Series: Wheel of Time by Robert Jordan

[Mason]

Lord of Chaos Spoilers

RAND -> (view spoiler)[

Alright so like a lot of folks, I thought the love square with Min, Aveindha, Elayne, and Rand was weird and a little off-putting. BUT... I think Jordan has changed my mind
(well, at least my understanding of it). I like this because each of the three women in Rand's life helps him in some way:

Min- Keeps him grounded. She probably has the most important part of this. She reminds him that he is not just the Dragon Reborn but still that woolheaded boy from two rivers.

Elayne- Helps him politically. Since Rand is just a boy from two rivers, he has no idea how to govern and command people. That is where Elayne comes in.

Aviendha- Helps with the Aeil. I feel like 90% of his followers are Aiel and I don't know about you guys but their way of life is really confusing. Aviendha guides him through all of this.

Now is this a weird way of writing in Rand's guidance? Yes, but I can understand it a little bit when I think of it this way.
(hide spoiler)]

[AndrewP]

Just starting 'The Shadow Rising'. Wow, it's about 30% longer than 'The Dragon Reborn' ! The hardback doesn't look any thicker, but it's a tiny font.

[Bobby]

AndrewP wrote: "Just starting 'The Shadow Rising'. Wow, it's about 30% longer than 'The Dragon Reborn' ! The hardback doesn't look any thicker, but it's a tiny font."

Haha I had all paperbacks of the first 8 books, and they started to get huge, but then got smaller. I didn't notice the first time, but on a re-read, Lord of Chaos (book 6) was way bigger than A Crown of Swords (book 7), which was way bigger than The Path of Daggers (book 8).

Then I started getting hardbacks as gifts each time the new book came out, and I seem to remember every hardback from book 9 on being bigger than the last.

[CBRetriever]

ah, the wonders of reading on a Kindle = adjustable fonts

I'm 63% through The Complete Wheel of Time which means I'm on chapter 5 of Crossroads of Twilight with 4 books to go after that one

[Aleksandra]

CBRetriever wrote: "I'm 63% through The Complete Wheel of Time which means I'm on chapter 5 of Crossroads of Twilight with 4 books to go after that one"

Well done! I'll finish soon Lord of Chaos and than I'll have 8 books left... I try not to think about number of pages left to read :)

[CBRetriever]

fortunately the compilation lacks page numbers, and just has locations

however, I often feel like I'm slogging through another compilation I'm reading: The North and South Trilogy: North and South / Love and War / Heaven and Hell

[Brendan]

Mason wrote: "Travis wrote: "I got sidetracked by Sanderson's Mistborn trilogy."

Such a good series! Hope you enjoyed that one."

I really like the Wheel of Time series. If I didn't and the only takeaway from all 14 books was connecting to Sanderson and Mistborn, it would have been worth it.

[Plaidchuck]

Finally picked the first one up so this will probably be my next big read.

[HeyT]

Well I've fallen way behind and only finished The Dragon Reborn today. I'm still liking the characters and the world which is good since there is so much more of it to come. Overall, (view spoiler)[I really enjoyed the fact that there was next to nothing of Rand's perspective at all. I think the fact that we see so little of him really shocks you when you do see him and how the effects of channeling are wearing on him. (hide spoiler)]

[AndrewP]

HeyT wrote: "Well I've fallen way behind and only finished The Dragon Reborn today. I'm still liking the characters and the world which is good since there is so much more of it to come. Overall,..."

Don't worry, your not the only one. I'm just started The Shadow Rising.

[Francisca]

Finally got The Great Hunt from the library so I'll go back and reread the comments as I read... :D

[CBRetriever]

I've made it into Knife of Dreams and things are turning bizarre

(view spoiler)[Tuon (love her) might end up Empress of the Seanchen, Rand might ally with the Seanchen, and Perrin definitely is trying to. The last book ended with Engwene captured (still don't know by who). (hide spoiler)]

Still at 68% of being through with The Complete Wheel of Time, so some of those later books must be massive

[Rob]

Yeah. Robert Jordan had said the series was going to end with book 12/Memory of Light.

Unfortunately he died before completing it.

Brandon Sanderson was picked to finish the series and he said in an interview that there was so much material in Jordan's notes he had no idea how he'd have done it in a single book.

Instead Sanderson wrote three rather meaty books and A Memory of Light became book 14.

[Melanie, the neutral party]

I finally finished The Eye of the World! I'm not even going to try and keep pace with the group, but I do plan on finishing the series. Within 1 year now seems an ambitious goal, but more realistic than reading them all this summer (my now abandoned plan A)

Catching up on Discussions:
#12 Jeanne (view spoiler)[“Do you guys visualize the WoT world similar to LOTR's Middle Earth or something entirely different?”

