Geoff > Status Update

Jibran wrote: "I have a semi-official visit coming up to the United States in March/April next year - the first time I'll set foot in that great country. I have been making plans with great excitement, intimating..."

The blood boils, Jibran. I'm embarrassed and ashamed for my country. Keeping fingers crossed for you.

Jibran wrote: "I have a semi-official visit coming up to the United States in March/April next year - the first time I'll set foot in that great country. I have been making plans with great excitement, intimating..."

If you do make it over, you should know there are a lot of great, decent people here, though it might not seem like it these days. Good luck, man.

Jibran wrote: "I have a semi-official visit coming up to the United States in March/April next year - the first time I'll set foot in that great country. I have been making plans with great excitement, intimating..."

Trump has no logic or consistency to his bigotry. He called Nawaz Sharif, praised him to high heaven, signalled his indication of visiting Pakistan, to the consternation of his party and government-in-waiting. Similarly, on the campaign trail he declared himself to a great admirer of India and Hinduism (often confusing the two!); based on which many Hindu hard-liners became his fans. But on Friday, he has talked in a rally of curbing H1 B Visas, which is going to hurt India very badly and will not earn him any fans among the Indian diaspora. It seems he says whatever is popular with the crowd he is addressing.

Okay, but, wait. Trump's team are not yet in place. The Obama administration is responsible for whateverviscoccurrung at this time at the State Departmwbt. WTF is going on at the Embassy in Pakistan that there's any change at all? I am embarrassed and ashamed, Jibran, that there's any security concern or change in process that would potentially impact your visit. *sigh*

I think Trump has a mild case of dementia, and I think the real power will be in the hands of his daughter and son-in-law. The craziness is because he truly believes in the conspiracy theories of white supremacists. Look at the videos from when he was young, too. He has always been racist and he has always preferred women who act like old-fashioned bimbos, and he has always been recorded. I don't understand why most of his supporters say, "he doesn't mean it." He obviously means it. His supporters HAVE to know he means it. So, conclusions: his supporters, whether racist or not, are white supremacists to a degree, and if one looks at when Trump began getting support, it was when Muslims, especially women wearing Muslim gear, were seen more and more on streets and in stores. I know it seems simplistic, but I have Trump supporting relatives who are also Christian fundamentalists. They grumpily accepted immigrants of all kinds, but the hijab, and other hair coverings and body covering clothes Muslim women wear, seem to have been too much for them.

P.S. The entire Trump family is about increasing their wealth and revenge. Except for Trump himself, that is what the family will be working on. Trump will be indulging not only his desires for wealth, power and revenge, he will be feeding his narcissism and his dream of being a Putin dictator clone, otherwise a front man and smoke screen for his family's rape of the country.

It seems that America is going to hell on a handcart.

For people who haven't already seen it:

Carol wrote: "Okay, but, wait. Trump's team are not yet in place. The Obama administration is responsible for whateverviscoccurrung at this time at the State Departmwbt. WTF is going on at the Embassy in Pakista..."

I also wondered who's calling the shots, why this change in the visa policy before Trump's inauguration? I can only speculate that the department responsible saw it prudent to change policy to reflect Trump's own should he go for a much stricter one.

@Nandakishore: that call was very embarrassing. Nawaz Sharif was ridiculed in Pak media for days, especially when he thought it was a good idea to release a transcript of the call to show to people that if he remained the PM for another term he'd be able to deal with something as wild and unpredictable as Donald F. Trump.

@Geoff, thanks! Some of the finest and most enlightened people I've known IRL are Americans. I've no doubt I'll meet many more great people when I visit the country, if I am allowed, that is.

Exxon take their seat at the table next to Goldman. Wasn't it nice when we used to be able to pretend there was a difference between state power and corporate power?

What is pathetically sad is how many White rustbelt Americans truly believed Trump was going to support the 99%, instead of giving the 1% actual (instead of virtual) seats at the table. We won't have to suss out the different groups of the Power Elite ever again, as they're rapidly amalgamating into one group.

howl of minerva wrote: "Exxon take their seat at the table next to Goldman. Wasn't it nice when we used to be able to pretend there was a difference between state power and corporate power?"

