Art Lovers discussion

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message 1: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments I feel like opening my own thread just to make announcements and post other thoughts about the group that I would like to draw attention to.

I will not close this thread but will keep it toward the top of the 'General' folder so anyone can feel free to make announcements of their own addressed to the group.

And...here is a way you can also announce major accomplishments or happenings in your life that you would like to share! Give yourself a pat on the back!


message 2: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Regarding my most recent poll as to the interest of our members in this group. I appreciate all of you who have voted and commented on the poll. I just opened it yesterday and would love more comments! Your input is invaluable to me.

If you have commented or followed along the poll at all, I invite you to go back and read some of my comments I just posted. I addressed each one of you and want to bring your attention to my responses.

Thank you for checking it out! We have an awesome group!


message 3: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Here yet another message from me! Reading through the various comments made in the recent poll, I would like to publicly announce (I hope this is alright) some accomplishments and happenings of some of our members. I really hope this isn't an embarrassment to you, I thought that since you shared these thoughts in the poll, you might not mind me sharing them with the whole group!


message 4: by Heather, Moderator (last edited Oct 23, 2016 06:18PM) (new)

Heather | 8333 comments 1) Leah is deeply involved in a large project of her own taking much of her time and interest. I commend her for taking this on and wish her the best of luck!

2) Peter just got his MA in Art History and with a distinction, too! Way to go, Peter!


3) (Ruth, I hope this okay to post, if not please PM me and I will delete it)
Everyone, Ruth has had a serious, devastating, and very tragic event in her life recently. I would invite you all to keep her in your thoughts.

Remember, anyone who has an announcement of their own, feel free to post it! I have created a new folder just for you. https://www.goodreads.com/topic/group...

We are a group together!


message 5: by Melissa (last edited Oct 23, 2016 03:34PM) (new)

Melissa Eisenmeier (carpelibrumbooks) | 27 comments I like this idea better than sending out messages to the group a lot, like some moderators do.


message 6: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 1897 comments Heather wrote: "Ruth, I hope this okay to post, if not please PM me and I will delete it)
Everyone, Ruth has had a serious, devastating, and very tragic event in her life recently. I would invite you all to keep her in your thoughts.."


Fine to post it, Heather. I'll just tell everyone that after 6 months in hospice here at home, my husband died last month. We were married 43 years. It seemed like no time at all.


message 7: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Thank you, Ruth. I truly feel for you.


message 8: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Melissa wrote: "I like this idea better than sending out messages to the group a lot, like some moderators do."

I'm glad, Melissa.


message 9: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Now that you've read this far down this thread, I want to take your attention to the folder that I just created FOR YOU. That is the folder where you can make your announcements and let us know what's going on. I think that would be more appropriate than this thread, I don't know why I didn't think of it at the time. I invite everyone to utilize that opportunity when you have something to say! Brag a little, pat yourself on the back and let us support and congratulate you!

The new folder is "What's Happening in My World..."
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...


message 10: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments We have quite a few new members to the group. I just want to say WELCOME!!!

Thank you for being with us and I hope you enjoy the group and feel free to participate, too!


message 11: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Hey Tim!


message 12: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments What brings you to the group? Do you want to introduce yourself or anything? You don't have to, just saying hello is nice.


message 13: by Heather, Moderator (last edited Nov 04, 2016 10:40AM) (new)

Heather | 8333 comments So I know we have the most recent poll about a discussion of the book The Vanishing Velázquez: A 19th Century Bookseller’s Obsession with a Lost Masterpiece. So far the majority of the votes has been for the book read and discussion so speaking with Haaze, we are going to begin the folder and thread sooner than the due date of the poll

We are still working out the details but look for that new folder!

He has suggested that we give people the opportunity and time to acquire the book so if you are interested, now is the time to go out and get the book if you don't already have it. I know I need to do that myself.

Updates and folder, threads and discussions coming!

