The Year of Reading Proust discussion

Time Regained (In Search of Lost Time, #7)
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Time Regained, vol. 7 > Through Sunday, 1 Dec.: Time Regained

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message 1: by Jason (last edited Jan 04, 2013 08:25PM) (new) - added it

Jason (ancatdubh2) This thread is for the discussion that will take place through Sunday, 1 Dec. of Time Regained, to page 176 (to the paragraph beginning: “These men, as they chatted quietly together...”)



message 2: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (last edited Nov 24, 2013 03:03AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
We raised the question Who Was Paul Morand? in last week's discussion and here is this article titled similarly... and quoting Proust and his reference to this writer and his novel.

Quand Auguste de Pologne comme raconte le charmant Morand, l'auteur délicieux de "Clarisse".... p. 179.

http://www.newcriterion.com/m/article...

Actually, his Venises is quoted in Fortuny, Proust y los Ballets Rusos.


message 3: by Fionnuala (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments I read the article about Paul Morand in New Criterion, Kalliope. I found it ironic that he recorded in his diary that Proust had a 'complex' for telling antisemitic stories when he himself eventually became a nazi sympathiser.
Also ironic, because I'd just read Saint-Loup's brave and impartial letter from the front, is the fact that Morand escaped being drafted via his society connections.


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Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "I read the article about Paul Morand in New Criterion, Kalliope. I found it ironic that he recorded in his diary that Proust had a 'complex' for telling antisemitic stories when he himself eventual..."

The article mentions that "it is plain that he sympathized with Joseph Caillaux, proponent of a separate peace with Germany".

And Proust has written in his novel (speaking about le Duc):

Il était de plus aussi anglophile que M. de Charlus était anglophone. Enfin il tenait M. Caillaux pour un traître qui méritait mille fois d'être fusillé.p. 166.

The section continues for a long paragraph discussing M. Caillaux.

the wiki...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_C...

As next year it is the centennial of WWI, I plan to read more about the war. My guess is that a great deal of this week's section will make more sense to me after I have gone deeper into the intricacies, political and military, of the war years. I will have to remember to come back to this volume.


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Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Paul Morand's

"Ode à Marcel Proust"

Ombre
Née de la fumée de vos fumigations,
Le visage et la voix
Mangés
Par l’usage de la nuit
Céleste,
Avec sa vigueur, douce, me trempe dans le jus noir
De votre chambre
Qui sent le bouchon tiède et la cheminée morte.
Derrière l’écran des cahiers,
Sous la lampe blonde et poisseuse comme une confiture,
Votre visage gît sous un traversin de craie.
Vous me tendez des mains gantées de filoselle;
Silencieusement votre barbe repousse
Au fond de vos joues.
Je dis :
- vous avez l’air d’aller fort bien.
Vous répondez :
- Cher ami, j’ai failli mourir trois fois dans la journée.
Vos fenêtres à tout jamais fermées
Vous refusent au boulevard Haussmann
Rempli à pleins bords,
Comme une auge brillante,
Du fracas de tôle des tramways.
Peut-être n’avez-vous jamais vu le soleil ?
Mais vous l’avez reconstitué, comme Lemoine, si véridique,
Que vos arbres fruitiers dans la nuit
Ont donné les fleurs.
Votre nuit n’est pas notre nuit :
C’est plein des lueurs blanches
Des catleyas) et des robes d’Odette,
Cristaux des flûtes, des lustres
Et des jabots tuyautés du général de Froberville.
Votre voix, blanche aussi, trace une phrase si longue
Qu’on dirait qu’elle plie, alors que comme un malade
Sommeillant qui se plaint,
Vous dites : qu’on vous a fait un énorme chagrin.
Proust, à quels raouts allez-vous donc la nuit
Pour en revenir avec des yeux si las et si lucides ?
Quelles frayeurs à nous interdites avez-vous connues
Pour en revenir si indulgent et si bon ?
Et sachant les travaux des âmes
Et ce qui se passe dans les maisons,
Et que l’amour fait si mal ?
Étaient-ce de si terribles veilles que vous y laissâtes
Cette rose fraicheur
Du portrait de Jacques-Émile Blanche ?
Et que vous voici, ce soir,
Pétri de la pâleur docile des cires
Mais heureux que l’on croie à votre agonie douce
De dandy gris perle et noir ?


