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Eye of the World...weak first book?
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I know that a lot of the time the earlier published books by an author are noticeably rougher than the more recent ones. Look at The Dresden Files, Discworld, The Dark Tower series.... I could list a bunch if I wanted to devote some time to it.I read the first three Wheel of Time books, and I thought they were all pretty average. Then again, I'm not really big on good-versus-evil-prophesied-showdowns.
I'm going thru them now; I'm on Book 7 at the moment, but I gotta say that the first few books were a bit more enjoyable, since the series currently seems to be getting a bit complicated and dragging a bit. Much more of a fan of the one problem--this book will solve it scenario
Cattfish wrote: "I'm going thru them now; I'm on Book 7 at the moment, but I gotta say that the first few books were a bit more enjoyable, since the series currently seems to be getting a bit complicated and draggi..."you are in for a looooooonnnnnngggggggg hall. 8 9 & 10 draaaaaaaggggg quite a bit. but 11 picks up the pace back like 1-6 did.
I started reading this series around 1991 or 1992 maybe. I remember that the first three books were out in paperback. I was in college then! I've kept up with them since then, so these books have been me for my whole adult life. I have noticed that upon re-reading the books, that the older I am, the more impatient I am with the story- most specifically the female characters. A bit to whiny and " oh look how dumb men are" for me.
However, the first 6 books are my favorite, in spite of the shortcoming I mentioned above. The first book was a bit predictable, but it engaged me enough to stick with it. It came at a time where I was ready for a new sprawling epic, and it fit the bill.
I would agree with some others that books 7 through 10 really slow down the momentum of the story, but if you can get through those, the pace does pick up in the final volumes. I have to say that I am looking forward to the end.
I recently re-listened to New Spring and have started re-listening to The Eye of the World.I don't think that The Eye of the World is a particularly weak "first book" for the series, especially if the reader is already a fan of the genre. As others have noted, it definitely moves faster than some of the later books and there's a good bit of action to draw the reader in. I don't think it uses too many "weird words" to confuse people on the world.
Maybe it's not the strongest out there (I think, for example, A Game of Thrones or Magician: Apprentice do better as "first books"), but it's not as slow-starting as The Fellowship of the Ring...
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Hm, it's been forever since I read them (like, since grade school), but of Susan Cooper's The Dark is Rising series, I remember being blown away by the second book, (same name as series) The Dark Is Rising, whereas the first book Over Sea, Under Stone seemed much weaker. In fact, I still remember some images from The Dark is Rising, while I can't remember anything about Over Sea, Under Stone at all.
Totally agreed about Susan Cooper's books. I recently read them all (having only read The Dark Is Rising when I was in 5th grade or so). The Dark Is Rising was definitely the strongest of the bunch.We read The Eye of the World in March, 2009 or so I think. I seem to remember listening to it while driving to NJ to do some stuff for work.
Started reading the series around 1996 and I instantly loved it. I've either read, listened, or some combination thereof the series four times now. What I find most amazing about the series is how much foreshadowing Jordan did early in the books for things that didn't have payoffs until many many books later. The first time through I didn't pick up on any of it but the later times through my jaw dropped a lot realizing that he had hinted at things so early on that didn't pay off til six or seven books later.
I've also found that while books 8-10 are the weaker books in the series that they aren't as bad as I thought the first time through. They came out in the time when Jordan's writing pace had slowed a lot and I think a lot of us were just frustrated by the long waits. On a re-read I found them to be better than I remembered.
Micah wrote: "you are in for a looooooonnnnnngggggggg hall. 8 9 & 10 draaaaaaaggggg quite a bit. but 11 picks up the pace back like 1-6 did. "
I enjoyed the series (though I thought Jordan did a very poor job when it came to writing women) up until those three books. Book 8 was a disappointment 9 & 10 made me quit the series. Two giant volumes of fluff where hardly anything happens.
Once the series is done I will see what everyone thinks of the ending and books 11-13 and look at it again.
I thought book 1 was very solid start to a series even if it did follow the majority of the common fantasy tropes. A young man coming of age who grew up in a rural area, a journey, a wise teacher etc...
Like I said, I've read these before. But I remember reading The Great Hunt and instantly started the next book. Not the case with Eye of the World. I will finish the series and most likely be thrilled I did, one book a month for a year. (if all goes well)I mainly only read fantasy, and have loaned out EotW to others quite a few times. I'm enjoying it once again, and I'm by no means sad I'm listening to it, maybe it.
