...
Dont watch past about 6:40 due to series spoilers, but the first few minutes talks about how he wrote the first book trying to prove his prof wrong. That story is actually a little different than I thought. He was trying to use the prof's method to prove it would make a cookie cutter bad book, but then he wrote storm front haha.
Also they talk a little bit about Harry's perception of women in the more spoilery parts and Marsters brings it up as Harry just being sexually frustrated/repressed... idk about that but it was an interesting interview

[Nyssa]

I missed the beginning of this series, buddy read. But I wanted to say that this is the book that made me fall in love with the series!
I stopped reading the series after Cold Days because I wanted a few more books to come out before I picked it up again.
I'm hoping Jim Butcher will be able to complete his "master plan" laid out oh so many years ago that includes a trilogy ending.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Nyssa wrote: "I missed the beginning of this series, buddy read. But I wanted to say that this is the book that made me fall in love with the series!
I stopped reading the series after [book: Cold Days|12216302..."

Butcher had a bad stretch there, but I'm hopeful for faster releases now... hopefully his interview responses weren't all spin... I know in the LARGE time gap between book 15 & 16/17, he moved + divorced + remarried a LARPer, etc etc... seems like he's in a better place now... I also want to see the series reach the end planned out...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "Toot toot is great! I remember reading somewhere or maybe it was an interview that Jim Butcher put in more Toot Toot because of James Marsters's narration. I was trying to find where i saw that and..."

Tons of side characters have ballooned in importance, from fan love / etc... Waldo Butters was initially just supposed to be a one-off medical examiner character that was a quick fan favorite to be brought back in #7ish as a full-on sidekick for a book, etc etc etc...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "Toot toot is great! I remember reading somewhere or maybe it was an interview that Jim Butcher put in more Toot Toot because of James Marsters's narration. I was trying to find where i saw that and..."

That video has some serious new info in it... I had no idea there were plans for a time travel book... of course Harry's gonna break the rule about no time travel... at first, I thought this was the Mirror, Mirror book (view spoiler)[from what I understand, evil Harry and Morgan with an eyepatch show up because someone powerful changed something in the timeline back in book 3?... can't remember now, rumors of plot elements of this book have been accumulating for years... but this seemed like a peripherally time-travelly book, but Butcher said the actual time travel book would probably be the final book before the capstone trilogy... once upon a time, that would have meant a Denarian book, but I think there are going to be like 22/23 books before the capstone trilogy now, due to series bloat and Peace Talks being broken into 2 books and Twelve Months being added as a main series anthology structured story to deal with a bunch of stuff to get Harry's life in order for the final segment of the series... (hide spoiler)]

That spoiler is for re-readers only, and kinda rambly :D

[slagathor]

Alright, managed to read until chapter 3 and again we're off to an action packed start (view spoiler)[with the assassination attempt at the beginning. It is so good to see Billy again and that he became quite stronger. Depressed Dresden is quite a pain in the bum though (and also looks like a bum), now his whole "I don't need anybody, I can deal with shit alone" attitude is even more magnified, but kinda for the wrong reasons, I think.
He keeps focusing on how he should have been stronger, faster, etc, but that was NOT what caused Susan's demise. It was him withholding information to "protect" her. If he would have told her what kind of danger these vampires are, she might have reconsidered or thought better of it. But all he said is "no, is dangerous, no", which... I mean, he was telling this to a supernatural reported, what did he expect to happen?

Reading chapter 2 and 3 back to back came out kinda hilarious if you look at the character descriptions. Mab, the super sexy seductress is described in vast detail (and in very cringey ways too), while in chapter 3 the old lady wizard (and the other non-sexy male wizards) gets 2-3 sentences. xddd That actually made me cackle.

