Lisa Niver's Blog: We Said Go Travel, page 32

Travel Enthusiast’s Dream: Nina Ruggiero, Trailblazing Founder of ‘Be a Travel Writer’ Class!

Thank you Nina Ruggiero, Travel and Leisure‘s digital editorial director and founder of the “Be A Travel Writer” course, for joining me on my podcast!

Nina told me, “Don’t be afraid to ask to do the things that you truly want to do.“

Learn more about her new “Be a Travel Writer” course- where they teach everything you need to know to get started.

INTERVIEW

Lisa Niver:

Good morning. This is Lisa Niver, from We Said Go Travel and I am beyond excited and honored to be able to interview today, an editor from Travel & Leisure, who I just met in real life in Ireland. Hi, Nina.

Nina:

Hi, Lisa. Thanks so much for having me on. Nice to see you again, since Ireland.

Lisa Niver:

My goodness, that trip was amazing. I love Maren and Travel Classics.

Nina at Ashford Castle for Travel Classics Ireland 2023

Nina:

We met so many great people. Maren’s amazing and Ashford Castle, you really can’t beat that setting for a travel conference.

Lisa Niver:

That place was amazing. But even more amazing than Travel Classics, and Ashford Castle, is YOU! You are an incredible premiere editor at Travel & Leisure. Tell people about what you do now, and how did you become an editor at Travel & Leisure. Congratulations.

Nina:

Thank you so much. I’m the Digital editorial director at Travel & Leisure, which basically, means I oversee the digital team, everything from special packages to day-to-day coverage. We do everything from travel news to features, to SEO and travel guides. It’s a great job. I love it so much. I’ve been at T&L for seven years now.

I started as a senior editor, then deputy and now this. I’ve seen them under three different companies, and it’s been a little bit different each time, but we’re growing and evolving, and the traffic to our website is much higher than it was when I started. We have a really engaged audience.

And in terms of how I got here, it was a long process. I knew I wanted to do it since I was in college. I decided I love traveling so much, it’s my greatest passion. Anytime I’m not in school, I’m traveling. I’m spending all the money I have on traveling, and studying abroad, and all of that. Then I found out, travel writing is a real job.

I wasn’t sure if that was a full-time job. So, to get there, I did so many other types of journalism, first. I did take one travel writing course in college. It was the only one that they offered at the University of Miami. We took a trip to New Orleans and I did my first ever travel reporting from there and I just loved it. But I also needed a job.

When I graduated, I did local news for a while. I was, literally, chasing fire trucks and police cars, and reporting on a town that I was assigned to, sometimes even a house fire in the middle of the night. It was crazy. Then I ended up getting a job covering fashion for a few years, which was fun. I just got a little bored of it after a while. And then, I did all sorts of other things, I covered lifestyle, wellness and politics for a little bit, which I did not enjoy. And then, the main thing that got me to T&L is, while I was doing all of that, I didn’t forget that I wanted to be in travel.

So, wherever I was, even if my job was fashion, I figured I could also contribute to the travel section. When my job was hard news, but no one was contributing to the travel section. I asked, “Can I do it?” So, everyone kept saying, YES! because if you’re getting your actual job done, no one’s ever going to say, “No, don’t do more work.” So, I worked a lot of Sundays and things, but I really built out my travel clips. And by the time the job at T&L came about, I had plenty to show for myself, in terms in the travel world, even though that hadn’t been my job.

That being said, I know we are going to talk about my “Be A Travel Writer” course that I am doing right now, to teach other people, and a part of the reason that I wanted to start that, is because I don’t think everyone’s journey needs to be quite as long as mine. I did all that for about 10 years before starting at T&L, so it’s a lot. It was really rewarding along the way. I took a sabbatical at one point, I moved to Sicily for a few months, and just traveled around Europe, and wrote about it, and was sending stories back to the New York newspaper, I was working at the time. It was very New York centric, the place I worked. I wrote a New Yorker’s guide to Athens calling it “East Village of Athens.” Those stories did really, really well, and gave me momentum when I came back to my normal job to keep doing travel content as well.

Lisa Niver:

I think that is really incredible information for people. A lot of time when people ask me, how do I be a travel writer? How do I go on a trip like you? They want to know, can they go tomorrow? And it sounds like what you’re saying is it took a decade of hustle, and commitment and persistence, that you were acting like an adult, you were paying your bills, while you were working as a journalist. You were improving, and you were also making your side hustle of travel, travel, travel happen. That’s one of the things that people forget is that in journalism, and travel journalism, there’s a lot of hard work and late nights pulling it all together.

Nina:

Journalism has changed so much since I started. There are so many more outlets now. In terms of getting started, having your own site, growing your social media following, using YouTube and all of these things, there’s a bit more of a fast track now.

Stacey Leasca, my partner on Be a Travel Writer, is freelance now. When I first met her, we both worked together full time at a different job, and I watched her transition from full time to freelance travel writer, and something she always says is you need to diversify your income. She does work for Travel & Leisure, for example, but she doesn’t fully depend on Travel & Leisure. And that’s so, so, so important. She does a newsletter for TripAdvisor, and she works on projects for Expedia as well as projects outside of the travel space. Honestly, she’s ended up making way more money than I have having a full-time job.

Lisa Niver:

It’s definitely a hustle. One of the things that’s really important is networking. Like you and Stacey met at a job, you knew each other, you started this project together and created your class. You have to have people who are supporting you and get how challenging it is and understand the life! Can you talk about taking your sabbatical? How did that happen?

Nina:

First of all, to your last point, I love that, because we all talk about that as travel writers amongst ourselves- we can only talk to each other about complaints. But I have to say my mom is funny, because she’s not in this space at all, but she’s so quick to tell people, “Nina is doing this really cool thing at this really nice hotel, but she works so hard. Do you know how hard she works?” We are so lucky to have these experiences. For people who really want to get into it, the main thing you have to understand is it’s a lot of work. And it’s a lot of time away from home. And it’s a lot of juggling of schedules. For me, it’s totally worth it. But I think some people don’t realize how much actually goes into it.

Back to your question about my sabbatical. I was doing travel writing on the side, but I wasn’t really getting those kinds of jobs, and I wanted to be doing it full time. I also always want to be in Europe, especially Italy. At the time, I was living in the East Village in New York, with two roommates in a tiny apartment, and I felt like I could take a break and do something different, and really accelerate the amount of travel clips that I had in my portfolio.

Another thing that I’ve always liked working on, on the side, is my Italian language skills, which are decent, but they get rusty when I’m not there. I do have Italian background, but I didn’t learn at home. I learned in school, and from study abroad, so, it can get rusty. I applied to an Italian school for foreigners in Sicily, in Termini, actually, now so famous because of White Lotus, but I had just gone there once. My aunt took me on a vacation and I fell in love with it. On day one, I made so many friends there, and I wanted to go back. So, I applied to this little school in the middle of Termini. It’s so cute. It’s in this little lemon garden down this cobblestone street. I enrolled in an advanced Italian course there during the week. And when I wasn’t there, I was traveling throughout Europe on weekends and writing about it. It was amazing. And it is incredibly affordable it is to travel throughout Europe once you’re in Europe, which is something I’m so jealous of everyone who’s based, there for that reason.

It was an incredible experience. It really accelerated my, otherwise, very long path in some ways. So, it was taking a leap, right? I was lucky, too, to have a really supportive boss at the time, who said, YES take the sabbatical. Go do it. I had seen in our employee handbook, that this was available if your boss was supportive of it. And I’m so lucky that she was. It was such a worthwhile opportunity for me.

Lisa Niver:

I think that’s a really good point, is that sometimes people, they’re afraid to even ask.

Nina:

Yes. And I’m so guilty of that. I’m the person who’s usually afraid to ask for things. And oh, my gosh, I mean, it was so long ago, now, but I can still remember the anxiety and fear leading up to, am I going to really ask this? That was a real life lesson for me, because looking back, I came out of my comfort zone and just went for it, and everyone was really supportive. Don’t be afraid to ask to do the things that you truly want to do.

Lisa Niver:

I haven’t thought about this in a long time, but when I was teaching in public school in Culver City, I taught eighth grade, and my parents were going with the rabbi for two weeks on a trip to Israel. And I went to my boss in public school and I said, I’m sure the answer’s no, but my parents are going on this trip, and they invited me to go with them to Israel, and I’d love to go. And she said, “Well, then I think you should!” and she went to the school board for me, to get me two weeks unpaid leave, to go do it, in the middle of the school year. She was the best boss I’ve ever had.

