Twilight
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Why did none of the vampires try to make a difference to the world or do something more useful?
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Gerd wrote: "Sandi wrote: "Smart people though recognize what it lacks and this is why all the questions about it are being posted."You do have to wonder how smart they can be, though, if they search for deep..."
Exactly! This novel was not meant to be literary, and I don't think Meyer herself even thought she was writing some earth-moving literary piece. This novel was just meant to entertain the audience, which was geared toward tweens and teens. So what if the vampires of Meyer's world did not try to make a difference in the world. There are a lot of characters in a lot of different books that are even more self-centered and egotistical. Why not pick on those characters as well?
St wrote :I am doing some of the things I have suggested in my posted question and I love doing them. I love being a part of research that tries to help the world to be sustainable and I love going to university. This is WHY I asked it to begin with because I don't know how people who live forever can just sit around repeating the high school curriculum. In Edward's case especially seeing as he can listen to what every student is thinking, that must be annoying to a level I can't even imagine.Heidi replied: I think thats awesome that you're doing that. Coming from that mind frame I can understand why you asked the question. I have said if I hit the lottery and never had to work again - after I had traveled and had some fun, I would love to be a part time student. Always learning and going to class of whatever I wanted to learn about. Part of me understands going to school over and over again, but thats college, NOT high school. I will add in, I don't personally know anyone who has done any of the things you have suggested. Thats what mind frame I was coming from. Not that I was opposed to your thinking at all(its a brilliant idea), but that I myself can not realistically relate to it.
Jeni said:I suppose the simple answer is that vampires can be motivated (or not) just as their mortal counterparts are(or are not) motivated to do something. Some will do great things, others will not.
Heidi replied: exactly what I was trying to get across, but more eloquently put.
Iibellue said:You know, people who have completed high school don't live as if they are frozen in time. There are more practical ways to get up to date on recent development in science, and trends in general.
Heidi replied: Agreed. I don't think they were going there for the educational value at all. If anything being around high school students can teach them about socialization. They don't even need to socialize with people, just observe.
Mochaspresso said:I didn't get the impression that Twilight vampires actually had the maturity of adults, though. They were stuck in whatever developmental/emotional stage they were in when they turned. They only seemed more mature than today's teens because of the time periods that they were from. For example, in Edward's day, boys were going off to war and people got married and had kids at 17 and 18. In Jasper's time, they were even younger.
Heidi replied: Agreed. I think the same happens with a lot of people abused or addicted or just growing up in general. I myself moved out when I was 18 years old. For years I blamed my parents for a lot of things that were going on in my life. Sadly, it wasn't until I was 30 did I realize that everything up until 18 I could blame my parents for (childishly), but the second I moved out - I made and drove my own destiny. It's the whole cycle of (kid) My parents know nothing (young adult) My parents know a little (adult) My parents know what they are talking about, but we have different on opinions. But I regress - they were portrayed as kids, and while they SHOULD have grown up, there are still grown ups that I've seen that still have Peter Pan Syndrome. For some reason Jerry Springer comes to mind. As an adult, (which there are kids on there a lot I know)when I hear Jerry say "watch for their shocking reactions!" shocking to me would be everyone remain calm and be able to speak about things like civilized adults. How often do you see that?
Amy wrote: "Gerd wrote: "Sandi wrote: "Smart people though recognize what it lacks and this is why all the questions about it are being posted."You do have to wonder how smart they can be, though, if they se..."
Well, most times we can detect underlying themes and get the message that the novel has layers. It is hard to see layers here because Twilight is what it is. Sometimes we go looking in murky water and come out with zip. Twilight has no real historical meaning. It doesn't doesn't seem to symbolize anything about any certain period the way Dracula does. For instance we know that Dracula is symbolic to the old aristocracy which is being phased out because of new inventions and more modern times. Twilight's main focus is the love triangle. Still, it has an entertaining value.
