Other than Grimdark, what else are you reading?

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

Mine too! These days I tend to avoid YA unless someone recommends it or it sounds really good. The thing that bugs me the most is the tendency in YA authors to just throw every cliche at a book. Its like reading the same book over and over in a (slightly) different setting.

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

James wrote: "I've been doing a few rounds of read to reviews and most of the fantasy writers seem to market themselves as YA. (I definitely don't). Some of them are about steampunk cats and lost princesses, so ..."

It must be really hard for authors, the YA market is extremely lucrative but also very restrictive, so I guess all they are stuck with is love triangles and teenage heroines with funny names!

[Heather]

I just finished A Court of Mist and Fury, which people typically label YA, but has very adult scenes. Some of the authors are just blowing off that rule now, thankfully.

What bothers me about the no sex in YA stuff is that it's sooooo obvious that they are avoiding it. It makes me cringe. I'd rather them leave it out completely.

[Jenna]

Tracey the Lizard Queen wrote: "It must be really hard for authors, the YA market is extremely lucrative but also very restrictive, so I guess all they are stuck with is love triangles and teenage heroines with funny names!"

Yeah, I feel like when authors approach publishers, some good work is denied because it doesn't fit with what is known to sell. Even if it's good, it's different, making it risky. On the other hand, a lot of crap sneaks in because it follows a story that has sold before. (Not saying all YA is crap - I like some YA)

Heather wrote: "What bothers me about the no sex in YA stuff is that it's sooooo obvious that they are avoiding it. It makes me cringe. I'd rather them leave it out completely."

YES. Exactly this. A few months or a year passes and they finally reach the first kiss stage and then no romantic development. And a lot of those relationships feel forced in the first place. Just leave them out.

[James]

Tracey the Lizard Queen wrote: "James wrote: "I've been doing a few rounds of read to reviews and most of the fantasy writers seem to market themselves as YA. (I definitely don't). Some of them are about steampunk cats and lost p..."

I've noticed authors giving a little lip service to princesses (er... well that sounds filthy) or de-aging protagonists. It's like rewriting Casablanca so Bogart is 19 years old in tights and Bergman is a Princess. "We'll always have Junior High..."

[Chris, kingtermite]

Jenna wrote: "And a lot of those relationships feel forced in the first place. Just leave them out. "

THIS is my big peeve. Movies are even worse. It's like there is an unwritten rule that every story (book or movie) MUST have a love story in it. Like no one will read it otherwise. If it's natural, fine. Don't FORCE a love story.

The relationship in Maze Runner does feel quite forced.

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

James wrote: "Tracey the Lizard Queen wrote: "James wrote: "I've been doing a few rounds of read to reviews and most of the fantasy writers seem to market themselves as YA. (I definitely don't). Some of them are..."

Sometimes I think publishers have no idea what we want as readers! I don't want the next Hunger Games. I've read it already. Its a total shame as Jenna said some really fantastic authors get passed on because their ideas are different. We want different. This is why I love groups like this, I get to hear all these great stories that I would never of heard of otherwise!

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

Chris wrote: "Jenna wrote: "And a lot of those relationships feel forced in the first place. Just leave them out. "

THIS is my big peeve. Movies are even worse. It's like there is an unwritten rule that every s..."

Movies are the worst offenders. And tv. I can't tell you how many tv shows and movies have been ruined for me because of a terrible love story. The whole 'Will they, won't they' thing drives me crazy!

I wasn't a fan of Theresa/Thomas relationship either.

[Chris, kingtermite]

Tracey the Lizard Queen wrote: "I wasn't a fan of Theresa/Thomas relationship either. "

For a while, I was hoping they'd find out they were brother and sister and that would be the bond. I was thinking of the two sort of like the brother/sister kids from the Witch Mountain movies.

[Silvana]

Heather wrote: "I have talked to several middle-grade kids that didn't like the series and I really think they just don't get the humor (and these are American kids that watch British tv shows). I theorize that pe..."

Yes, I think age also plays an important role. Most of Stroud fans I know are in their 20s-30s and started reading the books since they're in high schools at the earliest. I like Stroud books also since they're not corny (looking at you, Rick Riordan). And simply fun. Bartimaeus is one of the best (and funniest) characters ever.
Lockwood is not as funny but it could get scary at times. Can't wait for the next book!

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

Chris wrote: "Tracey the Lizard Queen wrote: "I wasn't a fan of Theresa/Thomas relationship either. "

For a while, I was hoping they'd find out they were brother and sister and that would be the bond. I was thi..."

Haven't seen it, bit I know exactly what you mean. They seemed more like brother and sister or at least close friends. Definitely not highschool sweethearts.