The few things I'm having to learn to adjust to:
-the women, everyone but Moiraine is so annoying. Pushy, bullheaded, and all prideful. He might have been trying to make them all strong, but the Two Rivers women make me roll my eyes.
-I know it's part of the mistrust of outsiders, but the boys never telling anyone anything of the weirdness going on, strikes me as ridiculous at times.
-Was the 'Dark One' this present in the other books? He's in their dreams like every other scene, I don't remember him directly doing anything in the other books, struck me as odd.
That said, I'm enjoying myself and look forward to reading them all back to back.
I did feel it was a mediocre beginning.But at least it stood alone, as opposed to the succeeding books. I faintly remember it starting to get exciting at around book four or five...
Brandon wrote:Once the series is done I will see what everyone thinks of the ending and books 11-13 and look at it again. Book 11 is definitely better than the prior three.
Book 12 is where Brandon Sanderson took over and with the exception of Mat's storyline everything starts happening very fast. Sanderson is obviously working from Jordan's outline and apparently there wasn't much for Mat to do until events that unfold near the end of book 13 so his parts continue to plod until the end of 13. Rand, Perrin, and Egwenes stories though are full steam ahead and a whole lot of stuff actually happens.
I would say that the Eye of the World is weak compared to where the series went afterwards. For me fhe first book was just one of a many books which were copying the Tolkien formula at that time. I loved it when I first read it because I was reading all of those books that I could get my hands on, but I'm not sure that I would want to read it again now.I think Jordan's skill was in taking that first book and turning it into the series that he did, taking the story in a direction away from Tolkien. I do think that the series will have to be judged as a whole once it has finished though.
Rik wrote: "What I find most amazing about the series is how much foreshadowing Jordan did early in the books for things that didn't have payoffs until many many books later. The first time through I didn't pick up on any of it but the later times through my jaw dropped a lot realizing that he had hinted at things so early on that didn't pay off til six or seven books later. "Totally agree about this. One of the many reasons I love this series. I find it so intricate on a lot of levels. It goes to deep down the proverbial rabbit hole at times but overall I love it for that.
Brett wrote: "-Was the 'Dark One' this present in the other books? He's in their dreams like every other scene, I don't remember him directly doing anything in the other books, struck me as odd."Jordan retconned that in the third book by revealing that it wasn't really the Dark One but merely Ishamael in disguise.
Is there a fantasy trope that is not used in that first book? Maybe it's my age but I don't have the patience anymore for something that blatantly derivative. Hats off to anyone who had the patience to stick with it beyond about book 5. Can you honestly tell me he couldn't have done this story in 5 books and the series would have been much better for it?
Ian wrote: "Is there a fantasy trope that is not used in that first book? Maybe it's my age but I don't have the patience anymore for something that blatantly derivative. Hats off to anyone who had the patience to stick with it beyond about book 5. Can you honestly tell me he couldn't have done this story in 5 books and the series would have been much better for it? ..."I will simply because books 4-6 are the strongest of the series until books 11-13. The end of book six, The Battle of Dumai Wells, is one of the best climaxes I've read in any work of fiction and definitely the highlight of the series.
Rik wrote: "I will simply because books 4-6 are the strongest of the series until books 11-13. The end of book six, The Battle of Dumai Wells, is one of the best climaxes I've read in any work of fiction and definitely the highlight of the series. "That doesn't mean Jordan couldn't've fit it all in to five volumes by getting rid of all the extraneous junk. Look at The Shadow Rising -- it takes everyone about three hundred pages to get out of Tear and the actual plot to start. That's a full novel worth of material that's wasted on pointless political subplots and Faile being annoying. And that's before the series got bogged down with chapter after chapter of recap and exposition with only occasional, glacial plot development.
A better writer would've done the series better in half the space.
Fully agree Sean that was my point - although I'm sure Jordan could have done it much quicker had it not become such a lucrative money spinner
I absolutely loved the first four books, though I first read them when I was a teenager so my expectations were different when I was first exposed to them. Eye of the World is definitely derivative (or full of homage, depending on how you want to look at it), but in my opinion it's considerably better than books 7-10, which are, quite frankly, awful and boring.I couldn't make it past book 8 the first time I read the series. I tried again a few years ago after meeing Robert Jordan shortly before he passed away, and I agree that things get much better at Knife of Dreams, but I gave up in disgust again the day I heard "the last book" was changing to "the last three books," and haven't had the heart to go back yet.
