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The Name of the Wind
Read books as they come out? Or wait till the whole series is in print?
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I keep telling myself that I won't start anymore unfinished series, but I keep doing it. My worry is that the series won't be completed, not that quality will decrease
Alex wrote: "By the OP's logic, I would never have read Rothfuss, George R.R. Martin, Scott Lynch, Brent Weeks, Mark Lawrence, or a slew of other authors that have series in progress. "I gave up on Scott Lynch when I saw how many Gentlemen Bastard books he had planned. It took twenty two years of my life to finish the Wheel of Time, and frankly the end (much as I enjoyed it) didn't feel like what Jordan himself would have written, and I consider the series unfinished. Rothfuss at least intends an end to his series; Martin has more or less hinted that he has no intention of ever finishing Ice and Fire. May never have had.
No, I'm done with bloated fantasies. People forget that the Lord of the Rings was only one book, and Tolkien finished it before he published it. Some people are fine with cliffhangers, but I'm not one of them. I like an ending.
I, too, dislike incomplete series. My biggest problem with them is the urge to reread earlier volumes before continuing the series. I must have read the first four of Katharine Kerr's Deverry series at least three times, and I still haven't read the whole thing! Eventually, I will want to go back through them all one final time, if only to get the series finished. I also start getting lost as to where I am up to when waiting for books to be released. Which book DID I last read in the above series? *scratches head*Yet I can't seem to resist hopping into new series regardless. I am itching to start on Name of The Wind, dammit. With Song of Ice and Fire, I am working through the series veeeeeeeery slowly, in the hopes that I will not have too long to wait for new stuff to come out. We'll see how that works out. ;p
Stephen King almost died before finishing The Dark Tower series. Since then it's been my rule not to read an incomplete series.Sometimes I break my rule completely (hello, Harry Dresden), and other times I forget it until I'm reminded that it'll be a looooong wait (goodbye, Song of Ice and Fire)
Mod
I try not to have TOO many series started at once, but there are just too many good ones going on right now that I like for that to happen:
Dresden Files
Stormlight Archive
Kingkiller Chronicles
Song of Ice & Fire
And I'm about to jump into
Gentleman Bastards
And there are several others I want to get to at some point.
I'll be honest, I usually don't know that its not finished. On the times that I've read a series that is already complete its been a nice surprise, but I'm always trying new authors and new books out these days and then plow through the series when I find a book 1 I enjoy. I guess the way I read them is a result of the fact that I rarely plan what I'm reading. It looks interesting, I read it.
I just read whatever sounds good. If the next book is not out yet, there is plenty of other stuff to read while I wait. I also don't tend to read one right after another in a series either. Seems like everything is part of a series anymore anyway-so I jump between things depending on availability and interest. If something starts to lose my interest, the next book will slide down my list and if I never get around to finishing it-it's not to big a deal because I'm wrapped up in other things I am really enjoying. I think if I waited years for a series to be done before I started and ended up not liking it anymore around book 3 or 4-I'd be super let down.
It depends on the series for me. I'll never read the Wheel of Time books because it's so overwhelming with 14 books and how long the last few are. I'd rather read as they are published so I can join in on discussion and so I don't have thousands of pages to read when it's finished. Also if a series is really popular like ASOIAF, I don't want to have to avoid spoilers forever.
I often pick book more or less at random from my shelves to read (I'll sometimes buy 4 to 5 books at a time, read 1 or 2 and shelve the others) so in some cases it's been 20 or 30 years between books in a series.I find that if a book is well written I don't really care if there's an "end" to the overarching plot and I can usually pick up and remember enough from a recap to enjoy later books.
It's part of the (admittedly frustrating) fun isn't it? There are also plenty of book series that are finished if you don't want to wait.
I like reading books as they come out. I also don't mind the wait for a new one. It's part of the fun.
It depends on the KIND of series. For me there are two very distinct series types: 1) The overarching story kind. LotR is the archetype here. There might be subplots but there's one main plot that spans the entire series (Destroy the Ring, Recover the Sword, whatever). Each book is an installment in the story and they often need both the book before and after to really make sense. The books also tend to be paced more slowly in might leave cliffhangers at the end.