Not to mention, after being described how scared shitless Dresden is of Mab and after being stabbed and then magically stabbed (or what should I call that little ice-stabby thing Mab did), I don't think any sane person, no matter how horny, would be checking out somebody's ass. But that's just my two cents as someone who also likes women. :shrugs:

Besides that I am really hyped to see the wizards meeting up and how they will react to this whole war going on. Will they really just get rid of Harry to appease the vamps? Would Mab actually let that happen, since they got a bargain and all that? I mean, having a damn fairy queen on your side should at least count for something. Also I do hope Harry will work together with others and learn to trust them to have his back. In any case, so far the book is promising, even if there are the usual hiccups. But what this series does great is always the story and the world, so I'm looking forward to what is to come. :) (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Things definitely start heading in the right direction by the end of this book, slagathor…

[Tonari no Emily]

Oh, I love Butters too! haha

@ Iain, series spoiler stuff (view spoiler)[ I vaguely remember seeing plot for a book like that...
But a time travel book seems like a weird way to end things before the capstone trilogy. Should be interesting.
So seeing Gatekeeper in this book brought back vague memories of timetravel.. do you remember if he's associated with time travel or the future at all? (hide spoiler)]

[Tonari no Emily]

@slagathor (view spoiler)[ Yes! It's always the contrast of sexy women descriptions next to descriptions of (mostly) men who get like 1 line. Always very amusing. And maybe Harry just really isn't sane xD (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "Oh, I love Butters too! haha

@ Iain, series spoiler stuff..."

Honestly, there's rumors for plots of more books than there's time for, before the capstone trilogy, if it's gonna be books 23-25... (view spoiler)[there's also talk of a Pagan God Wrestling book, and another book I've forgotten already... but when you've got:

18 = Twelve Months (Dresden getting his life sorted out, while trying to survive 12 dates with Lara, after the events of book 16/17 left them betrothed)

19 = Mirror, Mirror (I was wrong on some details here... it's evil Harry from another universe, who made a different decision at the end of book 3 and turned evil, summoning Harry Prime to use to fake his own evil death... and the eyepatch Morgan and all that jazz stuff)

20 = Denarian stuff

21 = could be Pagan Wrestling, or Dragons or Kaiju

22 = Time Travel Book

23-25 = Capstone Trilogy, Stars & Stone, and the other wizard swears... Outsider stuff

If more books are added, and you hit book 25 without starting the capstone trilogy, he'd need another Denarian plot to keep the pattern: 5/10/15/20/25... (hide spoiler)]

Gatekeeper: we're hitting on so many spoilery characters now with so much future material, it's great... (view spoiler)[I think the Gatekeeper plays with time travel... or can see the future and send messages back in time to himself... there's some stuff later in the series where he sends messages to Harry and then when Harry mentions it he doesn't know yet, because of timey-wimey stuff... Gatekeeper has special rules, because of his work with Mab to protect the border of reality from the Outsiders... (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

You know, I'm really glad I'm doing this re-read... beyond enjoying the first 15 books again, and seeing others get into the series...

So much happened in book 16/17, that I seem to have forgotten alot of it... I'd forgotten something I mentioned in the previous spoilery post, then reading reddit/wiki related to that reminded me of OTHER, BIGGER things I'd forgotten...

[Tonari no Emily]

Thanks for the reminder of Gatekeeper!

Right? I've forgotten a lot from the series. I wonder when 18 will be released...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Hopefully within another year or so... if there's another 6 year delay, I'll lose complete faith in Butcher's ability to finish in his lifetime...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Butcher was 40% thru the next Cinder Spire book at Dragon Con in September... planned to be done by his Halloween birthday, and working on Dresden now... not sure how close that came to true, but I'm cautiously optimistic...

[Katie]

Hopefully starting today ^^;
Then gonna check up on chat :D

[Tonari no Emily]

Hopefully his life is a bit more settled now, and he can get some good writing done 🤞

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Hopefully he has his writing mojo back... he has definite plans for a sequel/spinoff series following Goodman Gray, when Dresden Files ends... (view spoiler)[the guy from Skin Game and later that does jobs for $1... if Dresden survives the main series, they'll be frenemies and probably run into one another occasionally... there's already a short story called Monsters... the sequel series would be Monsters, LLC, the name of Goodman's agency...

There also might be plans for another Codex Alera book/series... or it was just a thought experiment thing at Dragon Con... if real, it sounded like it would be 100 years later, when the truce with the invasive creatures that were given a continent ended... there would probably be a second war, and growing pains for the new races that got access to "pokemon" at the end of the first series... I'm all for it, if it's real... potential side series once the Cinder Spires trilogy/series is finished... (hide spoiler)]

So hopefully Butcher has his writing mojo back, and can keep churning out books... otherwise this could end up like Robert Jordan... ideas for future series that never get a chance to happen... I'd have totally ready a spinoff/sequel series in WoTland, about Mat living in Seanchan :D

[Tonari no Emily]

Those all sound so enticing! Goodman Gray (view spoiler)[ Honestly Skin Game was one of my favorites, especially of the more recent books, so I am very much looking forward to that if he can get it done.
Heh and the Codex Alera spinoff would be cool. really liked that series. (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

I've liked most all Butcher has wrote... only reason I haven't read Cinder Spires was my growing wariness of unfinished trilogies/etc... and I'm glad I've waited, so far...

