Nicholas Nickleby: Chapters 49 - 65

[Sue]

Shirley, I’m glad you asked the question because I haven’t read the biography yet either. And I have Simon Callow’s book left to read too. So many books I want to read, but I should get to them next year.

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Simon Callow's Charles Dickens and the Great Theatre of the World is very entertaining, Sue!

[Jim]

A couple of final thoughts:
Regardless of the novel’s title and designated protagonist, it seems to me that Ralph Nickleby’s story might be of greater significance than that of Nicholas. Ralph’s troubled life and his horrific demise prompt me to consider the notion of redemption—and more to the point, the denial of redemption for Ralph. Every man, if he lives long enough, is likely to take some actions along the way which he needs to face up to and atone for, in some manner, if he hopes to achieve any peace of mind. And the more egregious those action have been, the more difficult the road to redemption may be.
Drawing a comparison of Ralph Nickleby with Ebenezer Scrooge—each of them hardened and embittered by what they see as ill-treatment by others and by fate— both seek to compensate by enriching themselves at the expense of others. But in this, both of them fail, rendering themselves friendless, isolated and miserable. Dickens was kind to Scrooge, providing him with a route to redemption; and in the end, Scrooge learned to accept the opportunity offered to him. Ralph Nickleby, on the other hand, when urged by the Cheerybles to face up to his transgressions, refuses to do so—even when he is faced with the worst of his sins, the abandonment and victimization of his own son.
All of which suggests that, regardless of one’s religious beliefs—or absence thereof—redemption can only begin with making a difficult decision. And for me, this is a more meaningful message than anything that has befallen Nicholas.

[Dee]

To all the members of this group

I have certainly learned so much about Charles Dicken's writing and,in particular, NN through your comments and criticisms. This is the first time in my 78 years that I have participated in group read. I have immensely enjoyed your thought-provoking insights. I listened to NN and finished much earlier than the group, but I did not post a review. Jean's chapter summaries and the group's comments served to reinforce what I had heard. I enjoyed seeing in print many of my own favorite quotations.
I listened to Simon Callow read: Simon Callow's Charles Dicken's and the Great Theatre's of the World. I highly recommend it to those of you who have not yet read it. Merry Christmas and happy reading from northwest Florida!

Jean,
Thank you for including me in this group. I can only echo the praise of others! You have gone above and beyond in your preparation for each chapter summary, the illustrations, the extra material, and responses to individual comments. You share your evident love for Dickens, and your delightful sense of humor is so refreshing. Your labors are appreciated.
Extra-special warm Christmas greetings, Dee

[Claudia]

Jim wrote: "A couple of final thoughts:
Regardless of the novel’s title and designated protagonist, it seems to me that Ralph Nickleby’s story might be of greater significance than that of Nicholas. Ralph’s tr..."

Great point, Jim!

I enjoyed reading about Nicholas' character development, although he has been described as a "flat" character by some scholars, i.e. he is (almost) the same at the end of the novel as he was at the beginning. Nicholas seems to have been designed for advancing the plot and show, through his emotions and initiatives, such virtues as courage, generosity, etc, while Ralph is embodying a dark, underlying side of human beings who, in spite of a fleeting glimpse into redemption (related to Kate) are much too intricate in evil schemes and cannot hope for redemption.

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Jim - Thanks for your final thoughts, which I very much enjoyed reading. We have picked up similarities between Ralph Nickleby and Ebenezer Scrooge on several occasions, haven't we, so it is good to read your considered final analysis.

To me they are complementary ... not exactly halves of a whole, but showing the choices - or two diverging paths - many people have. I was interested this time to see how many points where Ralph did actually consider the option of doing the moral thing, but his struggles did not last long, before he rejected it.

If they had been in the same novel, they would be examples of the divided self. Your comment Jim that "Ralph Nickleby’s story might be of greater significance than that of Nicholas" is very fair. We see only a little moral development with Nicholas, but none at all with Ralph. I do feel he is portrayed with more depth, as there are times when he could have redeemed himself. That he hanged himself in the end was a tragedy.

