Fretting over Stars again
Years ago, I made a comment that I saw nothing wrong with giving a book two stars on Goodreads. Goodreads says that 2 stars mean, "It was okay." And pragmatically, many of the books any of us read are just that. Okay. Okay enough that I finished it.
3 Stars mean, I liked it, and so on.
So. Say I just finished a book. I finished it, so that means it's not a one star. One star books don't get that much of my time. How do I feel about this book. For me, well, it's between and two and a three. I liked a lot of it, and in a few places I sighed and made the decision to keep reading.
But the thing is, I know that a goodly percentage of the people who read my books would actually give that book a four or a five star rating. Because it has x or y or z elements that they love, and they actually wish I'd put more of that ingredient in my books.
(X, Y or Z examples. Extended graphic sex. Very graphic violence. Pages of description of the geography. Pages and pages of intricate history you must know to understand why they are star crossed lovers. Buffonery and pratfalls. Puns. Gooey romance. S&M. )
Those are elements that, in excess, lessen my enjoyment of a book. But those same elements, lavishly and extravagantly applied are exactly what some of my readers most love in a book. Those elements are often why a book I merely liked becomes a number one best seller.
Soo . . . do I give a book the stars I'd give if I were recommending it to me? Or give it the stars that will bring it the readers it deserves?
It's a dilemma. And for now, I think I'll pretend I'm recommending the book to myself, and star it accordingly.
3 Stars mean, I liked it, and so on.
So. Say I just finished a book. I finished it, so that means it's not a one star. One star books don't get that much of my time. How do I feel about this book. For me, well, it's between and two and a three. I liked a lot of it, and in a few places I sighed and made the decision to keep reading.
But the thing is, I know that a goodly percentage of the people who read my books would actually give that book a four or a five star rating. Because it has x or y or z elements that they love, and they actually wish I'd put more of that ingredient in my books.
(X, Y or Z examples. Extended graphic sex. Very graphic violence. Pages of description of the geography. Pages and pages of intricate history you must know to understand why they are star crossed lovers. Buffonery and pratfalls. Puns. Gooey romance. S&M. )
Those are elements that, in excess, lessen my enjoyment of a book. But those same elements, lavishly and extravagantly applied are exactly what some of my readers most love in a book. Those elements are often why a book I merely liked becomes a number one best seller.
Soo . . . do I give a book the stars I'd give if I were recommending it to me? Or give it the stars that will bring it the readers it deserves?
It's a dilemma. And for now, I think I'll pretend I'm recommending the book to myself, and star it accordingly.
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Preston
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Feb 02, 2019 09:30PM
Surprisingly enough I remember when you first posted your logic behind your star designation and I adopted a similar system. I rarely give one star to a book as well because short of being stuck on a plane and only having the book available to distract me, one star books rarely warrant finishing.
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Robin, thanks for this.I find it is a dilemma that probably differs over time and perhaps stature.
I'm in the position of seeking reviews good enough to propel a little further along the journey.
Most of the opportunities I have of reviewing new work tend to come from folk that I know who are also struggling to establish. Combine that with a personal difficulty in coming to grips with e-reading and it leaves me in some dilemmas.
There is such a lot to master in the giving of reviews, not least of which is the actual quality of the book (as I perceive it) and what it deserves. Context of reading is a big thing, I think.
Anyway, thanks for posting.
Nothing wrong with your reasoning. Your rating system sounds much like mine so i might be biased. Mine is relatively simple, 1 star= I hated it (only because I couldn't give it no stars and still let myself know how i felt about it), 2 stars means i disliked it, 3 equals it was enjoyable but there were things i didn't care for and i may or may not pick up another book if its a series, etc. These rating systems are highly subjective so i simply look to see if a person I'm following gives their rationale for rating and if not then i just read their review if given and make a decision based off the initial review and a few others selected randomly, pro and con. Also, i may be a minority (honestly i think there are many others who don't bother to comment a lot of times- i had to force myself to write this much haha), but i do not like all the cringey sex scenes and gratuitous violence often found in my preferred genre and wish I could find a "clean" read that is good as well ( I haven't mentioned yet how obsessed i was with the Farseer and Tawny Man series but I'm squeezing it in here. I LOVED them).