Olivia wrote: "ok"In the words of Inigo Montoya "you keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means". Ok isn't really a dialogue. It is OK to silently agree with people without posting. In fact, if not accompanied by more thoughts, its usually prefered. Unless you agree or even disagree with thats posted and want to expand on that thought of "why you agree or disagree". Even then just "ok" isn't really a full thought. Because ok could mean you agree with someone, ok could mean that you were just paying attention, or ok could just mean you're confused. Ok? See right there ok was used more to make sure not only that you were paying attention, but that you understand the concept of what I was trying to express. If we all posted ok to everything, there would be little to no dialogue. Here is an example of someone using ok, actually a dirivitive of ok being kay in a sentence, with hilarity -*** Warning there is bad words in the following link*** http://www.damnfunnytexts.com/1821/le...
Also counterproductive to conversation, but okay. :)I lost track of the train of thought before it was derailed there, but for whatever reason my comment was singled out and I still don't understand exactly why.
Having said that, the comment I made about the Volturi is what I consider a valid argument why I don't think they are a good enough reason to stay under cover. SM put them into the story as a tension builder and basically a reason for Bella to hurry her conversion along.
They were a perceived threat that was looming over the entire Cullen family that never came to fruition after hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of pages. If the Volturi aren't going to do anything when I break vampire rules about other things, they aren't going to do anything when I become the local weather girl on tv. It's just my own take on that particular part of the story.
Not sure what that has to do with Dracula, since I never mentioned it, but I could have easily missed a post that caused my confusion. Thought I would clarify a bit.
ST wrote: "Olivia wrote: "ok"I like potatoes."
lawl!
You know Olivia's first language isn't English, right?
Jeni wrote: "Also counterproductive to conversation, but okay. :)I lost track of the train of thought before it was derailed there, but for whatever reason my comment was singled out and I still don't underst..."
Over reply after reply after reply of just "ok" I take counterproductive anyday. Reacting to something someone posted is silly is one thing. Posting ok and not really elaborating what is ok perturbs me.
Jeni wrote: "You know Olivia's first language isn't English, right?"Yep.
I understand the frustration, but English is her second language and she posts a lot on these threads because she likes Twilight. I'm just not fond of mocking someone because they're learning the language.
I'm encouraging her to open dialogue. To further that skill of learning. Saying the same one word in another language is not learning the language.
Olivia wrote: "that is true there. just wondering in half of the movies or tv serise about vamp, do they ever make a diff? "
Great question. Movies - Blade helped save humans. TV series, people could arguably say the Angel series made a difference to the world in being a private investigator. For the people he did detective work for at least. Thats the only ones I can think of.
Heidi wrote: "Olivia wrote: "that is true there. just wondering in half of the movies or tv serise about vamp, do they ever make a diff? "
Great question. Movies - Blade helped save humans. TV series, people c..."
Daybreakers was pretty interesting. The world somehow contracted the vampire disease leaving very little surviving humans. What humans they had left were hunted for blood up to the point where the humans were on the verge of extinction. A scientist that's a vampire was urging his company to make a synthetic blood source but they rejected it. After that, he meets a group of humans that were hiding out from the government and he decided that he'd help them. Eventually, he found the cure for this disease and good things happened after that. But yeah, totally different from most vampire movies I've seen.
Kasabuta wrote: "Daybreakers was pretty interesting. ..."I like the fact the homeless and destitutes in that world were vampires begging for blood from other vampires because they couldn’t afford what little blood there was left. I was like wow, that detail has never crossed my imagination at all.
ST wrote: "And Gerd, LOL that is insulting jeez. I like to discuss the books I read okaay?? I get that you liked it and that's good! but "You do have to wonder how smart they can be, though, if they search for deeper meanings in a (YA) romance. :D " is somewhat offensive..."Tee-hee, sorry.
But some people do make you wonder when they lay "twilight" under a microscope and find it to come short in the face of the question of life, the universe and everything...
Heidi wrote: "Great question. Movies - Blade helped save humans. TV series, people could arguably say the Angel series made a difference to the world in being a private investigator. For the people he did detective work for at least. Thats the only ones I can think of."
Gabriel Knight, Vampire Cop comes to mind, too.
The only other movie not mentioned that I can think of is Perfect Creature with Dougray Scott. In this story, vampires are born, not made, but for hundreds of years, no female vamps have been born. The main vamp is actually a Priest and he works to keep the evil vamps from killing off the human population.
