RESPONSE - Former Muslim Turned Christian Conversion Tale

Kirb Brimstone – [tags me in link]

Messiah or Prophet? - Nabeel Qureshi
Muhammad Rasheed - Another one of these guys? pfft...
Kirb Brimstone - What do you mean by "Another one of these guys?"
Muhammad Rasheed - Yes. These guys are very popular for y'all to circulate on FB.
They also lack value.
Muhammad Rasheed - RESPONSE - "A Message to President Obama from a Former Muslim"
Muhammad Rasheed - Wait... You Converted to Christianity Because of What the Qur'an Said About Jesus???
Kirb Brimstone - You didn't answer my question. What do you mean by "Another one of these guys?"
Kirb Brimstone - Did you even watch to the video?
Muhammad Rasheed - Kirb Brimstone wrote: "You didn't answer my question."
Did you answer my question asking you to clarify the "If you say so" response? Did you give me an example to the "close-minded" accusation like I asked?  Don't be an @sshole, Kirb.
Kirb Brimstone wrote: "What do you mean by 'Another one of these guys?'"
Did you see the links I posted with two guys exactly like that to which I responded on my blog? Former Muslims who are professional speakers that vilify my faith playing on their audience's ignorance. Those guys.
Muhammad Rasheed - Kirb Brimstone wrote: "Did you even watch to the video?"
I'm watching it now so I can add this dude to my collection. You realize the clip is 50 minutes long, right?
Muhammad Rasheed - 1.) The example he used that demonstrated how his father was kind, loving and peaceful is to point out that he joined the US military the second he got to America.
Kirb Brimstone - Muhammad Rasheed wrote: I'm watching it now so I can add this dude to my collection. You realize the clip is 50 minutes long, right?”
Then maybe you should write that this is "one of those guys" before you finished watching it.
Muhammad Rasheed - 2.) Wonders how his mom could learn what Christian westerners are really like if none ever invited her into their home. Meanwhile there are an awful lot of those westerners that demonize her people people they are different. Do you hear how that same demographic treats Obama, even though he is a self-confessed Christian himself?
Kirb Brimstone - 1.) The example he used that demonstrated how his father was kind, loving and peaceful is to point out that he joined the US military the second he got to America.
Oh that's a nit pick if I've ever heard one Moe. You're not even done watch the video and already you write this trivial foolishness? 
What does him telling his Christian audience that Muslims are generally peaceful people and using his father as an example have to really do with anything?
Muhammad Rasheed - Kirb Brimstone wrote: "Then maybe you should write that this is "one of those guys" before you finished watching it.
If he turns out not to be a dumbass like those other two then I'll apologize.
Muhammad Rasheed - Kirb Brimstone wrote: "What does him telling his Christian audience that Muslims are generally peaceful people and using his father as an example have to really do with anything?"
I'm just jotting notes as I go. Don't respond to them yet unless you want to delay me getting to the end of the clip by responding to your nonsense.
Make yourself useful and answer the questions I asked of you just prior to you pressing me to answer one of your questions.
Kirb Brimstone - I have a feeling nothing will get you to apologize and no matter what this guy says it's gonna be "dumbass" to you.
Muhammad Rasheed - 3.) There is a difference between the "stereotypes of the west" and what God said about Christians in scripture.
Muhammad Rasheed - Kirb Brimstone wrote: "I have a feeling nothing will get you to apologize and no matter what this guy says it's gonna be 'dumbass' to you."
This is a close-minded comment. Perhaps you should wait until I get to the end before you start with your foolishness...?
Muhammad Rasheed - 4.) His example of "being a good Muslim" is reading the Qur'an in Arabic before he's old enough to understand it.
Muhammad Rasheed - 5.) He makes the comment that Christians generally don't know why they believe what they believe, but very tellingly, the Former Muslim tells us that it was his mom that told him what to think when it came to knowing why he believed in Islam.
Muhammad Rasheed - 6.) "Most miraculous man that ever lived" isn't an Islamic principle. Part of the "Belief in the Prophets" pillar was that we aren't to uphold any of the prophets over any other. So how was he taught that from an Islamic standpoint? Besides, surely Moses was given permission to perform more miracles than Jesus did, right?
Muhammad Rasheed - 7.) "Gonna come back at the end of time and initiate Judgment" also isn't what the Qur'an says. All of the prophets will return to bear witness to/fro those they preached to during their lifetime. That's why Jesus is coming back, for the same reason they will all come back: to fulfill the final task in their prophethood role. Are you sure he was supposed to be a Muslim?