Nina: 

People like that are such great people to work with and be around, and I aspire to be that person for other people. It can make such a difference in someone’s life. And you just reminded me that when I did bring that up to my boss at the time, she had told me how there was a birthright trip that she missed out on and didn’t get to do, because she didn’t ask to get off of work. It was a potentially life-changing trip and she said– I missed my window, because I just was too afraid to ask. And she didn’t want me to experience that. And I appreciated that so much.

Lisa Niver:

That’s great. And you said you studied abroad? Was that in college? Did you go to Italy again?

Nina:

Yeah, there’s definitely an Italian theme in my travels. In college, I studied abroad in Rome. I went to this tiny little school called LUMSA, which is just around the block from the Vatican, and it was not your typical kind of American study abroad school. There were two Americans, including me, in the school that semester, and classes were in Italian. My Italian, at that point, was okay, I was not fully prepared for that level. They do all their exams orally. In my American schools, in foreign language, we’d have an oral exam, but we didn’t have an oral medieval history exam. They did. So, I had to do things in Italian, which was a real real challenge to me. And of course, a lot of my friends, at the time, were at American University of Rome, doing walking tours of Rome, and simple tests, and not really studying very much at all.

It was a really interesting way to do it, and I made local friends there. I met people who I’m still friends with today, who were took me under their wing and showed me around, and I got to know the city. I saw so much of Rome from a real local’s point of view. I ended up living in this neighborhood that none of my American friends had even ever been to, and it was such a cool way to immerse myself in Rome and Italian college life. And I think that was in my head, too, when I did the sabbatical, I wanted to experience something like that again.

Lisa:

Nina, you are so very interesting. I love this. If people want to learn more, you mentioned that you have this class with Stacey. Tell us about how to get started and what can we learn? And how do we join?

Nina:

The course that Stacy and I launched this year is called Be a Travel Writer. We teach everything you need to know to get started. We’ve had a really great response. You can buy individual classes, or you can do the full master course.

Some people are starting from square one. They want to get into travel writing, and they don’t have any background in it. With the whole course, there are worksheets, and we give feedback. You can take it to as intensive as you want. Some people are already writers, but not in the travel space, or some took a few years off, and want to see what’s going on now, and how important is social media these days, and what’s happening in the world of SEO, and all that.

Some people are taking it as more of a refresher. And then others are taking it as a 101, depending on what they’re looking for. We have a newsletter we send out every week, which highlights the classes or answer questions we’ve been getting. We also send out calls for pitches and job openings within the travel and lifestyle space. That’s been really popular and that’s free.

We have an online community where people are asking questions and sharing about their challenges like “I’ve been struggling to negotiate better freelance rates lately. What do you guys think? Or I’m traveling here. Has anyone ever been? Any inside tips? Or I had this weird press trip situation? What do you guys think about this?”

And it’s been really fun to see. It’s an industry that Stacy and I are both really, really passionate about, so, to be able to share that and to be able to help other people get into that is, is really special. And we both are so fired up on Mondays when we send out the newsletter. We enjoy it so much, and we have a great community going there, and I hope it keeps growing.

Other topics we cover are writing for digital, specifically, travel feature writing. There’s a kitchen sink class, that covers a bit of everything, including the business side and rates and things like that. And in each class, we didn’t want anyone to have to take just my word or just Stacey’s word for anything, so, we have an expert guest on the topic, who we interview, as well, on every class. So, there’s some great people there, as well.

Lisa Niver:

I noticed Rachel Chang, who was with us at Travel Classics in Ireland, is one of your guest speakers.

Nina:

Yes, Rachel Chang’s so great. She writes a ton for Travel & Leisure, and Conde Nast Traveler, and edits so many special edition magazines. Once again, another good example of hustling in this business. She is the expert on our writing a travel feature story course. And she’s so great and honest.

That’s the other thing. It’s not like taking a college course and it’s not super formal. It’s industry insiders, chatting back and forth, and asking the real questions, and talking about the real things that you wouldn’t necessarily learn in school. We also have Jeff Jenkins, who is known on social media as the Chubby Diaries, and he has a brand-new show that’s about to come out for Nat Geo, called Never Say Never, and he’s doing all of these amazing travel challenges, which actually will be interesting to you as another travel challenger.

Lisa Niver:

I actually have an episode with him on my podcast that I’m putting up next month in June, because his show comes out in July. I met him at IMM in New York.

Nina:

We have had many good people, and they know what they’re doing. We talk about things like, when to follow up on a pitch that you haven’t heard back from, and what works. So, I think it’s well rounded to hear from a bunch of different people within the industry.

Lisa Niver:

I think it’s amazing. I will put a link to your class and the article you sent me about your course in Forbes in the show notes for the podcast.

Nina:

Thank you. Yes. Laura Begley Bloom wrote that for her transformative, travel column in Forbes. She’s did a really good job of capturing Stacey’s story and how she got there, and my story and how I got there, and then how we came together and why, and everything that the class offers.

Lisa Niver:

Also in your class, Stacy offers some one-on-one coaching.

Nina:

Yes. Anyone who buys the full course gets one on one coaching with Stacy. I feel like she’s my personal coach and she also feels like I’m her’s. We go back and forth a lot. Stacey is so dynamic. She writes and she also does newsletters, a podcast, and social media. She does sponsored content, and so many different things within this industry that I think she has a lot to teach people. She also deeply enjoys giving this kind of feedback, and she’s recently kicked off one-on-ones with people in our course.

Lisa Niver:

Congratulations again on the new class.

Nina:

Thank you. People are finishing up and taking their one-on-one sessions with her, and they’ve been going great. People are really enjoying them. Stacy’s really enjoying them. And I think they’re learning a lot.

Lisa Niver:

That’s amazing. So, you have a full-time job, your dream job, and your passion of travel. You’ve lived in Italy a few times. What’s on your personal list? If you could do anything or go anywhere, what’s your goal?

Nina:

That’s such a good question. My next travel goals are to do things that are totally different from things I’ve done before. Because yes, I love a European summer trip, but I want to make sure I’m always branching out and having new experiences. I have never been on a safari and I am absolutely dying to go on a safari. Everyone seems to really love Botswana. So, maybe I’ll go to Botswana. But that’s the next big thing on my list.

The next trip that’s actually happening for me is, I’m going to Kauai for the first time next week.. I’ve been to Maui and Honolulu, but I’m excited about Kauai, because I’m a big coastal adventurer water sport-type of person. I’m working on my surfing, and will take some surf lessons. I’m judging a poke contest, which is something fun to add to my resume. I’ve definitely never judged a poke contest before.

Lisa Niver:

Oddly, after Ireland I was in Destin, Florida, judging for a lionfish contest. They prepare lionfish in different ways in the different restaurants. I had never been a judge before either. I’m sure you will enjoy it. It was very fun.

Nina:

That’s so interesting. Had you eaten lionfish before that?

Lisa Niver:

I have eaten lionfish. Lionfish are invasive, and decimating the Caribbean, and so one of the things that we’re working on is helping people understand that they are very good eating. And if we can create consumer demand, they’ll commercial fish more, if that’s possible, or at least figure something out. It’s actually very tasty.

Nina:

I learned about the lionfish when I was visiting St. Croix. There was a diver I met who, was protecting the island from that invasive species. But, I haven’t actually, tried it, and I’m curious.

Lisa Niver:

Well, the next time you’re in the Caribbean, or when you’re in Florida, there are restaurants that serve it as well as a project with one of the culinary schools where they’ve been training chefs to know about it, and prepare it, and put it on the menu.

Nina:

That’s great.

Lisa Niver:

I did a podcast with a guy, Alex Fogg, he’s called The Fish Guy. He did all his research about lionfish. He’s based in in Destin, Fort Walton, Florida.

Nina:

I’ll have to I’ll listen to that one.

Lisa Niver:

Thank you. It has been so much fun to talk to you. You are incredibly knowledgeable. I bet that everyone who takes your class will really learn so much from your passion and your enthusiasm, and your deep knowledge of traveling.

Nina:

Thank you so much. I really appreciate you taking the time to talk to me about it.

Lisa Niver:

Oh my gosh. I’m so excited for you. I hope you get to take another Italian sabbatical soon and again, congratulations on the new course for you and Stacey. I will have all the links in the show notes so that people can sign up for your class. Thank you for joining me!

