Babel: An Arcane History by R.F. Kuang - Restarting August 5th 2023

[Maisha]

Traduttore, traditore: An act of translation is always an act of betrayal.

1828. Robin Swift, orphaned by cholera in Canton, is brought to London by the mysterious Professor Lovell. There, he trains for years in Latin, Ancient Greek, and Chinese, all in preparation for the day he'll enroll in Oxford University's prestigious Royal Institute of Translation — also known as Babel.

Babel is the world's center of translation and, more importantly, of silver-working: the art of manifesting the meaning lost in translation through enchanted silver bars, to magical effect. Silver-working has made the British Empire unparalleled in power, and Babel's research in foreign languages serves the Empire's quest to colonize everything it encounters.

Oxford, the city of dreaming spires, is a fairytale for Robin; a utopia dedicated to the pursuit of knowledge. But knowledge serves power, and for Robin, a Chinese boy raised in Britain, serving Babel inevitably means betraying his motherland. As his studies progress Robin finds himself caught between Babel and the shadowy Hermes Society, an organization dedicated to sabotaging the silver-working that supports imperial expansion. When Britain pursues an unjust war with China over silver and opium, Robin must decide: Can powerful institutions be changed from within, or does revolution always require violence? What is he willing to sacrifice to bring Babel down?

Babel — a thematic response to The Secret History and a tonal response to Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norrell — grapples with student revolutions, colonial resistance, and the use of translation as a tool of empire.

[Dannii]

Just got approved for the audiobook for this so I'd love to join you :)

[Maisha]

Awesome!

[Brigia]

My Illumicrate box arrived, so I'll be able to join, too :-)

[Maisha]

Starting it today. But the book's so big! It's going to take me forever to finish it. Feeling intimidated right now.

[Dannii]

It's such a big book!! I'm so excited for it though as it sounds like exactly my sort of read. I'm going to start it tomorrow

[Maisha]

Chapter 1-3 (view spoiler)[ This book is giving me goosebumps. I already can tell it's going to be Epic. The prose is a little dense, almost reads like a textbook. But I'm enjoying it. I'm loving al these historical details. Specially how the author is showing the reality of British imperialism. Robin seems like an interesting choice for protagonist. I love Remy. As a South Asian myself, I can understand their situations. How they are being neglected and humiliated by nearly everyone..It's making me so angry (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Just starting :)

I've only listened to the historical notes and am already in awe of how much research Kuang has obviously put into this.

[Maisha]

Chapter 5 (view spoiler)[ Griffin's appearance surprised me. At first I really thought he was some kind of magical being. But turns out he's Robin's half brother. He's also member of a secret society. The situation is unnerving. I hope he's a good man. Griffin's words hit home though. How the British people were enjoying all the luxuries of life while poeple around the world were suffering. The money wasn't theirs even.

Also, how many illegitimate children have Lovell sired over the years? Why is he bringing them to London, training them to become translators and then sending them off to Oxford? What's his end goal here? (hide spoiler)]

[Bayan]

The audiobook is so terrifyingly huge I'm kind of slow with it

[Maisha]

Bayan wrote: "The audiobook is so terrifyingly huge I'm kind of slow with it"

It's fine. Take your time.

[Karen]

I’m so keen to read this, but have another to finish…and with it being so big I’m not sure I can take it to work. We’ll see…

[Dannii]

I'm moving through this super slowly too. I'm only one chapter into the audiobook. It is fascinating so far but that's only one hour of listening and I have over 20 to go.

[Bayan]

Dannii wrote: "I'm moving through this super slowly too. I'm only one chapter into the audiobook. It is fascinating so far but that's only one hour of listening and I have over 20 to go."

I'm super slow too, I only finished the second chapter on audio, and I have to be honest it's a little difficult to understand things, I'm getting the ebook too just to understand the different statements and why they are voiced different.

[Maisha]

Chapter 11 (view spoiler)[ Really enjoying it so far. But I'm also kinda because as nothing much is happening. I'm loving the discussion on morality and ethics. The historical references are fascinating. I find footnotes annoying. But still so far so good. I just wish something "big" would happen at this point. (hide spoiler)]

[Maisha]

Chapter 13 (view spoiler)[ I love Robin. And Victoire too. I would love to get to know Ramy more. Letty is annoying to be honest. She's insensitive and selfish. What do you think of Griffin? I think he's not a bad person. But he can be really cold and distant. He should open up to Robin more.

Is Robin really not a member of the Hermes society anymore? Will he start working for them again? I think he made the right decision by calling off that weird arrangement. He deserves to know more if he's to risk his life for this secret society. (hide spoiler)]

[Maisha]

Chapter 16 (view spoiler)[ a chapter from Ramy's pov! so excited

Ramy and Victoire have been working for the Hermes. It was an interesting twist. Robin's loyalty had me at awe once again. I'm surprised that Professor Lovell gave him a 2nd chance. Can't wait to see what happens next (hide spoiler)]

[Bayan]

How are you at chapter 16 I'm at 3 ugh the book is falling short for me so far it isn't interesting me at all╮⁠(⁠╯⁠_⁠╰⁠)⁠╭

[Maisha]

@Bayan, I almost dnf'ed it cause I found it pretty boring for a long time. But after hitting the 40% mark, it started becoming really interesting. Now, I see what all the hype is about. I just wish the pacing was better.

