Which Fantasy Author Did You Find Most Disappointing? Showing 251-300 of 1,088

[Matthew]

He may, indeed, consider that centrism. From his point of view it may very well be, which is rather scary in itself.

[Mike (the Paladin)]

Alexandra Victoria let me council consideration in terms. Actually I consider myself a Christian "fundamentalist". The term of course can be debated but I've been unwilling to let others define terms for me. (would you want a doctor who didn't practice "medical fundamentals?)

And right wing? Well, I'm politically conservative, don't know if you would consider me "right wing" or not. But whatever, I don't "hate" you, anyone, or any "group" I'm aware of.

Disagreement is fine and to be expected (many times I've taken the position with someone that we should just agree to disagree) and I stay out of most of these discussions unless they are on/in a thread actually dedicated to that sort of thing. Still, hate a bit strong and I don't think, at least I hope you didn't mean it "literally".

The only part of this conversation I ever got into up to now was to express the idea that one ought to read a book before condemning it, rather than condemning it because of a political or whatever disagreement with the author.

[[deleted user]]

At risk of derailing the conversation entirely, I will simply say that I've yet to meet somebody who is both right wing and a religious fundamentalist that I've liked.

[Mike (the Paladin)]

Well, that's fine. I can accept that you may not like me...though you don't really know me. Dislike and disagree differ from "hate". That was my only point.

Though I have many friends with whom I disagree and while I'm conservative my sister claims to be a socialist. We disagree but we still get along.

Have a good one.

[[deleted user]]

Well said, Mike. "grins". See, Jason? I was good this time!

[mark]

um, er....i like both of you! perhaps that makes me a centrist.

[Matthew]

For me, both "politically conservative" and "fundamentalist" are such broad terms that they in themselves only very roughly define an individual. Over 40% of the voting electorate votes Republican even in a bad year, and in some parts of the country, much higher; even if not all of those are actually "politically conservative", we're still talking about a third of the country.

"Fundamentalist", in the end, only describes someone who believes that their take on their religion involves what they consider the fundamentals of their faith. Obviously, there's a lot of room for disagreement on what those actually are and how they should translate into opinion, action and behavior. It tends to imply a conservative viewpoint, but there's a lot of room there, too.

So I don't know much about someone who identifies as that except they probably voted republican (but possibly with misgivings) and they're serious about being a Christian.

I'd note, also, that if you're not in a group you quite possibly notice only those that stand out, which are more likely to be the ones who vocally express positions you disagree with.

[[deleted user]]

Different people, different strokes. I don't know you well enough to hate you, and in the context that I know you (discussing fantasy books), I am mostly neutral. If we start talking abortion, I can guarantee I'd hate you five posts into that. I am very passionate about politics.

Anyway, the point of my original post was that Ender's Game didn't much offend me since it was apolitical, and a decent enough kid's SF book. Empire, on the other hand, is offensively political, and it doesn't help that I disagree with his politics. I kind of like Sanderson - not as a person, though, after listening to his podcast; I couldn't stand the guys running that after listening to a few minutes of their banter - but he's not a bad writer, at least based on Mistborn. Not great, but not bad. I can look past it if it isn't intrusive, and mostly, Sanderson isn't. He's also not half as vocal about his less-than-agreeable POVs.

[[deleted user]]

*sigh* It's saddening to see someone so young throw around hatred so nonchalantly. Hatred is a strong word. A strong emotion. I've found that those that use the word the most often have had the least experience with true hatred in life. I can't imagine that you'd be willing to guarantee hatred of someone over something so paltry as having an opposing view to your own. Passion is well and good but passion to the point of rage and blindness is dangerous beyond description.

I'm not trying to be patronizing, Alexandra. I respect that you're very outspoken (I certainly am) and I think you're very well read and intelligent, especially so to be only 19. However, your opinion could certainly stand to be tempered with some tact.

I'm a Christian. I'm a conservative. I don't vote blindly down any line so I wouldn't go so far as to say I'm a republican but I certainly lean in that direction. I'm pro-life, anti-gun control, pro immigration and think that welfare is the most godawful, abused, destructive instituion in existence. You may be completely and utterly counterpoint to me in every way and I suspect that in most respects you are, but no matter how viscerally you oppose my viewpoints or disrespect my or others "fundamentals" I wouldn't hate you. I reserve hatred for those truly worthy of it.

