2020 TOB Shortlist

[Heidi]

I have just two books left to be a completionist and last night I whined to my partner that I didn’t know what I was going to read once I finished! I did not get any sympathy.

[C]

Lauren wrote: "I did it - I finished the shortlist today! I wasn't sure if all of my library holds would come in on time, but it worked out. I think this would be my ranking of all the books. I wish the bottom 4-..."

Congrats Lauren! Since you mentioned 'Heavy', I suggest you read the ToB highlight from a few years ago, 'Long Division' if you somehow missed that one .

[Ruthiella]

Heidi wrote: "I have just two books left to be a completionist and last night I whined to my partner that I didn’t know what I was going to read once I finished! I did not get any sympathy."

I hear you Heidi. We moan when we have all the TOB reading ahead of us and then we are sad when it is all over. It's all part of the fun! :D

[Jason]

Congrats to all the completists. I've gone in a different direction this year. In an attempt to stave off the post-ToB reading lull I always seem to fall into, I've started reading books outside the shortlist that I want to read rather than burn out on books on the list that I don't want to read.

That said, as I finish The Water Dancer, should I spend my last Audible credit on The Testaments? I haven't read Handmaid's Tale since way back when it first came out and haven't watched the show neither.

And, is there a 2021 Contenders thread yet?

[Ruthiella]

Jason wrote: "Congrats to all the completists. I've gone in a different direction this year. In an attempt to stave off the post-ToB reading lull I always seem to fall into, I've started reading books outside th..."

I wouldn't purchase The Testaments unless you are an Atwood fan/completeist. I don't think it is as strong as The Handmaid's Tale (I've not seen the T.V. show either).

[Heidi]

Jason wrote: "Congrats to all the completists. I've gone in a different direction this year. In an attempt to stave off the post-ToB reading lull I always seem to fall into, I've started reading books outside th..."

Yeah, there's no chance I'd buy Testaments. Almost any book on the shortlist (except Overthrow) would be preferable.

[Lauren]

C wrote: "Lauren wrote: "I did it - I finished the shortlist today! I wasn't sure if all of my library holds would come in on time, but it worked out. I think this would be my ranking of all the books. I wis..."

This is only my second year following the ToB so I know I have a good amount of catching up to do. The super rooster competition this year is helping me get to the past winners at least.

I'm very interested in Long Division and just added it to my library holds list. Thanks for the recommendation!

[Lauren]

Heidi wrote: "Jason wrote: "Congrats to all the completists. I've gone in a different direction this year. In an attempt to stave off the post-ToB reading lull I always seem to fall into, I've started reading bo..."

Yes, I would also suggest saving that Audible credit for a better book. I listened to The Handmaid's Tale a few years ago and the narration couldn't hold my attention, so I made sure to read the print version of The Testaments. It was fine, but not high quality literature, so there are some other shortlist books that would be more deserving of that credit. ;)

[Bretnie]

Tim and Amy, thanks for suggesting I pick up Fleishman. I'm about a third through it and really enjoying it. The blurb didn't appeal to me at all, but the audiobook narrator is blowing me away.

Also, impressive work Karissa and Lauren and others!

[Ellen]

OK -- I'm almost done. I only have All This Could Be Yours left to go, and I have it on the Kindle and it's short, so I'll take a LEEEETLE break before reading it to read a couple of non-ToB books in my library pile. There are three I really, REALLY liked -- Golden State, Nothing to See Here, and Mary Toft -- one I liked a lot -- Your House Will Pay -- a bunch I thought were interesting, but I didn't love them -- Fleischman; Girl,Woman, Other; Trust Exercise; Optic Nerve; The Testaments; Saudade -- and two sort-of clunkers, Overthrow and Oval. Mind you, as much as I didn't care for these last two, they don't begin to approach my feelings towards such previous horrors as Wittgenstein, Jr. and Bain en Bainlieue. All in all, a good year, but my brackets have Nothing to See Here in the second round against Mary Toft, which pains me deeply.

