Nothing But Reading Challenges discussion
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Mockingjay
Buddy Reads: Current & Upcoming
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Collins,Suzanne, Mockingjay - informal buddy read begins 15 July 2024
Cat wrote: "@Kaley re Gale - that's the bit about Gale I never really got - his hatred for The Capitol is so visceral but it didn't particularly seem like his life was a step-change worse than any of the other..."Yeah, totally! I mean I get that he is young, but his viewpoint of all Capitol = evil and all district = good is hard to swallow. I get that President Snow and those who protect him are awful, and Gale has had to watch his best friend almost die twice at the hands of the Capitol, but Katniss and the other victors have been through the worst of the Capitol, and from my interpretation, none of them see the world as extremely as Gale does.
It's especially weird, thinking back on it now, wasn't there a Peacekeeper in book two that they actually liked? That Katniss considered almost but not quite a friend, who was turned into an Avox and had to serve her in Catching Fire to punish her? That Peacekeeper would have worked for the Capitol all those years. So does Gale think he should die too? It's all so extreme.
I wonder if anyone in District 12 other than Gale was whipped under the new Peacekeepers? That might explain Gale’s extra hatred. The older people, like Katniss’ mom, seemed to be aware of how bad it could be, but I think the Peacekeepers in their district hadn’t been changed in so long that everyone got comfortable and Gale’s whipping came as a shock to the younger people in the district.
I just reached the part where Prim ran back to fetch her cat instead of getting into the bunker when the alarms went off. This is 100% something I would do and never regret choosing to risk my life for my pet! I couldn't live with myself if I chose any other way!Also this reminds me of the movie scene where Katniss plays with the light torch and the cat, which is one of my favourite scenes. Since this way she manages to distract a lot of the people in the bunker from the horrible and scary stuff going on right outside (well, above ground, but still).
In the books I really liked the talk between Prim and Katniss, where they discuss what they think Snow will do!
Yasmine,I liked that exchange between Prim and Katniss, too.
After the deep-bombing of D13, when they are trying to film Katniss outside and she breaks down, I found it very touching that it is Haymitch she calls to comfort her, b/c he is her link to Peeta.
Part 1It’s been so long since I’ve read these books. I always thought the movies were so similar but they really aren’t.
The last book doesn’t grab you like the second one does or even the first. It’s a little slower to start and the first part is a little boring. Katniss is trying to figure out how to adjust to living in 13 without Peeta. Really the biggest thing here to me is Gale. I really see how much a revolution can affect a person and change who they are. All Gale sees is the chance at freedom and he is doing everything he can to get there. Even risking his friendship with Katniss.
When the rebels break thru the feed and poor Peeta is so lost and confused I feel so horrible for him. What terrible things has he gone thru? What more will they do to him. Poor Peeta.
Just got to 20%So far I'm really enjoying it.
Katniss has been down but I fully get why, especially in this book. The politics and changes with District 13 are sure interesting. Sad about (view spoiler)
I'm enjoying finally getting to know Gale. I know he was always around the first two books with memories and short scenes but I didn't feel their connection as much until this uninterrupted and drawn out time.
A shame Katniss and Buttercup keep up their hissing war but kind of amusing. Actually there are slightly little amusing tidbits so far through this that I'm enjoying.
And yes, agree with all on poor Finnick, I liked him last book and glad he's been around some.
That disgusting stew that just ate with all the slimy okra and that looks gray - gross
With the debate with Gale and Katniss about the three "prep team", I see both their points of view. She got to know them as friendly, so likes them, but he is not wrong that they stayed complicit. She argues that they are raised in it and did not know better, but we judge people who treat others wrong with history (Germany WWII), slavery and racism, and current regardless if they are raised in it or not,.