Would you rather have a career politician? Or would you also have had something to say about a republican politician being nominated?

If you're anti-Trump, let's just assume you're going to find fault with ALL of his cabinet picks.

I'd be shocked if you're able to mention one you genuinely approve of.

Christy wrote: "What is pathetically sad is how many White rustbelt Americans truly believed Trump was going to support the 99%, instead of giving the 1% actual (instead of virtual) seats at the table. We won't ha..."

Try telling that to the employees of Carrier.

Nick wrote: "Would you rather have a career politician? Or would you also have had something to say about a republican politician being nominated?"

This observation does nothing to refute howl's point. Politicians have proved lamentable choices so let's cut out the middlemen and appoint the billionaires?

I fail to follow your logic.

Yes Nick. I'd much, much rather have a career politician than the head of Exxon. At least they would believe in the value of public service to some extent.

And ATJG was right - your post did nothing to address the issue.

It's horrifying and sad how quickly the Right, for so long opposed to a powerful State, is now just right on board with an allegiance of big government and big corporations. Astounding how thin their beliefs actually are.

Nick wrote: "Christy wrote: "What is pathetically sad is how many White rustbelt Americans truly believed Trump was going to support the 99%, instead of giving the 1% actual (instead of virtual) seats at the ta..."

He saved around 1000 jobs, half of the jobs are still going to Mexico, by apparently bribing Carrier with contracts and the promise of tax reductions. Again, now the Right is seemingly okay with a big government selectively choosing which corporations to help and which not - sounds like intervention in the free market to me. Where oh where are those beliefs, Nick?

Geoff wrote: "It's horrifying and sad how quickly the Right, for so long opposed to a powerful State, is now just right on board with an allegiance of big government and big corporations. Astounding how thin the..."
You may get some head-scratching if you tried to explain to Trumpies how the Trumpian Carrier intervention was actual Socialism (of the icky, Venezuelan variety). And further, spared some 450 fewer jobs that first bloviated.

Ian wrote: "Geoff wrote: "It's horrifying and sad how quickly the Right, for so long opposed to a powerful State, is now just right on board with an allegiance of big government and big corporations. Astoundin..."

Yep.

Here's something you never hear:

Yeah, I need a lifesaving heart surgery, the prognosis is pretty bad, but it's my only chance. But you know what? I'm sick and tired of career surgeons, those stupid elites. I'm going to have my next door neighbor do the surgery instead. He sells insurance for a living, has no medical knowledge or background at all, but actually I feel pretty good about my decision. I think it's time to shake up the system. Oh, and if my neighbor is busy or out of town, maybe there's a former reality TV star that can do it.

And let's not forget that when the union leader for Carrier called the Donald out on just these manipulations, the president-elect, with all the dignity of the office he could muster, attacked the individual on Twitter, and he began to receive death threats.

Kirk wrote: "Here's something you never hear:

Yeah, I need a lifesaving heart surgery, the prognosis is pretty bad, but it's my only chance. But you know what? I'm sick and tired of career surgeons, those stup..."

Exactly.

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Alternatively, did anyone see the Bernie Sanders in Trump Country town hall thing that MSNBC held yesterday? It was one of the first times in a while where I felt like maybe there is a path forward in unity. Bernie with a panel of Trumpies responded to questions and had an open dialogue with the exchange of ideas. And, surprise, surprise, many of the Trump panel came to conclusions like, "They [the billionaires] got rich off of us, so they should be paying more in taxes than they do," when Bernie described the progressive left's agendas and platform. There's plenty of work to do, but Bernie's already kicking it off (why couldn't it have been him on the ballot last month?).

I'd be curious to hear Nick's justification for appointing cabinet positions based, seemingly, on the person's disdain for the very agency they're being put up for--and that's ignoring the plutocratic theater of the cast.

aPriL does feral sometimes wrote: ""

And a head of the EPA that is a climate change denier - let's not let that pass unremarked.

