Irrealismo Reception - the place for comments and enquiries

[Klowey]

Nathanimal wrote: "Thomas wrote: "I think I heard about Walser through The Brothers Quay . . ."

I love The Brothers Quay. They're not a book, but they seem irrealist to me. They seem very influenced by Jan Švankmaje..."

My friend Blaine (new member here) posted photos of his trip to Prague where he saw some marionette shows. I am a total puppet, etc. fan.

[Bill]

Nathanimal wrote: "Puppets, dummies, and manikins are regularly cited as examples of the uncanny. (I kinda hope Bill chimes in here, this is his warren.)"

When my warren is called, I... umm, never mind.

I admit I'm still having trouble understanding the boundary between the irreal and the not-irreal. So I'll just make some vague comments.

I love Prague and Czech puppets. This is worth a look:
Joseph Brandesky, Strings Attached: The Living Tradition of Czech Puppets

A little list, that can use more items:
https://www.goodreads.com/list/user_v...

I vaguely remember the Quays publishing a list of their influences, Walser being one of them. I must admit, I couldn't get into Walser's Selected Stories, and would appreciate other recommendations.

The Quays' Street of Crocodiles is one of my favorite works of art, ever.

"We haven't really talked about the uncanny as a part of irrealism, have we?
I feel a strong connection between the two as well.

[Nathanimal]

Bill wrote: "I must admit, I couldn't get into Walser's Selected Stories, and would appreciate other recommendations."

I'm a big big fan and I have trouble connecting with many of his short stories, too. The Tanners is probably where I really started to love him. Though it might simply have been an accretion thing—I read The Assistant first and was intrigued but didn't quite know what I was reading yet.

All that said, Walser could simply be Bill kryptonite since his characters tend to ramble and seem to delight in avoiding the point.

[Bill]

Nathanimal wrote: "Walser could simply be Bill kryptonite since his characters tend to ramble and seem to delight in avoiding the point."
Thanks. Obviously that has me worried. But let me check into that copy of The Tanners at the library.

[Thoma]

Again I know this isn’t a film discussion group, but have any of you guys seen Perec’s film Un Homme Qui Dort (“A Man Asleep”) which I believe is an adaptation of his novel of the same name

[Nathanimal]

I think I slept through that one.

[Thoma]

Nathanimal wrote: "I think I slept through that one."
Maybe that was the intention haha

[Thoma]

I feel tempted to choose Coin Locker Babies as my next read just so I can get away with mentioning Murakami in the group even though Ryū has no relation to Haruki and from what I can gather are very, very different writers

[Nathanimal]

That's pretty sneaky, Thomas. :-)

[Thoma]

But it’s not technically breaking the rules ;-)

[Thoma]

What are some works of speculative fiction (science fiction, horror, fantasy) you guys would consider irrealist? I’m just about to start reading Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep

[Nathanimal]

Hmmm. If I remember, there were some irreal moments in Ishiguro's The Buried Giant. Susana Clarke's Piranesi might count, too (though it's not as clearly a fantasy book as Jonathan Strange ♥♥♥).

There was a kind of writer that doesn't seem as popular anymore that would blur the boundary between odd otherworldlyness and apocalyptic science fiction, some good examples being David Ohle's Motorman or Matthew Derby's Super Flat Times. They tend to be very 'languagy'—perhaps Ben Marcus is another—and have an odd effect that's often dreamy and 'off,' but not sure whether I'd call it irreal, at least as we've been using that term here in the group.

In my experience (which isn't much), the conventions that genre writers stick to often dash the sense possibility, the mysteriously subconscious nature of existence inherent to irrealism. Also irrealism often has a fair amount of realism in it—it's the irony between the mundane and the 'offness' that gives it much of its effect, I think.

It does seem like there should be more crossover between horror and irrealism but not many examples come to mind. I've heard people call Kafka horror. Maybe The Vegetarian. (Though this shares affinities with Murakami, and I haven't been bold enough to make a case for him in direct defiance of the Group Rules.)

[Nathanimal]

Klowey wrote: "July 1st it is then for Paris Peasant. I'm looking forward to reading the Taylor translation."

