"A Study in Emerald" by Neil Gaiman / "The Bottle Imp" by R.L. Stevenson (June 10-17, 2013)

[Tressa]

This is the short story group read for the week of June 10-17.

"A Study in Emerald" by Neil Gaiman

http://www.neilgaiman.com/mediafiles/...

[Pamellia]

Tressa wrote: "This is the short story group read for the week of June 10-17.
"A Study in Emerald" by Neil Gaiman

When do we being discussion? So glad you got this going, Tressa, Moana Lisa

[Tressa]

You can start now. I won't have a chance to read it till tonight.

[Pamellia]

I'm going to read it tomorrow morning while I'm waiting for some stuff to get finished.

[Char]

Cool! I shall check it out soon.

[Ctgt]

I thought I would have a few minutes here at work to read but I keep getting distracted. Don't you hate it when the trivial gets in the way of the important?

I did get far enough to think, not another SH rehash, then I got to the (view spoiler)[crime scene and was instantly intrigued (hide spoiler)].

Also love the ads, constipation of the soul, awesome!

[Ctgt]

Yes! (view spoiler)[professional exsanguination provided by V. Tepes! (hide spoiler)]

[Tressa]

This was an OK story, and one I had to research after reading to get the things I didn't get while reading it.

[Ken B]

Okay, lets get this started!

(view spoiler)[I am a big time Holmes fan and am a purist at that. I don't like my Holmes to have a wife, girlfriend, love interest, etc. I don't like him gay. I don't like him fae. (All of these I have read.)

Where I am forgiving is when an author will intermingle genres. I like Holmes vs Dracula, Holmes vs. werewolves, Holmes vs. ghosts. So, why not Holmes vs The Old Ones? Loved it!

Couple of things:

1. The narrator of the story had apparently encountered one of The Old Ones while serving in Afghanistan. Was their existence common knowledge in the story? I couldn't tell.

2. It appeared to me that it was a massive state secret that the Royals were Old Ones. Again, maybe I missed something. But, they were hiding this, right?

3. The bad guy got away! Perfect!

4. John Watson was one of the bad guys? I didn't like this! (hide spoiler)]

[Jon Recluse]

Ken,

(view spoiler)[All the world leaders were Old Ones (hide spoiler)]

[Mixofsunandcloud]

Also (view spoiler)[ It wasn't just Watson who was a 'bad guy'. Sherry Vernet was Holmes. Notice the Consulting Detective was never actually named in the story. Holmes and Watson are using their skills to oppose the old ones, while someone else is trying to stop them. I always kind of assume it's Moriarty, even though he's not named. (hide spoiler)]

[Ken B]

Mixofsunandcloud wrote: "Also [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[I missed that! That makes the story even better! (hide spoiler)]

[Ken B]

Mixofsunandcloud wrote: "Also [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[I was thrown by the St Bart's introduction and the Baker St address of the Consulting Detective.

The St Bart's intro mirrored too closely other intros that I have read where Holmes was researching his various theories at St Bart's when introduced to Watson.

In the Holmes stories, Holmes is the only acting Consulting Detective in London (possibly the world). Gaiman's detective would make two!

I'm sure Gaiman intended his Consulting Detective duo to be a mirror of Holmes and Watson but maybe it was a bit to close and the hints to the contrary a bit too subtle. (hide spoiler)]

[Ken B]

Jon Recluse wrote: "Ken,

[spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[Right. I guess, though, that I am not that versed in the Cthulhu mythos. (I have added The Call of Cthulhu to my to-be-read list and will probably be adding other books along that theme.) Recommendations?

The narrator was sickened at the sight of the murdered royal. What I couldn't decide from some of the text was if he knew or not that the royals were anything but human. Was he shocked by the non-human figure or all the green blood? Do the Old Ones go about in human form? Is it common knowledge that they are the world leaders or is that knowledge held only by an elite few (and those fighting against them)?

I feel like a two year-old. Why is the sky blue? Why is the grass green?

