Is it Just me or Does Bella Seem like Jr Wards Favorite?

[Kathryn]

Dhfan4life wrote: "Honestly I don't think V could handle someone biting on him. I mean given all he went through at daddy dearest's camp. He might see being bitten as another form of a violation and take some control..."

I think otherwise. Everyone else including Blay & Qhuinn feed during sex. It is something that he doesn't get. Speaking of the "young" issue, since children are so revered and can only come around once every 12 years you would think that they would either make Phury start getting busy with the chosen since they are the only ones that are constantly fertile or the men would actually want a continuation of their line. I read that Ward doesn't like writing women, and I think that is why she makes all the men not want kids and pregnancy almost kill the women. I would think that men who lived like this would want as many young to continue their line as possible. I would actually help the storyline.

She said that it is an open ended series but it looks like she is writing herself into a corner since they have no new recruits and no one wants a young. I hated that Beth had a baby but needed a hysterectomy. I would have thought that since she was half human that would have made it easier on Wrath and then he would have lots of kids. Well, I'm not the writer so who knows what's brewing. I think they need a kick ass female who is smart, sexy and crazy and it just so happens so she will be V's shellan too.

Sorry I have a thing for V and I feel he got cheated buy ending up with a ghost.

[Dhfan4life]

But remember, even in his book I think it was where it was even said that V was into the BDSM type of stuff cause he wanted to stay in control and not have others be up on him like that. That is what I was thinking of mostly in regards to having someone feeding on him. Kind of would not be his thing unless he bit someone else. And my memory is kind of fuzzy but which book was it that had Blay and Qhuinn feeding during sex? As I thought there was some mention at one point that they would feed from a Chosen then go and have sex. But never during unless I missed something.

Wowza, I really missed something if the kids are so revered. As I never quite got the vibe that kids were ever revered too much for the BDB dudes. For the Chosen and even the SV. And honestly Phury in my opinion is Primale in name only. He was never in my opinion going to be like the Primales in the days of old sleeping with all the Chosen to get some kids. He's a gentleman and heck not that long ago a virgin himself. Be kind of strange seeing him going from virgin to spreading seed far and wide on the random. Actually who they need is Mhurder for that lol. As for Ward not liking to write women, well I guess that is pretty apparent in regards to her having done away with the shellans save for a few here and there. I do agree with you a few more kids would add another element to things. But given that she has written grown men running away from one woman, i.e. Layla when she first came around. I'm not surprised really that there aren't more kids really.

Mhmm. Will agree with you on the writing herself into a corner but maybe she saw this direction all along if she has grown tired of the series a bit. I'm not a big fan of Beth's, but even I thought that was a blow to do that to Beth. I mean damn, chick just wanted a baby. Didn't have to yank her womanly parts out with the kid too. HA! Life made easy for Wrath. I only just started liking Wrath at the end of the King. I can go on for days the ways in which...well I'll stop right there. As for the smart, sexy, and crazy kick ass chick, I would have thought that was Xhex. But even then, you see they tried to put her in the corner too with JM's freak out with her fighting. So I guess unless in particular roles the women folk of Ward's vamp world just don't exist.

No prob at all. Many feel the same way about V and Jane. I just feel that with V not being like the other guys. He just might not have responded as accordingly with a regular shellan per se.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Kathryn wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "PNR anything is possible... this is true. It isn't the ghost concept that bothers me though, its the way it all played out and where it stands now and why, that I have a problem with. Never liked ..."

I totally agree. I hate Jane and remembering that men can have more that one shellan I hope Ward gives V a living breathing vampire female. He said once in his book that no one has ever feed from him. I can only imagine how intense that would be for him and I want that for him. I feel like since they had a falling out with Havers Jane was the excuse for the BDB to get their own in-house doctor. His relationship was a cop out. I didn't really buy his instant attraction to Jane in the first place. "

Thank You!!! Their whole thing was just weird to me.. I don't see why V couldn't just keep giving Jane his blood to slow her aging process, cos they talked about that in their book, and he actually fed her his blood twice I believe. But then again, I didn't want them together anyway. So it would not have changed things much for me, even if the ghost angle somehow was avoided. The ghost angle just made everything else worse for me. It was just the cherry on top of the sh*t storm....

When Jane died, I was really hoping that she didn't come back, cos honestly that was the only tangible/real emotional scene I experienced with her & V throughout their book. I mean I actually cried. And I thought after I finished the book, wow, what if Ward never brought Jane back? Besides Tohr, he would be the only other Brother to lose a Shellan, but I wanted to be able to see V actually go through that process.. become darker, get lost in his mission with his Brothers, all of that. Over the course of several books I wanted to see this play out THEN he would meet the Shellan he is too be with & Bond to. This is how I rewrote V's book in my head. LOL ....

But just adding to where they stand now with the ghost thing... I don't like how they have no possibilities or room to grow now as a couple. Jane is basically dead, well she is dead. They don't have many options now as a mated pair when it comes to all the other possibilities that the other couples have. And that's another major sore spot with me when it comes to V & Jane. They're stuck. And I just don't like that.

And I definitely agree with you, He got the shaft with his HEA. Point. Blank. Period. I remember after reading his book the first time, I actually had a dream that V was cussing Ward out cos of who he ended up with in his book. That's how strongly I hated his HEA. LOL Sometimes I can't believe I still remember that dream.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

@ D,

Q & Blay do feed on each other sometimes during sex. It's not for nourishment though, cos that's not gonna work. They need a female for that. But it's more out of intimacy/a primal need when they are physically intimate with each other. No different from the other couples when they bite each other during sex out of intimacy, it's just that they will actually get nourishment from each other as well when they do it, but Q & Blay won't.