FORBES ARTICLE: The Secret Way To Get Paid To Travel The World, According To Two Industry Pros

“Travel can be an exclusive niche, but we hope to open it up to more people with varying points of view. We believe there’s space for everyone who really wants it and is willing to learn,” says Ruggiero.

BE A TRAVEL WRITER: Individual Class Offerings, Guest Lectures, Master Class

Want to get paid to travel the world and write about it? @SLeasca and I teamed up with other media industry experts to bring you Be A Travel Writer: An 8-class course full of insider tips and simple ways to get started. https://t.co/SaPEOyW5uV (DM me for a discount code!) pic.twitter.com/4qIPW2q5WX

— Nina Ruggiero (@NinaMarieNYC) March 7, 2023

Nina Ruggerio and Lisa Niver filming MAKE YOUR OWN MAP

Lisa’s book, Brave-ish, is coming SEPT 19, 2023

The post Travel Enthusiast’s Dream: Nina Ruggiero, Trailblazing Founder of ‘Be a Travel Writer’ Class! appeared first on We Said Go Travel.

Grateful and Honored: Finalist for Two 2023 Southern California Journalism Awards

Thank you Los Angeles Press Club and 65th 2023 Southern California Journalism Awards! I am honored to be a finalist for TWO CATEGORIES 2023 Finalist: 65th annual Southern California Journalism AwardsB6. TRAVEL REPORTING

* Lisa Niver, Jewish Journal, “Joshua Tree National Park: My First Visit!” from our Genesis GV70 Road trip.

* Julia Carmel, Los Angeles Times, “34 hours on America’s most scenic train. Is it as dreamy as it sounds?”
* Jaweed Kaleem, Los Angeles Times, “Welcome to Portugal, the new expat haven. Californians, please go home”

* KCET, KCET, “The Migrant Kitchen: Puerto Rico”
* KCET & Tastemade, KCET, “Broken Bread: Tijuana”

K6. PERSONALITY PROFILE/INTERVIEW, Non-Entertainment Personalities, over 10 minutes

* Lisa Niver, Make Your Own Map Podcast, “Deepak Chopra on the Divine Feminine and World Meditation Day”

* Jonathan Bastian, Andrea Brody, KCRW, “Inciting joy: Poet Ross Gay on gardening, grief, and basketball”

* Steve Chiotakis, Christian Bordal, Giuliana Mayo, Phil Richards, KCRW, “I don’t know if I’ll be able to avoid crying”
* Danielle Chiriguayo, KCRW, “How the ‘Christmas spirit’ brought joy and redemption”

* Mo’Kelly, KFI AM640/iHeartRadio, “Chief Robert Luna for Sheriff”

Lisa Niver interviewing Deepak Chopra for Mental Health Awareness Month Thank you to the Los Angeles Press Club and Diana Ljungaeus, Executive Director!

Lisa Niver has won many awards! From 2017 to 2023, in the Southern California Journalism Awards and National Arts and Entertainment Journalism Awards, she has won five times and been a finalist twenty-two times for a variety of broadcast, print and digital categories.

2022 Finalist : Southern California Journalism Awards for BOOK CRITICISM2021 Finalist: National Arts and Entertainment Journalism Awards for Commentary Diversity/Gender and Commentary Analysis/Trend — Film2021 Winner: Southern California Journalism Awards for  TECHNOLOGY REPORTING 2021 Finalist: Southern California Journalism Awards for BOOK CRITICISM2020 Winner: National Arts and Entertainment Journalism Awards for Book Critic. See all of Lisa’s book reviews here.2020 Finalist: National Arts and Entertainment Journalism Awards for Book Critic2020 Winner: Southern California Journalism Awards for print magazine article: Hemispheres Magazine for United Airlines2020 Five Time Finalist: Southern California Journalism awards2019 Winner: NAEJ Award for KTLA TV segment2019 Finalist: National Arts and Entertainment Journalism Awards in three categoriesCategory H2a. Soft News: Ms. Magazine: Polar Bears Can’t Vote So You Have ToCategory F6a. Soft News Feature – Under 5 Minutes—Film/TV: KTLA TV Oscars Countdown to Gold with Lisa NiverCategory C1b. Business, Music/Tech/Art: My Wharton Magazine article: Four Female Founders Share Their Origin Stories2019 Finalist: Southern California Journalism Awards for Broadcast Television Lifestyle Segment: Ogden Ski Getaway2018 Finalist for three categories of Southern California Journalism Awards:SCIENCE/TECHNOLOGY REPORTING: Smithsonian TRAVEL REPORTING: Popsugar FitnessPERSONALITY PROFILE: Saturday Evening Post2017 2nd place winner for Southern California Journalism Award Print Column “A journey to freedom over three Passovers” and finalist for Travel Reporting.

More about Lisa Niver: https://lisaniver.com/awards/

LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA – OCTOBER 16: BJ Korros and guest attend the Los Angeles Press Club’s 63rd Annual Journalism Awards Dinner at Millennium Biltmore Hotel Los Angeles on October 16, 2021 in Los Angeles, California. (Photo by Robin L Marshall/Getty Images)

The post Grateful and Honored: Finalist for Two 2023 Southern California Journalism Awards appeared first on We Said Go Travel.

Wanderlust Whisperer: Wisdom from Travel Maven Pauline Frommer

Thank you Pauline Frommer for joining me on my podcast!

I was honored to speak at the Travel and Adventure Show in New York, Chicago and Los Angeles–just like my travel idol, Pauline Frommer! I loved having her on my podcast and I know you will learn so much from listening to her extensive travel knowledge! Want more? Listen to her podcast, The Frommers Travel Show! And BUY the brand new guidebooks she talked about from their website or at your favorite local bookstore.

Lisa Niver and Pauline Frommer both speakers at the New York Travel and Adventure Show Jan 2023

Watch our interview on Spotify, YouTube or your favorite PODCAST platform. Enjoy the transcript here:

Lisa Niver:

Good morning. I’m so excited to be here with one of the most impressive people in travel publishing. Pauline Frommer. Thank you, so much, for being here.

Pauline Frommer:

Well, it’s such a pleasure. Thank you for inviting me.

Lisa Niver:

It was such an honor for me to speak at the Travel and Adventure show this year, and to see you in so many cities. And I can’t believe that, what started with you and your dad, The Frommer Travel Guides, that you’ve published, is it really true 75 million books?

Pauline Frommer:

Yes. It started well, before I was born. It started in 1957. My dad was drafted into the Korean War, and luckily, the day before he would have been sent to Korea, the powers that be discovered that he spoke Russian and German, because he was the son of immigrants. So, instead of being sent off to Korea, which was a very bloody war, he was sent to Berlin, and started traveling all over Europe. But this is after World War II, so, Europe was in rubble, and most of his fellow GIs just stayed on the base. They were too nervous to travel, because they thought if they couldn’t spend a lot of money, it wouldn’t be worthwhile, and when he came back to the base, they would pepper him with questions. And he thought, well, maybe I’ll write a little book for my fellow GIs. He called it the GIs guide to Europe, and he self-published it. The day it went on sale, it sold out at the PXs across Europe, and so when he got out of the army, he thought, well, maybe civilians would like this, too. And again, he self-published. He self-published a little book called Europe on $5 a day, which became the bestselling guidebook of all time when it came out in 1957. And so that was the start of it all. But I wasn’t born until well, after that.

Lisa Niver:

Wow. I had no idea. That’s such an incredible story.

Pauline Frommer:

He was very lucky, because the jet age was starting, and after World War II, Americans had a lot more money than people in Europe did, for the most part, and so, they were finally able to go out and see the world. If you ever go to the World War II Museum in New Orleans, the weight of that war, and the numbers involved, it was the bloodiest war in the history of humanity. Getting through the other side of that, there was this feeling of great possibilities, and joy and relief, and that’s what spurred travel.

I think it’s spurring travel, right now, getting out of that awful pandemic. Everybody wants to be on the road. So, even though inflation is high, travel numbers are higher still, because we came out of that pandemic, with the understanding that life is short, and that you have to grab life when you can, and there’s no better way to grab it, then through travel.

Pauline Frommer, Lisa Niver and Patricia Schultz at the New York Travel and Adventure Show 2023

Lisa Niver:

I can see why your travel show podcast is on the New York Times top travel show to listen to, because you’re so interesting. I’m fascinated. Please thank your dad for his service, and does he still work with you in the company?

Pauline Frommer:

It’s not easy being 93. I see him, at least once a week, and I tell him everything that’s going on, but on a day-to-day basis, he’s not involved anymore.