(Paul Morand, 1915)


message 6: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 25, 2013 07:53AM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Kalliope wrote: "Paul Morand's

"Ode à Marcel Proust"
..."



That is a fine portrait of Proust - I would love to be able to translate it so that everyone could enjoy it - I looked for a translation but didn't find it - perhaps someone else will.
I'm surprised though that it was written as early as 1915, that Proust looked so frail and deathlike already.

These lines I particularly liked:
Votre nuit n’est pas notre nuit :
C’est plein des lueurs blanches


They reminded me of a painting I was thinking of the other day when I was rereading Proust's meditation on writing, pages 88 to 95. Here is the painting, Van Gogh's Starry Night, remarkable for its sinuous brushstrokes and its intense palette.



I translated the Ode - it's at post #3915 in the Group Lounge


Manny (mannyrayner) | 27 comments Thank you Kalliope, what a beautiful poem! Particularly appreciated just after finishing Proust connu et inconnu, which revealed many of the references...


message 8: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 24, 2013 05:24AM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Manny wrote: "Thank you Kalliope, what a beautiful poem! Particularly appreciated just after finishing Proust connu et inconnu, which revealed many of the references..."

Exactly, Manny. Thanks to Gautier- Vignal's account of the details of Proust's life in those years, this poem was particularly vivid.

I've just read Gilberte's second letter and am struck by the new meanings to be found in the phrase, du côté de - the French side and the German side. Who'd have thought when we read about the aubépines in the Combray section that the hawthorn path would attain such significance.


message 9: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 24, 2013 11:50AM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments de notre balcon dans ce silence d'une nuit où il y avait eu tout à coup une fête vraie avec fusées utiles et protectrices
page 135 GF
I can't resist another Van Gogh - even though it wasn't inspired by bomb warnings during a blackout:
j'étais presque au pont des Invalides. Les lumières, assez peu nombreuses (à cause des gothas) étaient allumées...et au dessus de la ville nocturne éclairée dans toute une partie du....ciel bleuâtre il continuait à faire un peu jour... page 142 GF




message 10: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Manny wrote: "Thank you Kalliope, what a beautiful poem! Particularly appreciated just after finishing Proust connu et inconnu, which revealed many of the references..."

I am glad you liked it. Yes, quite extraordinary. I hope you liked Proust inconnu now that it has become a bit more connu.


message 11: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "Kalliope wrote: "Paul Morand's

" I would love to be able to translate it so that everyone could enjoy it - I looked for a translati..."


Perfect painting, Fionnuala.... A painter who did not stay on the surface of things.


message 12: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "de notre balcon dans ce silence d'une nuit où il y avait eu tout à coup une fête vraie avec fusées utiles et protectrices
page 135 GF
I can't resist another Van Gogh - even though it wasn't inspire..."


This other Van Gogh is even better.. I don't think I had seen this one before.


message 13: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 24, 2013 10:50AM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments For those reading the GF Flammarion edition, on page 138, line 19, it's as if the editor left a note from Proust to himself in the text by accident. In it he's reminding himself to present 'le pendent' or the companion piece to the theories Saint-Loup developed in Doncières and also certain passages concerning Gilberte which he had placed at the end of the novel. Strange... Especially as Saint-Loup goes on to reference strategies put in place in 1918 but I had thought this section of the narrative was located around about 1916...


message 14: by Fionnuala (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments On writing;
Un général est comme un écrivain qui veut faire une certaine pièce, un certain livre, et que le livre lui même, avec les ressources inattendues qu'il révèle ici, l'impasse qu'il présente là, fait dévier extrêmement du plan préconçu. Comme une diversion par exemple ne doit se faire que sur un point qui a lui même assez d'importance, suppose que la diversion réussisse au delà de toute espérance, tandis que l'opération principale se solde par un échec, c'est la diversion qui peut devenir l'opération principale. page 142

Perhaps the Albertine volumes were a diversion from the original plan of the Recherche. Now we seem to be back on track and that entire interlude is as if it never existed.


message 15: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "On writing;
Un général est comme un écrivain qui veut faire une certaine pièce, un certain livre, et que le livre lui même, avec les ressources inattendues qu'il révèle ici, l'impasse qu'il présen..."