I'd read your previous review remarks, but as it is, I always assume the stars are how someone personally felt about a book, and not their professional opinion. Unless you're being paid to write the review, even as a published author and public figure, I don't think you're obligated to do otherwise.
I would say give it the stars to reflect your taste and then explain in the first paragraph who you think the book would appeal to even though it did not quite ring any bells for you.
Interesting discussion! I think of stars as a personal reaction to a book, and assume that's how other people are rating, but am aware that I rate highly compared to some. And I often don't rate a book at all if I didn't like it or didn't finish it, which I realise now is misleading, as there are lots of books in my library I've never got round to rating. If I notice something I haven't rated but loved, then I'll do it, but not having rated something I've marked as read doesn't necessarily mean I didn't like it... ho hum, isn't life difficult!I am very glad, though, that you don't include your examples X, Y and Z in your books, Robin! How right you are about them. Particularly, I think many authors underestimate how difficult it is to write characters making jokes - it may have seemed terrifically funny to the author when they thought of it, but it rarely works for the reader. There are exceptions, but they are rare. And buffoonery is mostly just embarrassing to read.
That's absolutely fair. When I read a book for pleasure, I don't think of it in terms of what other readers might like. Of course I'm going to be subjective about it.I don't mind the graphic stuff in general but S&M in literature has become such a tiresome cliche these days that it's far more likely to turn me off. Ditto overly-gooey romances.
Some cliches are expected for specific genres. That's also fine.
I believe that everyone should review books according to their personal tastes, not as if they're vetting the suitability of a book for someone else.
I listen in audio and it gets really difficult because a 3* book can get a 4* rating if the narration is amazing and a 5* story can be a 4* if the narration is just good.
Great discussion! I agree, Robin... Rate per your preference, after all, other readers are looking for opinions in reviews, not a critique of spelling and grammar (except for some HORRENDOUSLY epic examples!).
That's one of the reasons I always review, not just leave star ratings. So, if I love descriptions of sunsets, and you (and a bunch of other people) have given a book two stars, and the reviews all say "the descriptions of sunsets went on, and on", I'll read the book, but if loads of people have given a book 4 stars, because "the violence is the best, there are just chapters and chapters torture" I'll leave that on the shelf.
I really wish that people were a bit more severe with their rating. It feels like 99% of books are between 3.5 and 5 stars, and most people I know would give 3 stars to a book they thought of as a bad. For any newcomer, 3.5 sounds like actually pretty good, which may not be the case. Since people rate that way, it feels to me like there's such a difference between a 3.5, a 3.75 and a 4, and it really should not be that way.
Well, I guess I’m different from all the people reviewing nowadays then- no surprise!I love to read reviews, they help
Me decide whether to try an unknown author In this age of eBooks, where it’s impossible to physically handle the book and divine it’s popularity from the wear of its pages and covers- or lack thereof!
I rarely give a 3, 2 or 1 though I have on occasion.
During times when I begin a horrible book, I tend to never finish it, so therefore have no need to give stars or reviews.
Sometimes, it’s years before that kind of read is over and if I am lucky, enough time had passed that I can enjoy it and review accordingly.
And so, I probably am a reader who wouldn’t read a book you gave 2 stars to so I don’t waste my time between worlds, and I also admit to refining my search to 4 stars and above for the same reason.
To each their own and I’ll do me and all that, thank you :3
That is what I do. The stars are given based on what I like, and while that might change with time and even with my mood, I can't really base it on anything else. That means that I some times give two stars to beautifully crafted classics and five stars to stories that would never win a single price, but that do teach me something about myself and/or the world.
I am sure you've made the right choice Robin.
This is a great discussion - your opinion is your opinion. Any rating on any book always has this bias. No one should make decisions about what they want to read based on a single review. There are some very popular books that I think are terrible, and some unpopular books I really enjoyed. It's great that we all have so many choices so no one has to be stuck with a book they are not enjoying.