My father wrote the first book, and he wrote it in a very personal way. The thing people would always say about his writing was, I felt like I was traveling with a friend, and we try and keep that going with the current books. All of our books are written by local writers.

I write New York City, since I’m based in New York. I have a wonderful woman named Margie Rin, who lives in Paris, and she writes Paris. I have a great author named, Liz Heath, in Rome, and she writes Rome, and so on. And we tell them that our biggest rival isn’t Lonely Planet, and it isn’t Rick Steves. It’s TripAdvisor and Yelp. People often think–I can’t trust travel guides. It’s all an institution. It’s written by committees, and so, we tell our writers, you need to show the reader that you’re a human being. Tell them what doesn’t work, as well as, what does, because unlike a lot of travel journalism, we don’t get paid to put a hotel in the book, or on our website, or a restaurant.

People assume that we’re all influencers now, and that the ethics have gone out of travel journalism, and that isn’t the case with Frommers. Our wonderful England writer, Jason Cochran says, “Don’t waste your time on the changing of the guard at Buckingham Palace. They’re going to play Abba tunes, it’s just gotten really silly. It’s a total mob scene. And you can actually go to another part of London where they do a smaller changing of the guard, and get right up to it, and show up five minutes before it starts, rather than having to waste two hours of your time waiting for the thing to happen.” Our reader is our only client, and we take that seriously.

Pauline Frommer speaking at the Los Angeles Travel & Adventure Show Feb 18 2023, Photo by Lisa Niver

Lisa Niver:

That is really good to know, because I do think people are confused about what’s sponsored content, and what’s paid for, what’s advertorial. That’s a really important commitment. And I know, when you speak at the travel show, I’ve always been mesmerized with your talk. You really share the best travel tips. One of the things that I think is really important for people, and I’ve heard you speak about this many times and has been a challenge on the COVID coaster. Can you speak to people about why it’s important to have travel insurance?

Pauline Frommer:

Well, it’s not important if you just take your flight. It’s not important if you’re driving somewhere and staying in a hotel. But if you’re paying a lot of money for a cruise, or a tour, or if you have to put down a hefty deposit on a vacation rental, you’re crazy not to get travel insurance, because that money could be gone. But there’s no one travel insurance company that’s always the best one. I like the Travel Insurance Marketplaces. They have names like Square Mouth, Insure My Trip, Travel Insurance.com. There are other fine ones. What you do is, you go to them, you put in your name, you put in your age and the details of your trip, and within 30 seconds, they’ve spat back a list of 500 different policies. And inevitably, the one that covers the most, isn’t the most expensive one. Usually, it’s one from somewhere in the middle of the list. I’ve used this and each time I’ve done it, I’ve ended up with an insurance policy from a different provider. When I went on safari in Africa, John Hancock had the best one. When I went to walk the Wu trail in Patagonia in Chile, Allianz did best for us. So, you never know what it’s going to be.

Pauline Frommer speaking at the 10th Women in Travel Fest in NYC March 5, 2023. Photo by Lisa Niver

Lisa Niver:

Thank you. Because I do think it’s really important that people understand that it’s complicated. I’ve heard you speak about travel insurance several times, and just after September 11, the cruise company that I was working for went bankrupt. And people who bought the insurance from the now-defunct company realized that was a mistake when things didn’t go their way.

Can you tell people about some of the new books that are out, and places that you’re recommending for 2023 and 2024?

Pauline Frommer:

Greece was one of the very first countries to come out of the pandemic and start welcoming tourists again. In the last decade, Athens has done so much to make itself more visitor friendly. They’ve built a glamorous new Archaeological Museum rather than the dusty old place that used to exist near the Parthenon. When you go there, it gives you context for what you’re seeing all these ancient master works. They really help you understand it. They have great restaurants now. The islands have always been spectacular, and they still are.

We have a new Athens and the Greek Islands book, written by author Stephen Brewer, who’s an incredible expert and a very erudite guy. He helps our readers understand why things may feel familiar in Greece, because so much of American culture comes from the classical era. He really does an amazing job of drawing the strands of history, so that it feels contemporary, so that you understand why history is still shaping our lives today. We’re really, really proud of the Athens and the Greek Islands book.

I’m working on the Maui book, which will be out in a couple of months. It’s really interesting. The dirty little secret is, you can go to Frommers.com, and see all of our guidebooks online, too. You can’t carry them with you, so, we still know that people buy the books, but you can see the text. As I was editing the Maui guide, I was looking to see what the prices were before. I realized that from pre-pandemic to today, prices for hotels have doubled in Maui, literally doubled. A cheap hotel in Maui right now is $300 a night, which is insane. For moderate hotels, you’re looking  at $6-7-800 dollars a night. If you want really the glamorous ones, that’s over $1,000.

Lisa Niver:

Oh, my goodness, that’s very pricey!

Pauline Frommer:

I spoke to Jeanne Cooper, who’s our author who explained that because of understaffing, a lot of these hotels are only 50% full. They cannot handle a full hotel, and so, they’re charging what they think the market will bear. What we’re finding is you have to make your reservation a couple of months before going to Maui, but the week before you travel, go to one of the private clubs, that gets better rates on hotels. Travel & Leisure magazine has one called the Travel & Leisure club. There’s one called Room Steals. The one I tend to use, which has some problems, but still has very good prices is one done by Trip Scout, and it’s only found on Instagram.

So, you write to Trip Scout, or you go to @hotels and you say where you want to go and they give you a list of what the prices will be. The reason it has problems is they don’t often surface all the information you might need to make a decision. So, for example, I was looking last year, for a place near Acadia National Park. I found really good rates. I didn’t realize until I looked at other sources of information that it was a hotel with a bathroom down the hall, which some people wouldn’t want, but the prices were still 25 to 50% less than they were everywhere else.

Why is that? Every hotel on the planet, right now, has a contract with Expedia, Orbitz, Travelocity, Priceline, etcetera, all of the major booking engines. And those contracts state that they cannot give discounts that are searchable, that are much lower than what they’re giving to Expedia, Orbitz, Travelocity, Priceline, but these hotels still want to move rooms, but they don’t want the whole world to know that they’re willing to let you pay 50% less than what you usually pay. When you go to Trip Scout on Instagram, what comes up can’t be searched by Google. The hotels can move a handful of rooms, and people going to Maui are not paying these insane prices. We’re trying to break this down in the book, so that people can still have it a vacation in Maui, and not pull their hair out for how much they’re paying, and so that will pay for the cost of the book.

Lisa Niver:

Wow. Like I said, I’ve heard you speak many times. You have a vast knowledge from generations of being in this business. I know that you have a new book, and people are so excited about Yellowstone from the TV show. Are you seeing many people buying the book about Yellowstone?

Pauline Frommer:

Yellowstone and the Grand Tetons came out, maybe three weeks ago. We were in the process of updating it, and then these terrible floods hit Yellowstone. This was about maybe a year and a half ago, now, and so we had Elisabeth Kwak-Hefferan, who’s our author there, stop her work, and we waited for a good five months, until we had more clarity on what was going to change, because these were really devastating floods. Entire roads were wiped out, and a lot has had to be rebuilt there. As soon as it was clear that that things were going to be as they were going to be for the next year or so, she went back to work. Right now, Lonely Planet is the best seller for the area, but it’s a book that came out pre-flooding. So, I have a feeling a lot of things that are in it probably aren’t as up to date as they need to be. And that’s the hard thing with travel books.

When you go to TripAdvisor and look at a hotel review, you’re taking the advice of someone who’s been to exactly one hotel. They may not know that, right down the road, there’s a place that’s just as nice, but cheaper. Our authors visit every place. So, they have context. They can talk about places in relationship to your other choices, whether it’s hotels, restaurants, attractions, what have you.

Lisa Niver:

One of the things you spoke about at the Travel and Adventure show in New York City, and because the Olympics will be in Paris, many people are going to be thinking about traveling to France. Can you tell us about your bike tour? I remember you spoke about how it was hard to find the information online and ended up being so economical.

Pauline Frommer:

We, actually, have a new France book that’s being researched, right now. It’ll be out in time for the Olympics.

But I went to a city called Dijon, which is in the region of Burgundy, which is of course a major wine growing region, and I looked online to see what I should do. And in Dijon, I, obviously, also looked at the Frommer guide, but when I looked online, Google told me that there was absolutely nothing to do in the city of Dijon, that the only thing to do when you go to Dijon was to get out into the countryside and take a wine tour. And I thought, that’s weird.