I loved this quote... Will come back to this.


message 16: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
I am responding here to Elizabeth's comments on the Wagner music and Apocalypse now. I should watch that film again (having visited twice where it was filmed in the Philippines). Had forgotten about the Wagner in that film... Than you.

And I am just back from listening to the London Symphony Orchestra plain Wagner's second Act of Tristan (and Schubert's 8th).


message 17: by Eugene (new)

Eugene | 479 comments Here we have Proust's most succinct definition of "...Habit, which cuts off from things...the root of profound impression and of thought which gives them their real meaning..." in a parenthetical.

It seemed (above all it had seemed at first, for upon those who had not lived, as I had, at a distance from Paris, there had descended Habit, which cuts off from things which we have witnessed a number of times the root of profound impression and of thought which gives them their real meaning), it seemed almost that there was something cruel in these leaves granted to the men at the front. ML p. 96


message 18: by Eugene (last edited Nov 24, 2013 10:11PM) (new)

Eugene | 479 comments This is some of the best war reporting I have ever read:

...it was from the shores of death, whither they would soon return, that they came to spend a few moments in our midst, incomprehensible to us, filling us with tenderness and terror and a feeling of mystery, like phantoms whom we summon from the dead, who appear to us for a second, whom we dare not question, and who could, in any case, only reply: "You cannot possibly imagine."

For it is extraordinary how, in the survivors of battle, which is what soldiers on leave are, or in living men hypnotised or dead men summoned by a medium, the only effect of contact with mystery is to increase, if that be possible, the insignificance of the things people say. ...
ML p. 97>>>


message 19: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
I am most fascinated by the approach to the war that Proust is taking. This was a time of severe nationalism, which in Europe were very much the product of the nineteenth century.

I have been very interested in the Dada group and the individuals who gathered around that "movement" (it was not really a movement) because they were part of the few who did not react to the war with severe nationalism.

Proust's subtle and rather neutral approach is exceptional.


message 20: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (last edited Nov 25, 2013 11:32AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
More "horizontal" threads..

Now the Myosotis or "ne m'oubliez pas" or forget-me-not.. appear again.. Now as "ne m'oubliez pas" and before as "myosotis".

...et même des soldats qui lui avaient seulement demandé "la permission de cueillir un des ne m'oubliez pas qui poussaient auprès de l'étang. p. 128.




message 21: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Interesting passage on the power, o lack thereof, of words.

Saint-Loup's letter to the Narrator.

L'épopée es tellement belle que tu trouverais comme moi que les mots ne font plus rien. Rodin ou Maillol pourraient faire un chef-d'oeuvre ave une matière affreuse qu'on ne reconnaîtrait pas... p. 129.


message 22: by Fionnuala (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Kalliope wrote: "..Proust's subtle and rather neutral approach is exceptional. "

I've the impression that he's examining the war in the same way he examined salon life - by x-raying it, looking at the patterns beneath the surface and certainly not reacting with any warped nationalistic fervour.


message 23: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Another horizontal thread, and not obvious.

Now El Greco's El entierro del Conde de Orgaz is mentioned and Karpeles includes it in his book.

This painting had been alluded to before, but not mentioned. When the Narrator's father travels to Spain, to Toledo, in the company of Norpois, the Narrator said that the father wanted to see a Greco painting there. This was this Entierro.

This painting does not travel. It is in a chapel in a church and is never taken out.

Fascinating the way he underlies the two levels.. the sky (celestial world) and the earth (societal relationships).

