Karen Chance Fans discussion

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Series Discussions > Easter Eggs (plot hints)

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message 51: by Claire (new)

Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments what do you guys think it meant when the "star" card started talking during Tempt the Stars?


message 52: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments Cassie's deck says the Star speaks of a heroic quest that *may* after a period of time and great effort, lead to a reward as sweet and clear as the pure water in the picture---if you survive.

There is no guarantee of success.

So she goes on her nearly impossible quest to rescue Pritkin, and strives and fails...or does she?

After challenging the "stars" of the demon council, she loses, and then at the very end. or after, she gets one more chance.

Like a real tarot reading, the ones in the Cassie books tend to resonate on several levels at once, as we saw with the Emperor-Death combo discussed earlier.


message 53: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments Way back when Cassie gave Radella the rune in return for evacuating kids & dark fey, Radella gave her a fey blessing, which Rosier said was useless outside of Faerie.

I'm guessing it would protect C from dark fey, but would the light fey honor it, too?

Seems like that blessing might be important if/when C goes to faerie again to find her dad?


message 54: by Scarlet (new)

Scarlet Heavens | 361 comments I think a fey blessing is like a charm/good luck spell that would help Cassie in a time of need, especially since I am convinced she will go back to Faerie at one point or another in the future.


message 55: by Somnium (last edited Apr 18, 2014 01:15PM) (new)

Somnium Shadows | 437 comments I'm really looking forward to seeing what a fey blessing actually does. All we really know is that it useless outside of Faerie, so I agree, I'm convinced she'll be going back there, or it would be irrelevant. Seeing as it probably won't be a short trip (since when is getting anything that important easy for Cassie), my theory is that the fey blessing will allow her to use her powers in Faerie. Although I suppose it's possible that she could use them anyway since she's a demigoddess and so she and her powers are from heaven, and she was just having a mental block in CbS, like with how she couldn't age the apple in HtM...


message 56: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments I thought the blessing might give her protection. Allowing her powers to work in faerie would be great! I like your thinking.


message 57: by Scarlet (new)

Scarlet Heavens | 361 comments I think that Cassie's power doesn't work in Faerie, even though she's a demigoddess, because Artemis was the ruler of the Hells, and the pathways, and not of the heavens.

But still, though, Cassie's Pythia power comes from a God, so shouldn't it work in the heavens as well?


message 58: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments No one's magic works in faerie except that of the fae.

The Pythian power over time comes from Apollo.

Artemis was out of power and was dying. That's why she joined the Pythian Court---to get access to that power.

Cassie's innate magical abilities were inherited from her father, who was a mage, a magical human.


message 59: by Somnium (last edited Apr 17, 2014 02:08PM) (new)

Somnium Shadows | 437 comments Exactly. Yes, sorry, when I say the fey blessing might allow her to use her magic, I mean her pythian powers from Apollo, not her human magic. KC said in Fury's Kiss that the problems humans have with using magic in Faerie, and they fey using theirs on earth, is due to crossing the divide between the heavens and the hells. Since the Pythian power is from the other side of the divide, the same side as Faerie, it should theoretically work better there than on earth, not worse. But I'm not sure if the fact that it's now being channelled by humans since it left Apollo has changed that. I might have to ask KC about this.


message 60: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments OK, now I understand what you mean. Makes sense.

I wondering now why it *doesn't* work. I hope you will ask her.

Poor KC. Does she get quizzed more than most authors about these kinds of details, does anyone know?

If so, I guess it's a tribute to her world-building and her story-telling that we care so much.


message 61: by Claire (new)

Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments I think KC probably doesn't get quizzed as much as other authors, by virtue of the fact that her presence on social media is pretty limited compared to them. It's interesting; I don't even know if she's a full time author or not.


message 62: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments I would love to know if she writes full time.


message 63: by Kat (new)

Kat | 131 comments Claire and Kathleen, I believe she is.

She mentioned in past interviews that she used to be a history professor, and still was while writing Touch the Dark, but after that she quit so she could write full-time.


message 64: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments Thanks, Kat! I had a vague notion that she was full time. Glad to know it's true!


message 65: by Claire (new)

Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments Ah, now her love of history research makes more sense. That's really cool!


message 66: by Winter (new)

Winter | 3 comments Thanks everyone, it makes sense that it would be about saunders.

I am happy.


message 67: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments I hope everyone spotted lots of delicious Easter Eggs over the holidays...
Cadbury, Dove, Godiva, or whatever makes you happy.


message 68: by Lannister (new)

Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Somnium wrote: "*re-emerges from behind a curtain* I HAVE RETURNED!!!"