The landscape most definitely; though this is the landscape of many a fantasy tale. They all kind of blend together.

The people races? Trollics and fades are unique enough that I did not draw parallels as I was reading, but now that I am actively thinking about it I see how Trolloc are similar to orcs and faeds akin to the Nazgul. (hide spoiler)]

#39 Mas (view spoiler)[“The way the girls treat the boys seems almost condescending in a way.”

I agree. Specifically Nynaeve is way too aggressive. I don’t consider this a spoiler because this is how she is introduced. It’s a lot like Harry Potter in the Order of the Phoenix. Just angry all the time without release. (hide spoiler)]

#40 Sedat (view spoiler)[“They do so many stupid and mindless thing and it sometimes drove me mad too lol. I mean why would you not tell Moiraine about the dreams, you can argue that they don't trust her fully because of the aes sedai prejudice but come on man! She saved your village, your father, and you and your 2 best friends! What's it gonna take for you to trust her, never mind trusting at least don't think her as a darkfriend jeez! They don't trust her but they are easily manipulated in their dreams by the Baalzamon!?!”

This I actually understood! There are just soo many stories about Aes Sedai betraying/harming people. Plus Tom, who to the boys is the most trustworthy companion, cautioned against sharing with her.

Sedat: “Moiraine kept so much from the boys too.” Trust does need to be a two-way street. She could have done more to be reassuring. For all of her smarts, she lacks some social skills. She gives a kind first impression and is able to buy loyalty, but she does not take the time to get to know people intimately or to let them know her. (hide spoiler)]

#143 Ivy (view spoiler)[“I'd argue her flaws are her way of hiding the fact that she cares for those men so much but she doesn't want to be vulnerable because she's either been hurt or is afraid of being hurt again. In Book One [ (1) We learn she was close with her dad and he taught her all she knew but now he's dead. (2) Her relationship with Rand is similar to that of an older sister. It is mentioned she changed his diapers. Now he's in danger...she cares enough to follow him and try and get him safe...but there's a chance she'll fail and I don't know if she can live with herself if she does. (3) She confesses her love to Lan and he rejects her. So she learns that being honest about matters of the heart doesn't really get you anywhere. Time to throw a tantrum?”

I get what you are saying, but I don’t think it was delivered well in the writing. (hide spoiler)]

#191 Travis (view spoiler)[ “I'm a little frustrated at how frequently he uses character mistrust as a plot engine, and I don't understand why anyone is in love with Rand, let alone two of the series' most interesting characters so far. But I really love watching how all of the different pieces come together and then spin apart.”

I definitely agree with you on ALL of that. The mistrust seems like it’s integral to the world building. It is a fractured society. There isn’t a single, trustworthy government. Even the “good guys” are at odds with each other. Children of the light hate Aes Sedai; Queen’s guards hate children of the light; Aes Sedai has factions that oppose each other. Therefore, people need to choose a side and submit to the demands of loyalty, or like Two Rivers, say away from it all entirely and live in their own buble hoping the rest of the world doesn’t notice them. Honestly, team evil seems way more cohesive than the forces of good, which probably attributes to their success. (What? There’s no modern political parallelle I’m make here!) (hide spoiler)]

My Takeaways and Questions:
1. The book really dragged for me in the beginning. It took me 3 tries at starting the book to get far enough in to really be engaged. (view spoiler)[The book picked up and the stakes changed when the party split up. That was when I really got into it. (hide spoiler)]

2. I appreciate how (view spoiler)[all of the “side quests” integrated themselves into the main storyline (hide spoiler)].

3. Character building was inconsistent. Specifically, I felt Nynaeve and Lan were poorly crafted for most of the book. Thusly (view spoiler)[when they begin their quasi-romance it seems random and unbelievable. Worse, I didn’t really care if they got together or not. (hide spoiler)]

I can’t decide if Rand/Perrin (view spoiler)[constantly thinking/commenting the other one is “good with girls” (hide spoiler)] is realistic writing or poor characterization.

4. Min’s Observations/ (view spoiler)[?Prophecies? (hide spoiler)]
I get most of them, but I kept turning back to this section of the book expecting to fully understand it by the end. I am now assuming, some parts are allusions to future books in the series. But I still question (view spoiler)[Tom’s lines: “juggling fire, and the White Tower.” Since this character is dead I assumed I should be able to understand this. (hide spoiler)]

[Melanie, the neutral party]

Request to the group. Can you bee more consistent stating what book you are talking about in each post for us poor folks that are behind in the reading?