Maybe someone should just point me to a Cthulhu 101 book. (hide spoiler)]

[Tressa]

I don't think we need to use spoilers here. It's a short story. If people can't read the short story before popping into this thread, then they deserve to have it spoiled.

[Pamellia]

Tressa wrote: "I don't think we need to use spoilers here. It's a short story. If people can't read the short story before popping into this thread, then they deserve to have it spoiled."

I don't even know how to use the spoiler alert!! lol

[Ctgt]

I have read some Holmes so I am not an expert, was Sherry Vernet an alias used by Holmes?

[Ken B]

Ctgt wrote: "I have read some Holmes so I am not an expert, was Sherry Vernet an alias used by Holmes?"

Not that I am aware of.

Wikipedia says this:

"Conan Doyle's drafts show he originally intended to call Sherlock Holmes "Sherrinford" (which some Sherlockians consider was actually the name of Sherlock's oldest brother). Holmes' grandmother was a relative of the French artist Vernet. "Sherry Vernet" is therefore an obvious stage name for Sherlock Holmes."

And that's from Wikipedia so you KNOW it is factually accurate!

[Tressa]

Pamellia, here's how to use spoiler tags.

< spoiler>Put the text you want to hid in here.< /spoiler>

Only remove the spaces between the two sets of brackets for it to work.

Gosh, is this week over? Ready to move on to the next story. This one is custom made for Cthulhu and/or Holmes fans.

[Ctgt]

Tressa wrote: "Pamellia, here's how to use spoiler tags.

Put the text you want to hid in here.

Only remove the spaces between the two sets of brackets for it to work.

Gosh, is this week over? Ready to move o..."

Thanks Ken. Wait a second, you mean Wikipedia isn't always accurate? :)

[Mariana]

I love a good Holmes rehash, and anything to do with Lovecraft. I greatly enjoyed this!

(view spoiler)[ I believe the narrator was Sebastian Moran, Moriarty's right hand man (judging by his signature (S___ M___), which would make his friend Moriarty himself. It makes sense, since Vernet was Holmes and the Limping Doctor was Watson. I was a clever twist. I was convinced that the narrator and his friend were Holmes and Watson all the way to the end. Didn't see it coming! (hide spoiler)]

[Tressa]

Ken suggested we do two stories a week: a contemporary and a classic.

Here's The Bottle Imp by Stevenson.

http://gaslight.mtroyal.ca/bottlimp.htm

[Chris]

The bottle imp is one of my favourite short stories. I first read it when I was in Grade 4...ish, so had no idea for years who had written it. When I went back to look for it recently, I thought it was Poe - who wrote the Imp of the Perverse.

Such an amazing conceit in this story, and the desperation of the mc's as they try to figure out how to keep it moving...

[Ken B]

Just finished "The Bottle Imp". Nice story.

If the price was down to 3 of the lowest valued currency you could find. Would you buy the bottle knowing you had to fully disclose to the next buyer?

[Pamellia]

Ctgt wrote: "Tressa wrote: "Pamellia, here's how to use spoiler tags.

Put the text you want to hid in here.

Only remove the spaces between the two sets of brackets for it to work.

Thank you, so much Tressa! A lot going on this week, still haven't read our first short story. Maybe this afternoon I will read it. ~ Pamellia

[Tressa]

You're welcome, Pamellia.

I really enjoyed Bottle Imp! Made me think a lot about my own selfish desires and what to disclose to the next buyer. After reading so many detailed, horrifying books about hell, I know for a fact I wouldn't want to find myself there. But would I care enough about the next person to tell him/her if it means I won't suffer?

I thought the story ended with a cop out, though. The last guy who bought the bottle was greedy and it's almost like the author didn't want you to feel sorry for him. I still did.

Reading it I actually felt the urge the characters felt to get my riches and then find a buyer stupid enough to take the offer.

I was confused, though, about if there was a penalty attached to your desire. Keawe(?) got leprosy and also his uncle and nephew died so he could inherit the land he wanted to build his dream home on (a la "The Monkey's Paw"), but I'm not clear on if the others suffered from their wishes.