2) The repeating theme kind. These are set in the same world, but each book is a standalone story in that world. The evolution is in the characters and the world, not the plot. Dresden Files is like this for me; there's not an overarching goal and each story can be read on its own. Because characters change over time and the later books happen after the earlier ones, you might get more out of reading earlier volumes but the stories are standalone.
I'll read the second kind of series if it's incomplete since each story works on its own and the progression of characters or the world in each volume does too. However I'm not interested in reading the first kind, not even if it's Sanderson and his Stormlight series.
For example, if Jim Butcher never writes another Dresden novel I'd wonder what was going to happen but I don't really feel like some larger main story is left hanging. Certain plot points would be (view spoiler) but it wouldn't be a WoT/ASoiaF/LotR style thing. on the other hand, if LotR had stopped after Fellowship the book wouldn't make sense.
I actually enjoy diversity in my reading, so I normally have a ton of unfinished series.I like to have the option to revisit a series later. And for unfinished ones I like the anticipation. One of my favourite things to do is search through to-be-released lists and wait for a new installment. My joy, when I have the book finally in my hands is greater than just stumbling onto the next book. It's weird, but it's me and I'm okay with that.^^
I'm always looking for new authors. I dont care if the series is finished or not. I often find that I need breaks between the books of series with a few exceptions. For example, I could not read Malazan all in a row. I also secretly enjoy the anticipation within reason (for example Martin turned me off with the wait among other things). That bring said, I can't say I've finished every series I've started, and sometimes it takes me a while due to forgetting about one. If I'd waited until WoT finished, I'd likely not have finished at all.
I do both with different series so I can bitch about it either way :)Depends how impatient I am
Speaking only for myself, I feel I am missing out on the experience if I just wait until a series is complete before starting it. Part (a great deal) of the pleasure is the anticipation. At least this is how I feel regarding literature.And if you haven't read Rothfuss yet, go do it.
I really don't care if the book I'm reading is part of an ongoing series or not. If I feel like reading a book I do it,if the book's part of an ongoing series I'll just reread the books before the release of a new installment.
The only series I've ever declared I'd wait until it was finished was the Wheel of Time - and that was only because it was such a HUGE world and it too SO LONG between titles releasing that I would lose track of who was who and what was where... And they're just not worth re-reading that many times. Now that they're all out, I'll finally get around to reading the series. Once. Otherwise? There are too many good series and good books happening right now NOT to keep reading them as they come out. Looking forward to new releases means that I get that "Christmas" effect all year 'round. I put the release dates for favorite series & authors on my calendar, so I can keep track of what is coming up, and enjoy the anticipation. :-)
ladymurmur wrote: "The only series I've ever declared I'd wait until it was finished was the Wheel of Time ... Now that they're all out, I'll finally get around to reading the series. Once. ..."My advice to a friend about to start the Wheel of Time was that there is nothing wrong with using Wikipedia to replace some of the middle books. I liked the first 3 or 4 but the series got sloggier and sloggier until a book or so before Sanderson took over. I honestly think that the weight of pushing the Wheel of Time forward was becoming harder for Jordan as the backstory increased.
Like the OP, Goodkind broke me of some of my series reading habits. I used to finish any series I seriously started but Goodkind's later books broke me of that habit. I still have no idea how that series ended (if it did) though I'm guessing that the hero turned out be John Galt ;)
I'm starting to lean toward the wait til its finished club. I haven't read the most recent Game of Thrones book and will not read it until the series is done. Since I think its far more likely that GRRM dies before finishing its up to the TV show to tell me how things end. However I'm not fully there. I'm currently listening to Cold Days in the Dresden Files and I'll read anything Brandon Sanderson puts out. Those writers though are far more prolific then some like GRRM that take many years between books.
Mod
I couldn't disagree more. If he stopped now, I'd be pissed. There is way more going on than your spoiler that need resolving.