Muhammad Rasheed - 8.) He said he told David that he was just “making this stuff up” because David had his own understanding of scripture based on his own self-study and dialogs, compared to the usual responses he received from other Christians. 
9.) “The key was here was a man that was passionate about his faith, who was passionate about God, who was willing to talk with me. Even though he was my total foil, we were exact opposites, he was a Christian and I was a Muslim, we became best friends because he cared about his God.”
Muhammad Rasheed - 10.) He said it makes a big difference if someone who tells you that your worldview is wrong cares enough to be willing to die for you.
Muhammad Rasheed - 11.) Disagreeing with a particular doctrine doesn't mean I'm trying to tear down the individual who is presenting it.
Muhammad Rasheed - 12.) "Relationships are critical for sharing the Gospel." You may wish to think about how it comes across to other people when you duck their questions all while pressing them to answer yours, Kirb.  It's not an endearing habit.
Muhammad Rasheed - 13.) He says that he came to the conclusion that the New Testament couldn't have been altered in a way in which we wouldn't have been able to detect it. That the one we hold today is the same NT from the fragments.
Muhammad Rasheed - 14.) He said that literally it says in Surah 5, Ayats 72-73 that it says if you believe that Jesus is God you will go to hell. It says:
72. They do blaspheme who say: "Allah is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help. 
73 They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One Allah. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.
I think the "blasphemers among them" part is significant, and refers to those who also they believe this unforgivable thing, still have their good deeds outweighing their bad deeds though. But don't take my word on it though. Why risk hellfire? It's better to repent and worship the One God alone. Stop worshipping the messenger.
Muhammad Rasheed 15.) "Did Jesus claim to be God or not?" Why would this be a serious question? Does he not understand how the revelation of sacred scripture through the prophets even works?
Muhammad Rasheed - 15.) "Did Jesus claim to be God or not?" Why would this be a serious question? Does he not understand how the revelation of sacred scripture through the prophets even works?
Muhammad Rasheed - 16.) "And I had been taught that Muhammad was the greatest man who had ever lived." (see: #6 above)
Muhammad Rasheed - 17.) His reference to the "earliest gospel" in which it shows Jesus saying he is god. Which gospel was that? One of the four that we have today?
Muhammad Rasheed - 18.) He said he doesn't have time to get into the details of why he believes the things he said about the Qur'an's preservation and Muhammad's life, but that it is "in his book." Kirb, do you have this book so we may analyze these claims?  Scan the relevant pages and post them, please.
Muhammad Rasheed - 19.) He said that Muslims put a lot of stock in dreams and visions, giving his own opinion as to why, and told the Christian audience not to take for granted their belief that God speaks to them directly. God said He listens to the prayers of all those that call upon Him, but there is indeed a strict rule to how He chooses to commune with mankind. Here's what God said about the matter in the Qur'an:
Surah 4251 "It is not fitting for a man that Allah should speak to him except by inspiration, or from behind a veil, or by the sending of a messenger to reveal, with Allah's permission, what Allah wills: for He is Most High, Most Wise."
Muhammad Rasheed - 20.) Interesting that when he reached a low moment of confidence in his beliefs, he didn't go to the Word of God, but opted for the "send me a dream" route. Naturally I would expect you to consider my contempt for this concept to be "closed-minded." lol But the Book has been sent here as a guide to mankind, and it has very definitive answers regarding these very matters that plagued him after his three year "critical study" of Christianity. Why didn't he go to the Qur'an instead of asking for an ambiguous dream?
Muhammad Rasheed - 21.) Takes note that the doctrinal (hellfire) aspect of the consequences for Nabeel's conversion are only an afterthought to him. He was FAR more concerned at the cultural/traditional part. It explains many of the things he said, and why his Islam understanding was so weak and surface-level.
Muhammad Rasheed - 22.) "For the first time in his life" he goes to the Qur'an for comfort/knowledge/wisdom instead of ritual recitation or searching for items for debate during this low moment. What happened to when he was supposed to have been studying Islam/Qur'an critically? But I suppose you would consider that "trivial foolishness" to bring that up, too, huh, Kirb?