SOMNIUM!!! Welcome back! :D

Glad to have you back around these parts again! Did you read Masks yet?


message 69: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments Have we been overlooking a *giant* Easter Egg in the knowledge that Pritkin is Merlin?

In a war, morale can make the difference between winning and losing, bout internal morale, like that of the English people let by Churchill in World War II, and external morale?

Like the whole Spanish nation getting behind Lord Wellington and his army to defeat Napoleon's generals and army who had committed so many atrocities that thousands of men who had lost their women and children to cruel slaughter formed guerrilla bands in the mountains to fight them. The English could not have one without their assistance and support. Morale, just not theirs.

How much would having THE MERLIN leading the Silver Circle energize the war effort by enheartening the whole light magical community (and other good guys)?

It would be HUGE. We keep thinking of Protein as a scruffy, antisocial war mage. A nobody who wants to stay anonymous.

I'll bet it never occurred to him, because he doesn't think he's anything special, but he really is.

He could be the most powerful and important character in the whole story, and all the story dynamics could turn on a dime.

Someone a few months ago on this thread made an interesting case that Protein could be Fenrir. That is not out of keeping with the Merlin Effect. The two could work together....

Vesides we have seen how the Children of Loki so far sometimes been metaphors, like representing Artemis's giant spell as Ouroboros, a giant snake wrapped around the Earth to protect it.

He could be metaphorically Fenrir....and instead of dying once the world was saved he could simply disappear back into obscurity if he chose to.


message 70: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments Pritkin as a leader would certainly shake things up a bit, there seems to be a consensus over at the "Death, death..." thread that shows that most people would like to to see (or at least expect to see) some drama at the top of the organisations (be that the Senate or the Circle). Removing Jonas would therefore be really interesting - Pritkin might have to step forward for the greater good and fill the void of authority to prevent the Circle from disintegrating... then again, I wonder what that would mean for him and Cassie... he could hardly stay her bodyguard that way, and it would almost certainly mean less Prissie time.

The problem in my opinion is that these "hints" are either waaay too small and seemingly inconsequential to pick up, or valid conspiracy theories that fall in line with prior info or logical speculation. It's probably like the "Things they would never say" thread: to the person coming up with the hint, it is evindently clear, however, others may interpret the clues differently or even apply them to a different character! Like KC also probably has all these plot bunnies hiding in the grass, which would be obvious to us too, if we only knew what the plotline is eventually heading towards... Speculation is always fun though, and I agree that Pritkin doing something other than self-suppression and avoidance would be interesting :)

Oh and I know it's just autocorrect (I assume? xD)... but Pritkin being "Protein" is just genius!!!


message 71: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments One thing I enjoy about Things They Would Never Say is the insight into characters that I get from other the guesses of others.

I love Plot Bunnies!!! They are my new favorite thing!


message 72: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments And what if Merlin and the Pythian married? It would be epic!!!


message 73: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments And yeah, the Android spell wrecker **thinks** it is a genius, but its edits are worse than my typos.


message 74: by [deleted user] (new)

As used by perplexed speculators in another forum devoted to a series that lurched to a stunningly unsatisfactory conclusion, I will offer my own WAG (Wild Asp Guess) about the two Tarot cards - the Emperor and Death. Winter said that Ms. Chance stated that Mircea, whom I adore, is the Emperor in the Major Arcana.

I think the card encompasses not only the death of Cleo and the accession of Mircea as leader of the six Senates, but also the "death" of the despotic governance of vampires by the most powerful. Mircea will implement reform of the autocratic system, analgous to adding the Bill of Rights amendments to the US Constitution and also issuing the Emancipation Proclamation. Perhaps other supernaturals/dimensions will see and emulate the actions.

After all, this is all presaged by Mircea's reaction as a young vampire in "Masks" to the abuses under the old Consul.

Thank you for reading my WAG for the UWHAT theory (Utopian Windup to HEA for All Things)!

(I'll go quietly now.)


message 75: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments Lol, don't go!!! That's an interesting theory, do you remember where KC said what card she associates with the characters? (Or was it just mentioned that Mircea is the Emperor?) I always interpreted it as either Apollo' s or Drac's demise, although it would be interesting if the Death card referred to the changes that would happen. I hope at least that it's to be meant figuratively then, because I didn't think KC would be as cliché as to announce the actual literal death of Mircea that way, so your reform theory would be really awesome. Though it is unsure how much of his idealism remains after so many years... Dory mentioned he had too many "yes types" around him. Interesting!

