Mockingjay
discussion
The sad truth of Gale killing Primrose. Intentionally or a horrible mistake.

I never realized that before.

But here Gale got a taste of what he had been doing with his weapons. There is always someone behind the battle, the people who die are somebody's sister, brother, husband, father.... Prim's death was "collateral damage", only it turned out to be someone he really loved. I don't think Gale could ever forgive himself, he was so sad the last time he saw Katniss.

Gale developed his bomb to kill not only soldiers, but the people who go to their aid. The 'Prims'.
Think of the implications of that. That wounded people would be left to suffer because medics (or even compassionate bystanders)would be too afraid of a second explosion. It wouldn't even need to be a double exploding bomb, simply knowing they exist would keep people from going to help the wounded.

I can't think of a more despicable weapon than that! Using human emotions as bait?Katniss saw this and left, it was just too wrong!
I think Gale lost his way in his anger and his need for revenge against the capitol. He started out as a great guy, and then, you could see him going deeper and deeper into his own anger and hate.
Even without Prim dying, Katniss would never go black to Gale, She had seen this dark side of him and it was just too much for her.


He created the weaponry he did, and in order to achieve the final goal, he was willing to sacrifice lives.
He did not mean to kill Prim specifically.
It was a occupational hazard. That's cold, but he would never intentionally kill her. He knew Prim, and I'm sure he cared about her, She aided him when he was injured.
He has siblings of his own, and I know he would never intentionally hurt her, and definitely not Katnis. They were the "good" guys.
I'm a 100% sure it was a accident that she died in the crossfire.
I don't know if he intended to kill all the Capitol Kids though.....




I think we forget that he went through hell too knowing his best friend and the woman that he loved was in the arena and paraded around as another man's "fiancee" as entertainment...I think you are all right that it was a way to get Gale out of the way easily- I just hate that after ALL that they went through together that they never made amends after the revolution. Gale was a good man. A strong man who had been beaten down by the Capitol and took a stand when other other were too weak to stand for their families and their beliefs and the people he loved (Katniss, Prim). I personally in my dream world/imaginary head- hope he finds peace.
ok- if this doesn't make sense just ignore... I am at work and I have to go see a patient and I am fangirling too much when I should be being a professional!


Fact is Gale helped Betee design a couple of bombs ( a few out of so many others made by so many other people lije someone rightly pointed out- hannah I think) crazy evil coin used these bombs on a place where she her own would be there. Gale was completely unaware of her intentions. His guilt lies within the fact that the strategy was his and the bomb may have been his. BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN HE KILLED HER.


Agreed. The only life there was for Gale was District 12 and working in the mines, possibly being killed like Katniss' father. No wonder he grabbed the chance to fight with the rebels. At the end he got a fancy job in District 2, something which would never have been possible for him before. I find the notion that Gale killed Prim on purpose because he was jealous of Peeta totally asinine.
The love triangle was completely pointless and unnecessary, IMO. I think I'm done with YA, thank you very much.