This is one of my favorite vamp movies, actually. Dystopian, supernatural, futuristic...I always recommend it.
There was an anime called Vampire Princess Miyu that I had watched a few episodes of (OAV). Honestly I really liked the art and imagery. Its somewhat Buffy-esk, not knowing she has powers. Having a higher calling to finding and banishing demons (known as shinma). She was awoken to her powers when a demon was just about to kill her, but paused because she was so young (13) and she ended up biting him instead. Because of his failure to kill her he is bound to her and has become a protector in hunting down others of his kind. When she bites a human, (even though she saves us from demons she still needs blood) the human is in a trance like state forever. The human becomes a vampire, BUT they live in a dream where all their dreams come true - "Eternal Happiness" in their mind. The story is different from the vampires you normally see. There is two versions of the story was well.
Nuran wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Daybreakers was pretty interesting. ..."I like the fact the homeless and destitutes in that world were vampires begging for blood from other vampires because they couldn’t afford..."
What I liked best about that movie is that blood from other vampires was toxic if they drank from them. Also if they went without human blood for long periods of time, they digressed into a lower subclass of vampires that are more primitive.
But, I haven't been keeping up with manga/anime in the past few years. Though, I am well aware that there were quite a few series on it.
Olivia wrote: "there is one thing i am wondering about, somwhere in the supernaturals where both bro had to fight off some vamp. so the q is what did they use to kill them off?"I think they cut off their heads in Supernatural. I can't be too sure since I stopped watching after it went to shit with season 6.
ST wrote: "Aside from Carlisle (sp?) who was a successful doctor, none of the rest of them tried to help the world in any way. The excuse of 'I look too young' isn't good enough because they can make their bi..."
There is one vampire in a series who made a difference but that was in the Crusade Series by Debbie Viguie and Nancy Holder. His name is Antonio de la Cruz. Oh he was bad before but he chose to help humans because of his faith in God. Interesting books.
There is one vampire in a series who made a difference but that was in the Crusade Series by Debbie Viguie and Nancy Holder. His name is Antonio de la Cruz. Oh he was bad before but he chose to help humans because of his faith in God. Interesting books.
I forgot the vampire in Nora Robert's The Circle trilogy (Circle trilogy #1-3). He's not only smoldering hot, but he's on a team of supes that will be fighting Lilith to save all mankind.
Huntley wrote: "Who cares? It's a love story."Exactly.
ST wrote: "Karyn wrote: "I think that you are missing the point. It was a romance. Not a book about doing good in the world. The point of most movies and books is to offer up entertainment and escape from the..." Edward not only played the piano, he composed music. the twilight book goes into that, and IT,S A LOVE STORY
Olivia wrote: "does each vamp do really make a diff at all?"No. Useless bunch of ingrates.
And I wouldn't condone stalking in any type of love story to the extent that Edward did.
ST wrote: "This is a great discussion and has added so many dimensions to a book I viewed as one dimensional! I may have come across as focusing on environmental issues but I just figured that they having li..."One thing that is very important to remember is that SM allowed her personal views and religion to influence her in a very specific aspect of this book, and that is you can clearly see the idea that women should be stay-at-home mothers. It's part of why Bella never really had an idea for her future in any sort of career.
If you think about it the only people who really had professional careers were men in the books. Renee was said to be a kindergarten teacher, a traditionally "woman's" job, and she was also portrayed as a less than amazing mother. Opposite of Renee was Esme, who was shown to be almost the ideal mother figure, and she was a stay at home house wife/mother that focused on and dedicated herself to caring for her family.
Bella decided that she didn't need college or a career, she just wanted to be with Edward. And then she miraculously conceives a baby and still, she never has plans for a professional life. Now I'm not saying that that is at all bad, I personally believe being a stay at home mom is exactly right for some people and a very respectable full time job. But if we're all being honest- the books were just a bit sexist.
And furthermore, they were a fantastical romance- they weren't supposed to be about a realistic pair of teenagers with regular problems and plans. Half of the point was the unreal, obsession-like love the characters experienced that made them soul mates in their alternate, mythological and magic-filled world.