[Irene]

I am amazed at the number of completists, or almosts completists. Well done everyone

[Bretnie]

Ellen wrote: "OK -- I'm almost done. I only have All This Could Be Yours left to go, and I have it on the Kindle and it's short, so I'll take a LEEEETLE break before reading it to read a couple of non-ToB books ..."

Ellen, I've left All This Could Be Yours as my last also - short, plus it'll be absolutely the last match up of the first round, which buys us a little time. :)

We have really similar rankings also! Still working on Fleishman, which I think will be either love or liked a lot. And I'd put Optic Nerve and Saudade as something between liked a lot and clunkers. And didn't read Testaments or Oval.

[Alison]

I've got two and a half books to go -- Waiting on Nothing to See Here from the library and I'm grinding my way through Oval with Overthrow waiting for me. I have to say that Oval had better improve dramatically or I will be offended that it made the Tournament when the lovely, perfect A Girl Returned did not.

[Michelle]

Alison wrote: "I've got two and a half books to go -- Waiting on Nothing to See Here from the library and I'm grinding my way through Oval with Overthrow waiting for me. I have to say that Oval had better improve..."

You're going to be offended. Oval is my least favorite of the play in round. Tears of the Trufflepig would have been a much better fit there. There are quite a few books that A Girl Returned is much better than with Oval and Overthrow among them.

[Jenny (Reading Envy)]

Alison wrote: "I've got two and a half books to go -- Waiting on Nothing to See Here from the library and I'm grinding my way through Oval with Overthrow waiting for me. I have to say that Oval had better improve..."

Oh goodness. I bailed on Oval after an hour or so of listening but recently since then read A Girl Returned, which is so perfect, loved it.

[Bretnie]

I just finished Fleishman and wish the book's blurb did a better job describing what it's really about. Sure it's about a guy in his 40's going through a divorce and rediscovering sex, but it's also very much about the narrator, Libby, and relationships and gender roles and so much more. I'm really glad Tim and Amy suggested not skipping this one. I hope it crushes Normal People, which will be a fascinating match-up.

[Caroline]

I just finished 'Nothing to See Here' and started 'Fleishman' and am laughing that I found the vaguely stuck in time Southern gothic spotaneous combustion book intensely relatable, while the online dating in the modern era book is incredibly alienating.

However, reading that the first chapter is not a good indication of what Fleishman is about, I soldier on.

[Nadine in California]

Caroline wrote: "I just finished 'Nothing to See Here' and started 'Fleishman' and am laughing that I found the vaguely stuck in time Southern gothic spotaneous combustion book intensely relatable, while the online..."

And I am laughing at your great description of Nothing to See Here!

[Caroline]

I would never have picked up NtSH based on the generic title but it is a combination of so many things I love.

[Lauren]

Michelle wrote: "Alison wrote: "I've got two and a half books to go -- Waiting on Nothing to See Here from the library and I'm grinding my way through Oval with Overthrow waiting for me. I have to say that Oval had..."

Did you love Tears of the Trufflepig? I met the author at the book festival and have been slowly working through my signed copy since then (October). For some reason I'm really struggling to connect with the story. I'm about 75 pages in and have considered DNF'ing it... do you think it will get better for me if I push through it?

A Girl Returned was one of my favorites from the longlist (and I wasn't impressed by Oval and Overthrow), so we might have similar taste. ;)

[Kyle]

Man, loved Nothing to See Here. There was so much to love: the narrator, the kids, the narrator's relationship with her friend, the weird setting...

I also gotta say, Your House Will Pay was really solid as well. I zipped right through it, while I'm pushing myself to get through We Cast A Shadow. I dunno, the over-the-top satire feels like it's setting the narrator up for a fall, and so I read it cringing.

After that, I've got GWO as the last I plan to read before the tourney starts. Not really planning to read any others unless one I didn't read starts dominating the tournament...

