Classics and the Western Canon discussion

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The Blithedale Romance
Blithedale Romance
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Blithedale Romance - Preface through Ch. 7

"Veil-It was white, with somewhat of a subdued silver sheen, like the sunny side of a cloud; and, falling over the wearer from head to foot, was supposed to insulate her from the material world, from time and space, and to endow her with many of the privileges of a disembodied spirit"
"knew the pale, elderly face, with the red-tipt nose, and the patch over one eye;”
“only revealing enough of himself to make me recognize him as an acquaintance.”
"Zenobia, by the bye, as I suppose you know, is merely her public relations name; a sort of mask in which she comes before the world”
“plunged into the heart of the pitiless snowstorm, in quest of a better life.” (Here I felt like the snow covered everything and that this was significant.)
Mr. Coverdale
In addition to the covering/veiled/hidden element, there is also mention of spirits. I guess this makes sense as spirits are covered by mortal bodies.
But it's still early in the story for me to make any comments on socialism, I think. I'll be on the lookout for that theme.
Holly

And, what was the "response [by the Veiled Lady to his question on the success of the Blithedale enterprise] of the true Sibylline stamp,—nonsensical in its first aspect, yet on closer study unfolding a variety of interpretations"?
My main feeling as I read these first seven chapters was of walking on very slippery ice, never being quite secure in my footing, slip-sliding about and not seeming to have much control over what I was reading.

"The pleasant firelight! I must still keep harping on it. ...it was fortunate for us, on that wintry eve of our untried life, to enjoy the warm and radiant luxury of a somewhat too abundant fire. If it served no other purpose, it made the men look so full of youth, warm blood, and hope, and the women—such of them, at least, as were anywise convertible by its magic—so very beautiful, ...we people of superior cultivation and refinement (for as such, I presume, we unhesitatingly reckoned ourselves) felt as if something were already accomplished towards the millennium of love. "



One dictionary's definition of blithe is a casual and cheeful indifference considered to be callous or improper. The singlular appearance of the word blithe seems to be in line with this notion:
Sometimes, encountering a traveller, we shouted a friendly greeting; and he, unmuffling his ears to the bluster and the snow-spray, and listening eagerly, appeared to think our courtesy worth less than the trouble which it cost him. The churl! He understood the shrill whistle of the blast, but had no intelligence for our blithe tones of brotherhood. This lack of faith in our cordial sympathy, on the traveller's part, was one among the innumerable tokens how difficult a task we had in hand for the reformation of the world.I get the sense that the blithe attitude as it is both held and delivered with a romantic insincerity that is grudgingly underappreciated. With all the talk of masks above, the blithe attitude seems to be yet another one of casual cheerfulness possibly veiling some underlying callous impropriety.

Dale is defined as an open valley, especially a broad one in an area of low hills. It seems to me it could represent a low spot, or a low point in ones' life, or even a depression. Coverdale does not seem shy about foreshadowing the melancholy outlook of events both at the time, and in recollection.

Romance: to invent or indulge in fanciful or extravagant stories or daydreams. As blithe and low as events may bet, he does seem to indulge himself in a romantic outlook of the events both at the time and in his recollection. He even paints himself as a hero:
The greatest obstacle to being heroic is the doubt whether one may not be going to prove one's self a fool; the truest heroism is to resist the doubt; and the profoundest wisdom to know when it ought to be resisted, and when to be obeyed.He defends his participation in events even further:
Yet, after all, let us acknowledge it wiser, if not more sagacious, to follow out one's daydream to its natural consummation, although, if the vision have been worth the having, it is certain never to be consummated otherwise than by a failure. And what of that? Its airiest fragments, impalpable as they may be, will possess a value that lurks not in the most ponderous realities of any practicable scheme. They are not the rubbish of the mind. Whatever else I may repent of, therefore, let it be reckoned neither among my sins nor follies that I once had faith and force enough to form generous hopes of the world's destiny—yes!—and to do what in me lay for their accomplishmentRomanticizing the events, which are clearly becoming an ordeal, seems yet another mask along with the cheerful yet callous and improper indifference to cover and somehow salvage a mistake; a low point in Coverdale's, and perhaps the author's life.

http://www.ancient.eu/zenobia/

http://www.ancient.eu/zenobia/"
One wonders, then, why she took on this name, and if that's the historical character she was basing her choice on.