And Kathleen: I find the "things they would never say" thread quite interesting (though I myself have run out of ideas), I just thought it could be an example of how much different perspectives matter - the author's take on a hint vs. how fans perceive it, for instance. I sure wish I could get a glimpse into KC's mind...


message 76: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments I believe the Emperor came up when C and M were on the plane on the way to Radu's...before M chained Cassie to the sofa.


message 77: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments @Kathleen: Yes, thanks, that's why I assumed it referred to either Drac (who was killed shortly after) or Apollo (who was killed at the end of the book).

However, Nancy said that KC mentioned that Mircea equates to the Emperor card, and I was wondering if KC said that in a Q&A or somewhere else??? Because that would be quite a hint for a future book - either as literal death or figurative change.


message 78: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments As we jump from thread to thread, having long chats about Mircea on the Pritkin thread, for example, I lose track of who said what to whom. Sorry for restating the obvious sometimes.

Tarot deals with current, recent and near future events, so I wouldn't read too much into it as a predictor of events in future books.

Then, too, there is a card that sums up each person's character and represents them (or someone like them) in readings. So Mircea is The Emperor, but the Death card might not apply to him personally, though it did represent the "death" of his obsession with punishing Drak, and maybe Drak's actual death, too.

It just occurred to me that Mircea and the Tarot are about the same age. Hunh!

Since this discussion (re)started, I've been thinking about some of the other Major cards and whom they might equate to.

In a real life pattern of acquaintanceship it would not be neat and tidy. Several people might have the same card, while some cards would not be represented. In the Cassie books, for example, I don't think anyone would have The Empress.

But there could be other Emperors: Caedmon. Anthony?


message 79: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments So Cassie might be The Fool, because the story is her journey.

And Artemis may be The Priestess.

But Pritkin does not fit the Magician... That might be Marlowe.

Could be an interesting exercise for those with enough knowledge of tarot and enough tolerance for ambiguity and irony....

I can see Jonas as The Hierophant.


message 80: by [deleted user] (new)

Winter in message 52 of this thread was the one who gave the info about Emperor/Mircea, and she also said Karen had said in a blog rambling that the tarot cards were possible Easter eggs to the plot line. (I haven't seen any further comments from Winter, so I don't know her source.)


message 81: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments @Kathleen: No worries, thanks for refreshing my memory of the exact scene it featured in from the books :) So far I only considered what we know about the cards from only the books, but if we expand the range of interpretation with "real world" tarot, it could me an interesting mix'n'match! I'll read up on it since I know nothing of the subject :(

@Nancy: Ah, so that's where that came from! Good to know, thanks! It just wasn't clear to me if KC implied that the Death card applied to Mircea then (I thought it was Apollo or Drac), but as Kathleen said, there could be many potential Emperor interpretations in the Cassieverse...


message 82: by Sarah ♥ dog crazy ♥ , Mircea's Moderatrix (new)

Sarah ♥ dog crazy ♥  (mylheage) | 6048 comments Mod
Someone (a group member?) asked KC about the tarot cards and here's her reply.

I once said Cassie is on the "Fool's Journey", which your friend may have misunderstood. The journey is one way the tarot has traditionally been explained. The tarot is seen as a map through life, from innocence to maturity, from ignorance to knowledge, and from vulnerablity to power. The Fool card is at numerical value 0 in the tarot, because that's where we all start in life, optimistic and clueless and pretty powerless. But then we meet people who challenge/instruct /obstruct/help us on our way, and learn things from them. In each Cassie book, there is a card or cards that shows up, describing the lesson she is learning/challenge she is facing. And as she meets those challenges, she moves further away from the Fool card where she started. So no, I don't think it describes her very well any more.


message 83: by [deleted user] (new)

What part will the Irin/the Fallen/the Watchers play? The Irin told Dory that she was playing out of her league and that was true for her people as well. He also said, "Tell them to leave it to us." Dory had wondered if the Irin were really fallen angels or merely a demon race with better-than-average PR. I hope this doesn't portend a magical solution that makes everthing all better instantly. That doesn't seem to be Ms. Chance's style, so I am hoping that the Irin learn that witches, vampires, demons, mages and the fey are to be respected and not to be treated lightly.


message 84: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments I totally missed all that, so thanks for filling me in, everyone! :) And Kathleen, your idea of trying to match tarot cards to characters sounded awesome and fun, so I looked into it and came up with these possible matches:

I can see how Mircea could be the Emperor, but technically, any male authority figure could pass for it, so your Caedmon could also apply (and perhaps Apollo too?), and maybe Anthony as well, though he seems to have a bit of a Devil edge to him.