[Lark]

Kyle wrote: "Man, loved Nothing to See Here. There was so much to love: the narrator, the kids, the narrator's relationship with her friend, the weird settingl..."

Kyle your post got me thinking: beyond the National Book Award and the arty outliers, is there another "TOB-style" book category that's highly likely to make the short list, where the novel offers a slightly zany, slightly other-than-reality story, told in a breezy, talented narrative style?...Books that hit the quirk button hard? It seems that way to me, after many years of following TOB.

Like:

Nothing to See Here
Golden State
all of Jesse Ball's books
all of Patrick DeWitt's books
Version Control
Stephen Florida
We Love You, Charlie Freeman
The Nix
Mr. Monkey
Bad Marie
etc

[Michelle]

Lauren wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Alison wrote: "I've got two and a half books to go -- Waiting on Nothing to See Here from the library and I'm grinding my way through Oval with Overthrow waiting for me. I have to ..."

Yes I loved it. I even marked it down to purchase so I could read it again. I struggled too at first but can't tell you the page everything turned around for me as I read the electronic version.

[Lauren]

Michelle wrote: "Lauren wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Alison wrote: "I've got two and a half books to go -- Waiting on Nothing to See Here from the library and I'm grinding my way through Oval with Overthrow waiting for..."

Ok, thank you! I will push through until I get to the middle, and hopefully it will grab me by then. :)

[Bretnie]

I was getting myself hyped-up for Monday til I looked at the bracket and realized the start date isn't til Friday the 6th! Argh the waiting!

[Seth]

I have read nine of the books this year. It's hard for me to imagine any of them ultimately beating Girl, Woman, Other. The ones I HAVEN'T yet read, and probably won't read in time (because they don't interest me and don't seem to have a lot of enthusiasm behind them on here) are below. I suppose I could be convinced to squeeze in one more before the tournament begins, but I've already moved on to titles that I missed on the Grand Tournament list! (Really loving The Sisters Brothers...)

Haven't read:

The Testaments
Saudade
Golden State
Oval
We Cast a Shadow
The Water Dancer
Optic Nerve

[Caroline]

I'm getting to the final part of 'Fleishman is in Trouble' and if I didn't hate everyone in 'Trust Exercise' so much, I'd really be in a bind about whether I hate everyone in 'Normal People' or 'Fleishman' more.

'Fleishman' might win on the basis of how I feel like it's telling me I am a bad person if I don't care about these characters, whereas 'Normal' is just telling me an endless story about people I don't care about without worrying about how I feel about it.

Are there an unusual number of these kinds of books this year or is it just my mood?

[Michelle]

Bretnie wrote: "I was getting myself hyped-up for Monday til I looked at the bracket and realized the start date isn't til Friday the 6th! Argh the waiting!"

Does anyone know the full schedule? I have the brackets but can't seem to find the dates we will discussing the books.

[Drew]

I’m currently reading Optic Nerve and still have Aa This Could Be Yours and On Earth to go. I haven’t hated anything yet but Overthrow was close.

[Lauren]

Caroline wrote: "I'm getting to the final part of 'Fleishman is in Trouble' and if I didn't hate everyone in 'Trust Exercise' so much, I'd really be in a bind about whether I hate everyone in 'Normal People' or 'Fl..."

I also didn't care for any of the characters in Fleishman, Trust Exercise, and Normal People. Well, maybe I had some interest in Libby for the first one, but definitely not Toby and Rachel. Yuck.

These stood in stark contrast to other ToB books like Girl, Woman, Other where the author managed to make me fall in love with and care deeply about the outcomes for all of the characters within a few pages of their stories. I will be studying that one for character development in my creative writing pursuits. :)

[Lauren]

Michelle wrote: "Bretnie wrote: "I was getting myself hyped-up for Monday til I looked at the bracket and realized the start date isn't til Friday the 6th! Argh the waiting!"

Does anyone know the full schedule? I ..."