As far as the Chosen thing, Ward just let it drop. The SV wanted more kids, more warriors, that's why she tried to get V to become the Primale in the 1st place, cos his seed would make some kick ass kids with the Chosen. Of course we saw how all that went... He wanted Jane, Phury stepped in for him and with a different vision for the Chosen females. Plus, Ward was definitely NOT going to have Phury Father babies with all of these women after he's mated to Cormia. Again, this action would undermine & completely throw out the purpose and meaning of a "Bonded Male"

But I agree, Ward dropped the ball with the Chosen angle big time. Cos she had so many avenues open to explore it. For the whole of the Race (when it came to more children) as well as having pure blood Brothers bred for the future. Now the Chosen as well as Phury's role in it, is adrift. Unfortunately. And it's been left alone for so long, I really don't see her expounding on it now. She missed her window to do so.. I too, think Murhder would make an excellent Primale. Given what little we know about him so far, but since Phury & Wrath has changed the ways of how the Chosen are used, I don't see them going back on that decision now. And the SV is still somewhere sulking cos she hasn't gotten her way in awhile.. Where the heck is that chick?

[Dhfan4life]

I totally have to go back as I so don't recall Blay and Qhuinn ever really feeding on each other ever. I probably glazed over it in between sub plots(hence why so many are not that good for my wittle brain at times).

Oh I definitely agree she dropped the ball on the Chosen. Hell I think she should never have really opened that door to begin with. By far one of the most antiquated pieces of vamp lore I've read thus far. And it went nowhere useful aside from some minimal back story on how the present BDB came to be. I still say that would never have worked with V as Primale. Given his past, who in their right mind would ask somebody that went through what he did to play brood stud like that? Uh no. So she was loco for having that idea. I will agree with you about the bonded male aspect in regards to Phury not going sudden stud. But I still think in his character it wouldn't make logical sense to be that way anyway. He's been number one savior without a cause since 'helping' his brother for years. And I don't think fighting the lessers was enough for him any more. So by being guardian of sorts to the Chosen it changed things up in at least a somewhat positive way for them both. May not have been the original purpose for them but it's somewhat better than nothing.

No kidding, I still wondered as to why she never had the Chosen take turns going back and recording what they experienced and learned to keep the histories current once they were freed. Given how Mhurder does not seem to care whom he is throwing his schlong at most days. I think he would still make a play for some available Chosen in one form or fashion just in spite of the other brothers. I mean he's been rogue this long. Who says he has to follow the mandate of the king now? I personally think SV is so weak and hanging on by a thread. I mean the race she created hasn't gone forth and created more life to cycle back through to give her more energy. No new brothers have been made. Chosen ain't having babies. So essentially I think SV is in a world of hurt big time. On life support and nobody is giving a damn.

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Kathryn wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "PNR anything is possible... this is true. It isn't the ghost concept that bothers me though, its the way it all played out and where it stands now and why..."

The devil's advocate in me wants to say, being stuck is a matter of perspective. But I'll stop cause we all could go on for days about V and Jane and they'd no doubt both tell all of us to take a long walk off a short pier somewhere lol.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

I know.. I really wish Ward would have allowed us to see the progress that V, Payne, & SV is/or should be making as far as their relationship. Yet another great plot Ward just let go. Not only would it allow us to see this progress how V & Payne are handling everything their mother did concerning them, and if they are able to really mend their relationships with her, but it would also keep the lines of communication open with SV period. We would actually see her. It makes no sense to me that the Mother/Creator of their race is just... gone.

As far as Phury and the Chosen go, I would be content with the way Ward has left things after having Phury change such a huge way of life for them, if we actually got to see how he's going about this transition with them as their Primale. Again, we see nothing. We don't know how any of them are truly handling the transition. Or how Phury & Cormia are handling their roles with them either. Especially since all we hear about them whenever they are mentioned is, they still go over to the other side from time to time, or when someone is breaking an appliance in the kitchen. That's it. And that tells me nothing.

Since Ward is so big on all these subplots I don't see why she doesn't take the opportunity to keep this plot alive with the Chosen, since she obviously doesn't have a problem with plucking one out of the bunch to pair them with someone... Plus its a solid plot and its another opportunity to keep Phury, his role as Primale, as well as a little updates here & there with he & Cormia, solid with the over all plot within the series.

There are so many things Ward just started & stopped that would have been great additions to the series, IMO. Things that are tangible and would have kept the plots fresh & interesting.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Dhfan4life wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Kathryn wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "PNR anything is possible... this is true. It isn't the ghost concept that bothers me though, its the way it all played out and where it stands now and why..."

The devil's advocate in me wants to say, being stuck is a matter of perspective. But I'll stop cause we all could go on for days about V and Jane and they'd no doubt both tell all of us to take a long walk off a short pier somewhere lol."

LOL! Pretty much. I get you on the perspective thing. But the facts are they are stuck. If their wants or desires were to change for any reason concerning certain things, they would not be able to embark on those things cos of how things stand with them. And that's what I mean when I say they're stuck. Nothing is open to them. They didn't even have a chance to exhaust or explore the possibilities, or even contemplate them cos they were never an option from the get go.

[Dhfan4life]

Oh I don't dispute your points at all here. Just that I've taken to looking at it all from the perspective of how she wrote her character's level of caring and compassion in the first place. Now I'm sure many will likely want to mob me for this. But I think the world in which Ward created, though highly creative and interesting, is not really conducive at times to giving a shit about your fellow man unless they are one of your inner circle.