Ian wrote: "Alternatively, did anyone see the Bernie Sanders in Trump Country town hall thing that MSNBC held yesterday? It was one of the first times in a while where I felt like maybe there is a path forward..."

Didn't see it but that sounds encouraging. Man I love the Bern.

Geoff wrote: "And let's not forget that when the union leader for Carrier called the Donald out on just these manipulations, the president-elect, with all the dignity of the office he could muster, attacked the ..."

I actually found the SNL tweet from the week before to be some much needed comic relief. Then his attack on the union leader filled me afresh with rage.

I think the best possible scenario right now would be if he used the presidency mainly as a platform to carry on his dignified polemics with other celebrities.

ATJG wrote: "Nick wrote: "Would you rather have a career politician? Or would you also have had something to say about a republican politician being nominated?"

This observation does nothing to refute howl's p..."

I wasn't trying to refute a point, but was asking a question.

The reason being, there is fault found in anyone he picks. It's either an establishment appointment and he's not "draining the swamp" or he is picking an outsider with no relevant experience. I genuinely want to know if there is a single person any of you approve of. Do I approve of everyone he has picked? No. But I would much rather have a wildly successful businessman/financier than some politician with "relevant experience." But that's the world I'm in, so it's what I relate to.

Take Terry Branstad for instance. He was destroyed by the left (and I believe on here), as some hick from a landlocked state, who probably couldn't even locate China. And yet, he probably has the single best relationship (of any American) with President Xi. I fail to see how anyone could possibly complain with this pick.

Or how about Mattis... oh, he's not eligible because he hasn't been out of office for blah blah blah. And yet, if you ask anyone in the military, they would tell you there's no one else they'd rather go to battle with... he is literally a god.

And I can go on...

I never said anywhere whether or not I approve of the Carrier negotiation... I simply said try telling the Carrier employees Trump only cares about the 1%. I don't know what was or wasn't promised, if anything.

As for taxes, the corporate tax rate in this country is already CRIMINALLY high. Literally the 3rd highest in the world. Yet this somehow is supposed to curtail the efforts of companies parking cash oversees or doing reverse mergers. Great thinking. I applaud any and every effort to reduce any taxes.

I am about as opposed to Bernie's policies (economic) as possible, so I don't expect to anyone on here to agree with me.

Geoff wrote: "Yes Nick. I'd much, much rather have a career politician than the head of Exxon. At least they would believe in the value of public service to some extent."

Oh c'mon... and elected officials don't serve their own interests? It's amazing how you can make blanket statements like this and think it passes as real logic.

So because he was head of Exxon and was successful... he can't pivot to a public role to serve the people? Plenty of successful (yes, even billionaires) have made a transition to public service or non-profit. Please don't make me list the hundreds of people you probably already know.

Just because someone made money or was successful doesn't make them evil. These were qualities we once celebrated. Now it just wreaks of jealousy and spite.

You're all crying the end of the world and yet not a single policy action has been put in place... and Trump hasn't spent a day in office. I fear I'll have to permanently leave this site at this rate from being bombarded by the incessant political bashing I see on every other social media platform.

That would be sad. I have no problem disagreeing with people. This thread is clearly chock full of pinko snowflakes. (That's why i like it). I'm sure there are more red-blooded corners of GR.

howl of minerva wrote: "That would be sad. I have no problem disagreeing with people. This thread is clearly chock full of pinko snowflakes. (That's why i like it). I'm sure there are more red-blooded corners of GR."

I was being facetious but it's why I don't stay in these threads to go back and forth. It takes away from other activities I find way more valuable/important.

I just get aggravated when the one social place that was my outlet away from the bombardment of the political season gets taken over and is just as bad as Facebook.

Even if I agreed with everything you all said, I'd still be annoyed.

This was my "safe space!" *tears*

Nick wrote: "Geoff wrote: "Yes Nick. I'd much, much rather have a career politician than the head of Exxon. At least they would believe in the value of public service to some extent."

Oh c'mon... and elected o..."