.. et je dis à Saint-Loup que s'il avait été à la maison la veille il aurait pu tout en contemplant l'apocalypse dans le ciel, voir sur la terre (comme dans "L'Enterrement du comte d'Orage du Greco où ces différents plans sont parallèles) un vrai vaudeville joue par des personnages en chemise de nuit,... p. 136.

Here is a couple of photos of the painting as it had to survive another war...






message 24: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
I am amused the Narrator calls the "casulla" that the priest is wearing the "chemise de unit"... I laughed at this...



Proust never saw this painting, but Gautier-Vignal wrote about the art books he lent to him, since he (G-V) travelled a fair amount and collected art books. Amongst these he mentions the books from the works in the Spanish museums.


message 25: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "Kalliope wrote: "..Proust's subtle and rather neutral approach is exceptional. "

I've the impression that he's examining the war in the same way he examined salon life - by x-raying it, looking at..."


I loved it when he used the X-raying expression (memories of Hans Castorp and The Magic Mountain...)...


message 26: by Fionnuala (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Kalliope wrote: "..des personnages en chemise de nuit,."

Well done for spotting this 'horizontal thread', Kalliope. I remember the reference, but only now that you've mentioned it.
Such a comical juxtaposition - the 'crème de la crème' in their night-clothes and the funeral cortège at the comte d'Orgaz's burial!


message 27: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "For those reading the GF Flammarion edition, on page 138, line 19, it's as if the editor left a note from Proust to himself in the text by accident. In it he's reminding himself to present 'le pend..."

Yes, that looks very much like an editorial note to himself...

I'll quote the full sentence.

Mettre ici tout ce qui est le pendant des conversations de Doncières et peut-être tout ce que je faisais dire à la fin du livre à Gilberte

This section is not in my audio (Pléaiade)... From Je demandais à Saint-Loup si cette guerre... p. 137 until Il faut dire pourtant que si la guerre.... in p 139, is not in this other edition.


message 28: by Fionnuala (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Kalliope wrote: "...Yes, that looks very much like an editorial note to himself....."

This is the sort of thing that will be visible, but highlighted, in the fac-similé edition from Gallimard, perhaps?


message 29: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 25, 2013 01:24PM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Reading that Mme de Villeparisis is now dead, the fact of her death doesn't surprise me - last time we saw her, she was stoically listening to M. Norpois uttering a long monologue and was none the better for it - but the way Proust inserts it into the text does surprise me a little. It shouldn't however because this is exactly how he dealt with Swann's death announcement, inserting it into a passage about something totally unrelated. Mme de V, like Swann was one of my favourite characters. At least they got the same treatment.


message 30: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "Reading that Mme de Villeparisis is now dead, the fact of her death doesn't surprise me - last time we saw her, she was stoically listening to M. Norpois uttering a long monologue and was none the ..."

The truth is that I am getting mixed up with the deaths and resurrections.. Wasn't the death of Mme de Villeparisis alluded to before? (before her dinner with Norpois in Venice)?


message 31: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (last edited Nov 25, 2013 01:33PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
For the Zouaves, I think FioFio will like Van Gogh's version (who also got deeper into the characters than the Goncourts..)...





Charlus is walking behind two Zouaves who do not pay much attention to him..

Marchant derrière deux zouaves qui ne semblaient guère se préoccuper de lui... p. 143.


message 32: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
One Modigliani too...




message 33: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
And for the Americans.. one Homer...





message 34: by Fionnuala (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Kalliope wrote: ".The truth is that I am getting mixed up with the deaths and resurrections.. Wasn't the death of Mme de Villeparisis alluded to before? (before her dinner with Norpois in Venice)?"

I think you are right - I had forgotten. Perhaps that's why it was not such a shock!


message 35: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "Kalliope wrote: ".The truth is that I am getting mixed up with the deaths and resurrections.. Wasn't the death of Mme de Villeparisis alluded to before? (before her dinner with Norpois in Venice)?"..."

