Karen Chance Fans discussion
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I think it depends on the syncing. remember claire's son was a lot older, like a couple years when it had only been a short time. Sometimes it's behind by a few days sometimes ahead by years.... It's a crapshoot.
I think it's entirely possible that Gillian is still around if she escaped into another world. Francoise and Pritkin are both proof of that.
Lannister wrote: "I think it was Verrell's comments about Dory's processed cheese that distracted me LMAO!I had to reread just to double-check that he was a vamp too. I'd thought he was, then I started to doubt my..."
Besides how nosy Marlowe is, L-C was a European Senator as well as a member of the famous Basarab line, so he must have entertained a lot. If Verrell is as great a chef as he sounds like, people would ask about him, including Marlowe, I think.
Anyway I'll bet Marlowe knows all the top household members of all the Senators in Europe and America. He's had a lot of time to learn all that stuff. He would probably make it his business to know them by sight for security reasons.
I kind of like Jules, Rico and Fred. The outtakes from Hunt the Moon really brought them to life. I am really wondering what will happen to Jules now, since the events in TtS.
Kathleen wrote: "Anyway I'll bet Marlowe knows all the top household members of all the Senators in Europe and America. He's had a lot of time to learn all that stuff. He would probably make it his business to know them by sight for security reasons. "Yeah, I think this is correct. I think Marlowe is the NSA and knows everything about everyone, whether they like it or not.
I am really wondering what will happen to Jules now, since the events in TtS.
Personally, I'm hoping for a giant showdown between Cassie, Mircea and the Consul. The Consul will freak out at discovering Cassie possesses a skill or 'weapon' that can be used against vamps, and demands Mircea do something about it. Poor Mircea's stuck in the middle between two powerful women and tries to keep everyone happy, but in the end, makes no one happy.
Maybe the Consul tries to kill Mircea for his disloyalty and Cassie, in a desperate bid to save Mircea's life, regresses Cleo until she's just a little baby snake. Then Dory arrives and stomps on her with her big biker boots. Afterwards everyone goes for tea. The End.
:D
Radu says he is deeply offended at being described as so-called "minor character." He believes he plays *at least* a major supporting role, and he prefers to be billed as Guest Star. His agent and his attorneys will contact you shortly.
Lance Speare,
Executive Personal Assistant to Lord Radu Basarab
Haha! Can we pacify Radu by offering him a nice big dressing room? And some hot young studs to assist with his wardrobe?!
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Perhaps he's not all that fussy! I think Gunther was pretty, though maybe he qualifies as a stud too LOL!
Do you remember how persnickety and demanding Radu is about hotel accommodations? You probably do not want to see how difficult he can be about a dressing room and wardrobe people he did not personally select. I'm thinking Guest Star billing would be wwaaayyy cheaper and easier. (Don't give him any more ideas?)
What is it about Antony? He has such a distinct, consistent and...likeable personality... despite knowing he is powerful and ruthless. I picture him as being that convivial and popular guy at the country club who is also a womanizer---and kind of a shark in business dealings. So real.
Kathleen wrote: "What is it about Antony? He has such a distinct, consistent and...likeable personality... despite knowing he is powerful and ruthless. I picture him as being that convivial and popular guy at the c..."I know what you mean. I love to read about him because he is so likable but it feel like he wouldn't think twice about stabbing you in the back if it was necessary. I think that his character is written very well. You never know if you can trust him or not.
Another character that KC brought to life with just a few brief appearances (including the HtM outtakes on her website, is Jules. I hope we see more of him and that he has a good life.
Yeah, I remember reading a spoiler filled review before TtS came out, where it was described how Jules was left to figure out his life-and gave the impression that he just took off by himself into the sunset or something. I loved how he(and the rest of the trio, including to an extent, Marco) seem to have given Cassie their royalty as they would any other vampire master, and how he tried to be a good servant to her, though he landed in a lot of trouble.
I wonder if Cassie will sever the link she has with him, and whether we will see more of him in later books-I kind of get the feeling we're not done with him yet, but I also thought Rafe will be back, so I am probably wrong.
Surely KC will show us what happens with Jules. It was such a dramatic scene, and Cassie was so worried about Mircea's reaction.I miss Rafe, too. Maybe he'll turn up in RtW. I wonder if Dory knows about him...
Back to Jules: I find him a sad, touching character. With his mouthy personality, and his having grown up during the 1930s, I don't see how he could support himself as a human, and his family would be all gone...and their descendants would not know him.
Yes, they do seem loyal to Cassie. I wonder if she is still officially Mircea's second...
On Jules, yeah, I agree with you guys. I can't just see him fading into the background. There's surely got to be more in RtW, especially as it's really TtS Part Two. Even if he remains human and never becomes vamp again, surely Jules is still part of Mircea's family? I can't see Mircea kicking him out on the street because he isn't vamp any more. Mircea keeps humans around for blood and presumably other work, so I'd have thought a role could be found for Jules somewhere.