So to expand on that, as you said with V, Payne, and their mom and their relationship. I sorta saw the writing on the wall where that was concerned after V learned about Payne. Kind of a "what? you lied and kept my sister from me?!?! Screw you. Now we both can kick you out of our lives for good." Kind of thing as that was just how V always seemed to be in my eyes. Aside from giving her those birds and getting help when with Jane when she died. He has not given a diddly about her too much.

And then Payne on the other hand lived with up there in the general vicinity of her for umpteen years and only saw far enough past her own nose to know that she wanted to have a regular life. Nothing wrong with that sentiment or even V's tude given his upbringing. But still this is their mom/creator of them all. I too would have thought Ward would have at least had some inkling in their heads that maybe someone needs to go and check on her. Not like either of their lives are so fabu that they can't.

As for Phury and Cormia, again another seeing the writing on the wall sort of situation. He was never the ideal male for the Primale role in the first place. And Cormia for all her quiet strength was not much of a female leader either. So the best they were ever going to achieve with the other Chosen was to get them to have a somewhat normal life like other female vamps of the Old Country. Able to for the most part do their own thing. But if it comes down to involving any males, Phury acts like big daddy in charge and warns them off. And the Chosen go back to breaking appliances and vacuuming all the live long day through. And Cormia gets back to doing whatever. That is why I just roll my eyes now at any mention of a Chosen that isn't Layla these days. I mean they are pretty much like kept birds in another cage of a sort. Pretty to look at and well cared for, but nobody really wants much to do with them. And it's sad.

Yep, I had thought in the beginning Ward would have used some of the sub plots to eventually get more of the Chosen paired off. But I guess not, other than the main two. And actually Selena was sorta a fore runner after Layla for a little while there. Beginning the second fast food chickadee on two legs. And in the King I guess it was apparent why. As it would seem only ehros make the best meals and eventually get a story too. Everyone in between up the creek.

And just you saying that last thought about Ward, is generally why I don't often read an author's other works they've done. You shaft me once shame on me. You shaft me twice then I'm wasting my time I could be reading something else.

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Dhfan4life wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Kathryn wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "PNR anything is possible... this is true. It isn't the ghost concept that bothers me though, its the way it ..."

Oh I get what you and Kathryn meant. Just to me V never wanted all those other options in the first place like some of the other brothers. There was not one scene I ever read with him in there crying out for more. He was happy with all his computers, his workshop making the daggers, having his visions no one wanted to hear, hell using the freaky gloved hand of doom to light his smokes. And that is it. Heck to get a shellan like Beth or anybody else, would likely piss him off is how I see it. As he truly is a male that does not admire much of anything in others at all.

So kind of why I saw the Jane/intellectual element in there as being his ideal match. Not messy with a whole lot of emotions. Not overly touchy feeling in ways he doesn't want. He can still live with Butch and no shellan whining that they spend too much time together. In his world, all his ducks are in a row, so not stuck to him at all. Those other possibilities might have made him stuck and he'd probably spiral out again just at the notion some female wants to lock him down in those other ways the brothers have. I mean remember this is the dude that was shown giving affection to Jane in a public place once and nobody even knew what to do or say about it cause it was so NOT him.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

LOL..that is true of V.. I just hoped that once he allowed himself to truly love another like that, that there were some things that would evolve or even change, as far as his views/feelings on them. But then again, V is very high maintenence when it comes to being in a relationship with him. I couldn't do it. I love me some V, but I couldn't do it. His emotional stability (questionable) his quirks, and how he just typically goes about his day to day existence, he seems like the most laid back Brother in many respects because of who he is, but if u were in a relationship with him? it would be hard for the average female I believe. So maybe he is better off with someone like Jane who doesn't really need all those things to line up in order to be content.

But I still just wish he were with a different female that could give him all that & still handle & be content with him & his ways.

[Kathryn]

Dhfan4life wrote: " ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Dhfan4life wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Kathryn wrote: ~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "PNR anything is possible... this is true. It isn't the ghost concept that bothe..."

D that's true, but part of her having these guys fall in love is the kind of transformation that we witness a la Zsadist. V and he have a similar history of abuse and closing themselves off. So the complete transformation f Z was widely accepted and loved by all.

It's not Jane's intellect that bothers me. Every other brother would kill, maim whatever for their shellan. That element was not present with them. I didn't really get an emotional connection from Jane or V. It felt totally forced. It would have been better if he went into an S & M club and met a human dominatrix as far I'm concerned. He needs someone who isn't scared of sex, violence or intelligence. Jane seems sooo timid sexually it makes me laugh. No way could he scale back his sexually needs to vanilla for her. IMO just seemed so fake. Even Manny's attraction to Jane was kinda outta left field.

I don't know. V's book and Phury's books were the worst for me. Neither one got a good HEA as far as I'm concerned. All of the chosen are basically simpering idiots and Cormia was one too. I'm assuming that we will hear from Amalya next.

I believe it was mentioned once that on the other side the chosen were always fertile. Why not do artificial insemination from Rhage, V, Blay, JM and Qhuinn on the chosen and just make a bunch babies, since all the chosen are good for is to feed from and be mom's. That way you can create more warriors and the chosen have a purpose. They don't seem to die during child birth on the other side so that would solve that problem. Who knows, just the thoughts of crazy series fan. :)

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

The only problem with that logic, Kathryn, is that artificial insemination doesn't work with Vamps for some reason, in this series.(this was said early on in the series, I forget which book) They have to make babies the old fashioned way. And since the males you mentioned are all mated/committed, they would not be down with that nor would their Mates.

