The House of Hades
discussion
NICO… YOU KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT O.o
ReaderGuy wrote: "Look, is it okay to have gay characters in books? Sure. Is it okay to have a gay character in a book focused on pre-teens? Debatable. I'm not sure 10 year old kids are really mature enough for that..."You make it sound like every child is born straight and they cannot handle a male loving another male. Honestly, that's ridiculous.
What Nico gives to this book is representation and there is nowhere near enough of that in books for children and YA. When a 10 year old reads this book and watches as a boy admits he loves/had a crush on another boy, he won't go around announcing he is gay. When that 10 year old reads the character of Nico, he will know that loving a boy is a possibility. He will know that loving someone of the same sex is normal. He will know that there are people like that.
If that 10 year old boy turns out to be straight 20 years later, that's great. What they learnt from that book and Nico's character that gay people are normal people and hopefully, that person will be more open minded towards other sexualities.
If that 10 year old boy turns out to be gay/bi/pan etc. that's great too. What he learnt from the book and Nico's character is that what he was feeling was normal AND SO he wouldn't need to stress about the fact that he knows nothing about the way he is feeling because he has seen it in Nico. And in City of Bones, and in Harry Potter and in Legend of Kora.
Because the gay characters should be obligatory in every book and tv show and movie. Showing them is as much a political move as showing characters that are black or anything other than white. THEY EXIST and to think that a child will understand that some boys like girls but some boys like boys and some girls like girls is simply stupid.
It's not the same as being "black or white."
It's a politically correct concept rooted in narcissism, naivety and in some cases straight up perverted. It just got blown out of proportion by wannabe activist teens on Tumblr.
Does no one else see the red flag? This is a big fat rainbow joke.
Effie Trinket would approve.
It's a politically correct concept rooted in narcissism, naivety and in some cases straight up perverted. It just got blown out of proportion by wannabe activist teens on Tumblr.
Does no one else see the red flag? This is a big fat rainbow joke.
Effie Trinket would approve.
Hey Kevin,
It's equally as much of a waste of time to say it's a waste of time.
We may never know why we stick around here, but as long as we do, why can't anybody at least stay on topic, huh? \-.-/
It's equally as much of a waste of time to say it's a waste of time.
We may never know why we stick around here, but as long as we do, why can't anybody at least stay on topic, huh? \-.-/
Brown wrote: "Two non-romantic partners could adopt. I know a mother and her older daughter who were considering adopting kids. You do not need to be in a romantic relationship. Again, you are making romance to..."
LMAO SORRY HUGE BLOCK OF TEXT SO YEAH KEVIN CHILL ABOUT THIS OKAY
No offense brown, but I think this whole thing is more about your own reservations about romance than the romance itself. I think you are simply struggling to care for romance as a significant concept in your own life. It seems to me that you see nothing unique about romance on paper and you're struggling to make it special to yourself / grasp meaning by overemphasizing the "uniqueness" of creating and sacrificing for a family because otherwise you don't see the point of it. By doing this, you try to isolate and place many restrictions on what you think romance or simply procreating should be and when it doesn't follow your tightly bound model, you struggle to define it to fit the other norms in your life. Ironically, you are fed up with the labeling things straight, bisexual, gay, etc -- but you yourself label romance most of all. You are the one who is unable to see it / comprehend it.
I'm sorry that you think it's a game. I never said anything defined you before. You are simply associating friendship and romance as two way too similar things. I don't quite understand because in my personal experience (and everyone I know as well), the dynamic between friendships and the person you're dating have been completely different. You keep saying that romance is friendship + unneeded pleasure and based on my experience, I just...disagree. If you feel that any romantic relationship that is not "straight" should stay only as a friendship, then that's more discriminatory than anything as it's completely based on the gender of the participants. I've been saying this for a few posts and you simply can't seem to accept my view.
Okay, if we go back to the fact this is on the House of Hades thread, about Nico, I will bring this back to LGBTQ+ topics. You think that there is no sacrifice from LGBTQ+ people who choose to adopt children? If anything, there is MORE of a sacrifice, from their own emotional and mental well-being from the aftershocks of society and the judgement that will be inevitably be thrust upon them of it not following the "traditional model". Your post is simply proof of that. They (and any "non traditional" couple like the one you pointed out) are STILL sacrificing time and effort to raise children. They are still making the sacrifice of valuing these children's lives above their own.