I think it might be tactless to ask Jules to let vamps feed on him, but maybe Mircea won't see it that way!
Who else we don't see enough of is Rico from HtM. He is adorable!
One of the charming things about KC's books is that you see and hear only through the eyes and ears of the main character in each book. With Cassie that often means that she shares a scene that we understand, but she doesn't, like when she and Pritkin are squabbling like an old, devoted couple at Jonas's kitchen table while he watches, biting his lip (to keep from smiling, no doubt.
Other times we witness a dialog in which the speaker is mistaken, but Dory or Cassie believes them, and we don't find out till later that they were wrong---sort of like real life.
I can sort of see Mircea giving Jules to Cassie if he stays human. And let's face it: she could really use a personal assistant, though I'm not sure how useful he would really be. Still, he would be loyal, I think....
I was looking through Curse the Dawn tonight and I came across a passage that I hadn't noticed before.Sal has just been outed as the traitor and she's arguing with Marco in front of Cassie. We have the following exchange:
"And you," Sal snapped. She looked him up and down contemptuously. "You can ape Mircea all you like, but the finest clothes in the world will never give you his power. And everyone knows how much you hate him for that!"I thought this was an interesting passage, as Sal seems sure that Marco hates Mircea, and Marco doesn't entirely disagree with her.
[snipped a little bit]
"Hate's a little strong," Marco demurred. "But you're right. I like power. I just got limits on what I'll do for it."
Passages like this are really interesting because of the insights they give you. Obviously we see everything through Cassie's eyes and that can sometimes be limiting, so getting the perspective of a character who's presumably known Marco for decades or maybe a century is interesting.
Sal was filled with anger and fear at the time of the discussion, so no doubt there's a bit of vitriol in there, but Marco doesn't really bother denying it. Do you all think he really does dislike Mircea, but accepts him as the best of a bad bunch of options? Or do you think Sal was completely wrong and Marco simply didn't want to argue with her about something fairly trivial compared to the real issue at hand?
Marco had another discussion with Cassie in Hunt the Moon ...
"That there's no freedom in our world, Cassie. If I left Mircea, I'd have to ally with some other high-level master in order to survive. And then I'd be dragged into his life, his fights, just like now. Everybody answers to somebody; everybody has restrictions they got to put up with. Even senators. Even Mircea."These comments make me quite sad for Marco, and possibly for all lesser vampires. They are, quite literally, slaves. That word has been used a few times in the books, but it's true. I think being bound chafes at Marco, but he also knows that not being bound to Mircea would be even worse. It's a rock and a hard place, with no resolution. I think KC is very skilled at making us overlook just what kind of creatures her vampires are.
Thoughts, anyone?
Full chorus of vampires accompanied by orchestra, singing (to the famous tune from 'Evita') "Don't Cry for Me, Puny Human."Applause. Bows. Curtseys. Armload of red roses for Sal as the curtain closes.
See, I always had a problem with that passage in CtD. The point of the Pythia is that she is the head of an independent court. She is supposed to be a neutral arbitrator in the supernatural world. Marco arguing that Cassie needs to take orders from someone is wrong. If she takes orders from Mircea, from the Senate, from the Circle, she is no longer a neutral party. The vampires will never understand this because they cannot comprehend a world in which you simply don't have a master. The concept is way too foreign to them. Cassie is bound by her responsibilities, but not by another governing body. I think that Marco definitely resents being bound to someone so much younger than he is. But I also think Marco realizes that his situation isn't going to get any better, and he wouldn't ever betray Mircea.
I think I was surprised that Marco might really dislike Mircea. I suppose a lot of people "hate" their boss, so maybe I shouldn't have been surprised, but I never got a hate/intense dislike vibe from Marco. I thought his comments about no-one being free in Hunt the Moon were a statement on vampire society as a whole, rather than a complaint about Mircea specifically. After all, he's said elsewhere that as masters go, Mircea's a good one. So Sal's comment felt a little out of place. But maybe Marco is using the Basarab family diplomacy around Cassie and he doesn't want to air his true feelings about his boss, possibly in case they got back to Mircea! Claire, I think you make a good point that vampires need their clearly defined hierarchy and maybe they have good reason for this, since I believe that without it they will often start fighting and killing each other. But, yes, their rules shouldn't automatically be applied to others.
I wonder if Marco has this sense of being trapped, and that's where his 'hatred' comes from. He knows he's unlikely to rise much in power now, yet he doesn't feel powerful enough to branch out on his own. Yet he's at Mircea's beck and call and, despite his power and loyalty, if one little thing goes wrong, even if it's not his fault, he'll be severely punished, and has been. What a way to live!