They were in the email:

Pre-Tournament Play-in Match
March 6
Golden State v. Oval v. We Cast a Shadow
Judged by Jeannie Vanasco


Opening Round
March 9
The Testaments v. Saudade
Judged by Micco Caporale

March 10
Normal People v. Fleishman Is in Trouble
Judged by Helen Rosner

March 11
Lost Children Archive v. Mary Toft; or, the Rabbit Queen
Judged by Meghan Deans

March 12
Girl, Woman, Other v. Nothing to See Here
Judged by Jenny Zhang

March 13
The Water Dancer v. Optic Nerve
Judged by Debbie Millman

March 16
On Earth We're Briefly Gorgeous v. Your House Will Pay
Judged by Lovia Gyarkye

March 17
Trust Exercise v. Overthrow
Judged by Catie Disabato

March 18
All This Could Be Yours v. Pre-Tournament Play-in Winner
Judged by Barry Harbaugh


Quarterfinals
March 19
TBD v. TBD
Judged by Maret Orliss

March 20
TBD v. TBD
Judged by Jade Chang

March 23
TBD v. TBD
Judged by Ethan Kuperberg

March 24
TBD v. TBD
Judged by Heather Cothran


Semifinals
March 25
TBD v. TBD
Judged by Ratik Asokan

March 26
TBD v. TBD
Judged by Deena ElGenaidi


Zombie Round
March 27
Zombie Pick No. 1 v. TBD
Judged by Dessa

March 30
Zombie Pick No. 2 v. TBD
Judged by Jeanna Kadlec


Championship
March 31
TBD v. TBD
Judged by All Judges

[Lark]

Good, at least they have just 1 judge for the play-in round this year. I can't remember what recent year it was where they had 3 or so judges and the writeup sounded like a bad podcast episode. In general I don't like the idea of a play-in round anyway and I'm not sure how it began. If they want to expand the tournament they can just make it a full round of 32.

[Jan]

Lark wrote: "If they want to expand the tournament they can just make it a full round of 32...."

Easier said than done, I'm sure! And much as I love the ToB, I do think it would be possible to overdose on it. :-)

[Jan]

Wanted to do a quick check-in since I'm traveling next week. I'm taking Saudade (in print) and the audio of All This Could Be Yours with me, and once I finish them , I will have read everything this year except Overthrow, which I decided to skip. My favorites at this point are GWO, Lost Children Archive, Mary Toft, Your House Will Pay, Trust Exercise, On Earth and Nothing to See Here. Most negative feelings about Fleishman, Normal, and Oval. Excited for the tournament to get rolling! Cheers, everybody!!

[Caroline]

Lauren wrote: "Caroline wrote: "I'm getting to the final part of 'Fleishman is in Trouble' and if I didn't hate everyone in 'Trust Exercise' so much, I'd really be in a bind about whether I hate everyone in 'Norm..."

Lauren -- yes, I loved 'Girl Woman Other' soooo much.

[Caroline]

I just realized that 'Normal People' is against 'Fleishman' while my two favorites so far (GWO and Nothing to See Here) are against each other in the first round too!!

Injustice :D

[Michelle]

Lauren wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Bretnie wrote: "I was getting myself hyped-up for Monday til I looked at the bracket and realized the start date isn't til Friday the 6th! Argh the waiting!"

Does anyone know the ..."
Thank You!

[Michelle]

Lauren wrote: "Michelle wrote: "Bretnie wrote: "I was getting myself hyped-up for Monday til I looked at the bracket and realized the start date isn't til Friday the 6th! Argh the waiting!"

Does anyone know the ..."


I never received an email and couldn't find the schedule posted on the site. Was I the only one? How do I get on the "list"?

[Lauren]

@Michelle you can enter your email address at the bottom of this webpage to get their emails: https://themorningnews.org/article/th...

[Susan]

Michelle, here’s the link to the article that contains links (in red font) to signing up for their newsletter or becoming a sustaining member (which grants all sorts of communication):

https://themorningnews.org/article/th...