(Also, I would like to emphasize again that your mother daughter situation is an isolated event and is not the norm in society. Whether that is a good or bad thing that no one else is considering this model is NOT the point. The point is that pointing out ONE pair as all encompassing evidence is faulty and not sufficient.)
Yes, two non romantic partners can adopt and while it is a legitimate possibility, sadly, there is a shortage of people in real life who are willing to make such a commitment to someone of a non-romantic nature. This isn't my opinion -- this is reality. Many romantic couples don't even consider adoption unless it's absolutely necessary, let alone non-romantic partners. Furthermore, to be able to successfully raise a kid, the the people in question have to be together or at least live in proximity for an extended period of time -- at least 18 years -- to provide a stable environment for the kid. I don't know about you, but I'm not planning on staying with ANYONE -- except a potential husband -- for that amount of time . Not my mom, not my dad, not my sister, not my friends. This is why it is even more logical for romantic couples to adopt, instead of non-romantic. (However, if two non romantic people are willing to make the commitment for that amount of time, more power to them. But acting like it's such an easy and logical step is false)
(I'm also going to ignore the fact that you don't think that giving orphaned kids parents, whether the parents (in this case, a romantic pair) are of the same gender or not, and a way out of the DREADFUL foster care system in the US today is also an important factor but yeah.)
Also, when you word your argument as "stealing" sperms or eggs, it really spins a negative -- and false -- connotation on it, when in reality, these sperm and eggs are altruistic donations from willing individuals. Like actually -- it is illegal to ACTUALLY forcibly take these from a human being. Any sperms/eggs in their respective banks were given with the full consent of the individual. They are not "stolen".
And I fundamentally disagree with you that the ability to make life is more important than raising said life. That's the EASY part. Any penis or vagina can carelessly make a baby (not including those with medical issues that cause them to be unable to, which isn't the point). Not everyone is at an appropriate point in their lives or even has the emotional capacity needed to correctly raise a child. The responsibility of taking care of life is the hard part -- the will to take care of children and the long term commitment is far more sacrificial than a simple biological act. Are you against the adoption of cats and dogs as well, as their biological parents aren't taking care of them? Of course, it is sad when a biological parent is unable to look after their kids for whatever reason, but in the end, raising is more important than a simply being able to have heterosexual sex.
I am not saying that biological parents do not matter. I was simply pointing out there are far too many cases of -- forgive my french -- of absolutely fucking shitty parents and neglectful parents and are as many cases of wonderful adoptive parents. And vice versa. The point is -- there are so many different situations and experiences that hailing biological parents or a certain idea as inherently superior as the truth is also inherently incorrect.
On the contrary, I personally do think that support from both platonic and romantic means is necessary for my personal happiness in the long run. But those beliefs are PERSONAL, not extended to every human in the world. I don't care if you think that this idea has been pushed onto me from the media or anything of that sort. Yes, obviously self-contentedness within myself is equally vital. All my relationships with people in my life, regardless of what nature, have pushed me to grow as a person. Support from other humans is equally as necessary. I have been in situations where I am utterly without support and let me tell you, it is a devastatingly lonely existence.
If the only difference (in your point of view) between marriage and friendship is the gender of the participants, it might as well be removed as a legal institution. If the difference, on the other hand, involves commitment to start a family of whatever description, between those participants, then gender need not be a part of it anyhow, as long as it they are doing all that they can to raise a kid.
It's ironic because now I realize that you are focusing too much on being idealistic about this issue instead of being realistic. You're too caught up in needing to believe in some significant amazing reason of the necessity of romance -- more specifically, trying to make heterosexual relationships exceptional and superior. Well, they aren't. Do not blame your disillusionment on this issue because people different than you can possibly find the same happiness together in a way that you seem to be unable to accept. I'm not trying to be rude, this is simply the way I see it.
After watching the god awful GOP debate and coming back to this thread, I'm increasingly becoming exhausted with all this, as no matter what, people won't budge.
Also your issue about political correctness? I could type out so much of my hatred of this term but this article does it so much better.
https://www.vox.com/2015/1/28/7930845...
Sorry I took so long to reply. But this thread just gets increasingly annoying and at this point, the repetitiveness of it makes me never want to return. It is clear we fundamentally disagree on many issues, and in a month, I quite literally will not have time to dedicate to this thread, as it not only wastes time typing these huge block of texts and but also wastes my patience :( Brown, I do hope that you've enjoyed this, as you've made it quite clear that you yearn for discussion. Hopefully this GIGANTIC block will satiate you. From one 17 year old teenage girl to another 17 (or 18?) teenage girl, it's cool to have been able to discuss such controversial issues without it dissolving into crudeness and death threats :)
I want to end this post by saying that your gripes about how "non-traditional" marriage threatening the "institution of marriage" was addressed in the US Supreme Court case on gay marriage, and was subsequently squashed. (Finally, the US does something right) If you want to see the flaws in your argument, I suggest you look to that case. It does a far better analysis than I ever could make.