[Chris, kingtermite]

I am almost finished with The Scorch Trials now (should finish today).

Luckily the book I've been waiting for (on hold from library) just finally came in. Next up, Miss Peregrine’s Home for Peculiar Children.

I wasn't thinking about doing two YA back to back....but well, here we are. A friend told the first book of Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children was great, but it fell apart after that. Maybe we'll see.

After that (assuming I read all three) and finish the third book here of the Maze Runner series, I'll probably need a YA break for a while.

[Heather]

Chris, are you sure Thomas and Theresa are a couple? She's kinda shady.

Authors should just trust that people who are looking for a love story will pick accordingly.

[Chris, kingtermite]

Heather wrote: "Chris, are you sure Thomas and Theresa are a couple? She's kinda shady.

Authors should just trust that people who are looking for a love story will pick accordingly."

I didn't say (or mean to imply) they 'were' a couple, just that the author was forcing an apparent romantic relationship story in with the rest of the story.

[Heather]

I think she's just using her female wiles to manipulate him.

[Scott]

For those with interest in historical fiction Amazon has a one day on The Nightingale for only $2.99 and it's one of the best pieces I've read in a bit. A Darker Shade of Magic is also on sale on a one day for only $2.99 so I picked it up.

[Terrible Timy]

A Darker Shade of Magic seems interesting, I'm going to take a look at that one. Though, it can't be bad if it's set in London :)

[Scott]

Timy wrote: "A Darker Shade of Magic seems interesting, I'm going to take a look at that one. Though, it can't be bad if it's set in London :)"

It's been on my to read list for a while. I've done really well with snagging Kindle deals for cheap money on these one day deals. The book is normally $9.99 so it's a great value especially if it's good since there's two more in the series.

[Silvana]

ADSoM is a bit YA and the London stuff is just cosmetics for me. The worldbuilding is not really there. But many people enjoyed it so I think worth to check out if you are looking for a simple story with young protagonists.

[Chris, kingtermite]

Heather wrote: "I think she's just using her female wiles to manipulate him."

She's not old enough to really have even grown out any 'wiles' yet, is she? :D :p LOL


I started Miss Peregrine’s Home for Peculiar Children the other day and am already halfway through. I'm really liking it. It's not just a very unique story, but it's done in a unique way with old timey photos scattered through the book and the author has a very compelling 1st person POV prose style. It's much better than any I've read in a long time. You really feel like you are seeing the main character's soul/character more than just 'his thoughts'.

[Chompa, Founding Father]

Regarding YA - I have read a few and generally end up not liking them or even hating them (The Hunger Games). However, if young adults are reading them I'm happy just to have them read.

I just read Fahrenheit 451 a few days ago. I'd not read it in about 30 years I'm guessing and found it extremely relevant for 2016. https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

I also read A Crown for Cold Silver before that. I'm going to work up that review next. Very Grimdark and pretty good.

[Scott]

I read YA because one of my daughters likes it and I usually start a book/series before allowing her to do so to determine if the content is appropriate. I simply have to remind myself some of the angst to will to her better than to me and as long as the violence isn't awful and there's sex I'm good with it. I read more GD than anything else but YA has some surprisingly good books. In the last few months some YA books that I've given 4 or 5 stars.

The Aeronaut's Windlass
Steelheart
The Emperor's Blades
Dawn of Wonder
Blood SongSecond Cataclysm

I'll grant that Blood Song and Emperor's Blades are more GD but the characters are very young. So it just depends.

[Mark]

Blood song and emperor's blade are in that group of fantasy which gets lumped in YA because the characters stories are started when they are kids. Mainly the contents are as you say grimdarkish.

Started Ice Forged and Throne of the Crescent Moon both very enjoyable so far.

[Terrible Timy]

Throne of the Crescent Moon got my interest. I'll check it out.

[Angela]

I'm having a change of pace at the moment and after finishing Storm Front I've moved onto reading Jane Steele. It's a reimagining of Jane Eyre. So far so good.

[Heather]

Angela wrote: "I'm having a change of pace at the moment and after finishing Storm Front I've moved onto reading Jane Steele. It's a reimagining of Jane Eyre. So far so good."

Jane Steele sounds awesome! I am adding it.

[Angela]

I hope you enjoy it Heather.

I really enjoyed The Emperor's Blades as well. I heard it was lumped as YA as well. I never considered it YA when I read it, just because the characters were teenagers a book seems to now get called YA. I have had friends though read it and say they felt it was YA. I guess everyone has their own perspective on how they classify a book.

So cool that lot so us enjoy historical fiction. Sharon Kay Penman is a favourite author of mine in that genre. She writes about the Plantagenets.