Oh my, how did I miss that? I honestly would have told you other than a slight resentment he pushed to the back of his mind for the man who holds power over him that Marco liked and admired Mircea for a boss...The only answer must be that Mircea is SCUM!
Okay, I kid. Still, though, I wonder how many people actually just like Mircea. Marlowe, maybe? Radu...?
Radu, maybe. Maybe LC, being more or less his equal...? I would not bet on Marlowe.
Vampires are very rigid in their thinking. This is unsurprising in the older ones, given how set in their thinking they must be. And then the younger ones always have their masters in their heads. So it becomes impossible to imagine anything else than the system in which they live. The problem is their inability to understand that Cassie, as a human and as Pythia, is outside that system. Clearly, they're trying. But as we can see, it's not going so well as evidence by Cassie being stuck in this weird wife-servant limbo.
But Mircea could fix that by making an announcement, and he hasn't. Maybe because while he uses that "wife" talk to control Cassie, deep down he realizes ultimately it won't fly?
Lia wrote: "The only answer must be that Mircea is SCUM!Okay, I kid. Still, though, I wonder how many people actually just like Mircea. Marlowe, maybe? Radu...? "
LOL!
I agree with Kathleen, that I think Marlowe has a good working relationship with Mircea, but that doesn't automatically translate to friendship. I'd say allies rather than true friends (he was a little stunned at Mircea's near death in Fury's Kiss, but I'd probably be a little stunned if one of my colleagues almost died in front of me. Doesn't equate real affection). This probably applies to most of the 'friendly' senators.
Radu, as family, might be something along the lines of "Can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em." I think there's no doubt he has a strong bond with Mircea, but Radu does seem to live his own life. He resented being pulled away from his home to be at MAGIC in Midnight's Daughter.
I think Dory and Radu are probably similar in their outlook that visits from the Mighty Mircea are nice, but being around him too much only leads to fights.
So, I think this means that we now need to refer to our favourite diplomat as Mircea No-Mates, because it doesn't seem to me that he has any close confidantes. That's really quite sad.
Claire wrote: "Vampires are very rigid in their thinking. This is unsurprising in the older ones, given how set in their thinking they must be. And then the younger ones always have their masters in their heads. ..."
Yeah, agreed.
I wonder if Mircea himself is part of the problem, in that he sends mixed signals. Cassie is Mircea's wife only when it suits his agenda. Other times she's treated as another of his floozies, and occasionally as a valued servant. How are the staff supposed to know how to behave towards her when the boss keeps moving the goal posts? As you say Claire, Cassie simply doesn't fit in their hierarchy and they aren't quite sure what to do (and possibly scared of doing the wrong thing!)
I still think it's an insult that the vamps who screwed up somewhere are sent to babysit Cassie. What kind of message does that send? The Pythia isn't even important enough to merit the top notch bodyguards?! Or is that Mircea expects attacks and doesn't care about losing a few of his screw-ups if he has to? Maybe they're the equivalent of the Star Trek Red Shirts.
Also, I wonder what Marco did to be 'punished' with watching Cassie.
I thought the deal with Marco was that watching Cassie was a temporary assignment (given maybe because he didn't seem to despise humans as much as some of the other senior masters did) until he screwed up. His punishment was to have the assignment (a very low status one to older vamps) made permanent.
She claimed the vamps (and Mircea) as family to the head of the circle. (Love that scene!) So at least they know where she stands. I don't know about you, but if my 'sister' acted all crazy, as Cassie often seems, I might not know exactly where she fit in either. She's strong one minute, drugged out the next and in between she's having breakdowns and power struggle issues (like running away because of an order they MUST follow from the master). She's making it hard for any of them to classify. She doesn't fit in the "human" category they'd love to put her in simply because she isn't a vamp.
The vampires don't seem to (usually) need many groups. Them and us, basically. Them breaks down to servants, humans (aka food), mages (the way they say mages makes it a vile swear word!), fae, were, and other enemy types (revenant, zombie vampires, etc.).
Dory has had difficulty breaking them out of that mentality, too. Cassie will get there. I think her first step was proving she accepts them for family.
Since vamps are a hierarchical (top down) society, they will act/think however their master does. It all goes back to Mircea: if he shows respect, his vamps will. If not, they won't (don't).
Hehehe. Locking her in the casino because he is afraid for her safety makes it look like he doesn't think she can fend for herself, no matter what he really believes. I'd run away if I was being treated like she has been. Understanding "the way they are" wouldn't make me feel better about being stuck in my room. She's way too nice about everything, probably because she knows how busy he is with the treaty (Er- was busy. Now she seems to feel free to go do whatever. Can't wait for the next book!!!).