I wanted to give people a reminder and enough time to procure the book if they were interested in taking part, so I've started us a Paris Peasant thread. Looking forward to this!

[Nathanimal]

Thomas wrote: "What are some works of speculative fiction (science fiction, horror, fantasy) you guys would consider irrealist?"

Oh, I was just looking through some of the posts in 10 Irrealists Fictions. There seem to be some good recs in there for you, Thomas. Bill suggested some good possibilities for horror, or at least dark irrealist works. And Ali brought up Stanislaw Lem. I think I agree with that, especially if we're talking his more serious books like His Master's Voice or Solaris. I've sensed affinities between Lem & Borges at times.

[Paul]

Nathanimal wrote: "Thomas wrote: "What are some works of speculative fiction (science fiction, horror, fantasy) you guys would consider irrealist?"

Oh, I was just looking through some of the posts in 10 Irrealists F..."

I'd definitely agree with Lem and Ishiguro - the latter's The Unconsoled is in the original ten, of course.

[Paul]

Thomas wrote: "I feel tempted to choose Coin Locker Babies as my next read just so I can get away with mentioning Murakami in the group even though Ryū has no relation to Haruki and from what I can gather are ver..."

You're only allowed to talk about it if you finish it, though, Thomas... Should we anticipate your reading the plays of Sara Pinto Coelho, the novels of Simon Tolkien and the memoirs of Wallace Rowling, New Zealand's former premier?

[Thoma]

Paul wrote: "Thomas wrote: "I feel tempted to choose Coin Locker Babies as my next read just so I can get away with mentioning Murakami in the group even though Ryū has no relation to Haruki and from what I can..."

I recognise some of those names (Coelho, Tolkein and Rowling) but they're only their last names. If those are the ones you're referencing I have next to no interest in them

[Paul]

Thomas wrote: "Paul wrote: "Thomas wrote: "I feel tempted to choose Coin Locker Babies as my next read just so I can get away with mentioning Murakami in the group even though Ryū has no relation to Haruki and fr..."

Erm, I wasn't being entirely serious...

[Nathanimal]

Aw man, I was looking forward to a report on that New Zealander premier's irreal memoir.

[Klowey]

Nathanimal wrote: "Klowey wrote: "July 1st it is then for Paris Peasant. I'm looking forward to reading the Taylor translation."

I wanted to give people a reminder and enough time to procure the book if they were in..."

Thank you. Love the summary. I'm going to read both translations (already read the Brown). If anyone is interested, it looks like there is a used Hardcover of it for $12 and some more expensive ones.

https://www.amazon.com/Nightwalker-pa...

[Nathanimal]

Great. Excited to dive in.

[Klowey]

I want to welcome Fed to the group since, like Blaine and Steve, I recommended it. I met Fed in the "Catching up on the Classics" group. He loves Calvino, Kafka, and many others.

Looking forward to the return of our fearless leader, Paul.

How is everyone? What are you all reading?

[[deleted user]]

Klowey wrote: "I want to welcome Fed to the group..."

Thank you, Klowey, and greetings!

Recent relevant reads: Cosmos by Witold Gombrowicz and, currently, a study of the fragments on Greek philosopher Pyrrho (unintentional inspirer of ancient Skepticism). Can recommend: The Tartar Steppe.

[Paul]

Our fearless leader returns albeit very briefly having been horrendously busy to welcome Fed to the group. The management hopes you enjoy your stay with us, Fed. Expect the room service to be on par with that experienced by K. at the castle or Ryder at the Hoffman Hotel.

I've been reading nothing but academic papers of little relevance to our group here, I fear. What about you, Klowey, any recommendations? 'The Tartar Steppe' sounds intriguing, Fed. Thanks for that.

[Klowey]

Welcome back fearless leader.

Academia doesn't sound too bad, though perhaps not post-modern, or is it?

The Catching up on the Classics group that Fed and I are in has some "challenges" which has lit a fire under me to commit. Fed proposed a buddy read Jan-Mar 2023 of The Man Without Qualities for which I'm doing some preparation reading. Fed also suggested Zeno's Conscience.