Uh ,,, perhaps the "bashing" one is receiving on this particular thread should either just be accepted, or could be averted by saving one's comments for a pro-Trump thread ... or perhaps such a thread can't be found? What would that say about the views of people who read books vis-a-vis the Donald, who has probably never read a book in his life, unless it is about him?

I think the difference between goodreads and other social media is that here people may actually take book recommendations. (For instance, I really am planning to read Road to Serfdom soon, and by the end no doubt will be convinced that corporate tax rates in this country are indeed a crime comparable to the holodomor)

But reading is an inherently political activity, methinks, and certainly now would be a bad time to try and change that.

Nick, part of the problem is you haven't exactly addressed why we liberals are bashing conservatives. It is not only about experience in political office. I live in the lower classes section of America, where if a child ever sets foot in a college, it is rare.

I have asthma. I need clean air. Trump wants to go full speed at trashing all of the environment protection laws which help me breathe.

I am on Medicare. Trump wants to privatize Medicare. When I worked, health insurance kept changing the rules, covering less and less and increasing co-pays. Private health insurance used to drop individuals the minute the person got really sick, directing them to the poor-risk pool, if one was available. Privatizing health coverage is a bad idea.

I am on social security. Many Republicans want to kill social security entirely, or privatize it. See private health insurance problems above.

I have a gay cousin. Republicans believe at best, gay people can be converted to heterosexuality with prayer or psychological torture or should choose celibacy. This is pure terrorism and torture for a gay person. I believe gays should marry and have kids. Republicans want gay people to not have access to the same rights as straights.

I want an abortion clinic on every corner like a Starbucks.

Yes, I think Trump is selecting people to run departments who all hate gays as if they were Satan, because many of them actually believe that since they come from either evangelical Christian or mainstream old-school Christianity. They think raped women either can clench their uteruses and expel the rapist's sperm, or that all women will love a rapist baby and having to quit their job or school to raise with love and no money a rapist's baby. Republicans and Democrats destroyed welfare, which has increased and deepened the poverty of young women. Men, unfortunately, rarely step up to support their unwanted kids.

I grew up in the underclass, where reality reigns, not theories.

There is no common bridge to meet in the middle here, other than live and let live. However, Republicans want to pass laws destroying the lives of women, gays, poor children, sick people, and the old. Republicans won't just ignore women who need or want abortions, they want to close all the clinics that provide abortions. Why do you think hate, distress, panic, is going on? It isn't just about believing different things.

It is about Republicans destroying people's lives by forbidding things by making necessities that poor people need to live illegal to provide. Republicans want to get rid of gays permanently somehow, first by shoving them into jails for their sexuality. They want to force women to have babies they don't want or can afford to raise.

I have many relatives who voted for Trump. This is why they voted for Trump - they think gays are Satanic, they hate taxes, they think the mills and factories and mines will come back needing millions of workers, the hate and fear nonwhite people, especially Muslims, who they fear will marry their daughters turning them Muslim, and Trump will export all of the Muslims. None of these people have gone to college, and none of them can fill out forms accurately, and none of them understood the Wall Street crash on any level.

I still think it is on the level of Weimar in 1933 or Rome in 1922 or Chile in 1973 we have seen the likes of Trump before just not at the head of the most powerful nation in history.

Nick wrote: "You're all crying the end of the world and yet not a single policy action has been put in place... and Trump hasn't spent a day in office."

No but I don't expect an about=face. He's a politician now. All of his words are actions. And there is no promise there..... except the end of the world.

Peter wrote: "I still think it is on the level of Weimar in 1933 or Rome in 1922 or Chile in 1973 we have seen the likes of Trump before just not at the head of the most powerful nation in history."

Trump isn't Pinochet. I mean, he's not Hitler either, obviously, and he's not even Mussolini, but he's nothing at all like Pinochet. Not everyone illiberal is the same!

Trump is not going to end American democracy. What you should be worried about instead is Trump as the next step in the gradual erosion of American democracy. But don't forget the parts that Bush and Obama also played in that process. In any case, crying wolf too early only makes it harder to persuade people when you really need to warn them about a more insidious threat...