At this point, I most likely will not return to this thread. I've been on it for nearly two years and the time to quit it is long overdue. I'm not sure why I keep subjecting myself to this tbh hahahahha Ariel I'm so sorry about what this thread has become I'm sure you did not expect this if you're even still bothering to read this
Also Kevin -- why are you still here? Honestly, if it annoys you so much, go on Reddit. If what you're looking for is a bunch of memes and want to make fun of people who literally have done nothing but be passionate about an issue that quite frankly, needs to be addressed, there are an infinite amount of places on the internet to meme to your heart's content.
Cecerose, thanks for talking, I appreciate it. I do.
My closing statement is only that you're completely right when you say I place many restrictions on what I believe romance is. Frankly most of what we see today is utterly fake and a fantasy and selfish, and I'm not ashamed to say that.
Also ends don't justify means. No amount of "this or that might happen" (foster kids being adopted, getting emotional support, etc) necessarily moralizes same sex marriage in itself. Neither do abuses (selfish straight couples) or misfortunes (couples who can't have children) logically justify it. Two wrongs don't make a right. Do you know what all those sound like? Excuses.
Okay, that was a long closing statement (your reply was pretty long), but I'll resist saying more.
I understand 100% about the thread being annoying and I don't blame you for wanting to be done, that's completely fine.
Thank you again for talking. It did turn out really long, I just appreciate civil back and forth whether it's long or short. Thanks for doing that.
I take everything on here with a grain of salt, I don't mean or take anything here personally at all.I just like discussion.
My closing statement is only that you're completely right when you say I place many restrictions on what I believe romance is. Frankly most of what we see today is utterly fake and a fantasy and selfish, and I'm not ashamed to say that.
Also ends don't justify means. No amount of "this or that might happen" (foster kids being adopted, getting emotional support, etc) necessarily moralizes same sex marriage in itself. Neither do abuses (selfish straight couples) or misfortunes (couples who can't have children) logically justify it. Two wrongs don't make a right. Do you know what all those sound like? Excuses.
Okay, that was a long closing statement (your reply was pretty long), but I'll resist saying more.
I understand 100% about the thread being annoying and I don't blame you for wanting to be done, that's completely fine.
Thank you again for talking. It did turn out really long, I just appreciate civil back and forth whether it's long or short. Thanks for doing that.
I take everything on here with a grain of salt, I don't mean or take anything here personally at all.I just like discussion.
I applaud Rick, some people might think it is inappropriate, but I think it was smart. He is teaching the new generation about gay rights. The book teaches about real life situations, and he blended it in so well with a great book. In addition, he would have had to planned this out from the Titan's Curse because from then on, you could tell he was jealous of Annabeth. I think Rick was superb, and those who think that there should not be gay marriages... go to Tartarus.
Also Larry is real
Dear Haters of the World,I understand that you are out there. I have seen many of you just on this thread. And Haters, I won't say names but you know who you are,you have no business to tear down everybody else because you don't believe in something. Homosexuality is now a huge part of this world, and Rick was trying to teach the new generation that they shouldn't judge people based on who their sex preference is. Haters, I know that you might be biased because of your parents, or your religion. But, other people have their own beliefs and you shouldn't make them feel bad because you don't agree. I believe in gay rights, because people should be allowed to be happy, allowed to marry who they want, allowed to be who they want. But if you believe that some people don't deserve it because they have a sex preference different than yours, go right ahead.
My message to all the Haters of the World, if you believe something that takes away from other's happiness, keep it to yourself. Because the people that do care, don't want to hear about it.
Yours Sincerely,
ihearthawaii
Don't say anything, Brown, they're just going to keep repeating the same lies. siiiiiiiiigh
I would never go down Nico's path of being gay but I admire Rick for acknowledging that there are gay people in the world and it is totally normal and I still love Rick and he is still one of my favorite authors. I found this as a surprise having read the books and always thought Nico liked Annabeth and was jealous of Percy but it was a huge surprise to find it was the other way around. Also I think you guys are making a big deal out of nothing. Everyone can have their own opinions and no one should judge them for it.
