Mockingjay
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The sad truth of Gale killing Primrose. Intentionally or a horrible mistake.
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Margarita
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Jul 19, 2012 10:45AM
He killed Primrose. That is all there is to it. He might have had gotten orders to do it, but if he truly loved Katniss the way he said he did, he wouldn't have done it. In the end of the book, to not face Katniss wrath, he fled like the coward he was even in the begining.
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I somewhat agree. Did he actually use the bomb or just create it? I can't quite remember. I thought he just created the bomb and didn't know what it would be used for. I don't think if he knew it was going to kill her he would have created the bomb in the first place...
I think that he was the one with the idea. The double bomb thing. But he thought it would be used on the Capitol. It was used on the rebels. I'm sure he didn't drop the bombs, so you can't say if he loved Katniss he wouldn't have done it. He didn't give the order and he didn't carry it out, so really it wasn't him directly killing her. It was an idea that he came up with for a different circumstance adapted to a much worse event.
Yeah. That's what I thought.
Lila wrote: "I somewhat agree. Did he actually use the bomb or just create it? I can't quite remember. I thought he just created the bomb and didn't know what it would be used for. I don't think if he knew it w..."
I agree with everything said here except that he wouldn't have created the bomb. He still might have, and that's why he's not a coward. It freaking sucks Prim died, but he would do what had to be done.
He didn't know it would kill Prim, and he did create the bomb but not order for it to be used though, that's it, bottom line.
I agree with everything said here except that he wouldn't have created the bomb. He still might have, and that's why he's not a coward. It freaking sucks Prim died, but he would do what had to be done.
He didn't know it would kill Prim, and he did create the bomb but not order for it to be used though, that's it, bottom line.
I just finished re-reading this book last week. Gale helped create the way the bombs were used. Through the book he is talking with Beetee about thinking like your prey. The tactic used at the end was to set off a group of bombs, wait for people to come running in to help, and then set off more bombs, thus killing even more people. Gale was responsible for that tactic used by 13's military, and maybe in creating the bombs. But he did not know how they were going to use it or that it would have anything to do with Prim. At the time it went off he had been detained by Captiol guards while trying to reach Snow's mansion with Katniss so he really had nothing to do with actually setting them off. Later when Katniss confronts him about it, he says he doesn't know if it was his bomb, but admits that it was his strategy used and he knew that he and Katniss could never have a future because there would always be the seed in her mind that he was linked to Prim's death. I do think he was responsible, but I don't think he was actually involved or ever meant to hurt Katniss/Prim.
Yeah. I guess he might have. But to be honest I don't really care that he's not talking to Katniss anymore. I never really liked him and Was kind of glad that he was out of the picture.
I think he was being a "big boy" by talking to Katniss to the extent that he did, at the end, anyways.
I was never a big fan of Gale, but I thought that this whole 'was he responsible for Prim's death?' was the author's way of getting him out of the picture for Katniss.
Margarita wrote: "He killed Primrose. That is all there is to it. He might have had gotten orders to do it, but if he truly loved Katniss the way he said he did, he wouldn't have done it. In the end of the book, to ..."Gale helped to create the bomb, he didn't actually drop it on them & he didn't know that Coin was going to use it on their own people. Holding him responsible for Prim's death in the midst of a war is ridiculous in my opinion. It cheapened the friendship he & Katniss had for her to turn on him for something like that. Everyone was killing people or coming up with ways to kill people. It's not his fault at all that Prim became a casualty of the war.
He proposed a tactic that we condemn as terrorism. He didn't intentionally get Prim killed, but he has his share of responsibility. If he dreamed up the idea of using parachutes because children would think of them as things to help them, that's like leaving out poisoned candy.
He didnt kill Primrose....i cannot believe there is even a discussion did you forget all the times he has saved her???
Except the time that he killed her.
Robert wrote: "Except the time that he killed her."Using parachutes wasn't Gale's contribution, it was the idea of a secondary explosion for further impact. And again, I remind people that they were in the midst of a WAR... People die in wars, how anyone could possibly twist the narrative into "Gale killed Prim" is beyond me. He didn't physically make that particular bomb, he wasn't in on Coin's plan to kill their own people to frame Snow, and he wasn't with the people who dropped the bomb. HE DID NOT KILL PRIMROSE. To hold him at fault is to lessen the culpability of those who actually bombed the children. It's like blaming the inventor of the gun for any particular soldier shot in a war zone.
Sorry, I guess I got a little passionate there, lol!