Through chapter 14–I need to focus on something other than Gale but I find that venting about him is what I feel the need to comment on the most. He just was talking to Katniss about how she is oblivious to other people feelings but the way he talked about Finnick/Katniss during this segment… No thank you. Specifically how he said he was starting to think Finnick liked her but he’s “back on track now” (since Annie is there). EXCUSE ME?! Back on track? As if liking Katniss is a path no one else is allowed to be on? Gag me 🤣
I'm dreading reading this I have to admit. I've become less and less of a fan of dystopian over the years, not to mention the current political climate makes this all a little more uncomfortable.I hate love triangles and this whole return to Gale being in the picture is just annoying. I get that Katniss is young and thus not always rational and more than a little immature. And yes she has a ton on her shoulders, but I hate watching her flip flop back and forth over whether she's committed to the rebellion or not. It's frustrating that she's really only good when under extreme pressure. I want to see her make her own planned choices (yay for actually having demands) but too much of the time she doesn't think through anything of what she's doing.
District 13 is super creepy. There's a really sinister vibe to it all from the beginning for me. It's feels like the Capital without the wealth.
I think I would like to read either a continuation of Ballad of Songbirds or at least a short story showing how Tigris ended up where she is now. I know she didn’t like Snow’s actions, but they were still family at the end of Ballad.
Wasn’t the rebel commander in 2 a former victor? She isn’t specifically mentioned as dying, but she isn’t at the meeting at the end.
Laura wrote: "Wasn’t the rebel commander in 2 a former victor? She isn’t specifically mentioned as dying, but she isn’t at the meeting at the end."Yup. I just read that part, and Lyme is a victor from District 2.
Now I have to pay attention to if we see her die. It could be off page, or just an oops.
Jenny wrote: "Laura wrote: "Wasn’t the rebel commander in 2 a former victor? She isn’t specifically mentioned as dying, but she isn’t at the meeting at the end."Yup. I just read that part, and Lyme is a victor..."
I was listening to the audio so I very well could have just missed her death.
Shelby wrote: "I'm dreading reading this I have to admit. I've become less and less of a fan of dystopian over the years, not to mention the current political climate makes this all a little more uncomfortable...."
Just finished it. She did a good job with the book but bleak city. Of course the whole series is bleak but damn.
But yes the concentration of the love triangle still was just frustrating. She is young but sometimes she frustrated me as well with her thought processes, but that's not saying either of the guys shone consistently in the book either. I did like the ending but very bittersweet stuff
To me this doesn't read like a love triangle, because whatever monologues or thought processes Katniss may have, for me it is clear that she doesn't care about Gale that way and never had. If it weren't for the Hunger Games, they could have ended up as a pair eventually (and I'm still thinking years and years), but Katniss volunteering changed that.
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Erin *Proud Book Hoarder*
(last edited Jul 17, 2024 09:19PM)
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rated it 3 stars
Melindam wrote: "To me this doesn't read like a love triangle, because whatever monologues or thought processes Katniss may have, for me it is clear that she doesn't care about Gale that way and never had. If it ..."
To me it definitely feels love triangle in this one especially. She was questioning on her love for both and seemed romantic with the jealousy from both men, her, trying out kisses with each, getting annoyed with each (lol)
I liked her bond with Gale more this book until the last quarter when it just seems like the world got bleaker and most left in their own way, then I could see the decision making sense of her choices
Something Gale says to Peeta that Katniss overhears when they are hiding with Tigris struck me again this time through. He says that Katniss will choose whichever of them she can't live without. And she thinks that makes her sound selfish, but I think that just makes her sound human. In this exact same situation, wouldn't we all be drawn to the one we can't live without?
Erin *Proud Book Hoarder* wrote: "Melindam wrote: "To me this doesn't read like a love triangle, because whatever monologues or thought processes Katniss may have, for me it is clear that she doesn't care about Gale that way and ne..."After the bombing, I don't think she could ever be with Gale. She would always look at him and see his idea being the possible catalyst for Prim's death. That's why she doesn't even really miss him when she's back in 12.
