Valar Morghulis--Valar Dohaeris discussion
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A Dance with Dragons
A Song of Ice and Fire
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Mach
(last edited Oct 22, 2012 03:57PM)
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Oct 22, 2012 03:56PM
Actually only Sansa looks like a Tully and of all the kids Jon resembles Ned the most. That's one of the reasons Catelyn hates him so much.
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Mach wrote: "Actually only Sansa looks like a Tully and of all the kids Jon resembles Ned the most. That's one of the reasons Catelyn hates him so much."I thought that Robb, Sansa, Rickon, and Bran all had Tully red hair and that only Arya looked like Ned and John...
I'm with Joan on this. Because Robbs red tinted beard is often described by Catelyn. Not to sure about Rickon though, I can't really recall his physical description being described in any of the books. :/ But she does use Jon's resemblence of Ned as another excuse to hate him. Quite frankly, I despise Catelyn, and am still upset she was brought back as Stoneheart or whatever her new lame name is. She was spiteful towards Jon when in reality if she was so upset about Ned fathering a bastard then she should have been hostile towards Ned and not Jon. Then there's all the other damage she has caused to Robb and his men. Ugg, whatever, I'll stop there before I bore you all with my droll nagging.
Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark? Meh I don't buy it. Personally I think Jon is Neds boy and it'll be some kind of, like father like son parallel between Ned and Robb. Only Ned, choosing honour over love, chose Catelyn over the other woman. Then that woman killed herself leaving Ned with the Baby.
William wrote: "Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark? Meh I don't buy it. Personally I think Jon is Neds boy and it'll be some kind of, like father like son parallel between Ned and Robb. Only Ned, choosing honour o..."IDK, I have lots of reasons to believe that Jon is Lyanna's son and not Ned's. (In the show) Ned never said that Jon was his son...just that Jon was of his blood. Ned'sense of fidelity and honor to keep a promise to his dying sister.
Lyanna had been missing over a year and found dying, in a bed of blood at the Tower of Joy. In the House of the Undying, most of Dany's visions were of Starks and Targs (the three-headed dragon, Rhaegar wanted a third child to fulfill that prophecy). Most stand out to me, why were the Kingsguard not with prince Viserys when Rhaegar was killed but at the ToJ...they were there to guard the king.
R+L=J...it's speculation, sure. But it's knda fun.
Joan wrote: "William wrote: "Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark? Meh I don't buy it. Personally I think Jon is Neds boy and it'll be some kind of, like father like son parallel between Ned and Robb. Only Ned, c..."I do know what you mean and I don't doubt that it's possible. I mean who knows? I would never have believed that it was Lysa and Littlefinger who killed Jon Aryn but there you go. Besides, it may not even matter. With the personal vendetta GRRM has seemingly taken up against the Starks, for all I know Jon doesn't survive the Nights Watch Mutiny. He probably will but I Havent been able to let myself trust again since Robb Stark!
the next book will see Jon Snow: Ghost Dog. at least i hope so! i want more warg-type activities.
I'm hoping for the warg too.Ned having a bastard is too mundane. He wouldn't have been all hush hush about it if that were the case. He was quiet to protect someone or their honor, so Jon being Lyanna's kid would make sense. Especially since Robert was hell-bent on killing all Targaryens, that baby would have been killed right then and there.
I don't think it matters who Jon's real parents were since only Ned had that info and he's too dead to talk.
yeah, the Rhaegar-Lyanna idea seems obvious to me at this point. GRRM appears to have put a lot of effort (subtle, but it is all over the books) in making this eventually be the reveal. cause he's gonna be riding the dragons with Dany and Tyrion! i hope.
And for the fact that R+L=J has been so obvious, it's what's making me think that it cannot be that either. Honestly, I don't know. GRRM is not what I could ever call predictable or obvious.
GRRM is tricksy but he did say that he wouldn't change the outcome of a plotline just because readers guessed the twist. It's just that I would love for Jon Snow to be the third head of the dragon. Robb did legimize Jon. If only Howland Reed would make a POV appearance in Winds of Winter to reveal what all transpired at the TOJ.
Though I don't think the little Lannister gargoyle is the third head. Aegon/LG is probably a Blackfyre if he's not the real Aegon.
oh, a Blackfyre! i had not even considered that.the only reasons i'm thinking Tyrion is the 3rd head is because: (1) i really like him and want it to be so! and (2) there was some vague but hint-filled stuff that's been talked about in ADWD (and maybe earlier) about his heritage. but either i don't remember the specifics or i tuned out while reading.
Hodor probably knows all the answers. Wouldn't you like to see his POV chapter?
but it would all just say HODOR! HODOR? HODOR!
It's what he doesn't say that's important. Errr...
I sometimes wonder if authors read topics like this & change things just to screw with us - or maybe pick up ideas.
I'm kinda scared of Hodor, isn't he a Frey?
i dunno. but if he is... Stoneheart stay away from Hodor!
Yes, he is.I'd like to see them kill enough Freys that Hodor becomes Lord of the Twins.
Wait..that's never been confirmed, actually. Old Nan said his real name was Walder, and we just assumed that meant he was a Frey.Because honestly, who the hell else would name a child Walder?
Wait a damn minute. GRRM, you sly bastard....Hodor is the third head of the dragon!
Chris wrote: "Wait a damn minute. GRRM, you sly bastard....Hodor is the third head of the dragon!"
Then that means ran can just warg Hodor-dragon and Bran becomes the third dragonhead!
Wasn't there some discussion about whether Tyrion could possibly be the third head of the dragon from the "a small man might throw a very large shadow"- line in GOT + some grumbling over whether Tyrion really could be related to the other glamorous Lannisters? Either by Cersei or Tywin, or both, I'm getting a little foggy on the details. I'm guessing Targaryens being Targaryens Daenerys might just marry Aegon, and there's your third head, Mummer's Dragon or no. :P