There can be such a lag time from the start to the finish of a series...the books can all go out of print/be really hard to find by the time the last one comes out.Series I'm still waiting to see finished: Diane Duane's Door Into series (the last one should be Starlight); Rosemary Kirstein's Steerswoman series; Laurie Marks' elemental Logic series (Water Logic had to find an indie publisher). I don't know if P.C. Hodgell is planning a definite end to Jame's saga, but the rathorn ride is a trip.
I also had the experience fairly early on, with the Xanth books, that when a series stops being fun just drop it. At least these days I can read the wikipedia entry on those last few Thomas Covenant books if I really want to know.
I'm not really into super long series to begin with unless they're broken into smaller semi-selfcontained arcs. That being said I tend to read them as I come across them. I'm not willing to wait for years for a series to finish before figuring out if I'm even into it.
But I have no problem with reading book 1 in a series and never returning to that series again.
But I have no problem with reading book 1 in a series and never returning to that series again.
Rob wrote: "Rick wrote: "For example, if Jim Butcher never writes another Dresden novel I'd wonder what was going to happen but I don't really feel like some larger main story is left hanging. Certain plot poi..."But there's no one overall story like WoT, etc. Yes, we know Butcher's going somewhere because he's said that, but the structure of the series doesn't require it whereas the structure of something like LotR, WoT or ASioaF does.
I don't want to derail the thread, but the point to me is that there are different KINDS of series and some you can pick up and read a book or two in and be fine. Others are one big story arc divvied up over many volumes and you really need to read them in order and read them all.
PS: And yes, in a series like Dresden Files there are plot points that would be left hanging if Butcher stopped now, but not a story arc really. Had Butcher never said anything about his plans for the series we'd not know. In WoT etc the main arc that holds the volumes together would be left hanging were the series never finished.
PPS: Jo Walton says this better than I am.
The Lord of the Rings isn’t a series, it’s one long book published in three volumes for technical bookbinding reasons. Cherryh’s Union Alliance books are a series, they’re all independent stories with their own plots and their own characters, but set in the same universe. Away from those extremes there are Bujold’s Vorkosigan books and Brust’s Vlad books where the books are about the same characters but are all independent stories and you can start pretty much anywhere, and in contrast Sarah Monette’s Doctrine of Labyrinths books and Daniel Abraham’s Long Price Quartet where the individual books have their own story arcs but the later volumes really aren’t going to make as much sense if you haven’t read the earlier volumes.
So, there’s style one, The Lord of the Rings, one book with extra pieces of cardboard.
There’s style two, Doctrine of Labyrinths, where you have some volume closure but need to read the books in order.
There’s style three, Vlad and Vorkosigan, where the cumulative effect of reading all of them is to give you a story arc and more investment in the characters, but it doesn’t really matter where you start and whether you read them in order.
And there’s style four, Union Alliance, where the volumes are completely independent of each other though they may reflect interestingly on each other.
http://www.tor.com/blogs/2009/04/so-w...
Mod
Who said anything about trading? Rick was saying he wouldn't be too upset if it suddenly ended. I'm saying I'd be pissed.
Rick wrote: "But there's no one overall story like WoT, etc. Yes, we know Butcher's going somewhere because he's said that, but the structure of the series doesn't require it whereas the structure of something like LotR, WoT or ASioaF does."
I'd have agreed with that maybe back in the beginning. I think there is definitely an overarching story tying everything together, and that it's been building up a lot longer than it's been apparent.
I'm just about to finish up a re-read of the whole series and while there isn't say Malazan level foreshadowing, there is a fair bit of it.
That said, Mr. Butcher does structure the books in a way that you can probably read them out of order and just focus on the story not be too confused, but I think it's unfair to say there isn't a larger story at play.
I liken the structure more to a tv series. You have that week's story, and you have the elements of the overall story.
However, since probably White Night the main story of each book is building block in the main story rather than just some side story.