(same message also posted in Polls folder)


message 14: by Heather, Moderator (last edited Nov 07, 2016 08:38AM) (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Just FYI everyone!
Yes, after 7 years of moderating, I am still learning new things!
I did add two videos to the group. Click on the word 'video' listed with other options for the group, written in green, directly under the background banner and above where it says 'moderator'. The two I posted are:
HISTORY OF IDEAS - Art

and
Art History Timeline

Check them out as your heart desires. Hope everyone is enjoying the group, even just observing the discussions!


message 15: by Ann (new)

Ann Watkins (topaintwithwords) | 6 comments Dear Ruth, I can't say I know exactly how you feel, but having been married for 32 years (almost all of my adult years), I believe that it must feel as if you have lost your right arm - the person who best knew you, shared private jokes and so forth. I hope that you will not be offended if I tell you that when I have lost loved ones in death, I found great comfort in remembering the promise of resurrection. You will be in my thoughts. Ann


message 16: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Holidays seem to get most or all of us pretty busy. I'm sorry if the group is slacking a bit. I'll try to dedicate more time here, but I wish everyone safety and joy during this season and upcoming month!


message 17: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 1897 comments Ann wrote: "Dear Ruth, I can't say I know exactly how you feel, but having been married for 32 years (almost all of my adult years), I believe that it must feel as if you have lost your right arm - the person ..."

Thank you for your kind thoughts, Ann. I take solace in remembering the 43 good years we had. It was a second marriage for us both, and this time we did it right.


message 18: by Deborah (new)

Deborah Ideiosepius | 136 comments Hello art lovers: I guess this is the 'meet and greet' area? I didn't see one elsewhere...?

I read a lot and paint for fun. Last year I made a personal reading challenge of increasing my reading in a marine theme, it worked really well and so for 2017 I am going to try and use the same tactic for reading about art. Other than reading, painting is one of my main hobbies but my Goodreads 'Art' shelf only has eight books on it!

Non-fiction, art history, is good and I have always liked fictionised or lightly written stories about famous artists, fiction where the main character is an artist... All should be options.

As a target goal I am aiming for 40 new books on my art shelf by the end of the year.

So this group seems like a good place to visit.

Sorry again if there is a thread for new members and I didn't see it...


message 19: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Hi Deborah! Welcome to the group!

No, we don't really have a meet and greet thread, it's more of a subtle group and focused basically on art and we haven't really gotten to introductions. But I'm so glad you did introduce yourself!

It's a great goal to read more about art and add to your bookshelf. We have so many members with many suggestions and reviews! There are some excellent readers, historians and just plain art experts here.

I think it's awesome that you do art yourself, one thing I can't do. I've tried, I'm just not artistically inclined so I choose to just study, learn and appreciate others.

We have a few threads to which you could add to and get some suggestions from others. There are actually two thread for Book suggestions and reviews. For the one thread I'd put the link here but there were only three posts. Luis suggested that he would like to read The Painter of Modern Life the other is named What are you Reading? and has more posts and different discussions https://www.goodreads.com/topic/group...

There is also a thread called Talent of the Members where we can share our own work. This would be a great place if you would like to show off your art! I would love to see it! https://www.goodreads.com/topic/group...

Another place where you can basically 'brag' about accomplishments in your life is What's Happening in my World: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/group... This is where you can also post your own art and say what you've done with it...sold it? Displayed it? Won an award? Really anything you'd like to add.

As far as reading about specific artists, maybe biographies, historical fiction, etc. is Books re: Artists and their Work https://www.goodreads.com/topic/group...

There are other books at the bottom of the group page that have been added by various members, too if you want to check those out.

So there are many threads from which you can gain some information and I'd like to invite you to just peruse the various topics we've introduced and discussed.

I'm so happy to have you in the group and look forward to your future posts if you feel so inclined. Welcome!

Heather (moderator)


message 20: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments So inspired by Deborah who just introduced herself, I would like to personally thank our newest members for joining! We're glad to have you and hope you gain something from the group and it would be great to hear from you, too!

So welcome all!


message 21: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments I posted this in our Holiday Time thread but I see that only 4 of you viewed it, so I'm posting it again because, I don't know about you, but I am curious as to what our members are reading!
Go ahead and click on the link below to post your books.

Just from the latest poll, I see many of us have many books we want to read this year. Feel free to just post a few, or however many you want. I hope some of us will do this!

What are some books are you planning, wanting, intending to read this year? Hopefully one or more will be related to art. Just share with us what you want to read! I think it would be fun just to get to know each others' taste in reading material and maybe we can get ideas from each other on books that look interesting to us, too. What do you say?

https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...


message 22: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Well hello everyone!
I have been spending (probably too much) time watching these short videos about Greek mythology. They are fascinating as well as a bit educational.

I urge you to take a look at them. The three that I posted are only about 4 minutes in length but fun to watch. Check them out under the folder 'Mythology'

https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...


message 23: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Luís wrote: "I'm on a travellin' book.