I want to know what you think of a book, not what others are likely to think of it. Please just be true to your opinion. I'd hate to think that someone as smart as weren't reviewing from your perspective.
I find myself in a pretty similar boat. To me a "3 star" is "I finished it and if the author wrote more i would probably read them too!"A 2-star is "I finished it, but god what a slog" and a 1-star is "oh dear god, what was the author thinking!"
4 stars are usually "oh this was amazing i found excused to keep reading!" while 5 stars are usually "oh god emotions, how dare you make me feel them!"
I definitely accept it as the reviewer's personal taste. And for myself there are often books that I recognize as masterpieces that I simply didn't enjoy, so they get one or two star ratings. I make no pretense to objectivity!
For what it's worth I think you should keep doing what you've been doing.
There's no way to reliably predict how other people will respond to a book. I think the reasonable way to score books is to give a personal reaction. Let's say I hear a new band. They're out of tune, the music is unoriginal, and the singer has a range of three notes. I could say I don't like them at all (1 star), or I could say (well, a lot of people like [your least favorite popular band] and give them three stars. If I do the latter, the score has no real meaning - it's just my prediction of what some undefined 'mass' will feel. If I give it a 1, that's a solid opinion, even if it's just one person's opinion.
Give the stars for yourself, it's your opinion!
Sharondblk wrote: "That's one of the reasons I always review, not just leave star ratings. So, if I love descriptions of sunsets, and you (and a bunch of other people) have given a book two stars, and the reviews all..."Interesting. I just rate and don't review because I am hesitant to put a lot of personal opinion into something that is so subjective, but I do see your point that explaining what you liked or did not like about a book can help someone else in their selection. I may have to re-think this.
BTW, one star for me is " so bad, that I could not bring myself to finish it" 5 stars is " I cannot wait to read another book by this author" In-between is rated accordingly.
I agree with your rating system. A three star book is one that I liked well enough to finish. A two star book is one that I read from cover to cover because there was nothing else (stuck on a plane after buying the wrong book at the airport, for example) or that I abandoned half way through because a promising start fizzled out. One star means I hated it from the get-go and would have thrown it at the wall if I wasn't concerned about breaking something. A ritual burning might also be appropriate.
I reserve 4-5 star books for ones that I can't stop thinking about/reading whenever I can/ones where I think I would love to sit and have tea with the characters, or those books that make me feel like I *know* the characters.One star books I don't finish.
Three are ok, and they were decent reads but I won't be sobbing in a puddle over the final chapter of the story.
I am VERY egocentric in my rating system because honestly, I have no idea what anyone else would think of the book.
Thank you, by the way, for always writing 4-5 star (in my mind) reads. Your characters are some of my most beloved (see what I did there?) ever.
Totally agree, I think rating a book is very personal, and it should reflect your opinion of that book, how it satisfies your needs and expectations.
I have to say my method is 1 star - Book i don't finish - this is a bad book that i don't rate
2 star - A book i did finish but left me disappointed. so I felt had potential but this was not delivered.
3 A good book, i both finished and enjoyed
4. A very good book, exceeded expectations and the kind of book i would strongly recommend to others
5 Is a top 10 books of mine. 5 is for the exceptions
But i agree is unfair to give a star rating with out a few lines of review. even for a 1 start to provide the author feed back. (constructive) good or bad they will have spend many days / weeks / months writing it far more time than we spend reading them.
PS so far all the Robin Hobbs books are in the 3, 4 and 5 rating with an average of 4.5 :)
I have a very similar method as well. 1 star means that I did not like the book, the book made me cringe. I only voted to express how disappointed I was with the story.
2 stars the book is OK, I might read something more from this Author, if I find the theme intriguing, but I probably won't be rereading this particular book.
3 stars I liked the book, I might wish to reread it sometime in the future, I might recommend the book.
4 stars I really liked the book, I would recommend it to others and I will most likely reread it.
5 stars - the book is really good and it also touched upon themes that I enjoy exploring. I will definitely reread it and I will recommend it to anyone who cares to hear me swoon about it's awesomeness.