But I still will never understand why the SV didn't have a back up plan when it was clear that the Brotherhood were no longer going to the Chosen anyway, to be serviced (in a sexual capacity) I mean she had decades upon decades to come up with something

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Kathryn wrote:
It's not Jane's intellect that bothers me. Every other brother would kill, maim whatever for their shellan. That element was not present with them. I didn't really get an emotional connection from Jane or V. It felt totally forced................... He needs someone who isn't scared of sex, violence or intelligence. Jane seems sooo timid sexually it makes me laugh. No way could he scale back his sexually needs to vanilla for her. IMO just seemed so fake. Even Manny's attraction to Jane was kinda outta left field.

And this is EXACTLY why I could never fully embrace them as a couple. U don't see or feel any of that with V & Jane, even all these books later. And like I said before, Ward only continues to play up the fact that they are intellectually compatible. And that's it. And sorry, it takes more than that to have a deep, emotionally intense & solid relationship. And as base & primal & dark as ALOT of V's "desires" are, I can't believe that he doesn't exude/ or express any intense emotion when it comes to his mate. It just makes no sense to me. They just don't mesh. They have always been a forced union to me.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

This always pops into my mind... But how different would the series have been you think, if Bella in fact chose Phury over Zsadist?

[Dhfan4life]

Kathryn, you hit on exactly what I was thinking you would. About V and Z having similar history. Which in some ways I can't dispute that. Just in a way I sorta think too Ward used Z as another plot device. Having him be all psycho and tug at the readers' love for the tortured hero, heart strings. Which even I can admit I mildly fell for him a bit too after I saw he had some kind of vision of brighter tomorrows when he was a slave. So Bella and baby just triggered that former idealic self for him. So much so he even wanted to have therapy in the basement with Mary.

However for the flip side with V, yea he might have had a soft spot once. But when your own parent is out to take your manhood so to speak from you and do it with such glee. I can kind of see how that does something to V. Broke him and his reality perception of things. And made him want to always be in control of things. So in essence kind of one of those characters that you can't really love past their pain and trauma. Even if we would want to. V's closed that door and locked it and only allowing in what he can control and will not transform for no one. Which I can get sucks for a crazy fan, lol. I've had some other fave characters not go the way I wished them too either. But had to pull back and see what was than what I hoped and prayed for them.

Actually I don't think he did regress back to vanilla sex with Jane. From their book last I recalled hadn't they mentioned they were still going to keep his place at the *cough*Whormodore(who isn't getting it on in that building these days? Geesh)*cough* Commodore. And still go there for the kinky stuff between them. Just he can't be taking on other lovers there though. LMAFO at the thought of V with a human dominatrix. Not to say your idea is beyond funny to me. But the V I have in my head, would probably laugh that poor woman out of the Compound and kick any toys she has out with her. LOL, she said even Manny's attraction to Jane was out of left field. Dude that was so another writing on the wall moment for me. I mean since book 1, who HASN'T been having a unrequited crush on somebody in this series that hasn't given them the time of day? That was why I was so wild for Butch and Marissa getting together at first. I was so over the other characters pining for someone else like little kids it wasn't even funny. So by the time Manny the fetus was introduced, I just knew he had to have a thing for Jane. Cause why not?

I just see Phury and V's books as ones readers have to turn side ways a bit when reading. As neither won't ever really match up to what we know of paranormal romance or even urban fantasy for that matter. And either perspective we put on it, still likely won't match whatever was going on in Ward's noodle when she put them together.

Would be interesting on the artificial insemination aspect for Rhage and Mary. But they can't do that I don't think? Qhuinn and his family unit already got a bun in the oven so to speak. V definitely doesn't want kids. Another reason why he is content with a never fertile, not alive shellan. No needing, no periods, nobody taking from emotional spirals if need be lol (So seeing even further what you mean about being in a relationship with him Princess on this one. ;) JM doesn't want any babies either given his past. Although that would be interesting to see. Although at times I felt like Ward wrote Xhex a bit too tough chick. Hell if they ever were contemplating having kids it'd be another book of arguing on who would carry it LOL.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Dhfan4life wrote: So to expand on that, as you said with V, Payne, and their mom and their relationship. I sorta saw the writing on the wall where that was concerned after V learned about Payne. Kind of a "what? you lied and kept my sister from me?!?! Screw you. Now we both can kick you out of our lives for good." Kind of thing as that was just how V always seemed to be in my eyes. Aside from giving her those birds and getting help when with Jane when she died. He has not given a diddly about her too much.

And see I would have loved to see V, Payne or both, telling their mother this. Anything. We just got nothing. We got to see V replacing his mother's birds cos of what she did for Jane, but we don't see them react to her in any way, about what she did to them & the things they found out? And she is the Mother of the race too, not just their mom. Her being gone, just poof out of the picture is just off the wall weird to me.

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "The only problem with that logic, Kathryn, is that artificial insemination doesn't work with Vamps for some reason, in this series.(this was said early on in the series, I forget which book) They h..."

Ah, I thought they couldn't but wasn't sure. Yep, I go back to these same males having run from Layla like her coochie was on fire or the devil. I swear I still burst out laughing just thinking about grown men being this way. I just can't picture how that is. So no way in the world would those dudes be taking on more Chosen lol.

I am with you Princess, about the SV. She had umpteen years to figure out contingency plans. But I guess the arrogance of being a Goddess got in her way. I mean sure in days gone by other brothers did her bidding nicely. But yea that didn't stick around for long.