Journey to Portugal: In Pursuit of Portugal's History and Culture

Delicious.."


I like your description, Luis "delicious"!


message 24: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Here is my 'comment from the moderator'...

This is great! You all are keeping me on my toes and I'm learning so much! Especially Aaron with all his artist introductions and Lobstergirl back with her picture of the day. Plus the additional comments by other members of the group. I look forward to reading the day's comments!

Thank you all!


message 25: by A (new)

A | 270 comments Thanks Heather, none of this would be possible without your dedication to running a great group. It's nice to have a place to share all this and you've really opened my eyes to art again particularly as found in everything.


message 26: by Ker Metanoia (new)

Ker Metanoia (kermetanoia) | 33 comments Aaron wrote: "Thanks Heather, none of this would be possible without your dedication to running a great group. It's nice to have a place to share all this and you've really opened my eyes to art again particular..."

This I agree with. Thank you, Heather!


message 27: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments That's great to hear your words from you all Aaron, Luis, and Ker Metanoia! You're very welcome. Just glad you're here!


message 28: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments wow, so I 'check out' for a couple of days and what happened? Hey y'all, come back!

I'm sorry for not being on the ball so much these last few days. I'm back and will bring my best to the group!

And as always...you're all awesome!


message 29: by A (new)

A | 270 comments Interesting to see some of the views on the Artist posts, some sure are getting a lot more views than others. I wonder if these are Goodreads members, group members or web bots?


message 30: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments I have been reading on and off Metaphysical Art, a Praeger World of Art Paperbacks. It´s pretty heavy in the art and psychological criticism and find it hard to digest. I will end up having to read it again. It mentions Bocklin, who someone introduced on another of Heather´s message threads, as he was inspiration for Giorgio de Chirico, the progenitor of the group of Metaphysical Artists before and around WWI. The work is extremely deep, serious, and monumental and I have to ask why it wasn´t ever resurrected. I have only seen one current artist who was directly influenced by that movement, a woman photographer in the Boston area who gained some acclaim and then disappeared from the art scene.
I suspect that Metaphysical Art developed into Surrealism with Andre Breton and his merry crowd of dream surveyers. De Chirico was part of that group but had serious differences with Andrew, not at all difficult as many people ended up severing their friendship with him.

Breton´s most memorable novel, ( he was many things, essayist, philosopher, columnist, etc.) is Nadja which I had the misfortune to read. It was about a man who kept a pet lobster and walked it on a leash on the streets of Paris.


message 31: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Geoffrey wrote: "Breton´s most memorable novel, ( he was many things, essayist, philosopher, columnist, etc.) is Nadja which I had the misfortune to read. It was about a man who kept a pet lobster and walked it on a leash on the streets of Paris.

Sounds really boring, how could you finish that?


message 32: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl The man who walked his lobster on a leash was a real person, Gérard de Nerval:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%A9...

That's the extent of what I know about him.


message 33: by Ruth (last edited Apr 14, 2017 06:00PM) (new)

Ruth | 1897 comments When I was an undergrad in Art at Cal St Univ San Bernardino in 1975, as a class project we recreated the famous Paris Surrealism show of 1938 in the school gallery. We didn’t manage to recreate every piece, but we did a great many of them. Someone even dug up an old wreck of a car which we turned into Salvador Dali’s Rainy taxi. (I sat on top of the thing in 95+ heat helping to paint it black.) We had Merit Oppenheim’s famous fur-lined teacup and a table made with human legs. The gallery was dark, with sacks of “coal” hanging from the ceiling, and visitors had to view the exhibit with flashlights.


message 34: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Had to. The book was part of the course requirements for Modern Novel. The teacher was even more boring.


message 35: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Ruth wrote: "When I was an undergrad in Art at Cal St Univ San Bernardino in 1975, as a class project we recreated the famous Paris Surrealism show of 1938 in the school gallery. We didn’t manage to recreate ev..."

That sounds awesome, Ruth!


message 36: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Geoffrey wrote: "Had to. The book was part of the course requirements for Modern Novel. The teacher was even more boring."

No kidding...No wonder the teacher made you read that.


message 37: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments I just want to say Thank You to all our devoted members who have been participating in the recent discussions. I like the direction to which the group has arrived in discussing the more particulars of different pieces of art, including opinions and observations. I find it interesting to read about our diverse opinions and the reasons for our thoughts and even having conversations in the thread regarding a certain piece, movement, era, artist, etc. I think the variety of observations by you all is refreshing! Again, thank you!