I think Marco is right--IN a vamp world. If Cassie stays with Mircea, she will have to play by their rules, I think is what Marco is saying. Marco is wrong because a) Cassie doesn't have to live in that world b) Cassie is a power in her own right.I don't know if Marco actually HATES Mircea, I think he just resents being owned. I think that's why he is sympathetic to Cassie. He understands her need to always escape.
Another ambivalent character is Aesubrand. He may be brought into the "light" alliance because his father, the Svarestri king, will certainly ally with the black alliance. Does anyone think he may be rehabilitated and be attracted to Dory romantically. He has already branded her as his prey.
Nancy wrote: "Another ambivalent character is Aesubrand. He may be brought into the "light" alliance because his father, the Svarestri king, will certainly ally with the black alliance. Does anyone think he ma..."One of our favorite crack ships in this group is Dory and Aesubrand (generally known as Asshat). I think he and Dorina could get along. This might seem crazy, but he didn't seem all that evil to me in FK. I think Asshat wants Aiden's throne, but does not want to the Aesir back. He and his mom seem to have a different mission than his dad, and they could be persuaded to change sides if it meant avoiding the old gods.
I think we've talked about it before and speculated as to what Radu's/Draculas master powers could be, and now in light of Lovers Knot - how about Radu's master power!! I had thought LC's veil was one that was his, that he developed, not that he had inherited it - esp. given I'd have expected that he had it in the timeline before being changed by Radu and in that timeline he wouldn't have inherited it .... ahhh timeline foibles what fun :). But back to the Radu's master power, Mircea implies Radu is quite strong mentally as well in FK by saying it would take someone very strong to block Radu. I wonder if the veil is in part an aspect of mental abilities by encouraging people not to see them .... mmmm, but LC mentioned that wards have difficulties sensing him when he's behind the veil, which implies it is something more than mental abilities.
Karen wrote: "I think we've talked about it before and speculated as to what Radu's/Draculas master powers could be, and now in light of Lovers Knot - how about Radu's master power!! I had thought LC's veil was ..."That's such an interesting topic, I've been discussing exactly this with a fellow reader! We couldn't really find a conclusive answer, because Radu uses his cloak, but Dory calls it a 'master power'. Does he have the veil? Was it some magic sartorial mojo a la Claude? Did it involve a mental rather than physical power?
"I wonder if the veil is in part an aspect of mental abilities by encouraging people not to see them .... mmmm, but LC mentioned that wards have difficulties sensing him when he's behind the veil, which implies it is something more than mental abilities."
It was mentioned that there's a theory that the veil actually shifts the caster's presence from the physical realm, which would explain why LC's power might be more physical. As an interesting comparison, there was that scene in one of the books when Cassie and Pritkin are made "invisible" to a guard by Mircea's power. If Mircea can manipulate the minds of onlookers, there's a good chance that Radu could too, so I think your guess that he might have a mental power that effects perception is definitely on the right track!
Radu was great in this novella, and I wish he and Elise had gotten more share of the action. On the other thread, K mentioned: "Finally, love seeing Radu's fatherly feelings for LC <3." And I agree totally, it's so nice to see Radu in more than just the eccentric crazy scientist uncle role! I considered that incredibly meaningful and interesting, considering Radu's fascinating back story (of which we sadly only got a small glimpse, such as in the profound reflective scene around the end of MD). He was given up by his own father into foreign confinement as collateral, he was raped as a young man and had to maneuver the deadly intricacies of the Ottoman power-plays for years, knowing full well that his life and fate were at the mercy of his oppressors. After all that, his fervent dedication to his child, such as busting LC out of imprisonment going against Mircea's directive to not interfere in history, his pride and affection for LC, and his fatherly fussing at the end of LK are such great parts of his characterization!
Regarding our favourite vampire sidekick trio, here's a potential hilarious alternate biography of Fred:The Utterly Uninteresting and Unadventurous Tales of Fred, the Vampire Accountant
Came across this book on goodreads, apparently there's a 'Fred, the Vampire Accountant' series! Lol.
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The question is whether she resents the Pythia's "marriage" to Mircea and the Consul's elevation to leading the vampire Senates enough to join the enemy alliance.
Ming-de will be in on the war strategy meetings, and she could easily transmit the information to the enemy cabal. She could probably establish a direct communication with Rasputin, for example.
On the other hand, if she is still possessive and protective of Mircea, she could be a real asset against the mental assaults the enemy forces are using now.
KC seems to be showing that mental abilities are going to be more important than mere power. The next books should show us whether Ming-de will work for the good side or the Black side.
I think it says somewhere in the books that the Black Circle used to regularly kidnap magic users, so it's entirely possible Gillian was kidnapped, but who knows?
Must admit, I didn't think the time differences between Earth and Faerie were that different. I thought they were out by a few weeks or months, but not years. Unless humans just age more slowly in Faerie? Or there's something else going on with Francoise?
But, yeah, it would be pretty funny if Gillian popped up again, maybe during the war against the fey.