Forced or what V wants. It's totally Ward's law of the land with them. My take away is thankfully they weren't a top fave for me anyway lol. But definitely hats off to you ladies for making compelling arguments. :)

Don't get me started on Bella and Phury. Oh lordy I wanted to beat her with that hair brush when she was brushing his hair. Is she that freaking blind? >_<

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Dhfan4life wrote: V definitely doesn't want kids. Another reason why he is content with a never fertile, not alive shellan. No needing, no periods, nobody taking from emotional spirals if need be lol (So seeing even further what you mean about being in a relationship with him Princess on this one. ;)

JM doesn't want any babies either given his past. Although that would be interesting to see. Although at times I felt like Ward wrote Xhex a bit too tough chick. Hell if they ever were contemplating having kids it'd be another book of arguing on who would carry it LOL. "


LOL! Yup V.. way too difficult to be with..

Lord I hope and pray that the kid issue never changes with Xhex & JM.. I wouldn't doubt she would try to figure out a way to have JM carry that baby for 18 months LOL

Xhex is definitely in many respects too Rough Neck Chick. I like her, but what I hate about her character is her default response is always to run away when stuff appears to be really hard & she needs to stick it out. She has no problems throwin her weight around so to speak, when she's trying to prove that she can battle & handle herself just as well as any male, but when she needs to be strong without being able to use her physical strength, she resorts to the very thing she claims to hate; cry baby chick, throwin a tantrum & running away cos she didn't get her way. I can't stand that. And her default response is always to push people away & run away *rolls eyes*

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Dhfan4life wrote: So to expand on that, as you said with V, Payne, and their mom and their relationship. I sorta saw the writing on the wall where that was concerned after V learned about Payne. Ki..."

What gets me more than anything though is also what is up with Wrath stop seeing her. Sure I get that V and Payne weren't going to go there. But dude he at least used to visit her too. I mean when he went all the way blind he turned his back on her too. It's like what the freak is going on here? Not to mention that time we did get to see on the other side and Darius mentioning coming back. I would have thought maybe some past brothers would be talking to her too and be like the new guys are acting up. Somebody needs to do something or whatever. Some kind of scene where she is interacting with the dead gone by other than that one time.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

LMBO!!! Yea Wrath was like "F*ck it. I got my own problems"

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Dhfan4life wrote: Don't get me started on Bella and Phury. Oh lordy I wanted to beat her with that hair brush when she was brushing his hair. Is she that freaking blind? >_< ."

My mother said the same thing, when she read that scene! LOL!

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Dhfan4life wrote: V definitely doesn't want kids. Another reason why he is content with a never fertile, not alive shellan. No needing, no periods, nobody taking from emotional spirals if need be l..."

LOL could you imagine that conversation?

JM:"I think I changed my mind about wanting kids..."

Xhex:"What the hell do you mean you changed your mind?!?!"

JM:"Well yea, a little me or you running around in leathers would be bad ass, right?"

Xhex:"Hell NO! Wait unless you carrying it then I'll reconsider."

JM:"That is NOT EVEN POSSIBLE! I don't even have any of your female "junk"(a la reference to Wrath and his association with Beth's "junk" from the King)!"

Xhex:"Male sea horses figure that sh*t out and so can you. I'm out!"

Runs off to bike and to the goth club to bounce people no bigger than my pinky to feel better about self....

Haha, so yea can't see rock-a-bye babies in that situation. I do agree with you on her running away for sure. I like Xhex, but dude, put on the grown woman draws already and stick around sometime and fight for the other stuff not just in proving you can whup some ass like the guys. Geeze.

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "LMBO!!! Yea Wrath was like "F*ck it. I got my own problems""

Isn't he always though? Another point of contention for me with Wrath. I mean damn to be the king he is the most side stepping character I have ever known lol. If it doesn't directly affect him he ain't seeing sh*t. Literally!

High five to your mom. And back to Bella and Phury. Honestly I have no words on how that would have gone down if they were a couple. Because if you think Jane and V were forced. Dude Bella and Phury would have been very forced too. I mean sure Phury had some infatuation there. But Bella the ridiculous would have really made them a dumb pair. I mean I hate to say it but it seems like she is only someone that can recognize a higher level of emotion/feelings in people. But when it comes down to something more subtle she is emotionally blind as a bat. I mean hell til Phury got really ticked off or something she probably be sitting there wondering what is going on. Or worse he would have been depicted as worshipping her for her beauty and kind heart. And yet not really seeing her for the ding bat she is at times.

Actually come to think of it though. I think Phury and Bella would have been the hetero version of what Qhuinn would always say of Saxton and Blay. The Abercrombie and Fitch couple of the year. Too pretty and perfect for words. And likely not much substance there. So in a way it was good they didn't get together. But I hoped that as Nala aged that she would have a close connection with Phury and follow him around. At least give him a sweet bond with the kid that sorta looks more like his kid than Z's in my head. Not to say that they wouldn't as they are already family. But nothing wrong with having a little buddy that looks out for Phury too would have been sweet.

[Lídia]

I don't mind, Bella and Zsadist are my favorite, their history is amazing, even their novela

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

LMBO!! Girl u got me in tears..