So, may be it is not just the two birds who resurrect... it is most of his characters...


message 36: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 25, 2013 02:50PM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Kalliope wrote: "...Charlus is walking behind two Zouaves who do not pay much attention to him.."

Thank you for posting those paintings, Kalliope.

As for Charlus...the Narrator repeats four times in as many pages that for Charlus as well as for Mme Verdurin, life continued quite normally in spite of the war. This repetition becomes almost like a refrain...but perhaps it is simply lack of editing?


message 37: by Jocelyne (new)

Jocelyne Lebon | 745 comments Manny wrote: "Thank you Kalliope, what a beautiful poem! Particularly appreciated just after finishing Proust connu et inconnu, which revealed many of the references..."

Yes, so many references, indeed. It is as if GV had written the poem. I really enjoyed Proust connu et inconnu. It gives us a different angle on Proust's last days and focuses more on the intellectual aspect of their relationship whereas with Celeste Albaret we are privy to the management of their everyday life. Both are great.


message 38: by Jocelyne (last edited Nov 25, 2013 05:04PM) (new)

Jocelyne Lebon | 745 comments Fionnuala wrote: "Kalliope wrote: "Paul Morand's

"Ode à Marcel Proust"
..."


That is a fine portrait of Proust - I would love to be able to translate it so that everyone could enjoy it - I looked for a translati..."


This is so uncanny, Fiofio. I first read the poem in The Lounge (with your masterful translation)and my eyes stopped at precisely those lines: Votre nuit n'est pas notre nuit C'est plein des lueurs blanches. My heart clenched at those words. I love the VG paintings.

In the Gilberte's letter I like the expression she uses 'le raidillon des aubépines'.


message 39: by Jocelyne (new)

Jocelyne Lebon | 745 comments Kalliope wrote: "Fionnuala wrote: "Reading that Mme de Villeparisis is now dead, the fact of her death doesn't surprise me - last time we saw her, she was stoically listening to M. Norpois uttering a long monologue..."

I too get a little mixed-up at the deaths and spontaneous resurrections, and I can only marvel at Proust's extraordinary feat: how on earth could he hold all those characters in his head for so many pages, especially knowing that he did not work with a word-processor and could not easily retrieve a piece of information that he might need to develop the character. It is mind-boggling.


message 40: by Marcelita (last edited Nov 25, 2013 05:54PM) (new)

Marcelita Swann | 1135 comments Jocelyne wrote: "Kalliope wrote: "Fionnuala wrote: "Reading that Mme de Villeparisis is now dead..

"...especially knowing that he did not work with a word-processor and could not easily retrieve a piece of information that he might need to develop the character. It is mind-boggling."


Cannot imagine Celeste's contributions...pasting Proust's re-visions on revisions!

Trailer for the awarding winning short-film:
LA PART CELESTE (Début) on Vimeo (1)
vimeo.com/45969386
Film de Thibaut Gobry. Les derniers jours de Marcel Proust vus par sa servante, Céleste Albaret

Extrait 2 du film "La part Céleste" de Thibaut Gobry (2)
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xstb...
Extrait du court métrage du Troyen Thibaut Gobry, primé au Rhode Island International Festival

La Part Céleste au cinéma (Troyes) (3)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWdy_8Io0Co

I have a copy of this charming film. If you are interested in owning your own, contact:
Camille Velluet
Zorba Production
23, rue des Jeûneurs
75002 Paris
c.velluet@zorbaproduction


message 41: by Eugene (new)

Eugene | 479 comments In this they were ungrateful, for M. de Charlus was to some extent their poet, the man who had been able to extract from the world of fashion a sort of essential poetry, which had in it elements of history, of beauty, of the picturesque, of the comic, of frivolous elegance. But people in society, incapable of understanding this poetry, did not see that it existed in their own lives; they sought for it rather elsewhere, and placed on an infinitely higher peak than M. de Charlus men who were much stupider than him... ML p. 110


message 42: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "Kalliope wrote: "...

As for Charlus...the Narrator repeats four time..."