Justin wrote: "I agree that things get much better at Knife of Dreams, but I gave up in disgust again the day I heard "the last book" was changing to "the last three books," and haven't had the heart to go back yet. "I don't think this was done for monetary reasons. From both Brandon Sandersons and RJ's widows comments it seems to me that 1 book would have cheapened the story and left out a lot. Jordan left A LOT of plot lines to tie up (even if you only count the main characters) and Brandon Sanderson has been doing an awesome job IMO. You should give them a shot when AMOL comes out early next year.
Yeah, I keep hearing that Sanderson is doing right by the story, so I probably will read them. I just couldn't subject myself to the waiting game, even if it was done with noble intentions.
I am sorry to say I stopped reading this series. I liked the story for the most part but got bored with Roberts rambling descriptions. If the author spends too much on detail I get bored. I have heard from my husband who has read the whole series thus far that Brandon did a much better job staying with the story and action. Almost makes me want to muddle thru. Haven't decided yet...
I only started the series for the first time about two and a half years ago, and really enjoyed the first book (twice) even with adult eyes. I think it's quite common to feel a book is much weaker when you come back to it after having first read it as a kid/teenager...I put it down to mentally putting it on a much higher pedestal than it might deserve, so that often even when it is a decent book which you'd otherwise enjoy, it just never lives up to the brilliance it was when you were young.Also totally agree with the massive slowing of pace - I got to about halfway through book 7 and gave up, but have been meaning to get through the whole series at some point.
It always amazes me how different people respond to this series. Some like the first book, some say it was weak, some hate book six, some (like me) think it's the best of the lot. There are even some who insist books 8-10 are simply world expanding, and not boring at all.I read book one when I was in my teens. After Tolkien, it was the only fantasy books I'd ever read. At the time it seemed okay -- certainly good enough to keep me reading -- but, as has already been said, it was very much in the mould of Tolkein. From memory, I'd say Wizards First Rule was a worse opening novel. Thankfully, that's another series which picked up as it went on (Although I've never gotten around to finishing in).
Recently I recommended EotW to a friend and he couldn't finish it. I don't like the thought of reading through the series again (although it is finishing incredibly strongly), but if I did, I do wonder whether (a) book one would seem as strong to my grown up brain, and (b) whether books 8 to 10 would seem as weak as I remember, read back to back.
Other Paul wrote: From memory, I'd say Wizards First Rule was a worse opening novel. Thankfully, that's another series which picked up as it went on (Although I've never gotten around to finishing in).I've tried reading this series three times now. Every time I get to about book six and lose interest about the time Goodkind starts getting all preachy with his politics. By the time I think I'll give it another shot I've pretty much forgotten what happened so I start over.
Rik wrote: "Other Paul wrote: From memory, I'd say Wizards First Rule was a worse opening novel. Thankfully, that's another series which picked up as it went on (Although I've never gotten around to finishing ..."Good grief, I only made it as far as book five before giving up, but I do remember -- at least in terms of writing -- the books improving. I think I only read them because it was one of those 99p per hardback deals with some book club. Reading them all in one block was just too much. There aren't many authors who can survive having their whole back catalogue read in one go. You start to see their tricks after a while.
I gave up Goodkind about thirty pages into the first book when somebody seriously proposed a ban on fire and the people around him didn't immediately respond, "Are you fucking stupid?"
I've struggled with this book for a while. I am considering Ken-ing it and reading the wiki summaries and starting with Great Hunt.
For those thinking of starting the series you could consider starting with New Spring rather than Eye of the World. Its a prequel that Jordan wrote sometime last decade. On the plus side its much shorter than Eye of the World and will give you a good introduction to the world. On the negative you actually might miss some important Easter Egg type things Jordan dropped into it for those who'd read the rest of the series.
I already know quite a bit about the world through discussions with my dad through his reading them as well as thoroughly reading The World of the Wheel of Time. Both have fascinated me, I just always men Eye of the World.
Sean wrote: "I gave up Goodkind about thirty pages into the first book when somebody seriously proposed a ban on fire and the people around him didn't immediately respond, "Are you fucking stupid?""I was listening to it an audiobook, and that speech confused the hell out of me. I couldn't decide whether Goodkind was trying to convey the idea that something terribly bizarre was going on (that formerly normal people were going insane) but his writing skills weren't up to it, or whether it was meant to be taken utterly seriously (but his writing skills weren't up to it). I put the iPod down not long after that, and didn't pick it back up...