[CBRetriever]

Melanie wrote: "Request to the group. Can you bee more consistent stating what book you are talking about in each post for us poor folks that are behind in the reading?"

some times it's generic over multiple books like the question about why people don't trust the Aes Sedai

and I usually try to do the reply to, so if the person I'm replying to has already referenced the book, I don't mention it again otherwise i do state which book usually

[AndrewP]

I believe he said it would end with A Memory of Light, even if it took him 2,000 pages or more.

[Francisca]

Spoilers for Great Hunt which I finished practically in one go (hurrah summer)

(view spoiler)[ This really pulls you in! The character development in the second book is much better, and since the girls spend more time away from the boys there's a lot less of the annoying banter. The testing chapter is really great too.

I think a lot of the boy's mistrust of Moiraine et al is because they play things so close to the chest. I liked the chapters from her perspective here, since it gave more depth to why - she has a lot to lose too! And I love Verin, especially the way she just nonchalantly accepts all of the craziness. Also, if you found out that you were fated to pull people along to some great destiny that it likely to involve even more suffering, running around, and killing than you've already experienced, heck, I'd try to deny it as much as possible too! I think they all, especially Rand, feel somewhat helpless, even as they take on more agency. There's some scene here where Rand snaps at Loial to stop calling the trio ta'averen that really resonated - but you also see how they start growing as they accept their role (Perrin with his wolves to track Fain and Mat when he blows the Horn).

Also, I agree with all the people irritated by Selene/Lanfear. That woman is clearly bad news as soon as she shows up.... And couldn't Jordan have settled on one girl for Rand? Did there have to be four , and that's not counting Lanfear!


(hide spoiler)]

[CBRetriever]

I've made it to the last book. Lots of surprises coming up.

[HeyT]

I just finished The Shadow Rising and I'm still liking most of the characters and the world. (view spoiler)[I really loved seeing the history of the Aiel in this one how they were originally non-violent and that the tinkers are a branch of Aiel. The only thing that truly makes me rage in this series is the continuation of Rand's Harem. I just cannot understand what is so great about him. (hide spoiler)]

[CBRetriever]

(view spoiler)[tall, good looking, powerful ... think of him as the Justin Beiber, Paul McCartney, Mel Gibson, good looking rock star of his time with all the girls dying to meet him (hide spoiler)]

[[deleted user]]

when i am thru with wrestling with V Hugo i will take The Great Hunt into my lap

[AndrewP]

HeyT wrote: "I just finished The Shadow Rising and I'm still liking most of the characters and the world. [spoilers removed]"

I just finished that one too. For me it was the first one where I really started to connect with the characters.

[Aleksandra]

Few days ago Brandon Sanderson announced that new WoT story will be published in Unfettered III. I cannot see
Sanderson on book page (authors section) but here's his blog with announcement: https://www.goodreads.com/author_blog...

[Aleksandra]

John wrote: "I look forward to reading the missing piece, as well as the other short stories. I only have read the first Unfettered and thought it was enjoyable. About a 7 month wait though, will most likely have to special order it. "

I also can’t wait, especially because there’s hint of some unanswered question :) with or without story it’s really good thing to purchase this book and support their battle.

[Travis]

I'm a third of the way through Lord of Chaos...

(view spoiler)[It is, as everyone says, slower than the previous books. In the chapter I just finished, Egwene complained about an experience producing loads of questions with no answers, and I LOLed because it felt like that's also the purpose of this whole volume so far.

But I'm still enjoying how the world is becoming more layered and complex.

My main complaint isn't pace, actually. It's that so many of the characters seem to be in such ruts and that so many of their interactions seem based on annoyance and mistrust. There are very few relationships here where people actually talk to one another instead of turning conversation into some sort of power struggle. It'd be nice to have some balance! (hide spoiler)]

[Aleksandra]

I’ve finished series yeeey! I’m actually going to miss all the glaring and skirt smoothing :D

[HeyT]

I finished The Fires of Heaven last night and had to immediately start Lord of Chaos because of a couple of cliff hangery type moments. My only thing about book 6 right now though is how is 80 pages a prologue?? Slap a number on that bad boy and call it a chapter already.

[Mason]

Haha yeah they get longer. I think the books after have 90+ page prologues 😂

[Rob]

Yeah, they do get longer in general. Or at least stay that long.

The prologue for A Memory of Light was released as a stand-alone novella ahead of its release: By Grace and Banners Fallen: Prologue to A Memory of Light

[Chris]

I have finally gotten around to diving into this series. I'm halfway finished with The Eye of the World and already looking forward to the next one.