And I want to include, as always, everyone is welcome to comment or post! Please do not be shy! No need to feel inadequate or less enlightened in art compared to others in the group, we are all at different levels of experience and expertise. I will admit, if it helps anyone feel better, that compared to many members of the group, I am but a novice and myself feel incompetent compared to even those participating at this point in time! But...here I am with my few words, for whatever they are worth!

Mostly I want to state again that I am just happy you are with us, either as a lurker or participant! We all have the common interest in art!


message 38: by Poly (new)

Poly Ethylene Modern Art schools teach almost nothing and are a total waste of money.


message 39: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Hmmm, thank you for you opinion Poly.


message 40: by Deborah (new)

Deborah Ideiosepius | 136 comments Never studied art, really. I am very much a do-it-yourself artist, at least since school where I didn't do much except art.

When I was young (teens, twenties ect) I also did not see the value of 'modern' or 'minimalist' art. Over the years though I read more and listened to other people, because I wanted to know what they were seeing that I was not. I also spent a fair amount of time just looking at the artwork. Amazing what you can see, if you look for a while. Thinking and reading what the artist has to say does, at times, also give you more chance of having a meaningfull interaction with the artwork. Yes, I still often didn't like it, but the emotional response to a piece of art is only one layer of what it can be.

Now, I am much more open minded, sure I don't like all of it.

It is possible to respect the piece, or what the artist is trying to say without liking the result. Much the same as respecting the work an athlete has put into getting into the Olympics while still being bored by watching them swim back and forth and back and forth.....

So, I want to say, thank you to Lobstergirl for posting a whole lot of art for us to look at and discuss. It does not seem to me she has been getting a whole lot of encouragement recently and she is putting in effort to make this thread interesting.

Leading me to some comments that I read somewhere back, along the lines of "anyone can put a white cube on a plinth, call it artwork and sell it. I wonder how much money it made." I am very familiar with such comments, I used to make them too when I was kid.

The thing about that, is that the people who say "I could do that" usually are not. If they did they would realise just how much work goes into it. Trust me, I went from dissing to practicing, there are more levels of difficulty than you can imagine.

*steps off soapbox*


message 41: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments That still begs the question, Deborah as to how much effort, intelligence, art musing, life musing goes into the making of a box.


message 42: by A (last edited May 15, 2017 08:46PM) (new)

A | 270 comments Deborah wrote: "Never studied art, really. I am very much a do-it-yourself artist, at least since school where I didn't do much except art.

When I was young (teens, twenties ect) I also did not see the value of '..."


I've spent a bit of time explaining my criticism and the only response I got was that it takes maturity. I think maturity comes with being to able to not only accept criticism, but formulate and express your thoughts, rather than expect everyone will see something similarly.

If I were to let's say take some time out and seriously think about making a statement to the world, a piece of my inner soul laid bare, and came up with a pale blue box, I would feel incredibly ashamed of myself displaying it especially if I were getting paid to.

Why? Because in my case there are no feelings, inspiration or meaning that I can personally convey to you with a box.

Does that make me immature or does that make me mature enough to admit it doesn't work for me?

After all this debate I still don't know what the artist's intent was with the box. Could someone please advise?

I think if we had their intent we could at least discuss that rather than the fact we have a random box for contemplation. Which perhaps has far more to say than a blank canvas.

Nothing about this reply should come off condescending, but I get the feeling that it takes an act of faith for us to believe or we're just not sophisticated.

If you'll take the time to read what I've written you'll see I'm quite open minded and have admitted the intersection of Art forms.

I also can spot sarcasm, have a sense of humor, embrace criticism and encourage discussion, but it seems we just can't get away from personal attacks here for some reason.


message 43: by Heather, Moderator (last edited May 15, 2017 11:55PM) (new)

Heather | 8333 comments I am going to make a comment as a moderator here and copy and paste it to the other thread in which it seems to have been initiated.

Regarding opinions and statements, we all have every right to our opinion. If I look at a piece of art and it looks like a barcode to me, I can say it looks like a barcode. That is my opinion. Anyone may agree or disagree with my opinion. They may also have their own opinion. Which is where the debate comes in. Debate is fine as long as it doesn't insult or infringe on one person's opinion. Does that make sense?