I agree with Rick's point that it depends on the kind of series. If there's one story arc running through several volumes, I'd rather wait until the last one is published, then read them all in order. But if they are just a collection of stories set in the same world, I'm fine reading a few and waiting for others to be published.
I definitely wouldn't wait, for a number of reasons. One is simply the sheer wall of words: I'd look at the stack of books and think "life's too short." That's why I've never read the Honor Harrington series, to name just one - there are just too damn many books!Another reason is that if nobody buys the ongoing books in the series, that's a real disincentive for both the author and the publisher to keep going. Yes I know it's not the reader's job to care, but without readers, there will be no books. Ergo, you are biting the hand that feeds you.
Imagine what'd happen if everyone waited for the final season to be finished before watching a TV show... It'd be off the air before the end of the first episode!
Rob wrote: "Alex wrote: "Rob, sure you'd be pissed, but would you really trade that for never have experienced the beauty that is the Dresden Files?"Who said anything about trading? Rick was saying he wouldn..."
No, I didn't say that. Read again:
if Jim Butcher never writes another Dresden novel I'd wonder what was going to happen but I don't really feel like some larger main story is left hanging.
The Files don't have one large quest style arc to the story. There are arcs and issues to be resolved, but it's simply not like a LotR series where destroying the Ring is THE point of the series. Look, I know you can read them out of order because I've done it. I started with Summer Knight and it was fine.
You're confusing, I think, the fact that the Dresden Files world is changing as the series progresses with a linear, predetermined arc to the story. In a series with a predetermined arc (LotR style), you kind of have to read them in order. In a Dresden files series it might help, but it's not required. In Walton's terms WOT/ASIOF etc are either type 1 or 2 series. Dresden Files feels like a type 3 to me.
My entire point in these posts isn't really about any one series though, it's to bring out the fact that there are different kinds of series and so if we discuss how we approach a series it's good to talk about which kind of series we mean.
Mod
If you read them out of order, or spread out, it may be less apparent, but it's been there since at least book 4.
You're entitled to your opinion, but I think you've missed some of the subtleties of what he's been doing.
I do agree there are different types of series, but I think Dresden has changed from the type into something much bigger.
I think Discworld might be a better example.
Ah, I think you and I are talking past each other a bit. Dresden might well have a hidden story arc but the it's not something that means you NEED to read the books in order so that you can understand what's going on UNLIK, say, in LotR, etc where you simply CAN'T read them out of order and have them make sense. Internally, you can most certainly read the Dresden Files out of order and have them make sense. You might miss some things, but they make sense. You can't do that with a type 1 or 2 series.
You're also wildly wrong about my reading of the series - I read everything available last August. The entire series, including Side Jobs, in 5 weeks. I certainly see the progression but to me a hidden story arc is quite different from one that's an explicitly admitted thread that ties the volumes together. Not only that, but some of what is happening here is the evolution of things in the Dresden world - the characters, but also their situations and the world at large. That's the kind of thing that one enjoys more if you read the series in order but it's also not essential to read the books in order to make sense of the series.
I'm also gonna stop here as I think we're derailing the thread. I'm fine with you not agreeing with me if you still don't and I'd rather leave it here than turn this into our debate thread.
I love the discussion and appreciate the input - when I initially posed the question I was thinking more of your epic fantasy (LOTR, SOIAF, Wheel of Time etc.) - I like the description of "they are one long story told over many books" because that is what my problem is with some of the series...when I was reading Wheel of Time (as it came out) I would have to spend a couple days just trying to remember what the hell happened in the previous 5 books so that I didn't miss anything in the new book.Books like Dresden or Scalzi's series (Old Man's War) I seem to be able to handle differently as opposed to something like Memory Sorrow & Thorn.
Great discussion - keep it coming
I'm happy to pick up a series long before it ends. I'm too used to series starting well then just going on too long and dropping in quality. I prefer to check out a good book, and if there are sequels - that's just a bonus. I like knowing I can visit characters or worlds I like again when I feel like it.When a series takes too long to write, I find it's better to read them as the author writes, otherwise the inconsistencies across a decade of narrative can stand out too much.