Good catch with Marlowe as the Magician and Jonas as the Hierophant, I can totally see those matches!

The Priestess for me sounds more like Agnes than Artemis (at least the Wikipedia interpretation). Artemis in my eyes is more like a mix of Justice and the Hermit (following the events of her life perhaps). And the Lovers could maybe apply to Cassie's dad?

I think Ming-de's ambitions would match the Chariot, Strengh would be Louis-Cesare and maybe Death could be Dory? Both a psychological transformation and ending of old patterns seems to apply to her, she's just been made the first dhampire Senator!

And if the Fool no longer applies to Cassie, then perhaps she's the Wheel of Fortune? She's certainly steamrolling through a lot of fateful events!

For the others, I couldn't find anything that matched very well, as the other cards seemed to relate to an event in the series rather than a character... but I had 0 experience with Tarot until like a day ago, so I'm really curious what others think!


message 85: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments One reason I hesitated to mention the tarot correspondences to characters is that the tarot, like all working (as opposed to theoretical) metaphysical systems is not a neat, tidy scheme, no matter how much modern, western people would like for it to be.

The thought of trying to actually fit even the main characters into that system gives me a headache, perhaps because I have been a student of the tarot---and sometimes professional reader---for over 25 years.

For starters only some of the major arcana represent people/characters. Many represent situations, for example the tower, the chariot, death, wheel of fortune, etc.

The Devil does not represent a person or metaphysical entity. The Devil is purely metaphorical. He appears to hold the man and woman captive, but they look complacent, and the tethers are big, loose loops that thé y could easily lift over their heads. The Devil actually represents being a prisoner of your own device, blaming your problems on a situation you could easily get out of---if you wanted to.

The Emperor represents someone who brings order, the rule of law, source of stability for civilization, not just power. So it does fit Caedmon, but definitely not the selfish, cruel and capricious Apollo.

We have a glimpse of Anthony's underlying seriousness and sensible nature at the convocation ball in 1890, when he bends the rules for Mircea, allowing Cassie to stay but making Mircea responsible.

The Emperor is also something of a father figure. Like many strong fathers, Anthony has weakened his Senate family by imposing order (using LC) at the expense of initiative and courage.

To really understand the tarot, you need to start with the Rider Waite deck, because it is the richest in metaphysical imagery. The best book to start with is The Complete Book of Tarot, by Juliet Sharman-Burke.

Once you have memorized the meanings from that book, you need to start reading for strangers and getting feedback.

Then you can start studying other important tarot courses, such as the books of Rachel Pollack, a therapist who uses the Tarot in her work.

You can't fully understand the tarot without absorbing it and using it, and until you internalize the Rider Waite, mixing in other decks, even most of the decks that are based on it, will just confuse you.

Once you internalize the Rider Waite, though, there are some very strong decks, such as the Cosmic Tarot and the Medieval Scapini that can be very valuable, including some decks that depend on visual references to the R-W for their meaning, such as the Alice in Wonderland tarot.

The major arcana of the R-W were conceived by AE Waite, one of the towering metaphysicists of his era, and the deck was executed by the brilliant Pamela Colman-Smith, another metaphysical adept, who was the genius who first conceived the idea of creating picture cards for the minor arcana, thus allowing them to display a wealth of imagery just like the major arcana.

The tarot is a tool for accessing the wealth of knowledge to which our normally only our unconscious mind has access. Though often exploited for fortune telling, the tarot is a tool for spiritual growth, but not all decks work.

Many decks are simply pretty or clever, but the designers don't understand how tarot works.

The unconscious/subconscious mind deals in imagery. By providing pictures rich in metaphysical imagery, the RW allows the reader to lightly trance out and let whichever images catch her/his eye at once convey the relevant messages from the subconscious for the person getting the reading.

That is how the same card can carry so many different, even conflicting, meanings at different times.

As for KC 's implication that we all go through every stage of the Fool's journey, in order, that is just way oversimplified. The first few cards can represent people at different stages, but there are many more meanings, and later cards represent situations that may or may not apply to everyone on different levels.

The tarot is not simple or superficial; it is very deep. That is why it can work so well if respected as a tool for spiritual insight and why it has survived for so many centuries.