I am seeing conclusions being drawn of different pieces of work and some of these are being attacked. This is not alright here or anywhere in this group. When one person is defending their view, maybe a background or reason for their opinion can be included to help us further understand why that member feels this way.

I want to add here that when a blanket statement is written "all of this is..." and that's it, please follow up with why you think that. Don't leave it dangling as a broad insult say, on a whole movement, or a whole way of learning, etc.

A member stated that we should investigate more what the artist is attempting to portray rather than blow it off if we just don't like it. Well, this can be true to a point. Take LG's latest post, Mermaid in the other thread. I can say I don't care for it. But I do find it interesting. I took the time to investigate the artist himself and learned that his art comes from a multi-cultural background that in turn influences his pieces. This knowledge doesn't help me 'like' it better, but it intrigued me enough to want to learn more about it.

On the other hand, I have no desire to investigate the meaning or reason for a barcode. (and please don't take that as a demeaning description of that piece, I am only using it as an example that was given such opinions by several people. Some of us concurred that it does look like a barcode. This is the only reason I have chosen to 'pick on' this piece) No offense intended!

The difference for me, is, though I don't care for Mermaid, it's uniqueness does invite my curiosity as to what he is trying to say here.

It comes down to that which I want to devote my time into investigating and that which really does nothing for me.

All of that said, in conclusion, we are all entitled to like or not like a piece of art. We can also call it whatever we want. But the line comes in where we criticize another's comment. There is no place to criticize a thought of anyone else. "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all". True in this case. If you would like to agree and extend the application in your own comment, great! If you disagree with the person's opinion, you can state that you disagree and why this is so, but you cannot attack the other person's opinion. If you have an opinion about the member himself or herself keep it to yourself!

I will say that I am impressed that we have strong-minded and strong-willed members of this group. Those who have debated, criticized, and interjected opinions seem to still be with us. Good for you! I'm glad nobody has taken such an offense then leave the group.

Now...on with the show!


message 44: by Aloha (new)

Aloha | 163 comments Totally agree with you, Heather! The convo was starting to sound whiny and pointless without qualifiers.


message 45: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 1897 comments I'm really sorry if I may have offended you or anyone else here. Of course everyone is entitled to an opinion. However, it shuts down both understanding and discussion, when someone offers only a flatly derogatory and dismissive statement and nothing else. Why not say something like, "Im afraid I don't get this painting, it almost looks like a bar code to me, does anyone understand what's going on here? What art movement is this artist at usually associated with?"


message 46: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Thank you, Ruth. I like your response. I think we could all (myself included) have a little more tact and appreciation in general. Thank you.


message 47: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8333 comments Aloha wrote: "Totally agree with you, Heather! The convo was starting to sound whiny and pointless without qualifiers."

thank you, Aloha


message 48: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 1897 comments Heather wrote: "Thank you, Ruth. I like your response. I think we could all (myself included) have a little more tact and appreciation in general. Thank you."

:)


message 49: by Deborah (new)

Deborah Ideiosepius | 136 comments Geoffrey wrote: "That still begs the question, Deborah as to how much effort, intelligence, art musing, life musing goes into the making of a box."

Now that is an excellent question Geoffrey, one I feel can't (always) be answered by just looking at the piece. On one hand one can say that visual artwork needs to stand on its own, without needing the interpretation and I don't feel the cube (or the barcode for that matter) do. They might in real life, but not in flat image.

That is a valid conclusion, but not the only conclusion because:

Personally, I know I cant do carpentry, so the pure craft is more than I could make. The intent behind the imagery is one I don't get without reading about it (which is more investment than I am going to make right now). But that can also be said about the Dutch Goldern Age painters as well!

Beautiful paintings, but that pretty tulip in the still life? Or that painting on the wall behind the sitter? Those things have a heavily symbolic loading that modern us are not going to get from just looking at the pretty picture.

So there could be a whole lot of effort, intelligence and artistic intent behind that cube. If nothing else, it has inspired considerable debate right here.


message 50: by Deborah (new)

Deborah Ideiosepius | 136 comments Aaron (or anyone else that objected to my comment) - Personally - and I suppose the comment above was aimed at least partial at me - I am not attacking your opinions or calling them immature. On the contrary, it takes self assurance to state a personal perspective and I respect self assurance.

I gave my personal perspective as mine alone and with no reflection intended on anyone else's response to art. I like debating art, its why I joined this group and like this thread.


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