[Bobby]

Chris wrote: "I have finally gotten around to diving into this series. I'm halfway finished with The Eye of the World and already looking forward to the next one."

Awesome! It's nice to see a new person pick up this series. It's a big reading commitment, but it's well worth it.

[HeyT]

Okay so I've gotten through Chapter 12 of Lord of Chaos and (view spoiler)[I was seriously side eyeing Elayne for thinking she would make Rand her warder and then boom out of no where Alanna is like boom wardered. So now even though I didn't want Elayne to do it to him I'm super pissed that Alanna did it without his consent and like I think I would have preferred Elayne to do it to him if it had to be done at all? I'm so confused because I hate Rand's harem but I think it would be less disgusting if one of his harem bound him because right now it feels really gross and I am like horrified on his behalf. (hide spoiler)]

[AndrewP]

HeyT wrote: "Okay so I've gotten through Chapter 12 of Lord of Chaos and [spoilers removed]"

Yeah, I had the same thoughts as you on that part. I'm on chapter 34 and Rand's life doesn't get any easier.

[HeyT]

Welp now that I'm on break and there are no real family obligations I'm starting to pick this up a bit more. I'm now up to chapter 41 of Lord of Chaos and (view spoiler)[like how out of the blue is this Egwene the Amyrlin business? I mean I love that she's as crafty as Suiane Sanche but like it's crazy. I also was really happy to see them all reunited and not just in telhanriod or w/e. And while I will forever hate Rand's harem I was glad to see Aviendha and Elayne come to an understanding as friends. Now I want to see Aviendha and Min meet. (hide spoiler)]

[HeyT]

I finished Lord of Chaos and wow did that pick up towards the end. (view spoiler)[So many things happened with the whole Rand gets kidnapped and like Perrin shows up to the party and LAN appears for like a paragraph but still! idk it's like so much coasting by and then the last ten chapters are like i hope you're ready for this and boom everything happens. (hide spoiler)]

[Bobby]

HeyT wrote: "I finished Lord of Chaos and wow did that pick up towards the end. [spoilers removed]"

The ending to that book is one of my favorite moments in the series.

(view spoiler)[The battle of Dumai's Wells and Rand's escape from the Aes Sedai is just amazing, and I remember being stunned after reading it the first time. Even on re-reads I still get chills when the "Asha'Man, Kill!" line comes out. (hide spoiler)]

[HeyT]

Yeah I spent most of the book wondering what the cover image in my edition came from and it was from that scene.

[AndrewP]

Same here, just finished Lord of Chaos yesterday and was surprised on how the pace of the book picked up during the last quarter. That more than made up for the very slow start.

[AndrewP]

Ten months since my last post and I'm finished! I fell well behind on the original 'one a month' schedule of the original post, but I got there in the end.
If anyone else in still struggling on books 7-10 I can tell you that it's well worth in in the end. Sanderson really picks up the pace in the last three books. A great series and I'm glad I had some incentive to read the whole thing:)

[Allison, Fairy Mod-mother]

Hey congrats!! That's a huge accomplishment. I'm so glad you stuck with it and you were happy with the ending@!

[HeyT]

Congrats on finishing! I need to start book seven but I'm putting that on hold until January after I graduate.

[Mason]

Congrats man! I felt the same way when I finished it. 7-10 were definitely worth it in the end. Slow, but brought some information that helps bring together the ending.

[HeyT]

Now that the holidays are over and I've finished grad school I'm picking this back up with A Crown of Swords. It's been an entire year since I finished book six.

[Nichelle]

I started rereading this series earlier this year and am on book 4, The Shadow Rising (or 5, if you count A New Spring as 1). It's been years since I read these, and am appreciative again of the world building and strong characters.

[HeyT]

Okay so I finished A Crown of Swords and I'm still enjoying my time in this world. (view spoiler)[I'm kind of excited the Seanchan are back because they are such good bad guys (hide spoiler)]

[Nichelle]

Almost done with The Shadow Rising. I had forgotten all the strange dominance/submission conflict that Jordan put in all his relationships. Love the world and most of the characters, but this relationship weirdness is annoying.

Does anyone else dislike Faile? What on earth does Perrin see in her?

[Jen]

I've decided to start doing this too, as I've always wanted to read this series. Starting Wheel of Time shortly!

[John]

AndrewP wrote: "... Sanderson really picks up the pace in the last three books...."

that phrase is great to see as those 3 are the only ones I have not read and picked them up a bit ago. Suspect not till summer and by then, this thread may have caught up.

[Gabi]

I started the second book on audio yesterday and I'm having the hell of a time not to get confused with the world of the Stormlight Archive ^^'.