Laura wrote: "Erin *Proud Book Hoarder* wrote: "Melindam wrote: "To me this doesn't read like a love triangle, because whatever monologues or thought processes Katniss may have, for me it is clear that she doesn..."Yes, that changed things for her. She blamed him in a way because he was involved with the war - as was she and everyone else - but it soured her too much on it. Also he just seemed to have been moving on and away to me by that point
Melindam wrote: "To me this doesn't read like a love triangle, because whatever monologues or thought processes Katniss may have, for me it is clear that she doesn't care about Gale that way and never had. If it ..."
I think you are correct. If Prim's name hadn't been called, there may have been a rebellion years into the future, but not by this timeline.
I think Coin would have figured out a way to get power over all the districts somehow. Maybe when Snow died or something.
Katniss probably would have ended up with Gale, pretty much by accident, but I doubt they would have had any children. Peeta, if he hadn't been in the games probably would never have gotten the courage to try to woo Katniss, and he is so much better for Katniss than Gale is. Just a better person too, I think.
There have been a lot of comments so far about how dark this book (or series) is, and I agree. It is dark. I don't think that it is too dark for the world that Collins imagined. It is just disturbing to those of us who do not live in that hellscape. Although, sometimes this stuff is disturbing because there are glimmers of what is happening in our world, and they hit close to home.
The other comment that is very prevalent is everyone's love for Haymitch. And, there is a Haymitch book on the horizon. I just want all of you to prepare yourself for what is likely to be the most brutal book of the series so far. Not only did he have to win over twice the tributes (if I remember correctly), in the quarter quell, but the book is likely to provide us readers with the details of what the Capitol does to victors once they win and become mentors.
So gird your loins.
I just finished!Back in the day when I first joined Goodreads, I was exploring and saw what turned out to be a Harry Potter fanfic that was a book entry on GR. It had a link and I clicked it. At the time I didn't even know what fanfic was (I had 6 children in a 9 year span, so I think we can cut me a little slack on not knowing what the internet was doing during those years!). Anyway, it was James Potter and the Hall of Elders' Crossing. That led me down a rabbit hole, and I ended up finding and reading the only other fanfic I've ever read. I think it was called "Growing Together". Or maybe "Growing Back Together". I know it was based on what Katniss says that glosses over the process of her Peeta both healing and falling (back) in love that is mentioned at the end. I found it to be so sweet, but I think it colors my end impression of this book. Because it really does end abruptly, without a good, solid wrap-up.
Jenny wrote: "The other comment that is very prevalent is everyone's love for Haymitch. And, there is a Haymitch book on the horizon. I just want all of you to prepare yourself for what is likely to be the most brutal book of the series so far. Not only did he have to win over twice the tributes (if I remember correctly), in the quarter quell, but the book is likely to provide us readers with the details of what the Capitol does to victors once they win and become mentors.So gird your loins."
He said in Mockingjay that within 2 weeks of his win his entire family was dead and so the Capitol had nothing to hold over him. So I don't think we'll see a lot of what typically would happen. Not like with Finnick.
I would like Joanna's story to be after Haymitch's.
I was interested in the discussion re Woody Harrelson. Now… thoughts on Tucci? I haven’t seen the films but have seen clips, and he’s got quite a characterization going on there!And I just recently realized that Elizabeth Banks was Effie.
I’m flying through this and already drawing comparisons between the strict regime of D13 and that of the Capitol. Have they just swapped one despotism for another. I agree with Cat, Haymitch is by far my favorite character this time round.
I do say I am laughing at the interaction between (view spoiler) in Chapter 16. Very funny that (view spoiler)
I rather enjoyed the first two books. What happened with this one?In other words, what’s the worst Hunger Games book, and why is it Mockingjay?
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I agree. Haymitch has become one of my favourites
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I think the jumper of my mum's that I picked after she died would be very high on my list ..."
Yes this is a hard one. Some items for me would be things handmade by relatives that have since passed away. Especially using crafts that aren't used much these days (like a ship in a bottle one of my great uncles made)
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D13 being controlling is understandable, but that sprea..."