Gale didn't kill Prim. It never said he was in the airplane when the bombs dropped. Yes it was his bomb, but you have to remember Beetee created it too. No one seems to remember that it wasn't just Gale. It was also Beetee.We don't blame the creator of airplanes when they crash a people die. We can blame the pilot, but Gale was the inventer. Not the pilot.
He created the bomb to get back at the capitol, not to kill Prim. He did NOT try to do that and he didn't know what the bomb was going to be used for.
Plus it was never comfirmed that it was his and Beetee's bomb.
While it was his strategy, like Trina said, those are the risks of war. Sometimes one side's ideas will hurt more people than just their target. It is never ok, but it is a risk that Gale was willing to take for their freedom.
Although, I do understand why Katniss would never be able to see Gale in the same way. The possibility that it was his bomb was too much. Gale also understood that, which is why he left.
So I don't think he is to blame, but he was blindly involved. I say blindly because he was not sure how his and Beetee's bomb would be used, and nothing proves that it was his bomb.
This is not a plane crash. This bomb functioned exactly as designed. The most you could do is to say maybe he didn't expect it to be used on civilians, and not against children. I don't know if he knew that or not. He doesn't seem to have cared.
I especially like Anna-Cosette and Janese's comparisons to the creator vs. the pilot. Particularly then gun one. Its absolutely true. Gale may have had the idea for the bomb, but he didn't drop it.
Janese wrote: "Robert wrote: "Except the time that he killed her."Using parachutes wasn't Gale's contribution, it was the idea of a secondary explosion for further impact. And again, I remind people that they w..."
That's what I've been saying! People are always blaming Gale, and it makes you feel bad for the guy. Not only was the girl he had a crush on practically forget about him, but the whole fanworld hates on him too... Plus there's the fact that I actually liked Gale in the beginning...
And Snow didn't kill people in the arena. He had other people do it for him. The tactic involved with his bomb is evil enough. We rightly condemn it when terrorists use it. I don't think Gale is an inherently evil person. I think he lost his way, and he had people like Coin willing to help him lose his way.
When he was asked if it was his bomb, he said he wasn't sure. If he didn't know about using parachutes, then it certainly wouldn't have been his bomb, so why didn't he deny it, claim that parachutes weren't his idea.Just because you like Gale doesn't lessen his culpability. He knew what these bombs were for. We rightly condemn such tactics when used by terrorists, is it OK just because we like Gale?
Robert, you keep talking about terrorists, but we're talking about war, which is also devastating, but inherently different. Terrorist tactics, as you term it are a natural part of war. The whole point is to kill your opponents before they kill you. Also, Gale's idea of a bomb with a secondary explosion could have easily been adapted to a parachute without his knowledge so that proves nothing.Anyway, guess we just gotta agree to disagree. I think the view that Gale killed Prim is extreme, and I wasn't all that crazy about Gale to begin with, so that isn't why I'm on this side of the question.
Here's what puzzles me. The aircraft that bombed the kids had Capitol markings. Who was piloting the plane? That person could explain what the purpose of the bombing was and who ordered it.Sometimes I think Coin herself flew the plane by remote control.
when you said he killed her, he didn't mean to he didn't know his bombs were going to be used against him , yes it was his devices that killed her but he never meant that to happen
he did not know what effect the bomb could have and he did not know who it would kill
It was a horrible accident. He never wanted to kill Primrose not at all. All he did was invent the bomb senario (where the bombs explode and then explode again when people come to help the wounded) he never meant for it explode on Primrose. He never even meant for it to explode on anyone but capitol people. It may have been a horrible bomb senario that was really harsh, but what happened to Prim was deffiantly an accident.
Janese wrote: "Margarita wrote: "He killed Primrose. That is all there is to it. He might have had gotten orders to do it, but if he truly loved Katniss the way he said he did, he wouldn't have done it. In the en..."agreed!
Hannah wrote: "It was a horrible accident. He never wanted to kill Primrose not at all. All he did was invent the bomb senario (where the bombs explode and then explode again when people come to help the wounded)..."agreed again.
gale wasn't responsible for prim's death...esp. since prim wasn't suppose to be there...i mean really who sends a child out as a medic in a war? esp. when there are better trained ppl to do it? coin did and she did that to drive katniss insane so ppl wonldn't look up to her as they did during the war. it was a political move by coin to ensure that she becomes that leader of panem, with gale being caught in the middle, since unlike katniss and a selected few, he actually trusted coin.
Anna-Cosette wrote: "Gale didn't kill Prim. It never said he was in the airplane when the bombs dropped. Yes it was his bomb, but you have to remember Beetee created it too. No one seems to remember that it wasn't just..."Yes, but Beetee wasn't looking to date Katniss (that we know of)
Gale contributed to the plan that killed Prim. Katniss could never have forgotton that. It doesn't matter who else was also involved, Beetee, Coin, whoever. The important thing for the Katniss/Gale relationship was GALE'S involvement.