Chris pointed out that this might well be an act of desperation, and I think there has to be a component of remorse there too, or why did he not continue as an evil usurer? (This is obviously a rhetorical question.)

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Claudia - "[Nicholas] has been described as a "flat" character by some scholars."

Indeed he is commonly held to be so, so this time of reading I consciously Iooked for some growth. Many 21st century readers do this automatically, wanting their characters to be dynamic rather than fulfilling the static roles of the 18th and early 19th century I described earlier. I do think there Nicholas develops - but subtly, such as in the way he treats his mother - and there are also times when he reconsiders the values he has been taught.

For example at the Cheerybles' dinner- party, he exclaims inwardly about the fact that they use their knives and don't have appropriate drinks i.e. they are not gentleman, but he approves of their generosity and good heart. I take this as a sign of growth. Another one is that early in the book he is very rude to John Browdie, making fun of his oafishness, and flirting outrageously with John's girlfriend, just because he wants to. He is also very cruel verbally to Fanny, when he meets her with Tilda later, rather than resisting her affections kindly.

Later though, he feels ashamed of himself for flirting and his rudeness to John, and has learnt from the episode with Fanny too. He remembers it as he carefully resists the charms of Miss Snevellicci, while staying gracious to her. He also, in a supreme act of self-denial, explains to the Cheerybles that he feels he must no longer be in charge of Madeline's care, because he loves her, and if they became very close he would thus be taking advantage of their trust. These are both mature actions.

Nicholas has shown few signs of resisting his hot temper yet, but Charles Dickens fully admits his hero's imperfections in his preface. I do think Nicholas is the most active of his heroes, and his quick temper and impetuosity remain. We assume that over the years his work at "Cheeryble and Nickleby" will steady him.

I like your point about the uncle and nephew representing two sides, Claudia. From the start they are like chalk and cheese, and for all his priggishness and over-developed sense of self-worth, Nicholas never deliberately performs an immoral action, whereas Ralph does little else, and is completely self-serving. I do agree that this is deliberate on Charles Dickens's part, and is another reason why Nicholas could not change too much - except to improve - or we would have been diverted from Ralph's story. Having said that, we did also need a happy ending for the other Nicklebys - which we got in spades!

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Dee - Thank you so much for your lovely thoughts. I'm delighted that you have enjoyed the read so much ... I do well remember the hesitance I felt before joining a group read on GR! So I'm so pleased that it worked for you, and hope you will join in many others, and never feel shy about posting 😊

Funnily enough, the "favourite quotations" was new this time, but it just seemed so obvious in a theatrical novel really, and I too loved how we often highlighted the same ones (which were often not overly theatrical at all!) I'm also happy that you read Simon Callow's book Charles Dickens and the Great Theatre of the World.

Your kind words are much appreciated, and you're right, it has been a labour of love, keeping me away from everything else I "should" be doing. My husband meanwhile, has manfully got on with the Christmas preparations, writing cards, ordering food, and so on 😆

[Lee]

Thank you, Jean, for yet another month’s
long dive into one of Charles Dickens’s novels. I really enjoyed seeing different talents of Dickens emerge in NICHOLAS
NICKLEBY that would eventually bring us absolute masterpieces in BLEAK HOUSE, Great EXPECTATIONS & A TALE OF TWO CITIES.

The exploration of his dramatic side that we did this past summer prepared us for new insights in NN that I would have misunderstood, not understanding that dramatic melodrama was central to his literary persona. When I began NICHOLAS,
It affected me indifferently; by the end of your study I realized I had just read another 5* DICKENS!

Merry Christmas to all!