NOTE: Many decks are labeled "tarot" that are not even close. Some may be decent oracles, but don't confuse them with tarot.

For starters, if it doesn't have 78 cards, it isn't really tarot. Even if it does, it may be simply an art deck, where someone tried to force a bunch of pretty pictures into a tarot framework. Those are not *reading* decks; they are collectibles.

Many psychics say they don't need cards to do readings. True, but a deck like RW helps access much more detail and boosts accuracy. Poor decks, though, can make reading more difficult and less accurate.

So start with the RW, study the best authorities, practice reading for lots of others, and then be flexible.

I hope that helps.

By the way, even a novice can give a good reading by truly dedicating herself/himself to being of service to the person being read for, even is the message you give is not one they want to hear.

Cassie gave real readings to people who just wanted to be entertained and flattered, and they often rejected them. Happens in real life, too.


message 86: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments Wow that is an impressive essay, lol! You clearly spent a lot of time studying the fine nuances and implications of this, although you managed to create 6 straight up "matches" in your previous post, so it can't be that hard to try to relate the keywords of the cards to certain characters. To me, it seemed to be what KC was doing too - a 'simplified' approach as you say - the 'Moon' card came up in Hunt the Moon, where they found out about Artemis, etc... It reminded me of an old post by KC where she mentioned the star signs of some characters - I can't quite remember, but Cassie might have been a Gemini? Louis-Cesare was Capricorn, Mircea Libra, and Dory and Pritkin shared on Aries / Aquarius respectively, I honestly can't remember which... but I thought it was a really cool idea to add that info to her characters, though noone really considered it a proper astrological analysis, more like just a loose association of marginally related characteristics.


message 87: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments When attributing a specific card to a specific person, the fave cards of the Minor arcana are usually a better bet, and the directly correlate with astrology. Just don't fall into the trap of trying to match cards with hair color.

But different cards apply to the same person in different situations right now, as well as in different eras of their lives---especially the Majors. For example Mircea is not the Emperor in relation to Cleo or Caedmon.


message 88: by Kathleen (new)

Kathleen Gresham (kathleengresham) | 2637 comments Not "fave", *face* cards, the page, knight, queen, king.

Thanks, Android!


message 89: by [deleted user] (new)

A possible Easter egg lurks in EtN, in a thought Cassie has as (1793) Pritkin and (future) Mircea are fighting over the Codex or map. She wants to stop the fight before either one is killed. Her thinking follows:

"Mircea rarely lost his temper, but when he did, it was scary. I'd already seen it twice and really didn't want another demonstration. Especially since Pritkin couldn't die tonight. Neither of these men knew it, but one day, they would work together to make some pretty impressive history. Some of which would be mine."

Pritkin and Mircea working together? In some of Cassie's history? Zounds! I see a plot twist ahead! Will Pritkin take up his responsibilities in the demon realm? Will Mircea lead the vampires as supreme consul? Oh, or could Pritkin lead the demons AND the Silver Council? My mind boggles at the possibilities!

Is this leading to a Cassie standing alone as a super-strong Pythia? Maybe as a special concession to Pritkin's and Mircea's heroic efforts, each is given a time waiver. Mircea gets a HEA with Elena (or at least saves her from impalement) and Pritkin gets a "do-over" with his wife. Maybe she lives and gets a power boost from him, enough to be able to live in Hell as she wished. Leaving Pritkin to Cassie, of course.

What other possibilities does anyone see?


message 90: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments Huh, I never considered that bit a hint towards a future storyline, but anything is possible! :O You have interesting ideas, it's good to hear someone ponder about the books especially now when updates are kinda slow.

I think Mardsden was pegged as a likely candidate for dying in another thread, so there could very well be some exciting changes in the Silver Circle's leadership - Pritkin is obviously 'man enough for the job', though he would need his attitude readjusted... maybe embrace his superhero status and get on with the "RAH, I'm Merlin, rally to me, rah!" routine :D

As for Mircea, I'm all for the 'he's hung up about something - have him fix it' plan, though I have no idea what and how it would work. Maybe his Pythia-interest is not about his past at all, but the future... though my gut is going with the Elena or Dory theory. Fingers crossed for a resolution / closure though.

Also (not sure who's idea it was originally) but there is a C+P+M threesome theory floating around here somewhere :D, so that could also be the 'work together' bit, lol.

