The Eye of the World
discussion
Start reading "The Wheel of Time" series, yes or no?
Next year... next year I will try to read it all.Yeah. I said that last year too.
I've owned The Eye of the World for several months now and I'm still not even halfway through the book. Don't get me wrong, it's a really good book so far, but the first few chapters are FILLED with exposition and it takes a while before the story actually gets interesting. However, I won't let that stop me from finishing the book. From what I've read in the comments so far, you all seem like smart people. I have one question. Do you guys consider the Wheel of Time to be a really long/stretched out coming-of-age story?
I started reading it and stopped as I thought it was too close to LOTR and for some reason could not "get in to it", I am hoping to come back to it though.
Wheel of Time is so much more than the LOTR ever tried to be. The plot, the conflict, the character development is so much greater. The battles are so much more vivid. The magic system is so much more vivid. Also while there is significant "Character Development" over the course of this series, (as for the characters they age several years over the course of 14 books). The Wheel of Time is not a long stretched out coming of age story. I do agree that reading the Eye of the World the first time was tough (but most avid fans of the Wheel of Time would agree that the series that you can read through more than once).
I would greatly disagree that the WoT series is more than LOTR would hope to be. Tolkien was a master in the field of linguistics, and he said the books were meant to be a foray into history and linguistics. To that end, LOTR carries a depth and intelligence that I found lacking in WoT. LOTR didn't lack character development completely, but it didn't require the development that WoT did-- AKA the characters in WoT were awful (IMO). The books were derived, formulaic, and lacking any real depth or originality. Not worth the read. I was staying out of this conversation, but seeing someone say that LOTR can't compare is completely overlooking the intricacies, choosing the ham-handed approach over the thought-provoking one.
Yeah, I went there.
Umar wrote: "I've owned The Eye of the World for several months now and I'm still not even halfway through the book. Don't get me wrong, it's a really good book so far, but the first few chapters are FILLED wit..."Aspects of it are definitely coming-of-age... but it's far more than that. WoT is sort of a political-fantasy-armageddon-approaches-and-we-must-be-ready story all rolled into an enormously long series.
The biggest problem with the WoT (IMHO) is that Jordan simply used too many words and tried to develop far too many characters. So many of the book (especially the middle ones) spend pages and pages on details and thoughts that are unimportant and do nothing to move the plot along. Some of the books (Winter's Heart, for example) just repeat the events of the previous book, simply from everyone else's perspective that didn't show up in the previous book.
The sheer number of characters who show up for tiny snippets and then don't show up again for several books (at which point, you've forgotten who they are and why they were important) is also very aggravating.
Don't get me wrong: I love this series. But I'll be the first to admit that it's not perfect.
And Jennifer, I totally agree with your thoughts on LOTR. It's not as wordy, but that's not a bad thing. Tolkien was precise and elegant with his writing. Jordan was overly descriptive and long-winded. Doesn't mean Jordan was a bad writer, but the styles are SO very different it's not even worth comparing the two authors.
I probably would not have read it if I hadn't bought the first 11 in one hit. It took me a good 200 pages (a small novel) to get past the Tolkien wannabe derivation. However I'm glad I persevered
One of the things that kept me reading was the fact that the plot was so interwoven--a character seen briefly in one book becomes important later in the series, and every action has meaning. Some people find this impossible, but I liked it. One of the reasons I stopped reading at about book 8 was because this stopped and the books became more of a drawn-out synopsis. This was when Robert Jordan was struggling with cancer and I understand someone else took over the writing for a while.
Lauren wrote: "One of the things that kept me reading was the fact that the plot was so interwoven--a character seen briefly in one book becomes important later in the series, and every action has meaning. Some ..."I understand that Jordan wrote up to 11. Brandon Sanderson took over writing the last volume (which turned into 3).
Ethic wrote: "I have never read "The Wheel of Time" series but found about half of the books at Goodwill the other day. Worth reading? Looks to be a big time investment."I would say yes but take your time. I tried grinding through the books as fast as I could and got burned out on book 4, these bad boys are long reads. Just read a different book or two between each one and you should be fine.
Also, don't do like I did and try and finish the books quickly, just enjoy them and have fun.