[Matthew]

It's worth keeping in mind, though, that such reactions often stem from severely bad encounters with individuals who identified thus. It's the same for all of us, no matter what groupings we may belong to/identify with; it's the assholes and the nuts that people remember.

[[deleted user]]

Fine, fine. I don't respect anyone who is pro-life or anti-gay marriage, specifically. Happy, now?

[[deleted user]]

Lol..not really :) But I still like you despite your not respecting me ;)

Matthew, I couldn't agree more. It's the worst from any side that always seem to leave the deepest impression. That says something rather sad about all of us.

[Jason]

For myself, I'm so far left I'm even left handed. LOL Bad joke, I know.

But I judge people for their merrits as an individual. Not for their beliefs or politics. Of course, I might disagree with people about these topics. But that's life. I'd bet that I disagree with just about every person on this planet about at least one thing, if not ten.

[[deleted user]]

Jason wrote: "For myself, I'm so far left I'm even left handed. LOL Bad joke, I know.

But I judge people for their merrits as an individual. Not for their beliefs or politics. Of course, I might disagree with..."

I agree, but I think there are issues we all hold dear enough that its hard to like somebody who feels the same way. What one person sees as being a relative nonissue, another sees as utterly life-shattering. To me, being pro-life is as bad as being an anti-semite.

Anyway, how about those fantasy authors? I noticed someone mentioned Anne Bishop up there. Can't say I disagree, although I wasn't expecting too much going in.

[[deleted user]]

Heh agreed on the bad joke!

Also couldn't agree more strongly with your outlook. Heck, my best friend in life is a Mexican sumo wrestler named Brandon. He's a staunch atheist, uber left liberal, pro choice, pro universal healthcare, pro pretty much everything I dont believe in. Only thing we agree on is that we love each other like brothers.

Good enough.

[Jason]

Grant wrote: "Only thing we agree on is that we love each other like brothers."

And that's all that matters in the end. I have friends who are my polar opposites too.

[carol. , Senor Crabbypants]

So. Speaking of disappointing... The discussion on religion and authors actually reminded me of C.S. Lewis, and how I had loved The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe as a child, but felt the series went downhill from there. I haven't been back to revisit as an adult.

Lady D. deserves a shout out for mentioning Anita Blake as uber disappointing. It was one of my first forays into urban fantasy. Loved the strong heroine, the idea of raising the dead, the mysteries... and then it turned into sexcapades. Now she's an auto-pass instead of buy.

Anne Bishop is another one I was only forcing myself to read because she seems to be part of the lists for modern fantasy greats. So she fits 'disappointing' as well.

And dare I say it? Oh yes, I will. Eon Dragoneye was a disappointment, especially as it was recommended as a monthly read in another group. I was hoping for something... more.

[Vivian]

I'm glad to see others who aren't big fans of Bishop. The first one (Black Jewels) was a DNF for me, and though I've been encouraged to give it another go, haven't felt the need to.

[Maggie]

I am very pro-choice (though it is probably more accurate to say I am pro-birth control). The earth is way too over-populated for people to be having kids thay don't want in the first place. (Come to work with me one day if you do not understand this statement) However, I would NEVER use the word hate to describe my feelings toward people who don't agree. I'm sure they had their own backgrounds and experience and faith to come to those decisions. I just do not agree.


Anyway-I do HATE gratuitous sex scenes. I am in no way shape or form a prude, but if there is one stuck in their with only a vague relation to the plot, I will get really annoyed really quickly. So I quit Blake and refuse to read Bishop for that reason. I kinda thought about reading Kushiel....but not with that cover! lol

[MrsJoseph *grouchy*, *good karma*]

Hatred is a strong word that only the young toss around casually. I reserve my hatred for people who truely deserve it - those that sow hate, murderers, child molesters, violent offenders, child molesters, racists (and politicians ).

Differing opinions are just that - differing opinions. I have learned that everyone has a different opinion based upon their environment. It takes a lot to look inside yourself and realize that you do not have all the answers and that others have the right to their own opinions as well.




