After the Fall, Before the Fall, During the Fall: Finished Reading **SPOILERS**

[Candiss]

Here's a general topic for people who have finished reading After the Fall, Before the Fall, During the Fall by Nancy Kress

Caution: Spoilers are likely in this thread!

[Shel, Moderator]

I nominated this one and am so glad the group chose it. I loved the way that Nancy Kress wove the storylines together of the different timelines. The back-and-forth reminded me a bit of Eifelheim by Michael Flynn (it's a very different book, otherwise, but it's amazing and I highly recommend it).

I liked how it wasn't Julie who was saved at the end, but her daughter - that was a clever twist. And also one that really socked me in the gut, as a mother.

Who wants to speculate about the Tesslies? Have they discovered the pitiful remnants of humanity and attempted to save them? Were they bystanders watching humanity destroy itself and only interfering at the last moment? Are they from the future of humanity, being sent back in time to save themselves in some sort of weird paradox?

[aPriL does feral sometimes]

I think the premise of something trying to save Mankind, like aliens, may not make sense, to me. If humans are the cause of a fatal disease to the planet Earth, they should not be permitted to repopulate the Earth again. As the children demonstrate, fighting over the women for sex, and the obvious remaining presence of our basic human biology of greed, desire and selfishness are still part of the remaining humans' genetic code.

[aPriL does feral sometimes]

P.S. I loved Eifelheim!

[Jim]

Shel wrote: "Who wants to speculate about the Tesslies? Have they discovered the pitiful remnants of humanity and attempted to save them? Were they bystanders watching humanity destroy itself and only interfering at the last moment? Are they from the future of humanity, being sent back in time to save themselves in some sort of weird paradox? "

It was not explained by the author. Considering the shortness of the book (more a novella than a novel), there was plenty of room to do that. So I must conclude that it was left to the reader to speculate on purpose. My own guess is that the descendants of the Shell refugees became sufficiently skillful scientifically to send "agents" back in time to intervene for humanity's good. But not skillful enough to circumvent the disaster that destroyed the world, aided by nuclear retalliation, the effects of which prevented the Shell people from having an independently viable breeding population.

[Jim]

aPriL does feral sometimes wrote: "I think the premise of something trying to save Mankind, like aliens, may not make sense, to me. If humans are the cause of a fatal disease to the planet Earth, they should not be permitted to repopulate the Earth again. As the children demonstrate, fighting over the women for sex, and the obvious remaining presence of our basic human biology of greed, desire and selfishness are still part of the remaining humans' genetic code. "

I found the actions of the humans in the Shell to be about as logical as one might expect considering the hellacious circumstances with which they are faced. Certainly a step or two up from "Lord of the Flies". I see the author's intent as being to explore such a scenario in a non-judgmental way and let the reader decide if the end justifies the means.

[[deleted user]]

I am not sure what I really think about this book. I found that I was more interested in the personal relationships of the characters, whether those between Julie and her brother and Julie and Gordon or Pete, McCallister and Ravi than I was with who the Tesslies were and what led to the ecological catastrophe that led to the end of human civilization. However, I did like the interplay between the three different periods that the story unfolds over and how Nancy Kress brings them all together. I was less impressed by the lecture on Gaia at the end of the story and the fact who the Tesslies were appeared, to me at least, to be ignored. Maybe I was just expecting more from Nancy Kress and I have missed something in the telling of the story,

[Chris, Moderator]

I thought this was a well told story. It certainly left a lot of open questions, such as the nature of the Tesslies. I agree that it got preachy near the end; are we supposed to think that Gaia intentionally set off earthquakes and tsunamis?? But I thought the interactions in the Shell were believably human, and the storytelling style across timelines really worked to keep me entertained.

[aPriL does feral sometimes]

I think the Tesslies were space aliens. I think they set up intentional tsunamis to destroy humanity, but they saved at random some humans. I think they were doing the minimum possible to save humans, seeing us as stock like cattle or sheep. Why should they see us as responsible beings? After all, our observed behavior before, during and after was no different than farm animals - sex, eats, physical comforts.

Plus, we clearly were making the earth unfit for mammals to survive in the long run - destroying the ocean life with plastic, fertilizers, poisonous trash, and drugs which change the sex of sea creatures to all females and no males; filling the air with toxins we and other animals can't breathe; poisoning all fresh water sources with chemicals from mining and manufacturing processes, and wasting what fresh water is left; and doing nothing to stop the proliferation of nuclear weapons in unstable countries as well as no one doing much in maintenance of nuclear weapons (American soldiers drunk and high while 'guarding' missiles with little oversight).

Gee, good thing all of this is just fiction, right? It sure would be stupid of humanity to be doing stuff to wreck our planet for realsies? If we were REALLY wrecking the earth, haha, I am surprised even something like the Tesslies would bother trying to save such an obviously braindead species which is fouling and poisoning its own nest!

Haha. Ha.

[Jim]

aPriL does feral sometimes wrote: "I think the Tesslies were space aliens. I think they set up intentional tsunamis to destroy humanity, but they saved at random some humans...."

I think this underscores my previous point. Kress left it up to the reader to speculate on the nature of the Tesslies. Nothing wrong with that in that it leaves room for many interpretations.

But if she comes out with a sequel.........