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Jason
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Oct 27, 2015 02:31AM
Ok. I'll get the Rupert Dreyfus facial tattoo.
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Rupert wrote: "You're getting my face tattooed on your face."Ha! That's scary...
Glad to hear you so energised Rupert. I'm abandoning promo for a while as it's completely done my head in and I want to get back to full on writing. I'll be interested to see how your real world promo tactics work out. Please keep us updated. Yes, time for some novel and creative ways ahead, I think. There has to be another way :)
Rupert wrote: "You're getting my face tattooed on your face."It's the only way I can think of selling your book, Pretty sure this is what Shakespeare did to get popular... Not sure how he knew what you looked like.
Cheers, Rebecca. I will keep you all updated on anything that works for sure. It's going to be a long-term venture so results maybe slow for awhile but I have some ideas.After a year I feel the same as you. I can't be arsed contacting people essentially begging for reviews anymore. It's zapped all my creative energy and I can't see me carrying on this road in 2016. It seems to me that unless you're content spending the rest of your days hounding people for the occasional review or giving all your spare money to Goodreads this approach doesn't really work.
Something is definitely rotten in the state of Denmark, though. I'm surrounded by talented indie authors who are struggling to locate readers while relatively shit books do well. I'm not opposed to relatively shit books doing well, but there comes a time when you have to ask yourself what exactly is going on.
For me personally I think one way forward is no longer relying solely on the internet. It clearly works for some things but not everything. Part of this is because Goodreads has cornered authors so they can now impose rules in order to extract money from them. Great if you've got money, shit if you don't.
So I'm having a rethink for 2016...
Probably, Catmunch, but it risks getting you in trouble with the Fun Police. I can contact readers now, but according to the note above my private messages, doing so risks having my account flagged for spamming people and possibly banned. So it's not worth the risk.What's happening here is the same with Amazon colonising the book market, and authors should really be kicking off about it. They've got us all by the bollocks right now...
EDIT: this is a reply to your first message :-)
I've been contacted by somebody via private message on here offering a new book to review, similar to what I've read before. Perfectly fine with me, I'd also be happy having the opt out button to be contacted... Maybe it needs use readers to put in the request enough of us doing it might make a difference.
Have any of you read All the Light We Cannot See ? fantastic idea for a book, but the writing is awful, the author is unable to set a scene properly, currently people are evacuating Paris during WW2, planes are flying overhead, buildings are on fire, a kid has been run over, you'd think I would be feeling something for the poor people, but nope, nothing, the way it is written makes me not care. This book won a Pulitzer, I guess the other nominations were utter crap.
I haven't read that book. Shame if it's not very good. It's a great title. I'll have to check it out anyway.
I do find it strange there is a restriction on giving away free stuff! Obviously, if an author was using direct messaging as a hard sell tactic then they should be pulled up on that, but a nudge to inform someone that you've got review copies available or have a free promotion active is harmless, I would've thought. I know I've certainly done my share of promo by proxy for GR by posting links to reviews/giveaways etc around all sorts of places. I've vowed never to shell out for any promotion, even though I'm strictly pursuing free routes for now so my point is perhaps moot, through the GR site, and I'm sure there are a growing number of authors who will take this line. And I won't pay for reviews full stop. One stat that burned into my memory banks is that for a self published author sending out review requests they can expect on average one positive response per 144 sent. So deflating when you hear things like this. By that assessment I'm doing great! But you're right - there is so little reward for so much time investment. I'm lucky that I don't expect much, this being my first release, but if I was two or three books in and seeing no traction I can imagine being really discouraged. I think Jason's idea of having readers request the opt out option has something. If this was reader generated then I think GR would be more inclined to take notice. This of course ignores the fact that authors are readers too...But how many readers would be arsed enough about this issue to take it on? Not enough, I fear. If enough authors and readers, like Lorie says, get together and commit to not giving GR money then maybe they could back track and the social networking elements of the site can come to the fore once more. May already be too late - goddammit! I think GR may be shooting itself in the foot taking this stance; it's the communities of readers and authors who are responsible for its success after all. Be a shame to see a mass exodus of smaller and indie authors as a result of all this.
I think outlawing cold calling on Goodreads is purely a money grabbing thing. If someone is relentless then, yeah, have a word with them, but a blanket approach isn't the answer. They've taken this approach because it'll ultimately make them more money.So what next? Authors having to pay a subscription fee? I wouldn't rule it out personally.
And you do right not paying for reviews, mate. I've never understood the logic to that. Same with buying Twitter followers or fake Amazon reviews. It achieves little. I can understand paying for advertising if you can afford it. I don't want to blame people for trying different things, though. I understand how annoying this game can be.
And cheers for taking this on, Rupert. It's good to stop and think about this, grab a moment to reassess. Been beneficial to consider the issues that you've focused on.
I will admit that I'm interested and that I'm too shy to ask. Sometimes I don't answer requests because:1. The book didn't interest me.
2. My plate is full.
3. I forgot in the midst of school work.
Please don't hate me.
Great post Rupert. Refreshing to read a blog post that just says it how it is for authors on Goodreads and the way it's going. (And offering splendid simple solutions too.)I might join you for a guerrilla poetry and short story performance on a bus sometime.
Like Becs I've become a bit bored of the promo thing at present, but new tactics are certainly needed. Good on ya geezer.
An addition to Rupert's suggestion: when doing a GR paperback Giveaway, why not just have a box to tick that allows non-winners to receive a digital copy if they/the author wish?Surely that would cut out a lot of crap. :)
I hope my comment didn't come off malicious. Sorry. But I'm reading the other comments and I'm surprised GR is doing this. Like it's none of GR's business what authors and readers are doing between messages. That's pretty odd. Maybe it's bc of the recent cyber bullying/stalking some authors have done?