#12 is the definite highpoint of Dresden for me... it was the newest book when i caught up with the series... (view spoiler)[there was a definite dip when I read Ghost Story and it was a much different kind of book, with Harry's access to magic so limited... and things have never quite been the same since, since Harry never really gets a chance to get his equilibrium back... 16/17 and 18 look to be trying to bring that back, with Harry raising his daughter and getting his magic tools back in line, etc...

All that said, 15 was a great book... the Butters stuff is something I wish I could yell about :D

Doing my re-read a year or 2 ago, and including all the short stories from the anthologies is great, too... but there's still a ton of short stories not in anthologies, I think, since he's written so many...

And it's a shame, since it seems like stuff that's only going to become more relevant... like the fact that the Raith family is tied up in an organization that's been fighting a war against followers of the Old Gods and their minions the Outsiders for millenia, I think... https://dresdenfiles.fandom.com/wiki/... (hide spoiler)]

[Choko]

Well, just finished Ch. 3 and reading all of your comments, I was laughing while agreeing with you guys! Him not listening to anyone, not giving anyone any important information about the situation, and straight up being stupid at times drives me crazy!!! But I still love the goofy wizard :) Mab is something, isn't she! And I love Billy:)

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Choko wrote: "Well, just finished Ch. 3 and reading all of your comments, I was laughing while agreeing with you guys! Him not listening to anyone, not giving anyone any important information about the situation..."

These BRs have definitely made me more aware of the flaws, but I love the mythology... there's a reason I've read over 1000 Urban Fantasy & Paranormal Romance books...

And Mab is one of the best characters in the series... Harry's always on shaky ground with her... she's powerful, but there are magical rules she has to follow... teaches Harry alot about diplomacy :D

[Choko]

Up to Ch 12. (view spoiler)[ His supposed dead ex showing up was unexpected and I wonder what the hell is she up to. I don't trust her yet...

The Council are such buttheads! So ready to just throw him under the bus. Thank goodness for the few guys who support him being in a good place to be able to do so. Him completely screwing up with his latin and attending In a "robe" was hilarious! I still think that he doesn't think before he opens his mouth though, let alone before he acts.

I don't understand why the warden is being such a humongous dick towards Harry. It has to be more than just his mistrust for him not using black magic and having a questionable past. This seems just too personal...

I feel horrible for Karen! Poor woman, her being in the vicinity of Harry has brought her nothing but pain and trouble. I really like her!

I have no idea what those dreams of Harry with Suzan actually mean. They seem too real to just be his lust for her and him not getting any...

I loooove Bob! Everything coming out of his mouth is gold! (hide spoiler)]

Now I am going to bed and will be back tomorrow:)

[Tonari no Emily]

Timelord Iain wrote: "I've liked most all Butcher has wrote... only reason I haven't read Cinder Spires was my growing wariness of unfinished trilogies/etc... and I'm glad I've waited, so far...

#12 is the definite hig..."

Gotta say I wasn't the biggest fan of Cinder Spires...

(view spoiler)[ the Butters stuff is something I wish I could yell about :D Right?? He's really one of my favorite characters. Polka will never die!!

I've really gotta catch up on all the short stories. And I had no idea about the Raiths and the Old Gods! Sheesh that's a lot of stuff he needs to wrap up. (hide spoiler)]

[Tonari no Emily]

Choko wrote: "Well, just finished Ch. 3 and reading all of your comments, I was laughing while agreeing with you guys! Him not listening to anyone, not giving anyone any important information about the situation..."

I do like Billyl and the Alphas! They're really good for Harry right now too I think.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Billy & the Alphas are the first real (supernatural) group that have made the effort to steamroll Dresden's obstinacy, for his benefit... it's great... UF series always feel better, once the MC builds a network of friends and allies to rely on, instead of the scorched earth approach...