Sam wrote: "I especially like Anna-Cosette and Janese's comparisons to the creator vs. the pilot. Particularly then gun one. Its absolutely true. Gale may have had the idea for the bomb, but he didn't drop it."So, in a war, when bombs are being dropped, who do you blame, exactly? The pilots? The inventors? Ultimately it's the general in charge of the army but you can't overlook the inventors contribution. For example - let's say someone launches an atom bomb tomorrow. Who do you blame? The person who pressed the button...or those who invented the atom bomb? For me, it's a combination...yes, the one who gives the order/pushes the button is the one making the attack...but if the atom bomb had never been invented, no one would have such an astronomically devastating weapon at their disposal.
I read it, but please don't spoil this for others.
Helen wrote: "Sam wrote: "I especially like Anna-Cosette and Janese's comparisons to the creator vs. the pilot. Particularly then gun one. Its absolutely true. Gale may have had the idea for the bomb, but he did..."Even though we're discussing fiction here, I have to argue with your point because technology loves so fast, & there are so many minds focused in the same direction, SOMEONE would have come up with the atom bomb or something just as devastating (same is true in the book). Unfortunately, self destruction is in the make-up of mankind, (as a species, not individuals).
Horrible Mistake. I don't see why the Resistance wanted to bomb the children in the first place, It's not really Gales fault that the resistance decided to use his idea, but Gale really shouldn't have invented such a weapon. So I guess in a Mistake on purpose. (If that makes ant sense)
Margarita wrote: "He killed Primrose. That is all there is to it. He might have had gotten orders to do it, but if he truly loved Katniss the way he said he did, he wouldn't have done it. In the end of the book, to ..."As much as I HATE Gale.....this is not the case!!!
He made the bomb....he DID NOT order the bomb to go off where it did/or when it did.
That was all Coin!
Look at it this way: you don't blame the car maker for running over and killing someone do you?
You blame the person behind the wheel.
Car's are dangerous machines, but we never blame the people who invented them, right?
It's the same thing!
Gale is not at fault!
I wouldn't be so hard on Gale, he didn't want to kill Prim or any ether children - but that doesn't mean he isn't guilty and he knows it.
He realized that the bomb couldn't bring anything good and that Katniss loved Prim to much to forgive him. It's sort of like she lost - the series started with Katniss giving her life for her little sister, she wonted Prim to live and have a better life. Thats what gave her strength and when she died - it was worse then her own death.
I didn't like Gale but I have to give him credit for understanding Katniss so well. It shows how well he knew and loved her. If he stayed, Katniss would always think about Prim and never get better - so he left.
He realized that the bomb couldn't bring anything good and that Katniss loved Prim to much to forgive him. It's sort of like she lost - the series started with Katniss giving her life for her little sister, she wonted Prim to live and have a better life. Thats what gave her strength and when she died - it was worse then her own death.
I didn't like Gale but I have to give him credit for understanding Katniss so well. It shows how well he knew and loved her. If he stayed, Katniss would always think about Prim and never get better - so he left.
Gale indirectly killed Primrose. He admitted the responsibility of it. But whether he knew the bombs were going to be used against the capitol children or his own Rebel children, there was something unsettlingly cold-hearted about the way he created the bombs. The idea...creepy. I wouldn't have felt comfortable being around him after that.
I mean, he knew people like Primrose were going to be maliciously killed by his cruel idea. So in the end, what's the difference?
His lust for revenge backfired on him-enormously.
Janese wrote: "Robert wrote: "Except the time that he killed her."Using parachutes wasn't Gale's contribution, it was the idea of a secondary explosion for further impact. And again, I remind people that they w..."
While I agree that he didn't technically kill Primrose, he is the one who originally mentioned using injured children against their parents. He was talking about setting a trap for baby animals to lure their parents in. So, regardless of whether or not he is responsible for Prim's death, he still came up with the twisted idea that resulted in her death. Even in war there are some boundaries that should never be crossed. People who can justify harming children "for the greater good" aren't people, they're monsters.
Tina J wrote: "Margarita wrote: "He killed Primrose. That is all there is to it. He might have had gotten orders to do it, but if he truly loved Katniss the way he said he did, he wouldn't have done it. In the en..."That scenario does not work in this case. The purpose of a car is not to cause death, it is created for transportation and the inventor made it with the understanding that people will use it for transportation and strive to keep from taking needless risks. The purpose of a bomb is to kill people. When bombs are dropped there's no knowing for certain who will be killed, children or adults, enemies or allies. Gale created the bomb with the understanding that people will die. So it doesn't matter whether he dropped it or not. He is as responsible for the deaths that occurred as the pilot.
