The Mookse and the Gripes discussion
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2018 MBI longlist and shortlist discussion
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Paul
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Apr 27, 2018 06:57AM
For avoidance of doubt ridiculous was my self-depreciating word not yours at all - was an element in my post of clickbait in hoping it lured people to click through to the article!
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Great to see that our views have attracted attention :)
All thirteen done and dusted now (having saved the worst, by far, for last). Time to start doing a little rereading...
From dynamic rankings: No massive issue with your lack of love for White Book Jonathan, but have to question your existence of love for your number 1 choice.
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Hugh wrote: "I have just updated the table, but it hasn't changed much!"Thankfully
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Yes if we discount the votes from those who didn't put it first, and indeed mostly hated it, it is indeed 2nd.And if West Brom only counted the points from the games they had won they would have a 100% record this season.
:-)
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I am still standing by my decision to rank Flights first.
Yes I would exclude those who have only ranked 1 as it distorts things (too many 1sts, but also drags the book's ranking towards the average)
Judge Helen Oyeyemi on what she looks for in a book then a brief intro to the shortlist.https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p066...
The paranoid in me can't help but feel that she omits certain criteria (like high quality prose for example) and that there is one book that ticks all of her boxes....
Please no!!!!!
Helen Oyeyemi is awesome, and her criteria are spot-on - you go, Vernon Subutex, take the prize!!!!
See Meike's comment! I am now going to end up hating the winner of my favourite prize!!My lesson for 2018 - if you want to ensure a prize doesn't disappoint you - make sure you are on the jury!
I love Helen Oyeyemi and I didn't hate VS1 but The White Book and Flights (especially Flights for me) deserve it so much more! Ugh.
Paul I am tempted to add to your 2018 lesson " and then be prepared to fight hard on the judging panel for the books you like and find ways to spike the chances of the ones you don't"
Yes, shame Helen Oyeyemi wasn't on the RoC jury as there would have been only one winner:Patty Yumi Cottrell's prose does so many of my favorite things--some too subtle to talk about without spoiling, but one thing I have to mention is the way in which her heroine's investigation of a suicide draws the reader right into the heart of this wonderfully spiky hedgehog of a book and then elbows us yet further along into what is ultimately a tremendously moving act of imagination.".
(which means that my beloved Helen was the of the awards - oh dear)
Live stream of translators event now on Man Booker Facebook page apparently. Hope to be there live myself but running late...
I know the winner of this year wasn't even announced, but it's never too early to start speculating (and hey, I called Subutex in October 2017! :-)). So for the IMBP 2019, I'm predicting a strong contender from Switzerland: The Dead: A Novel. Here's my review.
Interesting article from various MBI translators on their favourite untranslatable word from the books http://mentalfloss.com/article/544537...
Paul wrote: "Interesting article from various MBI translators on their favourite untranslatable word from the books http://mentalfloss.com/article/544537......"
Thank you for this, Paul. I am a sucker for things like untranslatable words. They should do this every year. I don't know how much I agree with "On" being untranslatable from French into English - it just has different meanings depending on context.
On the eve of announcement, I think we can safely call the Goodreads M&G forum verdict for The White Book.With Flights a clear (but distant) 2nd and FiB and Vernon Subutex fighting for 3rd spot.
Which I suspect may end our 100% streak of picking the winner as, while I think it is arguably the best book, I suspect the same author/translator won't be picked 2 years out of 3.
Meanwhile the Shadow Jury of bloggers & reviewers has just announced its verdict....
The announcement:It's been ten weeks since the Man Booker International Prize longlist was announced, and in that time the Shadow Panel has been working away in the background, reading frantically while discussing the merits and flaws of the selected titles. From the thirteen books we were given by the official judges, we chose a shortlist of six (only two of which made the official cut!), and off we set again, to reread as much as possible in the time we had left. Then, we discussed the books a little more before voting for our favourites, culminating in the choice of our favourite work of translated fiction from the previous year's crop. And who might that be?
THE WINNER OF THE 2018 SHADOW MAN BOOKER INTERNATIONAL PRIZE IS:
OLGA TOKARCZUK'S FLIGHTS
(FITZCARRALDO EDITIONS, TRANSLATED BY JENNIFER CROFT)
Congratulations to all involved! While not a unanimous decision, Flights easily won the majority of votes from our judges. In fact, in the seven years we've been shadowing the prizes (IFFP, then MBIP), this was the clearest winner by far, showing how impressed we were by Tokarczuk's integration of seemingly disparate pieces into a mesmerising whole. Thanks must also go to Croft for her excellent work on the book - as always, it's only with the help of the translator that we're able to read this book at all.
A special mention should also go to Fitzcarraldo Editions. This is their second consecutive MBIP Shadow Prize, as we selected Mathias Énard's Compass as our winner for 2017; they have proved to be one of the UK's rising stars of fiction (and non-fiction) in translation.
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It was the one that most grew in my estimation when I re-read the list.