Rik wrote: "For those thinking of starting the series you could consider starting with New Spring rather than Eye of the World. Its a prequel that Jordan wrote sometime last decade. On the plus side its mu..."It also has massive spoilers for that aren't revealed in the series until later. Not necassarily a bad thing, but the surprise in the series isn't there, personal choice I guess. Defiantly will give you a different perspective than those who read it later in the series.
To me I felt that Eye was the strongest of the books but I didn't get past book four. I am not saying that it wasn't mediocere but it was the strongest book because it had a much tighter plot.
Characters were not spread half way across the world, the characters you enjoyed actually had "screen time."
Everything after just sagged. I gave up on the book where Rand had about 100 pages on him when the rest of the book was like 600 pages long.
I've loved all of these books. The first time I read books 10 and 11, I did feel like the lagged a little. But having re-read everything prior to reading the newer books, I'm firmly in the camp that enjoys them for the world building. Plus even if they're less eventful, it's still time getting to know the characters. The world building is the main reason this is one of my favorite series, but to each their own of course :)
I hated Eye of the World. It was full of every single thing I was sick to death of in epic fantasy at the time. Every trope and cliche stood out bright as day, and not one thing happened to surprise or engage me. I only finished it because I already had a copy of The Great Hunt and felt obligated to read it too. Thankfully that book had some interesting ideas in it, although it didn't pick up for me until Mat (the only character with a soul, as far as I'm concerned) finally got screentime. It got better after that, but I never got past book 7.
So can I just skip from the end of book 6 straight to the Sanderson novels? Or will I miss out on crucial braid tugging, bowl fetching, and paragraphs about how Mat will never understand women and "Men...harumph!"?Seriously man, Lord of Chaos was like one big Skyrim side quest.
Keith wrote: "So can I just skip from the end of book 6 straight to the Sanderson novels? Or will I miss out on crucial braid tugging, bowl fetching, and paragraphs about how Mat will never understand women and ..."at least read 7 it was fairly short and a quick read. Maybe skip 8 if you wanted to but it does have Rand going even more batshit crazy so its crucial to know that and see it happen. But you have to read 9. BIG things happen in 9. VERY VERY VERY LARGE THINGS. But not until the end. 10 you could probably skip and just read a summary of as everybody says. It wasn't a bad book but nothing happened. Book 11 is Jordan's last book and all the story lines picked back up. then Sanderson took over and it started rocking again.
Keith wrote: "So can I just skip from the end of book 6 straight to the Sanderson novels? Or will I miss out on crucial braid tugging, bowl fetching, and paragraphs about how Mat will never understand women and ..."I can't remember exactly what happens in which book but as I recall not much happens in book eight. Something HUGELY IMPORTANT does happen near the end of one of the books and has one of the best climaxes in the series. I'm assuming its book nine given what Micah says since I'm sure we are talking about the same thing. Unfortunately the book after that is about 700 pages of characters standing around going "Oh my, this is scary" when they see signs of what happened at the climax of the previous book.
Rik wrote: "Unfortunately the book after that is about 700 pages of characters standing around going "Oh my, this is scary" when they see signs of what happened at the climax of the previous book. "Yes exactly this. Not a bad book but also did not move the story forward one iota. So it can be skipped and summarized if so inclined.
Rik wrote: "Keith wrote: Something HUGELY IMPORTANT does happen near the end of one of the books and has one of the best climaxes in the series. That would be book nine.
I think book eight is universally accepted as bleh or NOTHING INTERESTING HAPPENS.
The Sword and Laser
Books mentioned in this topic
The Dark Is Rising (other topics)The Eye of the World (other topics)
The Dark Is Rising (other topics)
Over Sea, Under Stone (other topics)
New Spring (other topics)
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I started the series back in 1997 while I was in High School, and lost track around book 9 and really haven't check out any since then. I thought I could stay focused this way on one series.
So I started, Eye of The World. I remember it being the weakest of the series...but I'm struck by how average it feels.
Have I just grown up since reading the series? It hold a fond place in my reading heart, but as I listen the story seems weak, and a rather thin beginning for a massive 13 book BELOVED series.
Is it just me or is it really just a weak start that picks up steam as the series progresses?
Thought I would see what you brilliant folks had to say on the matter. And are there any of series where the first book is the worst of the series?