Maggie, Maggie, Maggie... I thought we agreed to cover a HB in a brown paper bag and draw unicorns and rainbows on it? With a heavy sprinkling of glitter IIRC... What happened? The plan was perfect! :-)

[MrsJoseph *grouchy*, *good karma*]

LOL! I agree...

[Jason]

Ah...yes, people who talk at the theater. I hate them. HATE them...

[Bets]

mark wrote: "nice rant! i appreciate your comments a lot.

although i am curious, where have you seen mormon agendas being aggressively enacted in fantasy? i just can't think of any. i've mentioned before my ..."

Twilight. I suppose it is light, but I found it annoying

[Bets]

Jason wrote: "I haven't really seen any religious, Mormon or otherwise, agendas in fantasy, either. Actually, when I found out that Orson Scott Card was a Mormon, I was surprised. Same with Sanderson.

If it'..."

If you know some of the Mormon beliefs, you can trace his ennactment of them in his series. The fact Ender starts out at eight years old isn't random. However, I didn't see his work as an agenda so much as a conscious or not, using the tools and beliefs he had that happened to infuse his work. We all have our slants.

[Jason]

Well said, Nicki!

[Maggie]

Thank you Nikki-
I have differing views depending on the perpective I guess. I personally would NEVER have an abortion--even to save my own life. I firmly beleive that the fetus is a life and I do not have that right. However, in the bigger picture the government needs to look at all the issues, and until we solve over-population and child abuse, making abortions illegal would create way more problems. I do not beleive it is the role of the government to take on a decision like that either, but when it comes down to it, I think I agree with Roe v. Wade, with the trimester for a government stance.

[Mach]

Here in Norway abortion has been legal since 1964 and none of the political parties are against it. I think it's a little strange that there are so many against it in the US. I'ts not even a political subject here, while in the US people are marching in the streets to protest. The Catholic church and many other christian groups have been against abortion from the beginning and i think when you live in a country like the US where religion is a big part of the community, it's easy to learn to be against abortion. While here in most european country's, where we have grown up with abortion being legal, it's not something we think about or have anything against.

[Bill]

MrsJoseph wrote: "Alvin was my first meeting with Card and it left a sour (bored) taste in my mouth. Everyone keeps saying that Ender is great but I was so bored by Alvin that I haven't been able to pick them up."

Totally agree about Alvin. The poor book still sits uncompleted somewhere.

But the Ender series and Ender's Shadow series are superb SF. I wish someone besides Card has written it, but there it is.

I just started John Scalzi's series beginning with Old Man's War which is a delight, especially for anyone over 50. Some fun!

[Maggie]

MiniComm is coming up in a couple weeks, and John Scalzi is the guest of honor this year so I really want to go see him...if my real life wasn't so hectic!

[Maggie]

MrsJoseph wrote: "Maggie, Maggie, Maggie... I thought we agreed to cover a HB in a brown paper bag and draw unicorns and rainbows on it? With a heavy sprinkling of glitter IIRC... What happened? The plan was perfect! :-) "

Except I have a middle-schooler in my house who would think it was hers, remember? That would defeat the whole purpose of hiding the cover!

[Mach]

I am reading Old Man's War right now, it's good!

[MrsJoseph *grouchy*, *good karma*]

Maggie wrote: Except I have a middle-schooler in my house who would think it was hers, remember? That would defeat the whole purpose of hiding the cover!"

LOL!

That's when you put in big black bold print: "STAY OUT! and this means YOU"

Ummm, I think this might be a job for an ebook version... and a password?

[Bets]

I do have friends who are more conservative than me. But not many. I am pro-choice. Not saying I'd have one myself, but abortion has basically been part of culture and history forever. The question is, is it legal and safe, or illegal and harming and killing women?

I have a lot of gay friends. Actually, my aunt is gay and so was my minister when I was a kid, so I was pretty incredulous anti-gay sentiments even existed.

The only problem I have with welfare is that, yes, it is poorly handled. Meaning that it does not help people enough but sends them into a cycle of living in poverty without a way out. It needs to be amped, not destroyed. It is one percent of our budget anyway, so I have no idea why people get so excited about it.

I believe in universal health care. I have known people in pretty ugly straights due to the bloated private health care and insurance system.