I think becuase they are just as lazy as they were before they were vampires. Honestly...I think that if I were to become a vampire, I wouldn't do anything usefull for the next 200 years. I would just do random stuff and meet cool people I guess. It sucks that vampires don't sleep, I love sleeping.
'It's a love story.' I keep seeing that repeated. This is far from a love story. It's a story of obsession and vanity. All through the first book Bella kept referring to Edward as beautiful, dazzling, god-like. There was no mention of anything else that attracted her. She was vain and shallow and Edward was controlling and obsessive. I have yet to see any redeeming quailities in this series of books. There are so many well written and interesting novels out there that don't get near the attention that these poorly written books have gotten.
Kris wrote: "If you think about it the only people who really had professional careers were men in the books. Renee was said to be a kindergarten teacher, a traditionally "woman's" job, and she was also portrayed as a less than amazing mother. Opposite of Renee was Esme, who was shown to be almost the ideal mother figure, and she was a stay at home house wife/mother that focused on and dedicated herself to caring for her family."Jasper didn't have a job. In fact, Alice played the stock market so no one in the family really had to work. I don't think any of the Cullens did work they already didn't want to do. Rosalie was a mechanic, in fact it says in Twilight Wiki "During the long decades of her life, Rosalie developed a passion for collecting cars akin to her adopted brother Edward, and is a brilliant mechanic. She has attended several high schools and universities, and earned degrees in electrical engineering, business, and astrophysics, and has also studied medicine to help Carlisle keep up-to-date with the latest advances." None of those things seem very female based to me. What are they doing with their education? You can't see much because its form Bellas perspective. It's not something in the books that is really expanded on, because her perspective is focused more on one person then everyone else. Who BTW didn't want to get married in the first place. If you think about it, the way the Cullens live their life, you can bet Bella is going to be going to college and high school quite a few times if history repeats itself. I think you choose to think the glass is half empty with this book. Which you're entitled to. I like to think the best of people and their intentions, which is why I don't agree with you, but respect where you are coming from.
because Mayer Wrote this book
I don't get why this has to matter. They have years to live they could do something in the future and just because they are vampires and are old does not mean that they know everything. They probably don't know how to make the world a better place. They are just living there lives. I know living through high school is not ideal, but I think the family is done with this since Edward is married and has a kid.
Heidi wrote: "Kris wrote: "If you think about it the only people who really had professional careers were men in the books. Renee was said to be a kindergarten teacher, a traditionally "woman's" job, and she was..."On the contrary, I am a huge fan of Twilight. I'll be a Twi-hard til my dying day. I loved the series and the movies, and I personally don't find anything wrong with the views I feel are tucked into it. I am well aware of all the various areas of interest for each of the Cullen's; in fact, I posted all about it a few weeks ago at the beginning of this thread. I never said the women didn't have interests, and I wasn't specifically talking about the Cullen's, since none of the "kids" are actually shown to have careers. Yes, Alice and Rosalie had passions and interests, but not actual careers. And if they were going to bother going to college over and over, they were obviously going to go for things that at least interested them. Also, Alice did stock trading for the family solely because of her ability to see the future, it was never said to be a true passion of her's.
I do subscribe to the idea that it's impractical for any of the Cullen kids to have careers because of their physical ages. It was even a stretch for Carlisle to be a doctor because (if I remember correctly) he was turned at either 22 or 23.
It was pretty much the whole basis of Rosalie's character that she resented being a vampire because she couldn't have children, and that was her only real want in life. Alice was never shown to be too broken up about her inability to ever be a mother, (and I don't remember if this was a fan's reasoning or something I read from the actual series/SM) but I seem to remember that the possible reason for that was because she was not interested in having kids at the time she was changed, and was therefore frozen in that mindset.
And yes, Bella will probably eventually go to college many times just like the rest of them, but it will probably be quite a while because Renesmee changed things up a lot. I don't see Edward or Bella agreeing to spend the 7 years of her childhood in classrooms when they could be with her. And Renesmee certainly wouldn't be able to attend any sort of school until after she reached full maturity.