I'm currently reading Memories of the Future and The Unnamable. I put By Night in Chile on my to-read list along with more Calvino. However, I am ashamed to say that I don't get the 25 different parties reference. Though I do like the idea. ;-)

Also on my priority to-read list is more Borges, always more. More Beckett, and The Trial. I saw the film by Orson Welles but haven't read that or Amerika, so need to finish up my Kafka and I know he has short stories i'm missed.

Finally, I tried several times to read The Master and Margarita but it's not yet working for me. Any encouraging comments?

Anyway, great to see your message. Maybe our group could come up with some kind of "challenges" later this year.

Catching up on the Classics has a number of different types of 'challenges'. I might like to pair up some books by irreal writers as "double bills." Could make for some good discussions.

P.S.
I finished my cancer treatment in May and am doing great! I should be good for years now and am getting my energy back and my brain fog is fading . . . so no more excuses for not reading!!

[Klowey]

Ah, and, for those who read Paris Peasant in our buddy read, I owe you all a review. I have the French version and two different English translations and someday I want to write a long review and comparison of them.

I've encountered the issue of translation a lot recently. I wasn't aware of what a difference it can make. So now I research translators before I start a foreign book.

[[deleted user]]

Klowey wrote: "I've encountered the issue of translation a lot recently..."

With Kafka's novels, published posthumously, there's also the issue of [Max Brod's] editing. Some critical editions have started to appear lately.

[Klowey]

Fed wrote: "Klowey wrote: "I've encountered the issue of translation a lot recently..."

With Kafka's novels, published posthumously, there's also the issue of [Max Brod's] editing. Some critical editions have..."

Many thanks for the tip before I read Amerika or The Trial.
This group is very interesting. The post on Kafka:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

[Thoma]

I’m reading The Master & Margarita currently and even though I’m having mixed feelings so far I’m persevering with it

Would definitely be up for reading some short story collections though

[Klowey]

I want to wish everyone a Happy New Year and share some books I've read this year. If you want to start a discussion on any, let me know.

Sanatorium Under the Sign of the Hourglass
Odile
The Garden of Forking Paths Collection of 8 stories pub. 1941
The Country of the Blind two versions exist with different endings
Hunger the right translation is critical
Blindness didn't like this one but I'm open to another Saramago

If on a Winter's Night a Traveler I'm rereading and loving it this second time
Concrete finishing up tomorrow . . . really
Memories of the Future on the last story

This Craft of Verse amazing, available in text or on youtube youtube.com/watch?v=YSLV7t9DvN8 with Borges speaking

And a couple of off-group books I liked:
Candide
The Death of Ivan Ilych
Bartleby, the Scrivener: A Story of Wall Street
Stories of Your Life and Others

Plans for this coming year include:
Samuel Beckett: Watt, Murphy
Jorge Luis Borges: Artificios, The Aleph and Other Stories, Shakespeare's Memory
The Invention of Morel a reread
The Master and Margarita
maybe House of Leaves
The Weird: A Compendium of Strange and Dark Stories continuing, it's huge
The Man Without Qualities buddy read with Fed and others
The Gaucho Martín Fierro in conjunction with Borges' A Universal History of Iniquity

And I'm reading Islands of Abandonment and want to follow it with Off the Map: Lost Spaces, Invisible Cities, Forgotten Islands, Feral Places and What They Tell Us About the World sometime. I love your review of OTM Paul.

Comments on any books welcome.

[Klowey]

aspergersaurus wrote: "I’m reading The Master & Margarita currently and even though I’m having mixed feelings so far I’m persevering with it

Would definitely be up for reading some short story collections though"

I read the first few chapters and put it aside. I think it was different from what I was expecting. Going to try again this coming year.

[Paul]

Klowey wrote: "aspergersaurus wrote: "I’m reading The Master & Margarita currently and even though I’m having mixed feelings so far I’m persevering with it

Would definitely be up for reading some short story col..."

It was recommended to me, Klowey. I appreciated it but didn't feel it quite lived up to the hype some people had surrounded it with. I can't really remember why, though, now!

[Erik]

Dear Irrealists
Interesting group here; nice discussions and reading tips. To some of it I am most familiar (Kafka, Perec, Sebald...) as they are among my all time favorite authors, with Laszlo Krasznahorkai my absolute favorite living author (he was good friends with Sebald).