I don't hate Republicans or fundamentalists blindly, and obviously i don't hate them in a blanket sense, but these beliefs HURT people. They HURT people I know and love. I don't put up with people hurting people I love. It hurts me, and it should hurt everyone in the human spirit.

Yes, by the way. I'm Christian.

[Mike (the Paladin)]

Machavelli, I read Old Man's War back when it came out and though it an excellent science fiction read (I like a lot of military science fiction). Unfortunately the sequel(s) didn't snag me as much. I still have the third one (The Last Colony) sitting on my shelf waiting.

Hi guys. Just wanted to say that I have strong beliefs and feeling s about the things being discussed. I think what I do for reasons...but I don't think this is the place to go into it. Mild or strong disagreements about this type of subject can override anything else. So, don't interpret my silence as being "uncaring" I'm just going to keep my council as they say. I discuss things like these in other spots.

So, okay, carry on.

[Jason]

I guess you could say I'm pro choice. I think it's ultimately up to the woman. Since it's her body, it's her business.

I live in Canada, so welfare is probably different. I'm not sure. But, here in Canada, I've seen a lot of people take advantage of our welfare system. What it comes down to is that some people actually need welfare, while others simply don't want to work. I've known these people who don't want to work. They'll do anything not to work. It's sad.

[mark]

i'm a political person, way to the left of things. i'm extremely left-wing & consider democrats to be moderate. hell i've protested and been arrested more times than i can list off-hand, for everything including the gulf wars, the WTO, gay rights, the right to give food to the homeless in public places, the right to protest, police brutality, etc, etc, blah blah blah.

that said, i turn that part of myself off in many places in my life. when i'm with many of my relatives for example. or with old friends from orange county or my many friends & family who are in the military. or even in GoodReads groups. i've never been the kind of political person who is angry with folks on a personal level. i believe in what i believe in and i'm willing to fight and go to jail for it. at the same time, i like to think of myself as a person who loves people as well as my ideals, and people are so much more than a set of some opinions that i may vehemently agree or disagree with (although a little light debating doesn't hurt, or shouldn't at least). i just focus on the sides that i enjoy and try not to engage too much with the opinions that i disagree with. everyone has their reasons, and if someone believes strongly in the opposite of what i believe, i'm not going to judge them for it or attack their beliefs.

it is only when people actively hurt folks with their actual actions, and on a lesser level, actively degrade my ideals and/or groups of people, that i feel the need to get aggressive and to judge. but in my experience, it doesn't ever have to get to that if folks respect each other on a basic, human level. decency is neither a left-wing nor a right-wing concept, and folks with all sorts of beliefs can be decent people. i'll respect someone just for being a human being and will assume that there is decency there. well at least until i'm proven wrong.

[Jason]

Very well said, Mark! I especially liked this part:

decency is neither a left-wing or a right-wing concept, and folks with all sorts of beliefs can be decent people.

[C.M.]

MrsJoseph wrote: "LOL! I understand, I so understand."

Years ago when I discovered the Ender series, I loved it;mI actually read Speaker for the Dead first, and I thought the concept of species transmutation was brilliant.

After many years I re-read the series a few years ago, and this time the political/religious underpinnings became more clear. "Family values" shouted loud and clear, maybe because I'm much more aware of the catchphrase it's become.

I still like Card. He has terrific imagination and at times shows a deep understanding of people and in some of the Ender books, a profound understanding of the interconnection of all life. However, even though I'm a big rereader of books I like, I don't think I'll visit his series again.

[MrsJoseph *grouchy*, *good karma*]

I guess I struck out by running into Alvin first.

But with so many good books out there - and so many good books that I haven't read yet that I own - I find it hard to give Card a 2nd look.

[Traci]

Card's books are hit & miss with me. Loved the first few a Ender books. But they get really weird. Being in love with his sister...it's slight but definately there. But I think the line for me was when one character became three. The last Ender book released did nothing for me. I like the Bean books but they're political. Lost Boys has a very slow pace but the ending made it up to me. I actually cried at the end, that's rare for me. I hated Empire. But I did really enjoy his newest Pathfinder. I haven't read the Alvin books & probably won't now until I have read every thing else I want...which means never. :)

[MrsJoseph *grouchy*, *good karma*]

And even then it will be too soon.