[Sara]

Lee, you are not the only person here who had to revise their rating. 😃

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Lee - that's so lovely thank you! And my smile got even broader with your addition Sara 😁

[Bridget]

I too want to chime in with thanks to Jean for all she has given us. It takes a huge amount of time and work to put together summaries, and extras and answer our responses. And now I feel like I should also thank her husband, Chris, for taking care of everything else so that Jean could be dedicated to this!! I hope you now get to have a lovely holiday together!

On another note, I wanted to add an example of Nicholas's maturity to the excellent list Jean gave us in comment 307. I am remembering the humorous chapter where Newman Noggs follows a woman, he thinks is Madeline Bray, and arranges for Nicholas to enter her house late at night to see her. This leads to a funny scene, but it's also a very inappropriate act. It's something one would expect of teenagers, not adult men. Can you imagine Nicholas ever doing that with the real Madeline? I can't. Once he becomes the emissary for the Cheeryble brothers, all his dealings with Madeline are respectful and honorable. I think that shows a change in maturity.

[Bridget]

Jim wrote: "Ralph Nickleby, on the other hand, when urged by the Cheerybles to face up to his transgressions, refuses to do so . . . redemption can only begin with making a difficult decision.."

Thank you for sharing these thoughts, Jim. They really got me thinking. It's interesting, that Dickens has Ralph die by suicide. Certainly, he had plenty of characters who had motives to murder Ralph, but Dickens didn't do that. And I think that is connected to the "redemption" you talked about. There is no way suicide can lead to redemption. Most religions consider that act a sin. So having Ralph perish that way insures no redemption for him.

Also, having Ralph die by his own hand means the evilness of Ralph dies with him. No other character becomes tainted by murdering Ralph. It's a brilliant ending for Ralph.

[Kathleen]

I was reluctant to finish the last few chapters of NN and thus conclude the very enjoyable journey we've shared over the last three months. Thank you so much, Jean, for exceptionally guiding us on our journey. Your chapter summaries, extra background information and commentaries are excellent and very helpful.

And a whole hearted thank you to all my companions. Your personal insights, thoughts and comments were a great addition.

I look forward to a future journey through another Dickens novel!

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

This is another image sent to me by Peter for our read:



It is an historic photograph taken of Charles Dickens’s dining room at Gad’s Hill, his last family home. In the far right centre of the photo we can see the W.P. Frith painting of Kate Nickleby. As Peter says, Dickens obviously loved the painting, as he would have seen it each time he ate in the dining room.

Thank you Peter! And please remember his generous offer to email anyone who would like to read it, a copy of his article about W.P. Frith which was published in "Mudfog News": the journal of the Toronto Dickens Fellowship. I'd certainly like to read it please Peter 😊

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Bridget - That's a perfect example of Nicholas's immaturity, and in a way it's surprising that Newman Noggs went along with it. Noggs discovered where Cecilia Bobster lived - but the rest of the stalking is pure farce! And you are right; since it was in chapter 40, Nicholas had over a third of the book to "grow up" a bit!

Aw thank you so much. I've passed your message on to Chris too, and he was as pleased as Punch 😁

And my thanks to Kathleen too. I'm always pleased to see readers return for another novel, as I know all your comments will be so good. Yes, here's to the next, for as long as I can 😊

[Sara]

Bridget wrote: "Also, having Ralph die by his own hand means the evilness of Ralph dies with him. No other character becomes tainted by murdering Ralph. It's a brilliant ending for Ralph"

What wonderful, insightful thoughts, Bridget. I had not stopped to think that Ralph's suicide spared anyone else from being tainted by his death.

[Kathleen]

Back after a few days and relishing all of these great closing comments. I especially liked Jim's point about Ralph and Scrooge. I picture Dickens doing some serious thinking about how to end Ralph's story. As Jean says, we see that Ralph feels remorse, but he fails to act on it. What a lesson that is, for all the things we feel bad about. Acting, changing is the thing that takes us to that happy place Scrooge experiences at the end of his story.