It's the unknown that draws me towards this adventurous reading group. So I'll try something out this new year.

[Paul]

Dear Erik
Welcome to the Hotel. We look forward to your contributions to our establishment.
Sebald and Krasznahorkai were friends? Well, now that's something the management didn't know.
Felicitations
The Managment

[Erik]

Hi Paul
Thanks for the welcoming words.

Here’s an interview where Laszlo Krasznahorkai LK) talks about his friendship with Sebald, among other interesting topics.

https://www.musicandliterature.org/fe...

I hope the interview invites to read LK’s ‘War &War’ (as well as his other works of course) which I reread when it appeared in Dutch translation (Jan 2022). Strangely enough the war in Ukraine started shortly afterwards, which further increased its (allegorical/ prophetic?) relevance.
Hope you enjoy the depth at which LK communicates. He has quite an exceptional mind.

[Paul]

I have read some LK and enjoyed it. I haven't read W&W though.

[Thoma]

so what yall reading currently then?

[Klowey]

aspergersaurus wrote: "so what yall reading currently then?"

And what are your reading, your plans?

I've lined my reading up with the "Catching up on Classics" challenges, which leaves me lots of room to read what I want, but gives me structure, motivation, and deadlines.

Currently reading:
Memories of the Future
The 39 Steps quick light read for Feb monthly
The man Without Qualities vol. 1
and in conjunction
Fin-de-Siècle Vienna: Politics and Culture

Rereading:
If on a Winter's Night a Traveler and loving the second time around.
The History Of World Literature, which I like and find rich and informative.

And I have a question to the group. A friend just started Infinite Jest. I've gone back and forth on whether to put it on my reread list for later, but the reviews are pretty extreme on both sides. I really respect the views of this group. Has anyone read it or have an opinion?

[Paloma]

hi all! my name is paloma, just joined this group because yesterday i finished Calvino's If on a Winter's Night a Traveler, and it left me with such a unique taste in my mouth that i just need to have more. this space is incredibly niche on goodreads, and in my personal life i don't get many recommendations for "irrealist" reading material - the description of "irrealism" is precisely what my favorite novel is, so here i am!

i've read most of Borges' Ficciones, my favorite is The Circular Ruins, lots of Kafka, Calvino's complete Cosmicomics, Cortázar, and my absolute favorite novel is Pedro Páramo. i believe you could call those irrealist; i am still quite new to this genre, as mostly i've read lots of magical realism and surrealist work, so any recommendations are greatly appreciated!

very excited to join this space :)

[Klowey]

Welcome Paloma!
Our fearless leader, Paul, is occasionally busy but I'm sure will appear sometime and also welcome you. Your interests sound like a perfect fit.

I am halfway through my second reading of If on a Winter's Night a Traveler and am loving it. I think it's even better on a reread. I want to read more Calvino and have not yet read Cortázar but am interested.

My favorite writer is Borges. The Circular Ruins is wonderful. My favorite is probably The Immortal. Kafka and Samuel Beckett round out my top 3 favorite writers.

Great to have you here!

[Paul]

Hi Paloma

Echoing Klowey, I should like to say, 'welcome to the hotel!'

You sound like an ideal guest - impeccable taste there. Ah, what a book IOAWNAT is... The Hotel is undoubtedly an unusual institution within GR.

Yes, Cortázar definitely qualifies for inclusion here. A terrific writer.

If you meander through the corridors and rooms here, you'll find plenty of recommendations from our illustrious guests.

Enjoy your stay

The Hotel Manager

[Paul]

Ed wrote: "Paul wrote: "Well, you've put me in my place, haven't you, Ed?

I definitely wasn't trying to do anything of the sort. Why would I? How would that benefit me to insult a stranger who runs a discuss..."

Hi Ed. I was thinking about getting some discussion going on here again and read my response to your comment. I don't think I was in a very good frame of mind at the time and my reply was unhelpfully belligerent. I owe you an apology.

[Ed]

Paul wrote: "... my reply was unhelpfully belligerent. ..."

No worries.