Still, throughout all 4 books Bella never had any sort of career plan for herself, or even an idea of what she'd want to try out. It has been speculated by fans that she would study English or writing because of her love of books, and it's been suggested that she might have ended up going into some sort of science because she was shown to be good at that. But none of those were ever actually suggested in the series.
At the core, Bella is a character that ultimately needed a man to be happy, sacrificed her own life to have a child, and never really cared about having a career or doing something other than being with Edward. The first 3 novels are all about how Bella would sacrifice anything (her family, her friendships, her soul, her future as an adult beyond 18) to be with Edward. That is what the story is about. Sure, she said she didn't want to get married (mainly because she was worried about people's opinion and didn't want a wedding) but she wanted to tie herself to him for eternity in a much more permanent way than marriage. She wanted the ultimate, unbreakable commitment. It was a form of marriage, just one that didn't include the possibility of divorce. It was a true "til death do us part" that she wanted.
In the real world we know that the kind of love Edward and Bella had was shallow, vain, obsessive, and altogether unhealthy. But it wasn't supposed to be the real world, anyways. I choose to see it as an epic, unstoppable love between a tormented vampire and a human girl who was always destined to be his mate.
The majority of the people that dislike Twilight who I have talked to seem to take issue with the character of Bella, and her sometimes anti-feminism attitude and damsel in distress character.
From the central character outwards you can find hints of my theory that, perhaps, SM personally leans toward the idea of traditional gender roles.
I said that it was "just a bit sexist", not that it was blatantly anti-women or something like that. And you're lying to yourself if you don't realize that on some level this was not a book about a powerful, kick ass, independent heroine. This was not a story for feminists. Personally, I'm not a feminist and don't mind it at all.
I'm sorry if this post is a little chaotic or incoherent, it's 1 am and I really shouldn't be trying to make an intelligent argument right now... but oh well.
Jesse wrote: "I like to think it's because they're narcissistic asses who rather cheat humans out of their money so their cold dead bodies can sit on it longer than actually make a difference. There's a picture ..."
The meme is this:
The meme is this:
Envy of the unpropertied, much? :D
Kris wrote: "Heidi wrote: "Kris wrote: "If you think about it the only people who really had professional careers were men in the books. Renee was said to be a kindergarten teacher, a traditionally "woman's" jo..."I actually agree with the bulk of what you are saying. The only things I take exception to as why some people arbitrarily label the very basic and simple act of falling in love and desiring to get married as "needing a man to be happy", essentially taking a normal desire and turning into an undesirable, negative and possibly anti-feminist character trait. Bella has flaws, but wanting to get married isn't one of them, imo. It's the underlying insinuation that one cannot have feminist beliefs AND want a family at the same time that bothers me so much. I could be wrong about this, but it almost seems to me like some actually take far more exception with Bella's choice to get married and have a child than with her decision to become a vampire.
If Bella truly "needed a man to be happy", she would have been desperately throwing herself at any random man in the story. She wasn't doing that. Even at her lowest point in New Moon, it wasn't so much that she needed "a man". What she really needed and found in Jake was a friend. (...she also tried unsuccessfully to reach out to Alice.)
As far Bella's career aspirations, she didn't seem to have solid career aspirations before she met Edward either. This is just my interpretation, but I viewed that as being consistant with her character. Bella was depicted as being average...mediocre. She was book smart, but never seemed particularly driven or ambitious. She wasn't this "with it", "together" type of girl. She didn't have it all figured out and I can understand why some would see that as a character flaw. But, she eventually did figure out what she wanted and she made her choice.
There has been a lot of debate about what the overall message in Twilight is. I think the overall message is choice. I think the lesson of Twilight is that you, and only you, have the ability to choose and decide exactly what will make you happy and sometimes, what makes you happy may go against "the norms" of your particular world or society. To me, Twilight was about fighting for the ability and right to choose your own life path even if it isn't necessarily the path that others want you to take. It's really an age old theme. The only thing that is different is the choices. Law school vs. art school. In movies like "Step Up" and "Save the Last Dance", the choice is classical ballet vs. modern dance. I also think that the true underlying theme in feminism, at least in the ideology that I subscribe to, has always been opportunity, freedom and choice. It's not that every single woman HAS to choose career over family or conversely, family over career. It's the fact that she has the opportunity to choose, the freedom to choose and a wide variety of choices to select from and no one particular choice is necessarily bad or better than another. Saying that Bella is anti-feminist for her family is, imo, very divisive to the overall feminist movement. People are essentially saying that wives and mothers aren't part of "the movement" and that to me, is total bs. If that is the case, who exactly was the feminist movement for? Certainly not "all women" like it claimed to be.