A worthy ( shadow) winner. I expect (and hope) this wins the Man Book vote later this week.
An excellent choice by the shadow jury and I hope it goes on to win the prize.At the time of reading, The White Book made, I think, a deeper impression on me. But Flights is the book that has stayed with me more since finishing it.
The White Book is I still think quite stunning and a rare book that moved me emotionally. But Flights is I think the more complex work.
Although the translator of Flights was also a lucky recipient of a t-shirt last week at the translator readings and is now rooting for Vernon.Jennifer Croft (@jenniferlcroft) tweeted at 6:27 pm on Sun, May 20, 2018:
I’m easily the coolest person in Paris now thanks to translator and fashion designer @Terribleman and writer Virginie Despentes. @ManBookerPrize @TrudaSpruyt https://t.co/NdAMOZctdV
(https://twitter.com/jenniferlcroft/st...)
Even without a t-shirt, I will not be disappointed if Subutex wins.
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Safe to say that Vernon didn't exactly run Flights close on the shadow panel - but who knows what free t-shirts might have done.I do think it has a good chance to take the overall prize as this jury are clearly Love-Its on the marmite scale.
But as we have said here many times, second guessing a jury is something of a fool's errand.
It is a remarkably engaging book. I think I like Attrib. and other stories better, or they are equally matched, but Flights is hard to put down.
I presented Olga Tokarczuk and Jennifer Croft with the Shadow Prize last night. Jennifer Croft had followed the shadow deliberations on twitter and was excited, but probably fair to say Olga Tokarczuk was a little more bemused:
Excellent picture Paul and such a good idea.
Here's hoping the 'real' judges follow our lead...
The audience last night seemed to be Flights fans. Although Frank Wynne had obviously run out of t-shirts to hand out to curry favour hence the mood swing on VS.A little disappointing actually that three authors didn't show up last night although I suspect the fact that we had pre-announced our prize Monday morning may have accounted for Han Kang's almost immediate late cancellation in response (the timing is too much of a coincidence if you ask me!).
It's a real shame as she could have just handed out plain white t shirts.
Is it just me or these past few days (more so than in the preceding months) voices have been whispering about a potential win from Vernon Subutex? Might just be me. Joining the chorus here to say that I really do hope Flights wins this year. Although I have terrible record with predicting either the MBI or English Booker.
I think it is because a) some people here loved it (and others the opposite) so would tend to be an interesting choice
b) related to a), the judges picked it for the long- and short-list so it suggests they are in the 'love' camp and hence it has a chance to win (whereas some other books feel shortlist worthy but not winners). See eg. The Sellout or Eleanor Oliphant from recent awards
c) some interviews with judges have suggested some very positive views for VS1
d) did I mention free t-shirts?
Incidentally one of the judges did a live twitter stream from the judging meeting. Sounds like they had quite a debate to get to a winner, so it wasn't as near*-unanimous as the shadow panel.
And the winner is Flights !!!!!The shadow jury"s advice was heeded!
Flights it is.
I'm so happy! This is the first time my preferences align with the jury's.
I think that has to be an omen for Rachel Cusk to sweep the anglosphere - two authors united by a love for a crafty ciggy when they are supposed to be signing books and also by the experience of encountering severe online hostility (Olga via her joint Facebook page with Jennifer Croft, Rachel Cusk on Mumsnet)
I have yet to Read Cusk but I think I will pick her up soon.
Do tell more about the Facebook page
The host brought it up last night, and sounded as if Jennifer Croft had teed it up to discuss, although Olga T didn't seem to want to talk about it.She said something when collecting an award in Poland that got nationalist nutters in a rage, and when Jennifer Croft (who runs the page - Olga Tokarczuk is no fan of social media) woke up the next morning she had insults, even death threats.
It relates to The Book of Jacob - which Jennifer Croft is working on now for release next year.
Croft explains all here: https://lithub.com/when-an-author-you...
Tokaczuk's response to the abuse she received:“This experience has taught me that hate mail, or hatred, even if it’s able to engulf so many people and incite them to such aggressive, undignified behavior, nonetheless it also—and in spite of their intentions—leads to the creation of a countermovement. The enormous amount of solidarity I’ve experienced is a testament to this.
But it would be in vain for my aggressive and belligerent adversaries to await a response. I will not have a conversation in a climate of threats and invectives. I encourage them instead to read and to honestly reflect on the subject of Polish history; this history is comprised not only of great and glorious moments, but also of periods of shame and disgrace. Such discussions are incredibly necessary for us to have. Better late than never.
Polish nationalists and Mumsnet. I know which one would scare me most and it's not Polish.
The Mookse and the Gripes
Books mentioned in this topic
Under the Rock: The Poetry of a Place (other topics)Attrib. and other stories (other topics)
The Dead (other topics)
Satantango (other topics)
The Dead (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
Helen Oyeyemi (other topics)Laurent Binet (other topics)
Javier Cercas (other topics)
Virginie Despentes (other topics)
Jenny Erpenbeck (other topics)
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