Wastrel wrote: "Peter wrote: "I still think it is on the level of Weimar in 1933 or Rome in 1922 or Chile in 1973 we have seen the likes of Trump before just not at the head of the most powerful nation in history...."

The insidious threats I see are against the lives of gays, women who need abortions and the poor children and elderly. Not one of you Trump supporters is addressing that. The erosion of democracy is precisely Trump's and the Republicans war against the poor, women who need abortions and gays. There is no other threat against democracy!

EVERYBODY keeps using euphemisms and code words! No wonder Trump won.

I don't want Nick to leave Goodreads or these threads, if for no other reason than I've never met a Republican who is in any way interested in literature or the arts - he's a rare breed which should be recognized. He's like those Mexicans Trump said aren't rapists, drug dealers, or criminals. You know, some, I assume, are good people.

aPriL does feral sometimes wrote: "Wastrel wrote: "Peter wrote: "I still think it is on the level of Weimar in 1933 or Rome in 1922 or Chile in 1973 we have seen the likes of Trump before just not at the head of the most powerful na..."

I'm not a Trump supporter. Politics is more complicated than "people who agree with me 100%" and "Trump supporters".

There's nothing undemocratic about making life worse for women, gays and poor people - democracies are often illiberal. I don't like those policies, but that doesn't make them undemocratic. They are also, in the long term, far less important than the threats against democracy, without which none of us have any freedoms.

And there are threats against democracy, which is more fragile than I think people realise (until a few years ago, America was the only Presidential system in history to remain democratic for more than 25 years consecutively). Democracy relies on things like the rule of law, the independent judiciary, the transparency of the exercise of state power, the accountability of each branch of government to the others and to the people, free and fair elections, the independence of the media, and the freedoms of speech and assembly. These things have all been eroded over the last two presidents, but Trump's statements and track record suggest and even greater assault upon them is likely in the years to come. Combined with his apparent hostility to broader norms that sustain these institutions - his willingness to foment hatred and direct it at other Americans, his delight in encouraging and endorsing conspiracy theories, his receptiveness toward physical violence, his willingness to threaten to use the powers of the state against personal enemies, his unwillingness to even entertain basic anti-corruption practices, this points to a time of serious strain on the democratic system, and inevitably invites parallels with the rise of fascism. And yet, at the same time, we should recognise that the election of Trump is not the same as the rise of fascism - it's only one more step in that direction. You weren't safe before this, and you aren't without hope after it.

I have a hard time telling Between Dog and Wolf. So, to be on the safe side ::

Wolf!!!!!!!!

Oh shit where did that come from - gonna read that!

Geoff wrote: "Oh shit where did that come from - gonna read that!"

Wake on, man! Wake on!

I just learned :: you take a horse with you. Cuz a horse always can tell Between Dog and Wolf.

You want a college educated, politically involved population? So do I. BUT we need to S P E L L out solid factual ideas, programs and problems. We need to vote, but we also need to fricking STAND UP and TALK OUT LOUD at table, at work, with friends, not use catch phrases, slogans, bumper sticker code words like 'threat to our democracy' as both liberals and conservatives are saying, and 'make America great' as conservatives are saying - actually meaning make America white male blue-collar only again, and kick out all of the non-whites, non-English speaking, non-Christian. CALL PEOPLE OUT, don't just sit there staring. If you are liberal, fricking start getting LOUD.

Do not keep quiet or use code words, is all I am saying. Silence implies consent. We hit the streets and protested in the 1970's in a masses of people, too many to arrest. Have you checked out the Standing Rock protest? It still works. Wearing hipster glasses and talking code words won't stop Trump. I'm old, so I can't. Too fragile.

In my YA days, women HAD NO RIGHTS. We could not get good paying jobs or respect. We could not go to college and learn a profession except nursing or teaching, and then we were expected to quit when the children came. And come they did, because we could not get abortions. The Constitution did not apply to women, white or otherwise. Women could not even do sports, because men believed it would hurt our uteruses and so no babies or sex. Some Southern politicians believe this today! You think I am a talking about theoretical possibility Trump could make this happen again? No. You think code words and bumper stickers will stop Trump? NO. Women had the vote only for 30 years when I was born, and still women were intimidated into voting as their husbands wanted. Women could only be management or do sponsored sports only since the mid-1990's. Alaskan Natives were forbidden by Alaskan state law to attend state college until 1971. How easy it would be turn the clock back, because we were already like that! STOP BEING POLITICALLY CORRECT.