Jean, I do hope you know how much of a difference you continue to make for all of us through these long reads. Thank you, thank you, thank you! May you have a happy and restful holiday!

[Sue]

Jean, ditto what Kathleen has said!

[Sam]

I loved how Dickens took this picaresque, Bildungsroman, melodrama, seriocomic serial comedy and managed to bring it all together. Very early on Dickens sets up the tension between Nicholas and Ralph in a memorable scene and all throughout the reader is subjected to mostly rises in the tension between them, vicariously released occasionally by Nicholas' striking out at Squeers or Hawk but still keeping us anticipating an ultimate confrontation. And even those acts of violence by Nicholas complicate our anticipated showdown as we see with violence comes potential risk to Nicholas nor does it make him look quite so noble.

Dickens manages to maintain the tension between the two until almost the end of the run when he does something completely unexpected by me. Dickens manages to shift that tension from them as individuals to their guiding principles thus switching the resolution from the confrontation between them to a contrasting and comparison of those principles exhibited in a series of chapters which illustrate their differences . Thus the novel's tension rises to a conflict of principles, which is a higher metaphysical, more psychological/philosophical, argument to be resolved than the physical one between the uncle and nephew.

This is done so cleverly. At the scene where Nicolas frustrates the wedding manipulations of Ralph, Dickens avoids having a direct confrontation between the two, and I would say that our sense of tension is probably the highest at the moment in the novel. But from there Dickens deflates the tension through contrasting scenes of their guiding principles being played out against one another. Ralph's scenes emphasize his guiding principle of preoccupation with self, and the consequences of that path. Nicholas OTOH is shown in a series of scenes focusing on his care for others, and we are warmed by his compassion. The climax in my opinion is the juxtaposing chapters where we get Ralph's speech where he is actually pleading in his soliloquy for one more chance to damage Nicholas contrasted with Nicholas' behavior of caring for his dying friend. And with Nicholas focused on that caring behavior our tension seems to evaporate. The remaining chapters do away with Ralph and reward Nicholas and the ultimate confrontation never comes and further we don't miss it.

IMO, this is all due to Dickens skill as a writer. And it completely astounds me that he was able to exhibit this level of sophistication at his young age among a host of other considerations like his previous work, his heavy work schedule, the nature of serial writing etc. I consider what Dickens managed to be incredible. I don't know if any of you noticed this as I did or considered the difficulty of what the author accomplished but I am awed.

That is my last comment on the novel. I've said my thanks and gave my good wishes and hopefully this will hide near the end of our discussion where not too many have to bother thinking about it. I can't wait for Petra and The Haunted Man.

[Sue]

Fascinating assessment, Sam. Well done. And it explains our feelings as readers so well. It marks Dickens developing skills so well. Similarly, he removed Hawks from the scene to the continent so there would be no confrontation between him and Nicholas after the duel and Verisopht’s death.

[Kathleen]

I hope many do read your comment, Sam. It's fascinating to see you put into words what we experienced as readers, and exactly why what Dickens accomplished is so awe-inspiring.

I haven't read any Dickens biographies or analysis, so only know what I've learned here. :-) But I have to believe that, in addition to his talent, he had a level of genius that led him to make these choices at least partially from intuition. The combination of his life experiences, skills and innate gifts really come together to make these precious and lasting stories for us!

[Werner]

Sam, what Sue and Kathleen said!

[Connie]

Excellent analysis, Sam!

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Sam wrote: "I loved how Dickens took this picaresque, Bildungsroman, melodrama, seriocomic serial comedy and managed to bring it all together ..."

Sam - yes it is astoundingly good as you say - particularly for an early novel in his oeuvre. As is your exposition on the repeated examples we have of Ralph's self-serving behaviour and Nicholas's altruism, 👏 both of which become more polarised as the novel proceeds, until:

"The climax ... [in] the juxtaposing chapters where we get Ralph's speech where he is actually pleading in his soliloquy for one more chance to damage Nicholas contrasted with Nicholas' behavior of caring for his dying friend."