Lixian wrote: "I will admit that I'm interested and that I'm too shy to ask. Sometimes I don't answer requests because:1. The book didn't interest me.
2. My plate is full.
3. I forgot in the midst of school w..."
I think all any of us authors is asking for is the opportunity to be ignored without it being held against us! I don't mind at all if I don't get a reply, just implies that the person isn't interested, but I'd hate to think that that person had taken offence, dobbed me in, and then I could be branded a no good spammer and banished! So feel free to carry on ignoring all you want to Lixian - that part is completely fine!
I think maybe they've put this message out to stop the more dodgy behaviour of some authors but to apply this to everyone is unfair. Simpler for them, I guess.
Harry wrote: "An addition to Rupert's suggestion: when doing a GR paperback Giveaway, why not just have a box to tick that allows non-winners to receive a digital copy if they/the author wish?Surely that would ..."
Is it right that it's still not possible to give away digital copies in a GR giveaway? I'm running one on LibraryThing at the moment. I'll report back on how it goes.
It is unfair, there are report and block buttons for a reason. It's not like Tumblr or Twitter where someone can change their name quickly and continue on harassment, hopefully, I've never had to do that.
Harry: that's a blinding idea!Rebecca: you got that spot on. I don't mind if people ignore me and I don't think bad of them when they do (that'd be unfair). This is more an issue with Goodreads working against authors and nothing to do with its users.
Lixian: what Rebecca said ;-)
Alison wrote: "Well I'm up for reading and reviewing anyone's work. So I'm going to put that on my profile :)"Great idea, put down in your profile that I'll review books too.
Lixian wrote: "@Rupert, is it okay, if I put my email here, since I can't send it?"Sure, mate. Are you wanting copies of anything?
@Rupert, is it okay if you can send the short story collection so I can review it? Just so I can help out and because short story collections are the only things read these days, other than novels under 400 pages. xiaomeimei112@gmail.com. Thanks.
Paul: people would definitely enter your give away. At least 100 people enter them regardless of what's being offered.Lixian: I've sent you an email. Let me know that you get it.
Old Timer: thanks for your input. A lot of food for thought there.
Catfood: it's a massive talking point. I'll have a read of the article and get back to you.
Rupert wrote: "Cheers, Rebecca. I will keep you all updated on anything that works for sure. It's going to be a long-term venture so results maybe slow for awhile but I have some ideas.After a year I feel the s..."
You bring up an interesting side-point: Why do (relatively) shit books do well?
Far be it from me to scorn a writer who's beaten the odds. Yet the old question remains: Just how do some books become popular? Because conventional stories are, by definition, risk-averse. Nevertheless, from time to time, decidedly unconventional fare somehow ends up in each and every household.
When I was young, Stephen King became a multi-millionaire writing books my thoroughly conventional mother refused to touch. Today, everyone's read Game of Thrones. I have to wonder, though: Before the series, how many would give Mr. Martin the time of day (including myself)?
I think the Bandwagon Effect is stronger than we want to give it credit for. Normal people will read abnormal books if everyone else claims they're cool. I've experienced this personally:
One reader for my book said she couldn't finish because she found the main character unforgivably cruel and cold. I'd have believed this if I saw from her GR profile that she was in the habit of consuming naught but square fare. Actually, she does ... except Game of Thrones. She loves GOT and has read every one of its thousands of pages and its abundance of virtuous, lovable book boyfriends.
Whom the Bandwagon gods do not bless, they drive to drink. Cheers.
We're certainly living in strange times, Kevin - even stranger now that everyone and their mum has an author profile on Goodreads.The bandwagon effect is something I've thought about quite a lot because it's occurred to me there are enough people out there who need to be told what to read so it's just a matter of finding ways to tell them.
I haven't yet read Fifty Shades of Grey but it seems like a case in point. From what I can gleam from sampling reviews it's not very good. Regardless, against all the odds, it's been a massive success. A lot of people have been outraged by the fact that it's done so well. If you go read reviews on here then you quickly get the feeling that a lot of people have taken great pleasure out of panning this book. Fair enough. They have every right to pan it. However, I may be wrong but from an indie author point of view, this could be a counter-productive approach. I say this because if Fifty Shades is god awful and has made it as an indie book, surely this gives the rest of us who have written something half decent some hope? All we need to know now is what made a book as bad as Fifty Shades blow up to be a household name? If we can find answers to that question then any of us can break through.
I could be wrong because I don't yet know all of the facts regarding Fifty Shades but I'm planning to read this book very soon as well as studying its wider context so I can try to work out what has happened. I'm going to be as fair to the book as I can because we may all learn something.
Rupert wrote: "We're certainly living in strange times, Kevin - even stranger now that everyone and their mum has an author profile on Goodreads.The bandwagon effect is something I've thought about quite a lot ..."
I usually hate novels featuring a novelist writing a novel, but after 2016 I think you'll have enough interesting experiences to write a novel about a novelist writing a novel about getting people to read his novels. I think you're just the one to write it too! :-D
I see the issue, these books are described as amazing by idiots. We need to get an idiot to read your book. I suggest you start spamming users on here asking if they are idiots. This should be allowed by the boss people cos you aren't mentioning your book.
Rupert wrote: "We're certainly living in strange times, Kevin - even stranger now that everyone and their mum has an author profile on Goodreads.The bandwagon effect is something I've thought about quite a lot ..."
Oh, good, I hope you share your findings, because I would love to know all that without doing the actual legwork--too much going on in my life.