You want to know what being a poor girl kid was like, with crap parents, who told everybody "we love our kids" in white male blue-collar Republican land?? No one spoke unless it was in trite statements like 'Make America Great Again". There was no Constitutional rights except for white males. We didn't, COULDN'T, talk about non-whites, abuse, rape.

Have you ever starved? I have. A public nurse had to check me out and check my parent for following court orders for weeks after I was discovered in my own filth as a toddler. Grow up with trailer trash? I did. Have you ever been beaten almost to death several times by a father weekly who hated your guts because you were a smart girl? I have. He despised me so much he did everything he could to keep me cowed and obedient, and he confessed at the end of his life that having a family of wife, kids, and expectations of white picket fences almost killed him with the stress of having no money and no education. Have you ever been raped? I have. At the time, no law covered it except for one of pandering, and the judge was so full of rage about it he broke his desk.

Yet everybody in America was mostly white, and Protestant, and church-going back then, with 8th grade educations - the Greatest Generation - NOT. What the Republicans want to bring back today, we already had in the 1950's and 1960's, and I grew up then. See 'Leave it to Beaver' reruns on Youtube, that was the Republican idea of life,was, whether it was or not. That is Trump's America, only with a white-trash rich celebrity class, supported by blue-collar males and trophy women and evangelicals. Alcoholism, rape, birth defects, Catholics, foreigners, etc. did not exist officially in the 1950's, except for those evil rabble rousing pinko commie activists who,wanted Constitutional rights for women, non-whites and non-protestants.

I was a young girl in the 1960's, 1970's, 1980's. Police did nothing to help women in domestic disputes. Men could beat and rape their own children with impunity because girls and women had no rights. I was 22 when women could only be a nurse, teacher or a 'homemaker'., i.e. sex and cooking and cleaning toilets and diapers. I was not able to OWN a credit card by custom until I was 26 years old, and then it had my husband's name on it. Women were prevented from almost all credit, which meant no school, cars, houses unless a man co-signed. Women had 6-8 babies because men couldn't be bothered with condoms. I wanted to go to college, I was accepted but my father tore up the loan papers saying, "no man would want you!" Women all over the country were dying from self-induced abortions. Men spent paychecks on beer, cars, smokes, gambling and drugs before buying baby food, with video games on the table now.

Poverty was a built-in American institution for non-whites amd women and gays who were 'out', with no way to live decently without a white male overlord in the home or work. Damn it, being politically correct ain't gonna work against the Republican agenda! Liberals are going to be NPR nice until they wake up with 1950's whites 1% owning the entire country, which will be indistinguishable from a third world country.

Wake up! Talking NPR code talk without action is suicide for liberalism.

@April, I actually don't put too much stock in one of them fancy-pants college degrees. I figure me and my man's doing just fine without one.

I have written to representatives to delay the electoral college on the case of Russian interference in the election and Trump's conflicts of interest. I myself am not much younger than you (pushing 50) I have no clue what to do and arguing on goodreads isn't going make this go away. I know people who are protesting and live in the DC area. I have almost no experience in political action like most people. I don't know what to do but you don't have to berate people on a book site. I have a feeling that a lot of others are in the same boat.

@David, good for you! However, college changed my life because of taking Comparative Religions, Ancient Literature, philosophy, several electronics and computer programming classes, accounting classes and Statistics. True!

@Peter I'll speak my mind all I want on a book opinion and review site. Amazon permits opinions because, hello, reviews are opinions? I am reviewing politics, as is everybody else here. Besides, this thread began as an anti-Trump rant, did you notice?

Did you read the original 'status' comment? Is it not a scream against Trump? Is not that an opinionated opinion against Trump voters?