Our book has all of these museums in it, and they look great. One is considered the fourth most important museum in all of France. Why aren’t these being brought up by Google? I realized it was because they were all free. And so, all of the sites that cover travel, and then now make a lot of money by selling entrance fees and tours, and the like, weren’t covering these museums because there was no money to be made. Google hoovers all of the information up online, so their search was also kind of screwy.

Dijon was the seat of government for the Dukes of Burgundy. So, it has spectacular architecture, gorgeous museums, ancient mansions, extraordinary restaurants, where everything is made with wine in some way, whether it’s beef bourguignon, or these eggs meurette, which are these eggs that are poached in red wine and come with a red wine sauce, and are really delicious. They’re served at dinner, as appetizers, but you’d never know this, if you just searched online.

Lisa Niver:

You are such an incredible, gracious resource, and I am so honored that you were able to spend time with me here on the podcast. Obviously, people are going to want to know more, so, tell everybody, how can they find your podcast? Where’s the best place to buy the guidebooks? Tell them how do we find more of all of this?

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Pauline Frommer:

Well, for the podcast, you go to frommers.com, which is frommers.com/podcast. We cover a lot of the breaking news at frommers.com. Recently, remember when coming out of the pandemic, all of these destinations were saying they would give people free travel. Hong Kong actually followed through on it, and we were able to post, last week, that Americans could get, 5000 free airfares to Hong Kong. When you come to frommers.com, we’ll have great breaking news that you can use like that. Look for our guides at your local bookstore. You can, obviously, find us on Amazon, but I always push people to go to the great independent bookstores because I want to support them.

Lisa Niver:

And if they want to meet you in person, you’ll be next year at the best show, the Travel and Adventure Show. I look forward to seeing you there, and I can’t wait to learn more from you. And again, I just really appreciate you making the time to come speak with me on my podcast.

Pauline Frommer:

This was a lot of fun. Thank you.

The post Wanderlust Whisperer: Wisdom from Travel Maven Pauline Frommer appeared first on We Said Go Travel.

Celebrating Best Friend Day: Embracing the Magic of Friendship!

Thank you to Nicole Pajer, Meaghan Murphy and Woman’s Day Magazine for including Carl and I in their celebrations of Best Friend Day: June 8 which embraces the Magic of Friendship! We were on page 2 of the June/July 2023 issue!

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These BFFs became family

Lisa Niver los angeles
Carl Law san jose, ca

In 1985, Lisa was in her first year at University of Pennsylvania and Carl was a junior as well as her advisor. The two hit it off instantly, but it was a hilarious exchange one night  that solidified  their friendship. “Carl knew I had a date, who was picking me up at our dorm, so he put on a bathrobe and waited in my room. When my date showed up, he asked, What are your intentions with my daughter?” says Lisa. “Ever since then, we’ve told people that we’re family.” 

Over the years, the duo has supported each other through divorces, career shifts, dating, parenting adventures and more. “When my marriage crumbled, he was the person I called in tears from Thailand,” says Lisa. Lisa kicks off the first chapter of her upcoming memoir Brave-ish: One Breakup, Six Continents, and Feeling Fearless After Fifty with with Carl’s advice from that day. 

“When people look at us, they don’t think that we’re family because Carl is Black and I am Jewish, but we know that we are chosen family,” says Lisa. Carl describes Lisa as the sister he wishes he had. “She’s a person that brings sunlight into my life,” he says. “When I look back on my life so far, our friendship is one of the highlights.”

[image error] [image error] [image error] Do you want to unlock the power of friendship? Dive into Christie Tates’ book for a better BFF experience!Learn more from Christie by watching our podcast:

Best Friend Day is something I learned about recently but I have always celebrated my friendships. These remarkable individuals have been by my side through thick and thin, creating a tapestry of unforgettable moments and everlasting memories. Make time to shower them with appreciation and gratitude, reminding them of just how much they mean to you.

Friendship is like a beacon of light, guiding us through life’s ups and downs. It’s an everlasting bond that transcends time and distance, forever etched in our hearts. They are the ones who have seen me at my best and my worst, always offering unwavering support and love.

How can you honor this extraordinary person and cherish the beautiful memories of your friendship? Take a thrilling adventure, explore new destinations or go out for dinner, sharing laughter, stories, and a feast fit for royalty. Best Friend Day is about expressing gratitude and celebrating their ability to make even the darkest days feel lighter, and their knack for understanding us on a level that no one else can.

Happy Best Friend Day to all the incredible souls out there who make our lives brighter, our hearts fuller, and our adventures more exciting! Cheers to friendship!

The post Celebrating Best Friend Day: Embracing the Magic of Friendship! appeared first on We Said Go Travel.

World Environment Day 2023 at Dorado Beach, A Ritz-Carlton Reserve

Ocean Guardians Unite! Celebrating World Environment Day with Richard Murphy of Ocean Futures Society and co-creator of Ambassadors of the Environment at Dorado Beach, A Ritz-Carlton Reserve

World Environment Day at Dorado Beach, A Ritz-Carlton Reserve, today was an extraordinary event that left a lasting impact on all who attended. The celebration was a perfect blend of inspiration, education, and action, bringing together passionate individuals from various backgrounds to commemorate this important day.

The highlight of the event was undoubtedly the presence of Richard Murphy, a true legend in the field of marine conservation, who has dedicated an impressive 50 years to the Ocean Futures Society working with Jean-Michel Cousteau. I had the privilege of interviewing him, capturing his insights and experiences in this captivating video podcast. 

Throughout the day, the resort buzzed with excitement as guests engaged in various activities and workshops. From guided tours showcasing the resort’s eco-friendly initiatives to interactive displays and educational sessions, attendees were immersed in an environment of learning and discovery. 

The celebration culminated with a meaningful tree planting ceremony. We came together, shovels in hand, to plant trees in the nearby forest. The act of planting trees served as a reminder that our actions today shape the world of tomorrow, leaving a lasting legacy for future generations.

World Environment Day at Dorado Beach, A Ritz-Carlton Reserve, was celebrated at the Ambassadors of the Environment Program, which inspires guests to embrace sustainability and take their newfound knowledge and passion back to their communities. World Environment Day was started by the United Nations in 1972. Join in the Ambassadors of the Environment Program on your next holiday with The Ritz-Carlton Family!

Thank you Discover Puerto Rico!

Learn more about Ambassadors of the Environment.

Read Dr. Richard Murphy’s book, Coral Reefs: Cities Under The Sea

Lisa Niver with Jean Michel Cousteau at the 2018 DEMA Dive Conference

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Mafalda Costa Tavares, Dr. Richard Murphy and Lisa Niver at the World Environment Day 2023 at Dorado Beach, A Ritz-Carlton Reserve

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Marvelous May: Memorable Journeys and Momentous Moments

Marvelous May News 2023 with Lisa Niver & We Said Go Travel:Thank you to Travel Classics Ireland and Tourism Ireland!

A giant thank you to Maren Rudolph for creating and running this amazing conference and to Ruth Moran and Fallon Griffin and the entire Ireland team for an amazing event and tour. Go raibh maith agat Paula Carroll, Niall Rochford, Regina O’Donoghue and the entire team at Ashford Castle, I absolutely loved being back again! Want to see more about my adventures? Enjoy my 73 VIDEOS– Below is one of my favorites with Ireland School of Falconry and Inca & Tommy! My first visit to Ireland was also a memorable journey–I have big news about where you can read more about it coming soon!!!

After the conference, I went with my travel writing friends to Northern Ireland. One of the highlights was THE LOST VALLEY

I just found out that We Said Go Travel was listed #8 in 2022 for BEST ONLINE TRAVEL MAGAZINES and WEBSITES!! Thank you to Nomad Revelations and João Leitão.

IN CASE YOU MISSED THIS NEWS: Some highlights:: I am honored to be #11 on the Best Travel and Lifestyle Blogs List! Thank you Afluencer for naming me the #3 Top Travel Influencer for 2023! Thank you Feedspot for naming me #21 on your 30 Best Jewish Book Blogs and Websites. My website is now available on Google News! I was honored to be a speaker EIGHT times at the Travel & Adventure Shows in 2023! I spoke in FOUR cities: Los Angeles, Chicago, NYC and Dallas!