Back to Phury & Bella... I like Bella :)

I don't think she is emotionally blind really to the more subtle reactions or feelings per se, she is just more in denial of them especially when she can't return them. The impression I got from her concerning Phury, especially when they were kinda saying good bye to each other when she was brushing his hair, is she avoids the emotional elephant in the room when it comes to Phury. She knew he was feeling her, from the beginning. Granted, she wasn't paying that close attention at first, cos she was so wrapped up in how to get Z to notice her, but in her & Z's book, she finally saw the depth of Phury's feelings for her. She felt guilty cos she couldn't return those feelings so she would always revert to "If I don't acknowledge it, then it's not real" I hated that she did this cos it was so obvious to us, and it would be like a slap in Phury's face every time. But at the same time what could she really do or say? The only thing that would truly take the hurt from Phury in that situation is if Z wasn't bonded to her, and she was not in love with Z. So I get why she would react & relate to Phury the way that she did, but it still irked me too, cos I love Phury and my baby was hurting...

#Confession_ I really wanted JM to be with Cormia @ first, not really long term, but I was hoping he'd hit that. LOL (I know I sound like a dude) but the chick I would prefer he was mated to, would be Payne. Hands down. Even though I do love her & Manny together, she would be my ideal Mate for JM.... Honestly I can't see Xhex in a relationship with any male in the BDB.. But I can see her with this guy Wraith, in another series The Demonica series...

Leave my baby Wrath alone! I love Wrath! he's my boo.. Even though he is a major pain in the behind, I just still love him.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Lídia wrote: "I don't mind, Bella and Zsadist are my favorite, their history is amazing, even their novela"

I love them & their story too. Their book & Novella still remains to be my #1 books in this series. I guess I just always wonder how it would be if it went the other way, cos of how much Phury was feeling her.

[Dhfan4life]

That is the problem though. Cause I sorta like Bella too. But damn she was all Wrath with Beth and the Marissa situation. I mean I swear the lot of them need to grow a pair and just address the elephant in the room period. I've never read a series where all the adults just don't want to sit down with peeps and be like this is the score. I know you feel this way etc. etc. I get that. But I don't unfortunately, etc. etc. Add some much needed space in there and then I think peeps can move on and not be pining so much. But they just don't and it's just crazy.

I'll admit I saw a bit of a vibe between JM and Cormia at first. But I doubt they would have even let that happen. Not just cause he wasn't a brother yet or anything. But probably felt cause he like other young male vamps would be all about the perving on her and not respect her. So yea be another odd little Romeo and Juliet kind of thing. As for Payne, yea maybe. But dude would you really want V as your brother-in-law? lol. I mean dude even at the same age, V was all trying to play Payne's daddy and be uber protective of her when she was getting with Manny. Which is such a trip given how much action he and the brothers gotten for ages before he knew her. I know who you are talking about with Wraith. I still amazed myself by liking his book in that series too. But hmm, still kind of tricky for me seeing her even with Wraith. I mean when she was first introduced I thought she was going to be the first lesbian vamp character. But then Ward flipped the switch and had her wanting to get it on with Butch. Which I still thought was an odd pairing there too.

I did wind up liking him midway through/end of the King. But dude he has pissed me off for a long time. Hard to remember I actually like Wrath now somewhat. Old habits and all that.

[Dhfan4life]

Lídia wrote: "I don't mind, Bella and Zsadist are my favorite, their history is amazing, even their novela"

Yea, I liked their novella and most aspects of their book. Just Bella read a little too heat seeking missile on Z from the get go. Kind of the insta-trope of a good woman needing to fix the bad boy right off. Which I wasn't a fan of particularly given how he was with Beth and Mary.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

LOL Wraith is the closest male I can see her with though... It's like I wouldn't say I would want them together necessarily, but he's the only dude where I can kinda see them workin long term..

JM & Cormia, no long term, wouldn't happen. I wasn't feelin it like that, but I was kinda wanting JM to get some. It would have been so easy for him to attempt it too, since Phury charged him with looking after her & keeping her company.... Hahaha! Yea, V as a brother-in-law, would be harsh. But I still think it would be worth it cos I think they (JM & Payne) would be great together. Plus V is gonna be "Big Brother" to her always when it comes to males treating her right. but I think he would have been a little more receptive of JM since JM is Darius' "son" and all & he's pretty solid. He's had time to get to know him. Manny was just a human to V, in the outside world, on top of being a guy wanting to get with his sister, so of course V was gonna be all over that one LOL

[Dhfan4life]

But remember Wraith tended to like his women more feminine for sure. And although I wasn't overly fond of Serena and her teenage obsession with vamps when the book started out. I thought they wound up being a good match. I still think Xhex could have been a better lesbian for sure lol.

Dude they all could have had a piece. They just kept running from it with Layla lol. And in her own way Cormia is super sweet and innocent. So even short term being with him likely would have messed with her head. As she is one of the Chosen that wasn't quite skilled in the hit it and quit it fine arts. One would think so. But those brothers at times don't give a diddly squat if you are a close friend or not. When it comes down to an actual sib or someone under their protection they will rip you a new pair. Prime example how Wrath was being with JM even mouthing that he would be there for Beth and cared about her and stuff when he was having those seizures. I mean Wrath was going ape sh*t being like who the hell is this male to be getting like this towards MY WOMAN. Even if they are siblings. It was just stone cold silly to me. So I kind of like JM in those non-confrontational spots. He so reminds me of Bumblebee from those transformer movies at times. Great fighter and all that. But when it comes down to deal with dicey situations where he doesn't quite have the 'voice' so to speak to back things up at times, it's kind of tough reading him struggling to sign fast enough what he really means.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

I know sign language and I couldn't imagine trying to comprehend what JM is tryin to say during those moments of extreme emotion, fear, or anger

[Dhfan4life]

No kidding. And what usually makes it worse there is rarely someone close enough by to translate for him fast enough. So I just cringe when he and Wrath get together at times.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Dhfan4life wrote: "No kidding. And what usually makes it worse there is rarely someone close enough by to translate for him fast enough. So I just cringe when he and Wrath get together at times."