Muhammad Rasheed - 23.) RE: the part where he's complaining that the Qur'an didn't apply to him, but the bible had the answer to everything he asked. At that point he had already made up his mind about converting, so he was looking for something to comfort the upcoming morning period of separation from his folks. He found stern warnings against converting in the Qur'an of course. Naturally their wouldn't be any comfort in that regard. lol In the bible he found a verse that he used as a generic greeting card moment to apply to what he felt in the moment. I'm supposed to take that seriously? 
Then he asked if God even heard his prayers, and found a biblical footnote showing him where to go. He should recognize the Qur'anic verse that I referenced above in which God said He hears the prayers of all those who call upon Him. He didn't consider that of comfort? It comforts me as a believer. I'm not even in med school...
Muhammad Rasheed - 24.) In the part where he's "interacting with God in the pages of scripture," where he said "Jesus was not unfamiliar with the cost," what does God say about Jesus in the Qur'an? What about that cost? Of saying of the messenger that of which is not true, and hinging your soul upon it? Was that not important? Why not?
Muhammad Rasheed - 25.) "I heard these words: 'Because this isn't about you.'"
Perhaps it was the adversary telling you this, rejoicing in that his scheme to help you give in to your temptations to accept a doctrine whose central thesis is the One Unforgivable Sin.
Muhammad Rasheed - 26.) "...after jumping through these hoops, then He MIGHT be happy enough with me to let me into heaven..."
This is strawman nonsense Christian missionaries are taught to tell weak Muslims. It absolutely does not reflect the message of God in the Qur'an. God said several times, definitively, that if you believe in Him, do good deeds (he lists the top good deeds at least 3 times), avoid the temptations of sin, and repent of those sins when you mess up, you will indeed get your reward. You will have no need to fear, nor shall you grieve. The revealed message to mankind from the Lord of all the worlds. God does not lie. where are the missionaries who specialize in converting these weak cultural Muslims getting this wishy-washy "maybe you'll go to heaven and maybe you won't after jumping through all these Five Pillar hoops?" 
God does not lie, but mankind (and the unseen adversary) often lie. I choose to believe God and am therefore saved. You may keep your lies. I have no use for Paul.
Muhammad Rasheed - CONCLUSION: Like the other two cultural Former Muslims, Nabeel Qureshi was also weak in faith, insight and understanding in what he claimed to believe. He never subscribed to Islam based on his own desire to strengthen his soul, but to please his parents. He followed it because that is what he was raised to do. His reasons for why he believed in Islam weren't his reasons, they were the route memorized reasons his mom gave him. Nabeel himself never believed. His presentation was weaker than the other "these guys" because it had more fluff to it, and was on a strict time restriction. Even still, the comments he did make revealed a weak understanding of what he claimed he used to believe in. If he truly believed in what the Qur'an said, if he really critically studied it to show himself approved in the eyes of his Lord, he would be a stronger Muslim today.  In other words, yes, I find him to be a dumbass just like those other guys.  I don't know what you expected to be any different. Weak cultural Former Muslims who convert to Christianity and are popular on the evangelical lecture circuit are so far all alike. What else do you have that is more challenging for me?

Muhammad Rasheed - The interesting thing about Kirb is that he doesn't listen to a damned thing I say, and yet remains confused as to how his efforts to convert me fail.

At least Deac will have the common sense to custom tailor his argument towards what I actually list as my deal breakers in his doctrine.

Abdur Rasheed - That's not really interesting. That's just Kirby tripe. The opposite of interesting.

Muhammad Rasheed - Well, I mean "interesting" like watching a rodent in an experiment and recording the stuff it does or doesn't do according to various stimuli. Like that.

Not "interesting" like Avengers 2.

Kirb Brimstone - I notice you critique him not hos argiements.

Kirb Brimstone - Not ducking anything like I said I am at work. Can't really spend work hours hdoing this but I can't wait to respond when I can.

Muhammad Rasheed - Kirb Brimstone wrote: "Not ducking anything like I said I am at work."

You deliberately ducked direct questions before you went to work, and before you pressed me to answer questions of yours.

Kirb Brimstone wrote: “I notice you critique him not hos argiements.”

I guess being at work is affecting your ability to "notice" stuff, too, then?


See Also:

RESPONSE - "A Message to President Obama from a Former Muslim"
Wait... You Converted to Christianity Because of What the Qur'an Said About Jesus???

The Return of Kirb Brimstone