[Bets]

Jason wrote: "I guess you could say I'm pro choice. I think it's ultimately up to the woman. Since it's her body, it's her business.

I live in Canada, so welfare is probably different. I'm not sure. But, here..."

Mike (the Paladin) wrote: "Machavelli, I read Old Man's War back when it came out and though it an excellent science fiction read (I like a lot of military science fiction). Unfortunately the sequel(s) didn't sn..."

Jason wrote: "I guess you could say I'm pro choice. I think it's ultimately up to the woman. Since it's her body, it's her business.

I live in Canada, so welfare is probably different. I'm not sure. But, here..."

Jason wrote: "I guess you could say I'm pro choice. I think it's ultimately up to the woman. Since it's her body, it's her business.

I live in Canada, so welfare is probably different. I'm not sure. But, here..."

Mike (the Paladin) wrote: "Machavelli, I read Old Man's War back when it came out and though it an excellent science fiction read (I like a lot of military science fiction). Unfortunately the sequel(s) didn't sn..."


That's sort of the definition of pro choice--that it is up to the woman. Honestly it would take some dire circumstances for me to consider one, but I'm not saying never. I've also known a few people who had a really ugly choice either way. I respect what they decided--either way.

As for welfare--yeah. I obviously know the American system. I've never been on it, but I grew up in a blue collar community with friends--children who needed it. Overwhelmingly, those I have known on welfare have needed it. Even when it seems like they just don't want to work, if you spend some time with them, you realize transportation issues, child care issues (welfare does not pay), the fact that the only jobs they can get are minimum wage but if they take that job their welfare will be renigged, and that minimum wage job will not support them--will not be enough, health, and very often mental health issues, which are not immediately understandable, are overwhelming. Again, different in Canada, but for the amount of money we spend on killing people, we really spend nothing on helping people.

[Jason]

I've known people who need it, too, as I also live/grew up with blue collar workers in a small town.

But I've also known people who take advantage of welfare. In Canada, if you have two family members living together, both cannot be on welfare. You also, while on welfare, have to be actively looking for a job. At least, this is the way it was about 10 or 15 years ago. I'm not sure what the rules are now. They are no doubt different.

Back then I knew a guy who lived with his mother. They worked around it so that they both got welfare, saying that he wasn't related to the mother and was simply a tenant, renting out the basement. Instead of actively looking for a job, he'd go into a restaurant or any other place of potential employment and ask if they could sign the paper he carried around with him for proof of his searching for employment (something they used to make people on welfare do). He spent at least half of his days drinking and playing guitar. His sleeping pattern always changed. He lived like almost like a reclusive, eccentric rich dude. LOL

I've known and heard of other people like this, as well. It's sad, because they're taking advantage of a good thing. And when too many people get caught doing this, it makes it harder for the people who actually need welfare to get it.

[MrsJoseph *grouchy*, *good karma*]

Here in America it's a family killer. Most families cannot get on welfare if there is a working age male living in the house-hold. As a Southerner I can understand this - to a point...men are (mostly) physically stronger and have the ability to do more - but in the reality it breaks up families.


I don't know the cure (except education) but I sorrow for those who have been harmed. I am lucky to have come from a line of strong individuals.

[Maggie]

Where I work welfare is really prevalent, and I think a big part of the problem is that people who are 'raised in it' really dont know any other way to live. and as Cicada said, there are all sorts of ancillary issues which come out of it that make getting off of it even harder.

Here in Minnesota there is a five year limit to being on welfare, but this can be tolled for people trying to escape a violent relationship. Well, the people who are taking advantage of the situation just shuffle kids around from one relative to another, depending on who is still eligible, and then go get orders of protection against each other. It is a full time job to keep youself on welfare!

[Traci]

Iam from California & my single mother was on welfare. She did everything right. Didn't spend the money on any luxury items for herself alone. And as soon as she didn't qualify anymore she got dumped. My aunt, her sister, also on welfare used her money to support a drug addiction & she was on it for years. Also I know of women who have babies & keep having them for the welfare money. So I've seen both sides. I am not against it but it does need better regulation.
Regarding reading authors that I disagree with. I respect not giving money to an author because of strongly held beliefs. But my world would be boring if I only read like minded people. And I would never have learned to understand another side to my opinions.