I am currently about to start book 6. They are long books but fantastic as well but I ration myself. I aim to read one of the wheel of time books a month and then flit through other books inbetween.Yes they are worth reading most definately and for me 3,4,5, are better than 1 and 2
Awful books. Truly. Try some Joe Abercrombie. X
I have struggled through the first 4 books and I don't think I can take it any more. I'm really tired of reading every little detail described no matter how insignificant it is. @Robin - Reading "Red Country" right now. Love Abercrombie.
I tend to be a minimalist as a writer, but I don't mind the detail when I'm reading.
I am struggling to finish the fifth book, and this is my second attempt at the series (the first attempt I stopped less than a quarter of the way through the fourth book). The constant condescension towards the opposite gender, on both sides, is really getting on my nerves. I have about 15% left. Is it worth slogging through the rest? Does 6 pick up enough that I'll not be struggling so hard that it's almost unenjoyable? Or should I go back and reread George R.R. Martin? (We've been watching Game of Thrones and it's seriously making me want to read them over again just so I can point out to my non-reader significant other where the differences lie.) Thoughts?
Kait, I personally enjoy the series and would recommend it in general...but it's not for everyone, and it seems that it may not be for you. Book 6 is better than Book 5, but 8 and 9 (and, from what I've heard, Book 10) are significantly worse.I'm re-reading #7 at the moment, and while I'd say it's pretty good overall, the gender stuff is, if anything, even more problematic than in the previous books.
Finish #5 since you're almost there, then see how you feel about going on.
Kait wrote: "I am struggling to finish the fifth book, and this is my second attempt at the series (the first attempt I stopped less than a quarter of the way through the fourth book). The constant condescensio..."My opinion....they get exponentially worse in book 6 and book 7 (which is where I tossed the series in the garbage)
Scott wrote: "Kait, I personally enjoy the series and would recommend it in general...but it's not for everyone, and it seems that it may not be for you. Book 6 is better than Book 5, but 8 and 9 (and, from what..."MORE problematic? I didn't think that was possible!
Ah well. I'll stick it out till the end of 5, I haven't bought 6 yet so I'll wait till I finish 5 before making the decision. Thanks :)
Kait wrote: "Or should I go back and reread George R.R. Martin?"The First Law Trilogy would be my recommendation. It has the distinct advantage of actually being finished.
I have heard that book 11 of Wheel of Time picks the whole series back up, and Brandon Sanderson finishes it off in style, so it actually may be worth slogging through the next 5 books...
...then again, there's Wikipedia.
I think I need to revise my thinking on this. How about instead of asking 'should I start the series,' why not try reading the first few chapters of Book 1?I bet you'll have to finish the whole book, that's how good that first one is.
The Eye of the World
I have just started book 6 and so far am really enjoying the series but then again I like really thick books with lots of story to them. The switching off to other characters doesn't bother me as I know that at some point they will play an important part in the story. The repetitiveness of some parts (like the braid pulling) doesn't bother me either - people have habits they can't control whether in a book or real life. If you are a reader who gets into her characters and enjoys a good long read then you would enjoy this book - if what you really enjoy is a 200 page quick read without any depth or character development then you need to leave this series off your reading list.
I wouldn't recommend them. The characters are two dimensional and boring, the story trite and never goes anywhere, and overall pointless and childish.I couldn't even finish the first book. I can't imagine how he could write more books after that. I am willing to invest time in a good series but this one? Is a waste of time IMHO.
Belinda wrote: "I have read books one and two and really struggled to finish the second one, I think it is daunting knowing there are still so many for me to read. But also the story line does seem to drag on a li..."Agreed. If you want a long series that is actually entertaining and not a drag read GOT
Apart from Khaleesi, you will end up shuddering every time a chapter titled Daenarys turns up. Those drag. Especially when Strong Belwas isn't around.
Read Joe Abercrombie. Watch GOT and Vikings.
Daenerys' chapters started out being not as interesting for me but now she has grown from a young girl who did what she was told by her controlling husband and brother, to a powerful woman who makes her own destiny. Daenerys is no weakling. She will take what is hers with fire and blood. Give her a chance.