Thank you to The Travel Mom, Emily Kaufman, for inviting me to #CAMPTRAVELMOM in San Diego! I loved it! Thank you to Scott Jones from DiveNewsWire for sharing my podcast about PADI for EARTH DAY! I am honored to be part of this incredible publication that focuses on my passion of scuba diving! Thank you Debra Eckerling for celebrating my mother and her recipe for Mother’s day in your print Jewish Journal article on FOOD and FAMILY! THANK YOU for watching my podcast! It has now been seen and heard in 31 countries on 6 continents!

USA Canada Ireland UK Italy India Singapore Australia New Zealand Switzerland Hong Kong France Latvia Philippines Netherlands Japan Fiji Portugal Kenya Mexico Guatemala Germany Uruguay Bangladesh Spain Panama Thailand Uganda UAE Greece South Africa

New PODCAST episodes: Walking with Andrew McCarthy and Saving our Planet One Lionfish at a time with Alex Fogg WATCH my podcast, “MAKE YOUR OWN MAP: Are YOU ready to be BRAVE?” on Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon Music, YouTube Podcast,  Google Podcasts, Audible, Anchor, Pandora & iHeart Radio WHERE CAN YOU FIND MY TRAVEL VIDEOS?

Here is the link to my video channel on YouTube where I have NEARLY TWO MILLION views on YouTube! (now at: 1,870,000 views)

Thank you for your support! Are you one of my 3,940 subscribers? I hope you will join me and subscribe! For more We Said Go Travel articles, TV segments, videos and social media: CLICK HERE

Find me on social media with over 150,000 followers. Please follow  on TikTok: @LisaNiver, Twitter at @LisaNiver, Instagram @LisaNiver and on Facebook, Pinterest, YouTube, and at LisaNiver.com.

My Podcast: “Make Your Own Map!”

Fortune Cookie SAID:

“Embrace the Unseen, Wanderer, for Travel Unfolds the Extraordinary.”

“Enthusiasm is infectious, stimulating and attractive to others. People will love you for it.”

I loved hula-hooping all over Ireland and at Camp Travel Mom in San Diego! So many memorable journeys! THANK YOU for all of your SUPPORT!

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The Travel Mom’s Marvelous San Diego #CampTravelMom 2023 was MAGNIFICENT!

Thank you to The Travel Mom, Emily Kaufman, for including me in her marvelous #CampTravelMom weekend at the San Diego Mission Bay Resort! My favorite thing growing up was going to Jewish summer camp and it was such a blast to return to that feeling with a friend from Stephen Wise Temple!

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Dinner with Visit San Diego, Madam Tussauds and LegoLand California

I absolutely loved my time at Camp Travel Mom, where the excitement was off the charts! The weekend was an extraordinary blend of travel writers, karaoke, and disco, creating an atmosphere of pure joy and exhilaration.

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One unforgettable night, we took the stage by storm, showcasing our karaoke skills and unleashing our inner rockstars.

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Breakfast by the Pool with RVShare and TravelGuardSeaside Brunch Bliss with Atlantis Bahamas, Expedia, VRBO, Hotels.com and Travel Costa Mesa Afternoon Adventures with Massage Envy, pool side drinks with The Palm Beaches Florida, Grand Hyatt Kauai and Plant Juice Oils

And let me tell you, the disco night was an absolute blast! We danced the night away, donning our most outrageous costumes for an epic contest. To add to the fun, I brought my trusty hula hoop, spinning and twirling to the beat of the music.

With the support of incredible brand sponsors, we also enjoyed thrilling jet ski rides, valuable networking opportunities, and luxurious massages. Camp Travel Mom truly knows how to create an experience that ignites passion, sparks connections, and leaves you with lifelong memories.

Read more about our weekend on Hello Magazine!

Follow Emily Kaufman, The Travel Mom, on FACEBOOK and INSTAGRAM

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Saving Our Planet One Lionfish At A Time

How can you help our planet? EAT A LIONFISH!

I interviewed Alex Fogg, THE FISH GUY, who I first met at the DEMA Dive Conference when he was a speaker about LIONFISH, an invasive species in the Atlantic Ocean and Caribbean Sea.

Alex is a marine biologist who is part of the team at Destin-Fort Walton Beach. In fact, he is one of four marine biologists on the tourism team unlike any other tourism team I am aware of. Many people talk about over-tourism and over-fishing but what do they do about it? On the Emerald Coast, they have hired top professionals like Alex to focus on protecting their reefs for fishing and scuba diving both of which I did on my first trip here May 15-18, 2023 ahead of the Emerald Coast Open.

They call Destin–the “Luckiest Fishing Village” due to its prime location, rich marine environment, and warm waters of the Gulf which support a wide variety of fish species, including red snapper, grouper, amberjack, mahi-mahi, and tuna. Several of which I caught on my very first ever fishing trip with the amazing Captain Gaby of Lady Luck Adventures! I highly recommend going out with her to experience the thrill of the catch and see the gorgeous emerald green and turquoise crystal clear waters. We saw dolphins, the pristine white sand beaches and the thriving fishing industry makes it a favored destination for anglers.

However, I would call it the smartest fishing village since they hired Alex and have focused on sustaining and supporting the waters with their many projects including local advice by mom chat, artificial reef deployments several of which I saw installed today, Lionfish restaurant week and the incredible Emerald Coast Open happening this weekend.

How can you help our planet? CATCH A LIONFISH!

The Destin Fort Walton Lionfish Emerald Coast Open (ECO) is the largest lionfish tournament in the world! In 2019, ECO had 189 participants and removed 19,167 lionfish throughout the tournament – 14,119 in 3 days! ECO gave away $48,000 in cash prizes, and over $10,000 in gear prizes. We are looking forward to an exciting 2023 tournament!

Join marine enthusiasts and conservationists this weekend May 19-21. SIGN UP HERE. This tournament is held annually on the pristine shores of the Emerald Coast in Florida and tackles the invasive lionfish species while promoting environmental awareness and sustainable fishing practices.

Lionfish, native to the Indo-Pacific region, have become a major threat to the delicate balance of marine ecosystems in the Atlantic Ocean and the Gulf of Mexico. They cause ecological imbalances, habitat destruction, harm to native fish, and negative economic impacts. To combat this invasive species, the Lionfish Emerald Coast Open encourages participants to hunt and catch as many lionfish as possible during the tournament.

The event attracts skilled divers, recreational fishermen, and conservationists from all around the region. Participants compete for prizes based on the number and size of lionfish they catch. In addition to the thrill of the hunt, the tournament also offers educational workshops and seminars on lionfish biology, ecological impact, and proper handling techniques. These sessions help increase public understanding of the lionfish invasion and provide strategies for mitigating its effects.

The Destin Fort Walton Lionfish Emerald Coast Open serves as a platform for promoting sustainable fishing practices. Participants are encouraged to utilize spears and nets to catch lionfish, minimizing harm to other marine species and the surrounding environment. The tournament also facilitates the donation of captured lionfish to local restaurants, where they are prepared and served as a delicacy, raising awareness about lionfish as a viable food source and potentially reducing their numbers through consumer demand. I ate at La Paz last night and we loved our lionfish fajitas!

By combining sport, education, and conservation, the Lionfish Emerald Coast Open serves as a beacon of hope in the fight against invasive species. It fosters a sense of community, encouraging individuals to actively contribute to the protection of marine ecosystems and the preservation of the Emerald Coast’s natural beauty.

Alex sharing his love of the sea with kids at the NY Travel and Adventure Show Jan 29, 2023

Lisa and Alex at the NY Travel and Adventure Show 2023 where Lisa was a speaker!

Lisa and Alex met at the DEMA Dive Show in Nov 2018 and finally went diving together today May 17, 2023 in Destin, Florida! SEA you soon under water scuba diving or on the water soon!

Want to DIVE in DESTIN? I loved the team at ScubaTech and my gear rentals were fantastic!

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Walking with Andrew McCarthy

Happy Launch Day to Andrew McCarthy and WALKING WITH SAM Get your copy of WALKING WITH SAM at Amazon, Barnes and Noble or Bookshop

An intimate, funny, and poignant travel memoir following New York Times bestselling author and actor Andrew McCarthy as he walks the Camino de Santiago with his son Sam.

Enjoy our interview:

Lisa Niver:

Hello. I’m so excited and honored to be here today with author and actor and incredible travel writer, Andrew McCarthy. Hi, Andrew.

Andrew McCarthy:

Thanks very much.

Lisa Niver:

I so enjoyed being at the travel show with you and listening to you talk about your new book. Congratulations.

Andrew McCarthy:

Thanks very much. Thank you.