It all just raises the question of, "What do you do when you have an eternity stretching in front of you?"Get a bunch of bored immortals. I like that the movie version of Aro showed him as half nuts, because he's been around for so long.
It's good to have a focus. I think her idea may have partially to imply that when you find your mate, you are "satisfied" in some important way.
They need to stay hidden or risk being discovered. And despite that, Edward had worked on research, obtained doctorates and was well-educated. His goal, if I do remember correctly was to be like Carlisle, he just couldn't do what Carlisle could do yet because he was still so sensitive to blood. Just because they don't publish some incredible piece of research or go out and do incredible amounts of charity work doesn't mean they weren't making a difference. You have to help yourself before you can help others and these young vampires need to learn to control their thirst before they can even dream of being out in the human world helping to encourage progress along. They (especially Jasper) I think just weren't ready for that yet.
You guys, with them having to repeat school as many times as they had, it would have been a liability anyway. Even if they were to assume different names when they enrolled these new high school/colleges, their faces would be in their yearbooks. People eventually find this out. Accidents are bound to happen, I mean since they were all exposing themselves to a large population of humans via schools. Even Jasper went ballistic during the first part of the second book when Bella accidentally cut herself. Had something like that happened without the other Cullens and bam, instant investigation. But of course, in Meyer's world nothing terrible on a larger scale could happen.
And at the issue about Bella needing a man. I would understand this issue more.. had it not been all "Edward, I love you. You're so hot, lol" throughout the first book. If your definition of love is based on how hot your partner is without any other real connection, then yeah. This isn't really a relationship. Not to mention just how unhealthy and obsessive they were.
Also, in any given circumstance.. most females get over a breakup within a month or two. I believe it was half a year when Bella was still grieving? I am well aware that people can be pretty devastated for longer, especially when they were together for a good amount of time. I don't think they were even together for a year? So... for Bella to grieve as long as she had given the time that they were together does not seem to make sense to me.
Mochaspresso wrote: "Kris wrote: "Heidi wrote: "Kris wrote: "If you think about it the only people who really had professional careers were men in the books. Renee was said to be a kindergarten teacher, a traditionally..."Mochaspresso, I think you misunderstood me when I said she needed a man to be happy. I was specifically meaning that she needed Edward to be happy, and when I implied she was anti-feminist it had nothing to do with her decision to get married and have a kid. I don't think wanting a family is anti-feminist at all. I was actually meaning that when she completely broke down for the entirety of New Moon, that was in no way the actions of an independent, self-assured girl. In the story it made sense, in real life a break down like that would be considered a mental illness. And the way her friendship with Jacob went after Edward's return was not the shining ideal of somebody who could maintain healthy relationships. With Jacob, the only reason she kept him around despite his blatant manipulation and negativity about her and Edward was because she was afraid that he was right about Edward and she didn't want to be alone if he left again. She held onto him as a back-up plan.
Wanting to get married/changed and be with Edward forever wasn't really anti-feminist. I just used her willingness to throw away everything else, including any possibility of a professional career, to further illustrate my original point. And I think my point may have been a bit lost in all the rambling. Really, all I was trying to get across is that Bella isn't a strong, independent heroine, and that the books in some vague and unimportant way did seem to suggest a preference for traditional gender roles. And despite all my rambling, that aspect of the series really isn't important to it and definitely not a main point. It was just something that I picked up on with little things throughout.
I choose to take the books at face value as a fantastical love story, because if you try to actually deconstruct it and compare it to normal societal standards ad ideals, it definitely would not be about normal, healthy love and relationships. Compared to what is considered healthy and normal in real life these books are pretty much the exact opposite. And that's fine, because at the end of the day: Vampires don't exist. Therefore we have no real standard that their behavior could be judged upon.
