Robbie’s Comments (group member since Jan 21, 2008)

Robbie’s comments from the Books I Want To Talk About group.

Charly wrote: "Just read this a short while ago and I was really struck by the fact that so much that changed our culture and way of life came out of this fair and our history books in the schools barely mention ..."

Charly: that's what I liked so much about this book, too. Even though I thought it was kind of dry, I kept finding myself wanting to tell everybody about that world's fair!

It was kind of creepy, but not keep me up all night creepy. Probably when I was younger, and not completely desensitized to this sort of thing, it would have been creepier. I found it thought-provoking, though. I was going to pick it for my October choice, but now I have September :)

American Salvage

Do you like the short story format?
Which of the stories do you wish were longer?
Which might have lost something if the story had continued?
In which characters was it particularly hard for you to see their "core of platinum"?
Which was your favorite story?

Something Wicked This Way Comes

If you could become younger or older in the present day, but neither gain nor lose knowledge in the process, would you? Why or why not? Which age(s) would you choose?

My point of view? I don't even know where Dunkirk is! ;)

I liked that section, too.

It was a long time since I read this. What's in Part Two again?

Amen, Charly! I actually hadn't thought of it as a book for women, but I guess I can understand how someone could get that idea.

I will post here discussion questions that appear in the back of my book. Feel free to answer them or to bring up other questions or points. I'm posting these primarily to stimulate discussion.

1) Much of the novel takes place in two grand estates--Angelfield and then Miss Winter's. How are the houses reflections of their inhabitants?

2)As the story unfolds, we learn that Margaret and Miss Winter are both twins. What else do they have in common?

3) Margaret and her mother are bound by a singular loss--the death of Margaret's twin sister. How has each woman dealt with this loss, and how has it affected her life? If her parents had told her the truth about her twin, would Margaret still be haunted?

4) Books play a major role in this novel. Margaret, for example, sells books for a living. Miss Winter writes them. Most of the important action of the story takes place in libraries. There are stories within stories, all inextricably intertwined. Discuss the various roles of books, stories and writing in this novel.

5) Miss Winter asks Margaret if she'd like to hear a ghost story--in fact, there seem to be several ghost stories weaving their way through. In what ways is The Thirteenth Tale a classic, gothic novel?

6) Miss Winter frequently changes the point of view from third to first person, from "they" to "we" to "I," in telling Margaret her story. The first time she uses "I" is in the recounting of Isabelle's death and Charlie's disappearance. What did you make of this shifting when Margaret points it out [on page 204 in my version:]?

7) Compare and contrast Margaret, Miss Winter and Aurelius--the three "ghosts" of the novel who are also each haunted by their pasts.

8) It is a classic writer's axiom that a symbol must appear at least three times in a story so that the reader knows that the author meant it as a symbol. In The Thirteenth Tale, the novel Jane Eyre appears several times. Discuss the appearances and allusions to Jane Eyre and how this novel echoes that one.

9) The story shifts significantly after the death of Mrs. Dunne and John Digence. Adeline steps forward as intelligent, well spoken and confident--the "girl in the mists" emerges. Did you believe this miraculous transformation? If not, what did you suspect was really going on?

10) Dr. Clifton tells Margaret that she is "suffering from an ailment that afflicts ladies of romantic imagination" when he learns that she is an avid reader of novels such as Wuthering Heights, Jane Eyre and Sense and Sensibility. What do you think he means by drawing such a parallel? What other parallels exist between The Thirteenth Tale and classic nineteenth-century literature?

11) When did you first suspect Miss Winter's true identity? Whether you knew or not, looking back, what clues did she give to Margaret (and what clues did the author give to you)?

12) Margaret tells Aurelius that her mother preferred telling "weightless" stories in place of heavy ones, and that sometimes it's better "not to know." Do you agree or disagree?

13) The title of this novel is taken from the title of Miss Winter's first book, Thirteen Tales of Change and Desperation, a collection of twelve stories with a mysterious thirteenth left out at the last minute before publication. How is this symbolic of the novel? What is the thirteenth tale?

14) When do you think The Thirteenth Tale takes place? The narrator gives some hints, but never tells the exact date. Which aspects of the book gave you a sense of time, and which seemed timeless? Did the question of time affect your experience with the novel?

It was intentionally left unclear by the author. I think Ms. Winter was never sure, but one could find little things to support one view over the other. I think Ms. Winter was treating "Emmeline" well in case it truly was her. "Emmeline's" reaction when introduced to Aurelius could be interpreted as coming from either twin.

Meghan wrote: "Oh Robbie...(shakes head sadly)...the Steelers?! (haha)"

Did you watch that Super Bowl? If that last play wasn't a miracle, I don't know what is! ;)

Every time I read the first post here, I keep reading it as "Stephen King" instead of "King Stephen."

I thought of Philip's piousness/pride as being typical of a lot of Christians. Well, a lot of people in general, really. I'm sure I said this in response to something later in the book, and I don't think it's a spoiler, I thought Follett did an amazing job of capturing what it is like for a human--sinful by nature as it says in the Bible--to try to act faithfully, which I think Philip is trying to do.

Sarah, yeah the prayer stuff is tough. Perhaps the act of prayer is a demonstration of our reliance on God to take care of us, so our specific requests aren't so important? Sigh. It *is* a mystery. Who knows what the process of granting prayer requests, if/when they are granted is?

I confess. I've prayed for Steelers victories.

I forget exactly who was in the prologue, but they do come in to play eventually, and it's made quite clear who they are at that time. I don't remember anybody's name. Maybe I'll have to get the book out again for this discussion!

Thanks, Sarah :)
BTW, I'm pretty sure I answered these questions as I went along. It just took me so long to get through the first part, that I had some trouble remembering the book in order to answer some of the questions!

Awww...shucks! Thanks for the welcomes. I'll do my best here, folks!

I've stated this in other thread, I think. I had trouble getting through SOAW. Probably part of the reason was because I was in a bad emotional place at the time. Also, I hadn't read any of the original Oz books. After reading a few of the L.F. Baum books to my children, I thought to myself that I may have gotten more out of SOAW if I had read the Oz books first. Still, I don't plan to re-read SOAW.

I don't remember, either. She looked familiar, but I kept thinking she reminded me of a patient from my former job--slight developmental delay and very sweet. She did a great job in the film!

I saw the movie last night and enjoyed it. A bit of a tear-jerker at times. It must be pretty faithful to the book, as I had a sense of deja vu most of the time (you may remember earlier in the thread I confessed to not remembering much of the book.)

I mostly found David to be weak more than anything else. He was the typical paternalistic doctor and husband of his time. He provided a great example of what can go terribly wrong when somebody lies, particularly when they're too cowardly to admit to the initial wrong-doing.

I think Briony was trying to forgive herself, and I *hope* that she did. I enjoyed the movie, but I think it made Briony a less sympathetic character than I found her to be in the book. (As I recall it.)

Robbie died in the war. I think his part was accurate up to the point that he got the infection, and then he died from it instead of the other stuff.