Lisa Niver:

Tell us a little bit about your brand-new book because if I’m right, this is book number four?

Andrew McCarthy:

It is book number four. It’s called Walking With Sam: A Father, A Son, and Five Hundred Miles Across Spain. It’s a walk I took across the old Camino de Santiago in northern Spain, and it was a walk I’d done first 25 years earlier and a real life-changing experience for me when I did that. I had a moment, a white light experience in the middle of a field of wheat, a sobbing break down where I realized how much fear had dominated my life. I never knew fear was even a factor in my life until that moment of its first absence, and there was suddenly space and I felt like myself.

My wife is Irish, she has all these good Irish sayings, and one of them is, I felt like myself from the toes up, and in that field of wheat I felt like myself from the toes up in a very real way and a way I hadn’t before, and that changed my life. It started me traveling the world, it’s what led to me becoming a travel writer.

That first journey was a real life changer for me and the Camino was something I’d always wanted to do again. And my son was 19 and beginning his own life out in the world, and I didn’t want our relationship to end. When I was 17 I left home and my relationship in essence ended with my dad and that was one of the larger regrets of my life, and I didn’t want that to happen.

So, it was a journey by trying to rewrite how our relationship is cast as opposed to parent/child into sort of adults, seeing each other for who we really are as opposed to seeing the dynamic that exists between parent and child. It was a profound experience. I knew the first time it was so profound, I thought something might happen the second time as well, and we weren’t let down. The Camino has a way of doing that. The Camino, if you just keep walking has a way of sort of teaching you what needs to be taught.

Lisa Niver:

The Camino is a pilgrimage route. How did it get started? And why do people do these walking journeys?

Andrew McCarthy:

Why do people walk is a whole other conversation and a good one, but the Camino started in the eighth century. The Catholic Church said that the bones of the Apostle St James had been discovered in the farther western-most reach of the Iberian Peninsula and anybody who marched there would get half their time in purgatory knocked off. But really what it might have been more about was real estate because Islam had taken over Spain and the Catholic Church wanted it back and so, they said, while you’re walking across Spain to get your almighty soul purged and cleaned, kick out those damn Moors.

It was about the Christian reconquest of Spain and that’s what the beginning of the crusades and the Knights of Templar and all that good, bloody, gory history. And it’s still a religious pilgrimage, although most people now don’t walk it for that particular reason, and even the Catholic Church has walked back entirely that the bones of St James are there or that James was ever even in Spain, they’ve kind of fessed up to that.

So, it’s a pilgrimage route that people have walked since then, and millions and millions of people have walked it over the centuries. It fell out of favor after the reconquest. During the renaissance and all that, very few people made the walk. But early in the 20th century or mid-20th century it started to gain popularity again because…there were just a couple priests, actually, along the way that tried to reintroduce the route and they succeeded.

It’s an amazing journey, and walking really has a profound effect on people. Particularly in our culture now where we walk so little and don’t spend the time. Because when you’re walking the Camino, all you’re doing is walking. You’re spending seven, eight hours a day walking and you’re finding food and finding shelter, which is not difficult to do on the Camino. It’s not like you’re on the Appalachian Trail where you put your whole world in your pack and you have to really learn how to survive. The Camino, you’re just walking, and there’s something to that.

And there’s something about flowing into the current of millions of people who over centuries have done the same.

Lisa Niver:

I agree. I haven’t walked that yet although I’d like to, but I did a couple of eight-day treks in Nepal and there is something about being so focused on walking from one place to the next.

Andrew McCarthy:

You don’t even have to focus, you just have to just keep going. You have some big agendas for things that are going to happen and you’re going to have these big experiences, and the walk’s just going to do what it’s going to do to you. A lot of people walk just the last week or so of the Camino and I always say, that’s fine, that’s great, that’s all you can get off from work or if that’s all you want to do, that’s fine, but the gold is in the attrition that happens over a long period of time, over four or five weeks of walking and my experience is that the magic is in the exhaustion.

Lisa Niver:

You referenced that the walking is its own conversation. So, you recently had an amazing piece in The New York Times about the walking as the worst-kept secret.

Andrew McCarthy:

The Camino, the first time I did it, it really made me realize that I always looked at walking as sort of the slowest way to get anywhere, and over time I’ve come to realize that walking may actually be the event itself. There’s much documentation of many more intelligent people than me about how profound walking is. All that sort of hamster wheel stuff that goes on in our brains all the time just gets burned off and we drop home to ourselves, and it’s well documented that they fuel creativity. You could be home at your computer all morning pounding away and you go out for a walk and suddenly oh, that’s the answer, you know?

And that doesn’t happen by accident, and that happy accident happens over and over and over when you walk. We were born to walk, we were born to move at a walking pace. The sense of rhythm that happens in step after step I think is appropriate to the mind and the mind wants that and craves that, and the emotions want that and crave that.

So, I find walking often highly undervalued.

Lisa Niver:

During this time of the COVID coaster, you reference that people have had a lot of fears come back and a lot of alienation, and you mentioned that specifically in your talk in New York that it’s been a really hard time for people. I took a meditation class at UCLA and they kept talking about walking meditation. There is something very innate in the walking.

Andrew McCarthy:

Just going out for a good walk for a half hour changes the way you feel. Who’s famous line, if you’re in a bad mood go for a walk. If you’re still in a bad mood go for another walk. think it’s certainly better than going to sit and have a cup of coffee.

Lisa Niver:

There’s also something about repairing, or evolving your relationship with your son to an adult relationship. Early on in your book he talks about he’s not going to be on TikTok any more, and there’s other issues about finding food and learning to speak Spanish. Can you talk more about what it does for families to have this time to connect?

Andrew McCarthy:

One of the greatest luxuries, probably the greatest luxury you can have with an adult child is time. My relationship at home is –hey, Sammy, you want to go get some sushi? Okay, see you later. And so, to just have that time not feeling the need to problem solve, advise, all those boring parent things that kids don’t really want from us, to just walk beside and listen, and to just be able to say at times I don’t know.

The second day of the walk Sam said to me, what’s the point of this F-ing walk, and he didn’t say F-ing. And on the last day he said, Dad, that’s the only 10 out of 10 thing I’ve ever done in my life. I just had to keep him walking.

On the third or fourth day he said, is there an airport in Pamplona? But once he settled, I knew he would have a big experience, and I didn’t have to curate it, all I had to do was walk beside him. That’s one of the things we think we need to do as parents is curate our children’s experience in such a degree, and I trusted the walk enough having done it and having known its profound effects on me that I just kept walking beside him. My son was processing a lot of stuff in his life at the time and if you sit him down for a chat you’re not going to get very far, but you get him moving, eventually it all comes out.

We’d start the day walking and I would always tell myself, don’t speak, just walk. And whether it took 5 minutes or 45 minutes eventually it took.

It’s a real privilege as a parent to be able to receive our kids. At the end of the walk when he came marching up in Finisterre, I just stood there. I took a taxi to the end to receive him and what a beautiful thing that he let me receive him. People have to allow you to receive them and that’s a beautiful thing.

Lisa Niver:

It is a beautiful thing and I wonder if there’s a piece of that that comes from also your acting background, about stepping into different roles. Having been an actor for so many decades and being able to see things from different perspectives. Do you think that informs any of that? I loved all your movies and you’ve done so many interesting roles.

Andrew McCarthy:

I don’t know that it does, actually. It’d be a nice link-up to make, but I’m not sure that they really do. I think it’s just trying to be present and awake in your life, and being able to be observant to our loved ones and actually see them. See them, that’s all any of us want, right? See me, see me. But I don’t know that has anything to do with acting.

Lisa Niver:

One thing I did love, I have been watching The Resident, and I love your character on The Resident. I love that so many of the characters on The Resident have these very grand arcs, they’re very troubled and then they chang. But I loved when your character got to talk about instead of going to rehab that he was walking in Spain. I thought that was brilliant.

Andrew McCarthy:

That was a funny coincidence. IThey didn’t know I’d walked the Camino at all and that was just a total coincidence. I enjoyed doing that show. I hadn’t acted in about 15 years, I’d been directing and travel writing. That’s just something that came up and I really enjoyed doing it.

I started acting at 15 and it saved my life when I was a young guy. I really located myself in acting and so, to go back to it again was kind of like breathing to me in a very real way. It’s like that joke about the two fish swimming in the water and one swims by the other and says, morning, ain’t the water fine today? And the other one says, what water?