No doubt Wrath & JM hate being in a room alone together.. No one there to help, nothing but crickets.. LOL JM could whistle, but Wrath would be like... WTH u whistling for? I can't see anything ur pointing to"

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Dhfan4life wrote: I mean when she was first introduced I thought she was going to be the first lesbian vamp character. But then Ward flipped the switch and had her wanting to get it on with Butch. Which I still thought was an odd pairing there too.

But Butch is fine! I really can't blame Xhex for wanting to hop on top of that. LOL It was a strange pairing yes, but it was only a screw. And apparently a very good one ;D Remember, Butch needed the complete opposite of what his heart wanted that night, and Xhex was down, so it all worked out *giggles*

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Dhfan4life wrote: "No kidding. And what usually makes it worse there is rarely someone close enough by to translate for him fast enough. So I just cringe when he and Wrath get together at times."

..."

Haha, I was soooo thinking that when they were waiting for Beth to get back. Talk about your awkward silences and then a clear blue whistle out the yonder....and yet you still don't know what all the whistling is about. Thankfully they have great senses of smell between the pair of them.

[Dhfan4life]

~*~Princess Nhya~*~ wrote: "Dhfan4life wrote: I mean when she was first introduced I thought she was going to be the first lesbian vamp character. But then Ward flipped the switch and had her wanting to get it on with Butch...."

Oh not a slight against Butch. I'm just saying that at that point in the series I was so on the Xhex the new lesbian character train in my head(literal chick that has a metaphorical d*ck energy of her own going on). That it was like why would she be into such a masculine character as Butch? As I just could not see her softening enough to have sex with a guy. And when there was the mini reveal where she and Rhev kinda tried for things to at some point and it didn't work out. That too reaffirmed to me at the time she wasn't into the dudes. Then pretrans JM comes along and she's into him and he probably weighed 90 lbs. or so soaking wet at the time and I guess that really tripped her switch. But after he transitioned. It still seemed like Xhex just liked it better on 'top' so to speak.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

True... this is all true.. honestly I threw the biggest tantrum when I realized that Ward was pairing Xhex with JM... I didn't accept it until their book came and though I loved their book, I even fell in love with them, but when their book ended and to this day I still wish and want JM to have a different mate... xhex is just too annoying and selfish to me when it comes to her dealings and expectations she has concerning JM

[Dhfan4life]

Interesting. I gave their book 4 myself and I guess even for all her faults I still sorta back Xhex in general. Cause in some respects she finally repped a female that wasn't necessarily fitting into the 'kept' woman mold in their world. So in a way I had always hoped she would have brought something new to the table even with JM. But it didn't quite get there. Although it drove it home more that you can't change a old fashioned male either when they fought over her getting out there to fight even more. That too in a way is why I didn't quite see JM and Payne being a match. Cause no doubt he'd want her to stay home too.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

But that's the calling card for any bonded male though. Not sayin its fair, but that's the way it is with these males and when it comes to their mates. Xhex is over 3 centuries older than JM. JM is only 3 yrs out of his transition.. He's a baby compared to her... my point is, her reactions to him and his stances as a bonded male should not Surprise her at all. And it certainly shouldn't warrant the extremes she goes to to prove a point. She wants everyone to see her as strong and not try to change her, and yet she refuses to give her bonded mate that same courtesy and understanding while still demanding it of him. And that's why I have a prob with her and her relationship with JM.

[Dhfan4life]

I hear where you are coming from. But at the same time Xhex is also part Sympath so technically from the get go I felt that she always saw herself as somewhat removed from the regular vamp world. So it does kind of chafe at being told what to do like they are in the old world and not living in modern times. Actually chafes me a lot with their bonding rules too at times. I mean I get it may be all ingrained into their nature. But dude, it's 2014 change that junk up already. Hell you see it does nothing but cause friction at times and ends up with more females like the Chosen. In particular like Layla. Just another pretty bird in a cage, nicely protected. But don't let her want something more for herself without them saying something akin to "no you silly female, just sit there and don't lift a finger for anything. And don't have too strong an opinion or we will lock you up and likely use a needle on ya." I mean really? Dude makes me wish there was a Harriet Tubman vampiric female around there or somebody to finally say free at last or something. Cause don't get me wrong, I love JM. But even he went the way of patriarchal male on her, even knowing who she was too before they got together seriously. And what makes this even more funny and ironic is I'm usually the one that can't stand female characters that try and change their guys. But in such a repressed world, I'm definitely flipping the script for the women folk for sure.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

The thing is Xhex and all these females know who they are CHOOSING to be with too.. and if u know it's ingrained in a male vamps nature, there's just no getting around that. If its a deal breaker for you, then why are you with them?... and at the end if the day we aren't dealing with human males. These are male vamps whose possessive and protective instincts are closer to the baser needs of animals. can we really expect them to compromise on levels of an average human male when it comes to people they care for On a primal elemental level? U might as well ask or demand a cat or dog to stop acting like a cat or a dog

[Dhfan4life]

Again I hear you and theoretically understand to. But why does the male nature have to top the female nature all the time? This is what I never quite understand or get with vampire stories as a whole most times. I mean at some point it is just comes off as a glorified excuse to be a caveman. And yet, females/women are supposed to love this? Really? And as for choosing someone else where these females are concerned. It comes down to basic prejudice of things I think. Rather they want to admit it or not. I'm sure ingrained in their own nature is the belief that like Xcor, humans are tailless rats that they wouldn't sully themselves with. So kind of a damned if they do or if they don't in either direction really.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

I don't know sis, the moment Adam bit that apple, we were no longer equals... it's just the way of the world.... but again dealing with Pnr and aggressive vamp males, with strong baser, primal instincts, u would be naive to expect "progressive" thinkin and compromise when it comes to certain aspects of female and male relations

[Dhfan4life]

So wait, it's ok for them to evolve enough to like Rap. Move to America and be throwing their schlongs around in all kinds of humans etc. But yet when it comes down to evolve and change in regards to their women, they just won't? To me that just reads as counterintuitive to me on the part of Ward.