Always highly value the opinions of people that haven't even finished the first book of a 14 book series, then try to tell us why the whole thing is rubbish and a waste of time. Quality post Hannah.Books aren't like lollipops, where you can tell after one lick if you like the flavour or not. If the chapter or two that you read wasn't your flavour, that's fine. Just don't review or comment on something that you haven't finished, it makes your opinion uninformed and completely irrelevant.
Tried to start the series. Read the first two books and gave up. It's not that the books or the story was bad, but they were slow and the characters made (what it seemed to me) stupid choices (e.g., not trusting each other even when they were friends all their lives).
yes so good reeeead it
No. I read the first book and it was enough. There is no interesting plot or characters or logic or anything.The supposedly "funny" type, Matric, is obnoxious. He never says ANYTHING funny. Jordan was not a good writer. That is all.
Fabián wrote: "No. I read the first book and it was enough. There is no interesting plot or characters or logic or anything.The supposedly "funny" type, Matric, is obnoxious. He never says ANYTHING funny. Jordan..."
I don't recall a character by that name. Maybe I didn't pay enough attention.
Bill wrote: "I've only read up to book 10 (Crossroads of Twilight), and I do plan on re-reading the series so I can remember what happens up to then so I can finish it, but I'll warn you now: the ..."Bill's message (message 9) sums it up very nicely: the first 3 are tremendous, and then it all slows down. I read all the books, and I must say that Brandon Sanderson took over the series in a superb way. He managed to energyze the story once more!
Peter wrote: "Fabián wrote: "No. I read the first book and it was enough. There is no interesting plot or characters or logic or anything.The supposedly "funny" type, Matric, is obnoxious. He never says ANYTHIN..."
Matrim.
Yvette wrote: "Bill's message (message 9) sums it up very nicely..."Glad to be of service. Also, it's good to hear someone else's opinion of the Sanderson volumes of the series. When I finally do clear my reading list, I'll have to start the long slog back to book 11.
Yes! Though you will need some persistence to get through, especially when you hit the books after 6 or 7. You'll finish 800 pages and think to yourself - 'did anything actually happen?'I know that's not a ringing endorsement, but the final books are also very good, and overall it's worth the effort.
Fabián wrote: "Peter wrote: "Fabián wrote: "No. I read the first book and it was enough. There is no interesting plot or characters or logic or anything.The supposedly "funny" type, Matric, is obnoxious. He neve..."
Like I said....
I absolutely love the Wheel of Time series, and I picked it up as a kid, eagerly devouring a new book in a few days, waiting years for the next, and doing the same. This cycle repeated for over two decades, and it was all worth it.However, there are some criticisms that tend to be pretty common for people who do not like the series, so I'll toss those out for folks who are questioning if it's worth their time.
Robert Jordan's world is huge. The story spans over 3,000 years (though the majority takes places in about 5). Because the world is so rich and changes so much, Jordan is very descriptive about what's happening in it. There are literally paragraph-long descriptions of certain forests that have absolutely no value to the plot except describing what the characters are seeing.
Each character is described in a lot of detail, and this has bothered some people, who prefer to have more vague characters that they can imagine themselves. We can describe what any character is wearing in pretty much any scene and the women like to smooth their dresses a lot. This actually became some what of a running gag to Robert Jordan later in the series.
And yet despite this level of detail, there are some major plot points that get so little explanation that they become mysteries to readers for *years* until they're casually answered in the glossary of one later book, and nodded to much later.
On this specific one, Robert Jordan claimed he thought it was "intuitively obvious to the casual reader", but later admitted that he "liked watching people squirm" and hadn't addressed it directly before he died.
Due to the realities of printing and publishing in the real world, at least 4 of the books in the series started off as a single book and were later split. Because the decision to split was made by the publisher rather than the author, there are some serious pacing issues in some parts or the series. This is most notable in Winter's Heart/Crossroads of Twilight. Major world events happen in Winter's Heart, and it's one of the best books in the series (IMO), and it followed up with Crossroads of Twilight explaining what all other characters were doing during that monumental moment. Needless to say, CoT is largely regarded as the worst book in the series, and Robert Jordan certainly thought it was.