That’s what I felt when I was acting. I thought– oh, there I am. This is who I am and to a very real degree it is.

Lisa Niver:

I really, really enjoyed you in that show, just like I really enjoyed your talk at the Travel Show. Can you tell us about the Magic Road in Ireland and how your travels, and leaning into being present really changed your life. You went golfing and everything changed….

Andrew McCarthy:

In Ireland, they call it the Magic Road. It defies gravity, and that your car will roll uphill. I did an article for a magazine about Ireland and they said — we need some online content. Can you make a video? And I said sure, about what? And they said oh, just something Irish-y.

I became successful as a travel writer because of my acting experience, I knew to tell a story. Don’t sell a destination, tell a story, and that’s what’s important. And because you tell stories, people lean forward and they’re engaged and they’re interested.

So, when they wanted something Irish-y –I thought –Ireland is full of leprechauns and magic and all this Irish-y kind of stuff so, what’s a physical manifestation of that? That would be the Magic Road which is a story you can tell of searching for the Magic Road because quest stories, as you know, always work very well.

So, I went looking for the Magic Road and found it because it’s always good to find something if you’re questing in the story, and it was particularly Irish-y. We encountered a lot of Irish characters and asked everyone I met, have you heard of the Magic Road. It was a nice story to capture the theme of Irish-y-ness.

The Magic Road in Ireland

Andrew McCarthy – The Magic Road Intro from Goodman Speaker Management on Vimeo.

And Ireland’s great. I love Ireland. I have a home there and my wife’s Irish and we’ve been going for decades now so, I have a great affection for Ireland. It’s one of the few places in the world that’s exactly like what you think it’s going to be, and particularly when you get out in the country. The city does become quite sophisticated and quite liberal thinking, but the country is still just what you think it is in Ireland.

Lisa Niver:

I love Ireland. I’m just back from being in Ireland and I got to go to the north and I walked a hawk. There’s so many magical things about Ireland, and I agree with you, I’ve heard you say that we learn when we travel that people are just like us. Could you talk about how travel is our best hope for the world.

Andrew McCarthy:

I do feel that. Mark Twain said– travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness. My soap box is that I am proud to be American, I wouldn’t want to be anything but American, I love living in America, but I think America in many ways is a very, very fearful place and we make a lot of our decisions based in fear. Not all my fearful decisions have been bad but most of my bad decisions have been based in fear. I think that if Americans got out…how many of us have passports, what’s it, 38 percent, something like that, and half of us have used them? I mean, that’s an appalling number.

I think if Americans got out into the world they would realize that the world is a place that embraces us and people love Americans in the world and the world is a much safer place than we’ve been led to believe. Because of political agendas here we’ve been led to demonize people, and that just isn’t the case. You go out in the world and you really see, so many people who are able to separate our government from the people which we don’t seem to be able to do as Americans very well. People often say, I don’t really like your government but Americans are wonderful. They’re kind, they’re open hearted, they tip well, they’re polite, and people receive Americans in a wonderful way.

There’s nothing better than traveling with children because traveling with children basically says you’re making yourself very vulnerable and you’re saying, receive me, receive me.

The most important thing we can do is ask for help, on the road and at home, because it makes us right sized. When you go somewhere and you ask for help, nothing more powerful than that. Being vulnerable is a strength, not a weakness. If Americans went out and saw the world they’d come back and say, it’s not what I thought, and they tell two people and they tell two people and they tell two people, and we change.

We’re not going to change the world by governments and things like that, but by personal experience of going out there, and I do, I like to say that I’m going to change the world one travel story at a time because if they write a story and someone gets up off their couch and goes when they hadn’t been going before and that inspires them to do that, then I’ve got a good day’s work.

Lisa Niver:

I think that’s really beautiful and really important that we do all need to remember to ask for help, and to lean into the people around us. It’s so beautiful that you were able to take this 500-mile journey with your 19 year old son. And your younger son had a comment about how the book could have been better…

Andrew McCarthy:

When the books arrived, my young son picked it up and started reading it, and closed it and said, would have been better if it was about me. So, another critic has spoken.

Lisa Niver:

Do you think that it’s something you might do with your other children some day?

Andrew McCarthy:

If they wanted to, I’d love to. Like we said, traveling with kids is creating citizens of the world, the best gift we can give them.

Lisa Niver:

That’s so beautiful, and before you go, tell people how can they find you. Are you more an Instagram-er, or where can people look you up?

Andrew McCarthy:

I’m andrewmccarthy.com so, I’m on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook and at andrewtmccarthy.

Lisa Niver:

Tell people where your book is available, how they can get their own copy, and feel like they are walking with you and your son.

Andrew McCarthy:

Hopefully that is the feeling that’s created, that you’rewalking step for step right along across the country with us without breaking a sweat.

Lisa Niver:

Walking With Sam is available online and in bookstores. Tell us about your speaking tour around the country. People can come out and see you and get their book signed.

Andrew McCarthy:

I’m looking forward to going out on tour and getting across America.

Lisa Niver:

I really, really appreciate you spending this time with me. I hope your book has tremendous success. I loved reading it, and I look forward to seeing you at the travel show next season.

Andrew McCarthy:

Thank you, I really enjoyed it. Thanks a lot.

The Magic Road in Ireland

Andrew McCarthy – The Magic Road Intro from Goodman Speaker Management on Vimeo.

More Andrew McCarthy: his website, his Instagram, his Twitter and his Facebook

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I wrote this for the NY Times—Whatever the Problem, It’s Probably Solved by Walking https://t.co/8RZzVUcQle

— Andrew McCarthy (@AndrewTMcCarthy) March 25, 2023

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A post shared by Andrew McCarthy (@andrewtmccarthy)

Lisa Niver and Andrew McCarthy at the New York Travel and Adventure Show Jan 28, 2023

Lisa Niver, Andrew McCarthy, Rudy Maxa at the Dallas Travel and Adventure Show April 1, 2023

The post Walking with Andrew McCarthy appeared first on We Said Go Travel.

Newport, RI: Ocean Race’s only North American stop

Boats catch the wind on Leg 9, from Newport to Cardiff, of the 2018 Ocean Race. This epic sailing event will make its only North American stop in Newport, Rhode Island

Widely regarded as the most demanding sailing race on the planet, the Ocean Race is a test of skill, tactical decisions, navigation, and extreme physical and mental challenges. Before reaching the U.S. shore in May, sailing teams will have to conquer nearly 29,000 nautical miles from sunny Alicante, Spain, through Cabo Verde, and the icy depths of the Southern Ocean. Over the next 6 months, the tournament will stop in eight cities worldwide, with a single stop in May in North America: Newport, Rhode Island, the sailing capital of the country.

The Ocean Race began in 1973. Over its 50-year history, it has developed a reputation as the planet’s longest and most grueling professional sporting event. Within the sailing world, it’s considered the third leg of the sport’s “triple crown,” which also includes the America’s Cup and the Olympics.

Sailors practice for years to put their skills to the Ocean Race test, and some even develop an obsession with it. Just ask Sir Peter Blake, who competed in the first version (under its old name, the Whitbread Round the World Race), but came back repeatedly until he finally won in 1989-90.

11th Hour Racing Team sets sail on their new IMOCA 60 during during the commissioning period, after the boat was launched in August 2021. (Photo by Amory Ross / 11th Hour Racing)

Newport is a no-brainer stopping point for the Ocean Race. Thanks to Newport Harbor’s combination of ideal winds and lack of navigational hazards, it’s one of the top places on the planet for sailing. Last year, the city debuted its brand-new Sailing Museum, a fantastic resource for the sport’s history and the mechanics, and a great taking-off point for prospective sailors of all backgrounds and abilities.

An exhibit at the Sailing Museum. (Photo by Robin Catalano)

Newport’s 9-day, Ocean Race-themed festival, from May 13 to 21, will take place after boats arrive from Itajaí, Brazil. Celebrations will include educational experiences, spectator boat rides, sailing lessons, a watch party, and wing foil race. It will also feature One Blue Voice, an immersive experience that takes you under the sea and into marine environments to learn about ocean conservation.

The marina of Newport Harbor is jam-packed with boats during the summer. (Photo by Robin Catalano)

You can interact with sailing teams and their shore crew at “pit row.” In addition, the event will feature local entertainment, food, beverages, and games for kids.

Stay up-to-date on the progress of the race and the festivities in Newport at theoceanracenewport.com.

The post Newport, RI: Ocean Race’s only North American stop appeared first on We Said Go Travel.