"Taking the fundamental ideas behind Gale's traps and adapting them into weapons against humans... Endangering offspring in order to draw in the actual desired target, the parent... At some point, Gale and Beetee left the wilderness behind and focused on more human impulses. Like compassion. A bomb explodes. Time is allowed for people to rush to the aid of the wounded. Then a second, more powerful bomb kills them as well." (MJ, Ch.13)
There isn't much doubt that the Capitol bombing was designed by Gale and Beetee, and that it was intended to be used on non-combatants. To make the case that Gale never intended it to be used on innocent children or those compelled to provide aid, doesn't mesh with the text.
Sure he probably thought it would only be used against the 'enemy', the people in the Capitol, and not Prim or others on 'his side' of the conflict, but it doesn't change the designated use. Coin saw an 'effective' tool to use for her strategic purposes, but Gale knew what he was designing.
The fact that Gale would use such techniques - trapping and hurting the young animal in order to lure in the parent, knowing their instinctive need to protect their young - is abhorrent enough. To then design a weapon using the same natural impulse for compassion and empathy, to be used against humans, is even more disgusting.
I think the point that the author was trying to make with this twist in the story, was that crossing the line from basic human decency into willingly engaging in such vicious acts, even against the enemy, has a way of hurting everyone. Prim's blood was on Gale's (and Beetee's) hands, because he crossed that line by developing the weapon to be used this way.
There isn't much doubt that the Capitol bombing was designed by Gale and Beetee, and that it was intended to be used on non-combatants. To make the case that Gale never intended it to be used on innocent children or those compelled to provide aid, doesn't mesh with the text.
Sure he probably thought it would only be used against the 'enemy', the people in the Capitol, and not Prim or others on 'his side' of the conflict, but it doesn't change the designated use. Coin saw an 'effective' tool to use for her strategic purposes, but Gale knew what he was designing.
The fact that Gale would use such techniques - trapping and hurting the young animal in order to lure in the parent, knowing their instinctive need to protect their young - is abhorrent enough. To then design a weapon using the same natural impulse for compassion and empathy, to be used against humans, is even more disgusting.
I think the point that the author was trying to make with this twist in the story, was that crossing the line from basic human decency into willingly engaging in such vicious acts, even against the enemy, has a way of hurting everyone. Prim's blood was on Gale's (and Beetee's) hands, because he crossed that line by developing the weapon to be used this way.

I didn't read the whole comment, I couldn't be bothered. But I did pick up that you think it was not only Gale's fault Prim died but also Beetee's, and you are probably quiet right in saying so. But we can not forget that it was more than likely that Coin ordered the bomb to be made, and made sure that Prim was among the people in there.

Spoiler alert much?!?!
"
Well you shouldn't be commenting here if you haven't read it.

So annoying when people say this. Spoilers shouldn't be in the header, there's a major spoiler in the name of this thread, they are hard to avoid seeing, because even adding the book 'to read' will bring up discussions about the book.
It's why I had to just stick to the main page of discussion and can’t go into view more discussions because they will show all the books I’ve added and not just the ones I’ve read, even though not all the books I’ve read shows up in the main part.


Margarita wrote: "He killed Primrose. That is all there is to it. He might have had gotten orders to do it, but if he truly loved Katniss the way he said he did, he wouldn't have done it. In the end of the book, to ..."
I don't think he meant for the bombs to kill prim. To be honest that's what happens in war, and if you wan to save next generation you might have to kill 90% of your own so to me war killed prim not gale.

Gale and Primrose were best friends! He protected her. She healed his back after he had been whipped. They were like family.
How can anyone really believe that Gale would actually be so heartless as to make those bombs with the intention of killing dear little Prim?
Those bombs were meant for Peacekeepers who were loyal to the Capitol. Gale wouldn't want to hurt innocent, starving, frozen, and defenseless children, let alone Prim!



but he created the idea with betee
and was going to use it
he didnt know prim would be there
and because it was his idea is the reason catness couldnt be with him
she would have always seen prims death in his face
and its why he left too cause they even couldnt be friends anymore .
and katniss chose peeta right , he suits her better than gale .