This is something I really appreciate about this book.
The idea that you can go to war or topple a corrupt government and everything is sunshine and roses is horse poo. Wherever there is a vacuum people will step in and not for the best.
I understand D13 and the rules, but they are no more free in many ways than they were under the Capitol. And of course, the big question remains if they win the war, then what. The vague idea of a republic needs a lot more consideration and detail
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They are very binary in their thinking of having to be on the side of the Capitol or the Rebels. I really feel for Peeta as he is in an impossible position - he has to keep showing the face of being on the side of the Capitol but is really unaware of so much of what is happening
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It is a good point - although this is a YA Fiction, it is actually exploring some pretty important themes. I am appreciating it more the second time around
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I don’t know how I didn’t notice from the first minute I read this book how truly awful he is. I was NEVER Team Gale and only disliked him after later events in t..."
I really liked that scene where she tries to explain to Gale about her prep team and how they don't understand the Games and the impact. This shows real development in her and also how many people would feel the same as Gale. Life just isn't that black and white
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oh! the narrator I had was Carolyn something. Perhaps I changed narrators between the books?"
I have Carolyn McCormick too. Same for book 1 & 2. I don't really think she suits Katniss' voice and I keep flipping back to the kindle version as she makes Katniss more unlikeable somehow
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So gird your loins...."
omg. that would be hard reading.
I think it would be interesting to read someone's pov from the Capitol, how they experienced the events from the end of Book 2 onward.
Just finished!Something I wonder about all the time, whenever I reread this book / watch Mockingjay Part 2, is that roundtable moment where the surviving victors all have to vote to have whether to have a final Hunger Games with Capitol children. Coin claims that so many people are calling for all of the Capitol to be eliminated (or something of the sort) so she came up with the idea as a "compromise." Now, obviously this is the catalyst for Katniss making the choice she does, knowing that Coin would be no better than Snow . . . but I always wonder if it her backstory about how people wanted it was true, and if she really thought it would help. She sucks either way, but I wonder if she's just evil enough to let innocent children die to solve some bloodlust, or if she's evil enough that she just wanted to do this on her own in retaliation and made up an excuse that she thought would make it seem justifiable.
When she specifies that it will be made clear it happens with the living victors’ approval is what makes me suspicious. At the very least she is evil enough to use it to discredit them in everyone else’s eyes.
Yes! And that their votes would remain anonymous . . . so literally they could all be blamed by either side because if it was a majority yes and people were outraged or a majority no and people were outraged . . . they're all targets. It goes along very well with Snow's claim of how he and Katniss were watching each other and no one was watching Coin. In this same instance, the victors would catch the blame, and Coin would still get what she wanted.
I decided to read vs. listen this time and luckily my library has a copy.I don't remember much about this book except for a few deaths that happen later. I DO remember when I originally read it, some parents saying it was too grim for their children to read, and I didn't get what they were saying. This time, as I started it and Katniss was walking through the corpses on District 12, breathing in the dust of the dead, I was like "oooh....I see what they mean." I think in my first reading, I was so anxious to see what happened, that some of the grim just didn't register with me.
I love the more grown up Prim who can council her sister on strategy and be a helper, not just a dependent.
Just finished! This was a lot better the second time around, probably because (as I've said before) I'm way older now and see and think about things differently. I think The Hunger Games will always be a great work of dystopian fiction to me and I really liked this push the reread the books!
Finished. I think this is one of the more successful endings of a trilogy. I appreciate how the story concludes with chaos and a smidge of hope. I hate that there are characters that I cared about that didn't make it, but it makes perfect sense in the story. The similarities between the Capitol under Snow, and 13 under Coin are obvious, and I like that it was the slightly saner and less power hungry people who ultimately got put in power. For now. I watched the movies a few months ago, and they were good depictions of the books, with some exceptions. I wonder if Jennifer Lawrence was a better singer, the poignant bit at the end when the Mockingjay finds her voice again would have been in the movie.