People can make a big deal of it if they want to nobody really cares
Dear Ms. Biance.Aka.Leah2,People can make a big deal of it. But the people, like me, don't want to hear about it. Everybody in this world is allowed their own opinion, even gay people. But you shouldn't discredit somebody else's work. Rick took a year or more on writing this book. He took his time to try to make the new generation interested in reading. Also, I think he is trying to teach the new generation that everybody is different, and that you shouldn't judge people. And when you say that somebody's hard work is horrifying, imagine someone saying that about a school project that you spent every waking moment on. Because I'm willing to bet that it took Rick a lot of time to finish these books. So if you think that it is violating, you are allowed to think that, but when other people care about it, and somebody made it for the rest or the world. Keep to yourselves, because I know that there are a lot of people that don't care one bit.
Yours Sincerly,
ihearthawaii
All I want is for Nico to have a happy ending and it looks like Will may be able to provide that for Nico. We may never know for sure if they do end up together, but the ending of the Blood of Olympus tells us that he chose to give up on Percy. I believe we all should just relax and take a breath. People are people and you do not tell them who to love. In the end, we all are arguing over a fictional character. Rick Riordan clearly stated on his Twitter account that Nico is gay. If you have something hateful to say that isn't nice, just don't say it. I hope you guys have a beautiful day today and go outside and enjoy the out doors :)
Cecerose wrote: "LMAO SORRY HUGE BLOCK OF TEXT SO YEAH KEVIN CHILL ABOUT THIS OKAY..."<3 Welcome back Cecerose. Did you like my "cecerosey plz" pic?
Ihearthawaii wrote: "People can make a big deal of it. But the people, like me, don't want to hear about it. Everybody in this world is allowed their own opinion, even gay people. But you shouldn't discredit somebody else's work..."I liked how you were such a dirty hypocrite here, that I had to take a shower.
You can ignore everyone's opinion but they must not ignore yours?
The world is not a one sided "ME", you know that. Right?
You know what? I wasn't trying to make it about me. People are discrediting Rick's work because they think that it's violating that he made Nico gay. It's not! Homosexuality is a huge part of the world, and he was trying to make more people accept it. Besides, its Rick's book, and he can chose what he wants to write. Sort of how I can to. And I can ignore others opinions, and they can ignore mine. But luckily I have friends that support me, but based on what you wrote, I can't say the same for you.
And if you think that me stating my opinion makes me a hypocrite, what does that make you? Because I get almost all A's and a few B's here or there. I wrote a five paragraph essay in 35 minutes without a plan, and I got an A. So if I'm a dirty hypocrite, and I get such good grades, what does that make you? Because not many people make the same grades, and I'm willing to bet you don't either. I am assuming that because of your lack of grammar.
Ihearthawaii wrote: "People are discrediting Rick's work because they think that it's violating that he made Nico gay. It's not! ..."It's their choice to say they don't want to read the book and give it a bad review. There is something called free will & freedom of speech.
Homosexuality is a huge part of the world, and he was trying to make more people accept it.
It's how he went around doing it that has some people pissed, and if you can't put yourself in their shoes to see it from their POV you are biased.
But luckily I have friends that support me, but based on what you wrote, I can't say the same for you.
Now why do you have to go make it about you? What does you having friends who 'support you" have to do with ANYthing I said above?
From what I wrote before I never implied that it was about "you" specifically. I was talking about one group saying their opinions matter more than others.
The hypocrite and taking a shower was directed toward you though.
Also, are you implying that I don't have friends? or that you are not sure if I am one of those "friends" that support you?
Ihearthawaii wrote: "And if you think that me stating my opinion makes me a hypocrite, what does that make you? Because I get almost all A's and a few B's here or there. I wrote a five paragraph essay in 35 minutes wit..."It's rich to hear you speak of a "lack of Grammar". When I read your first comments I thought you were an 8 year old(are you?)
What does your grades, essays in minutes and group of friends have to do with people using their RIGHT to dislike a book that you like?
You think your academic prowess gives you some advantage or privileged status over others?
But clearly you are lacking grammar, because you don't capitalize grammar, it's not a proper noun.
And right should be rights.
There should be a comma after and.
You still need a period after the parenthesis.
And yes, I am implying that it would seem that you do no have friends, because based on your ability to incorrectly insult others, nobody would like you.
Ihearthawaii wrote: "prowess? Can you spell? Or do you have a lisp? Because prowess definitely isn't a word.".....I'm not sure if you are an unskilled, underage troll... or really dense.
