Elinor’s Comments (group member since Apr 06, 2022)

Elinor’s comments from the Nothing But Reading Challenges group.

Day 4 - Chapters 24 - 31

16. Gotta love a "do this impossible thing to win her hand in marriage" task! What do you think of the relationship between Sita and Rama, as we get different facets through this section?


Their relationship doesn't sound nice and Sita seems at her wits' end - why Rama chose to marry someone he would not be able to manipulate is beyond me though.


17. What do you think about the revelations from Lakshmana about Rama and how he interacts with the world. Do you have any thoughts about the neck-choking connection in the Binding Plain?


It's interesting to see a similar power to Kaikeyi's at play here. I'm surprised at how precociously power-hungry Rama is though perhaps it is youthful to want power before you understand what it truly means. He seems less wary of using his power than his mother - he's prepared to entangle and ensnare without a second thought - perhaps a side-effect of realising very young that he was a god. I like the imagery which reflects the strength of a god.
What an awkward time for Kaikeyi to be leaving again!


18. We meet Kaikeyi's mother. What did you think of her and her story? Are there any parallels or comparisons to draw between her life and Kaikeyi's?


I like her mum and her story sounds quite realistic to me. I can see the parallels in that both are women of power in a world of men.


19. The seeds are being laid for a big conflict, one way or another. Who's going to move first - Rama, the ashuras or Ravana?


Nice question - not a clue at this point. Still wondering what Kaikeyi is about to do to give her such a bad reputation.

Spells for Forgetting - Adrienne Young - October 2023

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Congratulations MelanieJoy!

Not volunteering for DQs as running late but looking forward to reading and discussing this one when I get around to it. I have ordered it properly this time :).

DQs Day 3 Chapters 16-23

11. What do you think of the three wives and their relationship with each other? Is it what you expected?
What of the creation of the Women’s Council? From stitch and bitch to a real world changer. Did you think there would be repercussions?

Not really - I expected lots of drama but it turns out they're really resilient - it's quite an interesting sign of their times isn't it? I mean I've read other books where men are polygamous and it's so engrained that nobody questions it, and they get on with it quite peacefully (okay, not always but you can't like everyone, and a lot depends on the husband being fair too!). The same goes for the Mosuo where women can have as many men as they like. If a society works and people are content then I feel few people will question the customs - on the other hand, if it fuels resentment, then change occurs. Okay, lol, reading back that last sentence does sound like a load of cobblers. I'll have to think about what affects change... as it requires far more than just minor resentment!

Re the Women's Council, we can already see some of the repercussions. Even positive changes come at a cost. This is one of the reasons I hope we keep moving forward as a society - it would be such a shame to lose the things others have 'earned' us.


12. Mom is alive. Honestly, I had put her out of my mind. Will Kaikeyi try to visit her? Will this be one if the boons?

I think they will meet again. I'm not sure Kaikeyi needs her husband's approval on this one - she does need her own though, if she wants the heart to heart that they deserve.


13. So, Rama. I don’t have kids, so I will let others expound on what it might be like to have a son who turns out to be a god.
He is starting out at least as kind of a jerk of a god, yes? Do you think that a god is possessing the child, or the child is the god, or there is a duality fighting for supremacy? Not sure that question made sense.

I think he is a god 100%, and don't feel the duality or possession you mention (but your question does make perfect sense!). I guess even gods have their blindsides and he is very inexperienced.

@Cat, @Angie, lol, loved your answers to this one


14. Did you expect Dasharath to keep his word about his sons and the heir? Do you expect Kaikeyi to be ok with his choice?

Yes, I did. I don't particularly recognise the Dasharath I thought I knew, but I also (kind of) understand his change of heart. I think Kaikeyi has accepted his choice, but I'm not sure it's a good one. I expected her to challenge it more because of the political ramifications for her brother's kingdom - what will happen to that relationship once she's gone? And/Or does this mean Kekaya is becoming less important on the world map?

I also feel Rama will be called to do much grander things than become raja - it feels like there's a build-up to something BIG happening. A few chapters start with Kaikeyi reflecting in the past tense about what has happened at the time of writing, and it sounds pretty ominous and like her relationship with Rama is going to implode.

15. Not sure how to ask this question, but I will try. I grew up on Greek mythology, and while I always admired the heroes and heroines and their deeds, the thought of living in a world with gods that spend their time screwing around with the lives of humans made me cringe. The scene with Kaikeyi and the sage in the temple, and the efforts of Ravana to promote science in his kingdom made me wonder about how any progress could be made if there were real consequences to disobeying the gods. Whether there are gods or a god in real life, our world seems to go on as if there are none. Or at least none that rain down punishments for not worshipping them. So. Would you want to live in a world of gods and magic? If so, would you be pious and try to be safe, or do what Kaikeyi is trying to do and change things for the better?

