"War for the Oaks" Full Discussion *spoilers*

[Brad]

What do you think of Eddi and rest?

[[deleted user]]

I really liked Eddi as the lead character. Strong and independent. Her interactions with Phouka(I keep pronouncing it Fooka) were charming and funny.

Willy was alright for a Sidhe while Carla, Dan and Hedge were just barely decent secondaries.

The Queens were great and exactly as I'd thought they'd be.

[Zen]

Eddi reminds me of a character in a manga I read Nana, Volume 1.

Also, I like how the addition of fey elements doesn't disturb the underlying normalcy of Eddi's life. By this I mean that she still has a normal existence to take care of - not just a sudden transportation to fantasy-that-solves-all-problems...

[Snail in Danger (Sid)]

I never really noticed this before, possibly because the dialogue is pretty good and makes up for a lot, but Ala has a point about the characters being kinda thin.

[Zen]

Nikki wrote: "I never really noticed this before, possibly because the dialogue is pretty good and makes up for a lot, but Ala has a point about the characters being kinda thin."

What do you me by "thin"? If I understand correctly, do you mean not enough personality?

[Snail in Danger (Sid)]

Yes, that's what part of what I mean. Also there were times when I felt like I was being told rather than shown things about some of the characters' motivations or feelings.

[[deleted user]]

There just wasn't enough meat to them, for me. They were part of the band, and helped a bit at the end battle, but that was about the limit of their usefulness.

Carla, Dan and Hedge could be replaced by Tom, Dick and Jane without any change to the story. They just weren't very real to me.

[Zen]

But they weren't integral to the story! The story was about Eddi. A sort of self-centered point of view, in my opinion. That's what made it so real for me. I mean, really, if you were Eddi, how much would you really care about Tom, Dick, and Jane? Yet, your story doesn't happen in a vacuum...

[[deleted user]]

If they weren't integral to the story, why even bother having them at all? Tie some symbols to Eddi's knees, put a big drum on her back, and make her a one-woman-band.

[Zen]

Ala wrote: "If they weren't integral to the story, why even bother having them at all? Tie some symbols to Eddi's knees, put a big drum on her back, and make her a one-woman-band."

Because your story can't happen in a vacuum - think of your own life... do you really notice the people around you as much when you are experiencing drama in your life? For example: The big break-up/divorce is about you. The great roadtrip only involves two people. You have a baby by yourself...and maybe share that experience with your partner.

So, I like the fact that Bull sorta ignores the secondary characters - because that's what they are! Secondary!

[[deleted user]]

If the people in my life were as important to me as these characters were supposedly to Eddi, then yes, I would actually notice them.

They're her band. She makes sure to emphasize that fact with each of them. Which means that they must be of great import to her. Carla, in particular, is seen to act as though they were sisters.

And yet, they come off as mere set decoration. Just window dressing.

I'm not asking for each of them to be fleshed out as well as the main character, far from it. I simply prefer my secondary characters to have a bit more depth to them.

[colleen the convivial curmudgeon]

I remember liking Pooka (sp?), and I tend to like Hedge's type, though I agree the secondary characters were a bit thin. I don't remember digging Eddi that much, but I can't for the life of me remember why.

[Alvin]

Like some of the other reviewers, I also liked Eddi, but not so much in the beginning. We were able to see Eddi grow to be a strong and independent leader, and she had great chemistry with the phouka. The one issue I had was that Eddi was selected because she was supposed to be special, but she did not show a lot of special qualities until we got deeper into the book, and by then I was just not that emotionally invested in Eddi.

Although Carla, Dan, and Hedge were merely secondary characters, I felt they had color, particularly Dan and Hedge. Not necessarily depth, but were nonetheless interesting. I imagined Dan as a young George Clinton and Hedge as an emo version of George Harrison from the Beatles.

[Mariah]

I think Phouka was the best character- he was fun and added a lot of comic relief. I agree Eddi wasn't that special to begin with, but developed a lot as a character as the book went on. I liked Carla & Willy as supporting characters. The rest were basically just side-kicks.

[Sandra]

I'm starting to like them. Am only on p. 109. Can't figure out why Eddi is so special. Pouka is growing on me. Like all the secondary characters.

[Hannah ⚔️ Jaedia]

Phouka was my favourite, he was the only one who, for me, had any real character. Eddi was alright, nothing really special, just a musician who's good with lights. As Ala said, I couldn't feel much of a connection with the other characters. We were supposed to care about Carla, Dan, Hedge, Willy, and Stuart? I didn't really feel them much. We knew what they looked like, and what they did, but we didn't know them, which is kind of an important aspect to story writing - character development, without it, the story may well fall flat.

[Sandra]

I finished it last night. My review. I loved the Phouka. And I thought Willie Silver and Hedge and Meg were pretty clear and very likable. I especially liked Meg and heartily wish I had a brownie! Carla and Dan more gradually came to life.