So many of these final thoughts by everyone are very, very good! I'm sorry not to reply to each one as it deserves, but please know that I do read them all, and often more than once. 😁

So Sam - please note that Kathleen has it spot on: everyone should read your post. There's nothing more dispiriting than someone putting an enormous amount of effort and thought in a post when a group read is concluding, for it to be overlooked, so I'm astonished that you apparently hope for this to happen ... 😮 I never do (whether for myself or anyone else)!

The reason why we have a week between reads is precisely so that everyone can share their thoughts on the novel as a whole. Some groups (and conferences or courses) only have this aspect, whereas we also have the opportunity to benefit from reacting and analysing as we go. But the GR term of "done with" a read 🙄 does not apply to "Dickensians!" The reflections shown here by several readers are remarkably insightful, and it would be such a shame to miss them!

Kathleen and Sue - thank you so much for your continued encouragement, which means so much to me personally 😊

[Sara]

Sam - You have expressed beautifully what most readers feel, even those who could not put it into words as you have done. I think that is another of Dickens' skills, his ability to transport his readers to higher thoughts and issues without seeming to have done so, primarily because he has made them care for the individuals themselves as much as for what they represent.

[Shirley (stampartiste)]

Sam wrote: "Dickens manages to shift that tension from them as individuals to their guiding principles thus switching the resolution from the confrontation between them to a contrasting and comparison of those principles exhibited in a series of chapters which illustrate their differences..."

Thank you for your final analysis, Sam! You did make a fantastic point that completely escaped me - namely, the conflict between Ralph and Nickleby went from a personal one to a comparison of their principles. And somehow, I didn't even feel cheated that there was no final "showdown" between the two men.

Thank you, Dickens, for resolving the conflict in such an unexpected manner, and thank you, Sam, for pointing it out to us. This is why I love reading with the Dickensians! I see things I would have never seen on my own.

[Bonnie]

Bionic Jean wrote: "We can't capture their sensation fully. We only know what it was like to live then from secondary sources: our knowledge of historical events and people. We know of their social conditions and attitudes ditto. We don't really have an inner sense of this.

But in this group we can recapture exactly what Charles Dickens wanted us to think about and feel at the close of each chapter. We can put ourselves in his hands and respect his wishes. Rather than rushing, we can mirror that experience of just not knowing, and thinking more deeply about possibilities (and of course marvelling at his craft). Plus we also have the benefit of talking to other at exactly the same point, just as his original readers would be talking in their homes, and to their neighbours 😊."

That is a lovely way to think about it this reading experience.

It also reminds me of how, certainly more than once in my life, getting into a discussion with strangers about a TV show we were excited about...
-A restaurant in Brooklyn where others heard our group mention "Palestinian Chicken" and we all laughed about Curb Your Enthusiasm,
-A pizza place in Berlin where I heard the table next to me discussing Game of Thrones and 'invited myself' to join in;
-A coffee shop in Berlin during the Pandemic, we had to sit outside; two people next to me were talking about Better Call Saul and I joined in.

I remember in high school when our teacher told us about the people in the 1800s who went to the docks waiting for the ship that would carry the next installment of Dickens story, I think The Old Curiosity Shop? and called out "Did Little Nell die?!" or something like that. Did that happen? And if so, while those super fans were standing at the pier waiting, maybe they started talking with each other about the story.!

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Bonnie wrote: "Did that happen? And if so, while those super fans were standing at the pier waiting, maybe they started talking with each other about the story.!..."

Yes, it most certainly did. I'm so pleased you've enjoyed reading this one with us Bonnie. We will be interested to read your final thoughts on it.

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Thank you to EVERYONE who has joined in with some or all of our "Dramatic Dickens" reads this year. 👏🤩🎉

This is our last official day for the grand finale read, although the threads will remain permanently open, both as a resource and for anyone to add their thoughts, perhaps reading along later.