[C]

Caroline wrote: "I'm getting to the final part of 'Fleishman is in Trouble' and if I didn't hate everyone in 'Trust Exercise' so much, I'd really be in a bind about whether I hate everyone in 'Normal People' or 'Fl..."

I know close to nothing about those four books... I haven't read them... precisely because they seem relationship-centric and seem to be about characters I won't like very much. (Yet, I'm a Call Me Zebra fan.) So yeah, I agree with you that there seem to be quite a few books like that this year.

[Michelle]

Thank you Lauren and Susan 😊 I'm all signed up👍

[Mindy]

"I know close to nothing about those four books... I haven't read them... precisely because they seem relationship-centric and seem to be about characters I won't like very much."

Is it necessary to like a character in order to find the character or book interesting?

[Lauren]

Mindy wrote: ""I know close to nothing about those four books... I haven't read them... precisely because they seem relationship-centric and seem to be about characters I won't like very much."

Is it necessary ..."

I don't think so. Based on the discussion of Mary Toft I read the author's previous novel Version Control. I didn't care too much for the protagonist and strongly disliked her husband (and the woman he worked with), but it was a fun-to-hate-the characters situation. I did really enjoy a secondary character in the story though. Even though I had negative or mild feelings toward the main characters, I still found it enjoyable to read and thought it touched on various important themes.

I can't think of too many other examples where I didn't like the characters but still liked the story though...

[Elizabeth]

Mindy wrote: "Is it necessary to like a character in order to find the character or book interesting?"

I'm thinking of Moshfegh, whose characters are definitely "interesting," but like Lauren said, their unlikabililty (and the books' general yuckiness) made it hard for me to like the story. Also thinking of The Magicians. Whereas even though I didn't like Toby and Rachel much in Fleishman, I did find myself sympathizing with them, and did like the books...Partly because of the voice, and the way the story was told, but also because she showed their humanity. And even though their lives as a whole weren't relatable, I thought their emotions were.

[Marionette]

I could not finish Confederacy of Dunces, which was a Pulitzer I think, because I couldn’t stomach the main character. Some terribly unlikable characters have my sympathy or a redeeming quality which helps to not turn me totally off of the book. But I usually need to like the main characters to finish a book.

[Carmel]

I definitely have trouble finishing (or even beginning) a book with characters I don't/won't like. That's too much like working with coworkers that push all my buttons! Time for a new job/book. ;-)

[C]

Mindy wrote: ""I know close to nothing about those four books... I haven't read them... precisely because they seem relationship-centric and seem to be about characters I won't like very much."

Is it necessary ..."

I love unlikable characters. But if it's also mostly just about relationships, then it won't really hold my interest, especially if they are unlikable in relationships. Again, not to say I know what those four books are like if I haven't read them.

[Heidi]

I DID IT! With Lost Children Archive, I have officially completed the TOB shortlist for the very first time and I couldn’t be prouder. I had already read two—Girl, Woman, Other and On Earth We’re Briefly Gorgeous—and listened to three—Overthrow, All This Could Be Yours, Nothing to See Here. My biggest (happy) surprises were Optic Nerve and Your House Will Pay. The others I’m still thinking about are We Cast a Shadow and Girl, Woman, Other. Overthrow and Oval were my biggest disappointments. Still not sure I understood Trust Exercise and could not be more “meh” about the Testaments if I tried.

The other day, I remembered that the reading of the books was not the prize, that I actually get to read thoughtful reflections, comment, and discuss in great detail all my thoughts and feelings about all the books throughout this month and I am looking forward to that more than I thought I would be. I don’t know if I’ll ever try to complete again, but I am vibrating with excitement for the tournament to really kick off on Friday!

[C]

Heidi wrote: "I DID IT! With Lost Children Archive, I have officially completed the TOB shortlist for the very first time and I couldn’t be prouder. I had already read two—Girl, Woman, Other and On Earth We’re B..."

Congrats Heidi!