Interesting question - I had to think about this! I think I grew out of the idea of gods intervening to punish/encourage people - things are rarely black and white, and I'd guess gods should be the first to know that - though of course Greek gods are not exactly a great example to us 'lowly' humans: they can make grand gestures but also hold grudges, are unforgiving and vengeful, and can be terribly full of themselves... but then these stories were written by humans :). Spiritually, I'd say it's unlikely gods would have any sort of human-like form - surely, they would be forces beyond our grasp and influence, higher powers that don't need material form?

So, to get back to the second part of your question, in Kaikeyi's world, where the gods listen to most (please, let's not talk statistics ^^!), I would try to stay safe, but given the gods aren't listening to her, I can see why she's going on a tangent and taking risks. She just doesn't know what they think, but she has beliefs and she's obviously not alone in having them - that her own son should turn against her, powerful as he is, is really sad.

Bonus question- Have you all noticed how many really good food references there are? Too bad we are not reading this during Restaurant Wars.

Oh yes, yum, let's share! :)

Bonnie wrote: "Elinor wrote: "Okay, this is slightly irrelevant but just realised I forgot to click the order button. So Kaykeyi is NOT on its way... Having read some of your comments, I’m not sure this one is fo..."

Thanks Bonnie, I did get a physical copy since :).

DQs Day 2 ~ Chapters 8-15

6. Manthara seems to have a more personal relationship with Kaikeyi than just a trusted servant. She is often motherly and at times a bit manipulative. What are your thoughts of Manthara? Is she truly looking out for Kaikeyi or does she have a hidden agenda?


Oo, good question - hadn't thought of that! So far, I've not felt any bad vibes around Manthara though she does seem to know what to do better than Kaikeyi. Perhaps Kaikeyi's mum asked her to do this as she had to leave? Also, I think this is probably how it was - like in the noble families where the housemaids were closer to the ladies than their close relations.


7. Kaikeyi’s access to the Binding Plane is more personal - and potentially more manipulative - than many other forms of power in this book. What does Kaikeyi’s use of this power say about her?


I think - so far - that she's being careful. Of course, she's getting her own way through the Binding Plane but... she's a woman in a world of men. Seems kind of fair in a sense (perhaps I should ask myself what that says about me, lol!).


8. Dasharath and Kaikeyi have a talk about what happened on the battlefield when she saved his life. They went on to talk about many things and he even grants Kaikeyi a seat on his counsel as she requested, but with the understanding that she has to also adhere to some of the more conventional roles. Do you think this was fair? Do you think that Dasharath and Kaikeyi’s relationship will grow now that they understand each other more?


It felt fair to me, he comes across like a nice man - I think she could have ended up with a far worse husband! I think their relationship will grow as well as her relationships with the other wives.

@Jenny, also curious about the boons!


9. What did you think of the exchange between Ravana and Kaikeyi where they shared many details about magic and his gifting her his scrolls? How do you think this will affect future events?


Ah, now this is curious - yes, I think it will affect the future. He felt like an interesting character, though I'm a little wary of him. I'm curious about what the other scrolls contain, and how Kaikeyi's power will evolve once she deciphers them.


10. Agni implied that Kaikeyi was "gods-touched." What do you think that means? How do you think it will affect her or those around her?


Well, we don't have much of an explanation yet, apart from what Agni said and that Manthara seems familiar with the concept. I just hope Kaikeyi is destined to do something great and not terrible.

Jenny wrote: "Elinor! I hope you are enjoying it.

I am still disappointed about not being able to fly, even after reading H.P."

Yes, I was expecting something completely different - this is fun :)

Just between us: oh, what I'd give to play a game of Quidditch!

Running very late, and you're probably all reading the second BOM already (or maybe have even finished it!) - but here are my first set of answers.

DQ's Day 1

1. Are you familiar with the Ramayana and the story of Keikeyi? Does that knowledge color your views of Keikeyi going in? If you aren’t familiar with the story, do you know much about Hinduism and their gods?


No, I'm not familiar at all with this story or Hinduism and their gods.


2. Losing her mother to banishment lead to Keikeyi’s discovery of her magic. What do you think of the Binding Plane and her exploration of what it can do? Were you as surprised as Keikeyi when she discovered what happened when pushing too hard?


I LOVE the idea of the Binding Plane - its early introduction really got me hooked. It's obviously a powerful tool so I'm not surprised how badly it can turn out. I like that she's learning to be cautious and to ask for things before using the plane, it seems to me that so far, she's been using it benevolently, though would caution against manipulation as can see the potential for bad coming from it too.

@Jenny, lol the voting booth eh? I can see where you're going with this... :)


3. Keikeyi’s desire to learn to fight is admirable and she works hard learning the forms (or whatever they're called!). Have you ever studied a martial art? If so, which one? Which would you want to learn if you could?


Well, I did judo and taekwondo many years ago, but it was only the forms. I never got so far as to understand the philosophy unfortunately - I think that can really build you up as a person. I worked with a karate teacher (in a completely different setting) and he had lots of qualities, which I believe he developed through honing his skills as karateka.