But the purpose of a plane is transporting people and merchandises through air. The purpose of bomb is killing people. The purpose of a double bomb is killing twice as people.
No, he didn't kill Prim. He would have died to protect her. But he was the one that put in motion this terrible idea, this weapon whose purpose was not other that killing as many as possible. He had to know the bomb would be used on civilians, perhaps children, and he didn't care.
However he though these civilians would be Capitol's citizens, and for him, all Capitol's citizens were guilty of mass murder, child's murder, and the destruction of District 12. For him, there were no innocents in the Capitol, because they were all accomplices of Snow's crimes, either for action or for inaction. And he was right, to a point.
He would have never use the bombs on the rebels, much less on Katniss' sister.
Thus, the plane example is not a valid comparison. I'll give you one that I think it's valid. The group of scientist that worked for the creation of the atomic war during WWII. They weren't the ones who dropped the bomb over Hiroshima and Nagasaki. They didn't decide to use it on a civilian target.
They worked restlessly in the creation of a weapon that could put an end to a terrible conflict, a weapon that would spare the life of millions of their countrymen, young men that would've died in battle otherwise. How this weapon was used, at the end, it was up to the military and the president. But these scientist, the men who came up with the idea, they were the ones who made it possible for it to be used.
Now. Thousand of people were killed because of the bombs, it's true. But they also achieved the purpose: the japanese surrendered, no more american lives were lost in the battlefield, and WW2 finally ended.
Imagine if those scientist hadn't come up with the idea. How long would the conflict have lasted? How many more american and european soldiers would have been killed by the japanese? And what if the Russians had being the ones that obtained the bomb first, what would have happened then? The consecueces might've being catastrophic.
This group of scientist created something terrible, yes, but they did it because the situation they were living in was terrible; and they wanted to help their country to win the war and defeat fascism. They did it because they believed in the principles of democracy and freedom, and they were willing to use extreme measures to ensure that those values were protected, that the world would have a future.
Are those scientist to be blamed for all the deaths their bomb caused? For the threat that followed in the Cold War? Are they heroes? Are they criminals?
I think they were neither. I think they were soldiers fighting a war, a war they didn't start, a war to protect their country, their families, their friends, their values and principles. They were good people who were put in a desperate situation and came up with a equally desperate solution. That's what war is, it brings out the worst of humanity.
And in a minor scale, this is what Gale was too. He didn't drop the bombs. He didn't decide to use them against civilians. He would have never agreed to use them against his own camarades. He would have died before using them on Prim.
But.
But it was his idea that made it possible. That's the truth. It's not an easy truth, and he'll need to learn to live with it. It doesn't make him a monster, not at all, the only monsters here are President Snow and President Coin. But he made it possible. His idea made it possible. And everytime Katniss looks at him, she knows this.
And I think, and this is only my personal opinion, that if the bombs had being used on Capitol's targets instead of Rebel's ones, Gale would have not felt guilt at all.
And again, I don't blame him because it was a war. His way of thinking is quite justified. The Capitol's citizens stood motionless for seventy five years as children were led to their deaths, and forced to kill each other. They made a public spectacle out of it. They enjoyed it.
This is all Gale knows and understands about the Capitol. He has never lived there, he has only one perspective of them, the one he acquired of them from the Districts.
Katniss had being in the Capitol. Katniss knows there are also good people there, innocent people, scared people, people who are ignorant. People who willingly chose not to see, and people who saw, and lost everything fighting against it. People who saw and were too scared to revolve against it. People who saw and didn't understand, because no one ever bothered to teach them to understand.
And in her heart Katniss hates them, because it was because of them that she lost her innocence, her freedom, her hopes, her future and at then end, her sister. But she knows that hating them is not the answer. It won't bring her any peace, it won't bring the deads back, it would only serve to perpetuate the system that took everything for her. So, at the end, she chose to let go of that hate; and she chose to let go of Gale.
Sandra wrote: "Coin killed Prim. She may have used a weapon Gale developed, but her ultimate aim was to destroy Katniss in whatever way she could. She knew what she was doing, and Katniss knew what she was doing ..."
Thank you!!! Gale would never had killed Prim, she's like a sister to him!!!
Thank you!!! Gale would never had killed Prim, she's like a sister to him!!!

If this was a legitimate act of war and you accept that Snow was not behind the attack then why did the airship have Capitol markings? Why did Snow's own troops surrender after the attack?
When Gale proposed the tactic Katniss says, "That seems to be crossing some kind of line. So anything goes? I guess there isn't a rule book for what might be unacceptable to do to another human being."
Snow denied he launched the attack. Gale didn't know so we can deduce Coin wasn't accepting responsibility for it. When Coin sent Peeta to join Katniss she was setting Katniss up as a martyr. Why not Prim? Another potential threat.
Boggs told Katniss that if her immediate answer wasn't to support Coin when the war was over Katniss was a threat. Did Katniss really support a game with Capitol tributes or was it just to make Coin think she was still on her side?
Now the possibility exists that Snow knows he's lost. He knows Katniss is close. With his monitors it's possible he knows Prim is there and she's a medic. In Finnick's monologue he mentions Snow's weapon of choice is poison. It is possible that Snow's final act was to drop the bombs that killed Prim to poison Katniss against Coin. Or it could even have been Plutarch the master of manipulation.