Discworld is a great example, there is really no reason to read all of those books in order right from the start.
On the other hand, Orson Scott Card books do build on one another, but really vary in quality. And I did read all the current Song of Ice and Fire books in a 2 month marathon, and that was way too much. I stopped appreciating them as much by the end and would likely have preferred to have started earlier with more enforced breaks.
I like to immerse myself in a world, so I have no problem with reading a long series, and finding a new (to me) series that is already done is great for me. But since few authors indicate on the cover of a novel that the first book is the first of twelve or whatever, I have often found myself playing the waiting game and getting angry when book 3 doesn't wrap up the story. WoT did this - at the end of book 3 I was disappointed, after book 6 I was frustrated and by book 9 I was pissed and stopped reading (they were pretty crappy in the middle too). Goodkind did this also. And I've stopped reading GRRM.Give me a nice tight trilogy, and I'm happy to wait a year or two between books. But drag it on and on and I will give up. But also, books like the Dresden Files, each stands alone enough that I'm not too frustrated. And Butcher has said it will be about 20 books total, so I know what I'm in for. He has a plan. I trust him to follow it through.
Also Jim Butcher doesn't seem likely to die anytime soon, so there's that also, while GRRM looks like he could go at any time. And I don't trust GRRM and I feel sure he wants to drag his story out for as long and lucrative a return as he possibly can, whether the story needs needs that many books or not.
Mod
He's also averaging slightly over a book a year since the series started: 15 books in 13 years, 1 month (assuming Skin Game comes out in December like it seems to be slated).
Mind you the books are shorter, and his pace has slowed the last 3 books or so, but that's still a much faster rate than most series.
I don't wait for the entire series to complete before diving head first into a story. At the same time I hate waiting on a writer to crank out the books. I look for trilogies that are complete, or I wait for 3 or 4 books to come out if it is a longer series.
For those of you who don't have any problem reading an unfinished series.. once the series is complete, do you reread it from the begining or simply pick up where you left off?
I agree with Alex! I will often reread, either the complete series (if it isn't too long or if I have the time) or the previous book or two to whet my appetite for the new one. Especially if the lag between books is lengthy.
ladymurmur wrote: "I agree with Alex! I will often reread, either the complete series (if it isn't too long or if I have the time) or the previous book or two to whet my appetite for the new one. Especially if the la..."So basically all George R.R. Martin books.
If I were reading GRRM, then yes, I'd likely reread them. Not a series that I was able to get in to.
ladymurmur wrote: "If I were reading GRRM, then yes, I'd likely reread them. Not a series that I was able to get in to."I tried to read it too, but it could not compell me past the first book. The same with Stephen King's Dark Tower series. So there are two series that I don't feel the need to stay abreast.
Robert wrote: "ladymurmur wrote: "If I were reading GRRM, then yes, I'd likely reread them. Not a series that I was able to get in to."I tried to read it too, but it could not compell me past the first book. Th..."
For me, it was the fact that Nothing. Good. Ever. Happened. to those poor people! I was so depressed reading the first book, that I put it down not even half way through. Many people love it - I'm glad for them. Plenty of other series out there for me to follow!
I have no problem jumping in the middle of a series that's incomplete. I often do this by accident by browsing book shelves and one catching my eye and I buy it no knowing its part of a series at all. I'll re-read them too if the series interests me enough while I wait for the next book, and to be honest if I didn't I'd probably be bankrupt from book purchases :), if I just can't get into it, than no I'll just leave it at the one though I can't honestly remember when that last was the case.
Right now I'd say it would be impossible to avoid spoilers for A Song of Ice and Fire.
The Sword and Laser
Books mentioned in this topic
Skin Game (other topics)White Night (other topics)
I've lately been rethinking that rule because it seems I'm missing some great discussions on books (e.g. Name of the Wind) and it's also killing me to hear great things about books and not be able to read them.
Am I the only one that waits for the entire series to be in print before starting? Have others been burned as I have? Any thoughts on if I should rethink my rule...