[slagathor]

Timelord Iain wrote: "Billy & the Alphas are the first real (supernatural) group that have made the effort to steamroll Dresden's obstinacy, for his benefit... it's great... UF series always feel better, once the MC bui..."

Yesss, totally! This is exactly what I'm looking for in this series too, that Dresden finally realizes that he can't just be all lone wizard-wolfing everything, he needs friends and allies and, for the love of Cthulhu, he needs to learn to trust people, rely on them and SHARE INFO WITH THEM. This is why I really liked the last book, since he was kinda forced to (at least partly) work with others. :)

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

slagathor wrote: "Timelord Iain wrote: "Billy & the Alphas are the first real (supernatural) group that have made the effort to steamroll Dresden's obstinacy, for his benefit... it's great... UF series always feel b..."

How far are you in this book?... After the White Council meeting, he finally (view spoiler)[comes clean with Murphy... like 3 books late, but still... it's sad really, since Murphy's damaged, at this point... and she never really gets back to 100%... there's too much corruption in the police chain of command/etc... she does a better job of doing what's right from this point forward, tho, I think... (hide spoiler)]

[Paula]

Ive started and its looking interesting
Up to chapter 5(view spoiler)[its nice that billy made him realize what a mess he was. Her godmother selling his contract to Mab was unexpected and i bet he is going to regret making that bargain. I wonder what was his fate that Martha talked about (hide spoiler)]

[Paula]

slagathor wrote: "Alright, managed to read until chapter 3 and again we're off to an action packed start with the assassination attempt at the beginning. It is so good to see Billy again and that he became quite str..."
(view spoiler)[yeah, Mabs description was so long i skimmed a bit and then the other descriptions being so short is funny (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Paula wrote: "Ive started and its looking interesting
Up to chapter 5[spoilers removed]"

That's a definitely long-term thing... you learn more about it in books 14 & 16/17, but it's something that's mostly being saved for the finale trilogy... (view spoiler)[his fate / birthright... (hide spoiler)]...

[Choko]

Ch. 20. Murphy with a chainsaw ===> priceless!!! And figuring out what to call the plant monster, hilarious!

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

I always forget which books go to walmart... I think it happens again in #14?... that's the one I usually remember...

[Paula]

Iain, oh, such a shame that's that far away

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Paula wrote: "Iain, oh, such a shame that's that far away"

Yea... for the longest time there were no details, just hints...

I'll give you a hint I didn't have :D

It's linked to (view spoiler)[He Who Walks Behind... kinda (hide spoiler)] :D

[Paula]

Iain(view spoiler)[haha, what a hint, I almost read it as He Who Must Not Be Named. Oh well, I'll read and find out (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

It's so hard keeping my mouth shut... this series mythology is just so awesome... so many reveals just put a grin on my face... mostly ones that don't affect the overall storyline, just add more flavor...

Also, as I was discussing with Emily, so much is buried in short stories and side material, because they're things Harry might never learn, so focused on the current threat...

Also, as seen in this book, and to a lesser extent, previous books... Harry's legend starts to build here... for being a grumpy hermit who shows up once or twice a year and punches well above his weight class... and wins... (view spoiler)[makes him scary, and hard to get close to, for the weaker supernaturals, as much as he starts trying to, later on... (hide spoiler)]

[Choko]

So, I finished and I loved it! I do have a question though. Did we ever find out how the young werewolves became werewolves???

[Tonari no Emily]

@Choko, I'm not really sure.. I think Harry mentions its just a specific kind of magic/spell that they do.

[Tonari no Emily]

This book is where I really started to like Murphy, and especially the friendship between Harry and Murphy. It starts to develop here when (view spoiler)[ he spills basically ALL the magic secrets to her. Here is also where Murphy can be vulnerable with Harry too, sharing about her first husband. (hide spoiler)]

[Choko]

Murphy is my favorite! And it was time for him to let her know all of that. It would have made things easier in the previous three books:)

[RachelG.]

I feel like I am pretty far behind the rest of you but plan to catch up over the weekend. I am so glad I switched to the audiobook.

I just finished Chapter 6 and this is probably not needing a spoiler tag but (view spoiler)[ I really like how the Merlin is a title rather than just a name. (hide spoiler)]

[Choko]

Yeah, I much rather prefer it to be a title. It just makes more sense...