Finally, Robert Jordan died before he could finish the series on his own. The final three books (also intended to be one) were written by Brandon Sanderson using Jordan's notes, material from Jordan's wife and editor (Harriet), and the extensive understanding of the series possessed by Jordan's assistants. Sanderson was a long-time fan of the series and intended to finish the Wheel of Time, but intentionally made no attempts to mimic Jordan's writing style. Because of this, there is an obvious change in "tone" in the conclusion of the series. Many fans feel the series was concluded well (and in my opinion, some of the final books rank among the best in the series) but there will always be critics to change, no matter what, and many fans were disappointed by it.
Book nine in the series gave me the strength to quit reading books mid stream. To that point, a book started was a book finished. Sure, book one showed promise. Book three was probably the height of the series, but certainly not worth the pain of what came after. A Winter's Heart - was simply the final straw.
Walk away now and avoid the heart break!
Definitely start reading, best book ever :)
It is interesting at first, but once you get to the 6th and 7th books, it just feels like the author is dragging it out.
Teressa wrote: "Pamela Su wrote: "Fair enough. Perhaps shrew wasn't the most apt term for all the female characters. :)Don't get me wrong. What I like is that most of the women are very strong personalities who ..."
I generally like the female characters but I agree, I am just so tired of Nynaeve's attitude. But I suppose that makes it closer to real life, in that some people will always be irritating/rub some people the wrong way.
I've started and failed to finish this series I think three times now. I always stall out on #9. Funnily enough, the volumes most people seem to complain about - 5/6/7 - are my favorites. I have every intention of picking it up again one of these days - from the very beginning - and finding out how it all ends.But wondering whether to start it? It's a pretty risk-free dilemma; if you have a library at all nearby, I'm sure you'd be able to find a book this popular. If you hate it, there's no need to continue.
Rainchilde wrote: I generally like the female characters but I agree, I am just so tired of Nynaeve's attitude."Oh, funny; Nynaeve probably grew to be my favorite out of all of the women. I won't say I disliked all the (good) female characters, but I did certainly start to grow tired of their singular universal bad attitude. Nynaeve's crabbiness, though, was the easiest to see through. She was prickly because she was so afraid of being weak. Once it became clear that it was just a veneer to cover up her fear, I grew a lot more empathy for her.
(Which is something I never did for Elayne. Hated Elayne.)
Don't. I've read the first half of the first book, and then I stopped. It wasn' interesting at all. And I felt like I was wasting my time.
If you live in the UK now is an excellent time to start collecting because they just released a new paperback print run. It's quite nice but I had 1-5 in the old run so I'm currently scrabbling to complete my collection before the old editions disappear.
I only just finished book two and realized that i would be in for the long haul. I will head everyone's warnings about the slowing of the plot.
Vaughn wrote: "Ryan wrote: "I only just finished book book two and realized that i would be in for the long haul. I will head everyone's warnings about the slowing of the plot."feel free to join us in a group r..."
Thanks,I would like that.
I am on the third book of this epic series, and to be honest I find it very slow, the part about the braids was correct, the prologue was good at the start but after that it is boring, the first book drags on way too long, I had to try and read it over the course of five years as i could not force myself to continue, It is way to slow and not worth going through excluding the end, some of the chapters are not needed and have nothing to offer the characters, I am not a fan of the characters either they are very happy to stay in there own world and not venture out I find this rather stale, Rand seems to be very selfish, mat seems to not care about anyone but himself, Perrin needs counselling, I will eventually finish this series, but after reading the sword of truth series excluding the new books, I much preferred that then this, I think the pace of wizards first rule was way better then this and I read it over one weekend and thoroughly enjoyed it, I can recommend many better series then this for fantasy fans as this is now to me outdated maybe during it's time it was a masterpiece but now we have read so much that this to me is very bland.
Remember all 3 are teenagers - of course they are self-centred, unsure of themselves, immature, etc.
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Even if you don't read the whole thing, picking up a few of the first books will at least introduce you to a unique and exciting world, and allow you to have a better understanding of what many fantasy readers already know and discuss frequently.
This is a great series that got bogged down but managed to pull itself together at the end for a good finish.