Please don't miss our next read of The Haunted Man and the Ghost's Bargain. Petra's leads of the Christmas books are always extremely popular, and as usual she has found a lot of extra goodies such as illustrations and so on. You may be surprised at how different this novella is - but also at one aspect which they have in common.

LINK HERE for the thread, where Petra will put introductory posts shortly.

[Sam]

Just adding I appreciate the kind words from all. Great Discussion!

[Bonnie]

Glad I read this. Years ago in Seattle I saw a preview at the movie theater for a movie version; I remember Christopher Plummer against a dark background saying "He shall be whipped, until he can be whipped no more!" or something like that. Although I was a frequent movie-goer then, I did not make it to that one so up until now I did not even know the NN story. Will try to watch that movie on video this week; BTW I kept an eye out for that quote by Ralph Nickleby in the book, but I did not notice it.

i was surprised at Uncle Ralph's demise, I had expected some degree of redemption for him.
So glad Nicholas remained with the Cheeryble brothers, they found each other about halfway through the book so I was very worried something would happen to force him (and Smike) to go elsewhere.

I read a bunch of Anthony Trollope novels with the GR Readers Review group, it is nice to think about Dickens / Trollope / Hardy in the 1800s, and their contributions to literature, and British literature, and society. I first heard of Charles Dickens (well, maybe not counting "A Christmas Carol") when reading Little Women, in the summertime when I was 11... there was a whole chapter where the girls plus Laurie form a ~Pickwick Club.~ Also the family reads stories aloud in the evening, from the serial newspapers I assume.

So I found out at the end what the cover of my edition is--Mrs. Squeers getting a taste of her own medicine from the Dotheboys Hall boys! My favorite was also the 1875 version of Tim L. and Miss La Creavy sitting by the window.
The extra drawings and ancillary information were wonderful and added so much context.

[Bonnie]

Sam wrote: "I loved how Dickens took this picaresque, Bildungsroman, melodrama, seriocomic serial comedy and managed to bring it all together.."

Yes indeed. And I like learning about those terms and literary devices (e.g. mesmerism and was it, animal fallacy?) and being able to place them in the timelines of literature, language, medical progress, history.

Hope to retain the motifs and symbols we heard about, like caged birds, and clocks, and stairways.

Someone recommended a book some chapters back, about Dickens terms. I did read the free online sample of this book, this morning:
What the Dickens?!: Distinctly Dickensian Words and How to Use Them


and Merry Christmas to all, my dears
🎄

[Peter]

Sam wrote: "I loved how Dickens took this picaresque, Bildungsroman, melodrama, seriocomic serial comedy and managed to bring it all together. Very early on Dickens sets up the tension between Nicholas and Ral..."

Sam

A very insightful summary that draws together so much of the novel, and that’s not easy to do.

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Thank for your final thoughts Bonnie, and your appreciation. I hope you'll be with us for more reads - including tomorrow's - which will continue well into the new year. 😊

The archaic term you were wondering about is "animal magnetism", to differentiate it from mineral magnetism. It quickly became known as mesmerism, and later, hypnosis.

Do please introduce yourself in the welcome thread, LINK HERE so we can get to know you a bit.

[Kathleen]

I want to share something, and I hope it's okay I put it here. I'm reading New Grub Street by George Gissing, about struggling writers in 1880's London. One of the characters mentions Dickens and melodrama.

After complaining about how realistic fiction doesn't sell, that, "nothing can induce working men or women to read stories that treat of their own world,” the character says:
"Dickens goes down only with the best of them, and then solely because of his strength in farce and his melodrama."

Isn't it interesting that these aspects we see sometimes as less-worthy today may have been what allowed Dickens to be successful, so that we could continue to read him now?

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

That's really interesting thanks Kathleen, and a great commentary on the merits of Nicholas Nickleby.