Kris wrote: "Mochaspresso wrote: "Kris wrote: "Heidi wrote: "Kris wrote: "If you think about it the only people who really had professional careers were men in the books. Renee was said to be a kindergarten te..."I am sorry for misunderstanding you. I actually do agree with most of what you say about taking Twilight at face value as a fantastical love story and what you say regarding Bella's character. I didn't think that the relationship between her and Edward was particularly healthy either, nor was her emotional state after their break-up in New Moon. However, I do fall short of saying that Bella wasn't a strong heroine because I think that strength can be displayed in many different ways. Rosa Parks didn't have a outwardly "kick ass" personality but she most certainly was a very strong woman in her own way. If you are have seen or read "The Color Purple", Sophia and Shug were outwardly strong and had dominant personalities but Celie had more of a quiet strength that developed over time. I thought that there were instances in the novels where Bella displayed a similar quiet strength that slowly builds and becomes more and more pronounced toward the end of the series.
libellule wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Even Jasper went ballistic during the first part of the second book when Bella accidentally cut herself. Had something like that happened without the other Cullens and bam, instant..."That was how I felt too. With school, you're dealing with fights and all kinds of things. I even remember that in the first book, they were drawing blood as well. I didn't see a point of any of them besides Edward being there, actually.
As I've said earlier, hiding in plain site just doesn't gel with me when it comes to this series. Yeah, it's just a book. But come on..
Kasabuta wrote: "libellule wrote: "Kasabuta wrote: "Even Jasper went ballistic during the first part of the second book when Bella accidentally cut herself. Had something like that happened without the other Cullen..."Carlisle was a doctor in a small town where everybody knows everybody. There was no way that he would be able to have 5 kids who all look like teenagers and not be able to explain why they were not in school. They were trying to appear "normal". The younger that the "kids" pretend to be at first, the longer that they all can stay. Plus, how else would you learn to control yourself around humans other than to actually be around them? I would imagine that it's like learning to swim. You actually have to get into the water to learn.
So why bother moving into a small town at all? Other vampires were nomads too and even avoided all human contact as much as possible. If they were to go that route, they wouldn't have had that problem. But hey, I guess Meyer couldn't think of any other way than the boring old high school/college arc that every other story seems takes place at.
With your swimming analogy, I agree to an extent.. but given the population of the school that they were attending, it sounds a lot more like Jasper was thrown into the deep end more than anything else. And he regressed when it came to that incident with Bella?
Kasabuta wrote: "So why bother moving into a small town at all? Other vampires were nomads too and even avoided all human contact as much as possible. If they were to go that route, they wouldn't have had that prob..."Not all Twilight vampires enjoyed that nomad lifestyle, though. Carlisle certainly didn't. (Remember Laurent and his fascination with how The Cullens and the Denali coven lived?)
The Cullens wanted to be able to have human contact. Carlisle felt that it kept them civilized and in touch with their own sense of humanity. As for Jasper, in Midnight Sun, I got the impression from Edward's POV that they all worked very hard to look out for Jasper. He was thrown into the deep end but there were plenty of lifeguards around him keeping a close watch. Imo, that incident with Bella would probably never have happened if she could have just learned to get over herself and graciously accept a damn gift.
Nah, I don't remember that part, haha. It's been years since I've read them. I just remember the incidents more than anything really. But honestly, there were only the four of them (excluding Jasper)? Sure, Alice could keep tabs on Jasper via her visions. I can't remember if Rosalie had all the same classes as him otherwise it wouldn't work out as well as I would hope to imagine. But considering if all four were nowhere near him when blood is drawn, something would likely happen. I can't remember if the school campus was big or not, but yeah. I don't think they'd expose themselves and use their powers either.
Even with lifeguards watching, accidents do happen from time to time. I'm just saying that with the magnitude of humans in one sitting, Jasper is a time bomb.
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You do have to wonder how smart they can be, though, if they search for deeper meanings in a (YA) romance. :D