As in the Red Wedding inn ASOIF, a few deaths to prevent many many more


Sure the Hunger Games are pure fiction but, the philosophy has gone beyond what was written on the pages. Gales tactic was designed to kil medics. It succeeded.
If we go back to the first book when Katniss and Peeta are on the roof and Peeta's one wish is that the games don't change who he is. This something Katniss wrestles with throughout the whole story. I'm sure it was raised some where I the book... Did the war change Gale or reveal him?
After seeing the movie I wasn't 100% convinced it was Coin tat dropped the bombs. But you factor in she thought Katniss was dead, because of Snow's broadcast and Coin's rallying broadcast following the announcement. Prim is going to realize Peeta was sent in by Coin before he was fully recovered. Prim is going to be a threat to Coin's plans at some point in the future. And the whole scenario is cold blooded murder.
Snow said in his exchange that he was focused on Katniss and Katniss on him that neither was seeing what Coin was doing.
As for Gale, Katniss made 1 request of him before leaving for the first Hunger Game and that was he protect her family. He didn't. He was probably the one who gave Coin the idea on how to kill Prim and make it look like Snow was responsible.



Thank you! I totally agree with you.

This is all Gale knows and understands about the Capitol. He has never lived there, he has only one perspective of them, the one he acquired of them from the Districts.
Katniss had being in the Capitol. Katniss knows there are also good people there, innocent people, scared people, people who are ignorant. People who willingly chose not to see, and people who saw, and lost everything fighting against it. People who saw and were too scared to revolve against it. People who saw and didn't understand, because no one ever bothered to teach them to understand.
And in her heart Katniss hates them, because it was because of them that she lost her innocence, her freedom, her hopes, her future and at then end, her sister. But she knows that hating them is not the answer. It won't bring her any peace, it won't bring the deads back, it would only serve to perpetuate the system that took everything for her. So, at the end, she chose to let go of that hate; and she chose to let go of Gale. "
This basically sums up I saw Gale's character throughout the war. He's there to show the parallel of there being no right and no wrong side of the war, they're both brutal and both essentially have the same mind set. He did nothing but fight for what he believed in at any cost. As did Katniss until she saw the consequences of it.





Yes this comment makes no sense just like most haters here on this thread.
To all those haters on this thread who are saying Gale killed Prim:
Even if you don't like Gale, there's no reason to be hypocritical and lie about what he did. He had no idea what the bomb he might have designed would be used, get this fact into your head although I doubt you could do it. Sure, you might not like his idea of winning at all costs (considering the alternative you not) but you shouldn't go and make lies about him like a delusional militant.

Because that's who it was designed to kill. Not soldiers or hard targets, but EMTs, medics, firefighters, police... civilians lending a hand. Sure, you might get a few extra soldiers in the second blast, but you're primarily killing noncombatants.
Gale designed the weapon knowing this. His only regret is that his weapon killed the wrong aid worker and lost him any shot at getting Katniss... which is getting off pretty easy, imo. He deserves to be brought up on charges of committing war crimes.


He designed it. But Katniss disapproved of the idea of it from seeing the designs. Felt it crossed a line into unacceptable.


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It's like if someone discovered a vaccine for AIDS. They would get the credit for saving lives even though medical workers would be the ones to administer it.
The reverse side of the coin (pardon the pun) is that weapons designed for war gives an advantage to the user to help preserve their own life. It could be said to either kill (when it's the enemy) or help protect (allies).
But that's war, killing is part of it, it's kill or be killed. But medics aren't there to kill people. They don't pose a threat. And that's where Gale's bomb crossed the line.
An inventor of a bomb has no control on who it will be used. But Gale invented a bomb that detonates a second time to kill the people who go to the aid of the wounded from the first explosion. In that, he well knew who the target was. If not Prim, then people like her.