Hollingsworth, according to our narrator, “was never really interested in our socialist scheme,” his mind preoccupied with his plan for reforming criminals. The waif-like Priscilla has apparently come for the sole purpose of groveling at Zenobia’s feet. Zenobia is clothed in mystery, “a sister to the veiled lady.” And our narrator who “delights” in hearing his own verses, seems more preoccupied with ogling at and unraveling the enigma that is Zenobia than with participating in the promise of Blithedale.
In some ways, the truth is veiled with all four characters. They don’t come across as sincere or forthright. It’s as if each is playing a role, acting a part, hiding behind a mask, harboring a secret. Our narrator makes it his business to “unmask” the three. The irony is that he, too, is unmasked. He reveals more of his unsavory character than he is aware. My dislike/distrust of him increased exponentially when they all sat together for their first meal. Seeing Silas, his wife, and the two maids seated at the table with him, our narrator refers to himself as having "superior cultivation and refinement."
I like Silas. Solid, sturdy Silas Foster. He serves as a foil for the foursome. There is nothing mysterious or hidden about him. What you see is what you get. He comes in from laboring in the field and speaks to them “as if he were speaking to his oxen.” (I just love that.) They wax eloquent with their visionary schemes. He plunks them back to earth with his focus on the practical:
Which man among you," quoth he, "is the best judge of swine? Some of us must go to the next Brighton fair, and buy half a dozen pigs.
He gulps his tea, helps himself to slices of ham and bread with a zest that has little concern for proper table etiquette—much to the chagrin of our narrator who describes him as
...perpetrating terrible enormities with the butter-plate; and in all other respects behaving less like a civilized Christian than the worst kind of an ogre.
But Silas is unfazed by proper table manners just as he is unfazed by Priscilla’s theatrical, drama-queen entrance. He offers practical advice:
Give the girl a hot cup of tea and a thick slice of this first-rate bacon," said Silas, like a sensible man as he was. "That's what she wants. Let her stay with us as long as she likes, and help in the kitchen, and take the cow-breath at milking time; and, in a week or two, she'll begin to look like a creature of this world.
In the midst of the secrecy and fakery that enshroud our foursome, we have Silas. Solid, straightforward, practical, feet-on-the-ground Silas. He reminds me of Gerasim in The Death of Ivan Ilych. Honest. Hard-working. Laborer. Dirt under his fingernails, mud on his boots.
What’s not to like?


Nice comment. Yes, Silas is a great contrast to the utopians who have this concept of the ideal community (or at least one or two of them do, and presumably there are others, whether or not we will meet them in future) but no pragmatic knowledge of experience of how to pull it off.
It reminds me of the passage from T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men:
Between the idea
And the reality
Between the motion
And the act
Falls the Shadow
And surely there is a shadow hovering around that dinner table the first night. How it will reveal itself will, perhaps, emerge in future chapters.

Between the idea
And the reality
Between the motion
And the act
Falls the Shadow..."
I love the connection you made. This is one of my favorite poems. Thank you.

Aleph-I'd be interested in more of your thoughts on this and how you see it in the work. Usually exoticism relates to faraway countries, but you are taking the definition in a different manner, and I'd love to hear more.
Holly

My favourite example:
Coverdale: 'These ruddy window panes cannot fail to cheer the hearts of of all that look at them. Are they not warm with the beacon-fire which we have kindled for humanity?'
'The blaze of the brushwood will only last a minute or two longer,' observed Silas Foster; but whether he meant to insinuate that our moral illumination would have as brief a term, I cannot say.
It's simply perfect as a representation of reality vs idealism, both in the characters and the language. Foster is exactly the kind of practical man who could potentially live in this socialist, naturalist world, while the lofty, airy idealism of Coverdale fails rather rapidly when faced with any hardship.

Emma,
I can see the humor now that you have drawn attention to it. When I first read it, though, I found Coverdale's propensity for clothing the prosaic in lofty, idealistic language very tiresome.
Give me the down-to-earth language of Silas any time.

Coverdale: 'These ruddy window panes cannot fail to cheer the hearts of of all that look at them. Are they not warm with the beacon-fire which we have kindled for humanity?"
I thought he meant it quite sincerely. It's a combination of the idealism of the project (beacon fire kindled for humanity) and the observation of the moment (ruddy window panes). I thought he really meant it seriously.
Don't forget, he's a poet, so he would think in terms of taking a specific reality (the window panes) and developing it into a wider meaning. Is that what poets of the time did much of the time?