[Bayan]

Aww well hopefully i make it there 🤣🤣

[Bayan]

Chapter five
Things just started getting interesting.. (view spoiler)[Griffin is very intriguing and I'm dying to see what happens with the four after the hint of them becoming enemies? (hide spoiler)]

[Maisha]

Bayan wrote: "Chapter five
Things just started getting interesting.. [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[ I was sad that their "brotherly bond" didn't have the chance to deepen or expand much. But I get it..Griffin is an interesting character (hide spoiler)]

[Maisha]

Chapter 25 (view spoiler)[ I wasn't expecting this. I never liked Letty. I've always thought she's selfish and annoying. But I also didn't think she would betray the. Ungrateful backstabber. I really wanna strangle her right now. Poor Ramy! He's dead. How could she do that?? Griffin is dead too, so is Anthony. My heart is breaking for Robin and Victoire. :( (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Maisha wrote: "Chapter 1-3 [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[I agree with all your thoughts, so far. It is proving to be very intriguing but also quite educational, regarding British history. The tone is quite dry but I'm enjoying it. Robin is very easy to like and the racism he is consistently subjected to is already hard to read about. The constant comments on his features are done almost without notice for how they would hurt, as though they view him as a lesser human without the same thoughts and feelings. It is angering me, although I understand that that is the point.

I'm very excited to witness his time at Oxford. I still wonder why he was chosen as a ward and trained for the university there. There have been a few comments made about how he looks like someone. But who? It has also been hinted that Robin had predecessors. Are they being experimented on? And if so, why and what for? (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Maisha wrote: "Chapter 5 "

(view spoiler)[I had the same thoughts! When everyone kept exclaiming over Robin's facial features I felt sure that there was some sort of other entity he looked like, rather than just the man whose ward he has become (I can't recall his name now!). I didn't anticipate a half-brother either. It makes me wonder all the more what the goal of their education is. He obviously wants something for himself, something only someone with their origin and their university education can get. (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Chapter 8

(view spoiler)[The etymology of language linking to spell work is so fascinating! I am actually in awe of Kuang's brain in structuring this mammoth novel! (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Maisha wrote: "Chapter 11 [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[I totally get you. I'm still so fascinated and finding myself really enjoying the slow pacing. I don't know why but it really works for me and I just want to spend an endless amount of pages in discussions and lectures with the university students.

Are you reading this physically or listening to the audio? In my audio edition the footnotes are read in a female voice whereas a male one is used for the rest. I like this way of featuring them without it being confusing. I don't really see the point of any of them though. (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Bayan wrote: "Chapter five
Things just started getting interesting.. [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[I didn't anticipate his character emerging. I wonder if their father is purposefully siring children for some unknown purpose or using those he has accidentally made? (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Maisha wrote: "Chapter 13 ..."

(view spoiler)[I feel exactly the same about all these characters. I really don't know how I feel about Griffin. He seems very desperate and willing to put Robin in any circumstance for his own gain and care little of his outcome. Maybe he is jealous of his position when he is starving and suffering?

I can understand why Robin continues to aid him though - he is his blood and also introduced him to the systemic racism inherent in the institute he is working for. Robin has always been aware of it on a personal level but is now exposed to how Babel elevates the wealthy, white British at the expense of the poor and other countries. (hide spoiler)]

[Maisha]

Dannii wrote: "Maisha wrote: "Chapter 11 [spoilers removed]"

I totally get you. I'm still so fascinated and finding myself really enjoying the slow pacing. I don't know why but it really works for me and I just ..."

I am reading the ebook. Can't imagine listening to the audiobook. It's so long! 😅😅
I'm liking the footnotes. They are interesting. Enhancing my reading experience by a lot.

[Maisha]

Dannii wrote: "Bayan wrote: "Chapter five
Things just started getting interesting.. [spoilers removed]"

[spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[ I think it was on purpose. And so far it seems all of his illegitimate children are chinese. His reasons are revealed later on. I couldn't grasp it all properly. But I guess you need to be fluent in Chinese and Cantonese in order to master the silver making art. (hide spoiler)]

[Maisha]

Almost done with the book. So many things are happening at once. I feel kind of overwhelming. Hopefully I''ll be able to finish it tomorrow.

[Dannii]

Maisha wrote: "Dannii wrote: "Maisha wrote: "Chapter 11 [spoilers removed]"

I totally get you. I'm still so fascinated and finding myself really enjoying the slow pacing. I don't know why but it really works for..."

I'm about halfway through now but ended up putting this down for a few days. Not because I was disliking the book (I'm actually loving it so far!) but didn't really have any reading time. Carrying on with it today :)

[Maisha]

Just finished. (view spoiler)[ the ending was so sad. I teared up at the end. I am confused about the last part though. What was Victoire planning to do? Live as a fugitive? Letty was so selfish. She should have died instead (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Maisha wrote: "Chapter 16 a chapter from Ramy's pov! so excited

..."