[Jon Recluse]

I'm not sure, but I think it involves being bonded to the bottle.

When Stevenson died, the Samoans searched his home for the bottle, in order to return their friend to them.

They also sing when ships come into port, asking if Mr. Stevenson is aboard.

[Ctgt]

Mariana wrote: "I love a good Holmes rehash, and anything to do with Lovecraft. I greatly enjoyed this!

[spoilers removed]"


Thanks Mariana. I figured there was some connection with the S___M____ but didn't have a clue.

[[deleted user]]

I finally got around to reading Study in Emerald. It was okay. I guess. I expected it to be better to be honest. I love Holmes and Lovecraft. The idea of mixing the two was fantastic. The twist was fun but a little too coincidental.

[[deleted user]]

I thought Bottle Imp ended in a cop out too. It was a nice story along the lines of be careful what you wish for but the end ruined the impact of the message.
I don't think I'd buy the bottle. Either I wouldn't believe in it and wouldn't fall for it or I would believe and wouldn't chance it. Boring answer. I know. If the wish was for a loved one though... I might but probably not at the absolute last price.
It reminded me of Monkey's Paw too. But also The Box, both the short story and the tv version.

[Kimberly]

Tressa wrote: "I don't think we need to use spoilers here. It's a short story. If people can't read the short story before popping into this thread, then they deserve to have it spoiled."

I agree, I was afraid I'd forget and type in something without the spoilers. However, being short stories that can be read in a few minutes, there's no excuse to be on this forum unless you're here to read or participate.

[Kimberly]

Mariana wrote: "I love a good Holmes rehash, and anything to do with Lovecraft. I greatly enjoyed this!

[spoilers removed]"

I agree, Mariana. I loved the fact that I did't see that one coming!

[Kimberly]

"The Bottle Imp" was one I hadn't read in a long time. I think that, as Tressa pointed out, one would expect some kind of nasty pay-back to get what you want--ie. The Monkey's Paw. In this story, it didn't seem to be the case. Although he lost his relatives to get the land/money, he didn't exactly seem broken up by it at all. I view the Leprosy as a chance occurrence, rather than an evil brought upon by the bottle. The fact that they're bonded to the bottle while it is in their possession, seems to be the actual "punishment". The fact that it ended happily for the couple never fails to surprise me, though. I always thought it would end with them having every material wish they ever wanted, but being too despondent to enjoy it, because they knew what was in store for them.

[Ryan]

I loved 'the bottle imp'. It's one of my all time favourite short stories. I love the way it is written, the style and the plot. I totally didn't see the end coming. I really think it's tough to beat. Excellent!

[Ken B]

I just went back and read The Monkey's Paw. As far as comparing it to The Bottle Imp, I would have to say that the similarities end with the granting of wishes and the potential negative consequences (Robert Louis Stevenson was even a little ambiguous on this point!).

I think that "The Bottle Imp" was a much more complex story given the option to sell the bottle and the constraints placed on that process.

Both were great stories!

BTW, in "The Monkey's Paw", what do you think would have walked through the door had Mr White not made his last-second third wish?

[[deleted user]]

I just read The Monkey's Paw again. I always believed that (view spoiler)[ the son had returned from the grave. I picture him being like a zombie (hide spoiler)] but rereading it now I'm not so sure. The story definitely falls into the be careful what you wish for category, but there seems to be an order to it. And the most obvious guess seems too easy. At least for me. I think I prefer not knowing. Did you ever see a version of this story... (view spoiler)[ The wish was to bring the person back exactly how they were before they died. But they had died of a heart attack and was in extreme pain. (hide spoiler)] I want to say it was Night Gallery... but I can't swear to it. It's my favorite version though.

[Tressa]

The Monkey's Paw is so open to interpretation, but since it's supposed to be a horror story I think the son did return as a shambling, green mess of his former self.

The other story is not familiar.

If anyone has any short stories to post and discuss, just go ahead and create a thread for them. I've fallen behind doing that but I enjoy reading and discussing them with y'all.