Yes, but doesn't he sound pretentious?
Hawthorne follows Coverdale's lofty sentiment with Silas' practical reminder that the blaze of brushwood "will only last a minute or two longer."
Doesn't that suggest that Hawthorne is knocking Coverdale down a peg or two? Perhaps even ridiculing him?


I'm not sure it's ridiculing. Unless it's self-ridicule; after all, Hawthorne was one of the first residents of Brook Farm, so it would seem that he might -- might -- be modeling Coverdale on himself.
I think what he's doing is emphasizing the effete/intellectual/poetic approach to Blithedale against the pragmatic/working man approach of Silas. I think he belabors the point more than he needs to, but he might know his audience (American readers in 1852, who might not have been the most sophisticated readers) so feels he needs to hammer the point home.
Just speculation, of course. But if he meant it humorously, he fooled Henry James, who called it "the lightest, the brightest, the liveliest" of Hawthorne's "unhumorous fictions."

Do you really think he doesn't?





Hawthorn also demonstrates temporal exoticism in the opening paragraphs when he describes clairvoyants of some 12 to 15 years earlier, as exemplified by the Veiled Lady, as being so much more of a special and intriguing attraction than the present times:
she was a phenomenon in the mesmeric line; one of the earliest that had indicated the birth of a new science, or the revival of an old humbug. Since those times her sisterhood have grown too numerous to attract much individual notice; nor, in fact, has any one of them come before the public under such skilfully contrived circumstances of stage effect as those which at once mystified and illuminated the remarkable performances of the lady in question.In this case he gives some argument as to why this is so. Is this perhaps to make us think he does not view everything from the past with a simple romantic eye?

And, what was the "response [by the..."
When Priscilla arrived with Mr. Hollingsworth, I surmised that was the very great favor that Mr. Moodie wanted of Coverdale....to bring her. Am I jumping to connclusions?

One dictionary's definition of blithe is a casual and cheeful indifference considered to be callous or improper. The singlular appearance of the word blithe seems to be in line w..."
I also looked up some meanings and I got the impression that the use of Blithe as a casual indifference was a relatively contemporary definition, but in Hawthorne's day it meant cheerful, gay etc. Certainly that would go along with the idea of a utopian or Eden setting. Everyone getting along, equal & happy. Naïve thinking to say the least!

Romance: to invent or indulge in fanciful or extravagant stories or daydreams. As blithe and low as events may bet, he does seem to indulge himself in a romantic outlook of the ..."
Boy, that wouldn't be my definition of romance, but certainly fits here. Another word I had to look up was "phantasmagorical", because for some reason I associated it with horrific apparitions. The definition that came up was a rapid sequence of images, or a dream.

Me too. Enjoying this writing a lot more than when I read The House of the Seven Gables !

Coverdale: 'These ruddy window panes cannot fail to cheer the hearts of of all that look at them. Are they not warm wit..."
That could well be the case, I can certainly see him being genuinely idealistic and overdramatic. Perhaps the immediate deflating of lots of his statements by himself or another character must be Hawthorne making a point? His lofty imaginings rarely get to go on too long before being neutralised. It's amused me throughout.
Interesting that James called it 'unhumorous'. I'm wondering whether it's my modern and very unromantic sensibilities that are upping the humour aspect? I imagine myself meeting someone who speaks and thinks like Coverdale now and it makes me smile, I would definitely play the bring-them-down-to-earth role Foster does.

They are brilliant together, I doubt either would be as effective alone.

I think you're right, that's what has been making me laugh. Coverdale even does it to himself in parts.

That fits with the way i've read it, great point.

I haven't tried THotSG again, but almost twenty years ago now my f2f book club read The Scarlet Letter together. Somehow, that experience opened me up to Hawthorne as other than just the sermonizing legate of puritan New England that my teenage mind had caricatured him.

The narrator's interest is focused on the women, their backgrounds, their sexualities, their relationship with each other, their relationship with him, their roles, far more than this great social experiment he is on the brink of.
So at the start of this novel, I'm curious whether Blithedale is just a convenient backdrop for a novel of male/female interactions, or is Hawthorne deliberately using an unreliable narrator to represent the sharp contrast between idealism and the real driving goals of being a human?