And Cassie is already kinda totally badass, she just doesn't know it (or can't really play the game very well), but in the last book she seemed more determined so perhaps she'll start taking charge and get stuff done. On that note, anybody else feel frustrated with Cassie sometimes? xD She has so much potential, so I don't know how much more avoidance and shuffling around she'll need to go through before she establishes herself as the 'best Pythia ever'.


message 91: by [deleted user] (new)

@Zoltan

Don't encourage me. I just reread the moment when Pritkin made his vow of protection to Cassie as Pythia. The last part of the oath is Easter-eggish, in that it held as long as she remained true to the ideals. It seems a difference of opinion as to her remaining true to Pythian ideals could divide Cassie and Pritkin, and lead him to disavow her.

I hope KC isn't taking that path, but the extended wait for RtW gives too much time for anxious ly mulling over possible plot hints.


message 92: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments You're right, that's a possible interpretation, though at the time of the oath, Pritkin had more cause to be weary of Cassandra... but I think he "got to know her" better now... lol, he's totally into her.

As for disagreements, I don't know for what purpose Cassie would break her principles so badly that it makes Pritkin turn away from her, it would have to be pretty drastic. And she's already broken regulations several times, not in the least to save him, actually! But it would be interesting to see a philosophical difference emerge, if only because it seems so unlikely at this point that those 2 won't end up as HEA.

But for the Pythia part, I don't think Cassie will remain Pythia for long. On one hand, because it would make sense to have a "she came to us in a time of war, turned out to be a godess, restored balance, then left" kinda saviour arc (lol) and on the other, I think she already found her successor.


message 93: by Kristen (new)

Kristen | 1074 comments I also keep thinking of what Casanova told Cassie when he told her she had a geis put on her and explained what it was. How afraid he was when he found out it was Mircea that had it placed. He told her Mircea was the greastest master manipulator and to do whatever he says (or that was the gist of it), and when Cassie got uppity about it he said something about it not getting any better then this and having ringside tickets to Mircea vs Cassie as the new reigning pythia. I really need to go back and look at that scene because it sounded like part of a prophecy for the future otherwise why add it.

Marlowe said the consul was worried about how quickly Mircea was accumulating power. He has plenty of power and status of his own, with his name, Radu, Dory, and LC, along with a close association with her greatest rival Ming-de and now a pythia loyal and marked by him? At first it was as if they were happy to have a pythia tied to a member of their senate and therefore their consul, but I wonder if Snakes would be more relieved if Cassie ended her association for whatever reason with Mircea?

Also Marlowe explained to Cassie in one of the shorts when she was receiving gifts what the people sending them wanted in return and how previous pythias responded, coincidence he was also the one featured with Mircea at Tony's when Cassie caught a snippet of their conversation where Marlowe asked Mircea about all the gifts he was sending the pythias through the years and if it was on the senates behalf why so many undocumented visits, especially with one he visited before even joining their senate? Nothing or Something? Though if Marlowe or the Consul really wanted to relieve Mircea of his part in Cassie's life on a personal basis, I'm sure there are quite a few things they could tell her to at least put a strain on their bond, if not an outright shove. Unless Mircea outsmarted both of them in that aspect and in a way kept his hands clean they'd have nothing to tell her that would emotionally bother her or have her break her allegiance with him, yet keep it with the NA for the war.


cristel-is-reading | 410 comments @Kristen: Well, there's always the Dory issue, though we don't know how much do Marlowe and Cleo know about which information does Mircea hide from Cassie. Maybe they think she knows and therefore don't see it as a tool to upset her.


cristel-is-reading | 410 comments Hey, guys! I remember there has been some discussion about whether Cassie can or can't travel to the future. I don't remember the thread, but I think I may have found something and it wouldn't be out of place here...
Well, remember in HtM, the scene when she's trying to age the apple? Couldn't that be a hint? I mean, if she can fast forward something like that, manipulate something's time in a localized way with a time bubble instead of jumping... I mean, we saw it can work both ways (when she de-aged Jules). I know it doesn't necessarily follow but, couldn't it mean that maybe her other power works in a similar way, thus allowing her to jump in both directions? After all, both abilities have to do with time, and are closely related. I have no idea how would that work, though...


message 96: by Zoltan (new)

Zoltan Makacs | 549 comments I think it was asked in a Q&A, and KC has neither confirmed nor denied it, while making vague references such as "you'll see" or "well... plot..." or something - which is pretty much an admission on her part that it's a spoiler and very probable to happen! So you may be on to something! That's also on my looong list of "things I'd like to find out more about";D.


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