[Sara]

I always love stumbling across one writer while reading another. This shows how truly respected and original Dickens was to his contemporaries.

[Plateresca]

Thank you, dear Dickensians, for your thoughtful comments! I've enjoyed reading this discussion, and you've helped me enjoy this lovely book even more.

Of course, Jean is the goddess of literature :) Thank you, dear Jean! You know you're the best. I cannot imagine the amount of time and effort that went into this. (Special thanks to your family for being so patient about it and covering for you). I loved your analytical posts, I really enjoyed all the artwork you've found, and, of course, your patience seems endless. I really think Charles Dickens would have been supremely grateful to you :)

So, trying to say something that hasn't already been said...

Some people here found Mrs Nickleby frustrating, didn't they? You might find this opinion curious:
'But the book contains something which is much more Dickensian. It is exquisitely characteristic of Dickens that the truly great achievement of the story is the person who delays the story. Mrs. Nickleby with her beautiful mazes of memory does her best to prevent the story of Nicholas Nickleby from being told. And she does well. There is no particular necessity that we should know what happens to Madeline Bray. There is a desperate and crying necessity that we should know that Mrs. Nickleby once had a foot-boy who had a wart on his nose and a driver who had a green shade over his left eye. If Mrs. Nickleby is a fool, she is one of those fools who are wiser than the world. She stands for a great truth which we must not forget; the truth that experience is not in real life a saddening thing at all.'
This is, recognizably, G. K. Chesterton speaking.
I do not necessarily think that Mrs Nickleby is wiser than the world, but I think it's an interesting take on this character.

Examples of Nicholas becoming older and wiser: I think nobody mentioned that he managed not to throw Gride out of the window when the latter was taunting him! Frankly, I think this was way more provocative than anything Mr Lenville could have done.

For me, Smike's story was very poignant. I really think that as he was, death was probably the best outcome for him, as opposed to struggling with fitting in and being tortured by unrequited love, but it's tragic to think that he didn't have to become this way in the first place, that his physical and mental health had been stunted by his parents' neglect and the Squeers' cruelty and greed.

I actually enjoyed what there is in this novel of the 18th century as much as what there is of the 19th! I absolutely agree with what you've said about the curious mix of Romanticism and realism, with the additions of Sentimentalism (hi, Tristram!;)), picaresque, Greek tragedy, and whatnot...

I also agree about doubles! Nicholas and Ralph (the good Nickleby and the bad Nickleby); Ralph and Squeers (the Bad and the Ugly, or intelligent evil and coarse villainy); Noggs and Smike (injured helpers); of course, Kate and Madeline, but also Madeline and Cecilia, too (and remember her 'ferocious Turk' of a father), Ralph and uncle Lillyvick, etc, etc. Consciously or not-so-consciously, the author has given us many ways to interpret this novel, many paths to his conclusions :)

And, of course, I think that most of these characters will stay with us forever, even if we forget the details of their adventures (but then it will be high time to reread the novel).

I'm happy to know Charles Dickens knew how good his writing was, that he was appreciated during his lifetime, you know it doesn't always happen.

So, thank you, Charles! :)

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Dear Plateresca, I've just found this comment at last! I'm so sorry for the delay.

Your thoughts bring the novel back so clearly, thank you! It's not often I agree totally with G.K. Chesterton on Charles Dickens, but he certainly seems to have nailed Mrs Nickleby's "beautiful mazes of memory", as expressions of "one of those fools who are wiser than the world". And totally addictive, for me.

I also think that some of Charles Dickens's worst villains can be found in this book. And I teared up as soon as you start talking about Smike.

You have added perfect concluding thoughts here; thank you so much for them all. And thank you too for "joining" us afterwards, when you were able 😊

[Plateresca]

Oh, thank you, Jean, you're too kind :)
It's been such an enjoyable read, and it's heartwarming to know that this group exists and that such in-depth discussions take place here.

[Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"]

Yes! 😊