I smiled at the note in my Penguin classics edition: "...Probably due to Sophia Hawthorne's prudishness, this sentence ['I almost fancied myself actually beholding it.'] was deleted from the original manuscript."
This is such fun to read across American (U.S.) history when the (alt?) news yesterday erupted with the stories about our VP's (and his wife's?) self restrictions on conduct! I also have been concurrently reading Jonathan Haidt's The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion wherein he holds forth that conservatives stand on a six legged platform of morality that includes sanctity and purity as well as care and concern ( and loyalty, respect, liberty, and fairness -- to paraphrase very roughly), whereas liberals tend to focus more on care and concern. I'll not comment here on whether I agree or disagree with that assessment, just that I noticed the continuity of the concerns across the years.
Incidentally, before we finish, we will be called to compare with John Bunyan's "popular allegory of the soul's progress toward salvation."
(Sorry, Goodreads is being funky on handling titles this morning. I'll try to come back and correct later. I did want to indicate with a link. Haven't been able to correct this, despite many attempts and variations.)
It may let me put it here:
The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion

Agreed. Enjoyed the passages you called out for us, as well as ones pulled by others of us. It just seems to me this work begs for this kind of re-chewing the words (okay, savoring again, -- like tasting for that hidden but almost recognizable spice).

Aren't the humor and satire part of what rescue this from being "one long tedious sermon"? Or maybe it is yet -- a long tedious sermon against any hope of accomplishing an idyllic or paradisaical living arrangement...? As Roger says @15, the boot prints on the pure white snow immediately provide a premonition of where the story is headed. Still, Hawthorne is sustaining suspense on the "how" from here to there. (Did Hawthorne plant a spoiler up front? )

Emma wrote: "Interesting that James called it 'unhumorous'."
I have the impression that Coverdale is trying to mask his pain or depression (dale) over the matter with humor. Sometimes the poetic or romantic imagery (romance) he creates is so extreme it seems desperate; as if he is trying too hard to make the memories more cheerful (blithe) than the experience actually was. However, similar to what Emma mentioned, it is difficult for me is to know if this impression is correct, or if I am missing something that Hawthorne's contemporary readers would relate more accurately to.

I like this Idea Aleph. I'm currently writing about the 18th c English picaro and how his/her desires change with age. I would suspect that someone like Moll Flanders would find her young self exotic. However, I wonder if there is another term that would be more specific to a changing self? Hmm

I'm not so sure James is calling Blithedale "unhumorous" so much as that Hawthorne's novels in general are "unhumorous," with Blithedale a bit of an exception. It often seems to me that James fled to Europe to leave behind what he considered to be an uptight New England legacy, exemplified by Hawthorne. My sense is that it bred an antipathy, especially when one considers the pressure James's apparent sexual feelings may have put him under in looking upon his American colleagues and what they wrote. James knew the restrictions society placed on what he dared tackle and how.

The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion by Jonathan Haidt
Here, Lily.

Hail to thee, blithe Spirit!
https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/45146

[book:The Righteous Mind: Why Good Peo..."
Thanks, Rafael. I still am stumped as to what editing quirk I ran into. I tried all sorts of things, and adding it at the end is a copy of what I have in the text! Asked the librarians, but they had no answer....
(I've debugged enough computer stuff in my life that this irked me. Gotta let it go, I guess. Okay, I found it. Had an unmatched pair of closing brackets in the previous paragraph. Long sigh....)
Books mentioned in this topic
The Goldfinch (other topics)The Blithedale Romance (other topics)
Fates and Furies (other topics)
The Righteous Mind: Why Good People Are Divided by Politics and Religion (other topics)
The Righteous Mind: Why Good People Are Divided by Politics and Religion (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
Lauren Groff (other topics)Jonathan Haidt (other topics)
He says his concern with the Socialist Community is merely to establish a theater, "where the creatures of his brain may play their phantasmagorical antics." He describes his experience at Brook Farm as "essentially a daydream -- and yet a fact -- and thus offering an available foothold between fiction and reality."
There is a lot of mystery in the first few chapters. It begins with Coverdale returning from an exhibition of the Veiled Lady, whoever that might be, and when Coverdale arrives at Blithedale we meet Zenobia, whom he calls at one point "a sister of the Veiled Lady," and then Priscilla, who arrives without a surname and has secrets.
Is this typical of "Romance," or is Hawthorne just setting the scene?