I whole-heartedly disagree Kylie!At the end of the day, the concept is the same, whether you think so or not!
Besides, they're in a WAR....Gale made the bomb to use against the Capitol IF NEEDED....Coin sent Prim, KNOWING what she was planing to do.
You don't go in to a war armless!
Coin is at fault!!!
Like I said, I can't stand Gale, but the thought of blaming him for Prim's death is a sad excuse for disliking him.
Gale wouldn't kill Primrose intentionally. No way. The bomb was made for a war. They had to use everything they had. And when making bombs you don't start labeling them.
"I'm going to use this one for the yellow building"
"This is only to be used for the skyscraper on the left"
"Damn it, we can't blow up that area over there! We don't have a bomb for it!"
Gale didn't make the bomb knowing it would eventually kill Prim.
The reason Katniss left him was that she couldn't live with him, day by day, knowing that he was the reason her sister died. And then he turned out to be a coward because he didn't go back to her, he didn't try to fight for her and get her back, he avoided her.
Again, what people are forgetting here, is that it was a WAR. Of course he knew he the bomb was going to kill people. A soldier goes to war knowing that he is going to kill people, who are the enemy. Had the bomb only killed bad guys, people wouldn't be here saying it was wrong to make a bomb; they would be praising Gale's genius.
Janese wrote: "Robert, you keep talking about terrorists, but we're talking about war, which is also devastating, but inherently different. Terrorist tactics, as you term it are a natural part of war.These tactics would get anyone convicted as a war criminal. The only reason anyone is justifying this is because they like Gale. I do not agree to disagree. There isn't any sane position where what he did was OK.
Kylie wrote: While I agree that he didn't technically kill Primrose, he is the one who originally mentioned using injured children against their parents. He was talking about setting a trap for baby animals to lure their parents in. So, regardless of whether or not he is responsible for Prim's death, he still came up with the twisted idea that resulted in her death. Even in war there are some boundaries that should never be crossed. People who can justify harming children "for the greater good" aren't people, they're monsters. Gale would have been convicted as a war criminal. It's a weapon that is meant to target civilians and then target those who come in to aid. You have to be pretty degraded to come up with a tactic which uses people's own compassion as a weapon against them. Gale can't be said not to know how the bomb was to be used, it was used exactly as he proposed it to be used, used against children. He's not specifically to blame for Prim's death, it seems clear that Coin put her there to get her killed off. But what Gale is guilty of is more than sufficient.
I don't think it's ever established in "Mockingjay" who piloted the craft that bombed those kids. Correct me if I'm wrong, please.
I don't remember if it was ever really revealed if Gale was actually a part of that plan. He did design the bomb, which I think was part of the reason why he fled Katniss and didn't speak to her again. He was probably ashamed of that fact. I don't think he killed her directly, whether or not he was part of the plan.
Janese wrote: "Robert wrote: "Except the time that he killed her."Using parachutes wasn't Gale's contribution, it was the idea of a secondary explosion for further impact. And again, I remind people that they w..."
I felt Gale had no idea how nor when the bomb(s) would be used but he designed it as a weapon of war. Coin sent Prim in I believe it though it doesn't say that; for Katniss' acts of defiance and being more popular than Coin. Coin and. The rebels sent the parachutes as if the children were in the Games. Thus, the children believed it was items they needed. That was mentioned. Did Gale want Prim dead? No. Did Gale know they were using his bomb design to murder children? No. I feel that is one reason he never wanted to face the inhabitants of District 12
rawr? wrote: "gale wasn't responsible for prim's death...esp. since prim wasn't suppose to be there...i mean really who sends a child out as a medic in a war? esp. when there are better trained ppl to do it? coi..."Agreed!
Betty wrote: "I don't think it's ever established in "Mockingjay" who piloted the craft that bombed those kids. Correct me if I'm wrong, please."It is mentioned I do believe that if Snow had a n aircraft he would have escaped as well as the gamemaker mentioning it almost as if it were nothing
Betty wrote: "I don't think it's ever established in "Mockingjay" who piloted the craft that bombed those kids. Correct me if I'm wrong, please."
Betty wrote: "I don't think it's ever established in "Mockingjay" who piloted the craft that bombed those kids. Correct me if I'm wrong, please."
People keep saying "it was war, so it's OK!" That's exactly what every terrorist says.
It happens in real life, terrorists do it. When it happens in war, the perpetrators are charged as war criminals.
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