The other ending bit, with Plutarch telling Katniss about what had happened during her "recovery" was handled with a letter from him instead, I'm guessing because the actor died. What he said to her wasn't conveyed as well, as it kind of touched on the hopelessness of the human condition, and the fact that all of this crap will likely happen again, and probably not too far into the future.
That message is kind of the whole gist of the book. People can be brilliantly good, but we as a species have yet to learn how to get along with others that we find different in some fashion, and those in power know just how to exploit that fact.
Katniss had it right when she was addressing the people at District One before she was shot. She opined that the only reason they were fighting each other was because of the rhetoric of Snow et al.
Wouldn't it be nice if we took that to heart and grew to not care about silly differences.
At part 3 now. For the first time, with Peeta's unstable metal condition (where he alternates bw wanting to kill her and insult her) I think Katniss finally realises that in some way she took Peeta for granted.Other strong points
- Katniss realising that Coin wants her dead & why & Boggs promising he won't let her die
- Haymitch telling Katniss that in switched circumstances, Peeta would have fought for bringing her back to herself, instead of taking umbrage and avoiding her, like she does
- the soldiers of the squad with Katniss, Finnick & Gale "playing" real-not real with Peeta
I think seeing himself on the television is a huge turning point for Peeta!
Karen ⊰✿ wrote: "Kaley wrote: "If Gale has no haters, I’m dead. I don’t know how I didn’t notice from the first minute I read this book how truly awful he is. I was NEVER Team Gale and only disliked him after lat..."
Karen, I just read that scene and I'm with you that it was powerful! I'm definitely taking Katniss side on that one, but you can see how the rebels would be split.
Finished through ch 7.This time I'm listening to the audiobook; the first time I read it was 10-12 years ago and I've watched the movies twice since then, so it's interesting reading the story while also remembering how it ends and some of the important parts in it.
One thing that stands out is I think in the movie, District 13 doesn't let Katniss see remains of District 12 until she becomes Mockingjay, right? That was how I remembered it in my, but the book has it differently.
I definitely forgot the prep team was locked up in like a prison box! So inhumane!
Knowing the ending, I can see the similarities of how District 13 runs things similar to how the Capitol does. It's something interesting to keep an eye on this time through.
PS - when the hold comes through for the ebook version, I may switch to that; I often switch back and forth to try and finish faster.
Part 2I’ve forgotten how much I respect Boggs. He is one of my favorite characters in this book. He truly cares for Katniss and looks out for her like Haymitch does.
There is so much foreshadowing for what happens in the end. So much to show that Gale will truly do anything to win this war. It has changed him and his heart. As much as I didn’t like Gale in the first 2 books, I loathe him in this one. He is an angry shell of himself but I guess rebellions are won because of people like that.
And Peeta, oh Peeta how terrible for you and for Johanna. Both are trying so hard to live a normal life.
I’m nearly at the end of this and thoroughly enjoying it. There is a lot going on here as they try to go in and kill snow. I feel sorry for Peeta being used as a Pawn between Coin and Snow, both using him as a pawn to kill Katniss. Boggs explanation of why Coin does this is spot on.
Part 1 Notes and Comments (posting these all at once because I wrote them all on my phone)(view spoiler)
Nothing But Reading Challenges
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I remember practically nothing about this book from my reading years ago. A couple of thoughts though, Katniss’ guilt over what happened to the people of District 12. She feels responsible and yet at the same time is she really? The plan was kept from both her and Peeta so the responsibility should be on others. I think it shows the growth in her character that she is not only about herself and family. And how unfair Peeta is portrayed as a traitor when he basically a hostage.
I liked where she asked Gail about whether he could kill someone and her take on it. Yes you can kill but even if only in self defense, kill or be killed, it leaves a stain on your psyche.
District 13, where to even start. They are so controlling. Are they any better than the capitol? Is the plan they have laid out for the districts to have a vote on the new order going to be a reality or is that just propaganda? I’m not sure I trust them at this point
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