Yes, the writing is more sloppy, apart from that note to himself that FioFio pointed out, there are some repetitions of words that one did not encounter before.

i>Les lumières, assez peu nombreuses (à cause des gothas), étaient allumées un peu trop tôt car le changement d'heures avait été fait un peu trop tôt... p.142.

This kind of repetitions do not seem to respond to stylistic interest... but as JoJo says, given the way he worked..... I am not complaining... just noticing.


message 43: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Marcelita wrote: "Jocelyne wrote: "Kalliope wrote: "Fionnuala wrote: "Reading that Mme de Villeparisis is now dead..

"...especially knowing that he did not work with a word-processor and could not easily retrieve a..."


Very interesting, Marcelita. How long is this film?


message 44: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Marcelita wrote: "Jocelyne wrote: "Kalliope wrote: "Fionnuala wrote: "Reading that Mme de Villeparisis is now dead..

"...especially knowing that he did not work with a word-processor and could not easily retrieve a..."


Found this, it is 30 minutes...

http://www.zorbaproduction.com/produc...


message 45: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 26, 2013 12:21AM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Kalliope wrote: "...Found this, it is 30 minutes."

La Part Céleste? Almost as good a title as La Part des Anges!
I can well imagine that the meticulous work of pasting all those paperolles onto the cahiers and the proofs did indeed fall to Celeste - it would have been difficult to do while lying propped up on one elbow and working without a firm support underneath..
In spite of repetitions and resurrections, I am more content reading Proust's prose than I have been reading anything for a very long time. What's more, this volume reads almost too quickly - I feel the need to slow down and make it last...


message 46: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "I can well imagine that the meticulous work of pasting all those paperolles onto t..."

The "paperolles" idea I think it was Celeste's.


message 47: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 26, 2013 05:36AM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Elizabeth wrote: "This week's reading mentions (obliquely) the English Blockade of Germany. This was considered scandalous at the time; the British Navy effectively stopped all imports (including medicine & food) i..."

I've just come to that reference, Elizabeth -page 159 GF - and I'm not sure what exactly Proust is saying here, via Charlus, about the English, Dostoyevsky and the Germans..


message 48: by Martin (new)

Martin Gibbs | 105 comments Eugene wrote: "In this they were ungrateful, for M. de Charlus was to some extent their poet, the man who had been able to extract from the world of fashion a sort of essential poetry, which had in it elements of..."

Eugene, this section jumped out at me as well. Among all the imagery it brings, I see Montesquiou as his relevancy fades.


message 49: by Fionnuala (last edited Nov 26, 2013 06:10AM) (new) - added it

Fionnuala | 1142 comments Jocelyne wrote: "This is so uncanny, Fiofio. I first read the poem in The Lounge (with your masterful translation) and my eyes stopped at precisely those lines: Votre nuit n'est pas notre nuit C'est plein des lueurs blanches. My heart clenched at those words. I love the VG paintings.."

Glad the lines stood out for you too, Jocelyne. A native French speaker like yourself would no doubt do a better job of translating Morand's snapshot of Proust. But I posted my translation effort because the poem which Kall unearthed is like a rare piece of film of Proust in the later years that has suddenly been provided to satisfy our yearning for further glimpses of him and I wanted everyone to be able to access it. Proust may not have appreciated this pen portrait by Morand but I think it must have been a fairly accurate one all the same.
And the Van Gogh paintings do fit well - his dreams were as tortured as Proust's.


message 50: by Kalliope, Priestess of Proust (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kalliope | 2929 comments Mod
Fionnuala wrote: "Jocelyne wrote: "This is so uncanny, Fiofio. I first read the poem in The Lounge (with your masterful translation) and my eyes stopped at precisely those lines: Votre nuit n'est pas notre nuit C'es..."

Proust cannot have been too upset with the Poem, given how he includes his "..comme raconte le charmant Morand, l'auteur délicieux de Clarisse...".. this sentence is completely unnecessary in the context. It is a tribute to Morand..


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