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/def...
Seriously, punctuation.
Hey "KEVIN" I haven't been following this feed long, but I have been long enough to say. I'm supporting Ihearthawaii, we have been friends since who knows how long. She has a very good point we both have gay and lesbian friends and we think it's cool. So if you want to judge Rick than go ahead but he put so much work into such a good series. I haven't read this one yet but I do know that someone has worked very hard on it.Btw we are not 8.
You see, supporting friends. But considering that you don't have anyone helping your case... I still stand by my opinion that it seems like you don't have friends.
Saying he mostly gets straight A's and writes essays, yet doesn't know what the word prowess is or that it exists.I truly fear for the future.
Instead of crying for social injustice on a book board, Educate yourself, go out in the world and make a difference. No one listens to an uneducated braggart.
educate shouldn't be capitalized, it isn't a proper noun.
Want to bet? Almost all the administrative people at my school listen to be. So do the teachers, and security guards.
I understand that in gods creation everyone was originally straight, but this is the 21st century, we have gays, cell phones, pregnant 15yr olds, kids on crack and way worse. The world is a scary place and if Rick wanted people to be oblivious about gays then he wouldn't write it but he did. There obviously was a reason for his writing. So Kevin if the fact that Rick put gays in his book than go email him directly.
Actually, I have made a difference. I have been in a run the raises money for people with epilepsy.
@IhearthawaiiI liked how you deleted your comment after I posted that prowess was a word.
Your comment is still quoted in my post, so it didn't make any sense.
I helped clean up trash at Hanauma Bay.
We are going to a global leadership camp to help animals or children.
I am doing the epilepsy run again this year, look it up. Maybe you should try to make a difference. http://www.chelseahutchisonfoundation... She went to my school and died because she suffocated in a pillow in the middle of the night. My dad works with her dad.
Emily wrote: "I haven't read this one yet but I do know that someone has worked very hard on it...."How does working hard on something affect it's value?
If I spent years on a book it is good, JUST because I spent years on it? Where is your reasoning?
I disliked this book not because of the "gay" part, but because Rick did a complete 180 with regards to his character traits.
I guiltily rated this 4 Stars because I followed the series for so many years, but it should have been 2.5 Stars.
Why does it take you so long to reply? Is it because it is difficult for you to write something that you think has meaning, but really doesn't? Or because you have to look up what to write on the internet? Either way, that grammar is still wrong.
I think you meant "in regards"
Actually, it will make it look like you don't make sense. You wrote about something that isn't even posted.
Ihearthawaii wrote: "You see, supporting friends. But considering that you don't have anyone helping your case... I still stand by my opinion that it seems like you don't have friends."Iheart, I like you. You made me giggle.
You feel my lack of bringing irl(or goodreads) friends here to help me fight a "battle" means I don't have support?
All my "friends" are busy with life and I don't think any of them read this book.
Don't worry, Brown and others(if they are still notified by this thread), will come sometime in the future.
If you go back a few pages, you will see that replies are stretched between a period of months.
Anyways enjoy your night, I have work in the morning. Will check back sometime during the week.
I just came on to update my reviews and saw an update in the thread.
Sorry I'm not a skater Kevin the term 180 isn't in my data base
Ihearthawaii wrote: "educate shouldn't be capitalized, it isn't a proper noun."One last thing. When i capitalize something, I am trying to Emphasize the word.
I guess I could put the entire word in all caps, and surround it with quotation marks...but where is the fun in that?
You want to know something lame? That a guy who supposedly has work in the morning, is concerning himself with a book that is meant for middle school students. And the fact that you would care so much about a teenager, when you have a life of your own is very... incredulous. So have a good day at street sweeping, or janitorial services, because based on your intellectual failures, that's probably all you are able to do.
I should be capitalized.
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I already put in my 90 cents like 80+ pages back?
I just come here to get a laugh at people still going on at it because they refuse to quit until the other person agrees with their view.
A lot of persons just upped ad left after they saw the other side didn't gaf..... but some still come back trying to spread their agenda(has to be) around as much as possible.
Other than some openly using their personal bias to fuel the pro-con argument it was pretty entertaining.
And in case someone might be flipping on their turbo switch on their keyboard for me, you can't seriously think that you saying "I like this in a book" on a goodreads thread will actually accomplish anything?
Want to change something? Get out there and meet people. using social sites to get across one's agenda is successful a lot of the time, but once interest wanes... no one cares anymore.
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