Eddi came to life more gradually, but by the first battle she was very likable.

[Anna]

buffer




buffer

[Anna]

buffer




buffer

[Anna]

buffer




buffer

[Anna]

Buddy read starting on March 28th, so this thread will temporarily turn into a BR thread, please use spoiler tags and tell us what chapter you're talking about. Thanks!

[Meredith]

Looking forward to reading and discussing this. I've only recently started reading Urban Fantasy - or, more accurately, realizing that much of the fantasy I enjoy falls into this category. I'm excited to dig into this classic of the genre.

[Meredith]

Okay, I started reading the other day and so far I am enjoying this. I'm about 25% in, end of Chapter 6 (view spoiler)[ I like the dynamics and interactions among the characters, especially Eddi and Carla. They feel like the smart, sassy girls in every 80s movie that I grew up with, which I guess is appropriate. I wish I knew more of the songs they refer to. I was in high school when this was written, so some of the musical references are definitely hitting my nostalgia buttons. (hide spoiler)]

[Allison]

Yes!! I love how human the people feel, and adore the use of music throughout!

[Megan (The Gemini)]

Starting this today!

[Cheryl]

I very much enjoyed this when I read it last year. To me it felt entirely original and smart, as I normally don't read UF or paranormal or anything. And it definitely made me wish I was more into music!

[Meredith]

About 54%, end of chapter 12. (view spoiler)[ exciting battle! I totally knew Willy Silver was going to turn out to be fae, but missed on Hedge. Loving the sneaky plotting by the phouka and waiting to see what comes of it. (hide spoiler)]

[CBRetriever]

Cheryl wrote: "I very much enjoyed this when I read it last year. To me it felt entirely original and smart, as I normally don't read UF or paranormal or anything. And it definitely made me wish I was more into m..."

try some books by Charles de Lint as they're the same sort of Urban Fantasy.

[Kristin B.]

Meredith wrote: "About 54%, end of chapter 12. [spoilers removed]"

This tickled me because I was (view spoiler)[certain from the first moment that Hedge was Fey, but wasn't 100% sure about Willy until he showed up at the battle. I thought he might be since Phouka was ok leaving Eddi alone with him. Plus the way he was described, but it could have been misdirection on the part of the author. (hide spoiler)]

8% (view spoiler)[ I was in love with Phouka's character from the very beginning. With lines like "Indeed not. I’m to be your bodyguard, am I not? Many’s the mortal in this city who’d envy you your fine big guard dog, poppet. See?” and "Oh, what a terror I am! But puppy-gentle with my mistress.” how could you not be? (hide spoiler)]

57% (view spoiler)[“Nobody can force you to be in this band,” Eddi told him gently. “I won’t. Your queen can’t, because if your only reason for being here is her orders, I won’t take you.” When he looked dubious, she added, “I won’t. She doesn’t rule here. This is my band. She can get down on her lily-white knees and beg me to take you, and I won’t do it. But if you want to play rock ‘n’ roll with these guys, and you’ll take directions from me and leave the Seelie Court out of it—” Eddi shrugged. “Up to you.”

I loved that the band was just as important as the Faerie war. I was reading this scene and thinking "she just survived a supernatural battle and found out the dude she was sleeping with was not human, and all she cares about is the music." Just delightful. (hide spoiler)]

End(view spoiler)[This was a solid five star read for me right up until the last five percent. It felt like it wrapped up much too quickly. We didn't even really get a sense of what the Queen of Air and Darkness was trying to do. I feel like some of the earlier band practices had more depth to them than the final scene. There was no final angry confrontation with her, no true sense of how Eddi fought to keep the room. It felt rushed in comparison to the rest of the story. That being my only real complaint though, I think I'll call it a 4.5 and round up. (hide spoiler)]

[Allison]

Re end

(view spoiler)[ I agree. I felt a palpable sense of triumph and magic when they were all playing together (LOVE the idea that the "it" factor is faerie magic) that I was hoping would carry through to the battle. I wanted Eddi's significance to mean more there--like how cool if instead of just hiding, she's glamoured the highborn with her music and they were compelled to dance or something. Idk, just spitballing but I wanted it to resolve a bit more neatly, and then come to rest.

But I love the phouka!! And everything when she was describing music. I also remind myself that this was a super early version of UF, and totally different from the detective-version we see so often these days. It was really refreshing even if I just wanted a bit more pizzazz at the end. (hide spoiler)]

[Meredith]

I finished last night and I enjoyed it a lot. I agree with the points above about the ending. (view spoiler)[ I adored the phouka. I really liked that Eddi, despite being swept into Faerie and their war, retained her sense of herself and asserted a certain amount of control over the situation she was in. Plus, she didn't let it completely take over her life -she kept doing the band. It was fun how that tied into things at the end as well. (hide spoiler)]

[Cheryl]

Oh I am so glad that so many of you liked this. I wish I'd kept my copy so I could reread with you.