(view spoiler)[I liked getting to know Remy better, through his interlude. It did make me understand his stance with Hermes and his sadness that Robin didn't include him better. Robin did take the fall for them though, which seems to have gone unappreciated.

I was surprised at Lovell's leniency in letting Robin stay at Babel, aooearring softer towards him afterwards, and not questioning the others about their part in it. I wonder if he was telling the truth about Evie's death or if it was a scare tactic?

Poor Lettie doesn't know what's going on with her friends. I wish they'd let her in. As hard-headed as she is i feel sorry for her, knowing their group is falling apart but not knowing the cause of it. I think I'd internalise everything if i was her! (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

Maisha wrote: "Chapter 25 [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[I was glad to see Robin standing up to his father but I did not expect Lovell's death to end their argument. His death brought his friendship group back together though and he grew especially close to Remy following it. I was so glad to see them rallying around him without question. I wasn't sure I trusted Letty after her initial hesitancy though. She was also the individual who still most believed that they would be treated justly from those in authority, when previous experiences with the others have proven otherwise due to their race or gender. I did feel sorry for her and the way she discovered about the Hermes society though. I didn't expect her to betray their trust or for Remy to die!! (hide spoiler)]

[Dannii]

What an incredible book! It took me almost the entire month to finish it but it was totally worth taking my time with.

[Brigia]

Chapter 1-4
(view spoiler)[ This has been really slow reading for me. I enjoy the setting and I'm curious about the classes that are about to beign, but the tone really is dry and Robin has been a difficult character for me - he is so passive!
I agree that the amount of research done for this book is incredible!
I'm relieved to see that everyone agrees the pace will pick up at some point, so I'm going to stick with it. (hide spoiler)]

[Jenn]

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Date changed. Restarting August 5th 2023. Happy Reading ☺

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[Cinthia]

Might join this one... the book size is daunting!

[Karen]

This is one I've been meaning to read since last year, but the physical size has rather put me off. With it being summer holidays, I've decided I need to start working through some of the books waiting on my shelves.

[Sibil]

The size is not so... welcomy! But hopefully reading it in good company would help! Even if reading it would take longer

chapter 1
(view spoiler)[I went into this one pretty blindly because I didn't want to make too high expectations, so I don't really know what I am getting into, but the first chapter was intriguing, I want to know more about all! I am not the biggest fan of long chapters but... oh well! (hide spoiler)]

[Karen]

Sibil wrote: "The size is not so... welcomy! But hopefully reading it in good company would help! Even if reading it would take longer

chapter 1
[spoilers removed]"

I found myself rather bristling at the attitude shown towards Robin, but I think this is meant to be part of what is being shown. Like you, I haven't read too much about it.

[Karen]

Up to ch4. (view spoiler)[ Horrified by the beating Robin received for getting caught up in a book. Don’t understand why his father doesn’t acknowledge him, and their introduction to Oxford highlights the fact that they don’t seem to fit in here. (hide spoiler)]

[Sibil]

Karen wrote: "Sibil wrote: "The size is not so... welcomy! But hopefully reading it in good company would help! Even if reading it would take longer

chapter 1
[spoilers removed]"

I found myself rather bristlin..."

I agree with you, but I wanted to see more about that!

[Sibil]

Karen wrote: "Up to ch4. [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[I totally agree! I was horrified and baffled, because sure Professor Lovell was unaffectionate and cold, but he doesn't seem like the violent sort. Poor Robin. (hide spoiler)]

Up to chapter 4
(view spoiler)[I am intrigued by Robin "dopplenganger" and I want to know more! Hopefully, things would become clear in the next chapter, I only hope to go back to the book soon.
I wasn't expecting so much racism in Oxford, to be honest. I was expecting a bit, obviously, but not so much. It's not that I am complaining about the book or the author, I am just saying that I was hoping something a tad different for Robin's sake! (hide spoiler)]

[Karen]

Up to ch11. The bond between them is strong, but Robin is, essentially, alone. He’s taking huge risks and I’m struggling to see that it’s worth it.

[Karen]

Sibil wrote: "Karen wrote: "Up to ch4. [spoilers removed]"

[spoilers removed]

Up to chapter 4
I am intrigued by Robin "dopplenganger" and I want to know more! Hopefully, things would become clear in the next ..."

(view spoiler)[ It's hard to see how much of the difficulty they experience in Oxford is presented as we're seeing things through their eyes. There's no doubt it's there - interesting to see how attitudes to race are examined. Used for their knowledge, but still deemed as inferior in some ways. Uncomfortable to read. (hide spoiler)]

[Karen]

Up to ch21. As things unfold it’s increasingly obvious that they are part of a much bigger picture, expendable and very much treated as a commodity.

[Karen]

Up to ch25. The way this is panning out seems grimly inevitable, and I’m wondering what chance we have of anything happening that could offer a little hope.