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

Yeah I've heard some people put Prince of Thorns in YA, because Jorg is so young! Isn't it more about content than the age of the characters? I would quite happily lend Steelheart to my friends 14 year old daughter, but probably not PoT. Not until she was a little older.

[Terrible Timy]

If historical fiction, then my favorit is the Shardlake series by C.J. Sansom. Or the Sano Ichiro series by Laura Joh Rowland. Both of them are about murder cases. The Shardlake series takes place in Henry VIII's England, while the Sano Ichiro series in the 17th century's Tokyo (Edo at the time). Though they don't have much to do with fantasy, my historian self loves these kind of books :)

[Chris, kingtermite]

Tracey the Lizard Queen wrote: "Yeah I've heard some people put Prince of Thorns in YA, because Jorg is so young! Isn't it more about content than the age of the characters? I would quite happily lend Steelheart to..."

Prince of Thorns? Really? I can hardly think of a less "young adult" book. Jorg may be young, but holy cow is the content "adult".

[Scott]

Jorg is a YA straight outta Compton.

[Heather]

There's no way Prince of Thorns is YA. There was a lot of adult angst about the book, though! Honestly, I would guess Lawrence got more people to read it because of the outcry, which I thought was unfounded. I also have never heard of Emperor's Blades being YA either.

People need to get over the idea that YA is any book with characters under 18.

[Silvana]

I always think that YA novels are written FOR ages ranging from 12 to 18. Not necessarily the characters themselves but the READERS (supposed market). Hence the content should be age appropriate.

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

Yeah seriously...

https://www.reddit.com/r/Fantasy/comm...

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

Even on GR, 119 people have shelved it as 'young adult'!

Sure a self-confessed rapist, murderer, looter, thief. All very typical behaviour of a teenager(!)

[Silvana]

GR shelves are very subjective.
Why don't we ask Mark himself whether he thinks PoT is YA. He is a member of this group after all :)

[Chris, kingtermite]

I just finished Miss Peregrine’s Home for Peculiar Children and gave a review.

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...


Overall, I really liked the book. :)

[Silvana]

Currently having an adventure in the Alps and rural France with Temeraire in League of Dragons (Naomi Novik).

Jack wrote: "I'm reading Robert Heinlein's Assignment in Eternity and Kokoro by Natsume Sōseki."

I need to read more Heinlein's books.

[Chompa, Founding Father]

I am reading The Long Way Down, an urban fantasy. It started out a bit slow for me, but really picked up. I'm kind of excited to find another UF series to read.

[Levi]

YA started out as a market demographic, but has morphed into a "pseudo-modernist" literary style.

https://philosophynow.org/issues/58/The_Death_of_Postmodernism_And_Beyond

[Silvana]

Currently plowing through my Netgalley's backlog with Academy of Secrets:. Didn't realize it is YA. And a rather underwhelming one as well (at least in the first 20%).

[Angela]

Heather, I finally finished Jane Steele so wanted to let you know I really enjoyed it. :-) It took me ages to read though as I've hardly had anytime to read this month.

[Scott]

The Leopard Vanguard which has been very good. A blend of historical fiction and fantasy in the Roman Empire era. Always fun recognizing the historical figures names.

[Angela]

Timy wrote: "If historical fiction, then my favorit is the Shardlake series by C.J. Sansom. Or the Sano Ichiro series by Laura Joh Rowland. Both of them are about murder cases. The..."

Timy both these authors sound really interesting. I've added them to my TBR. Thanks for the recommendations!

So glad you guys don't think Prince of Thorns to YA. Agree that I always figured YA was based on the age of the reader. There's no way I would be handing it to my 12 year old to read. Not that he wants to read any fantasy books anyway. Too busy reading mystery and spy books.

[Terrible Timy]

You are welcome Angela :-)

[Tracey the Lizard Queen, First In, Last Out]

After a few weeks absence I'm returning to Malazan! Wow, how I've missed it.

[Chris, kingtermite]

I finally finished the Maze Runner series yesterday. Like most YA, it started out great, but started falling until it kinda fell apart at the end.

Here's my review of third book:
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

One to finish the Miss Peregrine's Home For Peculiar Children series with book two, Hollow City.

[Sumant]

Finished Sword of lictor and here is my review for it, one of the most cryptic books I have read so far.

[Silvana]

Updraft by Fran Wilde.

[Reon]

Almost finished with the Monarchies of God from Paul Kearney, a fun ride just too bad he just took a setting in the real world (fall of Constantinople, Spanish Inquisition, Discovery of America) and gave everything new names, not really original but a fun ride nonetheless. Also started the Night Watch from Terry Pratchet as kind of a consolation and to cheer me up for the end of Game Of Thrones season 6.