And also I don't think it is naïve really to think they could be progressive. I mean they aren't that way entirely in the Dark-hunter books. Yes they are human based vampires. But still I think in and of itself sets a standard for what vampire stories could be going forward. That is why I don't get the need to stay stuck in the days of ol' vampire style of things. So it's more like naïve for authors to still hold to that standard. vampires and Pnr characters can be anything you want them to be. Reverting back to the old way is really saying you can't be as creative as you need to be without falling onto this trope where the male gets to have all these strong, dark, and primal feelings. But for a woman can't. To me that is just silly.

And hope that all doesn't sound like I'm being defensive or anything there. But I've always had this issue with the vamp nature, add on the alpha male 'tude too. And then it's like the reader and even the heroine is supposed to be so happy go lucky with the guy going caveman style like this. And unfortunately I don't buy it. As an aside it's kind of why I don't normally like reading about vamps in the story exclusively. Tends to end up being all about that primal side and how the chick he is with has to just accept it after he stalked her down or whatever. And yet he doesn't want to hear about what is going on in her nature too. Sorely tempts me to want to write a story where the male vamp has to back up as his chick has some stuff in her nature going on too. Like if you keep getting on her nerves she is going to go literal she hulk on him, lol.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

Dhfan4life wrote: "So wait, it's ok for them to evolve enough to like Rap. Move to America and be throwing their schlongs around in all kinds of humans etc. But yet when it comes down to evolve and change in regards o their women, they just won't? To me that just reads as counterintuitive to me on the part of Ward. ..."

Liking or disliking music, is a matter of taste, not a matter of primal instinct when it comes to their protective natures. Just like moving to another country. One has nothing to do with the other. It's like, if you give a wild animal food cos he's in captivity, yea he's gonna eat it, but it's not gonna take away his deep rooted instinct or desire to hunt & catch his prey. It's just in him. It's not something u can change. And that's exactly how it is when it comes to these vamps primal instincts and the drive that tells them to seek & protect what is theirs.


But no u don't sound defensive at all. I get where ur coming from, I just don't agree with it. Mainly cos when it comes to these stories, PNR etc.. they are labeled PNR for a reason. There are just things about the Vamps or even Werewolves natures' that sets them apart from a "Normal" male They are by calling card more aggressive, not with only their senses, but by their emotions as well. They have the ability to reason obviously, they are not total animals, but at the end of the day they do have a more baser primal side than an average male, and when it comes to certain things, that primal side is more dominate and in most cases will always win out.

So I don't take issue with the "caveman" act when it comes to some of these characters/stories, concerning male & female relations. Cos they are based in a world where these type of characteristics are set to be paramount, especially among the males.

[Dhfan4life]

Ok, you got me there on the music front. And not saying that I don't get that they are labeled PNR for a reason. It's just it still seems/reads like such an antiquated trope that men's feelings and urges are more important than a woman's when stories are written this way. Kind of like in the era of when they had those how to be a good wife books. And the first chapter is sit pretty, shut up, don't show your emotions, and submit(literally) to your husband's every whim. Which is nauseating and kind of deplorable to me.

As for werewolves I've read different takes on them as well. Some equally as cavemanish. And others somewhat just as progressive. So again, I think it comes back to more of what the author wants to see in the characters/story too. Cause although I don't expect fluffy bunnies from characters of either the fanged or fuzzy persuasion. I still don't think what the guy feels should be more important than the woman. Most especially if said womenfolk are of the same species and world too. And their natures should be just as dark and primal as well. Kind of an imbalance when only the guy is allowed to go Hulk or King Kong crazy. And yet the females of the species are 'angels' that sit back and watch. And last I recalled most anything with a vagina has sat back and been quiet. At least for more than half a second that is.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

I agree, it does depend on what the author likes to see in their characters and that dictates what appears in the page, definitely. It's just that most authors that write these stories do typically stay within the realm of mirroring the personalities to be in line with their baser instincts and I guess for me that route makes more sense to me when it comes to these type of stories/genres. And usually are much more entertaining for me. If I am wanting to see more PC/progressive equality among male and female relations, then I usually go to my more contemporary romance reads. I don't typically look for it or necessarily want to see it in my PNR reads. Cos in most scenarios of PNR, thus type if writing seems out of place to me.

[Dhfan4life]

True enough. I guess too that is why I alternate between PNR and Urban Fantasy reads. As the nature of the beast so to speak doesn't bother me and fits in the urban fantasy world. PNR or any romance to me is asking me to support/fall for the couple for X,Y, and Z reasons. And when there is the imbalance or a lack of respect for what your lady actually is or can do that is just a major blow not just to the ego. But to their whole relationship to me. And makes the story even more unbelievable for me. I try and pride myself on giving authors plenty of fictional leeway and accepted some things that others would say is too crazy. But even I can't fall for king kong and the dragon lady that has no fire. And so we agree to disagree once more.

[~*~Princess Nya Vasiliev~*~]

LOL *fist bump*