[Mike (the Paladin)]

In a way this is against my better judgement. I've seen political, religious, and philosophical discussions spin WAY out of control...but here I am. :)

Back in the Carter years I lived in a state that had HUGE unemployment, some counties actually hit 50% unemployed. I myself was laid off (I'd been working construction at the time) after which I found another job which lasted a year and I was laid off again. From that point for 5 years I found only part term or temporary work. I had 2 small children at the time and wife was never healthy. We never got "welfare" per se, but did move into subsidized housing and got food stamps. I found that once I accepted the help it was next to impossible to get away from it. I don't mean "they" did anything to keep anyone on the program, I knew people who lost help for seemingly arbitrary reasons. I mean that there were all kinds of problems surviving to get back on a self reliant footing. Getting a job ended your aid, right away. There was no "step down". You couldn't survive in the transition period. If you got a temporary job, that income would get you booted, the same with part time income. The working poor face the biggest challenge as it's possible to make too much to get any help. but not enough to live.

Personally I think the problem is that it's government run. You have a bureaucracy who has to more concerned about it's rules and so on than the people they're trying to help. That's why you get cheats who get multiple payments and ALL the programs , they've learned to work the system, and on the other hand honest people who can't get help even to get back on their feet.

A lot of it goes back to the (so called) Great Depression when the foundation of "our present" welfare system was laid. My grand parents and parents lived through it. My dad always said "the churches dropped the ball". I think he was partially right. Individuals should have stepped up through the churches and "non-government" charities and filled the gap. Instead it was (and still is) easier to say, "let the government do it". Thus we "get what we've got" It's not a good solution and at this point the rules are so convoluted that the agencies are rapidly reaching (or have reached) a point where they simply can't function.

By the way for those who wonder, I worked my way through and got a tech degree at minimum wage (and less) and got a job here in Nashville where I've been for the last twenty-some years...I didn't die or anything. :)

[Amelia]

That would have been really tricky if you had died. Then we could all assume that you were also just Grant/Ala/Aloha and now Mike.

I'm glad you made it through those tough times.

I've been a little heistant to join this conversation, but I'd like to say something about the welfare issus.

In my church, we actually have a very good system of helping people back onto solid ground. In order to get any help, those who need it have to work, usually in places that prepare the food, supplies, etc.

[[deleted user]]

In my line of work, I see people who abuse welfare on a daily basis and one of the truest statements I've read so far was Maggie stating, "people who are 'raised in it' really dont know any other way to live..". Here in the deep south, it seems like a viscious cycle. I wish I could say that those who manipulated the system were in the minority here but it's not true. Those deserving hard working people like Traci's mom are by the far the minority here and while I agree with Mike that churches and non-government charities could and should have helped fill the gap, it still boils down to a rotting culture of laziness and entitlement that's dragged down what was once a good intentioned program. Ultimately, we have to find a way to change the welfare program so that those who don't deserve aid can be weeded out from those righteous individuals who the program is truly meant to aid. Mandatory Drug Testing. Community Aid Programs. Mandatory Community Work or Vocational Training. Elimination of Aid to Criminals. Even then, there's still the issue of a ridiculous budget that funds completely useless studies *seriously just google government funded studies. Ri-freaking-diculous* as well as a governmental system that does more to aid the richest of the rich than the poorest of the poor.

Sadly, there'll never be a perfect fix, but Lord knows there's a ton of misappropriated money out there that could at least get us moving in the right direction.

[MrsJoseph *grouchy*, *good karma*]

These are pretty sad things to read.

IMO I think it boils down to family - taking care of family and being a part of a family (even if its not bio). Sensei taught his family something when they saw him work his ass off to make sure they were taken care of.

When I was growing up my dad let me do whatever I wanted. If it wasn't for my best friend's family, only God knows how I would have turned out. My best friend's dad (school principal) would check my report card, yell at me if I skipped school. He would also praise me if I did well and encourge me to do better, let me stay at their house all the time...he was more of my father than my real father.

Family. So under-rated.