What would be an up-to-date definition for subversive?

[Rock]

I have come across uses of this word that has little to do with overthrowing a government. For example, it is said that "teenagers and other subversives" liked to copy an artist's penchant for putting stuffed animals in specimen jars. This sort of quirk doesn't seem very subversive to me. Is there a more befitting definition?

http://www.mentalfloss.com/article/31...

[Ken, Moderator]

Does that article use the word? I couldn't find it if it did.

[Rock]

#3 on the "10 Horrible Things We Do to Teddy Bears"

[Ken, Moderator]

Ah. This line:

This installation was created in 1999, and has been copied by teenagers and other subversives ever since.

I think an entire age group has been libeled.

[Debbie, sardonic princess of cheerfulness]

Not all teenagers are subversive....some are more conservative than their parents! I always took subversive to mean undermining authority in any context....not just governmental....I have pupils who can be very subversive....they make the bullets and get someone else in class to fire the shots! Figuratively speaking here in NZ.....so far.....

[Ken, Moderator]

Yes. There are "subversive" people of all age groups. It's true that teens are unique in that their brains are still undergoing dramatic change, but many adults have brain issues too.

This is the Age of Mental Illness, Food Allergies, Auto-Immune Disease, Autistic Spectrums, Behavioral Issues, Acronyms for Conditions, Global Warming, Chemical Pollutants, and Fear & Loathing, after all.

[Debbie, sardonic princess of cheerfulness]

I blame it all on margarine myself.....

[Cecily]

Newengland wrote: "...I think an entire age group has been libeled."

Perhaps, but then again, many teens would take "subversive" as a compliment, wouldn't they?

[Ken, Moderator]

Some, yes. But as Debbie said, many teens are more conservative than their parents.

[Mark]

Some things deserve "subverting." Art is not one of them. Damage inflicted on kapok-filled fabric is not one of them. Damage inflicted on non-kapok-filled school children is. Superannuated as I am, given the prevailing landscape (which is inimical to human life in general), I'm inclined to go with the teens who think "subversion" (in the restricted sense of "challenging of authority") is a good thing.

[Mark]

On the other hand, I think Debbie is right that we have serious cause to be suspicious of margarine. :)

[Harold]

I think that Public Surveillance Cameras are subversive and the best thing to do with margarine is smear it on their lens. Next best thing to undermine their omniscient surveillance is to practice sousveillance. Take a toy camera with no film and pretend to take pictures of the public cameras...if they can photograph you, you can at least pretend to photograph them.

[Harold]

The George Bush Jr. illegal invasion of Iraq on a the lie of "weapons of mass destruction" is one of the greatest definitions of subversion. Bush Iraq should be a new eponymous synonym of subversion.

[Ken, Moderator]

Burning Lies Bush, they call him.

[Mark]

Harold wrote: "I think that Public Surveillance Cameras are subversive and the best thing to do with margarine is smear it on their lens. Next best thing to undermine their omniscient surveillance is to practice..."

Forget public surveillance cameras. I already assume my smartphone monitors me 24/7, with a continuous audio/video feed and GPS information, even when it is turned off. And underwater. Under boiling water. With the battery removed. And in a Faraday cage. 

[Mark]

Harold wrote: "The George Bush Jr. illegal invasion of Iraq on a the lie of "weapons of mass destruction" is one of the greatest definitions of subversion. Bush Iraq should be a new eponymous synonym of subversion."

I think "subversion" is too gentle a word for it. I'd go with "evil incarnate."

[Harold]

No phone that I've ever owned was smart...maybe smart assed and no amount of cultural paranoid conspiratorial thinking can bypass the brilliant consensus reality that has been instilled in us by our global consumerist masters. After all, the media is there to keep us thinking about thinking about something else...is'nt that what secret police are all about? Unplug your mind from the net and just say know more.

[Mark]

This is Mark's phone. Your message has been intercepted and is being forwarded to our processing center. Please do not bother filing an FOIA request.

[Harold]

This is Harold's phone...I was made in Korea and therefore claim diplomatic immunity...I'm going to call the Korean embassy....oh crap, Harold doesn't have the number in his contacts! What's that hammer doing in your hand..no Harold no...Squash!

[Mark]

This is Mark's phone. We regard squashing of products the manufacture of which puts Americans out of work to be an act hostile to predatory outsourcing. You have been placed on the "no-fly list," and will henceforth never be allowed to purchase flies, or even a fishing license.