@Jenny, I'd love to be able to fly, but not sure any Martial Art can teach us that... Harry Potter maybe? =D
@Angie, taekwondo teacher?! Wow!!


4. When Yudhajit tells Keikeyi that she’s his favorite brother, she takes offense at his sexism. He responds by saying:” “It’s a compliment. Who wants to be a woman?” How would you have responded if it were you?


I'd have been really annoyed - but, in a sense, he's only telling it as it is - they're living in a patriarchy and she's been brought up that way. Nevertheless, I can see her doing a lot because there's this feminist vibe to the story that's getting my hopes high.


5. Do you think that Keikeyi was clever by demanding that Dasherat prioritize their future son as heir before she agrees to marry him? What are your thoughts on her arranged marriage as the third wife?


It certainly felt clever, at least politically for her family. I'm not sure how the other wives will react, or even whether she'll bear children, b/c there's obviously something going on with the other two wives not having had any. I would have thought being the 3rd wife would have meant she could take a backseat, and enjoy more freedom - however, with this request, she's positioning herself as equally important as the others, so I'm assuming this will lead to tension in the household.

Vicki wrote: "@Elinor, you're going to love Wheels! It's so fun and I always meet old friends (so to speak) and make new ones. Anything music has to be fun, right?"

Oh yes! ♩♫♩♫♪♬

Kaykey - Vaishnavi Patel - September 2023

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I haven't worked out where the sign up SS is - there's usually one for Tower Teams and you can see whether your sign up has worked (or is it for UNO?). Right, I'm getting confused now - but I get the feeling you can usually check whether your sign up info has been sent through properly via a Google Sheet?

In any event, can't wait! The theme is MUSIC :)

Oo I signed up too - anyone else joining in?

x

Woot woot! Never played Weelathon and so looking forward to it :).

Loving the theme - I LOVE singing in my car (alone ^^), and would love to take lessons and join a choir. I did play the guitar during my teenage years. I was never really any good and, in retrospect, it was always more about impressing the girls than, ya know, playing music. I'm not ashamed :).

Anyone else watch the Proms this year?

@Shelby - wow, that's a lot of instruments!

Keli wrote: "I'm sorry to hear about your brother-in-law, Suzanne. I, too, wish him a speedy recovery.

I agree with y'all about the Bluest Eye. It is a fantastic emotional and powerful book. But Toni Morrison ..."

Keli, thanks for the rec. It's on my acquire next list :). I've heard it's good (impactful), and feel that Toni Morrison is probably one of those writers who doesn't do 'easy' (?). Haven't read enough of her works to have an opinion myself, but it strikes me that way from what you and Nanci have been saying.

Suzanne, that sounds a crazy august. So sorry to hear about your brother-in-law and hope he will make a full recovery.

Any chance of us all getting together again next year for the Tower Teams challenge?

x

Lol. It does sound like you have a lot on your plate right now. Do read a banned book any day - I've just ordered All boys aren't blue by George Johnson :). I've never been to the US - and think I would want to start with the National Parks on the West Coast - but also would love to visit Seattle where my grandmother was from.

The Bluest Eye is a really worthwile read, regardless of it being banned for that matter. It's quite jarring and such an interesting take - it's a rare thing when a book changes you a little - this is what this one did for me - and I wouldn't unread it, even if I could. I agree with Nanci's previous comment (quite some time back) about Toni Morrison's particular writing style - I felt fine with it, but can see how some might find it a little distracting.

Enjoy all those many challenges :).

@Jenny, thank you for the reassurance. I’ve gone and ordered it after all (and here’s hoping I didn’t forget to click order - I get so distracted at times!)

Ah now that’s really interesting. Circe on my TBR and looking forward to it. Right, well, you’ve given me food for thought (thank you :)) - perhaps I’ve been too quick to discount it based on how many characters there seem to be!

Okay, this is slightly irrelevant but just realised I forgot to click the order button. So Kaykeyi is NOT on its way... Having read some of your comments, I’m not sure this one is for me. So it may have been for the better.

Yes, I’m copping out and do hope you all enjoy it :-)!

Looking forward to participating in a future BOM (not the horror one ;-)).

Nanci, that’s really interesting. I wouldn’t know how to research that level of information. I just checked out PEN as was thinking about challenging myself to reading a number banned books every year (yes, in protest :)).

The Bluest Eye has been one of my favourites this year - a real eye-opener, and any book that makes you think must be worth reading (not sure I’ll ever understand banning books). So I totally get your family tradition of each generation reading it :).

Oo. I’d love to go to Alaska - we’ll done on visiting 50 states, no less! Great challenge. I’ve certainly not visited that many countries in Europe!

I miss the chatting also - we made such a great team this year! Hope everyone’s enjoying their challenges. I’ve just finished my Big Book Summer challenge for this year - and now the plan is to *chill*!

x